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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 1 post(s) |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 00:46:00 -
[31] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Rhinanna wrote:Well done, you managed to prove there are two fail SB pilots.... thats all.
Either that or they disconnected/lagged out. (since deliberatly forcing them to lag out is an exploit this isn't a valid tactic)
You have successfully proved nothing.... zero, zip, nada.
Either come back with something constructive or please just leave. You've made yourself look bad enough for one day ;) I dont get bottled up by afk cloakers while you do. Who is doing badly here? lol. They were NOT AFK cloakers. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Rhinanna
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2011.10.12 00:48:00 -
[32] - Quote
Who said I do? I'm normally the one doing the AFK cloaking thanks. I also don't really participate in activities where AFK cloaking is going to affect me. I have many other ways to generate ISK.
For a Goon, they probably aren't that much of a problem either since if they aren't dumb, you can just move to another system. Try thinking of someone OTHER than yourself for a change.
Now what about alliances that only have 2-3 systems? One player can place massive threat on all their systems in one go.... For virtually no effort or risk, vs a massive amount of effort to TRY to find and destroy/bait them or guarding all your ratters to try and defend against them.
Please try showing how that is in ANY WAY balanced. Quite simply it isn't.
Even with the ideas suggested for the de-cloak pulse every hour, a AFK cloaker can still lock down a system for a while for the cheap cheap price of 35mil (one SB), while the victim alliance is likely to have lost 100mil + in income they didn't get during the same period.
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baltec1
88
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Posted - 2011.10.12 00:49:00 -
[33] - Quote
The Apostle wrote: lol. They were NOT AFK cloakers.
They were for the 5 hours before they attacked me.
Rhinanna wrote:Who said I do? I'm normally the one doing the AFK cloaking thanks. I also don't really participate in activities where AFK cloaking is going to affect me. I have many other ways to generate ISK.
For a Goon, they probably aren't that much of a problem either since if they aren't dumb, you can just move to another system. Try thinking of someone OTHER than yourself for a change.
Now what about alliances that only have 2-3 systems? One player can place massive threat on all their systems in one go.... For virtually no effort or risk, vs a massive amount of effort to TRY to find and destroy/bait them or guarding all your ratters to try and defend against them.
Please try showing how that is in ANY WAY balanced. Quite simply it isn't.
Even with the ideas suggested for the de-cloak pulse every hour, a AFK cloaker can still lock down a system for a while for the cheap cheap price of 35mil (one SB), while the victim alliance is likely to have lost 100mil + in income they didn't get during the same period.
As opposed to the instant intel the ratter has to put no effort into meaning most of the time they are 100% safe from attack.
As for that little alliance, I was in one of those for many years before joining goons and we had no problem keeping our space secure and the isk flowing. |
Imaginary Girlfriend
Exploit Inc.
0
|
Posted - 2011.10.12 00:52:00 -
[34] - Quote
Sniped117 wrote:in the best interest of my alliance im posting on an alt.
READ: AFK Cloakers shut down our bots
Get some PVP ships and go to their space. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 00:54:00 -
[35] - Quote
Rhinanna wrote:Who said I do? I'm normally the one doing the AFK cloaking thanks. I also don't really participate in activities where AFK cloaking is going to affect me. I have many other ways to generate ISK.
For a Goon, they probably aren't that much of a problem either since if they aren't dumb, you can just move to another system. Try thinking of someone OTHER than yourself for a change.
Now what about alliances that only have 2-3 systems? One player can place massive threat on all their systems in one go.... For virtually no effort or risk, vs a massive amount of effort to TRY to find and destroy/bait them or guarding all your ratters to try and defend against them.
Please try showing how that is in ANY WAY balanced. Quite simply it isn't.
Even with the ideas suggested for the de-cloak pulse every hour, a AFK cloaker can still lock down a system for a while for the cheap cheap price of 35mil (one SB), while the victim alliance is likely to have lost 100mil + in income they didn't get during the same period.
The AFK cloaky alt issue has been an issue for quite some time, as was pointed out, but it has become much more pronounced since the sanctum nerfs.
It REDUCED the benefits of being in 0.0 by a big margin imho and quite possibly drove many out.
It will remain that way until the AFK cloaky issue has been resolved - for better or worse. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:00:00 -
[36] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:The Apostle wrote:baltec1 wrote:Rhinanna wrote:Well done, you managed to prove there are two fail SB pilots.... thats all.
Either that or they disconnected/lagged out. (since deliberatly forcing them to lag out is an exploit this isn't a valid tactic)
You have successfully proved nothing.... zero, zip, nada.
Either come back with something constructive or please just leave. You've made yourself look bad enough for one day ;) I dont get bottled up by afk cloakers while you do. Who is doing badly here? lol. They were NOT AFK cloakers. They were for the 5 hours before they attacked me. May be. But for you to catch 2 SB's in a Raven suggests they had nfi what they were doing.
I do agree though that once they are NOT AFK, you've got a chance. One of my most memorable kills was getting a Rapier to agress on a scramming blockade runner - it was a cheap kill but funny as hell
And herein is the OP's point - it's the AFK cloaking that's the issue, not the cloaking..... Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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baltec1
88
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:04:00 -
[37] - Quote
The Apostle wrote: May be. But for you to catch 2 SB's in a Raven suggests they had nfi what they were doing.
I do agree though that once they are NOT AFK, you've got a chance. One of my most memorable kills was getting a Rapier to agress on a scramming blockade runner - it was a cheap kill but funny as hell
And herein is the OP's point - it's the AFK cloaking that's the issue, not the cloaking.....
How is it an issue when people are making their isk while the afk cloaker just sits there and does nothing?
It is only the falt of the bears if they fail to organise themselves and just cower in station. |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
116
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:06:00 -
[38] - Quote
If you're talking about me i don't hot drop people. I just sit still, cloaked, in yar sanctums preventing them from despawning.
Works the same way. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
rootimus maximus
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:12:00 -
[39] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:14:00 -
[40] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:The Apostle wrote: May be. But for you to catch 2 SB's in a Raven suggests they had nfi what they were doing.
I do agree though that once they are NOT AFK, you've got a chance. One of my most memorable kills was getting a Rapier to agress on a scramming blockade runner - it was a cheap kill but funny as hell
And herein is the OP's point - it's the AFK cloaking that's the issue, not the cloaking.....
How is it an issue when people are making their isk while the afk cloaker just sits there and does nothing? It is only the falt of the bears if they fail to organise themselves and just cower in station. You're kidding right?
So if you were ratting in a PvE Tengu worth 100's of millions or a fleet of Hulks worth 100's of millions you'd be happy to accept the threat of a hotdrop at ANY tme?
You have absolutely no idea when - or if in all fairness - a drop could occur. You could put a 100 escorts in system and have every ratter/miner on watch list. By the time cyno is lit, drop made and bombs launched the escorts are only half way through warp to the screaming victim. And that's IF you're on the ball ready for it.
AFK cloakies kill systems. They know that - it's why it's done. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:19:00 -
[41] - Quote
rootimus maximus wrote:The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. Is this some kind of psychology exam question?
If you mean the problem goes away because you dock/safe up, then yes. That's EXACTLY what the OP is suggesting.
The issue is that an AFK cloaky doesn't even have to be armed - just there.
He is in fact the most effective 30 day alt in game for 0.0 without even having to ever decloak. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Soldarius
Peek-A-Boo Bombers
11
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:23:00 -
[42] - Quote
I have been afk cloaked. And I have done afk cloaking. I also run around in w-space.
Remove local. w-space is perfectly viable without instant intel on who's there. Honestly, spamming d-scan every few seconds is impractical. The odds of you catching a covert cloaker on dscan are pretty small. You might see probes if they aren't very experienced. The good ones will have all your sites already bookmarked.
Don't fly what you can't afford to replace. In nul or w-space I suggest to modify that to say don't fly what you can't easily replace. If losing a T1 BC is too much for you, you may want to go back to hisec missioning for a while and build up a war chest.
You will lose ships. That is a part of life in nul. Plan for it and mitigate the risks. "How do you kill that which has no life?" |
Rhinanna
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
6
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:30:00 -
[43] - Quote
Soldarius - Which would be fine if income from null-sec ratting was five to six times greater than empire, otherwise everyone just leaves null-sec to mission in empire because taking losses into account, its more profitable. Hence the problem.......
And I'd rather see a fix to the AFK cloaker's risk to reward ratio than boosting null-sec to that degree where it will just be exploited by bots. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:40:00 -
[44] - Quote
Soldarius wrote:I have been afk cloaked. And I have done afk cloaking. I also run around in w-space.
Remove local. w-space is perfectly viable without instant intel on who's there. Honestly, spamming d-scan every few seconds is impractical. The odds of you catching a covert cloaker on dscan are pretty small. You might see probes if they aren't very experienced. The good ones will have all your sites already bookmarked.
Don't fly what you can't afford to replace. In nul or w-space I suggest to modify that to say don't fly what you can't easily replace. If losing a T1 BC is too much for you, you may want to go back to hisec missioning for a while and build up a war chest.
You will lose ships. That is a part of life in nul. Plan for it and mitigate the risks. It's ironic when people defend a "no-consequence tactic" by stating "Eve has consequences".
And people wonder why so many are leaving 0.0. I know I did because there was and remains NO counter. Used to rat in a -0.9 system a lot. Made some good coin, bought some ships and jumped into CTA's and small gangs at every opportunity.
Sanctum nerf happened, AFK cloakies moved in and my income disappeared. Got to the point where I couldn't afford to lose ships anymore so stopped roaming. Couldn't rat, couldn't mine, couldn't roam. So I left.
And pray tell, removing local fixes it? How? Ignorance is bliss?
Even less people would bother with 0.0 if that were ever to be implemented. Yes, fights might improve but less people would bother being there if the income was as good as removed.
All other sources of income (moons etc.) is owned by the alliances..... What's left?
We need to promote 0.0 as a place to make money and fight for the right to do so - and it's not done by allowing silly little cloaky games and scaring everyone off. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Kitty McKitty
In Praise Of Shadows
354
|
Posted - 2011.10.12 01:42:00 -
[45] - Quote
Problem: Me and my buddies are unwilling to defend our operations in lawless space because it impedes on our profit margins.
Solution: Nerf some other doods. GÖÑ Haviing your portrait painted here helps INTAKI Disabled Children GÖÑ |
Seatox
Department of Defence Important Internet Spaceship League
0
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:46:00 -
[46] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:rootimus maximus wrote:The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. Is this some kind of psychology exam question? If you mean the problem goes away because you dock/safe up, then yes. That's EXACTLY what the OP is suggesting. The issue is that an AFK cloaky doesn't even have to be armed - just there. He is in fact the most effective 30 day alt in game for 0.0 without even having to ever decloak.
Where are you getting that 30 day figure from? Training plan for a fresh alt, please. I can't see how you could make a 30 day covops alt that's actually a threat in that time. Enough skills to sit in local under a regular cloak, maybe, but that's harmless. To actually stalk someone and light a cyno? You need cloaking IV, racial frigate V, covops I, CFT I (CFT V for covert cynos...) |
Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
117
|
Posted - 2011.10.12 01:54:00 -
[47] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:rootimus maximus wrote:The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. Is this some kind of psychology exam question? If you mean the problem goes away because you dock/safe up, then yes. That's EXACTLY what the OP is suggesting. The issue is that an AFK cloaky doesn't even have to be armed - just there. He is in fact the most effective 30 day alt in game for 0.0 without even having to ever decloak.
When you scare 3 moms and 4 carriers enough for them to hug pos 23.5/7 with nothing but a cloaky, weaponless buzzard...
Thats effectiveness.. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
Rhinanna
Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic
6
|
Posted - 2011.10.12 01:55:00 -
[48] - Quote
Kitty McKitty wrote:Problem: Me and my buddies are unwilling to defend our operations in lawless space because it impedes on our profit margins.
Solution: Nerf some other doods.
Way to misquote! Well done for trying to build a strawman.
The problem isn't that it makes it less profitable or hits profit margins, the problem is that it makes null LESS profitable than hi-sec. Do you really think that is right?
The secondary problem is that it gives a very cheap and risk-free way of seriously fecking up your enemy's economics. This heavily breaks the risk vs reward that EvE is based around. More risk = More reward, except in the case of AFK cloaking.
Now please try addressing the real problems and see if you can come up with an actual answer.
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Renan Ruivo
Hipernova Vera Cruz Alliance
117
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:56:00 -
[49] - Quote
Seatox wrote:The Apostle wrote:rootimus maximus wrote:The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. Is this some kind of psychology exam question? If you mean the problem goes away because you dock/safe up, then yes. That's EXACTLY what the OP is suggesting. The issue is that an AFK cloaky doesn't even have to be armed - just there. He is in fact the most effective 30 day alt in game for 0.0 without even having to ever decloak. Where are you getting that 30 day figure from? Training plan for a fresh alt, please. I can't see how you could make a 30 day covops alt that's actually a threat in that time. Enough skills to sit in local under a regular cloak, maybe, but that's harmless. To actually stalk someone and light a cyno? You need cloaking IV, racial frigate V, covops I, CFT I (CFT V for covert cynos...)
If youre worried about killing people youre shortsighted. A cloaked noobship can halt a system no matter how brave or reckless the pilots there are. Just sit in the sanctums and prevent them from despawning. Then go to sleep or to work.
I don't agree with that mechanic.. but man i use the hell out of it. Sometimes the only difference between a budding genius and a blooming idiot is where they chose to take a stand. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 01:58:00 -
[50] - Quote
Seatox wrote:The Apostle wrote:rootimus maximus wrote:The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. Is this some kind of psychology exam question? If you mean the problem goes away because you dock/safe up, then yes. That's EXACTLY what the OP is suggesting. The issue is that an AFK cloaky doesn't even have to be armed - just there. He is in fact the most effective 30 day alt in game for 0.0 without even having to ever decloak. Where are you getting that 30 day figure from? Training plan for a fresh alt, please. I can't see how you could make a 30 day covops alt that's actually a threat in that time. Enough skills to sit in local under a regular cloak, maybe, but that's harmless. To actually stalk someone and light a cyno? You need cloaking IV, racial frigate V, covops I, CFT I (CFT V for covert cynos...) You can AFK cloak in a system with covert ops and covert cloak in 26 days. (with +3's) An ordinary cyno on a covert ops is approx. 31 days (with +3's)
Agreed, fitting a covert cyno is a further 30 days but you only need that on jammed systems.
But yes, a covert ops cloaky can warp cloaked within 5k of you and drop a std. cyno at approx. 30 days. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Russell Casey
One Ton the dragons of eve
23
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:12:00 -
[51] - Quote
Funny how we got all these big suggestions for Starcraft-style cloaking mechanics like energy usage and cloakie detectors, but nobody ever suggests a simple timer to log out AFK people after a couple of hours of complete inactivity. Oh wait, I forgot that people do their PvE AFK also, sorry.
Seriously, as boring as mining, missions, ratting and trade are, you have to make some sort of keystroke every two hours, don't you? |
Seatox
Department of Defence Important Internet Spaceship League
0
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:14:00 -
[52] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:Seatox wrote:The Apostle wrote:rootimus maximus wrote:The Apostle wrote:Here's the thing, you don't KNOW if he's AFK so you ALWAYS need to assume he is not
If you act like that, your fabricated "problem" goes away. Is this some kind of psychology exam question? If you mean the problem goes away because you dock/safe up, then yes. That's EXACTLY what the OP is suggesting. The issue is that an AFK cloaky doesn't even have to be armed - just there. He is in fact the most effective 30 day alt in game for 0.0 without even having to ever decloak. Where are you getting that 30 day figure from? Training plan for a fresh alt, please. I can't see how you could make a 30 day covops alt that's actually a threat in that time. Enough skills to sit in local under a regular cloak, maybe, but that's harmless. To actually stalk someone and light a cyno? You need cloaking IV, racial frigate V, covops I, CFT I (CFT V for covert cynos...) You can AFK cloak in a system with covert ops and covert cloak in 26 days. (with +3's) An ordinary cyno on a covert ops is approx. 31 days (with +3's) Agreed, fitting a covert cyno is a further 30 days but you only need that on jammed systems. But yes, a covert ops cloaky can warp cloaked within 5k of you and drop a std. cyno at approx. 30 days.
Then, it seems to me, the problem is with cynos and hotdropping, and not cloaking. The most immediate counter-strategy that comes to my mind is to fit a cyno to the bait ratting ship and bridge in a fleet to counter the dropped gank fleet. Then they drop another fleet through a cyno, etc etc. Then the node crashes. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:17:00 -
[53] - Quote
I've always liked the idea that system timers on cloaks would be a good option.
Benefits to system residents:- 1) AFK cloakies are decloaked if they do not jump out and back in after x minutes have elapsed. 2) Non AFK cloakies have to locate and drop in under x minutes or warp out and back in to be able to recloak. Defensively this means there is a chance (a small one) that you can catch them at a gate.
Benefits to cloakies:- 1) Ratters etc. that warp to a safe and cloak up ALSO lose their effectiveness and can be scanned down. 2) Ratters that try to run to station/POS because of the option above can be bubbled enroute.
It would improve PvP options and leave ratting dangerous enough - without it being impossible.
I'd go back to 0.0 just for that. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
50
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:21:00 -
[54] - Quote
Rhinanna wrote:Please don't be dumb Nova,
Local can't be removed till a completely new scanner system is implemented that would give players some warning of other ships nearby without requiring the player to scan to spam a button every 3 seconds or less.
AFK cloakers do need removing, as you can't tell if they are AFK or not..... If they are AFK, fine they are no threat.... if they aren't AFK then they could be sitting 10km away with their finger on point/cyno buttons. Its impossible for a player to know which is which! Often because they are both depending on which particular moment you are talking about.
A module doing a de-cloak burst every 20-30 minutes (deliberatly random, help stops scripts from countering it) would do wonders here without stopping the true purpose of cloaks, bypassing gate camps and harassment.
And you think a scanner tool is going to save you from a cyno drop from hell? |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:21:00 -
[55] - Quote
Seatox wrote: Then, it seems to me, the problem is with cynos and hotdropping, and not cloaking. The most immediate counter-strategy that comes to my mind is to fit a cyno to the bait ratting ship and bridge in a fleet to counter the dropped gank fleet. Then they drop another fleet through a cyno, etc etc. Then the node crashes.
Close. It's the fact they CAN cyno in that's dangerous, not the fact they do. They don't have to.
I can shut down a whole system using a Prowler or a 100k frigate if I wanted to - as long as I am not seen coming into system Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Akirei Scytale
Test Alliance Please Ignore
113
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:24:00 -
[56] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:Seatox wrote: Then, it seems to me, the problem is with cynos and hotdropping, and not cloaking. The most immediate counter-strategy that comes to my mind is to fit a cyno to the bait ratting ship and bridge in a fleet to counter the dropped gank fleet. Then they drop another fleet through a cyno, etc etc. Then the node crashes.
Close. It's the fact they CAN cyno in that's dangerous, not the fact they do. They don't have to. I can shut down a whole system using a Prowler or a 100k frigate if I wanted to - as long as I am not seen coming into system
Or anywhere in nullsec where friendlies lie. Most juicy systems for afk cloaking are down long, long pipes, where you only need to be seen once for everyone to know what you're flying. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:24:00 -
[57] - Quote
Nova Fox wrote:Rhinanna wrote:Please don't be dumb Nova,
Local can't be removed till a completely new scanner system is implemented that would give players some warning of other ships nearby without requiring the player to scan to spam a button every 3 seconds or less.
AFK cloakers do need removing, as you can't tell if they are AFK or not..... If they are AFK, fine they are no threat.... if they aren't AFK then they could be sitting 10km away with their finger on point/cyno buttons. Its impossible for a player to know which is which! Often because they are both depending on which particular moment you are talking about.
A module doing a de-cloak burst every 20-30 minutes (deliberatly random, help stops scripts from countering it) would do wonders here without stopping the true purpose of cloaks, bypassing gate camps and harassment. And you think a scanner tool is going to save you from a cyno drop from hell? No, you're right. But we will know if he is actually there and not in bed fast asleep.
If he's actively pursuing targets then you have only yourself to blame. Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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Lyris Nairn
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
1245
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Posted - 2011.10.12 02:25:00 -
[58] - Quote
The proposition of a solution implies a problem. There exists no problem with AFK cloakers. AFK cloakers by definition are AFK and cannot hurt you. |
Ladie Harlot
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
460
|
Posted - 2011.10.12 02:26:00 -
[59] - Quote
The Apostle wrote:And people wonder why so many are leaving 0.0. I know I did because there was and remains NO counter. I still think you're Riverini but if you aren't then admitting that you got run out of nullsec by people who are afk is p funny. The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet. |
The Apostle
The Black Priests
246
|
Posted - 2011.10.12 02:26:00 -
[60] - Quote
Akirei Scytale wrote:The Apostle wrote:Seatox wrote: Then, it seems to me, the problem is with cynos and hotdropping, and not cloaking. The most immediate counter-strategy that comes to my mind is to fit a cyno to the bait ratting ship and bridge in a fleet to counter the dropped gank fleet. Then they drop another fleet through a cyno, etc etc. Then the node crashes.
Close. It's the fact they CAN cyno in that's dangerous, not the fact they do. They don't have to. I can shut down a whole system using a Prowler or a 100k frigate if I wanted to - as long as I am not seen coming into system Or anywhere in nullsec where friendlies lie. Most juicy systems for afk cloaking are down long, long pipes, where you only need to be seen once for everyone to know what you're flying. This is very, very true. Which is why it is actually done using Recons and not Prowlers
The word "rapier" puts more fear in me than "20 reds 5 jumps out"..... Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo!
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