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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:07:00 -
[1]
So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:07:00 -
[2]
So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
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Eran Laude
Gallente Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:12:00 -
[3]
I'm a carebear with claws but I'm not too sure how I feel about this blog. On the one hand, the inner mission runner and [shame]miner[/shame] says yes, but the latent and growing PvP part of my soul feels a disturbance in the force, as if a million pirates cried out at once . . . and were silenced . . .
At the very least the Goons should be given an exception so they can continue to fight their Jihads.
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Eran Laude
Gallente Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:12:00 -
[4]
I'm a carebear with claws but I'm not too sure how I feel about this blog. On the one hand, the inner mission runner and [shame]miner[/shame] says yes, but the latent and growing PvP part of my soul feels a disturbance in the force, as if a million pirates cried out at once . . . and were silenced . . .
At the very least the Goons should be given an exception so they can continue to fight their Jihads.
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MaDeX
Retribution Corp.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:14:00 -
[5]
Oh boy, this is it, from minnie nerf to this - wave goodbye to eve people.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:14:00 -
[6]
It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
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MaDeX
Retribution Corp.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:14:00 -
[7]
Oh boy, this is it, from minnie nerf to this - wave goodbye to eve people.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:14:00 -
[8]
It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:15:00 -
[9]
Originally by: MaDeX Oh boy, this is it, from minnie nerf to this - wave goodbye to eve people.
I've heard that with every change that is made.. EvE is still here
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:15:00 -
[10]
Originally by: MaDeX Oh boy, this is it, from minnie nerf to this - wave goodbye to eve people.
I've heard that with every change that is made.. EvE is still here
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:17:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Having a bit of a whinge?
-- Eve needs a dose of Top Gun without the sweaty shower scenes. |
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:24:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:25:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Having a bit of a whinge?
Yes i am since this game is becoming less and less of pvp'ing and more and more of blobbing which its obvius this server cant handle .
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Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:25:00 -
[14]
1) Faster concord repsonse = who cares. Won't change ganking industrials or T1 ships with tons of loot.
2) Sec status penalty increase = should be balanced. It is pretty damn easy to get -10 or go below -2.0. Tons of T1 fit caracals and stuff that don't hurt the enemy but only kill your sec status
3) Sec status based on Player vs Player sec status = who cares. Nice little change imo
4) Future removal of insurance from suicide ganks = WTF NO. HELL NO. --
http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Kahega Amielden
Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:26:00 -
[15]
Quote:
We also changed the functionality and reduced the spawn. CONCORD now spawns in groups of 3 ships: 2 frigate sized vessels, which will lock the aggressor down in place, and a heavy hitting battleship to reduce his or her ship to metal scraps. The frigates will lock almost instantly while the battleship takes longer to lock, and the aggressor is made more aware of his or her impending doom.
While they may have made them arrive faster, it seems like they've also made it so that you can survive CONCORD a bit longer. Anyone else think it looks like this?
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:27:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Having a bit of a whinge?
Yes i am since this game is becoming less and less of pvp'ing and more and more of blobbing which its obvius this server cant handle .
lol wut
But seriously, if you're going to sit on your ass, refusing to find loopholes in the system like any respectable griefer will, then I have no sympathy.
-- Eve needs a dose of Top Gun without the sweaty shower scenes. |
Leinad tir
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:28:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
I dont have been living in high sec never but u must admit that suicide gank is a stupid idea(that gives profits ofc) and goes against the playability of the game, im ok with the carebears carebearing in high sec, let them there playing their own hello kitty online or declare war to some of them, suicide gank is moronic.
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:30:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Maybe the devs decided they no longer wanted a game universe which is a step backwards from the 21st century, with a society where crimes like murder are effectively unpunished.
-- Eve needs a dose of Top Gun without the sweaty shower scenes. |
Rhanna Khurin
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:32:00 -
[19]
Crikey! CCP don't half make some controversial statements.
I wonder if we'll see a C&P whine similar to the nano one that's been plaguing general discussion recently.
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Zaqar
Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:34:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Vaal Erit 4) Future removal of insurance from suicide ganks = WTF NO. HELL NO.
Why? Why does it make sense that you should get an insurance payout?
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Kahega Amielden
Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:34:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 06/08/2008 06:35:09 Real life comparisons are ****ing stupid
In EVE, CONCORD only polices Capsuleers. Capsuleers don't die when their ship gets blown up. It's actually robbery/vandalism, at worst.
Regardless, I think the changes might be a little harsh, although I don't see a -huge- issue with them. The comedy autopiloting T1 industrials with hundreds of millions in loot will still be a delicious treat for any ganker. Think it just makes gankers pick their targets a bit more.
Really the only problem is that now it's much, MUCH harder to gank missionships, removing the only real risk of hisec missions. Which is a problem that could be solved better with a mission nerf rather than suicide gankers.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:34:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Maybe the devs decided they no longer wanted a game universe which is a step backwards from the 21st century, with a society where crimes like murder are effectively unpunished.
Then maybe they shouldnt make quotes saying that this isnt a fluffy happy happy land. Which it is rapidly becoming.
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Zeba
Minmatar Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:35:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Leinad tir suicide gank is moronic.
Filling your untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions in cargo is moronic. Having someone scan out your fittings and cargo then blow you up to take them for themselves is an intended game mechanic thats fun and profitable.
inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan |
Kahega Amielden
Minmatar 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:36:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 06/08/2008 06:36:08
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Leinad tir suicide gank is moronic.
Filling your untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions in cargo is moronic. Having someone scan out your fittings and cargo then blow you up to take them for themselves is an intended game mechanic thats fun and profitable.
Yet hundreds of millions of ISK worth of shit in an untanked t1 industrial will still be more than worth ganking. You're overreacting.
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:36:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn Then maybe they shouldnt make quotes saying that this isnt a fluffy happy happy land. Which it is rapidly becoming.
Feel free to rage-quit over it.
-- Eve needs a dose of Top Gun without the sweaty shower scenes. |
Khamal Jolstien
Caldari The Monkey Sanctuary
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:42:00 -
[26]
Wow... Just wow. I don't take part in suicide ganking, and even I think this is a step backwards for EVE. The Nano nerf was needed, but honestly? This is really starting to worry me.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:42:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Arthur Frayn
Originally by: Gaia Thorn Then maybe they shouldnt make quotes saying that this isnt a fluffy happy happy land. Which it is rapidly becoming.
Feel free to rage-quit over it.
Rage is overated. Leaving the game is quite possible actually.
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:42:00 -
[28]
This wouldn't be so bad if they also reformed the wardec system because it's almost meaningless as it is.
One amusing consequence of this is that we can expect an increase in alt-ganking. Which means that smaller, less profitable targets will be selected. A.K.A: newer players.
Ah well, I'm getting the hell out of empire anyway. This makes CCP's vision of it clear. I wonder if they're under the impression that these changes will actually decrease the level of complaints about non-consensual PvP? Haven't they learned that the bigger the bones they throw that dog, the louder it whines for more?
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Deviana Sevidon
Gallente Panta-Rhei United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:45:00 -
[29]
If you suicide gank someone, the security hit will be a bit higher. Other then that, it does not change much.
Why the emorage?
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Zeba
Minmatar Pator Tech School
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:46:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Kahega Amielden Edited by: Kahega Amielden on 06/08/2008 06:36:08
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Leinad tir suicide gank is moronic.
Filling your untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions in cargo is moronic. Having someone scan out your fittings and cargo then blow you up to take them for themselves is an intended game mechanic thats fun and profitable.
Yet hundreds of millions of ISK worth of shit in an untanked t1 industrial will still be more than worth ganking. You're overreacting.
Wat? I agree and am all for the changes and see little to no effect on 'legit' suicide gankers that take the time to stalk and set up thier prey for a takedown? This change will simply cut out the suicide ganks that are purely for the fun of getting a random killmail and lulzing at the miniscule loss of isk, standings and time to recover from it to get the emo thrill of causing someone a totally lopsided loss due to unbalanced game mechanics.
inappropriate signature. ~WeatherMan |
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Arthur Frayn
V.O.F.L IRON CORE H E L I C O N
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:50:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Vaal Erit Insurance is for everyone and I can do anything, that's called sandbox gameplay that is advertised by CCP. I understand that a sandbox has rules, but insurance is one of those very basic rules that applies to everyone evenly.
Translation: "I want to ruin someone else's day but don't want my day ruined in the process! Wahhhh!"
-- Eve needs a dose of Top Gun without the sweaty shower scenes. |
Kazuma Saruwatari
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:51:00 -
[32]
I'm all for suicide ganking and all, but the level its being done in empire is beyond sanity. I mean, I'm shuffling some named T1 to near Jita to sell, and two frigates attempt to suicide my T2-tanked indy, in 1.0
Naturally, all they caused was lag, and my shields to regenerate.
After I dropped of my load and headed back, the same two came in cruisers now. Still fail.
Okay, if idiots like this are suicide ganking and failing, spawning more CONCORD, and causing lag, do we really want this to continue? We all know we dont like lag.
Serious suicide gankers wont be deterred much by these changes, but idiots like Mickey and Moe here I'm talking about should find it much harder to "make a living". -
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Bai ZongTong
The Revolutionary Guard
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:54:00 -
[33]
gotta start suicide ganking soon before the nerfs... --- Want some YARRHHHS? The Revolutionary Guard Pirate Corp Looking for Members Uncensored KB |
Thargat
Caldari North Star Networks Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:55:00 -
[34]
Well, this is what whining leads to. CCP actually listens, so keep it up and we'll soon have a wow in space but run by SOE (I remember someone who said that'd be better).
There's only one sig that matters... and that's Radius. |
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:56:00 -
[35]
Edited by: Gaia Thorn on 06/08/2008 06:58:21
Originally by: Divad Ginleek Raven: 70-75ish mil to build, 32 mil to insure, around a mil to fit for torpedo gank (t1 siege launchers and BCUs)= 103-107 mil.
platinum insurance payout: 108 mil
net loss/gain for suicide ganker: 1 mil + phat lootz.
unbalanced game mechanic: Priceless.
i don't understand why so-called "hardcore PVPers" whine so much when an obvious error in game design is fixed. could it be that the ones crying loudest are the true carebears watching their isk faucet being repaired and yelling about it and throwing a fit like little babies?
get out there and work for your isk like the rest of EVE and maybe more people would sympathize when your profession gets "nerfed" (read: fixed).
i think the security penalty changes will make more of an underworld culture and bring pirate organizations closer together (as well as open up more trade opportunities in lowsec, thereby providing targets for the pvpers). who knows, just let the change come, try it out, and if it is obviously overdone, they will change it to make it more balanced. to me it sounds like a redirection of the game to bring it more in line with what highsec and lowsec should mean. highsec has never been safe for the carebear, now its just as risky for the sharks as well.
I dont Whine because i cant suicide gank.
I whine cause CCP is turning this game to shit cause they promote it as a sandbox but every patch that comes out the remove a fair bit of that sand from our box.
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Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.08.06 06:59:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Because there's more of us. CCP are running a business and they cannot afford Eve to be too harsh. There aren't enough blood-thirsty weirdos in the gaming community to keep such a thing going. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran, 4+ years)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Furb Killer
Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:04:00 -
[37]
I dont know if faster concord response really is needed, and i dont know if concord response is faster since the battleship will take longer to lock.
But removing insurance is exactly what needed to be done. You can still shoot anyone for profit, when he has enough valuable stuff in his cargohold. Sure your profit is lower, but you get over it. However it should stop the random ganking of industrials without even scanning what they got in their cargohold. It is even profitable to gank an industrial filled with homeless...
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Daan Sai
HAZCON Inc
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:05:00 -
[38]
I don't see a huge change here so far, but the insurance issue does need looking into. So long as suicide ganks don't stop, just a bit more cost/reward balance is needed.
It looks like it will still be easy to rat back up again, they didn't say anything about how that was going to change.
I'll trade you tho, campaign to get rid of respawing neut towers in lvl 5 missions and I'll come into lowsec more often for you to try to gank....
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:06:00 -
[39]
the one thing about this game was the options i had i felt i could do whatever i wanted.
That choice is rapidly being removed by CCP
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:11:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Because there's more of us. CCP are running a business and they cannot afford Eve to be too harsh. There aren't enough blood-thirsty weirdos in the gaming community to keep such a thing going.
The logical conclusion of this line of argument is a completely PvE orientated game with no place at all for the "bloodthirsty wierdos".
Thanks for taking the only game we have.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
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Trebor Locke
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:16:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn the one thing about this game was the options i had i felt i could do whatever i wanted.
That choice is rapidly being removed by CCP
Suicide gankers currently are the best match to the word carebear more than any other kind of person. Industrialists have had to adapt in many ways where 'fake pvpers' (such as yourself) havent had to adapt. In truth, there is no real adapting to random suicide ganking of Industrial Ships. Well, unless you want to afford a nice shiny transport ship (which requires specialized skills that are extremely hard for newer players to obtain. even older players for that matter. About 1-2months of training to "Adapt").
I'm very glad these changes are happening as they are much needed. Especially with the insurance.
Also, I have lived out in 0.0 for quite a while. Ganking is not PVP. It's a massacre. Player vs. Players assumes your target can fight back :) -------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate
Your friendly economic management and trade orginization. |
Kyle Klanen
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:16:00 -
[42]
EVEs been on the road to WoW in space slowly but steadily, Empyrean ages was a major step introducing battlegrounds, RvR and CTFs and if you read the CSM minutes there was discussion about war decs being a "pay to grief" system and they are looking into changes. It is quite obvious how its panning out, 0.0 is the pvp server and high sec a lot safer with some kind of a flagging system based around mutual wardecs and low sec will be for the battleground RvR factional warfare all with the end result that people who "choose" to pvp can do so but unconsensual pvp will be made difficult maybe even impossible eventually.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:17:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Because there's more of us. CCP are running a business and they cannot afford Eve to be too harsh. There aren't enough blood-thirsty weirdos in the gaming community to keep such a thing going.
One thing.
who is gonna buy youre ships ? since the carebears sledom lose ships in missions and if they do build a new one from the salvage and recycling of mods ?
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Trebor Locke
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:20:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
One thing.
who is gonna buy youre ships ? since the carebears sledom lose ships in missions and if they do build a new one from the salvage and recycling of mods ?
Simple, the rest of the EVE universe. All those orginizations called 'Alliances.' They tend to buy em in bulk during war time :) -------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate
Your friendly economic management and trade orginization. |
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:21:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Trebor Locke
Originally by: Gaia Thorn the one thing about this game was the options i had i felt i could do whatever i wanted.
That choice is rapidly being removed by CCP
Suicide gankers currently are the best match to the word carebear more than any other kind of person. Industrialists have had to adapt in many ways where 'fake pvpers' (such as yourself) havent had to adapt. In truth, there is no real adapting to random suicide ganking of Industrial Ships. Well, unless you want to afford a nice shiny transport ship (which requires specialized skills that are extremely hard for newer players to obtain. even older players for that matter. About 1-2months of training to "Adapt").
I'm very glad these changes are happening as they are much needed. Especially with the insurance.
Also, I have lived out in 0.0 for quite a while. Ganking is not PVP. It's a massacre. Player vs. Players assumes your target can fight back :)
Sigh waiting for the infamous "real men pvp in 0.0".
pvp = player versus player meaning if you are in your hauler and im in my titan its still pvp.
As for calling me a fake pvper i dont suicide gank as i stated before and ive been killing people before you where a twinkle in your mothers eye.
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:22:00 -
[46]
Incidentally, this is a bad change for all you miners and traders who actually play the game.
Your AFKing, macroing competition just got a big boost.
Enjoy your reduced profit margins.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:23:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Trebor Locke
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
One thing.
who is gonna buy youre ships ? since the carebears sledom lose ships in missions and if they do build a new one from the salvage and recycling of mods ?
Simple, the rest of the EVE universe. All those orginizations called 'Alliances.' They tend to buy em in bulk during war time :)
so the industrialists in 0.0 are there for there own profit ? the ones buying ships in empire and take em to 0.0 is my alt selling em for stupid profit since there is no money in pvping anymore.
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Trebor Locke
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:26:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Malcanis Incidentally, this is a bad change for all you miners and traders who actually play the game.
Your AFKing, macroing competition just got a big boost.
Enjoy your reduced profit margins.
That is actually a false statement. Traders wont see any real change in profit margins. A change in the amount of isk being moved yes, but not in the profit margin as that will stay steady given market forces (ECON 104 Macro-economics). All will remain normal even as gankers get their nerf as the change in price will reflect changes in opportunity cost and risk. -------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate
Your friendly economic management and trade orginization. |
Trebor Locke
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:28:00 -
[49]
Edited by: Trebor Locke on 06/08/2008 07:28:48
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
the ones buying ships in empire and take em to 0.0 is my alt selling em for stupid profit since there is no money in pvping anymore.
Exactly like real life. It's always been the manufacturers and suppliers that make profit from war and will remain that way in any free-market economic model.
-------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate
Your friendly economic management and trade orginization. |
Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:28:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Trebor Locke
Originally by: Gaia Thorn the one thing about this game was the options i had i felt i could do whatever i wanted.
That choice is rapidly being removed by CCP
Suicide gankers currently are the best match to the word carebear more than any other kind of person. Industrialists have had to adapt in many ways where 'fake pvpers' (such as yourself) havent had to adapt. In truth, there is no real adapting to random suicide ganking of Industrial Ships. Well, unless you want to afford a nice shiny transport ship (which requires specialized skills that are extremely hard for newer players to obtain. even older players for that matter. About 1-2months of training to "Adapt").
I'm very glad these changes are happening as they are much needed. Especially with the insurance.
Also, I have lived out in 0.0 for quite a while. Ganking is not PVP. It's a massacre. Player vs. Players assumes your target can fight back :)
This post is hilarious.
The vast majority of suicide gankers are 0.0 players doing it to make isk. The vast majority routinely pvp in 0.0/lowsec, the suicide ganking is merely an isk farming activity.
You have zero kills on battleclinic, all you have is a long string of losses. You wouldn't know pvp if it came up to you and smacked you in the face. So stop pretending you know anything about it, you don't.
If you can afford to be carrying hundreds of millions of isk worth of cargo, you can afford to spend a month to train for a transport ship. Newer players do not have hundreds of millions of isk worth of cargo, its only the old, lazy, stupid players that get ganked. Suicide ganking is good for eve, because it removes those players, social darwinism at work, the fat the stupid die, the smart ones live and get rich.
As for the OP, im skeptical till I see the actual changes, if ccp is smart the new concord despite responding sooner will not insta **** you in 1 second like they do now, which might be a good change.
Alternatively, ccp needs to reform the wardec system to remove NPC corp protection(and force people out of newbie corps after say 6 months) and deal with corp hopping to avoid wardecs.
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Vikarion
Caldari Onyx Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:28:00 -
[51]
I wanted suicide ganking to be made more difficult (I suicide gank, BTW), but not this much more difficult.
This is really ham-fisted, CCP. Hi-sec should not be safe, only safer.
These changes would make all but the most expensive loot not worth ganking.
Next I suppose war-decs will be done away with, or some other stupid crap like that. --------
Where I got my great sig... |
Volarius
D00M. Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:29:00 -
[52]
The cool kids live in 0.0 and lowsec anyways.
At least with these changes we'll have less bear whining.
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Plave Okice
Universal Securities
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:29:00 -
[53]
All people need to do to avoid 95% of suicide ganks is not autopilot.
CCP catering for the completely ****ing stupid and ******ed. Nothing needs changing with these mechanics, force people to play not AFK.
Would you like to know more? |
Xevan Templar
7th Batavian Squadron
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:34:00 -
[54]
If I read this correctly, suicide ganking is still possible , it's just that CONCORD will arrive abit faster. Besides that you don't get your insurance back, which actualy makes sense. So it will get abit thougher but not impossible.
And to come back to the OP's original line, there is a huge place called 0.0 yes? I don't see 'carebears' taking over 0.0 anytime soon. Just take it like a man for once.
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Trebor Locke
Gallente Round Table Enterprises Leather Rose Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:38:00 -
[55]
Edited by: Trebor Locke on 06/08/2008 07:39:49
Originally by: Gamesguy
This post is hilarious.
The vast majority of suicide gankers are 0.0 players doing it to make isk. The vast majority routinely pvp in 0.0/lowsec, the suicide ganking is merely an isk farming activity.
You have zero kills on battleclinic, all you have is a long string of losses. You wouldn't know pvp if it came up to you and smacked you in the face. So stop pretending you know anything about it, you don't.
If you can afford to be carrying hundreds of millions of isk worth of cargo, you can afford to spend a month to train for a transport ship. Newer players do not have hundreds of millions of isk worth of cargo, its only the old, lazy, stupid players that get ganked. Suicide ganking is good for eve, because it removes those players, social darwinism at work, the fat the stupid die, the smart ones live and get rich.
As for the OP, im skeptical till I see the actual changes, if ccp is smart the new concord despite responding sooner will not insta **** you in 1 second like they do now, which might be a good change.
Alternatively, ccp needs to reform the wardec system to remove NPC corp protection(and force people out of newbie corps after say 6 months) and deal with corp hopping to avoid wardecs.
Who cares about kills on battleclinic? I've always been a logician and have managed tactical and economic structures. It takes money to PVP after all and what better way to fund it than with someone who knows how to make money and how to cut off anothers trade? This game is 80% about economics and 20% about what you actually do with the equipment.
Also, Battleclinic has a VERY old record of me [which I do prefer] and doesn't even include several killmails (both kills and losses) that I have been recorded in. -------------- CEO of Round Table Enterprises Chairman of the Leather Rose Syndicate
Your friendly economic management and trade orginization. |
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 07:43:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Trebor Locke Edited by: Trebor Locke on 06/08/2008 07:39:49
Who cares about kills on battleclinic? I've always been a logician and have managed tactical and economic structures. It takes money to PVP after all and what better way to fund it than with someone who knows how to make money and how to cut off anothers trade? This game is 80% about economics and 20% about what you actually do with the equipment.
Also, Battleclinic has a VERY old record of me [which I do prefer] and doesn't even include several killmails (both kills and losses) that I have been recorded in.
Who cares ?
Pvper's care, and according to youreself u havent pvped then. As i thought.
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El'Niaga
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:53:00 -
[57]
EVE is suppose to be risk vs reward.
Currently their is little to no risk for the pirates/gankers in hi sec. They get more than their ship back in insurance.
This helps level the playing field. You can still gank in hi sec. If your doing it for fun you can blow up anything, just be out what you spent on it. If your trying to be a pirate, then you need to make sure its worth it as a target. (Use a Cargo Scanner, and a Ship Scanner...)
Below .5 the change in insurance will not affect anything.
The sec hits as described make more sense.
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Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:54:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Caldreean I have no issue with the concept of suicide ganking. But it shouldn't be as easy as it is now. This tries to address that, and that's fine with me.
And all you people spazzing out about the loss of insurance, boo hoo. Ganker tears are delicious! If you want to waste your ship ganking, party on, but let's be real here. With how easy it is to recycle alts (regardless of CCPs stance against it) or work standing back up, there needs to be *some* price to pay. And this is it. Deal
Recycling alts is an exploit, if you think someone is doing this you can petition to get them banned. So thats not an argument.
Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
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Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:55:00 -
[59]
Originally by: El'Niaga EVE is suppose to be risk vs reward.
Currently their is little to no risk for the pirates/gankers in hi sec. They get more than their ship back in insurance.
This helps level the playing field. You can still gank in hi sec. If your doing it for fun you can blow up anything, just be out what you spent on it. If your trying to be a pirate, then you need to make sure its worth it as a target. (Use a Cargo Scanner, and a Ship Scanner...)
Below .5 the change in insurance will not affect anything.
The sec hits as described make more sense.
Where is the risk for the npc corp level 4 mission runner in a CNR? When there is risk for him I would gladly support a nerf to suicide gankers.
Increasing risk is not nerfing the reward, increasing risk is implementing things like tradable killrights and fixing the bounty system. This is just a plain nerf.
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THEGREAT LOBO
Beyond Divinity Inc
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Posted - 2008.08.06 07:57:00 -
[60]
Just another step towards making eve a bland and boring place.
CCP- GIVING IN, ONE ALT WHINE AT A TIME.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:02:00 -
[61]
THE SKY IS FALLING....
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:02:00 -
[62]
Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 06/08/2008 08:06:25 Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 06/08/2008 08:05:38 Umm...if i read that right:
"Higher the security of a system = bigger/faster security + bigger security hit?"
How on earth is this a "bad" thing? Seems logical to me
Low sec= pirate pewpew place. High sec= secured and empire looks after its own.
Something is wrong in the game, yes, WRONG, if a high security place is a "pewpew" place for the pirates.
And no i don't consider my any of the affiliations like pirates, carebears or such. It's just logical concord thinking.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:02:00 -
[63]
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
First!
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Zephyr Rengate
dearg doom
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:05:00 -
[64]
I say the only thing to improve Eve is to add arena, that way pvpers can pvp in a safe instance without harming mission runners. Also in pvp instance there would be no concord. That would solve the whine about new concord spawn times.
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David Ryan
coracao ardente Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:06:00 -
[65]
Edited by: David Ryan on 06/08/2008 08:06:30 This is disgusting.
STOP AFK HAULING
Problem solved.
No changes needed. -------------------
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El'Niaga
Minmatar Republic Military School
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:12:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: El'Niaga EVE is suppose to be risk vs reward.
Currently their is little to no risk for the pirates/gankers in hi sec. They get more than their ship back in insurance.
This helps level the playing field. You can still gank in hi sec. If your doing it for fun you can blow up anything, just be out what you spent on it. If your trying to be a pirate, then you need to make sure its worth it as a target. (Use a Cargo Scanner, and a Ship Scanner...)
Below .5 the change in insurance will not affect anything.
The sec hits as described make more sense.
Where is the risk for the npc corp level 4 mission runner in a CNR? When there is risk for him I would gladly support a nerf to suicide gankers.
Increasing risk is not nerfing the reward, increasing risk is implementing things like tradable killrights and fixing the bounty system. This is just a plain nerf.
When he gets into low sec, that or he has to accept less isk a day as you get one from almost any level 3 or 4 agent within 5 jumps of low sec at regular intervals. He can choose not to take those, but doing that more often than once every 4 hours hurts his ability to do it in the future.
The other way is to flip his cans and hope he's stupid or that he shoots at you. Most are sadly and then you kill them, since they have a global and can be shot without concord interference. Indeed that is how most mission runners are killed today, not by suiciding. Most suiciding targets industrials, mining barges, freighters, exhumers and transports.....
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:18:00 -
[67]
Originally by: El'Niaga
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: El'Niaga EVE is suppose to be risk vs reward.
Currently their is little to no risk for the pirates/gankers in hi sec. They get more than their ship back in insurance.
This helps level the playing field. You can still gank in hi sec. If your doing it for fun you can blow up anything, just be out what you spent on it. If your trying to be a pirate, then you need to make sure its worth it as a target. (Use a Cargo Scanner, and a Ship Scanner...)
Below .5 the change in insurance will not affect anything.
The sec hits as described make more sense.
Where is the risk for the npc corp level 4 mission runner in a CNR? When there is risk for him I would gladly support a nerf to suicide gankers.
Increasing risk is not nerfing the reward, increasing risk is implementing things like tradable killrights and fixing the bounty system. This is just a plain nerf.
When he gets into low sec, that or he has to accept less isk a day as you get one from almost any level 3 or 4 agent within 5 jumps of low sec at regular intervals. He can choose not to take those, but doing that more often than once every 4 hours hurts his ability to do it in the future.
The other way is to flip his cans and hope he's stupid or that he shoots at you. Most are sadly and then you kill them, since they have a global and can be shot without concord interference. Indeed that is how most mission runners are killed today, not by suiciding. Most suiciding targets industrials, mining barges, freighters, exhumers and transports.....
And yes he doesnt have to go into lowsec unless you choose a agent close to a lowsec system.
And ganking mission runners is being nerfed and has been nerfed already remember "lofty scam" that was swiftly dealt with once the carebears started whining about being shot and loosing their ships.
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Zephyr Rengate
dearg doom
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:19:00 -
[68]
The lofty trick was dealt with to stop any problems occuring through FW.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:20:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn And ganking mission runners is being nerfed and has been nerfed already remember "lofty scam" that was swiftly dealt with once the carebears started whining about being shot and loosing their ships.
tsk!
it was hardly "swiftly" dealt with... please stop posting just because you love the clackety-clack of your keyboard...
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Xavieer Naidoo
Oberon Incorporated Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:20:00 -
[70]
At last. And to all the people saying that insurance should still be paid after you get blown up by concord, imagine this:
Insurance company, someplace, somewhere: - "Good morning, can I please have my insurance paid. My car got blown up..." - "What happened sir ?" - "Well... I robbed a bank, shot two people, and then police came after me, so I took my car and tried to ran away. They blocked the streets and wrecked my car. I also got arrested..." - "Oh... that's no problem sir. Here you go. Your platinium insurance. Enjoy it along with all the money you stole. Have a nice day."
Yeeeeaaaaah. Very immersive. Also makes so much sense. So a big YARRR! to those changes.
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Jeremy Paxman
Special Doc
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:23:00 -
[71]
Edited by: Jeremy Paxman on 06/08/2008 08:24:22
Originally by: copasetic sideways THE SKY IS FALLING....
-------------------- In Soviet Cornwall, cows tip you. |
Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:23:00 -
[72]
Ah, the sweet sound of pirate tears
What, people actually have to think about whether a suicide gank is worth the risk? You have to *gasp* actually scout and get intel? The horror! Flee too Delve/other games! Rabble rabble rabble!
In short: excellent changes. Suicide ganks are still possible, but are no longer automatically profitable. As should be.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:23:00 -
[73]
Exactly Xavieer, this is why i ask, AGAIN, and i know i KNOW, logical thinking is hard for some people:
Why shouldn't higher security system equal higher security?
It seems that all the pirates/gankers who get hellbent around here think that the whole of EVE should be 0.0
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Rhanna Khurin
Minmatar Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:24:00 -
[74]
I wouldn't want to be a suicide ganking vagabond pilot right now.....
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:25:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Kahega Amielden
Quote:
We also changed the functionality and reduced the spawn. CONCORD now spawns in groups of 3 ships: 2 frigate sized vessels, which will lock the aggressor down in place, and a heavy hitting battleship to reduce his or her ship to metal scraps. The frigates will lock almost instantly while the battleship takes longer to lock, and the aggressor is made more aware of his or her impending doom.
While they may have made them arrive faster, it seems like they've also made it so that you can survive CONCORD a bit longer. Anyone else think it looks like this?
Yes, I have noticed it too, but naturally "suicide ganking should be subsidized by CCP" people will not consider that.
I must admit that I like Bellum suggestion of removing insurance completely after a character has 60 days of play. Or maybe a better option is to increase the cost of insuring as the ships loss go up (broken for categories), for example the first time you insure a BS you pay the current values, after a BS insurance payout has been given to you the insurance price go up a 5%, with the second insurance payout 10% and so on.
That will give new players a buffer when they start playing with a new tier of ships bu after some time will make insurance non convenient.
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Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:26:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo At last. And to all the people saying that insurance should still be paid after you get blown up by concord, imagine this:
Insurance company, someplace, somewhere: - "Good morning, can I please have my insurance paid. My car got blown up..." - "What happened sir ?" - "Well... I robbed a bank, shot two people, and then police came after me, so I took my car and tried to ran away. They blocked the streets and wrecked my car. I also got arrested..." - "Oh... that's no problem sir. Here you go. Your platinium insurance. Enjoy it along with all the money you stole. Have a nice day."
Yeeeeaaaaah. Very immersive. Also makes so much sense. So a big YARRR! to those changes.
About as realistic as making a claim like this:
"I'd like to claim my insurance on my raven please"
"What happened sir?"
"I strapped a machine gun onto it and drove it to Somalia where I attacked the local militia there, unfortunately an RPG hit it and now its wrecked".
Makes about as much sense as suicide gankers getting insurance.
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Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:28:00 -
[77]
Originally by: El'Niaga
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: El'Niaga EVE is suppose to be risk vs reward.
Currently their is little to no risk for the pirates/gankers in hi sec. They get more than their ship back in insurance.
This helps level the playing field. You can still gank in hi sec. If your doing it for fun you can blow up anything, just be out what you spent on it. If your trying to be a pirate, then you need to make sure its worth it as a target. (Use a Cargo Scanner, and a Ship Scanner...)
Below .5 the change in insurance will not affect anything.
The sec hits as described make more sense.
Where is the risk for the npc corp level 4 mission runner in a CNR? When there is risk for him I would gladly support a nerf to suicide gankers.
Increasing risk is not nerfing the reward, increasing risk is implementing things like tradable killrights and fixing the bounty system. This is just a plain nerf.
When he gets into low sec, that or he has to accept less isk a day as you get one from almost any level 3 or 4 agent within 5 jumps of low sec at regular intervals. He can choose not to take those, but doing that more often than once every 4 hours hurts his ability to do it in the future.
The other way is to flip his cans and hope he's stupid or that he shoots at you. Most are sadly and then you kill them, since they have a global and can be shot without concord interference. Indeed that is how most mission runners are killed today, not by suiciding. Most suiciding targets industrials, mining barges, freighters, exhumers and transports.....
A mission runner in motsu has zero chance of being offered a mission to lowsec, and he makes more isk than the majority of 0.0 ratters who carry much more risk.
Stop dodging the point.
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sakana
North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:28:00 -
[78]
They only released this blog now to try and stop people complaining about the nano-nerf.
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Xavieer Naidoo
Oberon Incorporated Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:36:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Gamesguy
About as realistic as making a claim like this:
"I'd like to claim my insurance on my raven please"
"What happened sir?"
"I strapped a machine gun onto it and drove it to Somalia where I attacked the local militia there, unfortunately an RPG hit it and now its wrecked".
Makes about as much sense as suicide gankers getting insurance.
Concord is the Police. Somalia is the lawless space (0.4-0.0) where no laws apply. The assumption is quite simple - EVE is a harsh world where people shoot themselves. Insurance companies know it and pay you if your actions are not against the law. In empire we have the law, outside it - we don't, hence you didn't brake any by pirating / ganking / pvping / whatever.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr Imperial Servants
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:38:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
Just as funny as seeing all the suicide gankers crying foul now
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Tenoh
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:38:00 -
[81]
Edited by: Tenoh on 06/08/2008 08:40:13 finaly ccp doing something good for a change.Wish they would make guard npcs attack low security fkrs on sight and make then a free game. I'd also would love to see Concord pod-killing the fkin gangers.Taking their insurance is a good step.FU bloody griefers. It would be nice also to call Concord if your attacked,just like police.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:41:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
Just as funny as seeing all the suicide gankers crying foul now
Cause we always get the shortend of the stick.
whilst the "bears" get what they want.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:41:00 -
[83]
Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 06/08/2008 08:41:52 Here's another LOGICAL example for you who complain about "carebears winning":
You say; "EVE is a harsh cold place!"
Ok, let's go with that. It's a cold bad place.
Fine enough? Good.
When someone says; "Yes it is! Let's remove insurance!"
What do you say? Riiight.
So which is it? Cold and harsh? Or cold and harsh but only if you're not a pirate/ganker!
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Shadowsword
COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:43:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Vaal Erit 1) Faster concord repsonse = who cares. Won't change ganking industrials or T1 ships with tons of loot.
Might change where freighter ganks are concerned, however...
Quote:
4) Future removal of insurance from suicide ganks = WTF NO. HELL NO.
So what? All it does is raise the profitability bar toward true idiotic carebears. Won't change much where cruisers/bombers are concerned, it only really change with battlecruisers and battleships.
Besides, think about all the lazy guys in t1 haulers who'll think CCP nerfed suicide-ganking to oblivions, and get careless again... ------------------------------------------
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:56:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 06/08/2008 08:41:52 Here's another LOGICAL example for you who complain about "carebears winning":
You say; "EVE is a harsh cold place!"
Ok, let's go with that. It's a cold bad place.
Fine enough? Good.
When someone says; "Yes it is! Let's remove insurance!"
What do you say? Riiight.
So which is it? Cold and harsh? Or cold and harsh but only if you're not a pirate/ganker!
Dont mind em removing insurance, what i do mind is that they alter the gameplay giving penalty sec hits a increase and that includes everyone in the gang.
then to kick pirates in the nuts even more they say if u have 5.0 in sec status and u kill someone -1.9 u take a less sec hit ?
so the bears can shoot lowsec dwellers and such and take a less hit for it whilst the rest get a drop i dont even want to think about.
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Mika Meroko
Minmatar Crayon Posting Inc
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Posted - 2008.08.06 08:58:00 -
[86]
meh, this just raise the bar to gank a target....
nothing has really changed,
quite frankly, even with the easy ratting to get the sec status up...
alot of targets just arent worth it...
but an Faction fitted CNR is still a faction fitted CNR.. =P
granted, the profit margins goes down... but something about having a net gain from sucide ganking (even a failed one) feels like an exploit to me...
oh and yes... Eve is DYING.... =P
Originally by: CCP Atropos I pod people because there's money to be made in selling tears.
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Terror Rising
Death Of Fallen Angels
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:00:00 -
[87]
Y'know I actually enjoy my alt getting targetted by dumb gankers, had 5 ravens with torps target my mission running golem outside a station. The minute they open fired I just redocked and undocked to enjoy their wrecks ... Twice this has happened in the last few weeks ..
I think the dumbing down of eve is more to do with the gankers half the time
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:05:00 -
[88]
I don't know about the exact balancing of suicide ganking because I don't have the numbers. Creating an exception in the insurance mechanic for one particular group of people seems a poor way of handling it though. The other changes sound like they make sense, but the insurance one should be looked at I think. However, the way it is worded suggests there is no debate on this one.
Also, 10/10 to Xavieer's "RL Insurance Comparison" troll above. Perfect execution, you sound just like a genuine moron. Most people can't do it that well.
Finally:
Regardless of whether I agree with the changes or not, this seems to hold true more with every passing day. -
DesuSigs |
Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:05:00 -
[89]
Gaia can I have your stuff :3
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Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:07:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Because there's more of us. CCP are running a business and they cannot afford Eve to be too harsh. There aren't enough blood-thirsty weirdos in the gaming community to keep such a thing going.
One thing.
who is gonna buy youre ships ? since the carebears sledom lose ships in missions and if they do build a new one from the salvage and recycling of mods ?
Alliances. Corporations at war. Players upgrading. Pirates (who will still exist) paying the new gank price. Victims of ganking (who will hopefully now not include quite so many random victims).
As others (including CCP) have written:Ganking at the moment is too easy and is getting silly. People are being ganked 'just because' and that is a threat to the future of the game. I fully support ganking but it should require skill, teamwork and planning. Ideally it should not happen to noobs just flying around minding their own business trying to learn the game. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran, 4+ years)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:10:00 -
[91]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Gaia can I have your stuff :3
You cant handle my stuff ;)
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Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:13:00 -
[92]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Gaia can I have your stuff :3
You cant handle my stuff ;)
Not true anymore, and liquidate it please.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:29:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn Dont mind em removing insurance, what i do mind is that they alter the gameplay giving penalty sec hits a increase and that includes everyone in the gang.
then to kick pirates in the nuts even more they say if u have 5.0 in sec status and u kill someone -1.9 u take a less sec hit ?
so the bears can shoot lowsec dwellers and such and take a less hit for it whilst the rest get a drop i dont even want to think about.
The thing is, you start attacking peopl with no reason in high-sec, with high rating, and you're VERY soon in the same "scum" pool as the ones you're killing. It's not worth it, especially if you care about your high rating.
Also i believe this will bring more meaning to high and low sec rating of players.
If you see a guy with a 10.0 sec rating, you kow you're pretty durn safe around him in right sec status system. As it is NOW, it means nothing and everyone's a threat.
But i believe the BIGGEST thing i this whole devblog is the following:
"Through our research, we discovered that the balance between gaining standing and losing it was not in line with our intentions."
Now let's remember who made, owns, and brought to us this game and just accept it
Lie it says on your EULA; "Your soul is ours and we can do whatever we want and if you don't agree, you don't play."
We ALL agreed that CCP can do whatever they want with the game.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Avon
Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:40:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Blog In many cases, unsuspecting victims have no chance to escape , nor any help from CONCORD
That is the most worrying about-face I think I have seen CCP do.
I don't mind the changes too much, but I am concerned that it further upsets the balance between player and non-player corps. Immunity from war declarations needs to be looked at.
Eve-Online: The Text Adventure |
Roemy Schneider
BINFORD Solidus Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:43:00 -
[95]
not much changing there - the threshold has been raised from 20mil to 200-300mil, if you do it in a bs.
the good ole brutix can start gambling at ~100mil.
niarja will still be gank central
poor jihadswarm though
but now i'm wondering... the removal insurance payout will only apply to CONCORD kills or gae/station sentries aswell? - putting the gist back into logistics |
Gabriel Karade
Nulli-Secundus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:44:00 -
[96]
Lets see how it pans out.
I just wish they'd add more immersion to the whole Concord 'thing' rather than insta-gib.
Would it be so difficult to have a system where there is a slim chance of escaping only to pay a price later down the line; fines upon docking? Insurance removal? 'Flagged' to Concord vessels for 24 hours? Or maybe even make it possible to fight back, at least a bit, until Concord escalates the response (i.e. so we donÆt get loads of æYulaiÆ incidents).
--------------
Video - 'War-Machine' |
Siigari Kitawa
Gallente The Aduro Protocol
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:47:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Sheriff Jones But i believe the BIGGEST thing i this whole devblog is the following:
"Through our research, we discovered that the balance between gaining standing and losing it was not in line with our intentions."
Now let's remember who made, owns, and brought to us this game and just accept it
If it is not in line with CCP's intentions, then the players are thinking outside of the box by being innovative and finding different and unique ways to do things.
Suicide gankers should be applauded, not grounded.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:48:00 -
[98]
Edited by: Sheriff Jones on 06/08/2008 09:50:12
Originally by: Gabriel Karade Lets see how it pans out.
I just wish they'd add more immersion to the whole Concord 'thing' rather than insta-gib.
Would it be so difficult to have a system where there is a slim chance of escaping only to pay a price later down the line; fines upon docking? Insurance removal? 'Flagged' to Concord vessels for 24 hours? Or maybe even make it possible to fight back, at least a bit, until Concord escalates the response (i.e. so we donÆt get loads of æYulaiÆ incidents).
Aye. If you manage to gank someone in empire and escape to 0.0 through a gate(which, after a moment the CONCORD would "spikestrip", aka, bubble) you could go on your merry way to naughty-territory with your loot.
"Come on man the fuzz is right behind us!!" "I'm looting as fast as i can!!"
Or if you're REALLY bad-a**: "Come and get it you stinkin' CONCORD!!!"
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
Originally by: Sheriff Jones But i believe the BIGGEST thing i this whole devblog is the following:
"Through our research, we discovered that the balance between gaining standing and losing it was not in line with our intentions."
Now let's remember who made, owns, and brought to us this game and just accept it
If it is not in line with CCP's intentions, then the players are thinking outside of the box by being innovative and finding different and unique ways to do things.
Suicide gankers should be applauded, not grounded.
They're not grounded, they are just given the appropriate response from CONCORD to this new naughty behavior: "We've noticed an increase in suicide pilots in our systems and we WILL be putting it to your permanent record."
That's ALL that's happening here.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:52:00 -
[99]
Originally by: Gabriel Karade I just wish they'd add more immersion to the whole Concord 'thing' rather than insta-gib.
Would it be so difficult to have a system where there is a slim chance of escaping only to pay a price later down the line; fines upon docking? Insurance removal? 'Flagged' to Concord vessels for 24 hours? Or maybe even make it possible to fight back, at least a bit, until Concord escalates the response (i.e. so we donÆt get loads of æYulaiÆ incidents).
Like insurance, CONCORD is just a mechanic. Immersion or making sense are irrelevant. -
DesuSigs |
Gabriel Karade
Nulli-Secundus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:55:00 -
[100]
That would be awesome, trying to make for 0.0 while be chased/shot up at every gate. It was a lot of fun trying to avoid Concord in the past (Castor days) before it was decided "You! Your ship explodes or you are a dirty 'sploiter"
Station fines would solve the problem of people docking up and getting away 'scott free'. --------------
Video - 'War-Machine' |
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Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 09:59:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo
Concord is the Police. Somalia is the lawless space (0.4-0.0) where no laws apply. The assumption is quite simple - EVE is a harsh world where people shoot themselves. Insurance companies know it and pay you if your actions are not against the law. In empire we have the law, outside it - we don't, hence you didn't brake any by pirating / ganking / pvping / whatever.
Where did I say this was in lowsec? This is 1.0 super safe space where the raven died to NPC pirates.
Funny how the most heavilly patroled super safe space has entire pirate armadas roaming through it eh?
Also, I want your car insurance company that would insure a car being used in combat in Somalia.
Eve is a harsh universe so you get concord protection in safespace to make isk risk free? This is your idea of a harsh universe?
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:00:00 -
[102]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Gabriel Karade I just wish they'd add more immersion to the whole Concord 'thing' rather than insta-gib.
Would it be so difficult to have a system where there is a slim chance of escaping only to pay a price later down the line; fines upon docking? Insurance removal? 'Flagged' to Concord vessels for 24 hours? Or maybe even make it possible to fight back, at least a bit, until Concord escalates the response (i.e. so we donÆt get loads of æYulaiÆ incidents).
Like insurance, CONCORD is just a mechanic. Immersion or making sense are irrelevant.
Aye, making sense and immersion surely is so very very irrelevant in an MMORPG.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Gabriel Karade
Nulli-Secundus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:03:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Gabriel Karade I just wish they'd add more immersion to the whole Concord 'thing' rather than insta-gib.
Would it be so difficult to have a system where there is a slim chance of escaping only to pay a price later down the line; fines upon docking? Insurance removal? 'Flagged' to Concord vessels for 24 hours? Or maybe even make it possible to fight back, at least a bit, until Concord escalates the response (i.e. so we donÆt get loads of æYulaiÆ incidents).
Like insurance, CONCORD is just a mechanic. Immersion or making sense are irrelevant.
Eh? Are you seriously trying to say Immersion isn't relevant?
If it didn't matter we wouldn't have Concord ships: your ship would simply explode if you aggressed someone in high-sec... --------------
Video - 'War-Machine' |
Sweet Laylah
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 10:04:00 -
[104]
Quote: It is too easy to gain back lost standing, taking only a few days to erase all the damage done by ganking.
Too easy?!
Regaining sec hits for shooting enemies in low sec is one of the most tedious tasks in the game .. after ratting and mission running.
Not everyone with a low sec rating is a pirate, war decs are extremely limited in use (not to mention waste of isks for small corps), especially in low sec around 0.0. |
Axhind
Caldari Ex Coelis The Bantam Menace
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:05:00 -
[105]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Blog In many cases, unsuspecting victims have no chance to escape , nor any help from CONCORD
That is the most worrying about-face I think I have seen CCP do.
I don't mind the changes too much, but I am concerned that it further upsets the balance between player and non-player corps. Immunity from war declarations needs to be looked at.
+++ to that. Should have been the main thing for CSM. Kick the bastards out of the NPC corps (by limiting attacking, ships they can use, mission levels, whatever). Plus they need to fix the jump corps when war decced crap too. It would enable a lot more PvP in empire as NPC corps are used only for avoiding war deccs now days (and it's not only empire carebears there, there is plenty of 0.0 alts there too).
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Axhind
Caldari Ex Coelis The Bantam Menace
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:09:00 -
[106]
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo
Concord is the Police. Somalia is the lawless space (0.4-0.0) where no laws apply. The assumption is quite simple - EVE is a harsh world where people shoot themselves. Insurance companies know it and pay you if your actions are not against the law. In empire we have the law, outside it - we don't, hence you didn't brake any by pirating / ganking / pvping / whatever.
Where did I say this was in lowsec? This is 1.0 super safe space where the raven died to NPC pirates.
Funny how the most heavilly patroled super safe space has entire pirate armadas roaming through it eh?
Also, I want your car insurance company that would insure a car being used in combat in Somalia.
Eve is a harsh universe so you get concord protection in safespace to make isk risk free? This is your idea of a harsh universe?
Space is a damn big thing and CONCORD is delegating pirate fleet destruction to players. So no biggie there.
And how is suicide ganking preventing players from doing missions? The only thing it's doing is annoying people and preventing use of freighters like they are supposed to be. With no insurance the bar is raised and the "oh so greatly skilled PvPers" will actually have to scan and select targets. I'm sure it's very difficult thing to do but if you are unable to adapt to that kind of change I'm afraid that kitty online is a better game for you :)
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Abrazzar
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:09:00 -
[107]
Hey, it's still a harsh and cruel universe: For pirates in highsec. -------- Ideas for: Mining
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Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:12:00 -
[108]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Blog In many cases, unsuspecting victims have no chance to escape , nor any help from CONCORD
That is the most worrying about-face I think I have seen CCP do.
I don't mind the changes too much, but I am concerned that it further upsets the balance between player and non-player corps. Immunity from war declarations needs to be looked at.
Something should be done IMO to get all but noobs out of NPC corporations. I think that a lot of players would enjoy Eve more if they experienced a player run corp.
Unfortunately I don't like the idea of forcing people to do something and truth is that:
* Players in player corps do make friends and associations. * Getting war decced is seriously unfunny if you aren't in to PvP. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran, 4+ years)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Andrue
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:16:00 -
[109]
Originally by: Sweet Laylah
Quote: It is too easy to gain back lost standing, taking only a few days to erase all the damage done by ganking.
Too easy?!
Regaining sec hits for shooting enemies in low sec is one of the most tedious tasks in the game .. after ratting and mission running.
Not everyone with a low sec rating is a pirate, war decs are extremely limited in use (not to mention waste of isks for small corps), especially in low sec around 0.0.
Nah.
I've done some pirating with my second account and getting back sec status was no big deal. I just ran a few L4 missions in a Sleipnir and used the drones to take the BS out. It took them about 20 minutes for one BS so I just left them at it while I did other stuff.
I was surprised by how relatively painless it was. Of course players that devote all their time to Eve will be bored but most people seem able to leave the client running while they get on with other stuff. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran, 4+ years)
[Brackley, UK]
My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned. |
Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:18:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Gabriel Karade Eh? Are you seriously trying to say Immersion isn't relevant?
If it didn't matter we wouldn't have Concord ships: your ship would simply explode if you aggressed someone in high-sec...
That wouldn't be much different from what we have now; ships spawn and then your ship explodes. It would be nice if everything was immersive, but the rule is that you die if you agress is highsec, so whatever mechanic enforces it will immediately inescapably destroy your ship. -
DesuSigs |
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Gamesguy
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:18:00 -
[111]
Originally by: Axhind
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo
Concord is the Police. Somalia is the lawless space (0.4-0.0) where no laws apply. The assumption is quite simple - EVE is a harsh world where people shoot themselves. Insurance companies know it and pay you if your actions are not against the law. In empire we have the law, outside it - we don't, hence you didn't brake any by pirating / ganking / pvping / whatever.
Where did I say this was in lowsec? This is 1.0 super safe space where the raven died to NPC pirates.
Funny how the most heavilly patroled super safe space has entire pirate armadas roaming through it eh?
Also, I want your car insurance company that would insure a car being used in combat in Somalia.
Eve is a harsh universe so you get concord protection in safespace to make isk risk free? This is your idea of a harsh universe?
Space is a damn big thing and CONCORD is delegating pirate fleet destruction to players. So no biggie there.
And how is suicide ganking preventing players from doing missions? The only thing it's doing is annoying people and preventing use of freighters like they are supposed to be. With no insurance the bar is raised and the "oh so greatly skilled PvPers" will actually have to scan and select targets. I'm sure it's very difficult thing to do but if you are unable to adapt to that kind of change I'm afraid that kitty online is a better game for you :)
Oh so thousand ship pirate armadas are delegated to players but single ship criminals concord cracks down on. That makes a lot of sense!
Suicide ganking is the only way to introduce some risk to the guy grinding L4s all day in a 5b pimped CNR.
Scan and select targets? What you think people suicide ganked at random? Are you seriously this out of touch with reality?
Yes I'm unable to adapt thats why I have a mothership and I partake in what ccp considers the end game - 0.0 alliance warfare. Highsec is just such a scary place you know, I couldn't deal with it so I fled to 0.0!
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:21:00 -
[112]
so an NPC corp hugging mission runner is practicaly immune to any PVP which isnt classed as greifing (he is gonna have to fly about 4 Billion fit to be worth a look at, and if its not for profit then its one expensive lul bucket)
wow. ****ing ace, no no no, really. nice one.
eve> going from shit to shita.
Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Redback911
Malevolent Intentions
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:25:00 -
[113]
As a fulltime pirate I always thought hi-sec ganking was an utterly broken mechanic. You get to windowshop your targets without consequence and choose your risk and reward - where is the balance in that?
All we need now is lvl 4's moved to lowsec :-)
(never happen but I can dream)
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:25:00 -
[114]
Originally by: Sorted so an NPC corp hugging mission runner is practicaly immune to any PVP which isnt classed as greifing
or, you know, maybe go kill someone who's looking for a fight?
but then you'd be space dust, amirite?
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:26:00 -
[115]
Where the hell is the risk vs reward balance for mission runners?? Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:29:00 -
[116]
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Sorted so an NPC corp hugging mission runner is practicaly immune to any PVP which isnt classed as greifing
or, you know, maybe go kill someone who's looking for a fight?
but then you'd be space dust, amirite?
and who the hell are you??
Eve is non-consentual PVP.
I suicde gank, gate camp and fight in small roaming gangs and have done ever since I started playing 3 years ago (if I even bother to log in anymore I would still be doing that)
I am not one of those many 0.0 chumps who fly following orders from their FC in a 100 man + gang. Camp gates/engage another 100+ gang listening for who to primary next then claim they are uber @ PVP.
If you find yourself in a fair fight you ****ed up. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:32:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Sorted and who the hell are you??
i'm the guy collecting your perfectly formed emo tears in a small glass jar and wonder just exactly how much low sec your corp has recently liberated.
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Redback911
Malevolent Intentions
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:34:00 -
[118]
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Sorted so an NPC corp hugging mission runner is practicaly immune to any PVP which isnt classed as greifing
or, you know, maybe go kill someone who's looking for a fight?
but then you'd be space dust, amirite?
If you think PVP in EVE is about people looking for a fight, you are so so wrong.
NPC corps need looking at, definitely. 6 Months in NPC corp Max, then it puts you in a version that can be wardecced. Then add 1 week timer to move corps.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:34:00 -
[119]
Edited by: Sorted on 06/08/2008 10:35:20
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Sorted and who the hell are you??
i'm the guy collecting your perfectly formed emo tears in a small glass jar and wonder just exactly how much low sec your corp has recently liberated.
wow - orgional...
check the KBs if your interested.
EDITL wow - smacktalking coward-alt guy - post with your main etc..(origional huh, u like that one?) Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:34:00 -
[120]
Suicideganking in High Sec was too easy, there was no risk and the reward was too high. This will be balanced now and thats all. No Hello Kitty. The PVP in EVE, Low Sec, 0.0, War Decs..will be the same after the changes.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:36:00 -
[121]
Originally by: Gul Rashen Suicideganking in High Sec was too easy, there was no risk and the reward was too high. This will be balanced now and thats all. No Hello Kitty. The PVP in EVE, Low Sec, 0.0, War Decs..will be the same after the changes.
mission running is just full of risk.... Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:36:00 -
[122]
Originally by: Gul Rashen Suicideganking in High Sec was too easy, there was no risk and the reward was too high. This will be balanced now and thats all. No Hello Kitty. The PVP in EVE, Low Sec, 0.0, War Decs..will be the same after the changes.
And when they nerf NPC corps, your little safe haven will be full of PvP too
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Karina Bellac
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:37:00 -
[123]
CCP:
What happened to "Nowhere is 100% safe."? |
copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:38:00 -
[124]
Originally by: Redback911 If you think PVP in EVE is about people looking for a fight, you are so so wrong.
look at my shocked little face!
pvp is where it's at, this i know - i just don't understand the mentality of the forum whining arschtards who insist that anyone they choose should be instantly accessible... it's nothing to get stressed about... move on, find anohter victim...
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:39:00 -
[125]
Originally by: copasetic sideways
look at my shocked little face!
pvp is where it's at, this i know - i just don't understand the mentality of the forum whining arschtards who insist that anyone they choose should be instantly accessible... it's nothing to get stressed about... move on, find anohter victim...
Post with your main and I'll show you accessible.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:40:00 -
[126]
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Redback911 If you think PVP in EVE is about people looking for a fight, you are so so wrong.
look at my shocked little face!
pvp is where it's at, this i know - i just don't understand the mentality of the forum whining arschtards who insist that anyone they choose should be instantly accessible... it's nothing to get stressed about... move on, find anohter victim...
If they undock they should be accessible. End of.
currently war decs are broken (corp hopping is legal) NPC corps are a complete safe haven for the lazy (those that cba to corp hop) Suicde ganking is the only recourse against smacktalking tardmonkeys. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Tharukan Desm'ar
Gallente The Ninth Circle Accord Corporate Enterprise Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:41:00 -
[127]
Edited by: Tharukan Desm''ar on 06/08/2008 10:42:30 After reading the dev blog I actually don't see any problems in the proposed changes. Especially the insurance not paying out when concords involved. That never made any sense seeing a criminal get payouts after losing his ship committing an illegal action.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:42:00 -
[128]
Originally by: Sorted wow - orgional...
not really, it's just a game of catchphrase: "saywhatyasee, mr chips"
Originally by: Sorted check the KBs if your interested.
i'm not - i'm sure your stats are as mighty as your mouth. no, really. no, no, really.
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:42:00 -
[129]
Edited by: Gul Rashen on 06/08/2008 10:43:48
Originally by: Sorted
Originally by: Gul Rashen Suicideganking in High Sec was too easy, there was no risk and the reward was too high. This will be balanced now and thats all. No Hello Kitty. The PVP in EVE, Low Sec, 0.0, War Decs..will be the same after the changes.
mission running is just full of risk....
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen Suicideganking in High Sec was too easy, there was no risk and the reward was too high. This will be balanced now and thats all. No Hello Kitty. The PVP in EVE, Low Sec, 0.0, War Decs..will be the same after the changes.
And when they nerf NPC corps, your little safe haven will be full of PvP too
First, i live in Low Sec and am a PvP'ler I only run Missions to pay my Accounts with ISK.
That Missions are too easy is different Problem. But its in my interest that many ppl play EVE and its ok for me that they play it in a different way than i do. For the Missionrunners pimping their Ships is one of their goals in EVE. And why not? I like Ganking and i like PVP, but i don't like ganking without any risk and possibility for the victim to protct himself.
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:45:00 -
[130]
Originally by: Karina Bellac CCP:
What happened to "Nowhere is 100% safe."?
Still isn't. It's just "safe to an extent as intended"
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:45:00 -
[131]
Originally by: Gul Rashen First, i live in Low Sec and am a PvP'ler I only run Missions to pay my Accounts with ISK.
That Missions are too easy is different Problem. But its in my interest that many ppl play EVE and its ok for me that they play it in a different way than i do. For the Missionrunners pimping their Ships is one of their goals in EVE. And why not? I like Ganking and i like PVP, but i don't like ganking without any risk and possibility for the victim to protct himself.
Saying that gank victims have no possibility of protecting themselves makes it painfully obvious you don't PvP, so stop lying about that.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:46:00 -
[132]
Originally by: Ki An Saying that gank victims have no possibility of protecting themselves makes it painfully obvious you don't PvP, so stop lying about that.
shhhh little children, the adults are talking
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:47:00 -
[133]
Edited by: Ki An on 06/08/2008 10:47:06
Originally by: copasetic sideways
shhhh little children, the adults are talking
Post with your main, 08-boy.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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FDUSPYZOR
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:48:00 -
[134]
Why didn't CCP just remove Cargo Scanners?
War Decs will be next I suppose.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:48:00 -
[135]
Ahh, gankbear tears.
Can I have your stuff?
(Yea, I know I'm 5 pages late, but I just came back from a vacation, cut me some slack will ya)
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:48:00 -
[136]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen First, i live in Low Sec and am a PvP'ler I only run Missions to pay my Accounts with ISK.
That Missions are too easy is different Problem. But its in my interest that many ppl play EVE and its ok for me that they play it in a different way than i do. For the Missionrunners pimping their Ships is one of their goals in EVE. And why not? I like Ganking and i like PVP, but i don't like ganking without any risk and possibility for the victim to protct himself.
Saying that gank victims have no possibility of protecting themselves makes it painfully obvious you don't PvP, so stop lying about that.
The volume of suicide kills I have gotten from warping through that acceleration gate into a mission. watching the guy @45+K warp off, Warping to a close by planet myself and then back into the mission spot/gate only to see the guy land a few seconds later is staggering, but a fool and his isk are soon parted.
The runners have multiple ways to avoid suicde ganks, so too do the haulers.
in my experince most are too lazy or stupid to implement any of them tho.... Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Belmarduk
Amarr de Prieure Four Elements
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:49:00 -
[137]
"In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future."
This is good - Very good - As it should have been since the beginning, but not so sure about the rest... hm.
CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:51:00 -
[138]
Originally by: Belmarduk "In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future."
This is good - Very good - As it should have been since the beginning, but not so sure about the rest... hm.
Bin all insurance and be done with it! Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:51:00 -
[139]
Originally by: Ki An Post with your main, 08-boy.
i'm off to get a sandwich, you silly goose
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FDUSPYZOR
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:52:00 -
[140]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen Suicideganking in High Sec was too easy, there was no risk and the reward was too high. This will be balanced now and thats all. No Hello Kitty. The PVP in EVE, Low Sec, 0.0, War Decs..will be the same after the changes.
And when they nerf NPC corps, your little safe haven will be full of PvP too
You have no idea that NPC corps will be nerfed. Unless you have some proof that nobody else is aware of.
It's cleart that CCP want a safer Eve.
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:52:00 -
[141]
Edited by: Gul Rashen on 06/08/2008 10:55:48
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen First, i live in Low Sec and am a PvP'ler I only run Missions to pay my Accounts with ISK.
That Missions are too easy is different Problem. But its in my interest that many ppl play EVE and its ok for me that they play it in a different way than i do. For the Missionrunners pimping their Ships is one of their goals in EVE. And why not? I like Ganking and i like PVP, but i don't like ganking without any risk and possibility for the victim to protct himself.
Saying that gank victims have no possibility of protecting themselves makes it painfully obvious you don't PvP, so stop lying about that.
I talk about Suicideganking Missionrunners. What possibilities have they? Fly with cheap Fitting or stay on Station? Lol. And beware of saying that ppl are lying, when you don't know them. Thats not nice and kiddielike.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:52:00 -
[142]
Originally by: FDUSPYZOR
It's cleart that CCP want a safer Eve.
urmm.. hence the thread? Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:54:00 -
[143]
Originally by: FDUSPYZOR
You have no idea that NPC corps will be nerfed. Unless you have some proof that nobody else is aware of.
Just a healthy dose of common sense. My faith in CCP abilities aren't all gone yet. They're just throwing a few bones to the bears to keep them occupied, and then the crank down comes.
Originally by: FDUSPYZOR
It's cleart that CCP want a safer Eve.
No.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Belmarduk
Amarr de Prieure Four Elements
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:54:00 -
[144]
Originally by: Sorted
Originally by: Belmarduk "In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future."
This is good - Very good - As it should have been since the beginning, but not so sure about the rest... hm.
Bin all insurance and be done with it!
/signed CCP Please give us casual players a Skill-Queue !
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:54:00 -
[145]
Originally by: Gul Rashen
I talk about Suicideganking Missionrunners. What possibilities have they? Fly with cheap Fitting or stay on Station? Lol. And beware of saying that ppl are lying you don't know. Thats not nice and kiddielike.
plenty of options for runners.
Drop a can at the warp in point, move 30k from the can. Fly aligned. Use an alt to watch the entry gate. undock using an off grid undock insta to avoid scans., set the scanner to 1m KM and tap it occasionaly
the list goes on.
L2P Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:55:00 -
[146]
Originally by: Volarius The cool kids live in 0.0 and lowsec anyways.
At least with these changes we'll have less bear whining.
Heh, you really think so?
Next up: war-decs.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:57:00 -
[147]
Originally by: Gul Rashen
I talk about Suicideganking Missionrunners. What possibilities have they? Fly with cheap Fitting or stay on Station? Lol.
Again you demonstrate your lack of knowledge. It is this exact lack of knowledge that has led us to this situation. People are too ****ing stupid to examine the options they have.
I often haul through high sec. Do you know how many times I've been suicide ganked? Zero. Out of all the people I know (all of them fairly level headed, intelligent individuals), do you know how many of them have been suicide ganked? Zero. The reason is that we use the options available to us.
Originally by: Gul Rashen
And beware of saying that ppl are lying you don't know. Thats not nice and kiddielike.
Stop lying and I'll stop telling you to stop lying.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:58:00 -
[148]
Originally by: Malcanis
Next up: war-decs.
what?? again?? lol they are already more impotent than a 90yr old man. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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hedfunk
Caldari Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:58:00 -
[149]
I suspect an avalanche of Low Sec Liberator posts! Where are you Skunk!?
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Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles Zzz
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Posted - 2008.08.06 10:58:00 -
[150]
Quite a few different things have led to the current situation. For one, mineral prices have fallen significantly from the original 'base' levels on which insurance payouts are still based. There are so many competing people producing ships in central locations that prices are hovering only a few % above build costs. We also have faction ammo & heat, which, when combined, can give attackers a massive temporary advantage in the few seconds before CONCORD shows up.
Differentiating the penalties by sec status will not make much difference - a large fraction of suicide attacks already take place in 0.5 systems. The response time change will not make a great deal of difference except vs. freighters; most other targets are likely to go down in 1 volley anyway. Taking down a freighter is now going to cost about 750m isk (up from 150m).
I'd like to see some clarification of exactly which standings are supposed to affect the sec status penalties - is the standings between the characters concerned, their corporations/alliances, their sec status, or faction standings that will count?
The insurance change is going to annoy a lot of dual-boxers. Consider this scenario: raven + basilisk doing a level 4 mission. The raven accidentally does something to the basilisk, which is remote repping it, and dies to concord; the basilisk continues to repair it while it has a global criminal flag, and is also shot down by concord. Only now, no insurance payout is made for either ship, and the owner is down by about 200m isk.
Zzz research towers Direrie NEW: Liekuri
20:1 low-end compression |
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:00:00 -
[151]
Originally by: Sorted Where the hell is the risk vs reward balance for mission runners??
In the dev blog OP is crying about.
Btw, RvsR is built in to missionrunning already. You can have your supertank fairly cheap but then your performance will suck. Or you can exponentially raise the pricetag of your ship to have your supertank AND passable performance, but then you become a gank target regardless of these insurance changes, which raise suicidepirate overhead only so much. Or you can have good performance by cutting the tanking margin close, risking loosing your ships to rats, something lag and desynchs make more common.
Oh, another newsflash, people loose ships to npc's *all* the time, even experienced runners, which invariably means there is risk in missionrunning even player pirates interfering. Despite what gankers like Ki or Sorted keep claiming.
I wish Eyejog, Prism or someone else at CCP would release some more detailed numbers and statistics on ship losses, so it would be possible to prove it in threads like these.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:00:00 -
[152]
Originally by: hedfunk I suspect an avalanche of Low Sec Liberator posts! Where are you Skunk!?
damnit hedfunk. get ur whine on. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:03:00 -
[153]
Originally by: Sorted
plenty of options for runners.
1. Drop a can at the warp in point, move 30k from the can. 2. Fly aligned. 3. Use an alt to watch the entry gate. 4. undock using an off grid undock insta to avoid scans., 5. set the scanner to 1m KM and tap it occasionaly
1. See 3. 2. Only possible if you don't have to watch the distance to the NPC's (Cruise Missile-User) 3. Do they come through the Gate, when you get probed out? I don't know, wasn't ganked in Missions cause i use T2-Stuff. 4. signed 5. and? Then they can also watch the local. But you don't know who is a Ganker and who not.
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Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:03:00 -
[154]
Originally by: Gamesguy
The vast majority of suicide gankers are 0.0 players doing it to make isk. The vast majority routinely pvp in 0.0/lowsec, the suicide ganking is merely an isk farming activity.
I think the boleded part will make a perfect signature.
So you admit that suicide ganking is a form of farming, but you think is all ok as the people farming are 0.0 Pvpers alt?
And then you call mission runners carebears but suicide ganking is not carebearing?
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:03:00 -
[155]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Oh, another newsflash, people loose ships to npc's *all* the time, even experienced runners, which invariably means there is risk in missionrunning even player pirates interfering. Despite what gankers like Ki or Sorted keep claiming.
without detailed numbers I still lean on the argument that if its not PVP and you lost your ship to anything other than a massive lag spike then you shouldnt be undocking it realy.
fitting uber tanks to compenstate for the lag tho, now thats a different issue.
clowns who cant fly, or protect themselves.. i think thats what we are discussing here.... Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:04:00 -
[156]
Originally by: Gul Rashen Edited by: Gul Rashen on 06/08/2008 10:52:41
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen First, i live in Low Sec and am a PvP'ler I only run Missions to pay my Accounts with ISK.
That Missions are too easy is different Problem. But its in my interest that many ppl play EVE and its ok for me that they play it in a different way than i do. For the Missionrunners pimping their Ships is one of their goals in EVE. And why not? I like Ganking and i like PVP, but i don't like ganking without any risk and possibility for the victim to protct himself.
Saying that gank victims have no possibility of protecting themselves makes it painfully obvious you don't PvP, so stop lying about that.
I talk about Suicideganking Missionrunners. What possibilities have they? Fly with cheap Fitting or stay on Station? Lol. And beware of saying that ppl are lying you don't know. Thats not nice and kiddielike.
suicide ganking mission runners is the risk vs reward the carebears whine so much about.
You make free isk in empire and even more then a 0.0 ratter does with no risk of dieing from the rats unless u run a lvl5 and even that cant be soloed.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:04:00 -
[157]
Originally by: Sorted
Bin all insurance and be done with it!
That'd be fine, as long as actual new players had some extra security for a bit after starting. Of course it'd have to be implemented so that recycled suicide alts, which happen despite being declared an exploit, could not take advantage of it.
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:04:00 -
[158]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen
I talk about Suicideganking Missionrunners. What possibilities have they? Fly with cheap Fitting or stay on Station? Lol.
Again you demonstrate your lack of knowledge. It is this exact lack of knowledge that has led us to this situation. People are too ****ing stupid to examine the options they have.
I often haul through high sec. Do you know how many times I've been suicide ganked? Zero. Out of all the people I know (all of them fairly level headed, intelligent individuals), do you know how many of them have been suicide ganked? Zero. The reason is that we use the options available to us.
Stop lying and I'll stop telling you to stop lying.
Read the post. I was not talking about Haulers and come visite me in Oulley for a cup of Tea.
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Delichon
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:05:00 -
[159]
To the OP:
Welcome to the Hello Kitty Online. For free cake please proceed to the closest lowsec-to-0.0 bottleneck system. Faction fitted ships get a priority at cake-sharing. Enjoy your cake. Good bye. ------------------------------------------ All nerfs are meant to hurt you personally. They will be nerfing you directly next.
EVE A new game every 6 months. (c) Atomos Darksun |
Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:06:00 -
[160]
Originally by: Gul Rashen
Originally by: Sorted
plenty of options for runners.
1. Drop a can at the warp in point, move 30k from the can. 2. Fly aligned. 3. Use an alt to watch the entry gate. 4. undock using an off grid undock insta to avoid scans., 5. set the scanner to 1m KM and tap it occasionaly
1. See 3. 2. Only possible if you don't have to watch the distance to the NPC's (Cruise Missile-User) 3. Do they come through the Gate, when you get probed out? I don't know, wasn't ganked in Missions cause i use T2-Stuff. 4. signed 5. and? Then they can also watch the local. But you don't know who is a Ganker and who not.
so you havent been ganked, and never have ganked.. and your chirping up why?
3. Yes, of course. through the same gate you went through. use a back scout. (..waaaa.. i want to fly solo, well they have a few folk, so at least invest in an alt to protect ur multi billion mission ship) 5. (if you see a few ships within that range your in trouble)
and i repeat: so you havent been ganked, and never have ganked.. and your chirping up why? Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Tippia
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:06:00 -
[161]
Originally by: Axhind Should have been the main thing for CSM. Kick the bastards out of the NPC corps (by limiting attacking, ships they can use, mission levels, whatever). Plus they need to fix the jump corps when war decced crap too. It would enable a lot more PvP in empire as NPC corps are used only for avoiding war deccs now days (and it's not only empire carebears there, there is plenty of 0.0 alts there too).
Unless you also remove all control PC corps have over who can and can't join their ranks, this is a utterly moronic idea. You want players out of NPC corps? Then all limitations to joining PC corps must be removed as well. No more interviews; no more vetting; no more waiting for the CEO to accept you – just click "join" and you're in. Kicking people out would probably still be allowed, but guess what – click "join", and they're right back in. Sound like an awful idea? Yes, but that's what will be required.
You see, you don't get to tell me what people I must play with. I do. If I choose not to join a PC corps because I can't find one that a) isn't run by complete morons and b) doesn't require previous experience/tons of SP/inside connections, then that's my choice – not yours. If you don't like it, you can go jump in a lake.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:07:00 -
[162]
Originally by: Delichon To the OP:
Welcome to the Hello Kitty Online. For free cake please proceed to the closest lowsec-to-0.0 bottleneck system. Faction fitted ships get a priority at cake-sharing. Enjoy your cake. Good bye.
nice corp.... Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:07:00 -
[163]
Originally by: Tharukan Desm'ar insurance [...] sense
/facepalm -
DesuSigs |
Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:09:00 -
[164]
Originally by: Tippia Sound like an awful idea? Yes, but that's what will be required.
Or you could, you know, form your own one man corp? Or CCP could introduce specific wardeccable NPC corps? -
DesuSigs |
Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:10:00 -
[165]
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Redback911 If you think PVP in EVE is about people looking for a fight, you are so so wrong.
look at my shocked little face!
pvp is where it's at, this i know - i just don't understand the mentality of the forum whining arschtards who insist that anyone they choose should be instantly accessible... it's nothing to get stressed about... move on, find anohter victim...
Well, since you haven't been playing this game more than a couple of months, no wonder you don't understand.
Also you seem pretty fond of the sound your keyboard make
First!
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:11:00 -
[166]
Edited by: Gul Rashen on 06/08/2008 11:14:31
Originally by: Sorted
3. Yes, of course. through the same gate you went through. use a back scout. (..waaaa.. i want to fly solo, well they have a few folk, so at least invest in an alt to protect ur multi billion mission ship)
OK, i didn't knew that. Some of my Informations only come through the Forums and Friends. And yes, i've never Ganked Missionrunners. It's not my Style. I like roaming Gangs more, more thrill. But not i'm the theme here but the upcomig changes. Its possible to discuss this with arguments and without offenses.
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Moonmonkey
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:12:00 -
[167]
"In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future."
This must have seeded a few carebear tears, thats right gankers can be carebears to.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:12:00 -
[168]
Originally by: Gul Rashen Read the post. I was not talking about Haulers and come visite me in Oulley for a cup of Tea.
And you're still dumb. Mission runners have the option to not make themselves into targets. By fitting T2 instead of faction and officer for example. If you fit expensive, you increase your risk. That's how it is now.
After the nerf, mission runners will be completely safe. The amount of BS it takes to take out a CNR before CONCORD shows up is going to make it improfitable. Hence, this is a HUGE boost to NPC corp high sec mission runners. Just like they needed another boost.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:13:00 -
[169]
Originally by: Gul Rashen
OK, i didn't knew that. Some of my Informations only come through the Forums and Friends. And yes, i've never Ganked Missionrunners. It's not my Style. I like roaming Gangs more, more thrill.
What did I tell you about lying?
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:14:00 -
[170]
Originally by: Gul Rashen
Originally by: Sorted
3. Yes, of course. through the same gate you went through. use a back scout. (..waaaa.. i want to fly solo, well they have a few folk, so at least invest in an alt to protect ur multi billion mission ship)
OK, i didn't knew that. Some of my Informations only come through the Forums and Friends. And yes, i've never Ganked Missionrunners. It's not my Style. I like roaming Gangs more, more thrill.
how do you know. You have NEVER tried it.
wtfs up with you??
why are you here??? Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Gul Rashen
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:16:00 -
[171]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Gul Rashen
OK, i didn't knew that. Some of my Informations only come through the Forums and Friends. And yes, i've never Ganked Missionrunners. It's not my Style. I like roaming Gangs more, more thrill.
What did I tell you about lying?
I was uninformed but not lying. Stop your Offenses.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:18:00 -
[172]
Edited by: Ki An on 06/08/2008 11:18:52
Originally by: Gul Rashen I was uninformed but not lying. Stop your Offenses. If you wanna figths then fight IG.
You where lying about PvPing again. You don't PvP. It's obvious.
I'll take you up on your offer though. Fit faction and meet me in Tash Murkon region.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Max Warg
Caldari Chosen Path
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:18:00 -
[173]
Edited by: Max Warg on 06/08/2008 11:19:37 Those who choses to play the criminal will finally be treated as criminals by the game. Its by choice we gank in empire space. I dont make a carrear as a pirate but have been known to follow 0.0 foes into low sec and attack. I may have to re-think that one. Now that i cant rat for a while and repair my sec status. While not nessasary good for me, I do like these changes. My only concern is what happens over time will be that all pirates/ criminal activity will be removed all togather from empire as there security status gets worse and worse. Esentialy making large areas of safe space except for budding criminals that can still operate there. Max
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Redback911
Malevolent Intentions
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:18:00 -
[174]
If you don't leave you NPC corp within 6 months, you are thrown into a sister NPC corp that can (and I'm sure will be consntantly) be wardecced. That way people are more than encouraged to move into a Player Corp where some kind of organised defence can be undertaken.
Then, change corp leaving timer to 7 days regardless of roles.
Then move level 4 missions to lowsec, and implement exploaration mining belts (proper ones) with decent ore in lowsec and 0.0.
There you go - risk vs reward.
And for those who moan about lvl 4 missions in lowsec - why is it so hard for mission runners to band together to fight pirates? I know several successful corps in this regard.
Stop playing EVE like it's a 1 player game with a chat interface.
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Delichon
Perkone
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:18:00 -
[175]
Edited by: Delichon on 06/08/2008 11:23:54 "L4-carebears" debate is so much like "AFK-cloakers" debate.
Can't shoot you, can't give intel on you, yet some how ****es an incredible number of people off. ------------------------------------------ All nerfs are meant to hurt you personally. They will be nerfing you directly next.
EVE A new game every 6 months. (c) Atomos Darksun |
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:21:00 -
[176]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Axhind Should have been the main thing for CSM. Kick the bastards out of the NPC corps (by limiting attacking, ships they can use, mission levels, whatever). Plus they need to fix the jump corps when war decced crap too. It would enable a lot more PvP in empire as NPC corps are used only for avoiding war deccs now days (and it's not only empire carebears there, there is plenty of 0.0 alts there too).
Unless you also remove all control PC corps have over who can and can't join their ranks, this is a utterly moronic idea. You want players out of NPC corps? Then all limitations to joining PC corps must be removed as well. No more interviews; no more vetting; no more waiting for the CEO to accept you û just click "join" and you're in. Kicking people out would probably still be allowed, but guess what û click "join", and they're right back in. Sound like an awful idea? Yes, but that's what will be required.
You see, you don't get to tell me what people I must play with. I do. If I choose not to join a PC corps because I can't find one that a) isn't run by complete morons and b) doesn't require previous experience/tons of SP/inside connections, then that's my choice û not yours. If you don't like it, you can go jump in a lake.
Heres a tip for you.
Start youre own corp ? Since you only seem to love yourself. cost is something like 2 million if i remember correctly.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:21:00 -
[177]
Edited by: Qui Shon on 06/08/2008 11:22:10
Originally by: Serj
Also you seem pretty fond of the sound your keyboard make
Actually, I found this bog standard Dell OEM keyboard in a pile of unused stuff at work, and it has the most delightful feel and a nice sound too. I now like it more then any of the "pro" keyboards I've used over the years.
Hmm, have to post some more I think.
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ramzahn
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:26:00 -
[178]
The griefers are grieving?
Really?
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Stab Wounds
Caldari State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:26:00 -
[179]
hahah griefers had this coming for a long time. maybe you griefers in this thread should try fighting people that can fight back? first the nano-nerf and this. This game is turning out quite well.
Adapt or die losers.
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Furb Killer
Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:29:00 -
[180]
Like usual people are thinking the other side has it easier than what you do.
Remember when heavy dictors were introduced? All the carebears whining it would become grief online. Now security status will actually mean something and you are all whining you cant keep suicide ganking in high sec with little to no cost.
This means only one thing for the suicide gankers for profit: You dont gank everything which has more than 5M isk in its cargohold for profit, you only do it when you really profit from it. It doesnt make any sense that concord would allow people in high security space when it is known they will suicide gank a ship. (and its crew does not have clones waiting).
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Kash Ka
Amarr Point of No Return Vanguard.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:29:00 -
[181]
I dont like the idea that if u get killed by CONCORD u wont get ur insurance, what if u accidentally shoot something ur not ment to but didnt know it? Or u accidentally shoot ur out of corp buddy instead of repairing him/her ect. Not cool CCP iv never suicide ganked, um successfully, but the ammount of ships if lost to CONCORD is rediculouse because of locking the wrong thing then shooting and not relising until i see a blob of CONCORD shooting me, followed by an explosion and me thinking wtf.
Oh and sometimes people with a negative sec stat might accidentally jump into a system that there not alowed to enter without relising it then loose there ship. Iv done that a few times cause the system im ment to go to had a similar name to one i cant enter i.e malakalen and kalkalen or something like that. --------------==============================-------------- Forgiveness is between you and god, im just here to arrange the meeting. |
Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:30:00 -
[182]
Originally by: ramzahn The griefers are grieving?
Really?
Yeah, the amount of Pandemic Whineage in the devblog thread is quite awesome. Sweet music to my ears.
So highsec ganking will actually need some brains and planning now? The horror.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:30:00 -
[183]
all the gloaters in this thread need to shut the hell up, else your low sec will be liberated and ki an will probably stick his little underwear-sniffing face in too....
sorry if this sounds like an episode of judging amy... oh wait, this *is* an episode of judging amy
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Delichon
Perkone
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 11:30:00 -
[184]
Join 0.0 No Concord there! Free PVP! No sec hit!
You can get ... ehem... killed though... ------------------------------------------ All nerfs are meant to hurt you personally. They will be nerfing you directly next.
EVE A new game every 6 months. (c) Atomos Darksun |
Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:32:00 -
[185]
Originally by: Qui Shon Edited by: Qui Shon on 06/08/2008 11:22:10
Originally by: Serj
Also you seem pretty fond of the sound your keyboard make
Actually, I found this bog standard Dell OEM keyboard in a pile of unused stuff at work, and it has the most delightful feel and a nice sound too. I now like it more then any of the "pro" keyboards I've used over the years.
Hmm, have to post some more I think.
is this your main copasetic sideways.. is it? did you press the wrong button? SWEEEET. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:33:00 -
[186]
Originally by: Stab Wounds Edited by: Stab Wounds on 06/08/2008 11:27:34 hahah grievers had this coming for a long time. maybe you grievers in this thread should try fighting people that can fight back? first the nano-nerf and this. This game is turning out quite well.
Adapt or die losers.
Yeah since u seem unable to adapt the rest of eve will have to suffer. As fight people who can fight back, you can fight back but apperntly u lack the ability to fight back so we need to fall down to your level of stupidity.
Thank you for that one.
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Furb Killer
Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:33:00 -
[187]
Edited by: Furb Killer on 06/08/2008 11:34:07
Originally by: Kash Ka I dont like the idea that if u get killed by CONCORD u wont get ur insurance, what if u accidentally shoot something ur not ment to but didnt know it? Or u accidentally shoot ur out of corp buddy instead of repairing him/her ect. Not cool CCP iv never suicide ganked, um successfully, but the ammount of ships if lost to CONCORD is rediculouse because of locking the wrong thing then shooting and not relising until i see a blob of CONCORD shooting me, followed by an explosion and me thinking wtf.
Oh and sometimes people with a negative sec stat might accidentally jump into a system that there not alowed to enter without relising it then loose there ship. Iv done that a few times cause the system im ment to go to had a similar name to one i cant enter i.e malakalen and kalkalen or something like that.
There are those nice warning messages that warn you when you are doing something stupid. Use them. (and no you cant disable warning message you are shooting neutral in high sec).
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:34:00 -
[188]
Originally by: copasetic sideways all the gloaters in this thread need to shut the hell up, else your low sec will be liberated and ki an will probably stick his little underwear-sniffing face in too....
sorry if this sounds like an episode of judging amy... oh wait, this *is* an episode of judging amy
I'm the childish one.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Hungo
Minmatar Nightfallz
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 11:35:00 -
[189]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
Noty everyone likes to fly around killing other pklayers u silly little fool, we deserve righst to play as we see fiot, whetehr u agree or not
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Malachon Draco
eXceed Inc. eXceed.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:36:00 -
[190]
And another change to make Eve more idiotproof.
Congrats. What's next? A ban on scamming and griefing people with wardecs?
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:36:00 -
[191]
Originally by: Malachon Draco And another change to make Eve more idiotproof.
Congrats. What's next? A ban on scamming and griefing people with wardecs?
Ya cant grief with war decs. they just hop corp..... Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:38:00 -
[192]
Originally by: Hungo
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
Noty everyone likes to fly around killing other pklayers u silly little fool, we deserve righst to play as we see fiot, whetehr u agree or not
Stop trolling. This is a serious discussion.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Aaron Mirrorsaver
Warped Mining
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:39:00 -
[193]
so suicide ganking will have more penalties now and not be as carefree and there not as loved by griefers because it actually makes you KOS faster, and harder to regain that sec... boo hoo.
C.E.O.
Go Hard, or go Home.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:41:00 -
[194]
Originally by: Sorted is this your main copasetic sideways.. is it? did you press the wrong button? SWEEEET.
confirming i am da alt in da op... uuuuhh.... yea, if that's what puts the beef in your curtains, baby....
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:41:00 -
[195]
Originally by: Stab Wounds Edited by: Stab Wounds on 06/08/2008 11:27:34 hahah grievers had this coming for a long time. maybe you grievers in this thread should try fighting people that can fight back? first the nano-nerf and this. This game is turning out quite well.
Adapt or die losers.
Maybe you should try fighting back instead of whining for protection from CCP.
Cry or fail, loser.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:41:00 -
[196]
Originally by: Aaron Mirrorsaver so suicide ganking will have more penalties now and not be as carefree and there not as loved by griefers because it actually makes you KOS faster, and harder to regain that sec... boo hoo.
Its the standard over nerf,
Privs> 250 wars down to 4 Nano> lol 75% nerf on ma mach Ganking> need double the firepower, 60x the cost. increase in number in the loot split. Puts the "target" over 4Billion in fits to be viable. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:43:00 -
[197]
Originally by: Malcanis Maybe you should try fighting back instead of whining for protection from CCP.
the beautiful thing is - they're getting protection and there's not a gosh darned thing you can do about it other than vent hot hot air on the forums.
open wide, time for another spoonful.
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Granmethedon III
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:44:00 -
[198]
What a terrible, terrible proposal.
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Higgs Foton
Scoopex Zenith Affinity
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 11:44:00 -
[199]
I don't think these changes are bad, though suicide ganking was a great weapon against the ISK farmers, and that goes away now. Unless you indeed force people out of the NPC corps after a few months. That makes ISK farming quite difficult, since some corps will take it up to wardec every farmer corps they find. Great fun ahead!
Implement these changes, and force people out of npc corps after a few months (maybe into their own one person corps) seems like a good way to go to me. ___________________________________
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Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:47:00 -
[200]
Originally by: Malcanis
Maybe you should try fighting back instead of whining for protection from CCP.
If you want to blame someone, blame the Goons. I doubt this would be happening without their "kill everyone we can just for shits and giggles" campaigns.
Me, I'm actually thanking the Goons (hey, there's a first time for everything ). Forcing highsec ganking to actually carry an itty bitty element of risk and careful target selection is all good.
The fact that lowsec sucks in general is another separate matter that I hope CCP does something about in the future.
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:48:00 -
[201]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
Just as funny as seeing all the suicide gankers crying foul now
Cause we always get the shortend of the stick.
whilst the "bears" get what they want.
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
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MotherMoon
Huang Yinglong
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:53:00 -
[202]
oh no my low sec ganking now gives me a lot less sec hit?
I don't get it what's wrong.
Originally by: Dapanman1 Terrible idea, you're an idiot
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Sweet Laylah
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:54:00 -
[203]
Originally by: Andrue
Originally by: Sweet Laylah
Quote: It is too easy to gain back lost standing, taking only a few days to erase all the damage done by ganking.
Too easy?!
Regaining sec hits for shooting enemies in low sec is one of the most tedious tasks in the game .. after ratting and mission running.
Not everyone with a low sec rating is a pirate, war decs are extremely limited in use (not to mention waste of isks for small corps), especially in low sec around 0.0.
Nah.
I've done some pirating with my second account and getting back sec status was no big deal. I just ran a few L4 missions in a Sleipnir and used the drones to take the BS out. It took them about 20 minutes for one BS so I just left them at it while I did other stuff.
I was surprised by how relatively painless it was. Of course players that devote all their time to Eve will be bored but most people seem able to leave the client running while they get on with other stuff.
I don't have that luxury being always at war in empire or out in 0.0.
I seem to remeber CCP saying EVE wasn't meant to be played afk ...
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:55:00 -
[204]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Blog In many cases, unsuspecting victims have no chance to escape , nor any help from CONCORD
That is the most worrying about-face I think I have seen CCP do.
I don't mind the changes too much, but I am concerned that it further upsets the balance between player and non-player corps. Immunity from war declarations needs to be looked at.
It is funny how every time CCP changes a game mechanic, the people against the change dream up something new that they want changed in "retaliation."
Example: Nano nerf = crybabies wanting Drake tanks nerfed..lol
And you people are suppose to be the tough guys?..lol You are pathetic crybabies.
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Exlegion
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:57:00 -
[205]
These changes are mostly affecting the bottom feeders of Eve. And overall it is to shift the bulk of this kind of "PVP" to the outskirts of empire where it belongs. Unless you fit the category you won't see much change and there is no need for hysteria. It is not 'dumbing' down Eve.
Eve is a game for everyone, including the casual players that don't want to overly trouble themselves with details of precaution. Keep in mind there will still be risk for these players, but not as bad as in say, the lower levels of high security space and low security altogether.
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Gang Starr |
Tippia
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 11:57:00 -
[206]
Originally by: Crumplecorn
Originally by: Tippia Sound like an awful idea? Yes, but that's what will be required.
Or you could, you know, form your own one man corp? Or CCP could introduce specific wardeccable NPC corps?
a) No, because I like the social aspect of being in a large corp. b) Maybe, but they would most likely just be permadecced by everyone and their mother (I mean, who doesn't want to kill newbs? ), making them completely unattractive and might as well not be there. It probably could work, but would be difficult to implement well.
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 11:59:00 -
[207]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
Just as funny as seeing all the suicide gankers crying foul now
Cause we always get the shortend of the stick.
whilst the "bears" get what they want.
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Um what?
What have "gankers" had that they for 4 years? Repeated concord buffs?
Or do you mean the possibility of non-consensual PvP at all?
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Malcanis
We are Legend
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 12:00:00 -
[208]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: Blog In many cases, unsuspecting victims have no chance to escape , nor any help from CONCORD
That is the most worrying about-face I think I have seen CCP do.
I don't mind the changes too much, but I am concerned that it further upsets the balance between player and non-player corps. Immunity from war declarations needs to be looked at.
It is funny how every time CCP changes a game mechanic, the people against the change dream up something new that they want changed in "retaliation."
Example: Nano nerf = crybabies wanting Drake tanks nerfed..lol
And you people are suppose to be the tough guys?..lol You are pathetic crybabies.
You're speaking as if people asking for a reform of the wardec system is a new thing.
So, is that because you're ignorant or dishonest?
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
copasetic sideways
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 12:02:00 -
[209]
Originally by: Ki An I'd say this guy is in Hydra or IRC.
well, if i get to choose, can we make it hydra? specifically, the corp that invented bacon.
thanks.
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TrulyKosh
Gallente Solo for UNCLE
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:02:00 -
[210]
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: Caldreean I have no issue with the concept of suicide ganking. But it shouldn't be as easy as it is now. This tries to address that, and that's fine with me.
And all you people spazzing out about the loss of insurance, boo hoo. Ganker tears are delicious! If you want to waste your ship ganking, party on, but let's be real here. With how easy it is to recycle alts (regardless of CCPs stance against it) or work standing back up, there needs to be *some* price to pay. And this is it. Deal
Recycling alts is an exploit, if you think someone is doing this you can petition to get them banned. So thats not an argument.
And we all trust in the fact that it never happens, right? Negative Sec. status -> no alt recycling would be an easy fix.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:03:00 -
[211]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Then why havent u managed to adapt during four frekkin years ? Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
Next time check that your brain is connected before you engage your mouth.
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Cat Gilligan
Caldari Blair Corporation
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:04:00 -
[212]
The hardcore suicide gankers will just start using throwaway characters. You can train a freshly rolled toon to fly a caracal competently enough in a couple days.
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Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 12:05:00 -
[213]
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
Just as funny as seeing all the suicide gankers crying foul now
Cause we always get the shortend of the stick.
whilst the "bears" get what they want.
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Um what?
What have "gankers" had that they for 4 years? Repeated concord buffs?
Or do you mean the possibility of non-consensual PvP at all?
Concord buffs never seemed to make them too unhappy though, did it? Gankers have more than "had it their way" up until now. You are an idiot if you don't believe it. Do you even play the game or do you just post a lot on the forums?
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:07:00 -
[214]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Then why havent u managed to adapt during four frekkin years ? Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
Next time check that your brain is connected before you engage your mouth.
I wouldn't know, I never been ganked that way.
Doesn't stop me from recognizing you as being a total idiot though.
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NeoTheo
Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:07:00 -
[215]
by the time ambulation is released the devs will have watered down the game to the point where the most dangerious activity is sitting in station a knitting.
:-(
Neotheo Dark Materials
Linkage
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Lt Angus
Caldari Lt Angus Corp
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:07:00 -
[216]
Im gonna go suicide my way back to -10 in protest
Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
Hungo
Minmatar Nightfallz
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 12:10:00 -
[217]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Hungo
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
Noty everyone likes to fly around killing other pklayers u silly little fool, we deserve righst to play as we see fiot, whetehr u agree or not
Stop trolling. This is a serious discussion.
No actually it isnt, it's simply 10% iof the pvp base moaning because it just go harder to pick on carebears who like me, couldnt give a rats ass who owns what space and who war decced who.
Exactly why should we be war decced? Why should we be sucide ganked? Why should you have the right top destroy what we have worked for, because i knwo damn well if it was you who got hit liek we do, ud be on here with your moutyh making thread after thread
As always 10% of the eve base are forum *****s who sit here moaning day after day making ccp's job harder
Here's an idea, stop posting, and play the game for once
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:11:00 -
[218]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Malcanis
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Gamesguy Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
QFT!
Just as funny as seeing all the suicide gankers crying foul now
Cause we always get the shortend of the stick.
whilst the "bears" get what they want.
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Um what?
What have "gankers" had that they for 4 years? Repeated concord buffs?
Or do you mean the possibility of non-consensual PvP at all?
Concord buffs never seemed to make them too unhappy though, did it? Gankers have more than "had it their way" up until now. You are an idiot if you don't believe it. Do you even play the game or do you just post a lot on the forums?
I've been playing since September 06, thank you very much. Do you even play the game, or do you just make up stories on the forum?
And if you're trying to say that the CONCORD buffs were not objected to in the past, then you're even more ignorant than I'd thought. I suggest you keep quiet until you know what you're talking about.
I can tell you this, though: EVERY forum whine about suicide ganking has boiled down to this basic scenario:
Rich player/macroer goes AFK and gets ganked, then comes on to the forum to cry about it.
There's only two possible reasons for you to support a buff to this playstyle: (1) You're a new player too naive to realise this or (2) You're an AFKer who thinks you deserve to be safe without putting any effort into it.
Oh wait, (3) You're just a shit-stirring troll.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
amoros
Dark Materials
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 12:11:00 -
[219]
Originally by: NeoTheo
by the time ambulation is released the devs will have watered down the game to the point where the most dangerious activity is sitting in station a knitting.
:-(
So true its hurts..
This game really is becoming "who whines most wins"
A.
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:12:00 -
[220]
Originally by: Hungo
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Hungo
Originally by: Gaia Thorn So its finally happend the carebears have taken over eve.
Dev Blog
Noty everyone likes to fly around killing other pklayers u silly little fool, we deserve righst to play as we see fiot, whetehr u agree or not
Stop trolling. This is a serious discussion.
No actually it isnt, it's simply 10% iof the pvp base moaning because it just go harder to pick on carebears who like me, couldnt give a rats ass who owns what space and who war decced who.
Exactly why should we be war decced? Why should we be sucide ganked? Why should you have the right top destroy what we have worked for, because i knwo damn well if it was you who got hit liek we do, ud be on here with your moutyh making thread after thread
As always 10% of the eve base are forum *****s who sit here moaning day after day making ccp's job harder
Here's an idea, stop posting, and play the PvP game with non-consensual PvP as it's core ethos for once
Fixed and right back at you.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
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amoros
Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:12:00 -
[221]
Please do not water this fantastic game down anymore CCP.... PLEASE!
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Tippia
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:13:00 -
[222]
Originally by: Hungo Exactly why should we be war decced? Why should we be sucide ganked? Why should you have the right top destroy what we have worked for, because i knwo damn well if it was you who got hit liek we do, ud be on here with your moutyh making thread after thread
Because PvP is at the very heart of the game. Having to keep your stuff from being destroyed is the whole point of playing.
If you don't want that, then this game isn't for you. It's really as simple as that.
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Crae Matreki
Sten Industries
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:15:00 -
[223]
I can't believe people are threatening to quit over this!
The sec status changes are so-so.. it'll make things a bit slower to undo the damage, but not too much. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
The CONCORD changes sound interesting - if there's less ships, and no insta-lock from the battleships, won't that mean it's possible to tank them long enough to get a few more volleys off? It might actually work out better for the ganker in some cases!
The no insurance for CONCORD-related crimes makes sense - the gankers will have to think about what they kill again. Risk vs reward!
All in all, highsec still isn't safe, and I'm sure the idiots in their T1 haulers will still lose billions, and they'll still complain on the forums.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:17:00 -
[224]
Originally by: Tippia If you don't want that, then this game isn't for you. It's really as simple as that.
just keep telling yourself that....
meanwhile, the majority edge ever closer to increased protection from suicide ganking.
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Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:17:00 -
[225]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Hungo Exactly why should we be war decced? Why should we be sucide ganked? Why should you have the right top destroy what we have worked for, because i knwo damn well if it was you who got hit liek we do, ud be on here with your moutyh making thread after thread
Because PvP is at the very heart of the game. Having to keep your stuff from being destroyed is the whole point of playing.
If you don't want that, then this game isn't for you. It's really as simple as that.
My little sister wanted to play football but some nasty rough people took the ball away from her and kicked it all over the field and kicked it into her net like twenty times and she came home and she was crying because she just wanted to play football but they were so mean and they said she lost and laughed at her she just wanted to play football her way and she told mum and mum told her to get an EvE account and call the character Hungo.
True story.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 12:23:00 -
[226]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: copasetic sideways just keep telling yourself that....
meanwhile, the majority edge ever closer to increased protection from suicide ganking.
So you're saying that the majority is in NPC corps? Do you have any numbers to back this up?
The vast majority of EVE players are in highsec. This is direct from CCP. Make of that what you will.
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hedfunk
Caldari Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:23:00 -
[227]
Originally by: Cat Gilligan The hardcore suicide gankers will just start using throwaway characters. You can train a freshly rolled toon to fly a caracal competently enough in a couple days.
You can't gank crap with a caracal unless you have lots of them. Meaning the loot split is less.
CONCORD change does sound intresting...but I assume the frigs will still insta lock and ECM you. Just seems to be a lag reducing tactic.
Onceagain the carebears win. How many times have I had to say that now? Too many.
CCP should be paying me, the amount of isk farmers ive killed. I guess CCP just don't want people to find slightly creative ways of making money. L4 no risk missions, or 0.0 ratting. Or some uber fun trading.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:25:00 -
[228]
Originally by: Tippia So you're saying that the majority is in NPC corps? Do you have any numbers to back this up?
heh heh - crackaddictlogic is not logic...
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hedfunk
Caldari Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:25:00 -
[229]
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
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Dirk Magnum
Spearhead Endeavors
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:25:00 -
[230]
Originally by: Crae Matreki I can't believe people are threatening to quit over this!
The sec status changes are so-so.. it'll make things a bit slower to undo the damage, but not too much. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
The CONCORD changes sound interesting - if there's less ships, and no insta-lock from the battleships, won't that mean it's possible to tank them long enough to get a few more volleys off? It might actually work out better for the ganker in some cases!
The no insurance for CONCORD-related crimes makes sense - the gankers will have to think about what they kill again. Risk vs reward!
All in all, highsec still isn't safe, and I'm sure the idiots in their T1 haulers will still lose billions, and they'll still complain on the forums.
After reviewing the Dev entry about it all I'm inclined to mostly agree with Crae Matreki. If CONCORD response time is decreased but so is their damage, it apperas to me that what CCP is doing is catering to both sides of the aisle at once. Side one of course being whinesauces who complain about how long it takes CONCORD to arrive (not realizing that the lower sec status the system is the longer it takes), and the other side being suicide gankers (since decreased CONCORD damage would balance their faster response.)
Lack of insurance for suicide ganking is a logical step, and one that even some supporters of the practice (such as myself) have been pushing for.
The security status changes I'm not quite as thrilled about. Seems like status is now much easier to lose, but for those guys who are -10 that probably doesn't matter much. More casual PvPers like myself will have to wait and see how it works out for them.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:26:00 -
[231]
Originally by: Crae Matreki I can't believe people are threatening to quit over this!
The sec status changes are so-so.. it'll make things a bit slower to undo the damage, but not too much. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
The CONCORD changes sound interesting - if there's less ships, and no insta-lock from the battleships, won't that mean it's possible to tank them long enough to get a few more volleys off? It might actually work out better for the ganker in some cases!
The no insurance for CONCORD-related crimes makes sense - the gankers will have to think about what they kill again. Risk vs reward!
All in all, highsec still isn't safe, and I'm sure the idiots in their T1 haulers will still lose billions, and they'll still complain on the forums.
It isnt just this.
you need to see the bigger picture here this is only one of many nerfs that CCP has introduced makig the game safer for everyone.
which will lead to higher subscriptions to the game and more people willf lock from AOC or wow since it becomes harder and harder to lose what they have grind for.
Im betting this is why you dont hear ovuer or the rest of the "gang" posting here anymore since anything they have said earlier is becoming just what they said wouldnt happen.
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Nogap toosmall
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:27:00 -
[232]
Originally by: Alex Harumichi
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
I'm so glad that this change makes it impossible to gank t1 haulers hauling 2bil in cargo and make a hefty profit.
No wait... it has no impact on that. What it does impact is brainless, risk-free ganking of anything that moves -- which it seems is what you're actually worried of losing here.
Ganking valuable targets will remain profitable. Only now you have to actually do careful target selection and use your brains. This is apparently a painful change for many people.
QFT
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:27:00 -
[233]
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
Yes, you can. I've done it many times.
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Lt Angus
Caldari Lt Angus Corp
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:29:00 -
[234]
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
Yes, you can. I've done it many times.
Even using the cheat it takes over 12 hours
Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:30:00 -
[235]
Between the Suicide gankers tears and the Nano***'s tears, this past month has seemed like a holly jolly Christmas.
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Nogap toosmall
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:31:00 -
[236]
This thread should be renamed "hello emo online", kittys are way too tough for this kind of whinging
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NeoTheo
Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:32:00 -
[237]
Edited by: NeoTheo on 06/08/2008 12:32:33
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
i know this is just utter *******s, anyone who has done -9.9 to positive standings knows EXACTLY how hard it is, this few hours stuff is just horse crap.
mind you nessa didnt know sh1t when he was in BWL and still doesnt.
Neotheo Dark Materials
Linkage
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:32:00 -
[238]
Originally by: Lt Angus
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
Yes, you can. I've done it many times.
Even using the cheat it takes over 12 hours
Until 12 hours becomes 24 hours, then my statement remains true. It still only takes a few hours to get all that sec back.
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:33:00 -
[239]
Originally by: NeoTheo
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
i know this is just utter *******s, anyone who has done -9.9 to positive standings knows EXACTLY how hard it is, this few hours stuff is just horse crap.
Then you're not doing it right.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:34:00 -
[240]
Originally by: Sorted
is this your main copasetic sideways.. is it? did you press the wrong button? SWEEEET.
I've never used forum alts, outside the trade forums that is.
At a glance, I think I support the cheerful posting copasetic is doing though.
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:35:00 -
[241]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Sorted
is this your main copasetic sideways.. is it? did you press the wrong button? SWEEEET.
I've never used forum alts, outside the trade forums that is.
At a glance, I think I support the cheerful posting copasetic is doing though.
squirm....you little bastard Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:36:00 -
[242]
Originally by: Lt Angus ... Even using the cheat it takes over 12 hours
Wow!!! A WHOLE 12 HOURS!!!!
Let's see.... How long do you think it took the person you ganked saving up the ISK for his cargo and ship???
You sense of perspective is seriously imbalanced towards: "ME, ME, ME, ME!!!".
These are in fact quite reasonable changes. Suicide ganking of high-value targets are essentially not touched, and all the insurance removal does is raise the bar for what is profitable.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:36:00 -
[243]
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
Yes, you can. I've done it many times.
please enlighten me how you manage to do this in a few hours ?
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Roy Batty68
Caldari Immortal Dead
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:36:00 -
[244]
Originally by: Kazuo Ishiguro Quite a few different things have led to the current situation. For one, mineral prices have fallen significantly from the original 'base' levels on which insurance payouts are still based.
QFT
And CCP attacks the symptoms. \o/
Sig removed, inappropriate content. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
NeoTheo
Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:37:00 -
[245]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
Yes, you can. I've done it many times.
please enlighten me how you manage to do this in a few hours ?
he is talking about the jumping system and and taggin trick, its still longer than a few hours.
Neotheo Dark Materials
Linkage
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Gealbhan
Caldari Infernal Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:38:00 -
[246]
You can persecute us, nerf our standings, buff your concord and remove insurance for concord related deaths but you will NEVER, EVER stop us!
Pirates will Always be a part of Eve in every system from 0.0 to 1.0!
Yarrr with me brothers!!!!
P.S. This will increase war dec's on small empire corps 10x and turn empire into a warred out wasteland.
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copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:39:00 -
[247]
Originally by: Sorted squirm....you little bastard
but mizyur! wiv zeez rochay you are rrrrreally schpoilink uz!
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Furb Killer
Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:39:00 -
[248]
Because introducing hics really wasnt a boost for the gankers (no not for suicide gankers but you arent that important). Really only boosts for the evil carebears...
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Lt Angus
Caldari Lt Angus Corp
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:40:00 -
[249]
Originally by: Kerfira Edited by: Kerfira on 06/08/2008 12:36:57
Originally by: Lt Angus ... Even using the cheat it takes over 12 hours
Wow!!! A WHOLE 12 HOURS!!!!
Let's see.... How long do you think it took the person you ganked saving up the ISK for his cargo and ship???
You sense of perspective is seriously imbalanced towards: "ME, ME, ME, ME!!!".
These are in fact quite reasonable changes. Suicide ganking of high-value targets is essentially not touched, and all the insurance removal does is raise the bar for what is profitable a little bit.
If it took him more then 12 hours then he should try something more profitable, maybe suicide ganking
Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:40:00 -
[250]
It's extremely easy. You kill a battleship, jump to the next system and kill a battleship, jump back to the first system and kill a battleship.
The timer between kills resets every time you change system.
L2P before telling me I have no clue what I'm talking about pls. kthx bai.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:41:00 -
[251]
Originally by: Exlegion Eve is a game for everyone, including the casual players that don't want to overly trouble themselves with details of precaution. Keep in mind there will still be risk for these players, but not as bad as in say, the lower levels of high security space and low security altogether.
It's a small step from here to removing risk for these kinds of players altogether. -
DesuSigs |
copasetic sideways
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:43:00 -
[252]
Originally by: Crumplecorn It's a small step from here to removing risk for these kinds of players altogether.
EVE IS DYING!
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Lt Angus
Caldari Lt Angus Corp
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:43:00 -
[253]
Edited by: Lt Angus on 06/08/2008 12:45:04
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne It's extremely easy. You kill a battleship, jump to the next system and kill a battleship, jump back to the first system and kill a battleship.
The timer between kills resets every time you change system.
L2P before telling me I have no clue what I'm talking about pls. kthx bai.
wrong it doesn't reset, its a per system timer, so u can only do 1 every 8 mins with that, u need atleast a 4 system loop for the trick and even then it takes a long time
Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
Dirk Magnum
Spearhead Endeavors
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:44:00 -
[254]
Originally by: Gealbhan This will increase war dec's on small empire corps 10x and turn empire into a warred out wasteland.
The true test of whether or not CCP is really watering down the game might be seen in the following scenario:
1. Increase in empire war occurs 2. Massive whinefest and corp hopping over this occurs by people who didn't realize that wars are a part of the game
3a. CCP nerfs wars 3b. CCP nerfs corp-hopping
(3b. is the correct answer, CCP)
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:45:00 -
[255]
Originally by: Sorted
squirm....you little bastard
Haha, I thought I had made enough 'griefers are teh suck' and 'suicide ganking is broken' (which it is until insurance is changed) posts on my own to become a target many times over, but judging from your and Ki's reaction to copasetics posts I have not had enough attitude in my writing. Kept it too factual and on topic apparently .
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Tippia
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:45:00 -
[256]
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Tippia So you're saying that the majority is in NPC corps? Do you have any numbers to back this up?
heh heh - crackaddictlogic is not logic...
Maybe you should stop smoking then.
It's very simple.
Hungo claims that there is no reason why his stuff should be blown up. I claim that that's the whole point of the game. You interject that the majority wants protection from suicide ganking.
The problem with your argument is that removing/reducing suicide ganking won't keep your stuff from being blown up unless you're in an NPC corp. If you're arguing my point (and it looks like you were since you quoted my post), then you're implicitly saying that the majority is in NPC corps – if not, then this change will mean fsck-all for the survivability of their stuff.
So my question back to you was: are you sure that the majority will actually benefit from this change, seeing as how they'll need to be NPC-corpers to do so?
Clear enough?
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:45:00 -
[257]
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne It's extremely easy. You kill a battleship, jump to the next system and kill a battleship, jump back to the first system and kill a battleship.
The timer between kills resets every time you change system.
L2P before telling me I have no clue what I'm talking about pls. kthx bai.
thought it still took 15 per system atleast thats what my security log showed when i took my sec down for the forth time.
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:46:00 -
[258]
Originally by: Lt Angus Edited by: Lt Angus on 06/08/2008 12:45:04
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne It's extremely easy. You kill a battleship, jump to the next system and kill a battleship, jump back to the first system and kill a battleship.
The timer between kills resets every time you change system.
L2P before telling me I have no clue what I'm talking about pls. kthx bai.
wrong it doesn't reset, its a per system timer, so u can only do 1 every 8 mins with that, u need atleast a 4 system loop for the trick and even then it takes a long time
You weren't supposed to tell everyone exactly how it works genius.
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:49:00 -
[259]
All this really does is put more "er" in safer.
Empire space should never be completely safe, otherwise there's no point in ever leaving empire space unless you want to pretend like you're having fun sieging POS's every day.
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NeoTheo
Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:50:00 -
[260]
Edited by: NeoTheo on 06/08/2008 12:52:38
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Originally by: Lt Angus Edited by: Lt Angus on 06/08/2008 12:45:04
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne It's extremely easy. You kill a battleship, jump to the next system and kill a battleship, jump back to the first system and kill a battleship.
The timer between kills resets every time you change system.
L2P before telling me I have no clue what I'm talking about pls. kthx bai.
wrong it doesn't reset, its a per system timer, so u can only do 1 every 8 mins with that, u need atleast a 4 system loop for the trick and even then it takes a long time
You weren't supposed to tell everyone exactly how it works genius.
i think the point being Nessa that even doing this, its still a sh1t site longer than "a couple of hours" to get from 9.9 to decent security status. also not everyone has access to 0.0 in a ship that can do over battleships, yher i could be come a corp hopper but they are frowned upon as well aint they ?
personally, i am all for making suicide ganking harder, but i dont support the mechanism they have chosen.
same way i was supporting the nano nerf untill i tried it on sisi and it turned out to be overkill.
its the methods i dislike not the reasons.
and by the way, good skills on avoiding my flame bait; you are a bigger person than i.
Neotheo Dark Materials
Linkage
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Pindleskin
Amarr Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:50:00 -
[261]
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
A few hours, total horse crap...
even if you pick your 10 systems that are being Ratted, warp to, land a hit, warp to next system, hit rat, etc etc its still gonna take you some time, i know i have done it!
Even if you have friends at a belt in each system ratting and holding kills for you. You still neeed a very helpful alliance, good rats, and safe space.
This game used to be a challange, its now going the way or WoW, soon you will get your ship and all ya stuff back on death.. cause its fair that way. WTF
RAGH Rant etc etc
Amoros
P.S. Boost amarr :)
----this---- |
Zaknussem
Caldari The Ironbreakers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:51:00 -
[262]
It figures. CCP does something to correct a problem in their game, and people whine about it on the forums. I can't wait for the Infiniband upgrade to roll round just to see what types of whines will come up then.
For the people saying "EvE is a sandbox game" and, in this particular case, the OP's words:
Originally by: Gaia Thorn I whine cause CCP is turning this game to shit cause they promote it as a sandbox but every patch that comes out the remove a fair bit of that sand from our box.
I have a few points for you.
# This isn't your sandbox. This isn't your sand. You're allowed to use them, but you don't own them. If/when the owners of said box and sand decide to change something, your only choices are to keep playing in it or leave.
# Remember the sandbox you used to play in when you were young? Go out and find it. Chances are good you won't find it. Why? Because sandboxes are dying out. Because they're being abused. They're being used as toilets and trashbins by people that take the "Do whatever you want" idea for granted.
(Note that in this case it doesn't matter if you clean up the box and/or replace all the sand in the box, these same people will just come back and do the exact same thing, simply because it's there.)
# Assuming you find your old sandbox, do you expect it to be unchanged? To have the same exact same (amount of) sand that you used to play in, or even the same type of sand? To still have the original paint, or the original sandbox walls? Even sandboxes change in 5 years, whether you want them to or not.
# The carebears took over EvE a long time ago. Or haven't you looked at the ratio of players in Hi-Sec vs Lo- and/or No-Sec? Or is that the topic of your next whine? Or maybe you've already whined about that fact?
Now on to another thing. While reading this thread, especially the part about NPC corps, an idea came up. Granted, this idea isn't as hot since I read Tippia's answers (which are very good points in that argument, may I add) but the idea is this: Many skills cannot be trained on trial accounts to prevent exploits, but what about preventing some skills from being trained while the player is in an NPC corp? What would be the good/bad points of this idea? |
Nogap toosmall
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:52:00 -
[263]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Tippia So you're saying that the majority is in NPC corps? Do you have any numbers to back this up?
heh heh - crackaddictlogic is not logic...
Maybe you should stop smoking then.
It's very simple.
Hungo claims that there is no reason why his stuff should be blown up. I claim that that's the whole point of the game. You interject that the majority wants protection from suicide ganking.
The problem with your argument is that removing/reducing suicide ganking won't keep your stuff from being blown up unless you're in an NPC corp. If you're arguing my point (and it looks like you were since you quoted my post), then you're implicitly saying that the majority is in NPC corps û if not, then this change will mean fsck-all for the survivability of their stuff.
So my question back to you was: are you sure that the majority will actually benefit from this change, seeing as how they'll need to be NPC-corpers to do so?
Clear enough?
I think the fact that CCP are seen "to be doing something" about suiciders will be enough to placate the "nerf suiciders" gang.
Fact of the matter is that its stupidly cheap to perform a suicide (both in isk and sec hit terms)
All this change does is move the goalposts a little against the gankers.
Can you still suicide - yes Can you still make a LOT of isk from idiot haulers - yes Have said haulers whines been answered to some extent - yes
Where is the lose?
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:58:00 -
[264]
Edited by: Gaia Thorn on 06/08/2008 13:00:09
Originally by: Zaknussem It figures. CCP does something to correct a problem in their game, and people whine about it on the forums. I can't wait for the Infiniband upgrade to roll round just to see what types of whines will come up then.
For the people saying "EvE is a sandbox game" and, in this particular case, the OP's words:
Originally by: Gaia Thorn I whine cause CCP is turning this game to shit cause they promote it as a sandbox but every patch that comes out the remove a fair bit of that sand from our box.
I have a few points for you.
# This isn't your sandbox. This isn't your sand. You're allowed to use them, but you don't own them. If/when the owners of said box and sand decide to change something, your only choices are to keep playing in it or leave.
# Remember the sandbox you used to play in when you were young? Go out and find it. Chances are good you won't find it. Why? Because sandboxes are dying out. Because they're being abused. They're being used as toilets and trashbins by people that take the "Do whatever you want" idea for granted.
(Note that in this case it doesn't matter if you clean up the box and/or replace all the sand in the box, these same people will just come back and do the exact same thing, simply because it's there.)
# Assuming you find your old sandbox, do you expect it to be unchanged? To have the same exact same (amount of) sand that you used to play in, or even the same type of sand? To still have the original paint, or the original sandbox walls? Even sandboxes change in 5 years, whether you want them to or not.
# The carebears took over EvE a long time ago. Or haven't you looked at the ratio of players in Hi-Sec vs Lo- and/or No-Sec? Or is that the topic of your next whine? Or maybe you've already whined about that fact?
Now on to another thing. While reading this thread, especially the part about NPC corps, an idea came up. Granted, this idea isn't as hot since I read Tippia's answers (which are very good points in that argument, may I add) but the idea is this: Many skills cannot be trained on trial accounts to prevent exploits, but what about preventing some skills from being trained while the player is in an NPC corp? What would be the good/bad points of this idea?
Im saying this is a sandbox cause thats what CCP called it when they promote it !!
As for it not being my sandbox no its not but im sure as hell is paying for and have payed for the last 4 years.
And yes i can leave the game if it doesnt fit and im almost at that point where im actually considering it cause im getting less and less of pvp and more and more of blobbing.
And No i dont assume my sandbox to stay the same but it sure isnt fun to play in it if ive got a shovel with holes in it.
The ratio of highsec vs loand 0.0 has nothing todo with carebears cause i sure as hell have done pvp in highsec does that make one a carebear ?
And when CCP corrects a problem they use a hammer to fix what a screwdriver could have done leaving lesser of a mark.
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Pindleskin
Amarr Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 12:59:00 -
[265]
Unless the NPC corp changes maybe a little..
All toons over 5 mill SP will be forced to join the milita as global service (or any other RP thing u wanna use)
?
I just wanna have fun in the game, i dont fly afk for that risk is not worth the reward.. others should 2. In fact, just remove autopilot :)
Pindle P.s. Boost Amarr :) ----this---- |
Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:02:00 -
[266]
Originally by: Dirk Magnum
Originally by: Gealbhan This will increase war dec's on small empire corps 10x and turn empire into a warred out wasteland.
The true test of whether or not CCP is really watering down the game might be seen in the following scenario:
1. Increase in empire war occurs 2. Massive whinefest and corp hopping over this occurs by people who didn't realize that wars are a part of the game
3a. CCP nerfs wars 3b. CCP nerfs corp-hopping
(3b. is the correct answer, CCP)
I support this claim. I also support nerfing alliance hopping.
When I was in BWL still, we war decced a no longer existing alliance (partly due to our efforts) named Fang. Within 24 hours 8 corps left the alliance.
24 hours after the war ended several rejoined. If I hadn't been swept up in RL concerns at the time, I would have petitioned their cowardly actions.
This isn't to say that I really expected anything less from Toof.
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Sweet Laylah
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:03:00 -
[267]
Edited by: Sweet Laylah on 06/08/2008 13:04:25
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
A few hours?
Have you actually tried?
Average BS rat gives you 0.2% every ten minutes. |
Nogap toosmall
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:03:00 -
[268]
Originally by: Pindleskin Unless the NPC corp changes maybe a little..
All toons over 5 mill SP will be forced to join the milita as global service (or any other RP thing u wanna use)
?
I just wanna have fun in the game, i dont fly afk for that risk is not worth the reward.. others should 2. In fact, just remove autopilot :)
Pindle P.s. Boost Amarr :)
I dont think you can force people to play the game a way they dont want to.
Some people get off on the industrial side of the game, some in high sec some in low sec Some people get off on combat, some in pvp, some in pve, some in high sec some in low sec
Horses for courses
Thinking about it, the sec hit seems a little excessive but maybe thats just there to discourage alt rerolling (or to make it easier to detect?).
Basically all that needed to be done was a removal of insurance for concorden and a stamping on of people that use alts for this kinda thing (cos thats kinda griefing)
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:04:00 -
[269]
Originally by: Nogap toosmall
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: copasetic sideways
Originally by: Tippia
Can you still suicide - yes Can you still make a LOT of isk from idiot haulers - yes Have said haulers whines been answered to some extent - yes
Where is the lose?
The "lose" is that whenever CCP changes mechanics which make the game a wee bit harder for Mr. "EvE is harsh...blah blah..." they go overboard in their whines and act like CCP is out to completely change the game against their playstyle. Like it is some sort of betrayal.
Never mind that they can still pretty much continue to do what they have always done after the change. It is "cooler" to cry like a little ***** and declare the game Hello Kitty/WoW.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:04:00 -
[270]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
And yes i can leave the game if it doesnt fit and im almost at that point where im actually considering it cause im getting less and less of pvp and more and more of blobbing.
Bye.
So can I have your stuff then?
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NeoTheo
Dark Materials
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:05:00 -
[271]
Originally by: Nogap toosmall .
Basically all that needed to be done was a removal of insurance for concorden and a stamping on of people that use alts for this kinda thing (cos thats kinda griefing)
this....
new system is lame.
Neotheo Dark Materials
Linkage
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Damares
Maximum Yarrage
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:05:00 -
[272]
Edited by: Damares on 06/08/2008 13:06:28 this change sucks, concord reaction time sped up ok, but worse sec status loss is stupid, and removing insurance from concord is **** too, people dont always get concorded on purpose you know >.>
oh, and time to get suicide ganking, all my carebear friends are gonna be spamming me now telling me how theyre awesome and that you should be a good neibour and all other kinds of heresey.
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:06:00 -
[273]
Edited by: Neesa Corrinne on 06/08/2008 13:06:23
Originally by: Gaia Thorn Im saying this is a sandbox cause thats what CCP called it when they promote it !!
As for it not being my sandbox no its not but im sure as hell is paying for and have payed for the last 4 years.
And yes i can leave the game if it doesnt fit and im almost at that point where im actually considering it cause im getting less and less of pvp and more and more of blobbing.
And No i dont assume my sandbox to stay the same but it sure isnt fun to play in it if ive got a shovel with holes in it.
The ratio of highsec vs loand 0.0 has nothing todo with carebears cause i sure as hell have done pvp in highsec does that make one a carebear ?
And when CCP corrects a problem they use a hammer to fix what a screwdriver could have done leaving lesser of a mark.
I highly encourage you to try out a few other MMO's before actually quitting EVE. I recently left EVE to try PotBS (crap), Tabula Rasa (crap) and Age of Conan (mega crap), and I have to say that even with a few glaring faults, EVE is so much better than the alternatives.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:09:00 -
[274]
Edited by: Qui Shon on 06/08/2008 13:11:31 It should be a *LOT* harder to regain security status. Being able to go from -10 to -2 in under a day is absolutely ridiculous. The game is anything but harsh for pies.
Compare it to raising faction standing from -10 to -2. I'd like to see you do that in 24h. Not to mention some faction groups have points of no return, where it's just plain impossible no matter what you do.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:11:00 -
[275]
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne I highly encourage you to try out a few other MMO's before actually quitting EVE. I recently left EVE to try PotBS (crap), Tabula Rasa (crap) and Age of Conan (mega crap), and I have to say that even with a few glaring faults, EVE is so much better than the alternatives.
This is true, and that's why CCP figures they can get away with this kind of crap. The only ones who can believably threaten to quit the game are the WoW-crowd.
CCP, stop taking us for ****ing granted!
*emo*
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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heheheh
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:11:00 -
[276]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Then why havent u managed to adapt during four frekkin years ? Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
Next time check that your brain is connected before you engage your mouth.
I wouldn't know, I never been ganked that way.
Doesn't stop me from recognizing you as being a total idiot though.
stop the crappy abuse and post something decent or stfu
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Lorna Loot
Caldari Nox Eternus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:11:00 -
[277]
Testing my new sig ----------
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Fron Arran
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:12:00 -
[278]
Ganker Tears are the sweetest.
Your stuff plz.
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:14:00 -
[279]
Originally by: Qui Shon It should be a *LOT* harder to regain security status. Being able to go from -10 to -2 in under a day is absolutely ridiculous. The game is anything but harsh for pies.
Compare it to raising faction standing from -10 to -2. I'd like to see you do that in 24h.
Committing to -5 or below is an EVE altering event that few pies take lightly.
Most people who drop below -8 have no intentions of regaining sec status at any point in the future. Living in low sec / 0.0 is fairly easy with a hauler alt.
I don't really see it as necessary to change how quickly sec status can be gained in 0.0... it at least encourages a few more people to actually go to 0.0. Which is a good thing.
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Steve Hawkings
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:16:00 -
[280]
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne This doesn't change squat, and it hardly spells doom for EVE.
Even -10.0 sec status individuals can simply go rat in 0.0 for a few hours and be back to positive standings.
Yes, because you can rat from -10 back up to -1.9 in 'a few hours'.
rofl some people shouldnt be allowed to post such crap
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Michayel Lyon
Hematite Rose Bionic Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:16:00 -
[281]
"Oh my god!!! I can no longer suicide gank and get all my money back (insurance = ship cost + insurance cost) before even checking the wreck!!! I will have to work to make suicide ganking profitable!!! This is becoming a carebear game!!!"
Yeah, right... Adapt or die.
(No, I don't live in empire. No, I'm not a carebear.) --- Lasiverin Dark > Is everyone here allied? Red Knight > we are allied by our zombie like ability to ***** missions
GM Xamother: "Beeing online is not considered harassment or exploit." |
heheheh
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:24:00 -
[282]
I must admit this is quite shit, This game was supposed to be PVP based now its just benders building up their personal empire of Pixels and saying stuff like "Time is Money" bullcrap.
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Brugar
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:25:00 -
[283]
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Originally by: Zaqar
Originally by: Vaal Erit 4) Future removal of insurance from suicide ganks = WTF NO. HELL NO.
Why? Why does it make sense that you should get an insurance payout?
Why shouldn't I get a payout. I can self-destruct my ship and get payout and suicide it into camps in 0.0. Empire corps don't trust 0.0 alliances so they shouldn't be giving out payouts to those people. Hell, if I am -10.0, they KNOW I am going to pirate in it and kill other pod-pilots so I shouldn't get insurance either.
It doesn't make sense with how EVE is made ingame and it doesn't make sense to only nerf one playstyle (suiciding) in regards to insurance. Insurance is for everyone and I can do anything, that's called sandbox gameplay that is advertised by CCP. I understand that a sandbox has rules, but insurance is one of those very basic rules that applies to everyone evenly. How about new rule: if you shoot at another player, your skill stops training for an hour.
No insurance company today or ever, does or will, pay out when an illegal activity is committed. By Concord being involved, it proves it is an illegal activity.
You think that just because this is a game, there isn't to be an intellegence or realismn of some sort?
Please.
It's about time this happens. Never made sense to actually make a profit on this.
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Digital Solaris
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:27:00 -
[284]
As long as CCP classify running from concord as a exploit, EVE will always be a carebear game.
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:27:00 -
[285]
Originally by: Brugar No insurance company today or ever, does or will, pay out when an illegal activity is committed. By Concord being involved, it proves it is an illegal activity.
You think that just because this is a game, there isn't to be an intellegence or realismn of some sort?
To this, I can now finally say, see sig. -
DesuSigs |
Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:28:00 -
[286]
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Committing to -5 or below is an EVE altering event that few pies take lightly.
?? But there is no commitment. As you yourself said, you can eliminate your criminal record in a few hours. (Unlike committing to a faction group, and thus against another, which takes ages to fix and is in some cases impossible.)
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:28:00 -
[287]
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: heheheh
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Then why havent u managed to adapt during four frekkin years ? Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
Next time check that your brain is connected before you engage your mouth.
I wouldn't know, I never been ganked that way.
Doesn't stop me from recognizing you as being a total idiot though.
stop the crappy abuse and post something decent or stfu
Like what you just posted is so useful.
Leave the basement and take a shower once in awhile tbh.
yea yea very funny but your still posting abuse, im betting you were bummed by your dad as a child.
Your mother joined in and made it a three way tbh.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:30:00 -
[288]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
And yes i can leave the game if it doesnt fit and im almost at that point where im actually considering it cause im getting less and less of pvp and more and more of blobbing.
Bye.
So can I have your stuff then?
Sigh cant you atleast put it in some funny form cause thats just a waste of space.
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Steve Hawkings
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:31:00 -
[289]
Edited by: Steve Hawkings on 06/08/2008 13:34:31 I Give up arguing with abused kids, its not on and i apologise for tormenting the less fortunate
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Lorna Loot
Caldari Nox Eternus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:31:00 -
[290]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Committing to -5 or below is an EVE altering event that few pies take lightly.
?? But there is no commitment. As you yourself said, you can eliminate your criminal record in a few hours. (Unlike committing to a faction group, and thus against another, which takes ages to fix and is in some cases impossible.)
Tell that to the people who grind for days on end farming a 0.0 system to get some sec back so they can actually get to where 90% of the population play so they can try and make some money....... ----------
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:32:00 -
[291]
Originally by: Brugar
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Originally by: Zaqar
Originally by: Vaal Erit 4) Future removal of insurance from suicide ganks = WTF NO. HELL NO.
Why? Why does it make sense that you should get an insurance payout?
Why shouldn't I get a payout. I can self-destruct my ship and get payout and suicide it into camps in 0.0. Empire corps don't trust 0.0 alliances so they shouldn't be giving out payouts to those people. Hell, if I am -10.0, they KNOW I am going to pirate in it and kill other pod-pilots so I shouldn't get insurance either.
It doesn't make sense with how EVE is made ingame and it doesn't make sense to only nerf one playstyle (suiciding) in regards to insurance. Insurance is for everyone and I can do anything, that's called sandbox gameplay that is advertised by CCP. I understand that a sandbox has rules, but insurance is one of those very basic rules that applies to everyone evenly. How about new rule: if you shoot at another player, your skill stops training for an hour.
No insurance company today or ever, does or will, pay out when an illegal activity is committed. By Concord being involved, it proves it is an illegal activity.
You think that just because this is a game, there isn't to be an intellegence or realismn of some sort?
Please.
It's about time this happens. Never made sense to actually make a profit on this.
RL referneces ftw, insurance companies shouldnt insure you for low sec or 0.0 or misson etcs who'd insure u in a warzone etc. Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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Neesa Corrinne
Einherjar Rising
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:35:00 -
[292]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Committing to -5 or below is an EVE altering event that few pies take lightly.
?? But there is no commitment. As you yourself said, you can eliminate your criminal record in a few hours. (Unlike committing to a faction group, and thus against another, which takes ages to fix and is in some cases impossible.)
Ok, you took the mechanics of what I said in two separate instances and made whole cloth out of it.
Yes, it is quite easy to repair lost sec status.
However! People who drop below -8 or lower have made a conscious decision to live a lifestyle of piracy and don't really care to repair their sec status at any point.
Now there will be a few exceptions to this rule, but for the most part I see the same people over and over again for several years now who have never left -9.9 status and don't intend to.
Therefore, I don't see any need to make it harder to gain sec status in 0.0. There are far more pressing issues to be hammered out at the moment.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:36:00 -
[293]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Sigh cant you atleast put it in some funny form cause thats just a waste of space.
No, because then it would obscure the point, which is that I'm mimicking griefer posting templates.
Now please cry some more.
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:36:00 -
[294]
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: heheheh
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Then why havent u managed to adapt during four frekkin years ? Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
Next time check that your brain is connected before you engage your mouth.
I wouldn't know, I never been ganked that way.
Doesn't stop me from recognizing you as being a total idiot though.
stop the crappy abuse and post something decent or stfu
Like what you just posted is so useful.
Leave the basement and take a shower once in awhile tbh.
yea yea very funny but your still posting abuse, im betting you were bummed by your dad as a child.
Your mother joined in and made it a three way tbh.
ahh still there ? Mabye if you hadnt had your arse busted when you were about 10 you might actually be able to be nice to people instead of letting all you frustration out on a forum board, grow some balls, get out of your bedroom.
Yes I should follow your example of what a "nice person" is. I seriously hope you are this much of a failure in real life society.
You seem to have an obsession with my arse as well.
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Brugar
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:39:00 -
[295]
Edited by: Brugar on 06/08/2008 13:39:17
Originally by: Sorted
RL referneces ftw, insurance companies shouldnt insure you for low sec or 0.0 or misson etcs who'd insure u in a warzone etc.
Keep talkin' you're only giving them more ideas.
But seriously, I know it is a real world mechanic in a game, but it still doesn't take away from the fact that this is just unheard of for anyone, fictional or real. Whether it is real life or fictional, making a profit off of suicide ganking just doesn't sound right.
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Steve Hawkings
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:39:00 -
[296]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: heheheh
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Hello idiot. This is to inform you that you have had what you wanted for what?.....four years now?
I am not seeing the "short end of the stick." I am seeing a shortage of brain cells on your part though. Lot of whining too.
Adapt noob.
Then why havent u managed to adapt during four frekkin years ? Is it that hard to not afk haul 2 billion + in cargo in a T1 hauler through 0.5 systems ?
Next time check that your brain is connected before you engage your mouth.
I wouldn't know, I never been ganked that way.
Doesn't stop me from recognizing you as being a total idiot though.
stop the crappy abuse and post something decent or stfu
Like what you just posted is so useful.
Leave the basement and take a shower once in awhile tbh.
yea yea very funny but your still posting abuse, im betting you were bummed by your dad as a child.
Your mother joined in and made it a three way tbh.
ahh still there ? Mabye if you hadnt had your arse busted when you were about 10 you might actually be able to be nice to people instead of letting all you frustration out on a forum board, grow some balls, get out of your bedroom.
Yes I should follow your example of what a "nice person" is. I seriously hope you are this much of a failure in real life society.
You seem to have an obsession with my arse as well.
Read up, I decided that arguing with children was not on i apologize.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:43:00 -
[297]
Originally by: Lorna Loot
Tell that to the people who grind for days on end farming a 0.0 system to get some sec back so they can actually get to where 90% of the population play so they can try and make some money.......
Can I instead tell them that they suck and should go play something easier, like maybe something on the wii?
You know, just to keep mirroring a very common style of posting on these here forums.
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Jazlina
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:43:00 -
[298]
Edited by: Jazlina on 06/08/2008 13:43:29 I want to start my saying that I have never been effected either way. Neither ganked nor been ganked. But I have pvped and 0.0 ratted so I know what this is all about. I agree with the changes. They are logical and repair a game mechanic that has been faulty. Remember that not much has changed. You can still attack and kill people in high sec, the consequences are just more steep now. After all, isnt that what pirates are all about, consequences?
What is the first thing a pirate tells you when you get ganked in low sec. He lectures you on consequences for entering low sec doesnt he? When you get gate camped? More consequences. Well now the situation is turned around and the pirates are facing "consequences" and they dont like it anymore than the guy who just got gate camped. Well that is eve. In eve concord provides consequences, not safety. That hasnt changed at all. You can still attack anyone, anywhere ( far more generous than any other mmo I can think of, they all have absolute safe zones) So please all you gankers out there that will have to actually work for your money, get up off your lazy butts and do something productive for a change.
Now that that is out of the way i can say this. ROFL at pirate gankers for getting some poetic justice.
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Aarin Wrath
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:45:00 -
[299]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Neesa Corrinne
Committing to -5 or below is an EVE altering event that few pies take lightly.
?? But there is no commitment. As you yourself said, you can eliminate your criminal record in a few hours. (Unlike committing to a faction group, and thus against another, which takes ages to fix and is in some cases impossible.)
Spoken as sombody who has actually had to grind sec status, its frikkin painful.
So no your wrong. I went down to -2 a while back and it took forever just to get back to -1.5.
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:46:00 -
[300]
Originally by: Jazlina Edited by: Jazlina on 06/08/2008 13:43:29 I want to start my saying that I have never been effected either way. Neither ganked nor been ganked. But I have pvped and 0.0 ratted so I know what this is all about. I agree with the changes. They are logical and repair a game mechanic that has been faulty. Remember that not much has changed. You can still attack and kill people in high sec, the consequences are just more steep now. After all, isnt that what pirates are all about, consequences?
What is the first thing a pirate tells you when you get ganked in low sec. He lectures you on consequences for entering low sec doesnt he? When you get gate camped? More consequences. Well now the situation is turned around and the pirates are facing "consequences" and they dont like it anymore than the guy who just got gate camped. Well that is eve. In eve concord provides consequences, not safety. That hasnt changed at all. You can still attack anyone, anywhere ( far more generous than any other mmo I can think of, they all have absolute safe zones) So please all you gankers out there that will have to actually work for your money, get up off your lazy butts and do something productive for a change.
Now that that is out of the way i can say this. ROFL at pirate gankers for getting some poetic justice.
Yeah but you can't explain that to these little crybabies. If anything is changed against the way they play the game, it is CCP "betraying" them because the game is only suppose to be "harsh" when it applies to their victims.
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Cypher Run
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:49:00 -
[301]
Originally by: Kelli Flay If anything is changed against the way they play the game, it is CCP "betraying" them because the game is only suppose to be "harsh" when it applies to their victims.
QFT
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:54:00 -
[302]
Originally by: Qui Shon
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Sigh cant you atleast put it in some funny form cause thats just a waste of space.
No, because then it would obscure the point, which is that I'm mimicking griefer posting templates.
Now please cry some more.
CCP Please help me im a complete idiot and i cant fend for myself nor thnik constructivly. Nerf any one hindering my game play cause im a casual player and since i spend lesser time in the game then other people i should have the amount of isk and survivability as anyone else.
Hows that for mimicking you and youre carebear friends ? Must say its pretty spot on your whine template though i took some artistic freedom.
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Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
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Posted - 2008.08.06 13:57:00 -
[303]
Originally by: Jazlina Edited by: Jazlina on 06/08/2008 13:43:29 I want to start my saying that I have never been effected either way. Neither ganked nor been ganked. But I have pvped and 0.0 ratted so I know what this is all about. I agree with the changes. They are logical and repair a game mechanic that has been faulty. Remember that not much has changed. You can still attack and kill people in high sec, the consequences are just more steep now. After all, isnt that what pirates are all about, consequences?
What is the first thing a pirate tells you when you get ganked in low sec. He lectures you on consequences for entering low sec doesnt he? When you get gate camped? More consequences. Well now the situation is turned around and the pirates are facing "consequences" and they dont like it anymore than the guy who just got gate camped. Well that is eve. In eve concord provides consequences, not safety. That hasnt changed at all. You can still attack anyone, anywhere ( far more generous than any other mmo I can think of, they all have absolute safe zones) So please all you gankers out there that will have to actually work for your money, get up off your lazy butts and do something productive for a change.
Now that that is out of the way i can say this. ROFL at pirate gankers for getting some poetic justice.
Lol we need to get off our lazy butts ? How about u bears that slowboat to the gate with billions in cargo.
Cause i bet my left nut that the majority of suicide gankers go for the afk haulers and not those that warp zero to a gate.
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Kelli Flay
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Posted - 2008.08.06 14:01:00 -
[304]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jazlina Edited by: Jazlina on 06/08/2008 13:43:29 I want to start my saying that I have never been effected either way. Neither ganked nor been ganked. But I have pvped and 0.0 ratted so I know what this is all about. I agree with the changes. They are logical and repair a game mechanic that has been faulty. Remember that not much has changed. You can still attack and kill people in high sec, the consequences are just more steep now. After all, isnt that what pirates are all about, consequences?
What is the first thing a pirate tells you when you get ganked in low sec. He lectures you on consequences for entering low sec doesnt he? When you get gate camped? More consequences. Well now the situation is turned around and the pirates are facing "consequences" and they dont like it anymore than the guy who just got gate camped. Well that is eve. In eve concord provides consequences, not safety. That hasnt changed at all. You can still attack anyone, anywhere ( far more generous than any other mmo I can think of, they all have absolute safe zones) So please all you gankers out there that will have to actually work for your money, get up off your lazy butts and do something productive for a change.
Now that that is out of the way i can say this. ROFL at pirate gankers for getting some poetic justice.
Lol we need to get off our lazy butts ? How about u bears that slowboat to the gate with billions in cargo.
Cause i bet my left nut that the majority of suicide gankers go for the afk haulers and not those that warp zero to a gate.
And you can still kill them....what is your problem exactly?
Christ, stop crying.
|
Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:01:00 -
[305]
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
First!
|
Sumos Tigerclaw
Minmatar Republic Military School
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:07:00 -
[306]
Good changes that needed to happen! Suicide ganking is just plain old griefing 99% of the time its gotten way out of hand.
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Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:07:00 -
[307]
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
Yawn....the tired old "get on your main" crap.
My main agrees with my alt. They both think you are an idiot. Therefore, does it really matter which one says it?
|
Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:07:00 -
[308]
Originally by: Sumos Tigerclaw Good changes that needed to happen! Suicide ganking is just plain old griefing 99% of the time its gotten way out of hand.
0/10 -
DesuSigs |
Reven Cordelle
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:18:00 -
[309]
Have you guys forgotten that you can gank to your hearts content below 0.4 or are you whining because its just easier to blow people up in Empire?
Empire = Training Wheels Low Sec = "The Harsh, Unforgiving Eve"
Sure if they suddenly said;
"Okay guys, the entirety of the EVE universe is now 1.0 with no way of shooting each other, Welcome to Hello Kitty Online, please collect your kitty-kestrels at the docking bay"
I'd understand the whining.
But for ****s sake, you guys probably hang out in low sec 90% of the time anyway so just let the noobs have their security alright? Jesus christ.
|
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:18:00 -
[310]
Edited by: Gaia Thorn on 06/08/2008 14:18:50
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jazlina Edited by: Jazlina on 06/08/2008 13:43:29 I want to start my saying that I have never been effected either way. Neither ganked nor been ganked. But I have pvped and 0.0 ratted so I know what this is all about. I agree with the changes. They are logical and repair a game mechanic that has been faulty. Remember that not much has changed. You can still attack and kill people in high sec, the consequences are just more steep now. After all, isnt that what pirates are all about, consequences?
What is the first thing a pirate tells you when you get ganked in low sec. He lectures you on consequences for entering low sec doesnt he? When you get gate camped? More consequences. Well now the situation is turned around and the pirates are facing "consequences" and they dont like it anymore than the guy who just got gate camped. Well that is eve. In eve concord provides consequences, not safety. That hasnt changed at all. You can still attack anyone, anywhere ( far more generous than any other mmo I can think of, they all have absolute safe zones) So please all you gankers out there that will have to actually work for your money, get up off your lazy butts and do something productive for a change.
Now that that is out of the way i can say this. ROFL at pirate gankers for getting some poetic justice.
Lol we need to get off our lazy butts ? How about u bears that slowboat to the gate with billions in cargo.
Cause i bet my left nut that the majority of suicide gankers go for the afk haulers and not those that warp zero to a gate.
And you can still kill them....what is your problem exactly?
Christ, stop crying.
And yet the coin hasnt dropped.
I dont suicide gank. my problem is that CCP jsut keep making eve a safer place and putting it to broken mechanic dont fly anymore people are getting upset about it.
its like being in a treadmill just keeps going round and round and for every turn everything is less then it was before.
People are predicting sniping becoming popular which was heavyly nerfed 2 patches back for being overpowered.
|
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:20:00 -
[311]
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
Yawn....the tired old "get on your main" crap.
My main agrees with my alt. They both think you are an idiot. Therefore, does it really matter which one says it?
As a matter of fact, I think it does. You won't stand up for you opinion.
Okay, i will state the obvious. People use alts to post on the forum because they want to express their opinion but don't want to get their corps/alliance war deced by the kiddies here.
However, that doesn't mean the alt poster doesn't have a valid opinion. It also isn't an act of cowardice either because the alt poster is just protecting his corp mates.
People who say alt's posts do not matter are either just trying to goad the person into using his main or are idiots themselves who are delusional and think having a ticker under his name is some sort of intellectual badge of honor or validates anything they have to say no matter how clueless they are.
Anything else you need explained?
|
heheheh
The Scope
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:21:00 -
[312]
Edited by: heheheh on 06/08/2008 14:20:47
Originally by: Reven Cordelle Empire = Training Wheels Low Sec = "The Harsh, Unforgiving Eve"
If only that was the case.
|
Reven Cordelle
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:23:00 -
[313]
Originally by: heheheh Edited by: heheheh on 06/08/2008 14:20:47
Originally by: Reven Cordelle Empire = Training Wheels Low Sec = "The Harsh, Unforgiving Eve"
If only that was the case.
Explain yourself woman.
|
Gaia Thorn
Mortis Angelus The Church.
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:25:00 -
[314]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
Yawn....the tired old "get on your main" crap.
My main agrees with my alt. They both think you are an idiot. Therefore, does it really matter which one says it?
As a matter of fact, I think it does. You won't stand up for you opinion.
Okay, i will state the obvious. People use alts to post on the forum because they want to express their opinion but don't want to get their corps/alliance war deced by the kiddies here.
However, that doesn't mean the alt poster doesn't have a valid opinion. It also isn't an act of cowardice either because the alt poster is just protecting his corp mates.
People who say alt's posts do not matter are either just trying to goad the person into using his main or are idiots themselves who are delusional and think having a ticker under his name is some sort of intellectual badge of honor or validates anything they have to say no matter how clueless they are.
Anything else you need explained?
Thought you were safe now why CCP has provided you with several weapons against wardecs from us noobs !!
I mean corp hopping being youre primary weapon followed by whining to CCP. Then you can always stay docked or why not afk haul through empire with youre alt in a noob corp.
Whilst we sit outside station waiting for you or outside your system.
|
heheheh
The Scope
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:26:00 -
[315]
Originally by: Reven Cordelle
Originally by: heheheh Edited by: heheheh on 06/08/2008 14:20:47
Originally by: Reven Cordelle Empire = Training Wheels Low Sec = "The Harsh, Unforgiving Eve"
If only that was the case.
Explain yourself woman.
People dont "Train" in Empire they live there without risk for the whole of their Eve lives.
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:26:00 -
[316]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn Edited by: Gaia Thorn on 06/08/2008 14:18:50
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jazlina Edited by: Jazlina on 06/08/2008 13:43:29 I want to start my saying that I have never been effected either way. Neither ganked nor been ganked. But I have pvped and 0.0 ratted so I know what this is all about. I agree with the changes. They are logical and repair a game mechanic that has been faulty. Remember that not much has changed. You can still attack and kill people in high sec, the consequences are just more steep now. After all, isnt that what pirates are all about, consequences?
What is the first thing a pirate tells you when you get ganked in low sec. He lectures you on consequences for entering low sec doesnt he? When you get gate camped? More consequences. Well now the situation is turned around and the pirates are facing "consequences" and they dont like it anymore than the guy who just got gate camped. Well that is eve. In eve concord provides consequences, not safety. That hasnt changed at all. You can still attack anyone, anywhere ( far more generous than any other mmo I can think of, they all have absolute safe zones) So please all you gankers out there that will have to actually work for your money, get up off your lazy butts and do something productive for a change.
Now that that is out of the way i can say this. ROFL at pirate gankers for getting some poetic justice.
Lol we need to get off our lazy butts ? How about u bears that slowboat to the gate with billions in cargo.
Cause i bet my left nut that the majority of suicide gankers go for the afk haulers and not those that warp zero to a gate.
And you can still kill them....what is your problem exactly?
Christ, stop crying.
And yet the coin hasnt dropped.
I dont suicide gank. my problem is that CCP jsut keep making eve a safer place and putting it to broken mechanic dont fly anymore people are getting upset about it.
its like being in a treadmill just keeps going round and round and for every turn everything is less then it was before.
People are predicting sniping becoming popular which was heavyly nerfed 2 patches back for being overpowered.
But it isn't safer. It just costs the Ganker a bit more. It causes the ganker to make a decision rather than randomly ganking anything they see because there are consequences now.
Just like the noob has to face the consequences when he hauls billions afk in a T1 hauler.
Both sides have choices and both could get burned now. What is the problem?
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Nicho Void
Hyper-Nova Tenth Legion
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:27:00 -
[317]
Changes look fine to me. I'll be in 0.0.
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Orogaldeo
Amarr Star Horizons Rule of Three
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:28:00 -
[318]
meh, i tried to suicide-gank someone in empire i failed miserably. now this is even dumbier.
guess i'll have to get on giant secure container hacking if i want to gank someone in empire :|
thanks CCP for making this game less EVE ________________________________
|
Cypher Run
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:29:00 -
[319]
Edited by: Cypher Run on 06/08/2008 14:28:53
Originally by: heheheh People dont "Train" in Empire they live there without risk for the whole of their Eve lives.
And? Go on...
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Reven Cordelle
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:29:00 -
[320]
Edited by: Reven Cordelle on 06/08/2008 14:29:27
Quote: Explain yourself woman.
People dont "Train" in Empire they live there without risk for the whole of their Eve lives.
I fail to see whats wrong with them playing the way they want to.
They have empire, you have low sec. Not.. seeing why people are whining so much about high sec when they don't even have any interest in being there.
|
|
Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:29:00 -
[321]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
Yawn....the tired old "get on your main" crap.
My main agrees with my alt. They both think you are an idiot. Therefore, does it really matter which one says it?
As a matter of fact, I think it does. You won't stand up for you opinion.
Okay, i will state the obvious. People use alts to post on the forum because they want to express their opinion but don't want to get their corps/alliance war deced by the kiddies here.
However, that doesn't mean the alt poster doesn't have a valid opinion. It also isn't an act of cowardice either because the alt poster is just protecting his corp mates.
People who say alt's posts do not matter are either just trying to goad the person into using his main or are idiots themselves who are delusional and think having a ticker under his name is some sort of intellectual badge of honor or validates anything they have to say no matter how clueless they are.
Anything else you need explained?
Protecting you corp? I thought you were a badass on your main. I mean, with all your harsh comments.
Well, at least I'm not afraid to be wardecced by some "noobs" here on the forums.
First!
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:30:00 -
[322]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
Yawn....the tired old "get on your main" crap.
My main agrees with my alt. They both think you are an idiot. Therefore, does it really matter which one says it?
As a matter of fact, I think it does. You won't stand up for you opinion.
Okay, i will state the obvious. People use alts to post on the forum because they want to express their opinion but don't want to get their corps/alliance war deced by the kiddies here.
However, that doesn't mean the alt poster doesn't have a valid opinion. It also isn't an act of cowardice either because the alt poster is just protecting his corp mates.
People who say alt's posts do not matter are either just trying to goad the person into using his main or are idiots themselves who are delusional and think having a ticker under his name is some sort of intellectual badge of honor or validates anything they have to say no matter how clueless they are.
Anything else you need explained?
Thought you were safe now why CCP has provided you with several weapons against wardecs from us noobs !!
I mean corp hopping being youre primary weapon followed by whining to CCP. Then you can always stay docked or why not afk haul through empire with youre alt in a noob corp.
Whilst we sit outside station waiting for you or outside your system.
Because I said I was in an NPC corp when?
If you had even a single brain cell, you would realize from my post that i am in a real corp. I guess i am giving you too much credit there.
|
hedfunk
Caldari Low Sec Liberators
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:31:00 -
[323]
Originally by: Nicho Void Changes look fine to me. I'll be in 0.0.
Oh, I've heard of that place. That's where all the real men pvp isn't it?
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:32:00 -
[324]
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Serj Darek
Originally by: Kelli Flay blah blah blah noobs
Get out of your alt closet and post with your main? Or are you afraid? Otherwise the n00b l2p comments from a 3 month old n00b corp character is pretty contradicting.
Yawn....the tired old "get on your main" crap.
My main agrees with my alt. They both think you are an idiot. Therefore, does it really matter which one says it?
As a matter of fact, I think it does. You won't stand up for you opinion.
Okay, i will state the obvious. People use alts to post on the forum because they want to express their opinion but don't want to get their corps/alliance war deced by the kiddies here.
However, that doesn't mean the alt poster doesn't have a valid opinion. It also isn't an act of cowardice either because the alt poster is just protecting his corp mates.
People who say alt's posts do not matter are either just trying to goad the person into using his main or are idiots themselves who are delusional and think having a ticker under his name is some sort of intellectual badge of honor or validates anything they have to say no matter how clueless they are.
Anything else you need explained?
Protecting you corp? I thought you were a badass on your main. I mean, with all your harsh comments.
Well, at least I'm not afraid to be wardecced by some "noobs" here on the forums.
Hmm. Never claimed to be a "badass." Even if i was, i am smart enough to not drag my corp into a war because I made a post that some idiot didn't like.
I am glad you are not afraid or what ever you are blabbing about. Want some cookies kid?
|
Matrix Skye
Caldari
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:33:00 -
[325]
Edited by: Matrix Skye on 06/08/2008 14:33:58 I love the whole "post with your main" crap . Tell you what, why dont you post with your real name and phone number. None of this hiding behind an avatar. That'll show us you're a REAL REAL man with very large ******* and not afraid of silly little carebears. After all, it's about having guts, no? So go ahead
|
Reven Cordelle
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:34:00 -
[326]
Holy Pyramid Quotes Batman. Take it to Low Sec guys, you know. The place where you can do everything you're *****ing about not being able to do in Empire?
Yeah. Take it there.
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Nicho Void
Hyper-Nova Tenth Legion
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:35:00 -
[327]
Originally by: hedfunk
Originally by: Nicho Void Changes look fine to me. I'll be in 0.0.
Oh, I've heard of that place. That's where all the real men pvp isn't it?
It's a magical land where CONCORD doesn't exist...herds of haulers roam the open space lanes and a player is free to gank at will.
But, if people want to continue to ***** about killing being "too hard", that's fine. I'm going shopping for a huge ****ing "IRONIC" stamp.
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:35:00 -
[328]
Originally by: Matrix Skye I love the whole "post with your main" crap . Tell you what, why dont you post with your real name and phone number. None of this hiding behind an avatar. That'll show us you're a REAL REAL man with very large *******. After all, it's about having guts, no? So go ahead
Actually, I think they should show up on my porch at my house and say it to my face.
Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
|
Bartholomeus Crane
Gallente The Crane Family
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:36:00 -
[329]
Please, whine some more, I can't get enough of the tears! They taste so good ... -- Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? |
Kalintos Tyl
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:42:00 -
[330]
real word police have somewhere about 30% succes rate. Concord have 100% success rate. Canww we bring concord inline with police please? |
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Tarminic
24th Imperial Crusade
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:43:00 -
[331]
Stock Response:
*Sec Status Hit: Only occurs to one person even if a dozen are involved in the gank. Increasing this by a maximum of 10% (+5 sec stat vs. -5 set stat) will affect solo gankers a little, but not very much.
*Improved CONCORD response time: Will force players, in some instances, to upgrade to a larger ship, bring a friend, or fit a few T2 modules (cheaper than going from BC to BS)
*Sec Status Hit Based on System Security: Ganking becomes easier to sustain in lower sec systems and harder in higher-sec systems.
*No Insurance payout: Using a BC to suicide gank someone will now cost you $20 million ISK, not $5 million ISK. This will hurt your ability to profit from low-value targets, and such as someone who carries 50 million ISK of goods in a T1 hauler. It will also raise the bar for the minimum value of freighters to about 1.8 billion ISK (guessing) to be worthy of a suicide gank. However, it won't affect those who do things like carry blueprints in shuttles or officer modules in...well, anything. Profit will still be huge even after insurance payouts. This will also have no effect on suicide ganking mission runners as those worth ganking (officer/deadspace/faction fit) will still be very profitable. |
Matrix Skye
Caldari
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:44:00 -
[332]
Edited by: Matrix Skye on 06/08/2008 14:44:46
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl real word police have somewhere about 30% succes rate. Concord have 100% success rate. Canww we bring concord inline with police please?
Sure. And when someone commits a suicide gank in RL they die for good or go to prison for a very long time. So can we bring suicide ganks inline with real life suicide attacks please? |
Drunk Driver
Gallente
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:45:00 -
[333]
If you suck at PvP and are afraid to go into 0.0 then these changes will make you angry.
|
heheheh
The Scope
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:47:00 -
[334]
I was replying to some other guy, learn to read.
Originally by: Reven Cordelle Edited by: Reven Cordelle on 06/08/2008 14:29:27
Quote: Explain yourself woman.
People dont "Train" in Empire they live there without risk for the whole of their Eve lives.
I fail to see whats wrong with them playing the way they want to.
They have empire, you have low sec. Not.. seeing why people are whining so much about high sec when they don't even have any interest in being there.
Then thats fair enough, although we do have other interests. All i was pointing out was that your statement was rubbish.
|
Ranger 1
Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:49:00 -
[335]
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 14:51:31
Quote: Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
Nice derail. Normally I wouldn't even bother to respond to an alt post, but this time I will.
If you aren't willing to put your main ingame persona out there backing up your opinion, few people are going to or respect your opinion. Period.
You will be considered nothing more than a troll, no matter how valid you feel the point may be you are trying to make.
You can argue this all you wish, but like it or not it does not change the fact that this is how this board works.
So deal with it and if you have what you feel is an important point to make, do so with your main. Otherwise your post is simply a waste of space. I'm sorry if you don't like that fact, but fact it is.
|
Steve Hawkings
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:51:00 -
[336]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Matrix Skye I love the whole "post with your main" crap . Tell you what, why dont you post with your real name and phone number. None of this hiding behind an avatar. That'll show us you're a REAL REAL man with very large *******. After all, it's about having guts, no? So go ahead
Actually, I think they should show up on my porch at my house and say it to my face.
Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
I see angst ridden pre pubescent guy is still here fuming and hurling abuse, I suggest a cup of warm milk and a toss followed by a lie down.
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:51:00 -
[337]
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl real word police have somewhere about 30% succes rate. Concord have 100% success rate. Canww we bring concord inline with police please?
Can we bring the real world asteroid mining yields in line with EvE's?
Oh wait,I forgot, real world comparisons are irrelevant and dumb.
|
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:53:00 -
[338]
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Matrix Skye I love the whole "post with your main" crap . Tell you what, why dont you post with your real name and phone number. None of this hiding behind an avatar. That'll show us you're a REAL REAL man with very large *******. After all, it's about having guts, no? So go ahead
Actually, I think they should show up on my porch at my house and say it to my face.
Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
I see angst ridden pre pubescent guy is still here fuming and hurling abuse, I suggest a cup of warm milk and a toss followed by a lie down.
Yes but you aren't still here stalking me and talking about me in some sexual context again.
It's okay that you are gay. Im not though...sorry.
|
Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:57:00 -
[339]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Steve Hawkings
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Matrix Skye I love the whole "post with your main" crap . Tell you what, why dont you post with your real name and phone number. None of this hiding behind an avatar. That'll show us you're a REAL REAL man with very large *******. After all, it's about having guts, no? So go ahead
Actually, I think they should show up on my porch at my house and say it to my face.
Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
I see angst ridden pre pubescent guy is still here fuming and hurling abuse, I suggest a cup of warm milk and a toss followed by a lie down.
Yes but you aren't still here stalking me and talking about me in some sexual context again.
It's okay that you are gay. Im not though...sorry.
who said anything about gay lol
you worrying about sommat? lol Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
|
Matrix Skye
Caldari
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:58:00 -
[340]
Originally by: Ranger 1 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 14:51:31
Quote: Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
Nice derail. Normally I wouldn't even bother to respond to an alt post, but this time I will.
If you aren't willing to put your main ingame persona out there backing up your opinion, few people are going to or respect your opinion. Period.
You will be considered nothing more than a troll, no matter how valid you feel the point may be you are trying to make.
You can argue this all you wish, but like it or not it does not change the fact that this is how this board works.
So deal with it and if you have what you feel is an important point to make, do so with your main. Otherwise your post is simply a waste of space. I'm sorry if you don't like that fact, but fact it is.
if you need a nice pretty avatar picture with a nice corp and alliance ticker in order to understand and validate an argument you are the one with the problem. like i said, you want to feel brave and guts then post with your real life name and add a phone number where you could be reached. otherwise your post is a waste of time and should not be taken seriously
|
|
Xevan Templar
7th Batavian Squadron
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 14:59:00 -
[341]
Honestly, I don't see any difference between socalled 'carebears' and 'pirates'. Both can whine just as hard, no difference there.
Back on topic, there will be no big changes. The more 'pro' suicide gankers will still be able to do the same, because they already did the smart thing, picking the right targets. What will get abit thougher is the random 'hey let's just kill some random dude in highsec for fun hahaha' kiddy approach. You can still do it, but it will cost you. And that sounds very logical.
And yes EVE is a cold hard place, so just handle the upcoming changes. Be creative instead of acting like spoiled kids. Where is that 'I eat CONCORD for breakfest' attitude.
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Caldreean
Dawnwalkers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 14:59:00 -
[342]
Originally by: Gamesguy
Originally by: Caldreean I have no issue with the concept of suicide ganking. But it shouldn't be as easy as it is now. This tries to address that, and that's fine with me.
And all you people spazzing out about the loss of insurance, boo hoo. Ganker tears are delicious! If you want to waste your ship ganking, party on, but let's be real here. With how easy it is to recycle alts (regardless of CCPs stance against it) or work standing back up, there needs to be *some* price to pay. And this is it. Deal
Recycling alts is an exploit, if you think someone is doing this you can petition to get them banned. So thats not an argument.
Funny how all the carebears are saying "adapt or die!" when a week ago they were the ones who've been failing to adapt and whining for the past...two years?
How in the hell are you supposed to know which new trial alt belongs to who when you have so many people camping certain gates around the game? They could belong to any of two dozen or more people - names change all the time. Your suggestion, while correct, denies reality. But you keep on spouting that line big boy.
Funny you should act like you know me when you don't. But your ignorance continues on and on... I trained up transports a loooong time ago, and I don't afk while moving anything of value. I've also never been suicide ganked. I'm trying to figure out where I've been whining for the past two years?
Broad generalizations suck, because they never quite work. Still, I enjoy your tears.
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Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:04:00 -
[343]
Originally by: Matrix Skye
Originally by: Ranger 1 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 14:51:31
Quote: Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
Nice derail. Normally I wouldn't even bother to respond to an alt post, but this time I will.
If you aren't willing to put your main ingame persona out there backing up your opinion, few people are going to or respect your opinion. Period.
You will be considered nothing more than a troll, no matter how valid you feel the point may be you are trying to make.
You can argue this all you wish, but like it or not it does not change the fact that this is how this board works.
So deal with it and if you have what you feel is an important point to make, do so with your main. Otherwise your post is simply a waste of space. I'm sorry if you don't like that fact, but fact it is.
if you need a nice pretty avatar picture with a nice corp and alliance ticker in order to understand and validate an argument you are the one with the problem. like i said, you want to feel brave and guts then post with your real life name and add a phone number where you could be reached. otherwise your post is a waste of time and should not be taken seriously
Derailing into RL, well well. I think that posting with your main shows that you stand for what you say on the forum. This is a game remember, so what does my real name and phonenumber have to do with internet pew pew?
I think those 2 parts are separate. IG and IRL.
Since I was just called kid by the other alt troll I can at least divulge that I am male, 28 years old, live in Stockholm, Sweden. I live wiht my woman and have had a job for 8 years.
How about you?
First!
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Crae Matreki
Sten Industries
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:05:00 -
[344]
I keep on hearing about Hello Kitty Online, and how similar it is to EVE. I'm gonna have to give it a go, coz it must be a bloomin awesome game!
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Drunk Driver
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:06:00 -
[345]
Zero risk ganks of unprotected haulers is about as close to Hello-Kitty-Online as you can get.
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Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:07:00 -
[346]
Originally by: Ranger 1 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 14:51:31
Quote: Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
Nice derail. Normally I wouldn't even bother to respond to an alt post, but this time I will.
If you aren't willing to put your main ingame persona out there backing up your opinion, few people are going to or respect your opinion. Period.
You will be considered nothing more than a troll, no matter how valid you feel the point may be you are trying to make.
You can argue this all you wish, but like it or not it does not change the fact that this is how this board works.
So deal with it and if you have what you feel is an important point to make, do so with your main. Otherwise your post is simply a waste of space. I'm sorry if you don't like that fact, but fact it is.
Oh I am not looking for respect. Unlike you, i don't need to get it from an online forum. I couldn't care less if Mr random eve poster respects my opinion. I however don't see why which corp i am in would change one's perception......but whatever. I am still calling you idiots and crybabies.
Would you agree that you are a moron if I said I were in BoB or something?
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Faife
Minmatar Kinda'Shujaa
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:07:00 -
[347]
/hugs to all the "pirates"
- -
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Pesky LaRue
Minmatar L.O.S.T. Defence Force
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:07:00 -
[348]
Originally by: Reven Cordelle Edited by: Reven Cordelle on 06/08/2008 14:29:27
Quote: Explain yourself woman.
People dont "Train" in Empire they live there without risk for the whole of their Eve lives.
I fail to see whats wrong with them playing the way they want to.
They have empire, you have low sec. Not.. seeing why people are whining so much about high sec when they don't even have any interest in being there.
please, no logic or reason here, they're not awfully welcome
This message came from the Minmatar Messiah, accept no imitations Pesky LaRue, Minmatar Messiah Bringing Salvation To Your System Soon! ++ PRAY FOR PESKY ++ |
Matrix Skye
Caldari
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:09:00 -
[349]
Edited by: Matrix Skye on 06/08/2008 15:09:11
Originally by: Serj Darek
Derailing into RL, well well. I think that posting with your main shows that you stand for what you say on the forum. This is a game remember, so what does my real name and phonenumber have to do with internet pew pew?
I think those 2 parts are separate. IG and IRL.
Since I was just called kid by the other alt troll I can at least divulge that I am male, 28 years old, live in Stockholm, Sweden. I live wiht my woman and have had a job for 8 years.
How about you?
all nice and dandy, but since you havnt posted a phone number so i can validate whether what you say is true you're still a coward and could still be lying . so i cant take your post seriously, sorry.
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DogSlime
Caldari Perkone
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:09:00 -
[350]
CCP haven't nerfed suicide ganking.
CCP have nerfed CHEAP, almost RISK-FREE suicide ganking.
As has been stated by others, suicide ganking against high value targets will still be possible and will still be profitable.
This doesn't make the game "Hello Kitty Online". Cheap suicide ganking for amusement was an exploit of the game mechanics because of insurance. It didn't add anything to the game.
That having been said, it would also be nice to see CCP taking some action to stop entire corps repeatedly re-forming and corp-hopping in order to break wardecs, because this also seems like an abuse of game mechanics. |
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Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:10:00 -
[351]
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Ranger 1 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 14:51:31
Quote: Yes, they are REAL brave gamers because they made a post with their corp ticker under it.
Nice derail. Normally I wouldn't even bother to respond to an alt post, but this time I will.
If you aren't willing to put your main ingame persona out there backing up your opinion, few people are going to or respect your opinion. Period.
You will be considered nothing more than a troll, no matter how valid you feel the point may be you are trying to make.
You can argue this all you wish, but like it or not it does not change the fact that this is how this board works.
So deal with it and if you have what you feel is an important point to make, do so with your main. Otherwise your post is simply a waste of space. I'm sorry if you don't like that fact, but fact it is.
Oh I am not looking for respect. Unlike you, i don't need to get it from an online forum. I couldn't care less if Mr random eve poster respects my opinion. I however don't see why which corp i am in would change one's perception......but whatever. I am still calling you idiots and crybabies.
Would you agree that you are a moron if I said I were in BoB or something?
I'm not calling you a moron, I just think it's a bit
First!
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Antarr Slagh
Trans Eve Organization
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:11:00 -
[352]
Alright, maybe suicide ganking was a bit imba. But you can't double nerfbat them. Keep faster responses, but leave insurance the way it was IMO.
--------------------------------------------- Runner of the Fleet Lottos! |
Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:12:00 -
[353]
Don't argue with Matrix Skye. He's a ******.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:14:00 -
[354]
Originally by: Ki An Don't argue with Matrix Skye. He's a ******.
Why don't you go back to making some more straw man threads like how NPC corps need to be nerfed. "yawn."
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Pesky LaRue
Minmatar L.O.S.T. Defence Force
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:14:00 -
[355]
Edited by: Pesky LaRue on 06/08/2008 15:15:35
Originally by: Drunk Driver
Zero risk ganks of unprotected haulers is about as close to Hello-Kitty-Online as you can get.
can you go to the blog and quote the "zero risk" part, i evidently missed that. my reading of it was that they said it would still be possible to gank, you'll just take a harder security hit for it, which seems PERFECTLY reasonable to me.
look at it this way - you want to hang-out in a nasty, dirty, disused part of Kilburn and mug people then go right ahead. chances are that the cops won't get there in time and you'll be fine. your picture might appear on Crimewatch, but you'll get away with it.
however - and this is the part no one seems to get - if you want to go Covent Garden or Leicester Square and mug people then the chances are that there will be more police presence, you'll get arrested and get locked up.
i really don't see why everyone's whining (apart from the fact people LIKE to whine, that it makes them feel good about things they DON'T UNDERSTAND) - Empire Suicide Ganking IS STILL POSSIBLE, it just has consequences to move it out of the realm of "griefer" to "professional ganker"
and i think they're spot on with insurance - suicide ganking in high-sec SHOULD invalidate insurance. there, i said it. if you want to gank in high-sec then you can, but not only should you get a big security hit, you shouldn't get paid for what you do by the insurance company. no insurance company would pay out if you used your car to ram a truck off the side of the road to see what's inside, would they?
now, if you did it in the middle of no where and there were no cameras or witness around, it would be a different story...
This message came from the Minmatar Messiah, accept no imitations Pesky LaRue, Minmatar Messiah Bringing Salvation To Your System Soon! ++ PRAY FOR PESKY ++ |
Sniper Kalahari
Caldari Vengeance Imperium
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:14:00 -
[356]
I like how the biggest change is a one liner at the bottom of the dev blog! FFS CCP I'm sure it deserves more than one sentence.
I'm not suicide ganker, but i'm thinking of the times when someone accidently shoots somebody else in a mission, or smarties a station in space, or does any number of things which result in accidental concordokken.....
If you can seperate the intentional from the un-intentional then do it, but there will be shedloads of unintended consequences from this.
Seems hastily thought through and not very bright IMHO.
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Ranger 1
Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:15:00 -
[357]
... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
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Serj Darek
Minmatar Mentally Unstable Enterprises
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:16:00 -
[358]
Edited by: Serj Darek on 06/08/2008 15:18:25
Originally by: Matrix Skye Edited by: Matrix Skye on 06/08/2008 15:09:11
Originally by: Serj Darek
Derailing into RL, well well. I think that posting with your main shows that you stand for what you say on the forum. This is a game remember, so what does my real name and phonenumber have to do with internet pew pew?
I think those 2 parts are separate. IG and IRL.
Since I was just called kid by the other alt troll I can at least divulge that I am male, 28 years old, live in Stockholm, Sweden. I live wiht my woman and have had a job for 8 years.
How about you?
all nice and dandy, but since you havnt posted a phone number so i can validate whether what you say is true you're still a coward and could still be lying . so i cant take your post seriously, sorry.
I say again, what does IRL have to do with the game? But humor me, how old are you and where do you live?
First!
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Crumplecorn
Gallente Eve Cluster Explorations
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:17:00 -
[359]
Originally by: Pesky LaRue personally, they haven't gone far enough - suicide ganking in high-sec should invalidate insurance. there, i said it. if you want to gank in high-sec then you can, but not only should you get a big security hit, you shouldn't get paid for what you do by the insurance company. no insurance company would pay out if you used your car to ram a truck off the side of the road to see what's inside, would they?
Quoted for posterity. -
DesuSigs |
Matrix Skye
Caldari
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:18:00 -
[360]
Originally by: Ki An Don't argue with Matrix Skye. He's a ******.
yes, ccp, carebears, moderate pvp'ers, and pretty much anyone that disagrees with your playtyle is a ******. that is your definition of a ******, isn't it?
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Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:18:00 -
[361]
Originally by: Ranger 1 ... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
Like I said that is cool.
Keep in mind, It was alt posters like me who helped get this change and the nano nerf into the game.
But yeah, don't worry about what I or any alt poster says here.
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Xevan Templar
7th Batavian Squadron
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:19:00 -
[362]
Originally by: Sniper Kalahari I like how the biggest change is a one liner at the bottom of the dev blog! FFS CCP I'm sure it deserves more than one sentence.
I'm not suicide ganker, but i'm thinking of the times when someone accidently shoots somebody else in a mission, or smarties a station in space, or does any number of things which result in accidental concordokken.....
If you can seperate the intentional from the un-intentional then do it, but there will be shedloads of unintended consequences from this.
Seems hastily thought through and not very bright IMHO.
If you just use these words you get what you are actualy saying
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Space Wanderer
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:23:00 -
[363]
I sense goons alts....
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The Economist
Logically Consistent
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:29:00 -
[364]
I don't disagree with most of the blog (though i have my own ideas on concord response times, the idiocy of the gankees and that insurance shouldn't be modified); however, I am a little concerned with the focus of the last few blogs/nerfs since it seems to be focusing on ameliorating the suffering of the weak and stupid by tweaking the game to get more fluffy by small increments.
I just hope this isn't going to be a continuing trend.
Come to think of it though, there is one statement i totally disagree with:
"It is too easy to gain back lost standing, taking only a few days to erase all the damage done by ganking."
Are you serious? In principle...maybe; in practice it's mind-numbingly boring and takes ages (especially if you've gone very low); the only way it could take a few days to fix is if you happen to enjoy watching paint dry while npc'ing 24-7....and of the type of players that typically trash their sec status I think you'll probably find that the majority share this view. Tbh it's only too easy for mission *****s, npc'ers and carebears in general since it involves doing what they already do constantly. (now that'd be a funny twist; if the increase in sec hits and time it takes to recoup sec loss discouraged pvpers from suicide ganking, only to have their place taken by the erstwhile mission *****s that start to alternate between gank and 10 missions lol)
CSM: This so called council got elected by 5.7% of the player base! (12678 votes)
Who the hell are they going to represent??? |
Ranger 1
Amarr Shiva Morsus Mihi
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:29:00 -
[365]
Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 15:31:02
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Ranger 1 ... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
Like I said that is cool.
Keep in mind, It was alt posters like me who helped get this change and the nano nerf into the game.
But yeah, don't worry about what I or any alt poster says here.
"Sigh"
I don't disagree with most of what is in this proposed patch. I don't disagree with most of what is in the proposed nano-nerf patch.
That is irrelevant. The point is, your point of view carries no weight, whether I or anyone else happens to agree with it or not.
When a main posts, you can get some idea of whether or not they have any significan't level of experience with the matter they are voicing their opinion on.
When an alt posts, you can only assume their experience is zip and are only posting to see themselves in print.
That is the reality of the situation on this particular board. Your agreeing or disagreeing with it doesn't change that one wit.
Truthfully, these things are coming to pass DESPITE your posts in favor of them. In other words, your not helping your cause.
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Zora
Gallente Community for Justice Majesta Empire
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:31:00 -
[366]
this thread has teh kitties? sweet :)
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Mire Stoude
Cash Money Brothers R0ADKILL
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:35:00 -
[367]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter? Stupidity is not limited to one particular play style. Abusing faulty game mechanics does not make you smarter or better. It's like claiming your car is the fastest car on the freeway because you are willing to drive 110 and are passing everyone.
Have a cookie, everything will be right as rain when you've finished, I promise.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:42:00 -
[368]
Originally by: Mire Stoude
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter? Stupidity is not limited to one particular play style. Abusing faulty game mechanics does not make you smarter or better. It's like claiming your car is the fastest car on the freeway because you are willing to drive 110 and are passing everyone.
Have a cookie, everything will be right as rain when you've finished, I promise.
Because everyone haul stuff around, even pirates. And while some of us manage to always keep our hauler intact others apparently "dies every time they undock". Vote against the nano nerf! |
Kelli Flay
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 15:44:00 -
[369]
Originally by: Ranger 1 Edited by: Ranger 1 on 06/08/2008 15:31:02
Originally by: Kelli Flay
Originally by: Ranger 1 ... and still no one cares what the alt posters have to say...
Funny how that never changes.
Like I said that is cool.
Keep in mind, It was alt posters like me who helped get this change and the nano nerf into the game.
But yeah, don't worry about what I or any alt poster says here.
"Sigh"
I don't disagree with most of what is in this proposed patch. I don't disagree with most of what is in the proposed nano-nerf patch.
That is irrelevant. The point is, your point of view carries no weight, whether I or anyone else happens to agree with it or not.
When a main posts, you can get some idea of whether or not they have any significan't level of experience with the matter they are voicing their opinion on.
When an alt posts, you can only assume their experience is zip and are only posting to see themselves in print.
That is the reality of the situation on this particular board. Your agreeing or disagreeing with it doesn't change that one wit.
Truthfully, these things are coming to pass DESPITE your posts in favor of them. In other words, your not helping your cause.
What exactly is "my cause?" I already said i don't care what you think. Need that explained in more detail? I didn't say i supported this or the nano nerf. I said ALTS LIKE MINE have had a lot of say on the subject. Do you really think the devs care what alliance these alts are in? Oh yeah, thats right, they can probably check. So as long as the devs know which corps/alliances we are in, i guess that blows your whole ******ed argument out of the water....doesn't it?
Besides, assuming an alt has zip experience is sort of a negative view isn't it? Wouldn't you think it was 50/50 that the person was an expert on the subject?
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Drunk Driver
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:45:00 -
[370]
Originally by: Pesky LaRue Edited by: Pesky LaRue on 06/08/2008 15:15:35
Originally by: Drunk Driver
Zero risk ganks of unprotected haulers is about as close to Hello-Kitty-Online as you can get.
can you go to the blog and quote the "zero risk" part, i evidently missed that. my reading of it was that they said it would still be possible to gank, you'll just take a harder security hit for it, which seems PERFECTLY reasonable to me.
look at it this way - you want to hang-out in a nasty, dirty, disused part of Kilburn and mug people then go right ahead. chances are that the cops won't get there in time and you'll be fine. your picture might appear on Crimewatch, but you'll get away with it.
however - and this is the part no one seems to get - if you want to go Covent Garden or Leicester Square and mug people then the chances are that there will be more police presence, you'll get arrested and get locked up.
i really don't see why everyone's whining (apart from the fact people LIKE to whine, that it makes them feel good about things they DON'T UNDERSTAND) - Empire Suicide Ganking IS STILL POSSIBLE, it just has consequences to move it out of the realm of "griefer" to "professional ganker"
and i think they're spot on with insurance - suicide ganking in high-sec SHOULD invalidate insurance. there, i said it. if you want to gank in high-sec then you can, but not only should you get a big security hit, you shouldn't get paid for what you do by the insurance company. no insurance company would pay out if you used your car to ram a truck off the side of the road to see what's inside, would they?
now, if you did it in the middle of no where and there were no cameras or witness around, it would be a different story...
Uh....
I was making fun of the OP for his whine about EvE becoming Hello Kitty Online when in fact it already is Hello Kitty Online for empire pirates.
Ganking people in empire should be possible, but a ball buster. Right now it's too easy with little consequence. CCP appears to be trying to fix that.
So you and I are on the same page.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:46:00 -
[371]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Mire Stoude
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter?
Because they are smarter than their victims. It's just a fact. Admitting to being suicide ganked is like admitting that you're an idiot.
and what would you call someone that thinks his distorded views are inline with ccp's but then calls ccp ******s and idiots when shit dont go his way?
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J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:49:00 -
[372]
I support these changes.
While I think suicide ganking is a fair way to play the game, I also look down on it as the carebear version of PVP. If you want a fight, go fight someone who wants one and can actually defend themselves. Ganking is for wussies.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:49:00 -
[373]
Originally by: Matrix Skye
and what would you call someone that thinks his distorded views are inline with ccp's but then calls ccp ******s and idiots when shit dont go his way?
I don't know. Free-thinker?
I'd still call you a ****** though.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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J Kunjeh
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:58:00 -
[374]
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo At last. And to all the people saying that insurance should still be paid after you get blown up by concord, imagine this:
Insurance company, someplace, somewhere: - "Good morning, can I please have my insurance paid. My car got blown up..." - "What happened sir ?" - "Well... I robbed a bank, shot two people, and then police came after me, so I took my car and tried to ran away. They blocked the streets and wrecked my car. I also got arrested..." - "Oh... that's no problem sir. Here you go. Your platinium insurance. Enjoy it along with all the money you stole. Have a nice day."
Yeeeeaaaaah. Very immersive. Also makes so much sense. So a big YARRR! to those changes.
This, oh this, this, this! Good one, and so true.
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Matrix Skye
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 15:58:00 -
[375]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Matrix Skye
and what would you call someone that thinks his distorded views are inline with ccp's but then calls ccp ******s and idiots when shit dont go his way?
I don't know. Free-thinker?
I'd still call you a ****** though.
haha you funny! . given your broad view of what a ****** is i take no offense from your name calling at all. but seriously, have you considered not playing this ******ed game? i mean, isnt it too dumb and idiotic for your high and mighty intellect?
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:03:00 -
[376]
Edited by: Esmenet on 06/08/2008 16:03:48
Originally by: Xavieer Naidoo At last. And to all the people saying that insurance should still be paid after you get blown up by concord, imagine this:
Insurance company, someplace, somewhere: - "Good morning, can I please have my insurance paid. My car got blown up..." - "What happened sir ?" - "Well... I fitted my car with some machine guns and went out hunting the local drugdealers. Eventually they started shooting back and my car got shot full of holes before it blew up." - "Oh... that's no problem sir. Here you go. Your platinium insurance. Enjoy it along with all the guns and drugs you took from the criminals. Have a nice day."
Yeeeeaaaaah. Very immersive. Also makes so much sense. So a big YARRR! to those changes.
Go go rl comparisons. Vote against the nano nerf! |
Ooyama
Caldari Rastana CMP Motivated and Determined
|
Posted - 2008.08.06 16:07:00 -
[377]
Originally by: J Kunjeh I support these changes.
While I think suicide ganking is a fair way to play the game, I also look down on it as the carebear version of PVP. If you want a fight, go fight someone who wants one and can actually defend themselves. Ganking is for wussies.
Seconded.
Though hi-sec piracy is a legit piece of game-mechanics, it shouldn't be an easy line of work. This change will assure that pirates/gankers HAVE to actually think, as they now have to really make sure that the cost for them will be in-line with what they get out of each gank.
"Yama".
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Caliwyrm O'Libr
Dark Prophecy Inc. Axiom Empire
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:08:00 -
[378]
Originally by: Zeba
Originally by: Leinad tir suicide gank is moronic.
Filling your untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions in cargo is moronic. Having someone scan out your fittings and cargo then blow you up to take them for themselves is an intended game mechanic thats fun and profitable.
Assuming you're not using a faction/officer fitted ship, how would no insurance payout stop people from making a profit killing an "untanked t1 indy with hundreds of millions or even billions of cargo"? =======
Talk is cheap because supply always outweighs demand.. |
Stab Wounds
Caldari State Protectorate
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:11:00 -
[379]
Originally by: Drunk Driver
If you suck at PvP and are afraid to go into 0.0 then these changes will make you angry.
QFT
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Traidor Disloyal
NightCrew
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:16:00 -
[380]
It's more then likely been wrote already; I can live with these changes if the DEVs kick players out of non-wardecable NPC corps after the characters age hits 3 months and place em into wardecable NPC corporations. That will make me happy.
You want to smack talk me in local? You want to mission run in my system? There needs to be consequences for ones actions in game.
--------------------------------------------- Love is having a second account with a cov ops pilot |
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Pithecanthropus
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:21:00 -
[381]
Originally by: Traidor Disloyal
You want to smack talk me in local? You want to mission run in my system? There needs to be consequences for ones actions in game.
No there doesn't. I can do what I want. If you don't like my local chat, don't listen to me... block me. If you you don't want me to run missions in your system... well find another one. The system is NOT yours anyway. Maybe I'm claiming the system. Maybe it's mine... so blah.
If you are sitting there playing Eve and all ****y about players in NPC corps doing their OWN thing, then I think the real problem is YOU... and YOU finding something better to do then worry about someone else's preferred game style. Sheesh. Who are you to say what I can do? --------------------------------- Pithecanthropus erectus, a name derived from Greek and Latin roots meaning upright ape-man. |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:25:00 -
[382]
From the dev blog:
Quote: We are increasing the security penalties throughout high-security space. It will be a gradual change, from 1.0 down to 0.1, where the security level of the system will dictate how much penalty you receive for illegal actions against a fellow capsuleer. This means that 1.0 will now be the safest of places, where aggressions and kills will be severely penalized and can quickly outlaw the aggressor from higher security levels. Conversely, 0.1, 0.2, and 0.3 will see a decrease in penalty, but not a big step down. This should move most ganking to the lower security areas where it belongs.
Alt characters means no penalty is ever going to be effective. You might as well permakill the characters doing this and it wont make a difference at all.
Quote: This is, of course, a major change in the landscape of EVE, but we are confident that these changes and the future plans will make EVE a better experience for everyone.
No they wont change anything at all.
Quote: In addition, the highly requested feature of removal of insurance in CONCORD related events will be implemented in the near future.
I have no idea why you didnt just do this, since it will solve the problem on its own.
---
Originally by: Roguehalo Can you nano Titans?
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:28:00 -
[383]
Get a grip, folks. This change will not stop suicide ganking for profit (piracy, a totally acceptable trade in Eve). This change will only stop suicide ganking just for giggles (arguably griefing, and CCP seem to have landed on that side of the fence).
If folks want to run level 4 missions all day in high-sec in an npc corp to minimize risk to the extreme...then they have their reward in full already, because that's a pretty pointless Eve existence. Preying on those kinds of people just to do it was also a fairly pointless Eve existence.
Fit a scanner, find the haulers with the phat l00tz, suicide your ship(s), write off the losses as "cost of operating," and roll in the net profit. Pretty simple, really.
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:35:00 -
[384]
Originally by: Garreck Get a grip, folks. This change will not stop suicide ganking for profit (piracy, a totally acceptable trade in Eve). This change will only stop suicide ganking just for giggles (arguably griefing, and CCP seem to have landed on that side of the fence).
If folks want to run level 4 missions all day in high-sec in an npc corp to minimize risk to the extreme...then they have their reward in full already, because that's a pretty pointless Eve existence. Preying on those kinds of people just to do it was also a fairly pointless Eve existence.
Fit a scanner, find the haulers with the phat l00tz, suicide your ship(s), write off the losses as "cost of operating," and roll in the net profit. Pretty simple, really.
To get a bit serious for a while, I don't think most of us are actually whining about the changes themselves. What we - or at least I - are upset about is that the general focus of the game is being changed from a hard core dog-eat-dog environment where the devs don't give handouts and where players make their own justice and get to live with the consequences of their actions, to a casual-friendly mainstream online experience. I joined up to play the first game. If I wanted to play the second game I would have joined WoW, because that game does it much better.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:40:00 -
[385]
Edited by: Garreck on 06/08/2008 16:40:53
Originally by: Ki An
To get a bit serious for a while, I don't think most of us are actually whining about the changes themselves. What we - or at least I - are upset about is that the general focus of the game is being changed from a hard core dog-eat-dog environment where the devs don't give handouts and where players make their own justice and get to live with the consequences of their actions, to a casual-friendly mainstream online experience. I joined up to play the first game. If I wanted to play the second game I would have joined WoW, because that game does it much better.
I don't buy the "ganking folks in high-sec makes me/the game tough." The folks that have the most to lose from high sec ganking are still 100% vulnerable. Popping worthless afk haulers for laughs was neither particularly profitable for the ganker nor particularly costly for the dumbass afk-er (nor did it require any skill at all)...so I'm not sure where the hard-core is/was. The hard-core element...the potential loss (or more accurately "transfer" ) of billions for being overly lazy...still exists.
So what's the issue?
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Ki An
Gallente Filiolus Of Bellum
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:47:00 -
[386]
Originally by: Garreck
I don't buy the "ganking folks in high-sec makes me/the game tough." The folks that have the most to lose from high sec ganking are still 100% vulnerable. Popping worthless afk haulers for laughs was neither particularly profitable for the ganker nor particularly costly for the dumbass afk-er (nor did it require any skill at all)...so I'm not sure where the hard-core is/was. The hard-core element...the potential loss (or more accurately "transfer" ) of billions for being overly lazy...still exists.
So what's the issue?
Please read my post again. I am worried about the direction the game is taking. The last couple of patches have all been pointing to an increase in security in high sec, and a dumbing down of PvP. An increase in security in high sec, in turn, leads to less incentive to ever leave. In my view, CCP are nerfing the wrong end of the spectrum.
As I like conspiracy theories, here's one I think might actually be true. CCP are working on their WoD MMO. When it goes gold, they don't want to be stuck with EvE. They are now aiming at making maximum amount of profits until the game is pulled. This means getting subscribers from the WoW-crowd, which in turn means dumbing the game down and limiting PvP.
Filiolus of Bellum is recruiting
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5pinDizzy
Amarr Umpteenth Podding
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:47:00 -
[387]
Bears can say all day long how Gankers have it easy. There isn't really two sides of the fence, we all have to make a living.
Gankers need to haul stuff all the time too, most likely your stuff. :p They just don't suck royally at it and get blown up every time they undock, and go crying to CCP everytime they die and look for game mechanics to pick faul with to validate their tears.
It's just protection for the weak players who can't adapt. I believe it's just the start of a slippery slope, I personally won't quit over something like this, but if they announce something as bad next week, then sure count me in to the rageemoquitters.
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Laae Aenus
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:56:00 -
[388]
Hey, if someone wants to carebear in high-sec, fine by me. Their loss, the problem with people staying in high-sec and pimping our their CNRs is mostly the fact that they will never experience the interesting parts of EVE, but then again, EVE is what you make of it, so it's kinda stupid to judge, if someone enjoys grinding missions and it relaxes him, why the **** not, back the hell away, besides, if you're backed up by a decent alliance, 0.0 can be just as safe, and well, low-sec is pretty much a pvp zone. The other problem are ISK Farmers that sell it for real cash, but that's not even close to what the subject is about, since we all know, they can't throw out a decent post.
Now, as many people have said it before, the problem with ganking wasn't in the fact that you killed someone, but that people would fit a ship, kill someone, and make profit, no matter what you ganked, and that was in CCPs book a bit stupid, well it's stupid in anyone's book at least if he has half a brain. So what, you'll get an alt, or your main, depends who's ganking, throw him in a cheap frig and throw on a cargo scanner and search for appropriate targets, now is that so hard? Suicide gankers had it too easy since every suicide was profitable.
Ok, I get the point that people are worried EVE is getting waaaay too fluffy and all, but there's really no worries for that, at least not in this devblog, the changes were made to cut down on pointless ganks. Any decent suicide ganker will probably earn a ton more ISK from now on, because he'll be a bit more careful of what targets he plans to suicide.
Yes, this is an alt, a forum alt to be completely precise. No, I will not post with my main. And yes, you can have my stuff.
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Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:56:00 -
[389]
Big chunks of the sky falling all over the forums today.
Most people fear change, most people are only worried about aspects of the game that hurt their chosen playstyle, however broken, most people don't have any alternative ideas on how to improve the game yet all of them have a keyboard handy and the rage to use it.
Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav!
Also Known As |
Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:57:00 -
[390]
Originally by: Ki An
Please read my post again. I am worried about the direction the game is taking.
I read it. Your concern was that Eve is trending towards less hardcore.
I answered that concern directly: this change will not make the game less hardcore...because the hardcore element (extreme transfer of isk by force in defiance of "the law") will still exist.
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Cat Gilligan
Caldari Blair Corporation
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Posted - 2008.08.06 16:58:00 -
[391]
WAY over the top to do the sec status changes AND remove insurance!
Should have done one or the other, not both. What the hell's going on at CCP, did you hire Julio Torres, John Smedley, and Chris Cao and tell them to revamp EVE so you can compete with WOW?
(for those who don't know those people were the SOE/LucasArts "masterminds" behind the Star Wars Galaxies NGE).
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Traidor Disloyal
NightCrew
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:01:00 -
[392]
Originally by: Pithecanthropus I can do what I want. If you don't like my local chat, don't listen to me... block me. If you you don't want me to run missions in your system... well find another one. The system is NOT yours anyway. Maybe I'm claiming the system. Maybe it's mine... so blah.
Nope, what I want to do is war dec you and cause problems for your disrespect in local. I don't want to block you, I want to kill your ship and pod you multiple times. That would make me feel better and increase the enjoyment of my game play.
And if your claiming the system then maybe I want to take it from you. If you haven't noticed Hi Sec is a little different then Low Sec and 0.0. The only way to kick someone out of a Hi Sec system is to War Dec em. If I have a problem with a bunch of NPC corp people I should be able to war dec em to get em out of the system I want my Mother to call home. Isn't that fair? Isn't this no insurance suicide gank thing all about being fair? Shouldn't my play style be treated fairly also?
I have faith in CCP. They are doing the speed nerf. They will do this suicide gank nerf. I do think they will do the NPC corp nerf also. Never say never in this game. If you think the DEVs wont mess with it then it most definitly will be messed with. I can not wait for the day to come when I can finally kill dbhklfvb1 in Hi Sec without Concord being in the way.
--------------------------------------------- Love is having a second account with a cov ops pilot |
hedfunk
Caldari Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:09:00 -
[393]
Just to make a point, I'd like to know how many suicide gankers have lost loot when hauling it to trade hubs? I'm willing to bet zero. If we can do it, why can't you?
This change will stop profitability for suicide gankers, it WONT stop goons from popping miners and empty haulers for laughs. All you need is enough people in caracals to do that, and goons aren't short on numbers are they? And takes around a day or two to get a character to that stage.
Actually, I might just start doing that. If all the suicide gankers did that aswell as the goons, I'm sure some epic whine thread would emerge.
The Privateer nerf saw the rise of suicide ganking (yes it's been around for years, but only got very popular after priv nerf) perhaps the suicide ganking nerf will see the rise of plain old suicide griefing
Be careful of what you wish for.
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Eternal Error
Exitus Acta Probant
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:10:00 -
[394]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Garreck Get a grip, folks. This change will not stop suicide ganking for profit (piracy, a totally acceptable trade in Eve). This change will only stop suicide ganking just for giggles (arguably griefing, and CCP seem to have landed on that side of the fence).
If folks want to run level 4 missions all day in high-sec in an npc corp to minimize risk to the extreme...then they have their reward in full already, because that's a pretty pointless Eve existence. Preying on those kinds of people just to do it was also a fairly pointless Eve existence.
Fit a scanner, find the haulers with the phat l00tz, suicide your ship(s), write off the losses as "cost of operating," and roll in the net profit. Pretty simple, really.
To get a bit serious for a while, I don't think most of us are actually whining about the changes themselves. What we - or at least I - are upset about is that the general focus of the game is being changed from a hard core dog-eat-dog environment where the devs don't give handouts and where players make their own justice and get to live with the consequences of their actions, to a casual-friendly mainstream online experience. I joined up to play the first game. If I wanted to play the second game I would have joined WoW, because that game does it much better.
This. I don't really care about the changes that much myself, but I find the direction the game is taking VERY disturbing. If both this and the proposed nano-nerf go through in their entirety, I will be reconsidering my subscription.
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Lucy'Lastic
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:15:00 -
[395]
Edited by: Lucy''Lastic on 06/08/2008 17:16:54 Edited by: Lucy''Lastic on 06/08/2008 17:16:24
Is this change a result of the meetings the CSM had with CCP?
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Spine Raptor
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:32:00 -
[396]
After reading this thread... I think the majority of people need to just realize and accept that this is just a game.
That said, I liked Eve more than other MMOGs because the community didn't "whine" as much about "nerfs" and other changes. Eve is supposed to be a community of more-mature gamers...but I kinda see World of Warcrafters and the like all over the forums.
But yeah, this is just a game and everyone plays it differently. I play with my friends very very casually and PvP isn't a big thing for me. They're just trying to make a balanced game that all types of players can enjoy no matter what their play style is. CCP is doing what they think is best for the game...and since they created it and obviously want it to flourish and carry on for years, I say let's just all trust them that everything will work out. The game is constantly evolving and changing...so nothing is ever really set in stone anyways. |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:44:00 -
[397]
Edited by: Jim McGregor on 06/08/2008 17:46:16
Originally by: Spine Raptor and since they created it and obviously want it to flourish and carry on for years, I say let's just all trust them that everything will work out.
Like watching a car coming at you on the wrong side of the road and hope the driver wakes up soon...
No, seriously, its not that bad, but like many others, I was hoping for CCP to keep true to their original philosophy of a cold, harsh universe. Consensual pvp zones makes it like every other game out there in that regard.
Of course Eve has many other strengths as well, its just a shame it has one less now.
---
Originally by: Roguehalo Can you nano Titans?
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Dominious
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:47:00 -
[398]
A major boost to low sec and anti-piracy as a profession, yet people still complain . Just wow.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:53:00 -
[399]
Edited by: Qui Shon on 06/08/2008 17:54:35
Ahh, come home from work pretty late, take a peak at Eve-o forums, and what do you know, 3 more pages of gankbear tears!
Originally by: Jim McGregor
No, seriously, its not that bad, but like many others, I was hoping for CCP to keep true to their original philosophy of a cold, harsh universe.
When the Concord changes go through, they will finally have eliminated the Wow-esque 'you get your ship[value] back instantly upon death'-mechanic that is known as insurance. Though of course that was only true of those who fit for it, with cheap mods.
One small step towards a colder, harsher universe. Rejoice!
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Bartholomeus Crane
Gallente The Crane Family
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:55:00 -
[400]
Originally by: Qui Shon
When the Concord changes go through, they will finally have eliminated the Wow-esque 'you get your ship[value] back instantly upon death'-mechanic that is known as insurance. One small step towards a colder, harsher universe. Rejoice!
If only they got rid of it all together. Think about how cold and harsh that would be! -- Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? |
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:55:00 -
[401]
Originally by: Dominious A major boost to low sec and anti-piracy as a profession, yet people still complain . Just wow.
Why would anyone go to low sec besides running through it on their way to high sec or 0.0. Vote against the nano nerf! |
Jim McGregor
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Posted - 2008.08.06 17:55:00 -
[402]
Originally by: Qui Shon Ahh, come home from work pretty late, take a peak at Eve-o forums, and what do you know, 3 more pages of gankbear tears!
Originally by: Jim McGregor
No, seriously, its not that bad, but like many others, I was hoping for CCP to keep true to their original philosophy of a cold, harsh universe.
When the Concord changes go through, they will finally have eliminated the Wow-esque 'you get your ship[value] back instantly upon death'-mechanic that is known as insurance. One small step towards a colder, harsher universe. Rejoice!
Nobody will do suicide attacks by then. The value of a hauler will rarely be worth the loss of every ship in a successful suicide gank.
---
Originally by: Roguehalo Can you nano Titans?
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Ihar Enda
Veto. Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:15:00 -
[403]
Edited by: Ihar Enda on 06/08/2008 18:15:17
Fail.
More handholding for careless players.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:19:00 -
[404]
Originally by: Bartholomeus Crane
If only they got rid of it all together. Think about how cold and harsh that would be!
That's fine by me, as long as newbs are given some umbrella so they aren't as likely to quit when their first cruiser pops. But then the concord km insurance voidance has to be in effect, to prevent alt recycling becoming the new pirating.
Who knows, maybe it would lead to more cruisers and frigs!
I also have no problem with NPC corp limitations.
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Maam
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:20:00 -
[405]
Originally by: Ihar Enda Edited by: Ihar Enda on 06/08/2008 18:15:17
Fail.
More handholding for careless players.
Less handholding for grifers.
Hint - declare war. You can shoot people wherever you like. Yummy.
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Smothered Buffalo
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:20:00 -
[406]
If you don't want carebear mode, go to 0.0!
It is really that easy. lol @ your suicide ganking fun being ruined
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32Kilo
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:22:00 -
[407]
Originally by: Maam
Originally by: Ihar Enda Edited by: Ihar Enda on 06/08/2008 18:15:17
Fail.
More handholding for careless players.
Less handholding for grifers.
Hint - declare war. You can shoot people wherever you like. Yummy.
you dont know much. you dont know much about the war dec system. corp hopping is legal. you cant get noob corps who will now get to smack talk and mission ***** with imputity
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Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:23:00 -
[408]
Hello kitty online indeed.
Speed 5 years building a hardcore PVP population and then nerf it all to hell by removing the most challenging parts of combat and adding safe zones.
GG. I'm off to look for a real open PVP game :( Don't think I'm going to find one.
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Dominious
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:25:00 -
[409]
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Dominious A major boost to low sec and anti-piracy as a profession, yet people still complain . Just wow.
Why would anyone go to low sec besides running through it on their way to high sec or 0.0.
A bit off topic but since you brought it up I'll answer. Low sec is devoid of targets not because high sec is this magical high-profit land, but because it's been over-hunted. Coupled with the fact that in high sec you can do activities for longer periods of time but with less interruptions makes it less of a hassle to operate in. This patch may actually bring new life into low sec since it boosts anti-piracy and low sec. Anti-piracy isn't exactly what high sec pirates want but welcome to Eve, where there are consequences for your actions. The bulk of high sec pirates are being forced back into low sec, where they will face anti-pirates, and hopefully it will attract high sec dwellers. I personally operate in 0.0 and low sec. I can see how this change negatively affects the "free-lunch" PVPers. But I really have no sympathy for them anyway.
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Esu Nahalas
The Night Corporation RONA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:25:00 -
[410]
Wouldn't it be more accurate to describe this kerfuffle as the gankers whining that their personal Hello Kitty playstyle is being affected?
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Esu Nahalas
The Night Corporation RONA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:28:00 -
[411]
Originally by: Synapse Archae GG. I'm off to look for a real open PVP game :( Don't think I'm going to find one.
Suicide ganking is "PVP" by "hardcore PVP" gamers?
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:29:00 -
[412]
Originally by: Dominious
Originally by: Esmenet
Originally by: Dominious A major boost to low sec and anti-piracy as a profession, yet people still complain . Just wow.
Why would anyone go to low sec besides running through it on their way to high sec or 0.0.
A bit off topic but since you brought it up I'll answer. Low sec is devoid of targets not because high sec is this magical high-profit land, but because it's been over-hunted. Coupled with the fact that in high sec you can do activities for longer periods of time but with less interruptions makes it less of a hassle to operate in. This patch may actually bring new life into low sec since it boosts anti-piracy and low sec. Anti-piracy isn't exactly what high sec pirates want but welcome to Eve, where there are consequences for your actions. The bulk of high sec pirates are being forced back into low sec, where they will face anti-pirates, and hopefully it will attract high sec dwellers. I personally operate in 0.0 and low sec. I can see how this change negatively affects the "free-lunch" PVPers. But I really have no sympathy for them anyway.
Not a chance. Mining/ratting in low sec isnt worth it compared to high sec missions even if it was done in perfect safety. With the added risk its just pointless. Heck its not even worth it compared to high sec mining. Low sec missions add a neglible bonus that completely disappears when you consider that you must take precautions to stay safe. Vote against the nano nerf! |
Dominious
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:30:00 -
[413]
Originally by: Esu Nahalas Wouldn't it be more accurate to describe this kerfuffle as the gankers whining that their personal Hello Kitty playstyle is being affected?
This! Eve has actually gotten tougher for the "free-lunch" PVPers. But alas, it's not what they really want, is it.
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Maam
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:32:00 -
[414]
Originally by: Synapse Archae Speed 5 years building a hardcore PVP population and then nerf it all to hell by removing the most challenging parts of combat and adding safe zones
Help me out here. How does removing insurance payouts make it any easier or harder for you to gank someone? You just have to save your pennies up for longer to be able to do it.
It does, however, have no bearing on the /difficulty/ of the operation.
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Angeltara
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:33:00 -
[415]
Originally by: Gaia Thorn
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes It hasn't made the carebears safe, just safer. Now all they need to do, is limit the freedom in starter corporations and it's a great change.
Well why would you need to be safer ? Why is it always the pvp'ers way of life getting nerfed whilst the carebears roam around free with no need for adaptation ?
Why do the idiots need protection from the smarter in a game that is suppose to be a unforgiving harsh enviroment ?
Err, are you really saying that sitting outside a station for hours on end blowing up industrials with your thumb up yous a$$ really a smarter player???? If so, then your definition of smart is considered ******ed by most others. Guess you will need to get off your lazy arses and do some real PVP for a change.
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Furb Killer
Gallente The first genesis Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:34:00 -
[416]
Edited by: Furb Killer on 06/08/2008 18:34:49 So the hardcore players who want their cold universe are whining their profession which is less risky than lvl 4 missioning gets a bit more risk added, awwww....
Why do always the 'pvp' players think carebears get it easier all the time and the carebears think the pvp'ers get it easier.
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Maam
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:38:00 -
[417]
Originally by: Furb Killer Why do always the 'pvp' players think carebears get it easier all the time and the carebears think the pvp'ers get it easier.
Something about the grass always being greener on the other side?
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Bartholomeus Crane
Gallente The Crane Family
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:39:00 -
[418]
Originally by: Synapse Archae Hello kitty online indeed.
Speed 5 years building a hardcore PVP population and then nerf it all to hell by removing the most challenging parts of combat and adding safe zones.
GG. I'm off to look for a real open PVP game :( Don't think I'm going to find one.
If you think suicide ganking is challenging, you're doing it wrong! -- Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? |
Dominious
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:42:00 -
[419]
Originally by: Esmenet Not a chance. Mining/ratting in low sec isnt worth it compared to high sec missions even if it was done in perfect safety. With the added risk its just pointless. Heck its not even worth it compared to high sec mining. Low sec missions add a neglible bonus that completely disappears when you consider that you must take precautions to stay safe.
High sec mining is more profitable at the moment because not enough people are mining the low end ores. Supply vs Demand. Simple as that. CCP didn't all of a sudden decide Veldspar will be worth such and such. In a way, we, the playerbase, have decided that. If we don't like the current ore prices make these prices work for you. If Veld is profitable at the moment, hop on a hulk and mine it yourself in high sec. If enough players did this it would bring back down the price of trit.
In reference to your missions comment. Running missions in low sec IS more profitable than high sec if the interruptions were the same. Whether you believe this or not is irrelevant. The difference is that in high sec you spend longer periods of time uninterrupted while in low sec you don't. But this is the symptom brought about by the overhunting of low sec. In low sec pirates ran unchecked. With anti-piracy now having a better chance of survival things may actually change for the better driving both carebears and pirates into low sec.
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Esmenet
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:51:00 -
[420]
Originally by: Dominious
High sec mining is more profitable at the moment because not enough people are mining the low end ores. Supply vs Demand. Simple as that. CCP didn't all of a sudden decide Veldspar will be worth such and such. In a way, we, the playerbase, have decided that. If we don't like the current ore prices make these prices work for you. If Veld is profitable at the moment, hop on a hulk and mine it yourself in high sec. If enough players did this it would bring back down the price of trit.
If you mine in high sec atm you are either a utter fool or a macrominer/afk miner. The only reason you would be willing to spend your isk making time earning less than half of what a semicompetent mission***** is getting would be because you can do it with a macro. We the playerbase did not decide to set missionpayouts like they are now. So your statement is completely wrong.
Quote:
In reference to your missions comment. Running missions in low sec IS more profitable than high sec if the interruptions were the same. Whether you believe this or not is irrelevant. The difference is that in high sec you spend longer periods of time uninterrupted while in low sec you don't. But this is the symptom brought about by the overhunting of low sec. In low sec pirates ran unchecked. With anti-piracy now having a better chance of survival things may actually change for the better driving both carebears and pirates into low sec.
No its not a symptom of overhunting of low sec. You can never make low sec safe enough to make the tiny bonus better than missioning without any interruptions in high sec.
Vote against the nano nerf! |
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Lillian D'Florite
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:54:00 -
[421]
Originally by: Synapse Archae Hello kitty online indeed.
Speed 5 years building a hardcore PVP population and then nerf it all to hell by removing the most challenging parts of combat and adding safe zones.
GG. I'm off to look for a real open PVP game :( Don't think I'm going to find one.
I had to laugh.... hardcore pvp? ... define hardcore please.....
ganking EVERY single industrial in highsec with destroyers and costing nothing but some sec status (which can be gained though pie 0.0 npc ratting) is hardcore?...
oh as for a "pvp game" ... go pirates of the burning seas.... they are "hardcore pvp"... but yeah, they just had a server merge since hardcore pvp doesnt pay =P
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Cassandra Beckinsale
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:56:00 -
[422]
Finally! Removing the Insurance is the best thing since the invention of Internet. Now suicide gankers can actually start playing EVE like it was meant to be played lol. I'm really happy for these changes. Faction items will now become actually useful. What was the fun of having Alqueada after your expensive ship? What was the fun of flying it? For me, it was way too risky and not fun at all.
This finally brings sense to Secure Systems, which were everything but secure. Now there is space for both PVPers and Carebears. You don't like it? Go play WOW. :P
If you think EVE is only about PVP you're wrong, I don't understand where ppl get this ideias. I don't understand also why should anyone do PVP in EVE, why should a trader / manufacturer do pvp?
Oh yeah!
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Soporo
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 18:57:00 -
[423]
Boo freekin hoo.
So you have to be a little more discerning now in your targets is all, how terrible.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:14:00 -
[424]
Edited by: Qui Shon on 06/08/2008 19:16:09
Originally by: Esmenet
CCP didn't all of a sudden decide Veldspar will be worth such and such.
I would argue that in a way they did, and continue to do so. No, not literally such and such a price of course, but up and down certainly.
They set all drop rates/amounts, all spawn rates/amounts. They created the drone regions.
How much of which mineral in that particular drone battleship? How often and in what places or missions does that BS spawn? How far and through which area of space is it from drone regions to suitable manufacturing and distribution systems? You know exactly how much are L4's looted, and how much of that is reprocessed at current values, so if you change drop rates, you should be able to predict the mineral flow changes your drop rate change will cause. To an extent, at least.
How many roids that respawn how often?
etc etc.
We exploit the environment and each other, but CCP creates and modifies the environment.
Is it hard to predict what the players will do? Maybe, but I dunno. It doesn't seem very hard to figure out that if you introduce new areas where a primary source of income will be large quantities of highends, that those areas *will* be used and this will reduce highend price. Or that if you remove price caps on minerals, certain ones will go up. Especially easy since you can check just how many shuttles/similar stuff were recycled and at which local mineral market price that recycling started or peaked.
Will every prediction be spot on? Of course not. But they don't have to be.
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low26
Caldari Politically Incorrect
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:29:00 -
[425]
My question to CCP is when are they going to "Fix" empire war decÆs. Why should someone simply be able to corp. hop, or join an alliance to escape a war? I am perfectly fine with war-decking carebears that **** me off but, it is too easy for them to get out of it. So in other words there is now little option for retribution now.
So when will they fix the clearly broken war-deck mechanic? My opinion is they wonÆt. CCP now cares more about dollars than their game, and the majority of their dollars are now with the carebears thus all the nerfs. The behavior of CCP is the saddest part of this all.
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Dominious
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:39:00 -
[426]
Originally by: Esmenet If you mine in high sec atm you are either a utter fool or a macrominer/afk miner.
And this attitude is precisely what's making low end ores so valuable, the fact that you think it's utterly foolish to mine.
Quote: The only reason you would be willing to spend your isk making time earning less than half of what a semicompetent mission***** is getting would be because you can do it with a macro. We the playerbase did not decide to set missionpayouts like they are now. So your statement is completely wrong.
I was referring to low end ore prices, not mission payouts. That's a whole different story altogether. In any case mission runners may have a reconsideration once this change is applied to TQ. It creates a sense of security in low sec, and if it holds some water may actually keep some players in low sec. This is what this change is aiming for.
Quote: No its not a symptom of overhunting of low sec. You can never make low sec safe enough to make the tiny bonus better than missioning without any interruptions in high sec. Doing it in high sec also has the added bonus that you dont really have to pay attention to anything and can do some forumwhoring or watch tv while doing what many(most?) consider a boring activity to get isk.
The problem with the status quo is that low sec is too risky at the moment, precisely because pirates run unchecked. A bulk has now crept into high sec looking for cheap and easy kills. Part of the problem is that it is unreasonably difficult to challenge pirates in low sec without becoming a pirate yourself. This is a major boost to anti-piracy. And this in turn, is a major boost to PVP and piracy in low sec. The bulk of PVP is being moved to low sec, where it belongs. You can still "PVP" in high sec, in the form of suicide ganks (or whatever else) but it will suit you best to do it in low sec. I don't see anything wrong with this line of reasoning.
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5pinDizzy
Amarr Umpteenth Podding
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:41:00 -
[427]
For all the people saying "lol, suicide gankers are carebears, no risk to them
I could bring up the fact that we all have to haul stuff time to time and don't nerf the game when you in particular suck badly at it and make it far easier to be lazy and complacent but still that's not the point...
The spirit of EvE practically died with this announcement. Eve was founded on an open based PvP system where noone was safe from one another.
NPC corpers were already running around with virtually no risk, now with the announcement of faster concord and no insurance for concord they'll be practically all but immune.
Even if it's a personal vendetta against someone hiding in an npc corp, likelihood is you'll do far more damage to your own character and wallet then you do to them.
The typical Eve PVP'er does not want safe zones, the whole point of Eve Online is the sandbox.
There's two options available to them that I can see to restore balance from this horrible announcement.
1. Remove insurance altogether. 2. NPC corporation system needs completely relooking at.
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Balrokenx
Caldari ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:42:00 -
[428]
Suicide ganking is one of the things that makes eve, well eve. This just proves if you whine enough you get your way....
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Reaver One
Sigillum Militum Xpisti
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:50:00 -
[429]
I think these changes are fine. I also think more changes need to be made to balance the apparent ease of mining in hi-sec. I think the following changes will go a long way to addressing the problems with resource price disparity as well.
1. Make all asteroids in hi-sec yield veldspar only. Period.
2. Make the resource yield when reprocessing modules yield primarily veldspar, with only traces of other minerals (and none of hte more expensive ones such as Mex and Zyd).
Everyone should be happy.
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Esu Nahalas
The Night Corporation RONA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 19:55:00 -
[430]
Edited by: Esu Nahalas on 06/08/2008 19:55:38 Hate to say, SpinDizzy, the fact that you mention "the spirit of EVE" while lamenting the crimping of your personal play-style makes you a .
EVE is a game. Its spirit is to make money for CCP.
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Juleko
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:02:00 -
[431]
I have a question - one of the things that seems to come up regularly in this debate is the notion that "what am I supposed to do about L4 CNR mission runners now?". Well, unless I'm totally confused surely the answer is: nothing?
Is there a shortage of targets in low-sec or something? A L4 CNR mission runner isn't aggressing you so you have literally ZERO chance of losing anything when they're in the same system as you. Yet apparently there is a problem when you can't take out someone who is completely minding their own business.
I'm not opposed to suicide ganking as a game mechanic, people who fly ridiculously expensive fit ships should always be looking over their shoulder - but the current system is so obviously broken it's not funny. The delicious irony of course is how gankers are moaning about insurance payouts being removed and/or the dynamics of ganking changing - and in the same sentence whining about "where's the risk in Eve?". Tell me, where's the risk in knowing exactly how much it will cost to kill pretty much any ship, and that if you bring sufficient numbers that this kill is a certainty? (I don't know of any fit that will withstand 6-7 Raven overheated torp volleys)....
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Garreck
Amarr Border Defense Consortium Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:09:00 -
[432]
Originally by: 5pinDizzy Eve was founded on an open based PvP system where noone was safe from one another.
Interestingly enough, this announcement and the implementation of proposed changes won't change that one bit. You can still keep a-gankin'.
Now it will actually have a cost associated to it.
But, hey, that'll make it more hardcore for those hardcore enough to keep doing it.
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5pinDizzy
Amarr Umpteenth Podding
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:11:00 -
[433]
Originally by: Esu Nahalas Edited by: Esu Nahalas on 06/08/2008 19:55:38 Hate to say, SpinDizzy, the fact that you mention "the spirit of EVE" while lamenting the crimping of your personal play-style makes you a .
EVE is a game. Its spirit is to make money for CCP.
I'm not a suicide ganker, I never have been, for the 500th time, I just don't want to live in happy chappy toy land.
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Esu Nahalas
The Night Corporation RONA Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:15:00 -
[434]
Originally by: 5pinDizzy
Originally by: Esu Nahalas Edited by: Esu Nahalas on 06/08/2008 19:55:38 Hate to say, SpinDizzy, the fact that you mention "the spirit of EVE" while lamenting the crimping of your personal play-style makes you a .
EVE is a game. Its spirit is to make money for CCP.
I'm not a suicide ganker, I never have been, for the 500th time, I just don't want to live in happy chappy toy land.
So in other words, you are complaining about a change to the game that didn't affect the playstyle of you and your opponents?
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Dominious
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:17:00 -
[435]
Originally by: 5pinDizzy I'm not a suicide ganker, I never have been, for the 500th time, I just don't want to live in happy chappy toy land.
Then all is well. There will still be suicide ganks in high sec and there will still be enough mindless PVP in low/0.0 sec. In high sec, things get a bit more interesting for the criminal-minded. View it as a challenge. It's what we want; a harder Eve, no? Pirates also now get the extra bonus of facing more antipirates in lower sec.
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Alex Harumichi
Gallente Gradient Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:18:00 -
[436]
Originally by: Garreck
Originally by: 5pinDizzy Eve was founded on an open based PvP system where noone was safe from one another.
Interestingly enough, this announcement and the implementation of proposed changes won't change that one bit. You can still keep a-gankin'.
Now it will actually have a cost associated to it.
But, hey, that'll make it more hardcore for those hardcore enough to keep doing it.
Hey, self-styled suicide-ganking "hardcore pvpers" don't want this "risk" and "cost" thing. It messes up their hairstyle.
Meanwhile, most people who do real pvp (against targets that actually shoot back) find this wailing and gnashing of teeth to be quite amusing. Bring more popcorn! Cry more!
It's funny how few whiners have noted on the fact that sec status hits in 0.3 and below are actually getting reduced. You'd think they would be happily going on about more pvp in lowsec... but no, apparently "pvp" for these people means something else entirely. Not sure what it is, but it probably involves a dead horse and a big stick.
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soldieroffortune 258
Gallente Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:21:00 -
[437]
well, it wont really affect me much, since i suck at suicide attacking, lmao, yeterday i had a brutix that i needed the insurance for, and fit it with a full rack of smartbombs and looked for a target, found a Mackinaw with an assload of POS fuel and a shuttlecraft, flew towards it, and blew off the bombs, and he jumped through right afterwards, he had JUST gotten to the gate, it was like a race, so again, this wont affect me much
now, woohoo, it makes it a little harder for you to suicide gank a freighter, because honestly if you think about it, it was a little to easy, you could get 12 Torp Ravens and pop a freighter hella fast, causing the billion dollar loss of the freighter itself, a tremendous loss to the pilot, and dozens of billions of damage in cargo that they cant sell anymore, which is again, a TREMENDOUS hit, and what does that person get? maybe the insurance for their freighter, what do you 12 suicide gankers get? at the MOST you lose is about i would say 1 million at the MOST, assuming you didnt get anything from the freighter at all, and being a bit more optimisitic, you get around how much? lets say theirs 12 of you, the ship had 10 billion in cargo, you guys get around 800million a piece, PLUS the insurance from your Raven, so around 900million- a billion for a measly sec status hit you can get back up in 3 days, and 1 million dollars in modules, and then you guys go and ***** when it is to easy for Mission runners to make isk without reward, uh, this is probably the most chronic case of most isk vs. the smallest amount of risk, and you guys are complaining about it
12 people who will lose nothing can screw over supplies to an entire alliance, or an entire solar system/ systemS when they suicide gank a freighter, since they move tons of resources around (and it gets annoying when ammo is running low in the system, and i have to make 5 jumps for an op/ mission) and thats completely fair, but now you guys dont get the insurance back from your ship and your job is a bit harder, and you take a bigger sec hit, and thats UNFAIR LMAO cry me a river of wannabe PVP'er tears
again i say, suicide ganking is probably the safest occupation in this game, the miners / manufacturers have it rough from can flippers, scammers, and people like you, the pirates have it rough since they are evicted from all high security space, take sentry gun fire constantly, and live in lawless space (practically lawless), the mission runners have to worry about their mission being scanned down and looted / salvaged by a random person, and you suicide gankers uhh. . . .
let me think . . . . .
right now you lose a whopping. . . oh wait. . . .
you lose your 80million insured, oh wait, fully insured . . .
you take a massive sec, oh, damn no thats not so much atm . . . .
even the solid MISSION runners have more risk than you do right now, hell even the Macro Miners have more risk at what they do than your "occupational hazards"
i say again, cry me a river of wannabee PVP'ers tears
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soldieroffortune 258
Gallente Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:25:00 -
[438]
tdlr; version (i think im doing this right)
the suicide ganking "pvp'ers" are crying because they wont get the insurance payout from their crap t1 fitted ships, and they might get evicted to low sec space only where the TRUE pvp'ers are
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Myra2007
24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:29:00 -
[439]
Well eve is probably still cold and dark. But with everyone of these nerfs (think lofty, wtz, wardec nerf, now suicide ganking) its getting more and more cuddly and homelike.
At some point in time lowsec/0.0 will be the only place where pvp of any scale happens. Then what will be the difference from a pvp server in any other mmo?
I think given the recent nerfs and the "rebalancing" ccp is trying to streamline their product and make it more accessible to the mob. What they forget is that eve is a niche game.
Once the unconsensual pvp has gone (i estimate 1-1.5 years from now) people will want the game to actually work. (as in bugs getting fixed, lag not being so unreasonable ****ed, ui working at least 75% of the time, balance issues adressed in say less than 2 years, ...) At that point ccp will realize how good they have it now. Because on a professional level when it comes to who makes the nicest carebear-grind-mmo they'll never compete with blizzard or even other gaming companies.
The only reason why people accept the sorry state of the game is because they love it and they know they can't get the same thrill out of any other game. Once that goes there'll be nothing left.
Anyhow for the time thats left i'll try to make use of any still existing game mechanic to grief the shit out of that bear. I suggest you all do the same. The inevitable is just that no matter what we do about it.
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Fitzwelin
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:38:00 -
[440]
"Oh dear EVE is changing, what ever shall I do?" All those that think EVE wont change and adapt to an ever changing gaming populace might as well quit now. Can I have your stuff? Bravo CCP for thinking about the masses and not the minority.
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Wynona
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.08.06 20:59:00 -
[441]
Translation:
Letting your game client turn you into a virtual sitting duck while playing afk was getting too dangerous, we're making it safer for you to play while not playing.
Next thing you know Paris Hilton will be running for president.
What's your favorite CCP Time Sink?
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soldieroffortune 258
Gallente Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.08.06 21:40:00 -
[442]
Originally by: Ki An
Originally by: Mire Stoude
Why is it always the pirates (suicide gankers in this particular whine) claiming to be smarter?
Because they are smarter than their victims. It's just a fact. Admitting to being suicide ganked is like admitting that you're an idiot.
lmao, so the person that i suicide smartbombed a few days ago (and actually succedded) was stupider than me, just because i picked him as a target, and not the iteron that i decided not to attack? when in fact he was not AFK, and was just aligning to warp out to the next gate? lmao, so now attention people, if you become a target for anyone, you are now stupider then your attacker, just because they picked YOU
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duckmonster
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.08.06 21:47:00 -
[443]
Unf. Between nerfing nano style play, and suicide ganking, the last two things I enjoyed about this game that hadn't been nerfed have finally been nerfed.
OH WELL BACK TO 9 HOUR POS GRINDS FOR ME
gg CCP, I was starting to get worried that the game was getting fun again. Enough of that then... -----------
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KISOGOKU
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Posted - 2008.08.06 23:11:00 -
[444]
Comedy gold ,How many of your alliance mates have alts in NPC corps ?
Originally by: Pesadel0
If we could wardec your corp i would surely would.
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Zaknussem
Caldari The Ironbreakers
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Posted - 2008.08.06 23:31:00 -
[445]
One other thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet (most likely because it would ruin the drama) is that by forfeiting insurace payouts when CONCORD gets involved, regardless of whether it was intentional or not, is about the biggest anti-carebear action that CCP has taken since I started playing (about a year ago).
Think about it. A carebear screws up and fires on the wrong target. CONCORDakken ensues. Carebear limps home to base in his pod and finds that no insurance is paid out on his ship. Carebear realises that in EvE, your mistakes cost you. Carebear will either accept it and be more careful of what he's shooting at, or come here to whine on the forums.
Either way, looks like a win-win situation for the carebear-haters. |
Sergeant Spot
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.07 00:02:00 -
[446]
High Sec suicide piracy should be a serious money LOSER unless the target is fitted with / hauling extreme wealth. (If the target does have a multi billion fit on his raven, then all bets are off....)
Its that simple.
If you want more freedom to blast away, get the hell out of high sec.
I've been saying it for years: IGNORE the high sec carebears. I never have, and never will, comprehend why so many idiots seem OBSESSED with shooting at them. Shoot at something else.
Play nice while you butcher each other.
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Atsuko Yamamoto
Caldari The Nietzian Way Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 00:08:00 -
[447]
Originally by: DogSlime CCP haven't nerfed suicide ganking.
CCP have nerfed CHEAP, almost RISK-FREE suicide ganking.
As has been stated by others, suicide ganking against high value targets will still be possible and will still be profitable.
This doesn't make the game "Hello Kitty Online". Cheap suicide ganking for amusement was an exploit of the game mechanics because of insurance. It didn't add anything to the game.
That having been said, it would also be nice to see CCP taking some action to stop entire corps repeatedly re-forming and corp-hopping in order to break wardecs, because this also seems like an abuse of game mechanics.
/agree
People don't like thinking ahead or on a bigger scale, people like getting hysterical, and no one really tries to see much more than 2 inches in from of them.
The idea makes sense, it doesn't make suiciding gone, just makes you *gasp* work for it. And yes I know "those mission runners have no risk and all that cash and and they can just, you know, buy stuff!" and then fly it into lowsec (kaboom) and/or get hit by a coordinated high sec attack (kaboom). If they horde it all up and never use it, well, who cares? If they want be Howard Hughes let'em. And I agree with getting people out of the NPC corps and into the game, no hiding
I like EVE, and honestly comparatively with most MMOs, is the least ****ed up of them. It ain't perfect but it's fun. ____________________________________ "MONKEY!!"-Gir |
Doc Fury
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Posted - 2008.08.07 00:51:00 -
[448]
Tarminic, are you there?
Can we start making NWG references yet?
The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.' |
Cpt Branko
Surge. NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.07 00:52:00 -
[449]
Originally by: Sergeant Spot
I've been saying it for years: IGNORE the high sec carebears.
Get this: if my enemies fund their PvP by L4 mission farming alts, I cannot ignore them. Their safety is a direct nerf to me. Or I am required to do L4 missions in high-sec to be competitive ISK-wise?
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Clinically
Gallente ANZAC ALLIANCE Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 01:05:00 -
[450]
So when they fixing lag and sov mechanics? ________________ Q. How do you clear a system of 400 Northern Monkeys? A. Remind them its not cyno jammed. |
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Tortun Nahme
Minmatar Umbra Synergy Final Retribution Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 01:08:00 -
[451]
the only people who care about the high sec nerf is the carebears looking for easy pvp in high sec, get your butt out to where it matters and you will find you don't care at all, let the kids play in the sand, the rest of the ocean has pirates
Originally by: Cecil Montague They should change that warning on entering low sec to:
"Go read Crime and Punishment for a few days then come back."
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Sergeant Spot
Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.07 01:33:00 -
[452]
Originally by: Cpt Branko
Originally by: Sergeant Spot
I've been saying it for years: IGNORE the high sec carebears.
Get this: if my enemies fund their PvP by L4 mission farming alts, I cannot ignore them. Their safety is a direct nerf to me. Or I am required to do L4 missions in high-sec to be competitive ISK-wise?
They have to leave high sec, or log onto their war account to fight you, and then you have a target. Shoot it.
If they don't, then declair victory and move on to a real opponent.
I have no doubt a great many BoB haters are grinding out Lv 4 missions. I vigorously ignore them, all day long.
Play nice while you butcher each other.
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Terianna Eri
Amarr Scrutari
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Posted - 2008.08.07 01:56:00 -
[453]
Changes in CONCORD? Sure, whatever. Changes in standings? make sense, sure.
But.... removing insurance if you get CONCORD'd?
First, that's going to royally suck for all of the new players (and those of us who are slow on the uptake *raises hand*) who at some point misunderstand the aggression mechanics and accidentally get concord'd.
losing the time and money to buy and fit all of the modules is harsh enough loss as it is, this is just making it worse.
Also, if you remove insurance from CONCORD, why not also remove insurance if there's a sentry gun on the killmail? Clearly you were doing something illegal at the time. Why not remove insurance if you're in 0.0 entirely? Surely the insurance company won't cover that.
I know that those aren't especially likely to happen but we're one step closer to that and also it's immersion-breaking (yes, it matters for some of us) to have insurance revoked in some situations but not other, legally similar situations. Granted it doesn't make a lot of sense right now, but at least it's consistent. If you get blown up in a mission, by a player, by concord, by self-destructing - you get insurance. That's just how it is.
Finally... Was this even really a problem? It is really not that difficult to avoid getting suicide ganked - don't warp to 0, use something slightly more heavily tanked than an untanked hauler, go via less-used stargates, use a friend to scout, use an alt to scout (they're using an alt to loot, seems fair to me)... the list goes on.
People who carry huge piles of valuable crap in untanked ships will still get blown up and stolen from. You just won't see freighters getting ganked nearly as often, which IMHO speaks more to the difficulty of defending a freighter than the ease of suicide ganking.
And really, this does look like "it's too easy to do something mean, let's nerf it." which seems contrary to the spirit of EVE.
In conclusion, this change: Will have undesirable side effects: Will break immersion with respect to insurance payouts. Is only a problem because of people too incompetent to defend themselves, in general, and those are not the people that we want to be helping by changing the game. Won't even help that much the primary targets of suicide gankers - people carrying lots of valuable crap in untanked ships. And finally goes against the spirit of what I thought EVE was. __________________________________
Originally by: Arthur Frayn How much to ruin all your holes, luv?
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Cpt Branko
Surge. NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.07 01:59:00 -
[454]
Originally by: Sergeant Spot
They have to leave high sec, or log onto their war account to fight you, and then you have a target. Shoot it.
Yeah, OK.
However, they get a unfair advantage because their playstyle simply gives them more ISK, so they can afford to throw more ships at me. I'm certain you can understand the concept.
Now, is it a sound concept that the best ISK for a individual player (or bunch of individual players) is in a place where, guess what, they're also de-facto immune to PvP?
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Cpt Branko
Surge. NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.07 02:01:00 -
[455]
Originally by: Terianna Eri
Also, if you remove insurance from CONCORD, why not also remove insurance if there's a sentry gun on the killmail? Clearly you were doing something illegal at the time. Why not remove insurance if you're in 0.0 entirely? Surely the insurance company won't cover that.
Furthermore, why not remove insurance altogether? Hey, people self-destructing their ships get insurance.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Sakura Nihil
Stimulus
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Posted - 2008.08.07 02:27:00 -
[456]
Its not there yet... but its getting there.
PS: I'm totally jacking your sig, OP. The word needs to be spread.
Click me! You know you want to... |
Vasili Z
Pyre of Gods
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Posted - 2008.08.07 02:49:00 -
[457]
Edited by: Vasili Z on 07/08/2008 02:50:56 The only people whining about this are pussies who gank noobs in high-sec in the first place. If I had it my way you wouldn't be able to attack other players in high-sec at all, the only players in high-sec are noobs who make shit for money or play the game doing random carebear missions I've never heard of.
The only "pvpers" this effects are the losers who can't win any real fights so they gank characters with 8 million skill-points all day and think they're hardcore.
Maybe this will force all you sissies who are already playing "Hello Kitty Online" to grow some balls and pick a real fight.
"omg i cant gank hulks im quitting eve" -------
Everything I say represents my corporation and their views. Erikel's Main |
Cpt Branko
Surge. NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.07 02:58:00 -
[458]
Edited by: Cpt Branko on 07/08/2008 02:58:28
Originally by: Vasili Z
The only people whining about this are pussies who gank noobs in high-sec in the first place.
Not really. There are some players who don't even go to high-sec at all who think it's imbalanced. Do your homework before calling people pussies, noob.
Originally by: Vasili Z
If I had it my way you wouldn't be able to attack other players in high-sec at all, the only players in high-sec are noobs who make shit for money or play the game doing random carebear missions I've never heard of.
(a) lol at the 'no PvP zone' (b) "only players in high-sec are noobs who make shit for money" is totally wrong on both counts - first off, you've got tons of people who live in low-sec/0.0 who rely on high-sec alts for the ISK. Don't you think if high-sec ISK is so shitty, they'd be doing something else? Furthermore, how much ISK/hour do you consider 'shit for money'?
Ignorance (or even willful ignorance as you admit) doesn't change the facts, which are that high-sec is simply far too profitable considering the risks involved.
So, let's talk about ISK. Where does your ISK come from, and how much do you make?
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Vasili Z
Pyre of Gods
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Posted - 2008.08.07 03:06:00 -
[459]
Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 07/08/2008 02:58:28
Originally by: Vasili Z
The only people whining about this are pussies who gank noobs in high-sec in the first place.
Not really. There are some players who don't even go to high-sec at all who think it's imbalanced. Do your homework before calling people pussies, noob.
Originally by: Vasili Z
If I had it my way you wouldn't be able to attack other players in high-sec at all, the only players in high-sec are noobs who make shit for money or play the game doing random carebear missions I've never heard of.
(a) lol at the 'no PvP zone' (b) "only players in high-sec are noobs who make shit for money" is totally wrong on both counts - first off, you've got tons of people who live in low-sec/0.0 who rely on high-sec alts for the ISK. Don't you think if high-sec ISK is so shitty, they'd be doing something else? Furthermore, how much ISK/hour do you consider 'shit for money'?
Ignorance (or even willful ignorance as you admit) doesn't change the facts, which are that high-sec is simply far too profitable considering the risks involved.
So, let's talk about ISK. Where does your ISK come from, and how much do you make?
War-dec their alts if they're making so much money in high-sec. I get my isk off Clouse Cloud. He's rich. You should convo him.
wah wah wah I can't gank noobs anymore who have pith x-type shield hardeners, wah wah, how i get iskies now -------
Everything I say represents my corporation and their views. Erikel's Main |
Cpt Branko
Surge. NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.07 03:13:00 -
[460]
Originally by: Vasili Z
War-dec their alts if they're making so much money in high-sec.
Ahahhahaha....ahahahah....
Seriously now. Good joke.
Originally by: Vasili Z
I get my isk off Clouse Cloud. He's rich. You should convo him.
So, someone gives you ISK. That is nice. So why are you commenting on ISK making opportunities if you have no clue?
Originally by: Vasili Z
wah wah wah I can't gank noobs anymore who have pith x-type shield hardeners, wah wah, how i get iskies now
As I said, do your bloody homework. I can't even go to high-sec in the first place. And I don't rely on alts or someone giving me ISK away either
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
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Zarlis
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.08.07 03:22:00 -
[461]
/shrug people who know their stuff will still suicide gank and fotm people will move on to the next meme
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Traidor Disloyal
NightCrew
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Posted - 2008.08.07 03:33:00 -
[462]
Originally by: soldieroffortune 258 well, it wont really affect me much, since i suck at suicide attacking, lmao, yeterday i had a brutix that i needed the insurance for, and fit it with a full rack of smartbombs and looked for a target, found a Mackinaw with an assload of POS fuel and a shuttlecraft, flew towards it, and blew off the bombs, and he jumped through right afterwards, he had JUST gotten to the gate, it was like a race, so again, this wont affect me much
You did it wrong.
The one and only time I did a suicide gank was in a 0.5 system about 5 months ago. Takes Concord about 20 to 30 seconds to respond in a 0.5 system. I used a Brutix with all highs of Limited Neutron Blasters loaded with Caldari Navy AM, mids with an AB and three warp disruptors, and the lows full of MFS I's. I even had drones but forgot to drop em. It was an expensive miner ship that I blew up that I specifictly picked due to the no tank he had on it. Yes the guy was minding his business. Yes I did it has a laugh. Yes I collected the insurance, and his loot with an alt, and made a profit. And no, it wasn't really that much fun. I have more fun killing corp mates outside of stations while waiting for war targets to undoc.
--------------------------------------------- Love is having a second account with a cov ops pilot |
Vasili Z
Pyre of Gods
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Posted - 2008.08.07 03:48:00 -
[463]
Originally by: Cpt Branko
Originally by: Vasili Z
War-dec their alts if they're making so much money in high-sec.
Ahahhahaha....ahahahah....
Seriously now. Good joke.
Originally by: Vasili Z
I get my isk off Clouse Cloud. He's rich. You should convo him.
So, someone gives you ISK. That is nice. So why are you commenting on ISK making opportunities if you have no clue?
Originally by: Vasili Z
wah wah wah I can't gank noobs anymore who have pith x-type shield hardeners, wah wah, how i get iskies now
As I said, do your bloody homework. I can't even go to high-sec in the first place. And I don't rely on alts or someone giving me ISK away either
I was kidding about getting all my isk from him. I make it myself in 0.0 ratting or by selling loot I get from killing people in 0.0.
If you don't go in high-sec in the first place, like myself, why do you care how much sec status some noob gankers lose for ganking people in it? Dur ba dur. -------
Everything I say represents my corporation and their views. Erikel's Main |
Cpt Branko
Surge. NIght's Dawn
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Posted - 2008.08.07 03:50:00 -
[464]
Originally by: Vasili Z
If you don't go in high-sec in the first place, like myself, why do you care how much sec status some noob gankers lose for ganking people in it? Dur ba dur.
I'm annoyed by the ease of making money in high-sec. Security should have trade-offs when it comes to profits.
Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
Grath Telkin
Amarr The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2008.08.07 04:14:00 -
[465]
Originally by: Cpt Branko
I'm annoyed by the ease of making money in high-sec. Security should have trade-offs when it comes to profits.
THIS.
Its fairly broken that the safest place to live also generates the most income. There is NO risk vs. reward in that.
That is broken
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Sakura Nihil
Stimulus
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Posted - 2008.08.07 04:15:00 -
[466]
Originally by: Vasili Z The only people whining about this are pussies who gank noobs in high-sec in the first place.
I've never suicide ganked, actually.
Might have to try it before the patch, though.
Click me! You know you want to... |
hedfunk
Caldari Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.07 09:22:00 -
[467]
Originally by: Zaknussem One other thing I haven't seen mentioned here yet (most likely because it would ruin the drama) is that by forfeiting insurace payouts when CONCORD gets involved, regardless of whether it was intentional or not, is about the biggest anti-carebear action that CCP has taken since I started playing (about a year ago).
Think about it. A carebear screws up and fires on the wrong target. CONCORDakken ensues. Carebear limps home to base in his pod and finds that no insurance is paid out on his ship. Carebear realises that in EvE, your mistakes cost you. Carebear will either accept it and be more careful of what he's shooting at, or come here to whine on the forums.
Either way, looks like a win-win situation for the carebear-haters.
You're an idiot. This is in now way a hit on carebears, a carebear mis firing happens how often? Yes, that really compensates for being vunerable to suicide attacks.
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Qui Shon
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Posted - 2008.08.07 09:25:00 -
[468]
Originally by: Zarlis /shrug people who know their stuff will still suicide gank and fotm people will move on to the next meme
I agree, and if that's the case it sounds like a damn good solution.
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ShaffGT
The Lost Legion
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Posted - 2008.08.07 09:48:00 -
[469]
Originally by: Grath Telkin
Originally by: Cpt Branko
I'm annoyed by the ease of making money in high-sec. Security should have trade-offs when it comes to profits.
THIS.
Its fairly broken that the safest place to live also generates the most income. There is NO risk vs. reward in that.
That is broken
so pls tell us where other place can we fund money for pvp ? market ? still same no risk there, and not all ppl can trading very good. 0.0 space ? heck why we at empire if we have 0.0 space.
so all this 0.0 ppl whine about empire dweller gain money slowly and waste our time vs 0.0 ppl where they can ratting phat faction loot or if lucky officer spawn. not include ur so called dsypo moon that generate insane amount of money that empire ppl will NEVER taste it.
it obvious ppl who whine here jealous with empire carebears since they sucks ratting at 0.0 ?
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Sellyna
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Posted - 2008.08.07 09:51:00 -
[470]
ha ha ha this proves that CCP is startign to fail in creating eve- Welcome To WOw online! please CCP fire all the new creators!
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Sorted
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.07 10:09:00 -
[471]
Originally by: Sellyna ha ha ha this proves that CCP is startign to fail in creating eve- Welcome To WOw online! please CCP fire all the new creators!
i think "world of Spaceships" should catch on! Vote against the nano nerf! http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=832371
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coeathal vega
Gallente Reikoku Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.07 10:12:00 -
[472]
another carebear whine answered.
Now, if everyone start whining about lag, will that get fixed, CCP? ----
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Lord WarATron
Amarr Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.08.07 10:25:00 -
[473]
Edited by: Lord WarATron on 07/08/2008 10:26:06 Its a intresting change.
Suicide Ganks created the market in t2 transport ships and became the reason why maudader sales took off.
Before t1 haulers were ganked regularly, people would never dream of using a t2 transport ship. In fact, sales of transport ships were almost non-existant. Only when people relised that transport ships raise the bar of suicide gank, that people started buying them.
Mauraders were never that popular until Suicide ganking mission runners became commonplace. Even these forums has lots of anti-maurader posts asking why people would waste isk on them. People perfered faction/officer/deadspace fits on faction ships and saw little point in a maurader. Once people started gettign ganked for their core-x or gist stuff, then people relised that a t2 fitted maurader has almost the performance of a faction fit Nightmare/CNR etc. Maurader sales went through the roof since then.
But on the other side of the coin, in a risk vs reward game, where was the risk for the ganker? The ganker knew exactly what his risks are, and they were almost neglible due to insurance. In other words, the risk was non existant since the ganker had a certinty of the end result of his losses.
Keeping ganking in the game is good, and removing insurance is good as well. I hope CCP take this one step further and remove insurance altogether in 0.0 so losses actually mean something. --
Billion Isk Mission |
Stirnak
Finis Lumen Atlas Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 10:28:00 -
[474]
Adapt or quit
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Cassandra Beckinsale
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Posted - 2008.08.07 11:58:00 -
[475]
Edited by: Cassandra Beckinsale on 07/08/2008 11:59:33
Originally by: Lord WarATron Edited by: Lord WarATron on 07/08/2008 10:26:06 Its a intresting change.
Suicide Ganks created the market in t2 transport ships and became the reason why maudader sales took off.
Before t1 haulers were ganked regularly, people would never dream of using a t2 transport ship. In fact, sales of transport ships were almost non-existant. Only when people relised that transport ships raise the bar of suicide gank, that people started buying them.
Mauraders were never that popular until Suicide ganking mission runners became commonplace. Even these forums has lots of anti-maurader posts asking why people would waste isk on them. People perfered faction/officer/deadspace fits on faction ships and saw little point in a maurader. Once people started gettign ganked for their core-x or gist stuff, then people relised that a t2 fitted maurader has almost the performance of a faction fit Nightmare/CNR etc. Maurader sales went through the roof since then.
But on the other side of the coin, in a risk vs reward game, where was the risk for the ganker? The ganker knew exactly what his risks are, and they were almost neglible due to insurance. In other words, the risk was non existant since the ganker had a certinty of the end result of his losses.
Keeping ganking in the game is good, and removing insurance is good as well. I hope CCP take this one step further and remove insurance altogether in 0.0 so losses actually mean something.
I got my marauder so I could do lvl 4 missions more safe and faster, not because of ganking, I got my T2 Transport ship so I could transport more and faster, not because of ganking. All the expensive stuff I get is to help me do lvl 4 missions faster and safer... speaking also on behalf of many of my friends that are also PVE'ers.
I'm a pure PVE EVE player and you know why? Because EVE has room for PVE players. Never got suicide ganked basically because I only fit T2 items, I would love to use faction but for what? To have alqueada after me? Faction / complex / commander items were kind useless, they would actually make you loose more then help you get more. But with insurance banned I will start using them, the whole faction comunity will benefit from this I believe, contracts menu will now actually be usefull
If people want to PVP then go on low sec, they should think a bit more on others whose game style is not connected to PVP / Ganking. If all they want to do is to gank others then this game is not for you. I will eventually do PVP when I have the skills and money that I can afford to loose, so I'll move me ass to low sec when I'm willing to pvp. I only disagree with you with the part: "that ganking plays an important economic role in eve", as I mentioned above, PVE players tend to get the best there is to profit faster in PVE activities not to protect them selfs from ganking.
PS: Why would you dare to buy a expensive ship such as a marauder which costs something like 700 - 800mil, that cannot be insurance and still be ganked like all the others? They can gank your ship just for fun I believe...
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Cassandra Beckinsale
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Posted - 2008.08.07 12:19:00 -
[476]
Edited by: Cassandra Beckinsale on 07/08/2008 12:20:05 Further more, since when does ganking is a way of playing EVE? It does not makes any sense to me. Are there any skills which help you gank faster?
- SUICIDER Skill Book TTMx3: "It delays by 10% the time concord requires to help the ganker's Victim"
- CORSAIR Skill Book TTMx4: "It increases by 5% the ganker's Insurance amount payback"
- GANKING Skill Book TTMx1: "Increases by 5% the damage of the weapons when ganking someone"
No, ganking is fun and profitable, because you don't need skills, other than the skills required to fly a raven and its weapons (basically). And your loss is minimal unlike your victims loss which can be absurd. Lets all do ganking, lets all stay outside and wait for someone with precious items...
What if everyone would actually resort to gank? People would simply stand grouped and scanning each other ships and eventually die from tedium... Then they would say:
"We need carebears! EVE is dying CCP should so something about ganking being so easy and at the reach of any player". But no, not everyone wants to gank, why? Well I believe hardcore PVP'ers, that is TRUE PVP'ers enjoy battling foes which can fight back and being able to keep their ships intact after the battle, I think its way more rewarding and fun.
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Zaknussem
Caldari The Ironbreakers
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Posted - 2008.08.07 12:32:00 -
[477]
Originally by: hedfunk You're an idiot. This is in now way a hit on carebears, a carebear misfiring (<-- combined word) happens how often? Yes, that really compensates for being vulnerable to suicide attacks.
(Bolded type are corrections, a.k.a "Fixed it for ya".)
First rule of calling others idiots: Make sure you don't appear as one yourself. See above.
Second rule of calling others idiots: If you intend to refute their point(s), do so in a clear manner.
You're saying that carebears misfire their weapons so rarely that the upcoming insurance change won't affect them? Okay. How do you know this? Do you have access to logs or information that prove your point? Have you polled every single EvE-player, asking them how many times they've misfired at someone/something? Unlikely.
Or maybe you've camped outsite a newbie station for weeks on end, trying to grief your way to some easy kills, only to find that they aren't as dumb as you thought? Whatever. Doesn't change my point, which is this: It doesn't matter whether a player is a day-old n00b or been playing since the beta, or whether they're dumb as bricks or MENSA-members, in-game accidents can and will happen.
Everyone will be hit by this change, even the carebears. Everyone that ever makes a CONCORD-involved mistake will now suffer losses. This is a bold step towards EvE being the "cold, harsh and unforgiving world" that it claims to be. |
Cassandra Beckinsale
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Posted - 2008.08.07 12:34:00 -
[478]
Originally by: Zaknussem
Originally by: hedfunk You're an idiot. This is in now way a hit on carebears, a carebear misfiring (<-- combined word) happens how often? Yes, that really compensates for being vulnerable to suicide attacks.
(Bolded type are corrections, a.k.a "Fixed it for ya".)
First rule of calling others idiots: Make sure you don't appear as one yourself. See above.
Second rule of calling others idiots: If you intend to refute their point(s), do so in a clear manner.
You're saying that carebears misfire their weapons so rarely that the upcoming insurance change won't affect them? Okay. How do you know this? Do you have access to logs or information that prove your point? Have you polled every single EvE-player, asking them how many times they've misfired at someone/something? Unlikely.
Or maybe you've camped outsite a newbie station for weeks on end, trying to grief your way to some easy kills, only to find that they aren't as dumb as you thought? Whatever. Doesn't change my point, which is this: It doesn't matter whether a player is a day-old n00b or been playing since the beta, or whether they're dumb as bricks or MENSA-members, in-game accidents can and will happen.
Everyone will be hit by this change, even the carebears. Everyone that ever makes a CONCORD-involved mistake will now suffer losses. This is a bold step towards EvE being the "cold, harsh and unforgiving world" that it claims to be.
I second that
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Maximillian Bayonette
White Lion Manufacture and Salvage
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Posted - 2008.08.07 13:30:00 -
[479]
Originally by: Cassandra Beckinsale
Originally by: Zaknussem
Originally by: hedfunk You're an idiot. This is in now way a hit on carebears, a carebear misfiring (<-- combined word) happens how often? Yes, that really compensates for being vulnerable to suicide attacks.
(Bolded type are corrections, a.k.a "Fixed it for ya".)
First rule of calling others idiots: Make sure you don't appear as one yourself. See above.
Second rule of calling others idiots: If you intend to refute their point(s), do so in a clear manner.
You're saying that carebears misfire their weapons so rarely that the upcoming insurance change won't affect them? Okay. How do you know this? Do you have access to logs or information that prove your point? Have you polled every single EvE-player, asking them how many times they've misfired at someone/something? Unlikely.
Or maybe you've camped outsite a newbie station for weeks on end, trying to grief your way to some easy kills, only to find that they aren't as dumb as you thought? Whatever. Doesn't change my point, which is this: It doesn't matter whether a player is a day-old n00b or been playing since the beta, or whether they're dumb as bricks or MENSA-members, in-game accidents can and will happen.
Everyone will be hit by this change, even the carebears. Everyone that ever makes a CONCORD-involved mistake will now suffer losses. This is a bold step towards EvE being the "cold, harsh and unforgiving world" that it claims to be.
I second that
Because non-native English people can't recognise an idiot when they see one?
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Cassandra Beckinsale
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Posted - 2008.08.07 13:42:00 -
[480]
Edited by: Cassandra Beckinsale on 07/08/2008 13:44:33
Quote:
Because non-native English people can't recognise an idiot when they see one?
Because non-native english ppl tend to be smart enough to speak 2 languages, a feature idiots can't be part of. Idiots also tend to use small offensive phrases instead long texts to defend their ideias / arguments.
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mishkof
Caldari Finis Lumen
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Posted - 2008.08.07 13:47:00 -
[481]
Originally by: Sergeant Spot High Sec suicide piracy should be a serious money LOSER unless the target is fitted with / hauling extreme wealth. (If the target does have a multi billion fit on his raven, then all bets are off....)
Its that simple.
If you want more freedom to blast away, get the hell out of high sec.
I've been saying it for years: IGNORE the high sec carebears. I never have, and never will, comprehend why so many idiots seem OBSESSED with shooting at them. Shoot at something else.
This. I simply dont understand the obsession either.
Are you mad that they make 20 mil an hour doing the most mind numbing thing ever created?
Seriously, some people will cry when their milk isnt spilled.
I own a T2 BPO and Capital alt, therefor all of my views will be pro-Capital Alt/T2 BPO orientated. Please pick one of the following settings for your response. []hate me []troll me []smack me |
Maximillian Bayonette
White Lion Manufacture and Salvage
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Posted - 2008.08.07 14:43:00 -
[482]
Originally by: mishkof This. I simply dont understand the obsession either.
Are you mad that they make 20 mil an hour doing the most mind numbing thing ever created?
Seriously, some people will cry when their milk isnt spilled.
What do you think would happen if CCP decided that level 4 high sec missions are too rewarding (which they are), and decided to cut profits by 70%? I mean, you can still run your missions, right? Then what is there to cry about? I'd say the forums would have an eruption that would rival St. Helens.
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Exlegion
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 14:56:00 -
[483]
Edited by: Exlegion on 07/08/2008 15:04:19
Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette What do you think would happen if CCP decided that level 4 high sec missions are too rewarding (which they are), and decided to cut profits by 70%? I mean, you can still run your missions, right? Then what is there to cry about? I'd say the forums would have an eruption that would rival St. Helens.
I'd say PVP hardcores would still complain that no one's flocking to low sec to be masacred by the game elitists and thus, CCP should nerf high sec even more. Their motto: "Drive them to my guns or drive them out."
And thankfully, unlike them, CCP sees value in keeping them around. My advice to you is let them be. I moved out of high sec a long time ago and haven't looked back ever since. I don't care what's going on in high sec nor am I in any way envious of what players are doing up there. I run my missions in low sec and run about in 0.0 only worrying on who's waiting for me at the corner to take me out.
Edit: Oh, and if high sec space isn't dark or harsh enough for you try low/0.0 sec. Careful though. People do shoot back over there.
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Gang Starr |
Andrea Skye
Caldari The Python Cartel
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:07:00 -
[484]
None of this will really affect me, being a -10 already...
But i have to say, i think they have overdone it with the no-insurance change. Some people made a living out of scuicide ganking, and was one of the many options in eve to making isk. CCP, dont ruin the game, the reason eve is so great because people can choose what they want to do. By doing this your removing an option of gameplay.
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Maximillian Bayonette
White Lion Manufacture and Salvage
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:16:00 -
[485]
Nice dodge there, Exlegion, but you didn't answer my question at all.
Originally by: Exlegion
I'd say PVP hardcores would still complain that no one's flocking to low sec to be masacred by the game elitists and thus, CCP should nerf high sec even more. Their motto: "Drive them to my guns or drive them out."
PvP hardcores don't complain about that. Numbnuts complain about that. PvP hardcores have followed their prey into high sec. Now they've been nerfed yet again. Guess your motto is "Make Eve a carbear game or I quit". So far it's worked out well for you.
Originally by: Exlegion
And thankfully, unlike them, CCP sees value in keeping them around. My advice to you is let them be. I moved out of high sec a long time ago and haven't looked back ever since. I don't care what's going on in high sec nor am I in any way envious of what players are doing up there. I run my missions in low sec and run about in 0.0 only worrying on who's waiting for me at the corner to take me out.
Good for you that you managed to find a pile of other carebears (Hydra) to play with. So what you are saying is that you want two games. A PvE game in high sec and a PvP(ish) game in low-sec and 0.0. Well, it seems CCP is working towards it, but that's never been their stated intention in the past.
Originally by: Exlegion
Edit: Oh, and if high sec space isn't dark or harsh enough for you try low/0.0 sec. Careful though. People do shoot back over there.
How's Hydra working out for you right now when TRI is messing about? It's a matter of time before you're back in Empire, so I wouldn't be gloating too much if I were you.
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Juleko
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:17:00 -
[486]
Originally by: Andrea Skye None of this will really affect me, being a -10 already...
But i have to say, i think they have overdone it with the no-insurance change. Some people made a living out of scuicide ganking, and was one of the many options in eve to making isk. CCP, dont ruin the game, the reason eve is so great because people can choose what they want to do. By doing this your removing an option of gameplay.
Problem is the existing mechanic of suicide ganking with insurance payouts makes it profitable to gank everything.
Once again for the benefit of the cheap seats - CCP haven't nerfed suicide ganking, they've raised the bar at which you start to make a profit. It is, and will forever be profitable to gank something carrying/fitting several hundred millions of ISK - so nothing has changed in that regard at all.
I find it absolutely staggering that people talk about there being "no risk in Eve anymore" when they're proponents of an activity which is entirely risk-free. There is irony somewhere in people whining about risk in the same sentence as bemoaning the lack of insurance.
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Maximillian Bayonette
White Lion Manufacture and Salvage
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:31:00 -
[487]
Originally by: Juleko Problem is the existing mechanic of suicide ganking with insurance payouts makes it profitable to gank everything.
The problem is that people actually believe this. It was NEVER profitable to gank everything. Some people did it for lulz, but that doesn't make it profitable. The people who keep insisting that this was the case are people who have never suicide ganked anyone. The only experience they have - if any - was as the victim. Of course it seems simple after the gank is over. That doesn't mean it was.
Originally by: Juleko
Once again for the benefit of the cheap seats - CCP haven't nerfed suicide ganking, they've raised the bar at which you start to make a profit. It is, and will forever be profitable to gank something carrying/fitting several hundred millions of ISK - so nothing has changed in that regard at all.
No, what CCP has done is make raised the bar so high it's nigh impossible to be profitable while suicide ganking. It's not like it was raining targets before. Now there are even more restrictions. Again, this is a matter of people not having any experience/having one sided experience.
Originally by: Juleko
I find it absolutely staggering that people talk about there being "no risk in Eve anymore" when they're proponents of an activity which is entirely risk-free. There is irony somewhere in people whining about risk in the same sentence as bemoaning the lack of insurance.
Again, it was never risk-free. It was never easy. It might have required a tweak to bring it into balance, but this is far from a tweak. This is a sledge-hammer blow.
The reason why so many people are upset, however, doesn't really have much to do with the changes themselves. It has more to do with the fact that the recent changes to Eve mark a clear drive toward a more casual-friendly game, aimed at a bigger market. Since it's inception, this game has been a niche game for a special kind of audience. Now it's going away from that, and the people who played the game for its niche have nowhere else to go. After all, there are a hundred different PvE focused games on the market. There is 1 PvP focused game. That's being ruined.
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Exlegion
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:45:00 -
[488]
Edited by: Exlegion on 07/08/2008 15:48:49 Maximillian Bayonette,
If you have something to say about my alliance take it to CAOD. Either way I don't care. Your comments don't insult me. And honestly I really could care less whether you hate me for being a carebear or not. Unlike you, I derive no pleasure from others' miseries. I find these 'It's the end of Eve! Run for cover!' threads a bit hipocritical and ironic. Eve is toughening up for the high sec free lunchers. Sorry you don't see it that way.
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Gang Starr |
Fitzwelin
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:46:00 -
[489]
One question. Why does removing the insurance payment from ganking in high sec space ACTUALLY stop people from doing it??
All these posts saying I cant gank!, I'm going to leave!, CCP are ruining my game! You CAN still gank, you CAN gank as much as you ever did before only this time you will also suffer a penalty.
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Basic Miner
Caldari Navy II
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:50:00 -
[490]
Only noob pvp'ers manage to whine about this gift :)
This will make suicide ganking easier, now everyone will think hi sec is safe and put on autopilot ;...;
_______________________________________ [Insert catchy/cool phrase here] |
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Maximillian Bayonette
White Lion Manufacture and Salvage
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:57:00 -
[491]
Originally by: Exlegion Edited by: Exlegion on 07/08/2008 15:48:49 Maximillian Bayonette,
If you have something to say about my alliance take it to CAOD.
No, I'll say it here, thanks. It's quite ironic how you continue to prove the reputation of HYDRA with every post you make.
Originally by: Exlegion
Either way I don't care. Your comments don't insult me. And honestly I really could care less whether you hate me for being a carebear or not.
Cared enough to post, apparently. I'll have to think up new ways of insulting you, because you are in sore need of insulting. It might make you think about the rubbish that you spew on the forums.
Originally by: Exlegion
Unlike you, I derive no pleasure from others' miseries.
You know nothing of me or my motives. Unlike you, I care about the game and I knew what kind of a game it was when I joined it. I had no reason to have it change from the way it used to be. Upgraded, yes. Balanced, yes. But this? No. This is so far from the stated original vision that its getting rediculous.
Originally by: Exlegion
I find these 'It's the end of Eve! Run for cover!' threads a bit hipocritical and ironic.
That's because you're looking at this through carebear blinders. You're not seeing the big picture and the complete change of mentality. You're not seeing the similarities between what's happening in Eve and what happened to many other MMO's who tried to cater to the "lowest-common-denominator" masses and failed. If CCP keeps up with this new trend, Eve will die. It is proven by history.
Originally by: Exlegion
Eve is toughening up for the high sec free lunchers. Sorry you don't see it that way.
This is one of the stupidest arguments that continue to be posted on the forums. It's once again evidence of your narrow vision. It get's tougher for suicide gankers (your "free lunchers", although you're completely wrong about that) and as a consequence, it gets a whole heap easier for AFKers, macroers, stupid and lazy people. That is what we are protesting. Catering to those cathegories is signing the death warrant for a game.
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Juleko
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Posted - 2008.08.07 15:59:00 -
[492]
Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette
Originally by: Juleko Problem is the existing mechanic of suicide ganking with insurance payouts makes it profitable to gank everything.
The problem is that people actually believe this. It was NEVER profitable to gank everything. Some people did it for lulz, but that doesn't make it profitable. The people who keep insisting that this was the case are people who have never suicide ganked anyone. The only experience they have - if any - was as the victim. Of course it seems simple after the gank is over. That doesn't mean it was.
You most likely know more than I do, however using some conservative figures:
Raven - 75M T2 Torp, BCS & ammo fit - ~2M Plat insurance - 33M Plat ins. payout - 108M
Cost after payout - 2M
If you figure 6-7 clones of the above being enough to take down any ship before CONCORD are on grid in a 0.5 you're looking at a total cost of around 15M.
Are those numbers wrong or is there another aspect to it I'm not understanding? Are you going to tell me that 6-7 like minded individuals taking the time to scan someone in Motsu/Irjunen or wherever somehow adds a huge cost element to this?
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Exlegion
New Light Hydra Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.07 16:28:00 -
[493]
Edited by: Exlegion on 07/08/2008 16:28:54 I'll ignore your ad hominems.
Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette You know nothing of me or my motives. Unlike you, I care about the game and I knew what kind of a game it was when I joined it. I had no reason to have it change from the way it used to be. Upgraded, yes. Balanced, yes. But this? No. This is so far from the stated original vision that its getting rediculous.
This change mostly affects the 'free lunchers' in high sec. If you operate in low/0.0 it won't affect you for worse. Quite the contrary. It is boosting low sec by bringing the bulk of the fight to it. Not only that, but it might actually bring life to the anti-pirate profession, as now the sec hits won't be as bad. The only players with reason to fear this change are those looking for easy grief-style PVP.
Quote: You're not seeing the big picture and the complete change of mentality. You're not seeing the similarities between what's happening in Eve and what happened to many other MMO's who tried to cater to the "lowest-common-denominator" masses and failed. If CCP keeps up with this new trend, Eve will die. It is proven by history.
Granted, I haven't played many MMO's. In fact, it has only been Eve and Earth & Beyond (for those that care in remembering :(). In any case, I don't share your view that Eve will die with these changes. Low sec and 0.0 still cater to the hardcore PVP'er. And I suspect it always will. Again, the only ones that will be affected by these changes are the few bottom feeders operating in high sec space.
Quote: It get's tougher for suicide gankers (your "free lunchers", although you're completely wrong about that) and as a consequence, it gets a whole heap easier for AFKers, macroers, stupid and lazy people. That is what we are protesting. Catering to those cathegories is signing the death warrant for a game.
Haha! That's the beauty of it! The lazy AFKers (as you call them) may think it gets easier, but they'll be in for a surprise. The intelligent high sec PVPers will still be able to operate in high sec successfully. I suspect that the ones in it for more than just shits and giggles will actually welcome the challenge, as has already been posted in many of the threads about. A high-value untanked industrial will still yield a high enough profit to those that plan. To the "lulz" gankers it will turn out to be a greater loss.
One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Gang Starr |
Maximillian Bayonette
White Lion Manufacture and Salvage
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Posted - 2008.08.07 16:56:00 -
[494]
Originally by: Juleko
Raven - 80M T2 Torp, BCS & ammo fit - ~5M Plat insurance - 33M Plat ins. payout - 108M
Cost after payout - 10M
Those are more realistic figures. This means every suicide gank attempt costs the ganker 10M in ISK alone. There are other things to factor in as well, but let's stick with pure isk loss for the moment.
Now, what if the targets got a bit smarter? Like, for instance, fitted a passive tank? Do you think a Badger II can withstand the force of an overheated torp raven in a .6 system until CONCORD arrives? No? Well, it can, if properly tanked. This is not EFT talking either, I've seen it. Adding to that, the Badger had already survived a suicide attempt. So, a lonely T1 hauler AFKing through Empire survived two suicide attempts. So, there's one counter that has been proven to work: Fitting your ship properly.
Secondly, what do you think would have happened if the hauler had not been AFK? How many suicide attempts? I will tell you: 0. Because there isn't enough time to lock, scan, calculate and pop a hauler that is actually playing the game. So, there's two proven counters. There are more, but that's enough for now.
Originally by: Juleko
If you figure 6-7 clones of the above being enough to take down any ship before CONCORD are on grid in a 0.5 you're looking at a total cost of around 15M.
If you are speaking about Freighters, it's closer to 20 ships. Using my more realistic numbers, that's 200M per ATTEMPT. On top of that, there are the security penalties and the killrights.
Originally by: Juleko
Are those numbers wrong or is there another aspect to it I'm not understanding? Are you going to tell me that 6-7 like minded individuals taking the time to scan someone in Motsu/Irjunen or wherever somehow adds a huge cost element to this?
If you are talking about mission runners, in my opinion, 6-7 dedicated people scanning and popping a pimped out isk-mobile is good for the game. Those 6-7 people SHOULD be well rewarded. Because they managed to take advantage of stupidity. That should be the highest rewarding profession in the game. Also, again using my numbers, these people are facing around 70 millions in loss + security penalties if they fail.
Depending on the time it took them to find the mission runner, they would have to increase the potential reward to make it worth while. Let's say the mission runner has 1 billion in fittings. With 50/50 drop chance, provided it's not just one valuable module, the gankers can expect around 500M to share. That's about 71.5M a piece. Deduct the 10M and we're looking at just over 60 a piece. Now, let's say the gankers had to wait three hours to find their victim (very common when suicide ganking) that's around 20M an hour. Now we're at the level of which a high sec mission runner can make. Deduct the security penalties, and the reward is even less. A mission runner gets IMPROVED security rating, so his reward is already higher.
Now, if there was just a singler item that was valuable, there would be a 50/50 chance for it to drop. That is, there is a 50% chance that the gankers gain 40M (double the previous due to total drop) + sec penalties, and there's a 50% chance they lose 10M + sec penalties.
The point of this post is that most people don't really know what they are talking about when it comes to suicide ganking because they have no experience.
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Juleko
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Posted - 2008.08.07 18:49:00 -
[495]
Cmon man, you're extending scenarios to breaking point to prove your arguments.
I don't believe for one second that a group of 6-7 gankers sit around for three hours looking for target(s), or a specific target. All they would need to do - as you well know - is add a juicy target to their addressbook, monitor their online patterns and use locator agents when they're online. In short - gankers can just drop what they were already doing at a moments notice to get into their already prepared gankships to go and kill the target.
Secondly, you suggest that its typical for a single gank raven to take on a Badger II knowing full well that the Badgers tank fit could make the difference between success and failure? Quite frankly that scenario would never happen unless the ganker was plain stupid. Why leave anything to chance at all? Just bring alone one or two more torp Ravens and completely negate whatever tank said Badger has? Again, a contrived argument engineered to make it sound like there is actually an element of risk involved.
As for talking about targets - I wasn't referring to freighters, I was thinking more about pimped out mission ships. I'd wager it wouldn't take more than 7 torp Ravens to take out ANY battleship regardless of the tank, and that group of 7 can dictate where and when that fight takes place. And please don't try and suggest that suicide gankers speculatively lock, scan and attack people who just appear on the gate in a system - they will have alts who will have already scanned the ships coming out of the missioning stations hours or even days ago. The way you make suicide ganking sound is like it's some completely speculative and variable encounter when it isn't.
So, 7 torp Ravens who - assuming the pilots are clever enough to be able to lock a target and hit F1-F6 - will be guaranteed to kill their target before CONCORD show up in a sufficiently low security system, and as long as the can drops at least 70M they will make a profit. That pretty much puts every single ship with a half-decent faction module in that camp. If you get a faction invuln field then you're looking at a near 300% profit - from one module.
Incidentally as a final point - you state that "what do you think would have happened if the hauler had not been AFK". The answer? Nothing at all. WTZ doesn't grant immunity - I've read threads on here from people who have been ganked who were ganked in a mission, undocking (now that you're thrown out of docking range), on the gate in a new system en route to wherever they were going, etc. If you can lock a BS in less time than it takes to align - with or without sensor boosters - then that person is dead. Doesn't matter what they activate, or if they overload, or what.
The cards are totally stacked in the ganker teams favour, and this change seeks to raise the cutoff point for profitability. It doesn't change the dynamic of suicide ganking, it just means that it will cost more than 70M to gank with 100% success rate any non-freighter target in the game.
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Beltantis Torrence
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Posted - 2008.08.07 19:56:00 -
[496]
Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette Nice dodge there, Exlegion, but you didn't answer my question at all. PvP hardcores don't complain about that. Numbnuts complain about that. PvP hardcores have followed their prey into high sec. Now they've been nerfed yet again. Guess your motto is "Make Eve a carbear game or I quit". So far it's worked out well for you.
You failed when you called suicide ganking unarmed ships 'hardcore PVP'. Its easy mode, x3, with cheats enabled. There's nothing hardcore about it. Are you 'hardcore' martial arts if you can break a board that isn't trying to hit you back?
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Jeremy Paxman
Special Doc
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Posted - 2008.08.07 20:02:00 -
[497]
What you fail to realise is this:
Hello Kitty Online is really f****** good. You've obviously never played.
-------------------- In Soviet Cornwall, cows tip you. |
Synapse Archae
Amarr Demonic Retribution Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.08.08 01:29:00 -
[498]
Juleko: It really does take more than 3 hours.
You can spend half a day staring at traffic and not find anything interesting.
I'm telling you this from personal experience. Are you?
Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Veldya
Caldari Guristari Freedom Fighters
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Posted - 2008.08.08 02:33:00 -
[499]
Originally by: Juleko Cmon man, you're extending scenarios to breaking point to prove your arguments.
I don't believe for one second that a group of 6-7 gankers sit around for three hours looking for target(s), or a specific target. All they would need to do - as you well know - is add a juicy target to their addressbook, monitor their online patterns and use locator agents when they're online. In short - gankers can just drop what they were already doing at a moments notice to get into their already prepared gankships to go and kill the target.
An XL Gist or Pith shield booster is 1-2 billion. Caldari Invulns 300m+, then there are all the engineering, bcs, launchers, etc. It is a very lucrative business. I believe Triumverate had 40 people working on ganking mission runners. Jihadswarm had countless ganking barges and exhumers. It has and does still happen.
Many groups made a living off of preying on mission runners and knowing they are in a PvE fit which needs a very specific tank if you scan a raven and it is setup to tank KIN/THE and you tackle it and hit it with 5 T1 EMP Ravens then it is going to go down like a lead balloon, the cost to the gankers, probably in the vicinity of $50m, the potential payout is in the billions.
Suicide ganking has caused a massive depression in faction+ items, the demand for them has plummeted because of the ease of ganking. People don't use those modules as much anymore because you light up like a Christmas tree if you use these modules.
EVE is not meant to be lawless, in high-sec it is meant to be hard on pirates. It is silly we have ships like State Ravens we will NEVER have the pleasure of seeing flying around because of their rarity and value every idiot is going to want to destroy it, so we never get to see them. High end modules are more of a liability than benefit with ganking and if obtaining those aren't part of the pinnacle of the game then what is? Flying around with cheap T1 fits doing the same thing over and over?
To think people are claiming this change is going to ruin the game when they should be looking in the mirror and see who has forced these changes is quite laughable.
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Korin Veecolectus
Caldari Yurai-Tenshin Zaibatsu Celestial Imperative
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Posted - 2008.08.08 02:51:00 -
[500]
Suicide gankers should pay the penalty. Criminal activity is downright stupid. Taking advantage of others is also stupid. Would you like some cheese with that whine? I wish high sec was even more policed. If you break the law, you pay the price. Having a criminal mind doesn't make you smart. It makes you an idiot.
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Rawk Awn
Minmatar Encina Technologies
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Posted - 2008.08.08 03:06:00 -
[501]
@ page 17, tl;dr
Griefer tears taste the sweetest.
/me waves bye bye to the bottom-feeders.
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Gark32
Suddenly Ninjas
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Posted - 2008.08.08 03:17:00 -
[502]
Originally by: Korin Veecolectus Suicide gankers should pay the penalty. Criminal activity is downright stupid. Taking advantage of others is also stupid. Would you like some cheese with that whine? I wish high sec was even more policed. If you break the law, you pay the price. Having a criminal mind doesn't make you smart. It makes you an idiot.
Obvious Troll is Obvious.
i'm sure someone said it already, but these changes are actually good for the career suicide gankers among us -- carebears will think that they're safe in Hisec, and gankers will find more juicy targets.
________________________________________________
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Somealt Ofmine
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Posted - 2008.08.08 03:28:00 -
[503]
The Emo is strong with this thread.
The sun will rise tomorrow. Pirates will still sit deeply stoned camping gates and giggling like schoolgirls with each hauler kill. The lag will still suck so hard out in 0.0 that it blows everyone's hair back. And, of course, there will still be 600 in local in Jita.
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Mara Rinn
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.08.08 04:50:00 -
[504]
Just a trivial little factoid for people who may or may not care - WTZ does not make you immune to gate camps in hisec.
An industrial ship or freighter is very slow to turn and accelerate. There are tricks that can be used, such as having an escort come with you to webify you after you make the turn - this means that your current speed of 10m/s becomes more than 75% of your maximum webified speed. However, you still have to make that turn.
The time it takes a Iteron V to turn 45 degrees and accelerate to warp speed is more than enough for a script-boosted tackler to get a target lock and activate the warp scrambler.
WTZ does not make you safe.
To be "safe", you need to fit a tank and fit your hauler out for maximum agility so that noone can lock on to you before you enter warp. Not even the guy in the tackler frigate with the target painter and warp scrambler.
Does the removal of insurance payouts for CONCORD events raise the stakes? Yes it does! First, it means suicide gankers will be looking for more ISK value before ganking you. Second, it means carebears like myself can start fitting more valuable modules on our ships without being too worried about getting suicide ganked.
As the veteran population gets more skills, better sources of income, ability to fly better ships, etc, the new players need to have some kind of safety net. Hisec should be the safest place to fly, and moving to lower rated hisec areas should give the new players some cause for concern. Remember that a new player who does nothing but run missions for ISK will only be raising their security status slowly compared to the dedicated suicide ganker who spends their time ratting in 0.0.
Eventually the mission-runners will find that level 4 missions aren't exciting anymore and they'll go looking for something else. When they go forming noob fleets and heading out to level 5 agents, that will be your opportunity to teach them about PvP in losec.
There will be a time when even carebears like myself will go looking for PvP - this will be after I have established a stable income, after I have sequestered my +5 implant mission-running flesh in a jump clone station and have my naked flesh in a cheap throwaway ship, in a Faction Warfare corp.
Is CCP clearly catering to the carebears by increasing the cost of suicide ganking? I don't think so. Certainly, the required ISK value of a target must be higher to accommodate the lack of 110% payout on platinum insurance. Certainly, you have to be careful about picking your targets. It is also certain that carebears will become more complacent and fly their expensively fitted mission-running gankbait to places they really shouldn't be going.
This is not the end of suicide ganking for profit - it will certainly cramp your style if you're into suicide ganking for lolz.
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SPIONKOP
Caldari Macabre Votum Imperial Republic Of the North
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Posted - 2008.08.08 08:27:00 -
[505]
I have been waiting for this change for a long long time.
Now the suicide gankers will have to think about the risk v reward.
Still plenty of folks who think they can carry a high value BPO in a shuttle on AP to gank. Rest of us will be a little safer now.
--------------------------------------------- Space For Rent.
100mil ISK/Week.
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Purgatori
Minmatar Thundercats RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.08.08 09:13:00 -
[506]
Comming from a player who played since day 1 ,
Only one i seem strange is the insurance .. Gankers should be about.. so taking the insurance away isnt the best idea. You still shouldnt be 100% safe in empire. We get bad guys in rl .. so you should here..
Maybe a "Pirate" Indsurance .. where its not as high as deemed a "good" guy's insurance or a % of kills must be repaid to the "pirate" insurance ..
But no insurance... nooo... why are we making it too easy on them? i have a empire guy also..and even I dont want it this easy... please return eve to hardcore mode..
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Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2008.08.08 09:24:00 -
[507]
Originally by: Mara Rinn
There will be a time when even carebears like myself will go looking for PvP - this will be after I have established a stable income, after I have sequestered my +5 implant mission-running flesh in a jump clone station and have my naked flesh in a cheap throwaway ship, in a Faction Warfare corp.
Are you boring in real life to?
SKUNK
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Onionico
Series of Tubes
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Posted - 2008.08.08 09:46:00 -
[508]
Welp. Eve had a great run while it lasted.
Not saying it's doomed ofc, but this is just pathetic. I'll play until the servers shut down, but these are backbreaking changes.
"sandbox." lol
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Frenetick
Minmatar New World Federation
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Posted - 2008.08.08 09:55:00 -
[509]
Edited by: Frenetick on 08/08/2008 09:56:36
Originally by: Onionico Welp. Eve had a great run while it lasted.
Not saying it's doomed ofc, but this is just pathetic. I'll play until the servers shut down, but these are backbreaking changes.
"sandbox." lol
Damn those 'backbreaking' changes .....
Quote: 1. At least a dozen more topics in various forums 2. Use of extreme hyperbole, Comparisons to WoW and HKO, etc 3. Claim that all CCP devs are biased in favor of BoB macrominers and farmers 4 |
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