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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 15 post(s) |
Serilla
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:50:00 -
[601]
 Originally by: CCP Dionysus
This weekend's knee-jerk comments will be taken with a large grain of salt. If you (in general "you") want to do something about these changes, then get on sisi and try out various scenarios and give feedback then :)
What about missiles? There is no tracking equivalent for them, the only way to avoid them was speed and that is being removed.
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Sakura Nihil
Stimulus
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:50:00 -
[602]
Originally by: Garreck
I realize Providence is a microcosm of Eve culture and not representative of all Eve combat...but the majority of nano-usage there is to gank npcers 10v1, not to take on larger fleets. We've got a lot of enemies who are skilled raiders and I'm not trying to undermine that...but based on my experience against nanos I just don't see where this "but now we can't take on blobs" argument comes from. Currently, when the blob arrives, the nanos bail. With these changes and proper scouting...that's still a viable option.
Garreck, you're one of the only people in CVA I respect, so try not to get offended by my thoughts on this.
You guys don't respond to the nano in the traditional fashion, last time I checked. A normal nanogang can run into a place like TDE4, MB-NKE, or PNQY, sit around for a few minutes, and the locals will blob up and try to get you with varying results - while nanogangs can't outright decimate those formed up fleets, especially the ones with carrier and RR support in a cynojammed system, they can pick off the support and at least "play" with that fleet.
CVA doesn't bite often, if ever. Whereas BRUCE, Foundation, Smashkill, IAC, IRON, they'll all bite on it and try to kill you.
With this nerf, the ability to disengage will have been lessened, meaning you have to commit more to a fight now, which favors - guess what - blobs and the defender, especially where good scouting isn't enough. I mean, they can have a force ready to go on a nearby jump bridge, so that when you engage their bait forces, they JB and then warp onto you - in the past, proper scouting of nearby systems meant you only really had to watch out for the logonski, but these days...
Click me! You know you want to... |
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CCP Dionysus
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:51:00 -
[603]
Originally by: Matrixcvd
No, absolutely not and I am afraid we have detected humans that can't breath but are still walking. Oxygen helps your thinking chief. Do you even use your brain? MWDs stopping to scramblers. All MWDs getting the same boost, the list goes on and on.
For all of you nutjobs in this game and especially at CCP, I have seen 1, thats it 1 vaga go over 9k/s. 3 Intys around 24k/s. THATS IT. ALl of this nonsense you keep bringin up is just total garabage and has been brought on by FW. WHen you listen to complete PVP failures, will see how this game lasts
Yes, I make sure to always keep my oxygen tank firmly strapped and active.
The speeds that are being nerfed are exactly those huge speeds. Ship travelling in the 2-5km/s or so range won't feel this too badly.
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Haniblecter Teg
F.R.E.E. Explorer
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:51:00 -
[604]
Edited by: Haniblecter Teg on 25/07/2008 15:52:00
Speed was a problem to the point where you didnt see battleships in solo or roaming. BC's were popular cause of their cost.
This will bring ships back into the game, like assault frigates adn such.
Hell, nano-roaming is still an option, just gotta nano in interceptors.
How can anyone say anythign to this nerf. It was a problem, nano's were nigh invicible, this'll fix it.
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Friends Forever |
Ezekiel Sulastin
Gallente
Central Research Nexus
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:51:00 -
[605]
There's the sane way to nerf nanos, such as nerfing polycarbs to be in line with the rest of the speed rigs if not farther for starters, maybe reducing the effectiveness of the speed modules, snakes, etc. Still useful, not quite as uber. That's expected, and that's fine.
Then, there's the CCP way to nerf nanos, which completely obliterates their effectiveness in all cases, in addition to introducing new tactical decisions such as either dying in a blasterboat trying to get into range with either a scrammed MWD or craptastic AB or just completely forgetting they exist. Also, it won't fix blobs - just maybe change their composition.
Way to go, CCP Nozh. You cranked the Zulupark Effect up to 11 - I thought posting something as ill-informed as this devblog would be impossible.
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WTB Armor Nerf Hardener II, 10^100 isk OBO |
GO MaZ
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:51:00 -
[606]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
This weekend's knee-jerk comments will be taken with a large grain of salt. If you (in general "you") want to do something about these changes, then get on sisi and try out various scenarios and give feedback then :)
I'm really glad to know that input from the community is taken into account by CCP and that we're not just all worthless passengers in this terribly driven clown car.
If you're going to put up a thread where people can post comments on a dev blog, maybe you should pay attention to what people are saying - it's pretty easy to ignore the posts which are obvious whines, but ignoring all of the posts as "knee jerk" reactions when people have put time into explaining some of their concerns further reinforces some peoples opinions that CCP is synonymous with a cylindrical container filled with phallic looking objects.
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Saturn 5
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:52:00 -
[607]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
This weekend's knee-jerk comments will be taken with a large grain of salt.
translation: We don't actually care what our player base thinks about our proposals, we're pretty much gonna do whatever the hell we like.
Does CCP have a Customer Service dept? I would suggest that they are sacked, but with no customer care team, who would make important decisions on balancing game play? 
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Stab Wounds
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:52:00 -
[608]
Originally by: Dungar Loghoth
As a mission runner who has never going into 0.0 or used a micro warp drive,
the majority of EVE don't get their jollies off by ganking PVE inclined people like your fail nano-exploit alliance
more PL tears they taste soooo sweeeet
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Hani EQ
H A V O C
The Requiem
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:52:00 -
[609]
Thanks CCP. For moving towards making this a thinking man's game again. Eve is about strategy, tactics and experience not how fast you can spam your mwd.
To all the whiners in this thread. The First Person Shooters can be purchased, that way  .The twitchers can go twitch somewhere else.
Props CCP.
Firmus Ixion - Our shining moments come in our darkest hours
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Zikka
Hematite Rose
Bionic Dawn
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:53:00 -
[610]
Originally by: Heartstone
Originally by: Dungar Loghoth
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
This weekend's knee-jerk comments will be taken with a large grain of salt. If you (in general "you") want to do something about these changes, then get on sisi and try out various scenarios and give feedback then :)
Why do we have a thread for this then?
Actually I was wondering this and then it came to me that it is somewhere for people to vent which is why this will be my last post on here for now as anything I post in this thread will, by a CCP employee's own admission, not be considered as valid as one I post in a few days even if I think it through the same amount. Good to know.
Actually they said knee-jerk rants will be taken with a large grain of salt. Not well reasoned posts.
But TBH any feedback is worthless until people have been able to try the changes anyway.
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GETMEDOWNFROMNYAHH
Minmatar
Basement Innovations
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:53:00 -
[611]
why does every good thing in this game get nerfed? it's a crock of bs if you ask me why dont you guys change the game to how it was originally and I BET people would be a lot happier
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:53:00 -
[612]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
Originally by: Matrixcvd
No, absolutely not and I am afraid we have detected humans that can't breath but are still walking. Oxygen helps your thinking chief. Do you even use your brain? MWDs stopping to scramblers. All MWDs getting the same boost, the list goes on and on.
For all of you nutjobs in this game and especially at CCP, I have seen 1, thats it 1 vaga go over 9k/s. 3 Intys around 24k/s. THATS IT. ALl of this nonsense you keep bringin up is just total garabage and has been brought on by FW. WHen you listen to complete PVP failures, will see how this game lasts
Yes, I make sure to always keep my oxygen tank firmly strapped and active.
The speeds that are being nerfed are exactly those huge speeds. Ship travelling in the 2-5km/s or so range won't feel this too badly.
How do you justify the statement that a hac that cost 3-5 bil in speed fittings and implants is unbalanced cos its almost or as fast as a 20mil fully fitted interceptor?.
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A Sinner
Logical Progression
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:54:00 -
[613]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
Originally by: Matrixcvd
No, absolutely not and I am afraid we have detected humans that can't breath but are still walking. Oxygen helps your thinking chief. Do you even use your brain? MWDs stopping to scramblers. All MWDs getting the same boost, the list goes on and on.
For all of you nutjobs in this game and especially at CCP, I have seen 1, thats it 1 vaga go over 9k/s. 3 Intys around 24k/s. THATS IT. ALl of this nonsense you keep bringin up is just total garabage and has been brought on by FW. WHen you listen to complete PVP failures, will see how this game lasts
Yes, I make sure to always keep my oxygen tank firmly strapped and active.
The speeds that are being nerfed are exactly those huge speeds. Ship travelling in the 2-5km/s or so range won't feel this too badly.
Glad to see you reply and approve to a thread of which owner insults your customers. You could have slipped something in there like : please behave or whatever
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"There are no ugly women, just men who didn't have enough to drink" |
facialimpediment
Amarr
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:54:00 -
[614]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
With a few rigs, T2 overdrives and microwarpdrive and some implants, I can easily break 4km/sec with a vagabond. Then you can add gang bonuses, boosters, etc.
You do realize that very few HAC pilots actually use speed implants, right?
Right?
RIGHT?
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Sakura Nihil
Stimulus
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:54:00 -
[615]
Heartstone has a point. I seem to recall a certain EVE dev proposing a Deimos "buff" (read: nerf) based on the fact he was consistently trying to 1v1 a Zealot and failing miserably.
This is an example of what I fear might be running through the devs heads this time around, looking at things in isolation.
Click me! You know you want to... |
Matrixcvd
Caldari
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:54:00 -
[616]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
Originally by: KingCappo
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
The basic speeds in the 1k-3k/sec areas are basically untouched, in fact boosted in a few cases.
Its mainly the huge multipliers you get when combining large numbers of speed bonuses which used to get you to the 10-30km/sec speeds. They have been "nerfed".
So ships that are supposed to be "speedy" like the vaga will still be able to break 4 km/s?
With a few rigs, T2 overdrives and microwarpdrive and some implants, I can easily break 4km/sec with a vagabond. Then you can add gang bonuses, boosters, etc.
I just had an EPIPPHANY. I NOW KNOW WHY CCP DOES STUFF LIKE THIS!. THEY USE EFT AND SISI TO BASE ALL OF THEIR OPINIONS AND IDEAS ABOUT LIFE ON TQ JUST LIKE THE IDIOTS ON THE FORUMS!!!! GOTCHA!!!!
I can't believe I actually figured out the connection. Ridiculous EFT fits and SiSi stats mean you must know exactly how people play on TQ, BINGO!. See your not far from your user base CCP! You inspired them!
SO did that 4km/s vaga not really have T2 lows but Republic fleet ODs? come on now tell us the truth, T2 polys with there 7& bonus... You can tell us you got that number right off EFT wiht all the best implants and fittings, barely broke 4km/s, and btw breaking 4km/s doesnt mean 4028m/s either.
what a bunch of illiterate, irresponsible, bend me over backwards to help the failures in this game bunch of destroyers, not devs, see you have to actually develop something worth playing instead of just destroying what the players have perfected.
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Mitsuni Abashadoni
Minmatar
The Establishment
Establishment
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:55:00 -
[617]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
Originally by: Matrixcvd
No, absolutely not and I am afraid we have detected humans that can't breath but are still walking. Oxygen helps your thinking chief. Do you even use your brain? MWDs stopping to scramblers. All MWDs getting the same boost, the list goes on and on.
For all of you nutjobs in this game and especially at CCP, I have seen 1, thats it 1 vaga go over 9k/s. 3 Intys around 24k/s. THATS IT. ALl of this nonsense you keep bringin up is just total garabage and has been brought on by FW. WHen you listen to complete PVP failures, will see how this game lasts
Yes, I make sure to always keep my oxygen tank firmly strapped and active.
The speeds that are being nerfed are exactly those huge speeds. Ship travelling in the 2-5km/s or so range won't feel this too badly.
Apart from when they, guess what, get their MWD disabled 
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Siona Windweaver
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:55:00 -
[618]
Edited by: Siona Windweaver on 25/07/2008 15:55:37
Originally by: Stab Wounds
more PL tears they taste soooo sweeeet
/me thinks there will be enough tears tomorrow to fill whole Arrakis 
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Aprudena Gist
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:55:00 -
[619]
Originally by: Stab Wounds
Originally by: Dungar Loghoth
As a mission runner who has never going into 0.0 or used a micro warp drive,
the majority of EVE don't get their jollies off by ganking PVE inclined people like your fail nano-exploit alliance
more PL tears they taste soooo sweeeet
he was in 2 nano fail alliances Tri and PL but he was also in goonfleet before that and was kicked out because he was too annyoing/stupid.
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Dungar Loghoth
Caldari
The Illuminati.
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:55:00 -
[620]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
The speeds that are being nerfed are exactly those huge speeds. Ship travelling in the 2-5km/s or so range won't feel this too badly.
So you decided that because these game-breaking speeds are so common, despite costing 4b+ for the implants, 200m for the MWDs, and hundreds of millions of isk for the rogues/faction ODs, etc, that it would a good idea to spend countless hours trying to fix it?
I wonder how many other bugs could have been addressed, ones that have been around for months, but were not because of this prudent use of programmer time.
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Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:55:00 -
[621]
Originally by: CCP Nozh
Answering a few common questions:
Death to small roaming gangs
- Small roaming gangs existed long before polycarbon engine housings and snake sets. Sure we're reducing the maximum speed achievable but you'll still be able to go a lot faster than a standard MWD fit with various speed mods.
This is a pretty horrible argument, EVE was a totally different game back then, less players, pre-NOS-nerf, pre-ECM-nerf, pre-whatever else nerf. Or do you mean to say that you're bringing those back now? Small roaming gangs back then worked because there were other powerful tools available for smaller gangs, now as it is nano is one of the few remaining options for a small roaming gang to avoid running into a vastly superior force and dying immediately.
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
This weekend's knee-jerk comments will be taken with a large grain of salt. If you (in general "you") want to do something about these changes, then get on sisi and try out various scenarios and give feedback then :)
The only time in the past when anything actually changed from CCP:s own supposedly Dev-blog "idea" to what actually went on Tranquility was when THEoneTHATshallBEunnamed suggested some ridiculous carrier-changes, and the only reason it got changed was because of overwhelming criticism BEFORE THEY WERE IMPLEMENTED ON SISI. You're telling me that your coders will make all these changes on SiSi only to have to revamp them because of eg. a week of testing? Once it hits Sisi it's obviously gone through a chain of decisionmaking and player-feedback from the "in general 'you'" is mostly PR-nonsense (akin to CSM-influence).
We object because we like this game and wish it not to go south like so many other MMO:s that changed because the devs catered to those who whined too much from the get-go. You have a working game-mechanic, and as the old saying goes: If it's not broken, don't fix it.
Black Hand.
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Mitsuni Abashadoni
Minmatar
The Establishment
Establishment
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:55:00 -
[622]
Originally by: Zikka
Originally by: Heartstone
Originally by: Dungar Loghoth
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
This weekend's knee-jerk comments will be taken with a large grain of salt. If you (in general "you") want to do something about these changes, then get on sisi and try out various scenarios and give feedback then :)
Why do we have a thread for this then?
Actually I was wondering this and then it came to me that it is somewhere for people to vent which is why this will be my last post on here for now as anything I post in this thread will, by a CCP employee's own admission, not be considered as valid as one I post in a few days even if I think it through the same amount. Good to know.
Actually they said knee-jerk rants will be taken with a large grain of salt. Not well reasoned posts.
But TBH any feedback is worthless until people have been able to try the changes anyway.
If CCP says that all NPC bounties will be cut in half, I'm pretty sure you'll say that it's a bad idea even before they've tested it ;)
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Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:58:00 -
[623]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 25/07/2008 16:04:17
These changes will affect pvp so much that I really need to get on the test server to try them before saying anything about it.
It changes every variable of combat, from catching and keeping the target in range, to tracking and hitting it while in combat.
Caldari will be happy with this change since they will now hit everything hard again while sitting behind heavy shield tanks.
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Originally by: Roguehalo
Can you nano Titans?
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Heikki
Gallente
Wreckless Abandon
Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:58:00 -
[624]
Good and needed change, without nothing that drastic sounding yet.
-Lasse
with his very beloved >18 km/s nano-Vindicator..
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Scatim Helicon
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:59:00 -
[625]
Look at all dem cryin littal babbies in this thread
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Heartstone
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:59:00 -
[626]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
Translation pt2: yelling "the sky is falling" without even seeing the changes is not very helpful. Some of the comments in here have been interesting and useful, others not so much. thats what "grain of salt" is all about. If you come back with a thought through and intelligent commentary on these proposals, then we can understand what and why you are making them. 1 line flippant comments are not very helpful.
So umm no offense but can we have an answer to them rather than answering the flippant ones please? Such as my question about how you are going to test the wide ranging implications of a change like this when you need the numbers to do so which simply aren't ever going to be available on SISI?
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Saint Lucifer
The Illuminati.
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Posted - 2008.07.25 15:59:00 -
[627]
Originally by: Lee ChanKa
great job great!!!!!
1. im not nano pilot look mine loses on goods kb
2. ****ing macroer on belt or any other person IS HARD 2 CACH EVEN WITH POLYCARBON NANOFIBER SHIP and now with tanked inty r hac or dictor it will be more ****ED + if he put point on you you are dead in maximum 3 salva SO MACROES PLEASE BUY ALL TOBIAS WARP DISTRUPTOR AND YOU ARE SAFE IF SOMETHING CACH YOU BEFORE YOU LOG OF ON BELT(DIDNT KNOW THET MACROES HAWE SO STRONG LOBY IN CCP)
3. ROAMING I CAN IMAGINE ROMAING GANG OF RR BS OR TANKED HACS COMAND-you come in hostile region large bubble tec 2 on g8 and TITAN CLOAKED IN GRID JUST NEAD 2 PRES DD AND YOUR ALL GANG ****ED + if you even reaproch thet titan with some magic
or ms or anything till your frends come you are toasted from he or hes snipers
4. SOLO ROAMING-im roaming 90% of time solo or 95%-if i cach anything after 8 hours roaming it will be intresting!!!and if NOT-AFTER I JUMP IN 4 IDIOTS G8 CAMP WITH 1 INTI AND 3 BS IM DEAD THET IS PERFECT
OH I LOVE YOU EVE YOU MAKE GAME BETHER!!
NOW ALL LETC BUY LARGE BUBBLES TANKED HACS AND SNIPERS AND LETC CAMP SOME G8S THET IS SO FUN!!!!SUPERCAPS ARE COOL TO HAWE ALSO
AND NO!!!!IM NOT SARCASTIC!!!
You sound like you work for ccp.
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Gypsio III
Dirty Filthy Perverts
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Posted - 2008.07.25 16:00:00 -
[628]
Originally by: Xaen
Originally by: Lt Angus
Originally by: Raquel Trotter
Well what will be left for minmatar ships now? Speed is their only advantage currently over other races ships for most classes. I hope to hell that CCP are considering how minnie ships are balanced with other races after this change..
Also agree with other ppls comments that this seems to be another step in encouraging blobbing tactics.
if they are faster before the nerf they are faster after the nerf, overall speed is preety meaningless, relitive speed is what counts and it isnt changing much
Except that you'll now get torn apart by missiles and drones.
If this goes through, HACs are dead.
You'll still be able to dictate range.
You'll still have the buffer to take considerable fire.
You'll still be able to disengage at will.
You'll still whine.
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Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.07.25 16:00:00 -
[629]
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
Translation pt2: yelling "the sky is falling" without even seeing the changes is not very helpful.
And saying "there's no problem" when the house is on fire is?
Black Hand.
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Aprudena Gist
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.25 16:00:00 -
[630]
Originally by: Dungar Loghoth
Edited by: Dungar Loghoth on 25/07/2008 15:57:02
^^^^ yes this is me im the gay one
Originally by: CCP Dionysus
The speeds that are being nerfed are exactly those huge speeds. Ship travelling in the 2-5km/s or so range won't feel this too badly.
So you decided that because these game-breaking speeds are so common, despite costing 4b+ for the implants, 200m for the MWDs, and hundreds of millions of isk for the rogues/faction ODs, etc, that it would a good idea to spend countless hours trying to fix it?
I wonder how many other bugs could have been addressed that actually effect a wide player base, ones that have been around for months, but were not because of this prudent use of programmer time.
Heh Prudent use of programmer time you know they Made Ambulation right? Walking around in stations in a ****ing space ships shooting game?
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