wow... this discussion is becoming very very pointless. you just want an easy time ratting in 0.0, without fear and risk. Maybe you want a handy readout of the neut in local of his weaponsystems too, and maybe the fleetcomp of the to-be-hotdropped enemy fleet? sheesh.

That would affect active cloaking! I want to target just the inactive cloakers. An active cloaker ought to be able to keep active and watch for prey to do somthing stupid and hotdrop on them. Being active at the computer ought to be rewarded with good kills not nerfed to hell and back to fix AFK cloaking.

My solution removes the incentive to be away from the keyboard while cloaked. That is what I am targeting with my suggestion.

But this affects active cloakers greatly in wormholes! You screw things up like this with your "massive cloak nerf bat". The problem regarding this auto-decloak in holes is that you take away the ambush. You can connect to a static, scan down the sites that need scanning, warp to one cloaked and simply wait. (Yes, you learn patience in the hole.) You may have to wait hours for the ambush to spring, it may never happen. However, being forced to warp all over the place while you're trying to wait is simply foolish and a poorly thought out response to a non-issue. Keep in mind, in a hole you may choose to afk at the ambush point for those hours, flipping over to an alt for example and doing other activities while you wait. You may want to take a bio, get some lunch, run to the store, then come back and see if the prey is in the trap. It could be hours, it could be minutes, it could be never. But, the fact remains that you're ill-though concept would destroy a perfectly viable and acceptible paradigm of wormhole existance, nerfing the inherent dangers in the systems.

Won't be of equal use. At least not everywhere.

CCP has hinted that they want to replace local with something similar only for sov upgraded systems so that the defenders have an advantage. Everywhere else is fair game.

No I just want local to stay as it is

and to be able to decloak those who are cloaked in system and away from their keyboards.

I am just targeting AFK cloaking with my suggestion.

So can we focus on the topic please?

No need to warp all over the place. Should a method like the one I suggested be implemented (probes to detect cloakies) you would simply have to be on your feet about as much, or less (depending on actual numbers for how long these probes would take to scan down a cloaky using these new probes) than another person in wormhole space.

Simply put, a cloaky sitting in a WH would have to hit dscan periodically to see if "cloaky detection space probes (tm)" show up on it. If they show up, then you know they're looking for cloakies and you can warp away "all over the place". There's absolutely no reason a cloaky should be able to sit in a hole without any risk like any other ships in there, to ask to keep such a mechanic is carebearish because it implies you are unwilling to put yourself at risk in order to get your kills.

Make them have to fit an expanded launcher to use these probes for all I care, or even make them use some new launcher that gimps people to oblivion. Doesn't matter to me, so long as people have the ability to kill off people sitting AFK in systems. If you're at your keyboard actively seeking prey, excellent, I want you to stay undetectable, but if you're off to the store, watching videos online, or otherwise not actively engaged in-game, I want the option to find you and kill you.

Ya I highly doubt that will happen. I and many others have stated that nerfing local = leaving the game. So can we focus on the topic please?

No need to warp all over the place. Should a method like the one I suggested be implemented (probes to detect cloakies) you would simply have to be on your feet about as much, or less (depending on actual numbers for how long these probes would take to scan down a cloaky using these new probes) than another person in wormhole space.

Simply put, a cloaky sitting in a WH would have to hit dscan periodically to see if "cloaky detection space probes (tm)" show up on it. If they show up, then you know they're looking for cloakies and you can warp away "all over the place". There's absolutely no reason a cloaky should be able to sit in a hole without any risk like any other ships in there, to ask to keep such a mechanic is carebearish because it implies you are unwilling to put yourself at risk in order to get your kills.

Make them have to fit an expanded launcher to use these probes for all I care, or even make them use some new launcher that gimps people to oblivion. Doesn't matter to me, so long as people have the ability to kill off people sitting AFK in systems. If you're at your keyboard actively seeking prey, excellent, I want you to stay undetectable, but if you're off to the store, watching videos online, or otherwise not actively engaged in-game, I want the option to find you and kill you.

Ya I highly doubt that will happen. I and many others have stated that nerfing local = leaving the game. So can we focus on the topic please?

Same kind of people said they would leave the game if CCP even thought about nerfing supers. They are still here.

If you really mean it, then leave. They are going forward with it.

CCP is listening to its customers now. If they had ever even thought of it. They will listen now and not go forward with it just to give you free ganks. If somehow they did tho I will take no action until it is on an official feature list or confirmed for TQ. I don't insta quit on rumors.

And hopefully they will listen to this and fix AFK cloaking without swinging the nerf bat like crazy. My idea (Or some variation) will do this.

Wow, lost my response. Here we go again... I can appreciate the thought you put into this concept, however it would greatly detract from wormhole life. Even simply being able to detect the presence of cloaked ships is a huge nerf on the whole wormhole culture and the danger inherent in the system. A big part of planning a system assault often revolves around having an unknown cloaked vessel in a target hole for days or weeks on end actively gathering intel. You may be logged on for hours sitting idly by watching a pos to determine hours of operation, active people in the hole, etc. The secrecy is key. Allowing your presence to be advertised via probe would also shift the whole paradigm such that it would become a near requirement for someone to keep these probes out constantly while any ops are going on, possibly even when they're not. This massive nerf (and it is massive, if you have any clue at all about wormhole life) is grossly unnecessary, unneeded and unwelcome.

Wormholes are the last frontiers of Eve. Anything that nerfs that needs to be fought tooth and nail.

You simply refuse to acknowledge how significant of a nerf your idea is outside of your own little paradigm. At least my method balances cloaks, removes the surprise hotdrop you never saw coming and prevents "afk cloakers" from ever being an issue again, while addressing the free, unearned intel while cloaked thing by making cloaked vessels have to actively gather intel.

Your idea is nothing but a nerf. Nothing in enhanced. Only you (and rat-bots) benefit, not Eve as a whole, and many others feel the pain so you can live a little safer in the place that, by definition, you're not supposed to live a little safer.

If you are active and watching said stuff that's fine but inactive means able to be found. That is the reason behind the suggestion. The entire POINT is to deny the ability to AFK to watch said activities.

If you don't want a probe to be able to "See" you how about this. The longer you stay on grid the more presence you build up. After a random amount the probe will be able to see you (And resulting in a decloak after some time later) If you keep moving I can see why it isnt needed for a probe to say there is a cloak in system. In nullsec local will provide that info anyway.

If you are active and watching said stuff that's fine but inactive means able to be found. That is the reason behind the suggestion. The entire POINT is to deny the ability to AFK to watch said activities.

If you don't want a probe to be able to "See" you how about this. The longer you stay on grid the more presence you build up. After a random amount the probe will be able to see you (And resulting in a decloak after some time later) If you keep moving I can see why it isnt needed for a probe to say there is a cloak in system. In nullsec local will provide that info anyway.

Why should I need to remain active? I do after all pay for my account, it's mine to play as I wish.

You've yet to give a valid reason as to why this is an issue. Not only that, but you want more power on top of the already overpowered local intel tool and that is not a balanced approach.

I never said my idea isn't a nerf. It is only a targeted nerf towards those who are Afking while cloaked which people are admitting they are doing even in wormhole (Removing the idea that removing local = removing AFK cloaking) If you are active I want to keep your activties the same as today as possible but the minute you walk away and don't log off I want the penalty to get worse resulting in your location decloaked and destroyed.

How about no? Being long on the grid is a requirement of gathering good intel. You can sit there for hours, undetected, for days on end gathering what you need for a successful op. This isn't an exaggeration... we have someone this dedicated to making successful ops a reality.

Your idea unnecessarily nerfs wormholes. This is a flat out fact. There's neither need nor reason for this.

Same thing was said when CCP nerfed the hisec free ganks with the Concord buffs. Just because you pay for an account does not mean you deserve to be able to AFK cloak in a hostile system.

It doesn't just target the AFK, it also affects active players and you still keep your all powerful seeing eye. Not a balanced approach.

Also, you still fail to understand the reasons for AFK cloaking in null. Until you've grasped that simple concept, you're just blowing hot air.

But he does deserve the ability to be passively cloaked in system, for hours on end if he so chooses. Intel gathering may require this.

Active players wont be decloaked without warning with my plan. They have time to go to safespot and come back generating a new random point to be uncloaked. It doesn't seriously affect them. It just removes the incentive to go AFK.

But it affects them all the same and you still have your all seeing eye. Not balanced.

I have every right to go AFK, just because you rely on local and misread it's instant intel is not my fault., it's yours.

Well if you don't want it then ill go back to suggesting it will show the random spot at any time. I tried to adapt the plan.

If your friend was that dedicated he wont have an issue being at his computer for the days it is needed for an OP. Otherwise sorry but if your plan requires being able to AFK for hours days whenever it needs to be changed as much as the Hisec ganks did before CONCORD was buffed.

Just because you are in WH doesn't change the fact that it is AFK cloaking. Being able to cloak free AFK in a hostile nullsec system is also claimed as needed to set up various ops such as instapwn hotdrops. Nothing is different there.

It is time to fix this issue. My idea is the best but ill support many methods to remove any incentive to walk away from the computer while cloaked.