Easy. Introduce Interdiction Nullifier module -> A lot more activity in majority of formerly dead systems, a lot less in entrenched ratting heavens.

ban npc corps
nerf highsec station refining rate
overhaul 0.0 industry in general
add capital strip miner for rorquals that only works on low end ore

Null space doesn't lack rewards, just access.

Wrong move. This will herd not only highseccers, but also small null and lowsec people into mega sov null NAP trains, where they will stay in entrenched safe areas, making majority of null space more deserted than ever.

Lowsec parts that actually offers reward, like FW areas, are bustling. Null space doesn't lack rewards, just access.

So my question to the masses is this: What features could be introduced to reverse the trend, and increase the number of people wanting to come to null?

Null is very time consuming in design, and does not invite anything but semi-pro players.

How can you know that null sec is boring and safe and high sec "in many case" is more dangerous and yet come to the conclusion that high sec needs yet more nerfing?

If you're refering to the original post, then I fail to see where I came to the conclusion that highsec needs nerfing. Forcing players to move by the stick and not the carrot is not the right way to go. Boost null - yes, but nerfing highsec just pisses too many people off.

Null sec is pretty rad. You poors should give it a try.

Then use both the stick and the carrot and move all level 4s no lo sec.

As low already has lvl 4's, where is the carrot in this?

I've noticed the traffic in null slowly reducing to a point where it is actually safer to be around null than highsec in many cases!

nuke hisec incursions, make it exclusive to lowsec

done, more people leave hisec, even if it's just daytrips to lowsec

L4 Missions removed from hi - stick
More L4 Mission agents added to lo - carrot

Its a zero sum transaction.

Your carrot needs work, doesn't really add anything new or more profitable. Just more of the same.

If that were the case it wouldn't be worth asking for as nothing would change.

Except now more people go to lo sec.

Which solves the problem of lo sec being depopulated.

Dunno, between the extra caution, needing to secure an area to run, losses, etc. and having this all exasperated by a higher population, unless you are already in the entrenched groups you mentioned, it sounds better to just smash 3's in highsec.

I'm fine with the hi sec slaves grinding away their lives for pennies in L3s.

I'll be in lo sec.

sorry only semi-pro players are allowed in null

So my question to the masses is this: What features could be introduced to reverse the trend, and increase the number of people wanting to come to null?

Then use both the stick and the carrot and move all level 4s no lo sec.

So your answer is to make space unentrenchable, meaning all of it becomes deserted and unused.

In Eve I am almost exclusively a small gang/solo pvper.!

ban npc corps
nerf highsec station refining rate
overhaul 0.0 industry in general
add capital strip miner for rorquals that only works on low end ore

ban npc corps
nerf highsec station refining rate
overhaul 0.0 industry in general
add capital strip miner for rorquals that only works on low end ore

And this is why florists should never be tapped to remove a tumor that is deep within the brain.

Whatever, I'm just amazed that after all this time, the-smarter-than-your-average-MMO-players still don't get it. This game will get run into the ground for a little self-gratification and sense of entitlement.

It is simple economics. Null and empire have a symbiosis, and a tension, and that is a key motor of the economy. You stop that, the economy dies, or becomes the barter/wage slavery of null, were the measure of success is a plex a month, and you get all your stuff giving to you by the indies of your alliance for zero isk.

Right now attempt to enter null-sec for a carebear seems like 100% risk to lose ships and implants. So

1) make insurance for implants - or jump clones available every 3 hours + lower cost of clones;

2) make whole ship insurable - including modules and rigs;

3) make full insurance cost much less.

Next day there will be non-stop massacre. However present nullbears won't be happy watching their POSes being desintegrated by RvB casuals.

Wrong move. This will herd not only highseccers, but also small null and lowsec people into mega sov null NAP trains, where they will stay in entrenched safe areas, making majority of null space more deserted than ever.



Lowsec parts that actually offers reward, like FW areas, are bustling. Null space doesn't lack rewards, just access.

also increase npc corp tax to like 40%

I honestly think that this is a common misconception of nullsec. It's actually quite easy for anyone to get into with the use of the map and a scout. The problem is that once you get there, you can't really do a great deal unless you have somewhere to settle (e.g. station or POS), and the perceived risk is too great compared to other areas of the game for people to even attempt to get into null.

There are already interdiction nullifiers on T3's, but that has served mainly the current inhabitants rather than encouraging a new wave of residents.

There are a few reasons that I can see for a reduction of traffic, mainly caused by a lack of migration of players into null:

- High barriers to entry for newer players/corps/alliances to move to null
- Not enough of a carrot to entice players away from highsec
- A lack of differentiated content in null vs. other areas of space.
- Current alliances entrenched in their space.
- Not enough reason for industrialists to be in null

lack of bubbles made lowsec a bustling area, right?

From a purely selfish point of view I would like to see this trend reverse and see null becoming as vibrant as it has been in days gone by so I've got stuff to shoot.

Except... we have Insurance in nullsec too, you know. So you'd kill us, and we'd reship immediately because we keep entire fleets worth of ships on contract to reship in, and we'd just meatgrinder whatever pubbie "Highsec PVPer" tried to show up to try to ruin our day.

nuke hisec incursions, make it exclusive to lowsec

done, more people leave hisec, even if it's just daytrips to lowsec

ban npc corps
nerf highsec station refining rate
overhaul 0.0 industry in general
add capital strip miner for rorquals that only works on low end ore

I have this great news for you: null sec is the apex of player generated, emergent content.

Make your player generated content less sh!tty and maybe you'll convince someone to go there.

Let's see. We can't manufacture well enough to outperform probably even almost the shittiest hisec system, in deklein, we have to move ore to a special refinery station and then move it to a second system to actually manufacture things in it. We don't have anything which really enables us to mine stuff locally quicker, so it's much easier to just compress and import, or even just buy whole ships and import. And up until the last half year or a year, hisec has been more or less 100% safety (outside of hulkageddon) for miners, and with a few minor precautions by manufacturers, 100% safety for them as well.

Gee, I wonder why industrialists prefer to stay in hisec. The reason completely eludes me.

sorry only semi-pro players are allowed in null

'Semi-pro' may be the wrong phrase to use, but null is generally not for casual players.

I've been part of a alliance with a nullsec presence and it became a real pain to log-on and play for a couple of hours. By the time all of the comms channels were up and running, the intel chat was open, and the corp chat, and the alliance chat, and then requests for intel came in every 5 seconds, then a CTA was called and we sat in a station for two hours waitng for the FC's to decide whether to undock...and then it was time to log off for the night, and I'd actually done nothing!

Won't happen. Not even if hell froze to Anctartica levels.

so you're saying that hisec incursion runners are irrationally risk averse

1) as you well know they were in for the ISK. Remove pimpmobile efficiency so ISK / hour plummets and they stop doing incursions at all. Oh wait, they already stopped doing them even in hi sec that allows those pimpmobiles, once the ISK / hour stopped being so insane. So imagine how many you'll get in low / null.

2) Incursions are to come extract empire people off their planets. Quite odd to move them away from the place where they were set up to go hit.

Because you REALLY were after industrialists only, eh?

Oh wait I have been there multiple times in multiple corps and alliances (I have a good number of accounts) and the thing all had in common was a general despise for industrialists, seen as "alt worthy, and we already have our industry and research alts and no way we'll let you use the corp POS, else you steal".

Also, 0.0 is paradise for subsidized / reimbursed PvPers, they really find their thing (in my case it was small roam, for others it's blobs, each his taste). But if you are not one of them, there's really little in for you. I mean, even the few infrastructures that could be put up, aren't. So if you are not a ship PvPer you indeed find only the hardship and little of the rewards. Only stuff I found to be as good as hi sec was trading in NPC nulll.

1) You don't need pimped out faction battleships to run incursions. CFC incursion runners did just fine (120m/hr) with Zealot/Guardian fleets.

2) Lowsec is empire space

1) I know you don't NEED pimpboats but YOU want to bring incursions out of hi sec, which as I said will not entice them to move there at all. They are not even enticed to do incursions in hi sec as is, figures outside it.

If nullsec was made much better for industry, we would be.

As for the "use the corp POS" ... you know that's a direct result of game mechanics, yes? Put a lot of resources in a public place, and allow many people access to it, someone will steal it. Now, if CCP made POSes which could be setup by individuals, for their personal use (or with the possibility of granting access to specific people (no, not through standings, an actual access list)), you'd see less of this protectionism, because it wouldn't be needed.

What sort of infrastructure are you talking about? Because we've got JBs, we've got tons of stations we've added all over the place, we've got system upgrades everywhere etc for military indexes and such.


Again, if your alliance didn't have this, then you either didn't have time to setup shop properly, the leadership sucked ass or ... well, I guess if the military and industry upgrades don't do it for you, then I guess nullsec just never will live up to your cushy standards, since you've been comforted too much by hisec.

Then put all those fresh forces you got to work. Instead of breaking the balls to hi seccers or others who don't care about the far west, break the CCP balls so that they put in a minimum of living standards. And not just for the NAPsters but for every 0.0 citizens.

Sorry, not everybody are in for the lame ass blobbers with all the comfortabilities. Smaller alliances or corps have an hard time to get all the stuff you pull out without thinking. Better to join a low sec corp and use the facilities in there than to be a blobber.

Not to worry, they've more or less stopped being run in its entirety because they weren't frothing forth ISK anymore. So much for their initial "YOU SHALL NOT NERF INCURSIONS THEY ARE SO SOCIAL WE LOVE HOW SOCIAL WE ARE WHILE MAKING ISK" defense.

Oh well so sad. vOv

Anchorable cyno jammers and interdiction nullifiers. Allow new corps to set up without being curbstomped by supercaps. This way, new corps/alliances can create chokepoints on gates that they can keep a hold of while they get permanent cyno jammers, stations etc. in place.

I have this great news for you: null sec is the apex of player generated, emergent content.

Make your player generated content less sh!tty and maybe you'll convince someone to go there.

First moongoo , make it depletable after x months so alliances need to protect their income

sure t2 ships and items will go up in price but they mostly overrated anyway and too specilzed to be very common

Sure all you nullsecdwellers will flame this idea but just you FO with your whines it is about time you lazy do no gooders learn that ittakes time and effort to keep their sandcastles intact

Forgive my ignorance of null sec and jump freighters and feel free to correct me but as I understand the current mechanics a jump freighter jumps from Null Sec to Low Sec and then gate jumps the rest of the way to a market hub to sell commodities like Technetium. My idea is based on this assumption. Again, if it is incorrect please let me know.

Why not allow a jump freighter to only jump within Null and then gate jump through several systems in Low Sec before getting to High Sec and the market hub?

It could potentially increase the population in Low Sec by giving PvP enthusiasts and pirates nice targets to shoot at. It could give Null Sec residents something to do by forcing them to put together escort fleets (likely Drakes and Logistics) for their Freighter Convoys - Small gang PvP in Low Sec - Fun for Null Sec residents.

Just theorycrafting out loud here.

0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire needs peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you.

0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire needs peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you.

Highsec is the old carebear land.

90% of o.o is blue's

Massive orca, golem blobs preclude any mission being hard.

Look how quiet highsec was until this last year or so.

That's why you hate nullsec now. Your bored,

L4 Missions removed from hi - stick
More L4 Mission agents added to lo - carrot

Its a zero sum transaction.

I don't think you understand carebears anymore than carebears understand you. All Level 5s moved to low sec. Some people ran them others just continued to do Level 4s in High Sec.

If you move Level 4s to Low Sec some people will take a chance on them but many will just do Level 3s in High Sec instead and 2 years from now you will want Level 3s moved to Low Sec.

isn't there that 'statistic' that states that there isn't enough manufacturing capability in all of nullsec to manufacture the ammo that nullsec, in general, uses?

I personally would love to see a JF nerf. In fact, jump logistics needs to get out of my EVE.

Jump drives have done more to ruin lo/nullsec industrialists than anything else.

Here's the issue with using the carrot to push hi sec carebears into lo and null.

There are already people like me who are deeply entrenched in the existing lo and null gameplay. If you plant more carrots in our garden, we are in a perfect place to eat them before you even get there.

That means we will use your buff to get even deeper entrenched and you'll have an even stronger obstacle to entering lo and null.

By the way, if you want to get into null try living in outer ring. Its all NPC space with lots of space stations you can dock at.

Null sec is pretty rad. You poors should give it a try.

You poors should provide some real reasons as to why someone should move to null, other than by your say so.

Well, I've read pretty much every post in this thread and think there's a lot of point-missing.

If you took all the alts out of hisec, you'd be left mostly with casual gamers. They're not motivated primarily by ISK/hr, although that's a part of it. Casual gamers generally don't want a hyper-competitive environment, they want a social activity, sometimes to the extent that their profession is a background while they chat with corpmates. Dicking around with the efficiency of refineries or the location of L4s is not going to change much because it' completely misunderstands people's motivations.

Again, what stops a large number of people from getting into null is that they perceive it as being full of assholes. Now, I'm sure I'm going to get a load of the usual "this isn't hellokittyonline"-type replies, but if you want more people in null, the solution really isn't rocket science.

nuke hisec incursions, make it exclusive to lowsec

done, more people leave hisec, even if it's just daytrips to lowsec

[quote=Tyberius Franklin]
Except now more people go to lo sec.

Which solves the problem of lo sec being depopulated.

Which still leaves null sec with nothing, and still does not drive people anywhere.
Stop nerfing things and look at ways to boost null sec to make it an attractive place to go.

Because nullsec has no social interaction.

Null sec is pretty rad. You poors should give it a try.

Want to make Null vibrant? Make a tutorial on corp/alliance politics that you have to take when you start. Because obviously that is what it takes to get into null. One does not simply "Go to nullsec".

The highest barrier to new nullsec corps and alliances is politics. So train them for that and more people will go.

I didn't say that. Have another read.

It's funny, currently highsec ores are passing Crokite on the isk/m3 scale. I think before long, null miners will be moving to highsec where the real money is.

the only members of a nullsec alliance who are involved in 0.0 politics are diplomats, FCs and leadership

the only members of a nullsec alliance who are involved in 0.0 politics are diplomats, FCs and leadership

And mandozers, but I don't think creating diplomatic incidents are really something any tutorial can prepare you for.

You're making partially faulty assumptions, however. Some people would love to go to null, if the rewards were worth the added work, they decide it isn't. Others are delicate flowers who get a heartattack if you mention the 7 words you can't say on TV: ****, ****, ****, ****, **********, ************, and ****.

Surprisingly, I don't really care about the delicate flowers.

that's not really true in other alliances that openly recruit: you have to have some social skills to get in and such

because you've spent two years in the starting area, for instance

Well, I guess that pretty much covers it all with how awesome POS refineries are. :P

And you fail comprehension. You've provided no reason.

How about advanced refinery skills to improve POS refineries?

Unless they provide more than 100% return, and do it quicker than instantly, they can't compete with station refineries. Station refineries don't cost isk to run, POSes do.

0.0 is the actual game

highsec is basically like staying in riverwood and chopping wood for Hod

Honest answer - I percieve null to be full of assholes. The sheer level of assholery on Eve, mainly from the direction of null, puts me off. I don't get the impression that it's a community I want to really be a part of. I know that not everyone who calls null home is an *******, and I don't doubt that there are even null corps with mostly decent people, but the general impression I get from what I see on the forums and from the alts in my (starter) corp is too negative for me to bother with.

And fail again!

See, at the end of the day it all comes down to ISK/hr with you lot.

I'm not going to try to convince you to move to 0.0 if actually playing for fun takes a backseat to your aversion to loss.

Hey, if you want to babysit a refinery POS all day every day just to be able to cope with a single hulk's output, and pay 100m/month to do so and still get less in return compared to what you'd get by going to a refinery station, selecting multiple types of ore and modules and ships and what have you, right click and press "refine", then by all means, be my guest. I'm pretty sure we'll find some system you can setup a POS in and refine away to your heart's content.

No. More general.

"Come to lo sec!" -- No, I can make more isk in hi sec.
"Come to nullsec" -- No, I can make more isk in hi sec.*
"Come to WH space" -- No, I can make more isk in hi sec.**

Every time someone suggests a challenge, you answer about isk/hr.

*which is incorrect, btw
**Once again, this is only correct if you insist on being a solo player,

That's taking the danger equation out of the mix, since what you should be saying is "can make more isk/hour in relation to danger or effort, in hisec".

(...)

So my question to the masses is this: What features could be introduced to reverse the trend, and increase the number of people wanting to come to null? (...)

You're suggesting people will only hang out where they're safe?

That would explain the current circle jerk.

So my question to the masses is this: What features could be introduced to reverse the trend, and increase the number of people wanting to come to null?

If players are abandoning null and/or chose to remain in hisec, then develop hisec and backburn nullsec.

And once again, you reduce the entire argument to isk/hr.

Your dream MMO is making huge sums of cash for no effort and no risk.

Nice strawman, since that's not what I'm saying.

I disagree.

You have yet to prove to the forum that you aren't only motivated by isk/hr.

..

We have this thing called PvP, maybe you've heard of it.

I disagree.

You have yet to prove to the forum that you aren't only motivated by isk/hr.

LOL


You know what will happen right?

Nullsec will become highsec, with a bunch of people paying concord.

Jita would die, but then a system in each null area would be picked to play the same role. Major sov holders will essentially be forced to be space police for ever, with nothing else to do.

Hence, they leave. It snowballs.

Game dies.

You stop that, the economy dies, or becomes the barter/wage slavery of null, were the measure of success is a plex a month, and you get all your stuff giving to you by the indies of your alliance for zero isk.

the problem isn't that nullsec is being 'abandoned' by anybody, it's that the broken risk/reward balance in the game has caused people to leave their PvP mains in nullsec and make isk in hisec with alts, despite their alliances holding a ton of upgraded space

the problem isn't that nullsec is being 'abandoned' by anybody, it's that the broken risk/reward balance in the game has caused people to leave their PvP mains in nullsec and make isk in hisec with alts, despite their alliances holding a ton of upgraded space

So, what you are saying, is that there is no way to make ISK in null sec?

So, what you are saying, is that there is no way to make ISK in null sec?

So, what you are saying, is that there is no way to make ISK in null sec?

Oh, no, there is. It's just a lot less effort/risk to do it in hisec.

Of course there is, but often there's a lot of ways to make more money in other areas with less effort.
Since things called "alts" exist, 0.0 players will make money with their PvE character elsewhere and fight with their PvP character in 0.0. This phenomena irritates roaming gankers to no end who then complain about how 'finding ratters and carebears in 0.0 is too hard", when in reality they just don't exist.

Of course there is, but often there's a lot of ways to make more money in other areas with less effort.
Since things called "alts" exist, 0.0 players will make money with their PvE character elsewhere and fight with their PvP character in 0.0. This phenomena irritates roaming gankers to no end who then complain about how 'finding ratters and carebears in 0.0 is too hard", when in reality they just don't exist.

I was ratting in nullsec and doing a sanctum just this morning.

I was ratting in nullsec and doing a sanctum just this morning.

So the real reason is the that hard core null sec PvPers can't break their addiction to high sec. Makes sense for their calls to nerf it.

EVE is a cutthroat game where no advantage can be left ignored. This is why obvious advantages like NPC corps and highsec manufacturing supremacy need to eliminated because they degrade the experience for everyone hth

Or we could just propose JF nerfs again and all become hermits with our own little markets.

Man, if I could find a way to get out to null somewhere in some backwater system and not have to socialize with people I'd love blasting rats in the face while basking in the beauty of a desolate, empty space....set the scene by pointing my ship towards the sun.

I wonder if I could somehow get a cloaked ratting ship and some cans out somewhere and live of of that? Bleh, how would I fit my stuff?

Man, if I could find a way to get out to null somewhere in some backwater system and not have to socialize with people I'd love blasting rats in the face while basking in the beauty of a desolate, empty space....set the scene by pointing my ship towards the sun.

I wonder if I could somehow get a cloaked ratting ship and some cans out somewhere and live of of that? Bleh, how would I fit my stuff?

So the real reason is the that hard core null sec PvPers can't break their addiction to high sec. Makes sense for their calls to nerf it.

Please CCP, kill jump logistics and fix your game overnight.

Please CCP, kill jump logistics and fix your game overnight.

before JFs people used carriers to cart stuff from empire

hint: nerfing JFs won't fix anything

Please, CCP, kill jump logistics and stop people from having massive 1000+ fights because

Please CCP, just make Alliance owned areas in null sec be just like high sec; but remove high sec. thanks!

TBH - that's my take on this.

Then Eve wouldn't be a sandbox. There is a choice to forgo any part of the sandbox if you so choose, but it's not chosen. So then people decide that it should be removed entirely because they can't garner the will to not do something. LOL!

... Where are you getting that?

Killing jump logistics includes nerfin carriers.

Then Eve wouldn't be a sandbox. There is a choice to forgo any part of the sandbox if you so choose, but it's not chosen. So then people decide that it should be removed entirely because they can't garner the will to not do something. LOL!

So the real reason is the that hard core null sec PvPers can't break their addiction to high sec. Makes sense for their calls to nerf it.

... Where are you getting that?

EVE is a cutthroat game where no advantage can be left ignored. This is why obvious advantages like NPC corps and highsec manufacturing supremacy need to eliminated because they degrade the experience for everyone hth

Let's try this again.

Most NullSec pilots don't want to nerf High Sec into oblivion. What we want are Industrialists/Miners/Ratters/etc. to be incentivized, (either through carrot, stick, or a combination of both) to come live and stay in Null Sec.

I bolded the important part there. Null Sec Empires should be NULL-SEC based Empires, with large amounts of industry, ISK generation, group activities, etc. taking place. The idea behind this is that it promotes the long talked about "farms and fields" idea, giving small and large groups a like new targets to seek out and attempt to destroy. Thus we get more pew pew!

Industrialists get more options/profit-margins in Null Sec. Win
Miners get high end ores that will likely be bought straight by their Alliance or Industrialists in the area. Win
PvP Happens

LOL, null bears finally admited they're also hs bears. Awesome.

It basically boils down to people don't feel safe enough in null sec to make their ISK.

Hi, genius.

I live in null and lo. I do not get income from hi sec.

Sounds good to me. It seems like there are some issues that are preventing this. What are those issues?

It basically boils down to people don't feel safe enough in null sec to make their ISK.

Sounds good to me. It seems like there are some issues that are preventing this. What are those issues?

Can't find targets? Reset some blues.
No one wants to move to null to be your punching bag? Reset some blues.
Tired of traveling seven regions to find targets? Reset some blues.

Reset some blues.

0.0 dont have anything special to fight for, its a PVE festival. In my opinion CCP need to make some "resources" (moongoo, whatever) "random", and once they deplete (2/3 months) they should spawn in other systems, that way, the alliances will have more reasons to fight for space.

In the current state i dont see why we should lose time with 0.0 warfare.

....but to actually create an empire in nullsec, you kind of has to be infested with bears.

0.0 dont have anything special to fight for, its a PVE festival. In my opinion CCP need to make some "resources" (moongoo, whatever) "random", and once they deplete (2/3 months) they should spawn in other systems, that way, the alliances will have more reasons to fight for space.

In the current state i dont see why we should lose time with 0.0 warfare.

Sure but then stop trying to nerf hs so badly. Keep your null bears in nullsec, along with their greedy alts and leave our hs/us carebears alone.

Can't find targets? Reset some blues.
No one wants to move to null to be your punching bag? Reset some blues.
Tired of traveling seven regions to find targets? Reset some blues.

Reset some blues.

THEY WON'T COME BECAUSE NULL SEC INDUSTRY IS A JOKE, CAN WE MAKE THIS ANY MORE CLEAR.

Sure but then stop trying to nerf hs so badly. Keep your null bears in nullsec, along with their greedy alts and leave our hs/us carebears alone.

they've been mentioned ad nauseum but here goes:

lack of factory slots
lack of refinery/factories
lack of a source of lowends
lack of viable compression
lack of increased profitability for building in nullsec to counteract the disadvantages of it
lack of any ability to do serious t2 manufacturing since moongoo is regional and you must go to jita to get everything you need ergo just do it next to jita

etc etc etc

take it from marlona sky people, he has experience in successful 0.0 alliances like Atlas

Sure but then stop trying to nerf hs so badly. Keep your null bears in nullsec, along with their greedy alts and leave our hs/us carebears alone.

they've been mentioned ad nauseum but here goes:

lack of factory slots
lack of refinery/factories
lack of a source of lowends
lack of viable compression
lack of increased profitability for building in nullsec to counteract the disadvantages of it
lack of any ability to do serious t2 manufacturing since moongoo is regional and you must go to jita to get everything you need ergo just do it next to jita

etc etc etc

Excellent! These are ideas I can support!
I also figured they've been mentioned before, I'm just not really sure why we continue to have these threads.

Can't find targets? Reset some blues.
No one wants to move to null to be your punching bag? Reset some blues.
Tired of traveling seven regions to find targets? Reset some blues.

Reset some blues.

Wrong move. This will herd not only highseccers, but also small null and lowsec people into mega sov null NAP trains, where they will stay in entrenched safe areas, making majority of null space more deserted than ever.



Lowsec parts that actually offers reward, like FW areas, are bustling. Null space doesn't lack rewards, just access.

please don't weigh in on 0.0 incentives for fighting when you live in empire

Dont take conclusions when EVE is a game of multiple accounts :) Anyhow, please elaborate instead of making empty arguments. Fact, 0.0 has never been so stationary like last year. It's dead.

Fact, 0.0 has never been so stationary like last year. It's dead.

THEY WON'T COME BECAUSE NULL SEC INDUSTRY IS A JOKE, CAN WE MAKE THIS ANY MORE CLEAR.

Dont take conclusions when EVE is a game of multiple accounts :) Anyhow, please elaborate instead of making empty arguments. Fact, 0.0 has never been so stationary like last year. It's dead.

This. 1000 times this.

Nullsec Corps and Alliances have severe difficulty getting any meaningful Industry going. Allow Nullsec Alliances to build more than one station in a system, and all those systems to provide the facilities they do now, just better.

Fact, 0.0 has never been so stationary like last year. It's dead.

I know but that is your nullsec problem, we carebears just DON'T CARE. Move your nullbears through hs all you want but stop trying to change things in other PEOPLE'S BACKYARD.

Wow! I didn't realize that you could only build one station in a system!
I can understand the facilities may not be as up to par as high sec, at least initially, but I would think it should be possible to build/upgrade them to have them on par, if not better than high sec.

This seems like a big problem. Any reason for this type of limitation?

I can't tell if you're trolling or not, but if you aren't by god Jim, and I think he's got it! Welcome to the points we're trying to make!

Wow! I didn't realize that you could only build one station in a system!
I can understand the facilities may not be as up to par as high sec, at least initially, but I would think it should be possible to build/upgrade them to have them on par, if not better than high sec.

This seems like a big problem. Any reason for this type of limitation?

I know but that is your nullsec problem, we carebears just DON'T CARE. Move your nullbears through hs all you want but stop trying to change things in other PEOPLE'S BACKYARD.

/facepalm, and here I thought we were making progress with the whole "even if we bring Null-Bears to Null Sec right now there's no point"

oh I forgot to mention you can't mission-run in conquerable nullsec in my list of disadvantages before.