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wth did you do to my missiles?

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Diabolyc Amarr A.N.A.R.C.H.I.C.A G00DFELLAS	Posted - 2008.11.12 06:53:00 - [211] Originally by: Pedro Snachez 2. Shield Tank. You seriously can't sacrifice 1 slot to use a target painter? I've flown a Raven and 95% of missions won't even come close to pushing your tank as long as you don't aggro the whole room. If you need to use all of your mids and rigs for tank then you're doing something wrong. This expansion seems to be all about sig radius, so why is it such blasphemy that you might need to sacrifice some tank for gank? Before this patch the Raven had it both ways: Uncontested lows for BCUs and mids for tank. Now you'll have to balance it. good one
Dirtee Girl Omega Enterprises 0mega Factor	Posted - 2008.11.12 06:59:00 - [212] um wait there was this great quote that kept comming up what was it ....? oh yeah adapt or die right ? * *
Illwill Bill Genos Occidere	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:01:00 - [213] Time for the mission runners to adapt or go cashless? WoW in space. Yes, that's it!
Wayson Minmatar Trans Nebula Inc. FOUNDATI0N	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:11:00 - [214] I still do not know, and never will understand, why missiles had to be nerfed. Were they destroying PvP? Hahahahaha. Were they breaking PvE by making missions ridiculously easy? ... not really, as NPCs vomit defenders and there are swarms of small ships even in L4s. Blargh. continues training Gallente Frigate III, onward to the Dominix! ___ Originally by: Tishlin Veredici CONCORD is like the UN. Their entire job is to do nothing until its too late. Originally by: Ranger 1 It finally happened, even lag has been nerfed.
Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:13:00 - [215] Originally by: Pr1ncess Alia I'm not naive, i think they knew full well what they were doing. Either you are going to go back to level 3's or you are going to invest in their uninsurable golem isksink designed for one thing and one thing only, level 4 missions. Grief, it's not that bad. Flying a Raven with just so-so skills (like 8m sp; t1 damage, t2 tank) it's just slower, not undoable. I took on the Vengeance mission right after the patch and though I only had time to do the first pocket today I got through it with my tank intact and made a quick 5m for 8 battleships and about 25 cruisers and frigs. This was using my existing cruise/medium drone fit rather than switching out for target painters or webbers. In one of the harder missions I'd have to warp out more often and yeah it felt slow and rather boring as a result. My main gripe was that I went through quite a lot more ammo than I normally use...like it's taking me 100+ missiles to bring down a battleship that used to take about 60-70. Not so much 'oh noes I can't fly missions nao' as 'ugh, this is even more boring' (not least since my ship is also 15% slower). I dunno, I'm going to try out some alternative fits, eg afterburner and torpedoes or something besides the obvious things like target painters. But level 3 vs. Golem are not the only choices. I'm less than thrilled since I haven't been doing level 4s all that long but it still pays a lot better than mining.
Thorian Baalnorn	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:28:00 - [216] Ok i just did an "easy" level 4 mission. My raven doesnt hit for crap( unless a BS is moving at less than 200m/s or less i get damage reduction on even those) it took two ravens 8 drones to do the mission. i actually used more missles on a 30k isk frigate than i did on a 500isk battle ship. a mission i normally run in 20 minutes in 2 ravens now takes 1 hour. I also hear, in game, gunships are having problems hitting npc targets. Given my recent experience i have concluded a couple of things. 1)missioning is now as profitable as mining in a rookie ship in hisec 2) i can effectively tank most battleships in a t1 frigate. 3) this is just a different version of nano***gery. the smaller the ship the better. 4 frigate can neutralize and kill all but a heavily tanked BS. So tell me in what universe can a frigate easily tank a battleship?...ahhh the eve universe.
Kusotarre Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:34:00 - [217] Originally by: Cpt Branko Enjoy your nano nerf, Caldari pigs. Am I too late to quote this?
apock21	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:35:00 - [218] Originally by: Vikarion Edited by: Vikarion on 12/11/2008 04:59:34 Originally by: Aeo IV And again, I don't care, all I know is somehow between Nanos broken, and Nanos fixed, someone broke my Raven. And my Abaddon. And my SB. And probably a good host of other things I haven't realized. This. THISTHISTHISTHISTHIS. Why should everything I enjoy flying be penalized because I didn't pay much attention to what other players were politicking about? Oh, right, because CCP uses a sledgehammer to swat gnats. THIS made me chuckle. Completely correct, this patch was an absolute epic fail. I love how half the people screaming "adapt or die" dont use ravens. Its funny to think that a ship type can influence the market, however i predict inflated prices on everything for the next couple of months, until they fix the patch or mission runners cross train a competent level 4 boat. I have no interest in saving up for a golem and spending 1bil plus to run missions, and I doubt very many other people will either.
Thorian Baalnorn	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:37:00 - [219] Originally by: Anig Browl Originally by: Pr1ncess Alia I'm not naive, i think they knew full well what they were doing. Either you are going to go back to level 3's or you are going to invest in their uninsurable golem isksink designed for one thing and one thing only, level 4 missions. Grief, it's not that bad. Flying a Raven with just so-so skills (like 8m sp; t1 damage, t2 tank) it's just slower, not undoable. I took on the Vengeance mission right after the patch and though I only had time to do the first pocket today I got through it with my tank intact and made a quick 5m for 8 battleships and about 25 cruisers and frigs. This was using my existing cruise/medium drone fit rather than switching out for target painters or webbers. In one of the harder missions I'd have to warp out more often and yeah it felt slow and rather boring as a result. My main gripe was that I went through quite a lot more ammo than I normally use...like it's taking me 100+ missiles to bring down a battleship that used to take about 60-70. Not so much 'oh noes I can't fly missions nao' as 'ugh, this is even more boring' (not least since my ship is also 15% slower). I dunno, I'm going to try out some alternative fits, eg afterburner and torpedoes or something besides the obvious things like target painters. But level 3 vs. Golem are not the only choices. I'm less than thrilled since I haven't been doing level 4s all that long but it still pays a lot better than mining. I ve never had to warp out of a level 4( normally) and given the amount of time it takes to kill npcs now figure a reduction in bounty/per hour of about 50%( if your lucky) i tried a level 4 in a drake and my drake does better damage to all targets but battleships ... a drake out DPS a BS a frigate can outtank ( yay nano***gery) a BS using its speed and size... and all missle based ships basically becoming obsolete
Vikarion Caldari White Rose Society	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:43:00 - [220] Edited by: Vikarion on 12/11/2008 07:43:39 Originally by: apock21 Originally by: Vikarion Edited by: Vikarion on 12/11/2008 04:59:34 Originally by: Aeo IV And again, I don't care, all I know is somehow between Nanos broken, and Nanos fixed, someone broke my Raven. And my Abaddon. And my SB. And probably a good host of other things I haven't realized. This. THISTHISTHISTHISTHIS. Why should everything I enjoy flying be penalized because I didn't pay much attention to what other players were politicking about? Oh, right, because CCP uses a sledgehammer to swat gnats. THIS made me chuckle. Completely correct, this patch was an absolute epic fail. I love how half the people screaming "adapt or die" dont use ravens. Its funny to think that a ship type can influence the market, however i predict inflated prices on everything for the next couple of months, until they fix the patch or mission runners cross train a competent level 4 boat. I have no interest in saving up for a golem and spending 1bil plus to run missions, and I doubt very many other people will either. I'm not even majorly specced for Caldari. I fly Amarr. I'm unhappy about EVERY large ship getting nerfed. -400% close range tracking is bad. Very bad. That missiles are worth less than the pixels they use is also bad. But frankly, I'm more concerned about the fact that battleships have basically been turned into miniature capital ships - unable to hit anything, too slow to be dangerous, and generally about as fun to fly as scrubbing your dishes. Apparently the only people who deserve to have fun in Eve are those who fly cruisers or smaller. What really bugs me is that I keep almost quitting, then I find something fun to do, and then CCP nerfs it.

Anig Browl Caldari	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:43:00 - [221] Originally by: Minsc The salvage you get from a level 4 mission is a fraction of what you'd get from ratting in low-sec or 0.0 in the same amount of time. Hmmm, I haven't been out to 0.0 for over a month, but I don't remember it being that profitable. Lowsec certainly isn't...though maybe it's different following the patch. My point is that in a mission you get maybe 15-20 battleships plus twice that number of smaller ships to pick over for salvage items...plus nobody's gonna pop you while you're running your salvager
Spyra Gryra Cruoris Seraphim	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:44:00 - [222] Edited by: Spyra Gryra on 12/11/2008 07:43:59 hahaha adapt or die nubs
Araxmas The Blue Dagger Mercenery Agency The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:45:00 - [223] With exception to precisions my missiles pretty much work as usual. Granted I took the time time to max my missile skills. -------- derek
Kerfira	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:55:00 - [224] It seems to me that CCP has made a pretty good first attempt at a game balance here. 1. Speed was nerfed, but speed-tanking is still useful. 2. Missiles was nerfed, but are still useful against bigger/mwd'ing ships. 3. Target painters are made relevant again. 4. AB's are made relevant again. 5. Mission income nerfed. Ravens were way too good at missioning. There'll probably be tweaks needed down the line (hard not to when changes are this big), but a decently good first shot... FYI, I fly a missile boat for my money-making (L4 high-sec) I'm adapting Seen from a game balance perspective, this is pretty damn good.... Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Lucas Avignon Avignon Associates Inc.	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:56:00 - [225] It sounds like CCP didn't nerf them enough, turret bs's can't hit frigates, why should cruise ravens? Originally by: CCP Prism X Yeah, and while we're at it we can create a controlled environment around account hacking and credit card fraud and all the other EULA breaches..
Vikarion Caldari White Rose Society	Posted - 2008.11.12 07:58:00 - [226] Originally by: Lucas Avignon It sounds like CCP didn't nerf them enough, turret bs's can't hit frigates, why should cruise ravens? Maybe because it's the only thing that cruise missiles are good for? Oops...were good for.
Muad' Dib Gallente Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:00:00 - [227] Originally by: Khamal Jolstien Originally by: Muad' Dib Edited by: Muad'' Dib on 12/11/2008 06:05:12 Also, CCP nerfed the solo bs, you thought you would get away mission runners ? Not all caldari are mission running carebears. Much more than mission runners are hurt from the patch. You are questioning my supposed misconceptions about all caldari being mission runners, when it says nothing in my paragraph about caldari, while you assume from the fact that we are talking about mission runners that we are talking about caldari mission runners. Your post is very badly thought, the fact that i said 'the solo bs', could mean anything from mission runner to pvp-er, but i guess this never crossed your mind. --- I smack just for myself. [orange]Your signature is too large. Please resi
Vikarion Caldari White Rose Society	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:01:00 - [228] Originally by: Muad' Dib Your post is very badly thought, the fact that i said 'the solo bs', could mean anything from mission runner to pvp-er, but i guess this never crossed your mind. Solo BS PvPers needed a nerf like low-sec needs a nerf.
Amartius ANZAC ALLIANCE	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:01:00 - [229] I did some research on explosion radius/damage with various T2 and faction Launchers. Checks it out. Data
Viper ShizzIe The Illuminati. Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:06:00 - [230] I, for one, think they should have left missiles alone after slowing everything in EVE to a snail's pace. This would have made it much easier for Caldari ships to PvP, as they already had to give up their midslots for things like tackle and EWAR, making their tanks almost useless. As for missions, a single ship should be able to run a level 4 mission in hisec nearly AFK, and there's no way that this concept should have ever been nerfed whatsoever. Having to take a long time, or god forbid use multiple ships to complete an NPC driven storyline goes against everything EVE is about. Changing missiles so they're ineffective at utterly destroying anything they're fired at is a downright slap in the face for the entire EVE community. To conclude this message, I will be canceling 12 of my accounts and demanding reimbursement from CCP for the last five years of my life they've wasted while I've trained my characters to run missions nearly risk-free while doing other, more important things.

Kerfira	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:06:00 - [231] Originally by: Vikarion Solo BS PvPers needed a nerf like low-sec needs a nerf. As some CCP guy said a long time ago (Oveur or Wrangler I think): "The battleship isn't, nor was it ever intended to be, a solo wtfpwnmobile!" If smaller ships are relevant again, EVE will be a better game. Variety is good! Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Khamal Jolstien Caldari Product Number 3	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:06:00 - [232] Originally by: Muad' Dib Originally by: Khamal Jolstien Originally by: Muad' Dib Edited by: Muad'' Dib on 12/11/2008 06:05:12 Also, CCP nerfed the solo bs, you thought you would get away mission runners ? Not all caldari are mission running carebears. Much more than mission runners are hurt from the patch. You are questioning my supposed misconceptions about all caldari being mission runners, when it says nothing in my paragraph about caldari, while you assume from the fact that we are talking about mission runners that we are talking about caldari mission runners. Your post is very badly thought, the fact that i said 'the solo bs', could mean anything from mission runner to pvp-er, but i guess this never crossed your mind. Nope not at all. Just pointing out that missiles are worthless in all aspects, not just limited to mission running. Aimed directly at your "thought you could get away" comment.
Lexx Phoebus Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:10:00 - [233] Originally by: Vikarion Originally by: Muad' Dib Your post is very badly thought, the fact that i said 'the solo bs', could mean anything from mission runner to pvp-er, but i guess this never crossed your mind. Solo BS PvPers needed a nerf like low-sec needs a nerf. solo bs pvpers need a nerf? My god you are stupid - do you have any idea how hard it is to solo and even break even these days? Especially in a BS.
Vikarion Caldari White Rose Society	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:14:00 - [234] Originally by: Lexx Phoebus Originally by: Vikarion Originally by: Muad' Dib Your post is very badly thought, the fact that i said 'the solo bs', could mean anything from mission runner to pvp-er, but i guess this never crossed your mind. Solo BS PvPers needed a nerf like low-sec needs a nerf. solo bs pvpers need a nerf? My god you are stupid - do you have any idea how hard it is to solo and even break even these days? Especially in a BS. I weep for the human race. ... It's called sarcasm. Low-sec badly needs a buff. Solo-PvP needs a buff. Neither needed a nerf.
Szent AdamKiraly Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:15:00 - [235] Originally by: Vikarion Originally by: Lexx Phoebus Originally by: Vikarion Originally by: Muad' Dib Your post is very badly thought, the fact that i said 'the solo bs', could mean anything from mission runner to pvp-er, but i guess this never crossed your mind. Solo BS PvPers needed a nerf like low-sec needs a nerf. solo bs pvpers need a nerf? My god you are stupid - do you have any idea how hard it is to solo and even break even these days? Especially in a BS. I weep for the human race. ... It's called sarcasm. Low-sec badly needs a buff. Solo-PvP needs a buff. Neither needed a nerf. Thank god for that we are in agreement, i thought you were serious lol.
Vikarion Caldari White Rose Society	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:16:00 - [236] I guess there is such a thing as being too subtle.
Thenoran Caldari Hegemony Enterprises E L I T E Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:17:00 - [237] Originally by: Cpt Branko Originally by: Taius Pax I picked up Blockade lvl 4, and I've been shooting non stop for 30 minutes and I'm barely through the first spawn. 7X CN Launchers with 3X CN BCU. What kind of bull**** is this? Enjoy your nano nerf, Caldari pigs. hugs his Ferox and Rokh Okay so maybe Caldari gunboats didn't get a buff, but atleast missiles have downsides now in missions aside from travel time ------------------------ Ship Yield Calc Improve Mining
Malcanis RuffRyders Eradication Alliance	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:18:00 - [238] Originally by: Dirtee Girl um wait there was this great quote that kept comming up what was it ....? oh yeah adapt or die right ? I seem to remember a few mission runners saying something along those lines on this forum yes...
Vikarion Caldari White Rose Society	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:20:00 - [239] Edited by: Vikarion on 12/11/2008 08:20:18 Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Dirtee Girl um wait there was this great quote that kept comming up what was it ....? oh yeah adapt or die right ? I seem to remember a few mission runners saying something along those lines on this forum yes... It's relatively easy for the mission-runners to adapt to this. The effect it is going to have on PvP and PvPing BS pilots will be pretty nasty. Oh, and I don't see Caldari PvP pilots being really happy either.
Taradis Amarr The Imperial Assassins	Posted - 2008.11.12 08:26:00 - [240] Originally by: Lochmar Fiendhiem Originally by: Bohoba hehe charicter Bohoba can be recycled in 10 hours 55 min another 70mill sp char bites the dust... training an ammar noob now thats just ****ed. so in two months when you've trained all your learning skills for your "amarr noob" you'll be able to run lvl 1 missions. Or you could train amarr cruiser 5 and medium beam/pulse laser to 5 for an amarr hac and lasers. He won't do it cuz he's too **ing stupid to go that route why not just buy another ebay'd toon. If i was in that position I would cross train cuz their's no point in losin a 70mil sp toon imo



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