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Sticky:[Oceanus] Cyno Exclusion Zone around starbases

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CCP Fozzie C C P C C P Alliance 11233	Posted - 2014.09.17 22:33:00 - [1] - Quote Hello everyone. In our upcoming Oceanus release we are planning to make a change to the rules surrounding the way Cynos and Starbases interact. These new rules will help mitigate the issues surrounding jumping capitals sometimes colliding with ships inside a starbase forcefield. Currently you can light cynosural beacons as long as you are outside the forcefield. After this change, cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the forcefield edge. If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno). At the same time we will also be increasing the minimum distance that Jump Bridges and Cyno Generator Arrays may be anchored from the forcefield to 25km. The maximum distance away from the control tower that a structure can be anchored will be increased to 55km/60km/65km for small/medium/large starbases respectively. Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away. This change does increase the risk involved in cynoing to starbases in some situations, but in our opinion this added risk is both acceptable and desirable. Game Designer \| Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie http://www.twitch.tv/ccp_fozzie/

Belen Shields Iskender Kebap Corp 7	Posted - 2014.09.17 22:36:00 - [2] - Quote Good idea. Most caps get a cyno on grid at warprange anyway.
Uppsy Daisy Perkone Caldari State 612	Posted - 2014.09.17 22:36:00 - [3] - Quote interesting...
Ravcharas Infinite Point Nulli Secunda 347	Posted - 2014.09.17 22:50:00 - [4] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away.. M-m-my bookmarks
Makoto Priano Priano Trans-Stellar State Services Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 6358	Posted - 2014.09.17 22:59:00 - [5] - Quote A solid fix to the exploit, and generally messier for all involved! Love it. :D Priano Trans-Stellar: elegant solutions for the State's needs.
baltec1 Bat Country Goonswarm Federation 13237	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:09:00 - [6] - Quote In before the tears. A logical fix to titan bowling and a more risky galaxy for jumping caps is always nice Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
FT Diomedes The Graduates Forged of Fire 538	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:19:00 - [7] - Quote My Titan pilot is very happy now. Thank you, Fozzie. This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Liam Inkuras Top Belt Heroes Black Rise Police Department 1273	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:21:00 - [8] - Quote I just read changes to cynos. Yes I wear my goggles at night. Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Womyn Power Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 96	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:25:00 - [9] - Quote taking a low from a frigate while adding a launcher slot yet only giving it 5 more cpu fozzie ur a genius
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:36:00 - [10] - Quote A step in the right direction.

H3llHound Koshaku Tactical Narcotics Team 35	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:38:00 - [11] - Quote Will bookmarks on JB places also be altered automatically to the JBs new location or do we have to redo all those bookmarks?
kais58 Origin. Black Legion. 15	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:44:00 - [12] - Quote Have you considered the impact of this on dreads/supers dropping on fleets bashing towers? This would mean that if they hug the shield they'll mitigate a lot of the DPS as they're at a much longer range, 20-30km and that's if you can get a cyno right on the edge of the limit. There'll be no more warping in at 0 top of them then lighting the cyno.
Basil Vulpine Blueprint Haus Get Off My Lawn 42	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:45:00 - [13] - Quote NOW can we have alliance bookmarks? :)
Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 39	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:47:00 - [14] - Quote kais58 wrote: Have you considered the impact of this on dreads/supers dropping on fleets bashing towers? This would mean that if they hug the shield they'll mitigate a lot of the DPS as they're at a much longer range, 20-30km and that's if you can get a cyno right on the edge of the limit. There'll be no more warping in at 0 top of them then lighting the cyno. Also no more jumping dreads in to shoot a large tower and being even remotely within CR gun range, particularly for Moroses. Can still jump to a perch and warp down, but it definitely adds hassle.
Fleischgewehr 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 2	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:48:00 - [15] - Quote And of course CCP will update all our JB bookmarks, right ? ;)
kais58 Origin. Black Legion. 15	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:48:00 - [16] - Quote Oh Takashawa wrote: Also no more jumping dreads in to shoot a large tower and being even remotely within CR gun range, particularly for Moroses. That's way less of an issue, you've got time to warp down from a ping, but doing that in a hot drop could easily allow them to escape, as well as them being out of immediate range of ghost riders if you try and drop at the shield edge.
Kismeteer GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 627	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:49:00 - [17] - Quote Fixing problems with titan bowling? Sure, **** over everyone who runs a pos for an alliance. Or anyone with bookmarks anywhere near a JB. Or has to light a cyno to get inside a pos. All for an exploit that happened once a week for a couple months, and even then it wasn't declared an 'exploit' until it had happened like 10 times. All rather than dealing with your terrible pos code. Which you guys have acknowledged is a problem for three years now. But you still refuse to address the fact that the POS code is an unmaintainable mess.
Darksen Belisarius Raging Ducks Goonswarm Federation 1	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:49:00 - [18] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hello everyone. In our upcoming Oceanus release we are planning to make a change to the rules surrounding the way Cynos and Starbases interact. These new rules will help mitigate the issues surrounding jumping capitals sometimes colliding with ships inside a starbase forcefield. Currently you can light cynosural beacons as long as you are outside the forcefield. After this change, cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the forcefield edge. If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno). At the same time we will also be increasing the minimum distance that Jump Bridges and Cyno Generator Arrays may be anchored from the forcefield to 25km. The maximum distance away from the control tower that any structure can be anchored will be increased to 55km/60km/65km for small/medium/large starbases respectively. Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away. This change does increase the risk involved in cynoing to starbases in some situations, but in our opinion this added risk is both acceptable and desirable. What will be with the people who already lost titan due to "POS bump" ? as usual nope?
Dabigredboat Merch Industrial Goonswarm Federation 42	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:50:00 - [19] - Quote kais58 wrote: Oh Takashawa wrote: Also no more jumping dreads in to shoot a large tower and being even remotely within CR gun range, particularly for Moroses. That's way less of an issue, you've got time to warp down from a ping, but doing that in a hot drop could easily allow them to escape, as well as them being out of immediate range of ghost riders if you try and drop at the shield edge. This also means if people are hugging the pos shields with a few capitals to rep the tower, you cannot cyno jump in bump range and/or web range to keep them from getting inside the pos shields, so dropping with bombers is now a no go really. Also, ccp, does that mean that if I light a cyno without the pos shield up and jump my super carrier into the spot, I will appear 55-65km away anyways, even if the pos shield is still not up? Or can I put the ship into the pos next to the cyno, then put the pos shield up after?
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 780	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:51:00 - [20] - Quote I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone?

Kismeteer GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 627	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:54:00 - [21] - Quote Or if someone is shooting your pos, hope you have perches! Because otherwise, you can't just step outside to cyno in carriers, because welp you have to get 25km away. And if you have dreads/carriers tackled outside a pos, you can't light a cyno to come save them either. This is the worst type of 'CCP doesn't play their own game' solution.
baltec1 Bat Country Goonswarm Federation 13237	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:54:00 - [22] - Quote Fleischgewehr wrote: And of course CCP will update all our JB bookmarks, right ? ;) HA! Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
Kismeteer GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 627	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:54:00 - [23] - Quote Hope you are happy with the answer 'Well I guess you need more dudes for POS warfare' small groups. gg
kais58 Origin. Black Legion. 15	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:55:00 - [24] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? This definately seems better than stopping you from lighting a cyno, also, maybe lowering the distance? The radius of the largest titan is <10km plus the 5km off the cyno, means you should be all clear down to 15km.
Rattman Van Diemen's Demise Pandemic Legion 26	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:56:00 - [25] - Quote So now something cynoing in like a rorqal/JF will have to slow boat in 25km or cyno in greater than 150 and have virtually 0 protection from the. Just seems like lazyness on your behalf, cant find a real soluation so just do the dumbest/simpliest and bugger you all
BadAssMcKill ElitistOps 867	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:57:00 - [26] - Quote Maybe fix poses instead .
Aebe Amraen Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 88	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:58:00 - [27] - Quote Does this change also affect covert cynos?
Soleil Fournier StarFleet Enterprises Intrepid Crossing 12	Posted - 2014.09.17 23:59:00 - [28] - Quote Will this extend to titan bridges? IE titans need to be 25km away from the pos shield to bridge a fleet?
Fix Lag GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 784	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:01:00 - [29] - Quote hey guys I know our game is broken so we're going to put a bandaid on it also this bandaid gives you cancer CCP mostly sucks at their job, but Veritas is a pretty cool dude.
Lex Arson Adversity. Psychotic Tendencies. 369	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:01:00 - [30] - Quote Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. There's no use crying after every mistake, you just keep on trying 'til you run out of cake.

SkyFlyer ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 79	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:03:00 - [31] - Quote What? What the absolute christ. I (bob_FM) have killed upward of 5 supers in this 25km sphere, not being able to light a cyno in that range makes solo-tackling a super with a suicide cyno hic impossible near enough now.
Jalebi Economic Stimulus Corp 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:05:00 - [32] - Quote nice troll raivi
Angelus X Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 4	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:06:00 - [33] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? If it is possible to implement this seems like a far better idea.
Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 39	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:06:00 - [34] - Quote Why not just have it so nothing that jumps in can spawn within 25km of a POS shield? Wouldn't that be simpler, and not have all the negatives associated with effectively turning every single POS in EVE into a ((shield radius + 25km) * 2) diameter cyno inhibitor? Also, what about close-range dread guns? Folks aren't going to want to put dreads within 25km of POS shields anymore, as they won't be able to cyno in reinforcements or anything. That means even with tracking comps & long range, low damage ammo, close-range dread guns are going to be severely hampered in shooting large towers. I'm totally fine with nothing that jumps in appearing within whatever distance you want, but a blanket prohibition on cynos makes POSes even safer for their owners and an even bigger hassle and grind for aggressors. Thanks CCP, more structure shooting.
Travis Musgrat BURN EDEN Northern Coalition. 18	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:06:00 - [35] - Quote As a future CSM member and current player who is adamantly against the pos bowling mechanic, I approve this message
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 330	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:07:00 - [36] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? edit: basically I'm wondering if there's additional intended effects I'm not seeing, it's hard to tell what was intended and what was not with this change (besides ending pos bowling). THIS x 100
Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 39	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:07:00 - [37] - Quote Fix Lag wrote: hey guys I know our game is broken so we're going to put a bandaid on it also this bandaid gives you cancer I feel dirty agreeing with you.
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 334	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:08:00 - [38] - Quote Travis Musgrat wrote: As a future CSM member and current player who is adamantly against the pos bowling mechanic, I approve this message You're fantastically useless, you know this right?
Destiny Calling North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion 40	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:08:00 - [39] - Quote "Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone?" plz
Grath Telkin Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 2542	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:08:00 - [40] - Quote Do it. This change is nice, its going to shake things up a bit more than people suspect I'd think. Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.

Soleil Fournier StarFleet Enterprises Intrepid Crossing 13	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:09:00 - [41] - Quote Angelus X wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? If it is possible to implement this seems like a far better idea. Sounds great to me. Same result with better functionality.
Poision Kevin Burning Napalm Northern Coalition. 19	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:09:00 - [42] - Quote Anchoring cans and warp spots I hope will still work. As stated above, is covert cynos obidient by this too or as always immune to enviormental effects such as this? I guess this means Stain Coaltion will start using their titans again.
Haraku Malzahar Dixon Cox Butte Preservation Society Test Alliance Please Ignore 12	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:09:00 - [43] - Quote Womyn Power wrote: im gay xD same
BadAssMcKill ElitistOps 867	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:10:00 - [44] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Travis Musgrat wrote: As a future CSM member and current player who is adamantly against the pos bowling mechanic, I approve this message You're fantastically useless, you know this right? Don't be rude to ~future csms~ bob You never know what he might do .
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:11:00 - [45] - Quote HIC points go further than 25k fyi I don't see how this is an issue at all. Now at the very least you'll have to do some basic positioning before you can drop hell and earth on some unsuspecting dreads.
Lex Arson Adversity. Psychotic Tendencies. 371	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:12:00 - [46] - Quote why not just fix cynos so that ships coming in will always land in a position that doesn't bounce them off another ship There's no use crying after every mistake, you just keep on trying 'til you run out of cake.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 11249	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:12:00 - [47] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: HIC points go further than 25k fyi I don't see how this is an issue at all. they might have to burn the cyno for the ghostriders a tad bit further away this change is literally killing eve q_q Twitter: @EVEAndski "It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -á-á - Abrazzar
Poision Kevin Burning Napalm Northern Coalition. 19	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:13:00 - [48] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: HIC points go further than 25k fyi I don't see how this is an issue at all. Now at the very least you'll have to do some basic positioning before you can drop hell and earth on some unsuspecting dreads. Ever heard of webs to rpevent people from slowboating into shields? It's a miracle you guys manage at all.
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:14:00 - [49] - Quote Ever heard of rapiers and lokis?
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 334	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:17:00 - [50] - Quote tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF

Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 42	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:17:00 - [51] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: Ever heard of rapiers and lokis? Because what EVE really needs are mechanics that make certain ships absolutely mandatory or you shouldn't even bother.
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:18:00 - [52] - Quote Like archons? Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF edit No, seriously, Grarr, please do tell me more about this game you use as a conduit to empty your massive complain and whine-boner Maybe you ought to have some backup to your one **** *** cyno frig paving the way for twenty goddamned supers. And I'm the one complaining here? Haha, laughing all the way to the bank mate. It's funny as ** that the minute your substitute for skill (jump drives) gets nerfed a bit, you're on the forums within minutes to complain.
Samantha Fullbright Macabre Votum Northern Coalition. 1	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:18:00 - [53] - Quote Will this change effect covert cynos also? If so can you also make it so people can't run links at 0 out of POS while you at it?
alpha36 GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 9	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:18:00 - [54] - Quote all you had to do was ban the guys exploiting it and say: dont do that
Poision Kevin Burning Napalm Northern Coalition. 19	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:18:00 - [55] - Quote Oh Takashawa wrote: Grarr Dexx wrote: Ever heard of rapiers and lokis? Because what EVE really needs are mechanics that make certain ships absolutely mandatory or you shouldn't even bother. He didn't catch that hint it seems. But oh well.
Capqu Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 641	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:20:00 - [56] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNpMiT5qpyI
Gorski Car Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 334	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:22:00 - [57] - Quote (_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à_¦¦¦à-+¦¦¦àa¦¦¦à-Å¦¦¦ài¦¦¦àj-¡¦¦¦àu¦¦¦àa¦¦¦àn¦¦¦àa¦¦¦à_¦à_¦à_¦à()a+öa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ç #GORSKI4CSM https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4265138#post4265138
kais58 Origin. Black Legion. 17	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:22:00 - [58] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: Like archons? Maybe you ought to have some backup to your one **** ***** cyno frig paving the way for twenty goddamned supers. And I'm the one complaining here? Haha, laughing all the way to the bank mate. Oh no, your backup cyno archon landed 20km off the tower, RIP archon, no kills for you
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 337	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:23:00 - [59] - Quote Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too Don't be rude pls, if a pubbie lights and has to slowboat 30km into the POS shield now, 4/5ths of that time is under the no cyno zone.
Jalebi Economic Stimulus Corp 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:24:00 - [60] - Quote While you're at it, can you make it so that carriers can't sit 0m outside shields and assign fighters? Or at least bring back low-sec DDs? Also give Machariels AOE DDs

Belen Shields Iskender Kebap Corp 8	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:26:00 - [61] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF edit No, seriously, Grarr, please do tell me more about this game you use as a conduit to empty your massive complain and whine-boner Why dont you take Tech 3's for your cloaky AFK faggotry on cynobeacons Bob?
Tiberizzle Amok. Goonswarm Federation 49	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:26:00 - [62] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too Don't be rude pls, if a pubbie lights and has to slowboat 30km into the POS shield now, 4/5ths of that time is under the no cyno zone. warp from your perch to his cyno at 0, tackle him, and light your own am i missing something?
Capqu Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 642	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:27:00 - [63] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too Don't be rude pls, if a pubbie lights and has to slowboat 30km into the POS shield now, 4/5ths of that time is under the no cyno zone. in the old system 4/5ths of the time he'd already be in the pos were u born this stupid or did u grow into it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNpMiT5qpyI
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 337	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:28:00 - [64] - Quote Tiberizzle wrote: warp from your perch to his cyno at 0, tackle him, and light your own am i missing something? Yes, a girlfriend.
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:28:00 - [65] - Quote cause then it'd cost a bit more than 35m for a free jf kill
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 435	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:28:00 - [66] - Quote i too need to be at 0km on my target in order to light a cyno
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 337	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:29:00 - [67] - Quote Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too Don't be rude pls, if a pubbie lights and has to slowboat 30km into the POS shield now, 4/5ths of that time is under the no cyno zone. in the old system 4/5ths of the time he'd already be in the pos were u born this stupid or did u grow into it Learn to speak better-than-immigrant english and talk to me thanks
Capqu Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 642	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:29:00 - [68] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too Don't be rude pls, if a pubbie lights and has to slowboat 30km into the POS shield now, 4/5ths of that time is under the no cyno zone. in the old system 4/5ths of the time he'd already be in the pos were u born this stupid or did u grow into it Learn to speak better-than-immigrant english and talk to me thanks reported also the guys i'm completely wrong so i better insult him in some other way card, very nice. very nice indeed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNpMiT5qpyI
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 337	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:31:00 - [69] - Quote Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000
Abdiel Kavash Paladin Order Fidelas Constans 2725	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:32:00 - [70] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away. Thanks, I didn't have any use for those 300+ bookmarks anyway.

SkyFlyer ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 79	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:32:00 - [71] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000
Angelica Scatterbrain WH United 21	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:33:00 - [72] - Quote I have a crazy idea. How about just fixing the exploit and not screwing with the rest of the game? Weird huh? Or, admit your code is so dorked that you are incapable of fixing the exploit and have to screw with the rest of the game.
Jalebi Economic Stimulus Corp 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:33:00 - [73] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 can you convert this to kilomiles
Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 44	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:34:00 - [74] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 Don't forget to add force field radius to this to calculate your minimum necessary range if you want to cyno in and actually shoot the damn things. Oh, you wanted to fit close-range guns? Eat a ****. Why? Because this is easier.
Kat Ayclism Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 286	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:34:00 - [75] - Quote SkyFlyer wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 What if I were to cyno in at 525m?
Capqu Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 642	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:34:00 - [76] - Quote SkyFlyer wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 what https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNpMiT5qpyI
Tiberizzle Amok. Goonswarm Federation 49	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:35:00 - [77] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 were you going somewhere with that
Belen Shields Iskender Kebap Corp 8	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:37:00 - [78] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: tell me more about how you're going to burn a no-tank probing stealth bomber 20km under POS guns to light a cyno while holding tackle on the JF did u even read the op u ******, cynogens are moving out too Don't be rude pls, if a pubbie lights and has to slowboat 30km into the POS shield now, 4/5ths of that time is under the no cyno zone. in the old system 4/5ths of the time he'd already be in the pos were u born this stupid or did u grow into it Learn to speak better-than-immigrant english and talk to me thanks What?! No jokes on black people? Cmon Bob, I know you can do better.
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 337	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:37:00 - [79] - Quote Jalebi wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 can you convert this to kilomiles I think so Previous Range (kilomiles)New Range (Kilomiles) 310.685596115534.27981 621.371192215534.27981 932.056788415534.27981 1242.74238415534.27981 1553.42798115534.27981 1864.11357715534.27981 2174.79917315534.27981 2485.48476915534.27981 2796.17036515534.27981 3106.85596115534.27981 3417.54155715534.27981 3728.22715315534.27981 4038.9127515534.27981 4349.59834615534.27981 4660.28394215534.27981 4970.96953815534.27981 5281.65513415534.27981 5592.3407315534.27981 5903.02632615534.27981 6213.71192215534.27981 6524.39751815534.27981 6835.08311515534.27981 7145.76871115534.27981 7456.45430715534.27981 7767.13990315534.27981 8077.82549915534.27981 8388.51109515534.27981 8699.19669115534.27981 9009.88228715534.27981 9320.56788415534.27981 9631.2534815534.27981 9941.93907615534.27981 10252.6246715534.27981 10563.3102715534.27981 10873.9958615534.27981 11184.6814615534.27981 11495.3670615534.27981 11806.0526515534.27981 12116.7382515534.27981 12427.4238415534.27981 12738.1094415534.27981 13048.7950415534.27981 13359.4806315534.27981 13670.1662315534.27981 13980.8518315534.27981 14291.5374215534.27981 14602.2230215534.27981 14912.9086115534.27981 15223.5942115534.27981 15534.2798115534.27981
Arnak Arareb Viziam Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:38:00 - [80] - Quote " oh dude, my titan is tackled outside the POS oh golly good thing I have a cyno to bring in triage ! , oh **** can't light within 25 KM " RIP

Plexforlol FrankerZ Industries Gunboat Diplomats 11	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:38:00 - [81] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 please in miles
Capqu Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 642	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:38:00 - [82] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Jalebi wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 can you convert this to kilomiles I think so Previous Range (kilomiles)New Range (Kilomiles) 310.685596115534.27981 621.371192215534.27981 932.056788415534.27981 1242.74238415534.27981 1553.42798115534.27981 1864.11357715534.27981 2174.79917315534.27981 2485.48476915534.27981 2796.17036515534.27981 3106.85596115534.27981 3417.54155715534.27981 3728.22715315534.27981 4038.9127515534.27981 4349.59834615534.27981 4660.28394215534.27981 4970.96953815534.27981 5281.65513415534.27981 5592.3407315534.27981 5903.02632615534.27981 6213.71192215534.27981 6524.39751815534.27981 6835.08311515534.27981 7145.76871115534.27981 7456.45430715534.27981 7767.13990315534.27981 8077.82549915534.27981 8388.51109515534.27981 8699.19669115534.27981 9009.88228715534.27981 9320.56788415534.27981 9631.2534815534.27981 9941.93907615534.27981 10252.6246715534.27981 10563.3102715534.27981 10873.9958615534.27981 11184.6814615534.27981 11495.3670615534.27981 11806.0526515534.27981 12116.7382515534.27981 12427.4238415534.27981 12738.1094415534.27981 13048.7950415534.27981 13359.4806315534.27981 13670.1662315534.27981 13980.8518315534.27981 14291.5374215534.27981 14602.2230215534.27981 14912.9086115534.27981 15223.5942115534.27981 15534.2798115534.27981 good maths tho https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNpMiT5qpyI
Bob FromMarketing ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 337	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:40:00 - [83] - Quote Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Jalebi wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 can you convert this to kilomiles I think so Previous Range (kilomiles)New Range (Kilomiles) 310.685596115534.27981 621.371192215534.27981 932.056788415534.27981 1242.74238415534.27981 1553.42798115534.27981 1864.11357715534.27981 2174.79917315534.27981 2485.48476915534.27981 2796.17036515534.27981 3106.85596115534.27981 3417.54155715534.27981 3728.22715315534.27981 4038.9127515534.27981 4349.59834615534.27981 4660.28394215534.27981 4970.96953815534.27981 5281.65513415534.27981 5592.3407315534.27981 5903.02632615534.27981 6213.71192215534.27981 6524.39751815534.27981 6835.08311515534.27981 7145.76871115534.27981 7456.45430715534.27981 7767.13990315534.27981 8077.82549915534.27981 8388.51109515534.27981 8699.19669115534.27981 9009.88228715534.27981 9320.56788415534.27981 9631.2534815534.27981 9941.93907615534.27981 10252.6246715534.27981 10563.3102715534.27981 10873.9958615534.27981 11184.6814615534.27981 11495.3670615534.27981 11806.0526515534.27981 12116.7382515534.27981 12427.4238415534.27981 12738.1094415534.27981 13048.7950415534.27981 13359.4806315534.27981 13670.1662315534.27981 13980.8518315534.27981 14291.5374215534.27981 14602.2230215534.27981 14912.9086115534.27981 15223.5942115534.27981 15534.2798115534.27981 good maths tho Thanks bb
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 11249	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:52:00 - [84] - Quote Oh Takashawa wrote: Because what EVE really needs are mechanics that make certain ships absolutely mandatory or you shouldn't even bother. installing ihub upgrades requires one of four ships doomsdaying something requires one of four ships fighterbombers require one of five ships webbing something at a long range requires one of three ships pointing something at a long range requires one of three ships i can go on about mechanics that make certain ships absolutely mandatory but i'm sure you get the picture by now Twitter: @EVEAndski "It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -á-á - Abrazzar
Adwokat Diabla Hel No plz 17	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:57:00 - [85] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hello everyone. In our upcoming Oceanus release we are planning to make a change to the rules surrounding the way Cynos and Starbases interact. These new rules will help mitigate the issues surrounding jumping capitals sometimes colliding with ships inside a starbase forcefield. Currently you can light cynosural beacons as long as you are outside the forcefield. After this change, cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the forcefield edge. If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno). At the same time we will also be increasing the minimum distance that Jump Bridges and Cyno Generator Arrays may be anchored from the forcefield to 25km. The maximum distance away from the control tower that any structure can be anchored will be increased to 55km/60km/65km for small/medium/large starbases respectively. Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away. This change does increase the risk involved in cynoing to starbases in some situations, but in our opinion this added risk is both acceptable and desirable. I agree that it is a nice change, although it would be great if you would extend it to 30km away with respect to the cyno gens next to a force field. More then once I have had a carrier slowboat into a pos-shield and, while this will probably fix that problem especially for errant thannies/niddies, archons and chimeras may still present a problem where they can slowboat into a pos force-field vs a solo super. I am also really happy to see one of Black Legion's favourite little bugs getting fixed with regards to force-fields that have yet to be activated.
Tiberizzle Amok. Goonswarm Federation 50	Posted - 2014.09.18 00:57:00 - [86] - Quote Capqu wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Jalebi wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 can you convert this to kilomiles I think so Previous Range (kilomiles)New Range (Kilomiles) 310.685596115534.27981 621.371192215534.27981 932.056788415534.27981 1242.74238415534.27981 1553.42798115534.27981 1864.11357715534.27981 2174.79917315534.27981 2485.48476915534.27981 2796.17036515534.27981 3106.85596115534.27981 3417.54155715534.27981 3728.22715315534.27981 4038.9127515534.27981 4349.59834615534.27981 4660.28394215534.27981 4970.96953815534.27981 5281.65513415534.27981 5592.3407315534.27981 5903.02632615534.27981 6213.71192215534.27981 6524.39751815534.27981 6835.08311515534.27981 7145.76871115534.27981 7456.45430715534.27981 7767.13990315534.27981 8077.82549915534.27981 8388.51109515534.27981 8699.19669115534.27981 9009.88228715534.27981 9320.56788415534.27981 9631.2534815534.27981 9941.93907615534.27981 10252.6246715534.27981 10563.3102715534.27981 10873.9958615534.27981 11184.6814615534.27981 11495.3670615534.27981 11806.0526515534.27981 12116.7382515534.27981 12427.4238415534.27981 12738.1094415534.27981 13048.7950415534.27981 13359.4806315534.27981 13670.1662315534.27981 13980.8518315534.27981 14291.5374215534.27981 14602.2230215534.27981 14912.9086115534.27981 15223.5942115534.27981 15534.2798115534.27981 good maths tho um 25000 meters is 0.0155343 kilomiles bro
Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 44	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:00:00 - [87] - Quote Andski wrote: Oh Takashawa wrote: Because what EVE really needs are mechanics that make certain ships absolutely mandatory or you shouldn't even bother. installing ihub upgrades requires one of four ships doomsdaying something requires one of four ships fighterbombers require one of five ships webbing something at a long range requires one of three ships pointing something at a long range requires one of three ships i can go on about mechanics that make certain ships absolutely mandatory but i'm sure you get the picture by now Everything but top tier upgrades, beacons, bridges, and jammer upgrades, fit in JFs or smaller, so it's 8+ hulls. LR webs are actually loki huginn rapier bhaal ashimmu (does the cruor have this too?) and hyena. so 6-7. and LR points are... 4 ceptors, 1 EAF, 3 mordus, proteus, arazu, lach - so that's uh, 11, by my count. Diversity is fine. I like diversity. I love the choices and options EVE gives us. What I don't love are mechanics changes which force me into one sole course of action. I have multiple means of moving most ihub upgrades, for example. Doomsdays I admit are a niche case, but they, and fighterbombers, fundamentally fulfill the goal of shooting things - I have a plethora of ways to shoot things, and dreads in particular give me the means of doing supercarrier damage without a lot of the hassles, but with drawbacks. It's about choice, no matter what I'm doing. This change doesn't give me much at all if I want to keep someone from getting back to a POS shield.
Powers Sa 1371	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:02:00 - [88] - Quote Lex Arson wrote: Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. By me lol
Aryth GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1581	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:02:00 - [89] - Quote Excellent Change. Increased risk for the lazy and not much else. Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal. Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.
JamesUtah Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:06:00 - [90] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hello everyone. Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away. RIP Jump Bridge network bookmarks

Adwokat Diabla Hel No plz 17	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:08:00 - [91] - Quote Lex Arson wrote: Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. This does not even make sense. A long point on a super goes 30km before links and fighters nowadays dunk subcaps like crazy. You can still dunk on noobs in bombers or oracles or w/e. Please, feel free to sit your carrier on the edge of the pos shield and be "invulnerable" . A hic point is 24km? so even that should be fine to just light a cyno, have a hic jump in and mwd for 2seconds at a bad-guy shooting your pos in a titan or something ********. Your whole post makes no sense.
Unsuccessful At Everything The Troll Bridge 16858	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:14:00 - [92] - Quote SPLOOSH. *Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?*
Neckbeard Nolyfe Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 14	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:15:00 - [93] - Quote Bob FromMarketing wrote: Jalebi wrote: [quote=Bob FromMarketing][quote=Capqu]froths at the mouth many numbers that didn't help me be in rr range, rip utu *~lvl 60 paladin~*
Lex Arson Adversity. Psychotic Tendencies. 372	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:17:00 - [94] - Quote Adwokat Diabla wrote: Lex Arson wrote: Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. This does not even make sense. A long point on a super goes 30km before links and fighters nowadays dunk subcaps like crazy. You can still dunk on noobs in bombers or oracles or w/e. Please, feel free to sit your carrier on the edge of the pos shield and be "invulnerable" . A hic point is 24km? so even that should be fine to just light a cyno, have a hic jump in and mwd for 2seconds at a bad-guy shooting your pos in a titan or something ********. Your whole post makes no sense. I was referring to cyno'ing in Vindicators to keep the carrier that is 1000-2000m away from the pos edge from getting in while you own it with dreads. Sure you have Loki's, but meh, they don't do the job as well. This mechanic creates more practical "risk-free" situations than it removes. lelob pls. There's no use crying after every mistake, you just keep on trying 'til you run out of cake.
Amtey The Executives Executive Outcomes 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:23:00 - [95] - Quote Adwokat Diabla wrote: Lex Arson wrote: Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. This does not even make sense. A long point on a super goes 30km before links and fighters nowadays dunk subcaps like crazy. You can still dunk on noobs in bombers or oracles or w/e. Please, feel free to sit your carrier on the edge of the pos shield and be "invulnerable" . A hic point is 24km? so even that should be fine to just light a cyno, have a hic jump in and mwd for 2seconds at a bad-guy shooting your pos in a titan or something ********. Your whole post makes no sense. a full skilled hic pilot got 36km point range. with skills to lvl 4 Graviton Physics and Hic you are looking at 28.8km. Means you actually have to train them skills to 4 on your suicide hic pilots. and i dont know where you guys get your numbers from.
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:29:00 - [96] - Quote Adwokat Diabla wrote: Lex Arson wrote: Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. This does not even make sense. A long point on a super goes 30km before links and fighters nowadays dunk subcaps like crazy. You can still dunk on noobs in bombers or oracles or w/e. Please, feel free to sit your carrier on the edge of the pos shield and be "invulnerable" . A hic point is 24km? so even that should be fine to just light a cyno, have a hic jump in and mwd for 2seconds at a bad-guy shooting your pos in a titan or something ********. Your whole post makes no sense. that's an issue with fighters, not with the cynos being limited to 25k min
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 431	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:30:00 - [97] - Quote Also, towers RFed every single day? abloobloobloo, a justified nerf to your massive pos network
AssandTits University of Caille Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:30:00 - [98] - Quote The PL alt tears are so tasty. Perhaps a simple logic test ... if toon = owner of tower activate cynogen within 25km ... if not FOFO 25km you go.
Tarsas Phage Freight Club 325	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:44:00 - [99] - Quote Fozzie, why can't you just avoid the sphere edge (dealing with radians and sin/cosin isn't really taxing max) and make sure the server pics a spawn point from the FF that is further modified by the size of the ship being spawned? You'll then guarantee that an object spawning on a POS FF will not intersect with the FF's sphere.

ISD Cyberdyne ISD Community Communications Liaisons 1584	Posted - 2014.09.18 01:52:00 - [100] - Quote Conducted some thread cleansing. Please keep the discussion on-topic, productive, and respectful. Please discontinue the rule violations. Thanks. Quote: 2. Be respectful toward others at all times. The purpose of the EVE Online forums is to provide a platform for exchange of ideas, and a venue for the discussion of EVE Online. Occasionally there will be conflicts that arise when people voice opinions. Forum users are expected to be courteous when disagreeing with others. 5. Trolling is prohibited. Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote. 6. Racism and discrimination are prohibited. Racism, gender stereotyping, hate speech, and sexism are not permitted on the EVE Online Forums. Derogatory posting that includes race, religion or sexual preference based personal attacks and trolling can result in immediate suspension of forum posting privileges. 23. Post constructively. Negative feedback can be very useful to further improve EVE Online provided that it is presented in a civil and factual manner. All users are encouraged to honestly express their feelings regarding EVE Online and how it can be improved. Posts that are non-constructive, insulting or in breach of the rules will be deleted regardless of how valid the ideas behind them may be. Users are also reminded that posting with a lack of content also constitutes non-constructive posting. 27. Off-topic posting is prohibited. Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued to the off-topic poster. ISD Cyberdyne Lieutenant Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department


Dunk Dinkle Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 64	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:10:00 - [101] - Quote This appears to be solving for the exception case at the expense of the majority, no-problematic case.
Kenneth Feld Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 151	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:13:00 - [102] - Quote AssandTits wrote: The PL alt tears are so tasty. Perhaps a simple logic test ... if toon = owner of tower activate cynogen within 25km ... if not FOFO 25km you go. Coming from an alt LOL That being said, I think you are confusing laughing at goons who should live under the motto "Be careful what you ask for, you may just get it" and us laughing so hard we are crying https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5030264#post5030264 I'll just leave this here for ya
Kaarous Aldurald ROC Deep Space The ROC 9809	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:19:00 - [103] - Quote Good change. There is no reason to permit them as close as they are at present, save to tiptoe around POS bumping exploits. "Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws." One of ours, ten of theirs.
Capqu Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 649	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:24:00 - [104] - Quote isd im sorry 4 my hate comments i get *passionate* about this game overall i think this change is a bit ham fisted and knee jerk to be honest, i don't know if its a good change or not but i think its being made for the wrong raisins https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNpMiT5qpyI
Lord Mantus Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 2	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:34:00 - [105] - Quote Hey how about fixing poses instead.
Blawrf McTaggart GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1807	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:40:00 - [106] - Quote Thank you for fixing this exploit, Fozzie!
Jalebi Economic Stimulus Corp 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:46:00 - [107] - Quote Oh Takashawa wrote: Why not just have it so nothing that jumps in can spawn within 25km of a POS shield? Wouldn't that be simpler, and not have all the negatives associated with effectively turning every single POS in EVE into a ((shield radius + 25km) * 2) diameter cyno inhibitor? quoting so CCP doesnt miss this make it so that you can cyno within 25km but anything that jumps in will have to spawn at 25km away from the force field
Vhaine Vhindiscar Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation 22	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:49:00 - [108] - Quote Terrible change. It's arbitrary and bad mechanics. A bandaid on a problem that really only affects that 1%. How about taking it back to the drawing board and seeing if you can't come up with a solution that doesn't affect ALL of null sec just to fix a problem that really only is an issue for a small minority of the players. Honestly, how long will you let super caps define the play of the entire null sec population? Isn't it time to stop catering to them? Fix the problem, but don't go creating a whole laundry list of issues in the process. Surely, you guys can fix an exploit without resorting to a sledge hammer in the process...
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc Test Alliance Please Ignore 1850	Posted - 2014.09.18 02:59:00 - [109] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: A step in the right direction. further from the shield of invincibility is definitely the right direction Vhaine Vhindiscar wrote: It's arbitrary and bad mechanics. A bandaid on a problem that really only affects that 1%. It affects me. Am I part of the 1%? Fit a warfare link to your tech 1 battlecruiser. Train Wing Commander. Get in the Squad Commander or Wing Commander position. Your fleets will be superior to everyone else's. (had this sig BEFORE Odyssey BC rebalance) "What if [climate change is] a big hoax and we create a better world for nothing?" -comic on Greenmonk
Savesti Kyrsst CTRL-Q Iron Oxide. 12	Posted - 2014.09.18 03:04:00 - [110] - Quote Oh god why am I posting on eve-o. CCP are forbidding cynos to be lit in the 25km radius rather than simply moving the cyno spawn point as it's way more intuitive. Don't worry, I'm sure people new to/bad at capitals will die in many other ways.

baltec1 Bat Country Goonswarm Federation 13238	Posted - 2014.09.18 03:14:00 - [111] - Quote Lord Mantus wrote: Hey how about fixing poses instead. You stop this crazy talk now. Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
KIller Wabbit The Scope Gallente Federation 739	Posted - 2014.09.18 03:28:00 - [112] - Quote Well, CSM - you gave your approval for this I guess? CCP .. always first with the wrong stuff CSM .. CCP Shills with a vacation plan
Blawrf McTaggart GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 1807	Posted - 2014.09.18 03:31:00 - [113] - Quote Vhaine Vhindiscar wrote: Terrible change. It's arbitrary and bad mechanics. A bandaid on a problem that really only affects that 1%. How about taking it back to the drawing board and seeing if you can't come up with a solution that doesn't affect ALL of null sec just to fix a problem that really only is an issue for a small minority of the players. Honestly, how long will you let super caps define the play of the entire null sec population? Isn't it time to stop catering to them? Fix the problem, but don't go creating a whole laundry list of issues in the process. Surely, you guys can fix an exploit without resorting to a sledge hammer in the process... you're so dumb, son.
CorryBasler Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 86	Posted - 2014.09.18 04:47:00 - [114] - Quote Adwokat Diabla wrote: Lex Arson wrote: Great change, CCP. -Now I can sit my carrier on a POS edge, rep it, and be even more immune to getting dropped on. -If my fleet is bubble inside a tower, I can no longer run outside and cyno in reinforcements; I'll be dead long before I clear a 25km zone of hatred. -Pretty much anything shooting/repping a pos short of dreads/triage is immune to being killed. Can't wait to have my towers reinforced EVERY SINGLE DAY. This does not even make sense. A long point on a super goes 30km before links and fighters nowadays dunk subcaps like crazy. You can still dunk on noobs in bombers or oracles or w/e. Please, feel free to sit your carrier on the edge of the pos shield and be "invulnerable" . A hic point is 24km? so even that should be fine to just light a cyno, have a hic jump in and mwd for 2seconds at a bad-guy shooting your pos in a titan or something ********. Your whole post makes no sense. Since that carrier that was already hugging the shields, can simply burn right in when the cyno goes up in a matter of a few seconds, unless you light the cyno with a long range web ship, which would then need a faction disruptor to prevent the ship from just jumping out before the super gets in to tackle it.
PotatoOverdose Handsome Millionaire Playboys Mordus Angels 2118	Posted - 2014.09.18 04:52:00 - [115] - Quote Sweet. A timely response to a significant issue. Good stuff.
Catherine Laartii Providence Guard Templis CALSF 284	Posted - 2014.09.18 05:01:00 - [116] - Quote Grath Telkin wrote: Do it. This change is nice, its going to shake things up a bit more than people suspect I'd think. Chaos is the mother of adaptation.
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 281	Posted - 2014.09.18 05:19:00 - [117] - Quote Travis Musgrat wrote: As a future CSM member and current player who is adamantly against the pos bowling mechanic, I approve this message Oi! I see what you did there, you naughty, naughty boy.
Leifler The Suicide Kings Black Legion. 3	Posted - 2014.09.18 05:54:00 - [118] - Quote So lets say a titan in a forward system away from your staging accidentally bumps out of the tower and gets tackled. Said titan doesnt bump 25km outside of the forcefield. With this change he cant even light a cyno to save himself. How does this make sense? Alchy09 had and interesting idea posted in the reddit thread about this "Whilst I do like this change, the whole mechanic of bumping going through a Cyno is a pain in the backside, and something that should of been looked at years ago. However! Recently they made some changes elsewhere that could in theory be applied to Cynos. Wormhole mechanics! Hear me out here! What if mass dictated where you appear when you go through a cyno, meaning inties, land 5k off, dreads say 15km around, titans say, 25km around. This would resolve a lot of the issues with bumping, and the mechanic for it already exists, CCP just simply need to apply it to cynos. Tho... would make jumping to stations with a JF seriously fun.... ooo I like!"
Altrue Exploration Frontier inc Brave Collective 1289	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:10:00 - [119] - Quote What if a cyno is lit against a control tower but the password has not been entered? I understand that once its entered, the ship will appear far away, but what if there is no forcefield? Signature Tanking - Best Tanking
Glasgow Dunlop The Dark Space Initiative Scary Wormhole People 178	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:12:00 - [120] - Quote HTFU twitter: @glasgowdunlop-á TDSIN Recruitment Director : Join 'TDSIN pub' Glasgow Meet Organiser

5yndr0m3 Origin. Black Legion. 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:14:00 - [121] - Quote Adwokat Diabla wrote: . I am also really happy to see one of Black Legion's favourite little bugs getting fixed with regards to force-fields that have yet to be activated. could you explain this in detail? i have no idea what you are talking about and it would be nice to know.
Carhart Jacket Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 1	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:27:00 - [122] - Quote Darksen Belisarius wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: Hello everyone. In our upcoming Oceanus release we are planning to make a change to the rules surrounding the way Cynos and Starbases interact. These new rules will help mitigate the issues surrounding jumping capitals sometimes colliding with ships inside a starbase forcefield. Currently you can light cynosural beacons as long as you are outside the forcefield. After this change, cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the forcefield edge. If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno). At the same time we will also be increasing the minimum distance that Jump Bridges and Cyno Generator Arrays may be anchored from the forcefield to 25km. The maximum distance away from the control tower that any structure can be anchored will be increased to 55km/60km/65km for small/medium/large starbases respectively. Any existing Jump Bridge and Cyno Generator Array structures will be automatically pushed away from their starbase's forcefield until they are 25km away. This change does increase the risk involved in cynoing to starbases in some situations, but in our opinion this added risk is both acceptable and desirable. What will be with the people who already lost titan due to "POS bump" ? as usual nope? you/they get qq'd. ask mittens to give you one of his
gascanu Bearing Srl. 151	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:31:00 - [123] - Quote how about that pos rework that CCP promised like, uhmm... 3-4 years ago? instead we get duct tape?
Anthar Thebess 694	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:41:00 - [124] - Quote 25k is good change , but can it be increased bit more? Titans have big signature , and you can still bump them into the direction of forcefield. Can we get at the same time more range on Mobile Cyno Inhibitor , or at least reduce the minimal range between those structures. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Petrified Old and Petrified Syndication TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance 162	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:43:00 - [125] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: ... If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno)... This seems to imply that it will still be possible to light a cyno within 25 KM of a POS shield if the password is in place?
colera deldios 206	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:43:00 - [126] - Quote From reddit: This change is so ***** stupid it's not even a *** exploit. In EVE we punish people for every stupid move they did not think over before doing: Go to HS in 10+b JF without quick exit cyno we punish you, Grinding infrastructure in 0.0 with solo super we punish you, You don't look what anomaly you warp to you end your carrier in ESS bubble we punish you, You don't align as you land in anomaly we punish you, You don't anchor up in fleet fight you primary you dead, You don't look which button you press and you jump instead of bridge we punish you So many punishments for so many tiny mistakes but THIS this is where we are going to hold hands for stupid people who are incapable of deploying a Mobile Cyno Inhibitor you can have like 500000000 of these in your Titan or your Super Carrier or any fleet scout can take them with him. HERE we are going to hold hands and in turn over entire EVE. https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Mobile_Cynosural_Inhibitor[1] This module has been out for what a year now. You drop this thing in direction your Titan/Fleet is facing and noone can jump in. It's cheap, it's already made, it works and it costs no dev hours and it wont destroy 1000's of hours of work. This is another Jump Fuel change. It's stupid and **** and wont do anything else but ** over people who made all the bookmarks for corps/alliances.
Anthar Thebess 694	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:45:00 - [127] - Quote Leifler wrote: So lets say a titan in a forward system away from your staging accidentally bumps out of the tower and gets tackled. Said titan doesnt bump 25km outside of the forcefield. With this change he cant even light a cyno to save himself. How does this make sense? Alchy09 had and interesting idea posted in the reddit thread about this "Whilst I do like this change, the whole mechanic of bumping going through a Cyno is a pain in the backside, and something that should of been looked at years ago. However! Recently they made some changes elsewhere that could in theory be applied to Cynos. Wormhole mechanics! Hear me out here! What if mass dictated where you appear when you go through a cyno, meaning inties, land 5k off, dreads say 15km around, titans say, 25km around. This would resolve a lot of the issues with bumping, and the mechanic for it already exists, CCP just simply need to apply it to cynos. Tho... would make jumping to stations with a JF seriously fun.... ooo I like!" No this will cause more issues. Overall idea is good, but recent events proved that people will abuse every possible bug. Can during the jump drive code check if there is pos nearby and spawn ships "not closer than" tower size + pos shields +40 Km Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Anthar Thebess 695	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:48:00 - [128] - Quote colera deldios wrote: Stuff You are aware that this is because of exploit mechanics in the obsolete pos code? Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Gerdan BloodELF Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 15	Posted - 2014.09.18 06:50:00 - [129] - Quote Fozzie, I see what you are trying to fix and its commendable but I feel like its a bandaid on a bigger issue to do with mechanics around forcefields, model hitbox sizes and bumping mechanics. Id like to see a better solution to solve the issue than the ones you have proposed and I am sure other before me have listed some alternatives above me that would be more ideal.
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.18 07:08:00 - [130] - Quote Leifler wrote: So lets say a titan in a forward system away from your staging accidentally bumps out of the tower and gets tackled. Said titan doesnt bump 25km outside of the forcefield. With this change he cant even light a cyno to save himself. How does this make sense? Well mate, there's a point to your question but ... This change removes a significant factor which can cause your titan to be bumped out, that's one. The statement by CCP Falcon regarding bumping ANY ship out of the POS as long as there's not password to it ASSURES that the bump you mention can only happen with some amount of negligence or other, otherwise it's an EXPLOIT - that's two. Cause we all know that CCP will own up to their WELL DEFINED statements, right guyz?

Eugene Kerner TunDraGon Cynosural Field Theory. 1371	Posted - 2014.09.18 07:18:00 - [131] - Quote In before jf pilot rage...picking up moon goo in those non station systems... TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs " -á CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a di++k joke."-áRobin Williams - RIP
Anthar Thebess 695	Posted - 2014.09.18 07:19:00 - [132] - Quote Depending who exploits bugs , or what alliance loose ships to large player scale engagements. But at least someone did something. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Mizhir Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships. 68784	Posted - 2014.09.18 07:40:00 - [133] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: This change does increase the risk involved in cynoing to starbases in some situations, but in our opinion this added risk is both acceptable and desirable. Indeed it is. Awesome changes. One Man Crew - Collective solo pvp
Kat Ayclism Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 287	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:11:00 - [134] - Quote Oh, Fozzie making another nonsensical poorly thought out post that pretty much wrecks a whole lot more of Eve than it's intended to address, but we have to "stay on topic" in the face of something clearly put forward devoid of thought. Should we all just post +1 to the 3-4 posts that succinctly point out just how idiotic this is? Added risk? This eliminates a lot of risk for any triage repping a pos up. This eliminates or severely limits a lot of risk for pos shoot groups. Both of which will just sit in the 25km sphere of ***** invulnerability. It makes the people that exploit (yes, exploit) the cyno into a pos with no forcefield up for invulnerability of their super/titan even safer- since CCP won't ever actually lay down the law when they do so no- all they have to do is time it slightly differently. So where is the risk added in? It's added in to the already most mindnumbing bullshit in this game of doing JF runs, now you get the option of being completely defenseless with zero chance to burn into the pos. It's added further to any titan bumped out by whatever means, cause they won't even be able to light a *** cyno to bring in help unless the merciful bump gods do send them 25.0000001 km out. I'm pretty goddamned sure the added safety to triage and pos shooters kinda outweighs annoying the everliving out of JF nerds and absolutely damning bumped out titans. ** it, if there's a good point it clearly has to go to reddit instead of here.
Diivil Magellanic Itg Goonswarm Federation 286	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:11:00 - [135] - Quote As others have posted you should be able to light the cyno but have the ship land 25km away from the shields. Being tackled in a titan in the exclusion would be pretty frustrating otherwise. But my main question is why is this measured from the forcefields and not from the POS stick? Cynoing in to a POS with forcefields down and then putting them up has been ruled as an exploit right? People still do that all the time. So why not just make the exclusion zone not care about the forcefields and use the POS stick as the anchor point for calculating distance? That way you would get rid of two exploits at once.
Anthar Thebess 695	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:18:00 - [136] - Quote Good idea, or make this constant value. So no matter how big pos is the same range applies. Why ? As it is much easier to bump stuff from small and med tower. EDIT: Can we get cyno spin up timer depending on the ship size? 15 seconds : noobships. 10 s : T1 Frigates 5s : T1 Destroyers , industrials 0s : T1 Cruisers and above , T2 Ships Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
GeeShizzle MacCloud 471	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:37:00 - [137] - Quote Thank f**king god the +1up'ing of ridiculous lengthy and completely irrelevant posts on this thread is over. was doing my nut in. and more PL tears plz as its hilarious that you guys can complain about something that prevents you in even the most trivial of ways especially when you argue your corner when there's such a simple and obvious solution to your little faux-issue with this fix. grow up and stop acting like a spoilt little child throwing ur toys out of the pram, sheesh!
Saisin State War Academy Caldari State 143	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:43:00 - [138] - Quote Diivil wrote: As others have posted you should be able to light the cyno but have the ship land 25km away from the shields. Being tackled in a titan in the exclusion would be pretty frustrating otherwise. But my main question is why is this measured from the forcefields and not from the POS stick? Cynoing in to a POS with forcefields down and then putting them up has been ruled as an exploit right? People still do that all the time. So why not just make the exclusion zone not care about the forcefields and use the POS stick as the anchor point for calculating distance? That way you would get rid of two exploits at once. +1 "surrender your ego, be free". innuendo. solo? There is a new hope http://turamarths-evelife.blogspot.com/2014/05/ok-now-im-betting-man.html
Alvatore DiMarco Capricious Endeavours Ltd 2677	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:43:00 - [139] - Quote One small step for EVE.. ...one giant leap towards death to all supers.
Sentient Blade Crisis Atmosphere 1355	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:49:00 - [140] - Quote Having read through 7 pages worth, here is my feedback: #1 Invisible interdiction areas are a horrible mechanic. Not knowing when you / someone else can light a cyno because of some invisible and arbitrary line in the sand is poor game play. #2 Bookmarks, if these are not updated then this should definitely not happen. #3 The issue of not being able to light a defensive cyno on the edge of a POS, in the case of a titan / super being bumped out, is practically begging to become an exploit itself. Ships will be bumped out of the POS but kept within cyno blocking range and not be able to call for reinforcements. #4 This is ultimately a solution to something which should not have been allowed in the first place. Rather than fixing the mechanics problem (collision bubbles being able to penetrate POS shields) this fix has much wider repercussions, in many cases negative ones.

Alvatore DiMarco Capricious Endeavours Ltd 2677	Posted - 2014.09.18 08:56:00 - [141] - Quote Sentient Blade wrote: Having read through 7 pages worth, here is my feedback: #1 Invisible interdiction areas are a horrible mechanic. Not knowing when you / someone else can light a cyno because of some invisible and arbitrary line in the sand is poor game play. Stop flying with your overview minimized. Fozzie's told you where the "line in the sand" is. All you have to do is be able to read numbers and understand which ones are greater than/less than 25. Furthermore, I can virtually guarantee that after the change goes live, attempting to light a cyno will give you an error message that states the correct minimum distance required.
Rad1st AirGuard LowSechnaya Sholupen 2	Posted - 2014.09.18 09:02:00 - [142] - Quote I require cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the any stations too Or patch will be not full
Anthar Thebess 695	Posted - 2014.09.18 09:08:00 - [143] - Quote Large tower 30km shield radius + 25km = 55km from pos. Make it 55km from all towers , as i stated again small and med towers are much easier to bump out. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Anthar Thebess 695	Posted - 2014.09.18 09:09:00 - [144] - Quote Rad1st wrote: I require cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the any stations too Or patch will be not full This could be interesting , but at the same time stations are to different . Some are small, and on some traveling dozens of KM is still keeping you in dock range. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Zomgnomnom Royal Black Watch Highlanders Mordus Angels 41	Posted - 2014.09.18 09:20:00 - [145] - Quote So let me make sure I am understanding this. You clearly have the ability to fix the ACTUAL problem with the code your're wishing to implement. But instead of just fixing the actual problem, you're going to create 37 more? This change, as proposed, creates more problems than it solves and is therefore a poor one in my opinion.
Kasimir Wulf Ubiquitous Hurt Exodus. 15	Posted - 2014.09.18 09:50:00 - [146] - Quote Sentient Blade wrote: Having read through 7 pages worth, here is my feedback: #1 Invisible interdiction areas are a horrible mechanic. Not knowing when you / someone else can light a cyno because of some invisible and arbitrary line in the sand is poor game play. #2 Bookmarks, if these are not updated then this should definitely not happen. #3 The issue of not being able to light a defensive cyno on the edge of a POS, in the case of a titan / super being bumped out, is practically begging to become an exploit itself. Ships will be bumped out of the POS but kept within cyno blocking range and not be able to call for reinforcements. #4 This is ultimately a solution to something which should not have been allowed in the first place. Rather than fixing the mechanics problem (collision bubbles being able to penetrate POS shields) this fix has much wider repercussions, in many cases negative ones. 1. learn how to use your overview. 2. bookmarks are easy to make, oh no the jump bridge moved 25km out, what will i ever do, oh wait i can warp to the bookmark at 20km and land within jump range of the bridge while also making a new bookmark. but hey if i was smart i'd of already made a 300km pounce off the pos so it shouldn't matter anyways.. stop complaining, learn how to play the game.. 3. two part answer.. T2 logistics have a 71.4km rep range, carriers have a 52/57km rep range.. so in laymen terms THAT MEANS YOU WILL ALWAYS BE IN RANGE! 4. ultimately the solution fixes a major game mechanic exploit, is it the perfect fix? no, is it a fix that works with the current engine mechanics? yes. you're complaining about a fix to a game that has existed for 11 years, there is only so much they can do with what currently exists without out having to waste 100's of hours completely rewriting something just so a small portion of players are happy because they are to damn risk adverse. the only negative effect this has is that people will be forced to put their ships at risk if they are using a pos, woopty friggin do.. if you can't handle it then don't fly it. and for the other people complaining about how it'll effect people pos bashing, ion seige blasters hit out to 46.3km without any range scripts, rev hits out to 40km, nag hits out to 53km... that MEANS AT 25 KM YOU ARE STILL IN RANGE. for the love of god(although who loves something that doesn't exist, oh well) you kids need to quit knee jerk reacting to every change CCP makes and actually spend 5 minutes checking things before you cry about it. woooo my brain hurts now, i was forced to actually think, what will i ever do now../sarcasm Anthar Thebess wrote: Large tower 30km shield radius + 25km = 55km from pos. Make it 55km from all towers , as i stated again small and med towers are much easier to bump out. it doesn't matter if it's easier, it's still 25km off the edge of the pos shield not the actual tower whether it's a small or large.. so it's the same exact effect.
Adrie Atticus The Shadow Plague The Bastion 329	Posted - 2014.09.18 09:50:00 - [147] - Quote nvm, read wrong.
Azami Nevinyrall Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 2006	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:01:00 - [148] - Quote You missed the "You cannot use Titan Bridges within 25km of POS shields...let alone inside them" part... EVE needs more Pssshhhh
Kasimir Wulf Ubiquitous Hurt Exodus. 15	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:03:00 - [149] - Quote Azami Nevinyrall wrote: You missed the "You cannot use Titan Bridges within 25km of POS shields...let alone inside them" part... if only that was the case then everything in eve would be great again..
RoCkEt X Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 90	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:10:00 - [150] - Quote RIP bumping stuff off the edge of a forcefield... ever again. This change is poorly thought out at best. So much so i cba to argue the point.

JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:29:00 - [151] - Quote RoCkEt X wrote: RIP bumping stuff off the edge of a forcefield... ever again. Which is good, right? Cause it's an exploit, right?
Azami Nevinyrall Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 2006	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:30:00 - [152] - Quote Kasimir Wulf wrote: Azami Nevinyrall wrote: You missed the "You cannot use Titan Bridges within 25km of POS shields...let alone inside them" part... if only that was the case then everything in eve would be great again.. With one stroke of a keyboard... With one...just one line of code... The Blue Doughnut is instantly killed... Renters will turn into rebels... The vast empty space would be taken by smaller...but dedicated groups! But the tears...the tears would flow like rivers! Flooding everything in its path! Nothing, absolutely nothing would compare to its destructive power! Wiping out thousands of settlements in an instant! .....and it...............it would be beautiful! ..........excuse me, I got something in my eye. EVE needs more Pssshhhh
BigSako Burning Napalm Northern Coalition. 108	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:33:00 - [153] - Quote LOL inb4 stainwaggon re-subs all their titan toons just to find out that they have no more POSes to bridge from.
Aijle Mijleroff Infernal Laboratory Infernal Octopus 43	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:34:00 - [154] - Quote and what about covert cyno? 25km too? this very bad because covert operations very sensitive, Fozzie, you think about this?
Vigilanta S0utherN Comfort DARKNESS. 40	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:41:00 - [155] - Quote JIeoH Mocc wrote: RoCkEt X wrote: RIP bumping stuff off the edge of a forcefield... ever again. Which is good, right? Cause it's an exploit, right? Hint, ther was stuff legitimatly outside of the forcefield that you used to be able to bump away by jumping in caps, or block from getting int he forcefield by jumping in caps, now a cap/super/titan within 25k of the forcefield, but not inside can not be somewhat predictably bumped by a gank cap fleet jump in. Instead of a mechanic that increases legitimate cap kills we are creating a mechanic that actually makes cap kills a bit harder, not to mention that coupled with a mobile cyno inhibitor dreads will be awefull hard to drop on that are on a forcefield edge, let alone carriers repping it. poorly thought out change, to fix 1 problem you have created 15 more, let alone unintended consequences, not to mention you are rush deploying this change not leaving much time for community input and tweaking. Two easier thoughts come to mind- While not optimal, make the titans sphere smaller, makes it harder to jump in on shield edge with a blob and successfully bump, not to mention it would force bridging titans to inch out of the forcefield a bit more. bumping them would be a bit harder but none more so than say a supercarrier, and easier than than that still. this at least has fewer unintended consequences. and/or second, have the bridge increase the titans mass like happens with a sieged dread, they become much more difficult to bump with a conventional ship then - though this would introduce some other unintended consequences, though fewer than your current proposed change. TBH, the issue i have with this change in particular, was instead of asking the community and saying hey we have the issue, we cant easily code in the optimal fix for the problem, but here are some ideas, or do you have ideas on how to fix said problem, you just said oh here were making this really hamfisted change, discuss. This just reminds me of the original frieghtor rigging thread debacle. There were much better ways to go about this. Just my thoughts, dont expect anyone to agree.
Yun Kuai Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop 189	Posted - 2014.09.18 10:45:00 - [156] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? edit: basically I'm wondering if there's additional intended effects I'm not seeing, it's hard to tell what was intended and what was not with this change (besides ending pos bowling). Learn to read. It said it would spawn you outside the range. So you can cyno on top of your poor Titan, but you may just land 25km from it --------------------------------------------------------::::::::::::--:::-----:::---::::::::::::--------------:::----------:::----:::---:::----------------------:::::::-------:::---:::----::::::-------------------:::-----------:::--:::----:::---------------------::::::::::::----:::::::----:::::::::::::-------
Arkon Olacar Bearded BattleBears Brave Collective 385	Posted - 2014.09.18 11:19:00 - [157] - Quote This is not the change to 'fix' the titan bowling 'exploit'. Back to the drawing board please Fozzie, you've created far more problems than you've sold. Warping to zero
Anthar Thebess 696	Posted - 2014.09.18 11:22:00 - [158] - Quote Eve will be better after this change than before. DD from titan will hit target even if you jump those 25km more. Webs from recon will still web capital sitting near pos shields. You want to catch capital fleet near pos - drop 1 carrier carrying hictor , or just bridge some dictors. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Eleanor Wish Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 37	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:02:00 - [159] - Quote Good change, but admit it Fozzie, you're primary reason for doing this was to troll the bookmark managers rather than fix bumping....you evil genius you
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 796	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:17:00 - [160] - Quote Yun Kuai wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? edit: basically I'm wondering if there's additional intended effects I'm not seeing, it's hard to tell what was intended and what was not with this change (besides ending pos bowling). Learn to read. It said it would spawn you outside the range. So you can cyno on top of your poor Titan, but you may just land 25km from it i suggest next time you attempt to seem smart you actually do the reading and don't ever try to correct me again you idiot: CCP Fozzie wrote: After this change, cynos will not be lightable within 25km of the forcefield edge. If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno).

Kyria Stenory ICE is Coming to EVE Goonswarm Federation 6	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:18:00 - [161] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? edit: basically I'm wondering if there's additional intended effects I'm not seeing, it's hard to tell what was intended and what was not with this change (besides ending pos bowling). +1
Worrff Viziam Amarr Empire 14	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:19:00 - [162] - Quote Nice to see the prompt responses from Fozzie addressing the points raised here. Oh wait.........
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 796	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:25:00 - [163] - Quote Worrff wrote: Nice to see the prompt responses from Fozzie addressing the points raised here. Oh wait......... You mean while he would be asleep?
Worrff Viziam Amarr Empire 14	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:33:00 - [164] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Worrff wrote: Nice to see the prompt responses from Fozzie addressing the points raised here. Oh wait......... You mean while he would be asleep? He is sleeping at 1.30 PM ? i want a job like that.

CCP Fozzie C C P C C P Alliance 11280	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:42:00 - [165] - Quote Worrff wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: Worrff wrote: Nice to see the prompt responses from Fozzie addressing the points raised here. Oh wait......... You mean while he would be asleep? He is sleeping at 1.30 PM ? i want a job like that. It's only 12:42 PM. Learn 2 clock. Game Designer \| Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie http://www.twitch.tv/ccp_fozzie/


CCP Fozzie C C P C C P Alliance 11280	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:43:00 - [166] - Quote I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Game Designer \| Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie http://www.twitch.tv/ccp_fozzie/

Belligerent Undesirable 1	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:49:00 - [167] - Quote Wow satisfactory That sure does mean a lot Yep
Azami Nevinyrall Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 2007	Posted - 2014.09.18 12:49:00 - [168] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Now, do the same for Titan Bridging... You know you want too... It'll instantly kill the Blue Doughnut! EVE needs more Pssshhhh
Anthar Thebess 697	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:05:00 - [169] - Quote Azami Nevinyrall wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Now, do the same for Titan Bridging... You know you want too... It'll instantly kill the Blue Doughnut! Don't forget about capital jump range. Block their ability to jump between regions, and force them to use XL sized regional gates. Every one wins! Even blocking ability to bridge between regions could be good. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
BadAssMcKill ElitistOps 878	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:06:00 - [170] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Worrff wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: Worrff wrote: Nice to see the prompt responses from Fozzie addressing the points raised here. Oh wait......... You mean while he would be asleep? He is sleeping at 1.30 PM ? i want a job like that. It's only 12:42 PM. Learn 2 clock. I hear being snarky to your customers is all the rage these days .

Jassmin Joy Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 275	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:10:00 - [171] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Translation: We spoke about some stuff, spoke about this stuff too, liked what we spoke about.
Vol Arm'OOO Imperial Academy Amarr Empire 292	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:13:00 - [172] - Quote With the death of the new cyno bumping mechanics, can we now at least make it so that you cannot bridge from the safety of a pos? Bridging is extremely powerful and largely risk free if done from the safety of a pos with the exception of spias and awoking which the pos doesnt protect against anyways. If folk want to bridge, they should have to at least put the bridging ship at some risk - after all eve's mantra is risk v. reward. I don't play, I just fourm warrior.
Azami Nevinyrall Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 2007	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:15:00 - [173] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Azami Nevinyrall wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Now, do the same for Titan Bridging... You know you want too... It'll instantly kill the Blue Doughnut! Don't forget about capital jump range. Block their ability to jump between regions, and force them to use XL sized regional gates. Every one wins! Even blocking ability to bridge between regions could be good. Actually, ranges are fine! Move the Titans outside POSs for bridging! I'm more then willing to bet every Nullsec CSM will foam at the mouth at the thought of it! EVE needs more Pssshhhh
vikari Association of Commonwealth Enterprises Nulli Secunda 81	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:23:00 - [174] - Quote Fozzie, a few issues this causes that should be considered. Impact to BMs - minor as it might be in the grand scheme of things, we really don't want to remake a hundred plus BMs if we can help it. POS attacking with Dreads - the use of short range guns just became less viable, unless you want to slowboat the distance required to get into or at least close to optimal. Offensive risk management of subcaps - If you are in a subcap fleet it just became safe to attack a POS while hugging the shields, current mechanics let us drop a cyno on a hostile fleet and immediately bubble them, this change would grealy reduce our ability to get bubbles on a fleet before they can at least partially run away. Risk/Benefit of cyno beacons - you're greatly changing this ratio. This might be a good idea, but could lead to them being less likely to be used in favor of simply station cyno characters, and that would result in actually less conflict over all, as the risk would be lower then it is even now with cyno beacons. I understand the problem, but isn't this fix impacting a lot of things so solve one issue? It seems the goal here should be to solve the problem with as minimal impact to other parts of game play as possible.
Anthar Thebess 697	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:25:00 - [175] - Quote No ranges are not fine. From my perspective eve universe should be BIG. When time need to move from one edge of the universe to another is counted in dozen of minutes not dozen of hours (or more) then something is wrong. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
shimiku Black VooDoo Asassins The Kadeshi 21	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:25:00 - [176] - Quote now that we are at it why don't we just add this to station also and kill logistic
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:26:00 - [177] - Quote Azami Nevinyrall wrote: I'm more then willing to bet every Nullsec CSM will foam at the mouth at the thought of it! That's because you use your head for talking out of it, instead of thinking with it. Consider, who will suffer the most from such a thing - a power house that can field a couple of dozens of titans, tens of supercaps and hundreds of caps at will, or some low-sec pirate cove with one-two titans used for bridging? Consider also who'll be the first to reap the "rewards" of such mechanics, the blue doughnut you keep ranting about, or the ones not included in it?
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 797	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:35:00 - [178] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. YOU TEASE
Veng3ance Origin. Black Legion. 38	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:36:00 - [179] - Quote This is a terribly lazy fix. The problem is bumping mechanics, not the range of cynos compared to a force field. You are not even fixing the problem you are slapping a band-aid on and leaving the problem to rot. For one Dreadnaughts will have a hard time getting in optimal range. Secondly, bumping will still happen. Meaning if you jump in near a pos and get an unlucky bump it could stop you from lighting a cyno. What if you are bait? What if you are repping a pos and need to bring in backup? Am I supposed to ping with my carrier now? Solutions like this are why people are leaving the game. Fix your core mechanics or don't waste our time.
Rydra Wong Dark-Rising Executive Outcomes 7	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:44:00 - [180] - Quote Do not agree with this fix. What about the mechanic of lighting a cyno between enemies and the shields? I've used this in the past to stop shield huggers with well placed cyno warpins. how about the fact that you now can't cyno in and bubble a pos, meaning you just shield hug now with a lit exit cyno and no one can trap you or for sub caps just warp off. Not even in range of standard t2 warp disruptors for manual point. This mechanic badly needs to be rethought out. Fix the pos mechanics and the corp permissions which haven't been fixed in what 8 years now? This cyno thing is not a problem that needs fixing at the moment.

Sierra Payne Confederation of Independent Contractors Swamphole 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:47:00 - [181] - Quote Angelica Scatterbrain wrote: I have a crazy idea. How about just fixing the exploit and not screwing with the rest of the game? Weird huh? Or, admit your code is so dorked that you are incapable of fixing the exploit and have to screw with the rest of the game. Guess what, They are fixing it by making it impossible to bump. Is 25km excessive? Possibly. But is it a good change? Yes. Not only does it fix bumping, but it also introduces a slight bit more risk in order to fly the biggest ships. What do we tell every newbro? Don't fly what you can't replace? Yea...
Oh Takashawa Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 54	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:49:00 - [182] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Saying it was satisfactory is all well and good, but what we actually care about is the substance of that conclusion, which is remarkably absent from your update.
Veng3ance Origin. Black Legion. 39	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:50:00 - [183] - Quote Sierra Payne wrote: Angelica Scatterbrain wrote: I have a crazy idea. How about just fixing the exploit and not screwing with the rest of the game? Weird huh? Or, admit your code is so dorked that you are incapable of fixing the exploit and have to screw with the rest of the game. Guess what, They are fixing it by making it impossible to bump. Is 25km excessive? Possibly. But is it a good change? Yes. Not only does it fix bumping, but it also introduces a slight bit more risk in order to fly the biggest ships. What do we tell every newbro? Don't fly what you can't replace? Yea... Actually it reduces risk in most situations. In a game where people are insanely risk-adverse.
Diivil Magellanic Itg Goonswarm Federation 287	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:51:00 - [184] - Quote vikari wrote: Impact to BMs - minor as it might be in the grand scheme of things, we really don't want to remake a hundred plus BMs if we can help it. I know most people posting about the BM thing are not truly serious but in case some actually are.. Just get one corp in your alliance to update all their bookmarks and then copy them to the other corps. I won't go flying around the whole CFC JB network just so that my 5 man corp can have up to date bookmarks. I login my alt in Goonwaffe and copy the BMs, trade and import them to my corp. Takes like 2 minutes.
Heat-seeking Moisture Missile Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 14	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:51:00 - [185] - Quote What can't the POS forcefield merely cancel out the bump mechanic? Suttf outside then can't bump stuff inside. Which seems logical to me you know.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 797	Posted - 2014.09.18 13:56:00 - [186] - Quote I think it would help if we knew what the intended goal here was - obviously part is to fix the pos bowling exploit, but this change seems more far-reaching than you'd need for that and it seems like you're aiming at something else as well. It's hard to tell if this is a good change and make any useful feedback without knowing that.
SFM Hobb3s Wrecking Shots Black Legion. 149	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:01:00 - [187] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Suddenly you have a reason to have an mjd Nestor on standby for Titan rescue ops. If by rescuing means giving the titan the chance to refit likely well before a carrier could warp to it.
SkyFlyer ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 80	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:05:00 - [188] - Quote Jalebi wrote: Bob FromMarketing wrote: Capqu wrote: froths at the mouth I made a table comparing the previous cyno distance from the POS and the current cyno distance from the POS as it stands Previous Range (m)New Range (m) 50025000 100025000 150025000 200025000 250025000 300025000 350025000 400025000 450025000 500025000 550025000 600025000 650025000 700025000 750025000 800025000 850025000 900025000 950025000 1000025000 1050025000 1100025000 1150025000 1200025000 1250025000 1300025000 1350025000 1400025000 1450025000 1500025000 1550025000 1600025000 1650025000 1700025000 1750025000 1800025000 1850025000 1900025000 1950025000 2000025000 2050025000 2100025000 2150025000 2200025000 2250025000 2300025000 2350025000 2400025000 2450025000 2500025000 can you convert this to kilomiles the math was wrong fixed Previous Range (kilomiles)New Range (Kilomiles) 0.00031068559615534.27981 0.00062137119215534.27981 0.00093205678815534.27981 0.00124274238415534.27981 0.0015534279815534.27981 0.00186411357615534.27981 0.00217479917215534.27981 0.00248548476815534.27981 0.00279617036415534.27981 0.0031068559615534.27981 0.00341754155615534.27981 0.00372822715215534.27981 0.00403891274815534.27981 0.00434959834415534.27981 0.0046602839415534.27981 0.00497096953615534.27981 0.00528165513215534.27981 0.00559234072815534.27981 0.00590302632415534.27981 0.0062137119215534.27981 0.00652439751615534.27981 0.00683508311215534.27981 0.00714576870815534.27981 0.00745645430415534.27981 0.007767139915534.27981 0.00807782549615534.27981 0.00838851109215534.27981 0.00869919668815534.27981 0.00900988228415534.27981 0.0093205678815534.27981 0.00963125347615534.27981 0.00994193907215534.27981 0.0102526246715534.27981 0.0105633102615534.27981 0.0108739958615534.27981 0.0111846814615534.27981 0.0114953670515534.27981 0.0118060526515534.27981 0.0121167382415534.27981 0.0124274238415534.27981 0.0127381094415534.27981 0.0130487950315534.27981 0.0133594806315534.27981 0.0136701662215534.27981 0.0139808518215534.27981 0.0142915374215534.27981 0.0146022230115534.27981 0.0149129086115534.27981 0.0152235942 15534.27981 0.0155342798 15534.27981
Parthannun Solette Prime Forces The Methodical Alliance 4	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:19:00 - [189] - Quote so now you cant get an rorq to jump close to an forcefield anymore and so possibly get killed because it takes ages to move the thing
Dirk Action Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 261	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:24:00 - [190] - Quote good thread team

Hairpins Blueprint CBC Interstellar Fidelas Constans 64	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:30:00 - [191] - Quote cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy you wona kill low sec no more jump freighters lol
Alner Greyl Tr0pa de elite. Pandemic Legion 159	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:43:00 - [192] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Hello Fozzie, I have few questions: 1) Why it's more easy to make more troubles than fix code? 2) Where we can read/watch real CSM opinion about this trouble? It's look like "we discussed and I didn't change my mind." 3) How are you gonna solve these troubles: a) Noone can help you when something happened on pos. So you need to pass through tons of bubbles/enemies etc to light a cyno? Or players have to make more cyno toons? b) Black Ops operations. A lot of ppl do it because it's funny to catch something on pos/cynogen/jb whatever. They will need to pass through distance and then take a fight? c) Carrier repping pos. You gave them safety and shiny chances to do whatever they want. d) Short range dreads? Why you give us choice for long range guns only? e) Again hit on logistic. JF/rorqs will lose even little chance to get saved. Why? Why do you hate them? My main question: Why do you, CCP, try to delay solution of the trouble? Tell us: we can't fix pos right now, don't bump titans pls and we've already begun working on fixes. Everyone will be happy.
Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 90	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:46:00 - [193] - Quote A legit solution. Will result in tears from those who want to casually just to a POS, but it all makes logical sense. If they can't fix the issue with the POS shield barrier through coding, which apparently they could not, then this is really the only solution other than to just ignore it.
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 141	Posted - 2014.09.18 14:47:00 - [194] - Quote shimiku wrote: now that we are at it why don't we just add this to station also and kill logistic After w-space got essentially the same treatment in hyperion it would just be fair to extend this to stations. Moving caps via cynos is way to safe. Low and null sec should be a dangerous place.If you don't have enough people to defend a cap you shouldn't be using them. Everyone complaining about this is a carebear and should HTFU. (Did I miss anything? There were so many nullsec shitposters in the wormhole thread - I might have missed some of their useless arguments)
Inslander Wessette primordial star Universal Paranoia Alliance 2	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:12:00 - [195] - Quote Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well right down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there
raging star Circle Of Chaos 7	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:22:00 - [196] - Quote Vhaine Vhindiscar wrote: Terrible change. It's arbitrary and bad mechanics. A bandaid on a problem that really only affects that 1%. How about taking it back to the drawing board and seeing if you can't come up with a solution that doesn't affect ALL of null sec just to fix a problem that really only is an issue for a small minority of the players. Honestly, how long will you let super caps define the play of the entire null sec population? Isn't it time to stop catering to them? Fix the problem, but don't go creating a whole laundry list of issues in the process. Surely, you guys can fix an exploit without resorting to a sledge hammer in the process... So hate to agree, making a change this major affects everyone just to please a few.
LtCol RTButts UK Corp RAZOR Alliance 27	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:38:00 - [197] - Quote Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there lesson one, evey cyno alt is an unsave cyno after he had lit his first cyno. plain and simple. solve this problem and you increase your survivability.
Bugsy VanHalen Society of lost Souls 1056	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:47:00 - [198] - Quote I find this change very interesting. This will certainly shake up capital activities abit, especially if this also applies to Titan bridging, no more poking nose out for bridge. I believe the hardest hit though will be jump freighters though, as you will no longer be able to jump in right next to the sheilds. Slow boating in from 25KM out is not really an option for a JF when you got a lit cyno anouncing you presence. This is going to cause some significant changes to basic EVE mechanics.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 437	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:50:00 - [199] - Quote Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there if only there was some sort of capital ship that could haul 150k+ m^3 and could fit an MWD
El Space Mariachi Love Squad Pasta Syndicate 132	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:56:00 - [200] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there if only there was some sort of capital ship that could haul 150k+ m^3 and could fit an MWD well maybe he doesnt WANT to train a rorqual GOD why cant he just align down in his jf??? gay gamers for jesus

Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 798	Posted - 2014.09.18 15:59:00 - [201] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: if only there was some sort of capital ship that could haul 150k+ m^3 and could fit an MWD no time to figure out how to play the game, too busy replacing "you" with "u" in my posts busy busy busy
Esteban Dragonovic Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation 89	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:00:00 - [202] - Quote I would say a better solution would be to simply exclude physics interactions between ships that are permitted to be inside of the pos shield and those that are not. But that would require you to actually look into that dreaded pos code now wouldn't it?
Skia Aumer Atlas Research Group 91	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:06:00 - [203] - Quote Parthannun Solette wrote: so now you cant get an rorq to jump close to an forcefield anymore and so possibly get killed because it takes ages to move the thing Because Rorquals dont have warp drives. My feedback: I dont like the fix, it reduces situation awareness. Also, carriers delegating fighters at field edge can feel safer now.
Drak Fel Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 55	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:07:00 - [204] - Quote You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km. Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between.
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 142	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:08:00 - [205] - Quote Drak Fel wrote: Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Don't fly in between then?
Overman FinFleet Northern Coalition. 1	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:16:00 - [206] - Quote Really curious why this was thought to be the best solution. Instead of say, increasing the mass of the Titan during bridging to prevent it from being bumped. I understand Occam wasn't Icelandic or anything, but you guys might look into simple solutions for simple problems.
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:30:00 - [207] - Quote I too thought it would be better to say "guyz, don't do this" and then just ban everybody who did it, but meh...
Drak Fel Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 55	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:43:00 - [208] - Quote Jessica Duranin wrote: Drak Fel wrote: Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Don't fly in between then? Because a titan has never bumped a little out of a shield. He should still be permitted to light a cyno to save himself when he is. This is bad for everyone with a super/titan, not just one group.
Skia Aumer Atlas Research Group 91	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:43:00 - [209] - Quote What about this solution? Right now, jump-in point is not legit, if [distance from ship center to POS tower] < [field radius]. Change the rule to: "jump-in point is not legit, if [distance from ship center to POS tower] + [ship radius] < [field radius].
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 800	Posted - 2014.09.18 16:43:00 - [210] - Quote Skia Aumer wrote: Parthannun Solette wrote: so now you cant get an rorq to jump close to an forcefield anymore and so possibly get killed because it takes ages to move the thing Because Rorquals dont have warp drives. My feedback: I dont like the fix, it reduces situation awareness when fighting at POS grid. Also, carriers delegating fighters at field edge can feel safer now. random proposal: for the purposes of drones and YOUR targeting, while in the exclusion zone you count as in the pos shields (so you can be shot at, but not shoot) kills shield-hugging which is a dumb mechanic problematic side effect is it kills unbonused ships from being able to rep pos or pos mods (and since nothing has a bonus to hull reps, ends hull repping) hrmm, may need to rethink that

Moloney Faceless Men 159	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:05:00 - [211] - Quote Kismeteer wrote: This is the worst type of 'CCP doesn't play their own game' solution. Welcome to Hyperion wh changes... We already know the above. But since ye all came over to the wh forum and gave advice. I'll return the favour: get the lube and bend over.
Overman FinFleet Northern Coalition. 1	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:05:00 - [212] - Quote Additionally, I'm curious why the added risk to capitals cynoing outside the pos is now desirable. The entire impetus for this change was SOCO crying about lighting bridges on the edge of POS' being too risky. Was the game mechanic THAT broken before that it needs an ad-hoc fix with far reaching implications? Is this some well thought out change that CCP has been testing for months and contemplating various contingencies for? I don't think so. This is why CCP gets so much crap. This is really an awful change that has not been very well thought out in response to emotional feedback from a titan lost last week. If you want to validate your rule or prevent the "exploit," then just do that. Make a narrowly tailored change and move on making this game better. Issues like these create wastes of time 6 months down the line when CCP realizes, yet again, that it acted too hastily. Ignoring the actual annoyance of this change, take a minute to contemplate the wasted man hours that will go into fixing this issue again when all the ramifications are realized. Those man hours translate to real life money and inefficiencies that affect the bottom line. It's disheartening that someone even has to say this, but Measure Twice Cut Once.
Grath Telkin Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 2546	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:10:00 - [213] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. This thread couldn't get any better if it tried. Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.
True Payne Megatron Heavy Industries Brothers of Tangra 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:12:00 - [214] - Quote You know! I have been playing since 2006 and this is the worst idea CCP has ever came up with! Now every Super/Capital/JF/Roqs will be very vulnerable when jumping in. So now that ohsht cyno means nothing just inside that Exclusion zone!!! [b]How about CCP makes Titans itself have that Exclusion Zone*... Your putting a lazy Band-aid on the Problem. Stop Screwing the rest of eve with these pointless fixes
Overman FinFleet Northern Coalition. 1	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:17:00 - [215] - Quote Grath Telkin wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. This thread couldn't get any better if it tried. WTB Referrendum Call http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recall_election
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 801	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:18:00 - [216] - Quote True Payne wrote: You know! I have been playing since 2006 and this is the worst idea CCP has ever came up with! Now every Super/Capital/JF/Roqs will be very vulnerable when jumping in. So now that ohsht cyno means nothing just inside that Exclusion zone!!! How about CCP makes Titans itself have that Exclusion Zone*... Your putting a lazy Band-aid on the Problem. Stop Screwing the rest of eve with these pointless fixes.. Ships being vulnerable on jump-in isn't a bad thing. Stop acting like a wormholer. It's more if this exclusion zone actually leads to good gameplay that I'm not sure about, this is a really odd change given the only goal that's been publicly stated which makes me think there's more Fozzie is aiming at.
GeeShizzle MacCloud 473	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:19:00 - [217] - Quote Overman wrote: Grath Telkin wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. This thread couldn't get any better if it tried. WTB Referrendum Call http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recall_election tough luck, you should have made your vote count when it could count, instead of being all bitter and vetty
Kismeteer GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 646	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:21:00 - [218] - Quote Will this apply to online and offline pos? Or is a POS bubble necessary to get cyno protection?
Drak Fel Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 55	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:21:00 - [219] - Quote Overman wrote: Grath Telkin wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. This thread couldn't get any better if it tried. WTB Referrendum Call http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recall_election See, and I read read Fozzie's post as, " They talked. I listened. Then did what I wanted to anyway." I'm so cynical.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 801	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:22:00 - [220] - Quote Kismeteer wrote: Will this apply to online and offline pos? Or is a POS bubble necessary to get cyno protection? this is answered in the original post, go read it (only applies to a forcefield, not a stick)

Serotta Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:24:00 - [221] - Quote Why not make is so the pos shield modifies the ships properties so that a ship of the same class outside the pos shields would not be able to bump the ship inside the pos shield far enough for it to leave the pos shields. At the same time the pos shields would buff up the ships acceleration, agility, or whatever.. so it would still be able to fly same inside or outside of the pos shields.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 802	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:31:00 - [222] - Quote Serotta wrote: Why not make is so the pos shield modifies the ship's properties so that a ship of the same class outside the pos shields would not be able to bump the ship inside the pos shield far enough for it to leave the pos shields. At the same time the pos shields would buff up the ships acceleration, agility, or whatever.. so the ship still flies the same inside or outside of the pos shields. because there is no such aoe effect anywhere in eve's coding and doing that would probably cause the servers to crash over and over again?
Alp Khan GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 148	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:43:00 - [223] - Quote Proposed change does not make any sense at all. It creates more problems than the actual Titan bumping problem it is supposed to solve. Fozzie's track record on similar propositions (such as the freighter rebalance fiasco) makes me wonder if Fozzie and the player base are dealing with the same game here. I believe that there are more direct solutions available to CCP for resolving the singular problem that this proposal is supposed to change without hitting up a dead end on the problems of the POS code. I sometimes really wish Fozzie would start coming up with solutions that actually manage to tackle the real problems, instead of breaking a million other things.
Drak Fel Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 55	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:43:00 - [224] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Serotta wrote: Why not make is so the pos shield modifies the ship's properties so that a ship of the same class outside the pos shields would not be able to bump the ship inside the pos shield far enough for it to leave the pos shields. At the same time the pos shields would buff up the ships acceleration, agility, or whatever.. so the ship still flies the same inside or outside of the pos shields. because there is no such aoe effect anywhere in eve's coding and doing that would probably cause the servers to crash over and over again? Actually, the pos shield already creates and area of effect. You don't take damage when you're in one. You can't activate most modules when you're in one. This would just add more affects to the same aoe radius that already exists.
Pj Harvey Ship spinners inc 55	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:50:00 - [225] - Quote Love these changes
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 802	Posted - 2014.09.18 17:54:00 - [226] - Quote Drak Fel wrote: Actually, the pos shield already creates an area of effect. You don't take damage when you're in one. You can't activate most modules when you're in one. This would just add more affects to the same aoe radius that already exists. the pos shield most certainly does not create an area of effect and you can absolutely take damage inside a pos shield (as the many people who have been killed by missiles fired before they were in the shield but hit after can tell you) - you merely cannot be targeted what you're asking would be to change the physics and stats of a ship based on where it is in the solar system, something that does not exist at all to the best of my knowledge in eve's code and would have to be written from scratch
Overman FinFleet Northern Coalition. 2	Posted - 2014.09.18 18:04:00 - [227] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Drak Fel wrote: Actually, the pos shield already creates an area of effect. You don't take damage when you're in one. You can't activate most modules when you're in one. This would just add more affects to the same aoe radius that already exists. the pos shield most certainly does not create an area of effect and you can absolutely take damage inside a pos shield (as the many people who have been killed by missiles fired before they were in the shield but hit after can tell you) - you merely cannot be targeted what you're asking would be to change the physics and stats of a ship based on where it is in the solar system, something that does not exist at all to the best of my knowledge in eve's code and would have to be written from scratch It absolutely does. The simple recognition of the server that XshipinPOS?=1 is that area effect required for the purposes of creating another condition for ships in a pos.
Serotta Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 18:06:00 - [228] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Drak Fel wrote: Actually, the pos shield already creates an area of effect. You don't take damage when you're in one. You can't activate most modules when you're in one. This would just add more affects to the same aoe radius that already exists. the pos shield most certainly does not create an area of effect and you can absolutely take damage inside a pos shield (as the many people who have been killed by missiles fired before they were in the shield but hit after can tell you) - you merely cannot be targeted what you're asking would be to change the physics and stats of a ship based on where it is in the solar system, something that does not exist at all to the best of my knowledge in eve's code and would have to be written from scratch https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Wormhole_environment_effects
Krystyn Serenity Rising LLC Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 184	Posted - 2014.09.18 18:33:00 - [229] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. So tell us what the conclusion was then.
Inslander Wessette primordial star Universal Paranoia Alliance 3	Posted - 2014.09.18 18:36:00 - [230] - Quote El Space Mariachi wrote: Promiscuous Female wrote: Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there if only there was some sort of capital ship that could haul 150k+ m^3 and could fit an MWD well maybe he doesnt WANT to train a rorqual GOD why cant he just align down in his jf??? Ppl who dont use Jf's so i guess .. i'll consider those posts ******** replies .. the reason one wud use a JF is i can jump from High sec to my low sec pos ..if i had to bring my stuff to a rorqual thru a hig-> low sec gate which is mostly camped .. yeah good luck .. doing 50 trips to fuel 5 poses and then move it thru a roqual .. lol migth as well dedicate my eve carrier to running my poses ..

Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 445	Posted - 2014.09.18 18:44:00 - [231] - Quote Inslander Wessette wrote: the reason one wud use a JF is i can jump from High sec to my low sec pos ..if i had to bring my stuff to a rorqual thru a hig-> low sec gate which is mostly camped .. yeah good luck .. doing 50 trips to fuel 5 poses and then move it thru a roqual .. lol might as well dedicate my eve carrier to running my poses .. wow just wow you do know that rorquals can't go into highsec right
Quesa D00M. Northern Coalition. 32	Posted - 2014.09.18 18:57:00 - [232] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I'm curious if this is actually a good idea. The giant cyno exclusion zone has a lot of seriously strange effects, like a titan bumped out of a pos being absolutely boned because it can't cyno in help. Have you considered allowing any cyno to be lit within that zone, but you still land outside it (a mechanic you clearly already have since you implemented it as a fallback) and what's the downside of just doing that instead of this exclusion zone? edit: basically I'm wondering if there's additional intended effects I'm not seeing, it's hard to tell what was intended and what was not with this change (besides ending pos bowling). This proposal actually makes more sense and shows a great deal more forethought into a change and the repercussions.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1920	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:00:00 - [233] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Azami Nevinyrall wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Now, do the same for Titan Bridging... You know you want too... It'll instantly kill the Blue Doughnut! Don't forget about capital jump range. Block their ability to jump between regions, and force them to use XL sized regional gates. Every one wins! Even blocking ability to bridge between regions could be good. that and move the jump bridge to the ihub. that way there is no pos for protection/ defence. also make the JB acessable by anyone... Pretty much i would like to see JB moved from personal alliance based safe transportation to playowned stargates. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1920	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:03:00 - [234] - Quote Vol Arm'OOO wrote: With the death of the new cyno bumping mechanics, can we now at least make it so that you cannot bridge from the safety of a pos? Bridging is extremely powerful and largely risk free if done from the safety of a pos with the exception of spias and awoking which the pos doesnt protect against anyways. If folk want to bridge, they should have to at least put the bridging ship at some risk - after all eve's mantra is risk v. reward. either that or remove titan bridge as a separate move and just make a jumping titan leave a residual wormhole that acts as the titan bridge with enough mass to transport 250 of the largest battleships. that way you increase the risk to hotdrop by huge amounts. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1921	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:10:00 - [235] - Quote shimiku wrote: now that we are at it why don't we just add this to station also and kill logistic yes!!!! 1000 times yes! Imagine you cant just use non kickout waypoint stations to insta cap your ships... every mid point would have to be those scarry safe spot ones where there is a huge risk of getting hot dropped. 0.0 is supposed to be full of risk at every corner... we need to remove all the safe tranport ability to properly nerf power projection. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1921	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:13:00 - [236] - Quote Hairpins Blueprint wrote: cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy you wona kill low sec no more jump freighters lol IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics. JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 142	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:18:00 - [237] - Quote Drak Fel wrote: Jessica Duranin wrote: Drak Fel wrote: Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Don't fly in between then? Because a titan has never bumped a little out of a shield. He should still be permitted to light a cyno to try to save himself when he is. This is bad for everyone with a super/titan, not just one group. You can still have someone else light a cyno outside the 25km range. If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them.
Drak Fel Blackwater USA Inc. Pandemic Legion 59	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:25:00 - [238] - Quote Jessica Duranin wrote: Drak Fel wrote: Jessica Duranin wrote: Drak Fel wrote: Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Don't fly in between then? Because a titan has never bumped a little out of a shield. He should still be permitted to light a cyno to try to save himself when he is. This is bad for everyone with a super/titan, not just one group. You can still have someone else light a cyno outside the 25km range. If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them. Because the only way to keep Eve's subscriber count rising is to create an artificial need for even more alt accounts.
Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 90	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:36:00 - [239] - Quote Drak Fel wrote: You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km. Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Very legitimate point here, unless it is somehow covered by this part of Fozzie's remarks: "If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno)." Not sure how else a cyno could be active if it is a dead zone, unless it's referring to a cyno that is lit and coasts or is bumped into the dead zone.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 806	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:42:00 - [240] - Quote Dirk MacGirk wrote: Drak Fel wrote: You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km. Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Very legitimate point here, unless it is somehow covered by this part of Fozzie's remarks: "If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno)." Not sure how else a cyno could be active if it is a dead zone, unless it's referring to a cyno that is lit and coasts or is bumped into the dead zone. pos was not online when the cyno was lit, so there was no forcefield creating a barrier, then the pos came online

Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 90	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:47:00 - [241] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Dirk MacGirk wrote: Drak Fel wrote: You should really make it so that you can still light a cyno withing 25km but ships jumping in land beyond 25km. Capitals/Supers/Titans in the 25km deadzone will not be able to light a cyno to even attempt to save themselves if they are tackled in between. Very legitimate point here, unless it is somehow covered by this part of Fozzie's remarks: "If for any reason a cyno is active within 25km of a forcefield (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno)." Not sure how else a cyno could be active if it is a dead zone, unless it's referring to a cyno that is lit and coasts or is bumped into the dead zone. pos was not online when the cyno was lit, so there was no forcefield creating a barrier, then the pos came online Yeah. Agreed that is what he meant
DaGreat Cornholio Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2014.09.18 19:54:00 - [242] - Quote Hmm what was it that nullsecers were telling wormholers with regard to the recent wormhole mass spew mechanic here: Forum Post I believe it was HTFU. Sounds like things have come full circle.
Alp Khan GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 149	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:04:00 - [243] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Hairpins Blueprint wrote: cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy you wona kill low sec no more jump freighters lol IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics. JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship. While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you? You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:11:00 - [244] - Quote I have no fundamental problem with ending jumping to docking rings (though you'd need to do some thinking about if jump freighters would need a corresponding buff of some kind), but it seems silly to extend the discussion that far without figuring out what the goals are here.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:13:00 - [245] - Quote Alp Khan wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Hairpins Blueprint wrote: cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy you wona kill low sec no more jump freighters lol IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics. JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship. While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you? You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision. So according to you no one lived in 0.0 before red moon rising? There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Alp Khan GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 149	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:16:00 - [246] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Alp Khan wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Hairpins Blueprint wrote: cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy you wona kill low sec no more jump freighters lol IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics. JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship. While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you? You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision. So according to you no one lived in 0.0 before red moon rising? Null was a different place with different variables in logistics before Red Moon Rising. CCP moved away from that vision, to the current vision. Now, CCP has another vision that they are building towards with the player built stargates and all, but that is not a discussion pertaining to this forum thread.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:18:00 - [247] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I have no fundamental problem with ending jumping to docking rings (though you'd need to do some thinking about if jump freighters would need a corresponding buff of some kind), but it seems silly to extend the discussion that far without figuring out what the goals are here. I know people wont like it but IMO. Only tech 1 freighters should be able to hold regular non packaged items. I would the make jump freighters have a 4million m3 sma instead. If you want to import items up the 0.0 pipe from jita then you should need an escort fleet like in 2007. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:22:00 - [248] - Quote Alp Khan wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Alp Khan wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Hairpins Blueprint wrote: cynogen/jb i guess no one cares but station? oh boy you wona kill low sec no more jump freighters lol IMO jumping a ship jumping should be the same risk as using a stargate. if its not then there is a major problem in the mechanics. JB network/titan jumping/ jump drives are supposed to save time not the risk of loosing the ship. While at it, why don't you ask CCP for a button to instantly teleport you on top of nearest JF in null space and automatically get it tackled for you? You are not making any sense. Nobody would live in null if logistics was tangled with your weird vision. So according to you no one lived in 0.0 before red moon rising? Null was a different place with different variables in logistics before Red Moon Rising. CCP moved away from that vision, to the current vision. Now, CCP has another vision that they are building towards with the player built stargates and all, but that is not a discussion pertaining to this forum thread. You mean null sec was a fun place back then. Logistics is one of tge main problems with emipre sprawl. Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec... There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 143	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:38:00 - [249] - Quote Drak Fel wrote: Jessica Duranin wrote: You can still have someone else light a cyno outside the 25km range. If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them. Because the only way to keep Eve's subscriber count rising is to create the artificial need for even more alt accounts? Yep. They already did it to w-space. Now it's your turn to feel the pain.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:52:00 - [250] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: I have no fundamental problem with ending jumping to docking rings (though you'd need to do some thinking about if jump freighters would need a corresponding buff of some kind), but it seems silly to extend the discussion that far without figuring out what the goals are here. I know people wont like it but IMO. Only tech 1 freighters should be able to hold regular non packaged items. I would the make jump freighters have a 4million m3 sma instead. If you want to import items up the 0.0 pipe from jita then you should need an escort fleet like in 2007. freighter ops were stupid as all ******* hell in 2007 and have gotten no better since plus the thing that carries packaged ships already exists, it's called a carrier

Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 20:54:00 - [251] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec... the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:02:00 - [252] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec... the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content so you are saying that the current stagnation of null sec is contributed threw safe logistics and if this was changed would act as a paragim shift in the way 0.0 works? There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:06:00 - [253] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec... the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content so you are saying that the current stagnation of null sec is contributed threw safe logistics and if this was changed would act as a paragim shift in the way 0.0 works? i am saying what i posted, not whatever nonsense you understood logistics that exist in a way that permits transport of goods to and from highsec in volumes and effort levels that only jump freighters can supply is an absolute necessity for any content in 0.0 you can tweak the safety in which they do so (though that is an increase in effort and can cause issues if not balanced) but the idea of going back to freighter ops is one of those mind-bogglingly stupid ideas only ever put forth by people who have never been on a freighter op
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:09:00 - [254] - Quote it also requires a stupendous amount of poor thinking to think that freighter ops would benefit the little guy we could do freighter ops: the various small groups we fight who live in npc null could not (and would quickly run out of stuff)
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:18:00 - [255] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Jf are some of the most important components of 0.0 empires yet they do not generate content and do not die that often outside of low/high sec... the content that does exist in 0.0 exists only because of jump freighters, and although there's little content in killing or saving them they are a necessary factor in any other content so you are saying that the current stagnation of null sec is contributed threw safe logistics and if this was changed would act as a paragim shift in the way 0.0 works? i am saying what i posted, not whatever nonsense you understood logistics that exist in a way that permits transport of goods to and from highsec in volumes and effort levels that only jump freighters can supply is an absolute necessity for any content in 0.0 you can tweak the safety in which they do so (though that is an increase in effort and can cause issues if not balanced) but the idea of going back to freighter ops is one of those mind-bogglingly stupid ideas only ever put forth by people who have never been on a freighter op dude back in 07 were the most fun i have had ni 0.0 doing freighter ops. Having to berak threw gate camps... each jump was a thrill. it lead to great fights and loads of fun. Hell i even remember before all the jump bridge nonsence having to take a iteron V filled with plush drone goo threw 14x and avioding burn eden gate camps... those days were truely the best in eve. and no having basically risk free logistics does not lead to fun. By making JF logistics risky will be great for 0.0... for 1 it will incentify players to have local hubs instead of just jita. and 2 it will generate heck loads of content for pirates and null sec players... its really a win win. I just think its rather ironic that a 0.0 sov guy would claim that 0.0 logistics should be less risky then high sec. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:24:00 - [256] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: dude back in 07 were the most fun i have had ni 0.0 doing freighter ops. and no having basically risk free logistics does not lead to fun. By making JF logistics risky will be great for 0.0... for 1 it will incentify players to have local hubs instead of just jita. and 2 it will generate heck loads of content for pirates and null sec players... its really a win win. I just think its rather ironic that a 0.0 sov guy would claim that 0.0 logistics should be less risky then high sec. man if the most fun you had in 2007 was freighter ops i hope you got the mental health treatment you needed because that's just a horrible life to be living, a completely pleasureless year is a sign something is seriously wrong i have had to organize and attend freighter ops recently - short ones, relatively speaking - and every bit of it sucked. there were no redeeming features whatsoever. you cannot simply rely on local hubs because the eve economy is set up to require trading: ice, moon minerals, and regular minerals are regional. you simply must import low-ends, non-regional moon minerals, and the non-local isotopes at a bare minimum. that's not even including other stuff like datacores, faction mods, deadspace mods, decryptors and the like that all must be imported from somewhere else but aren't as big volume-wise crius made it a lot more managable to do local production so the need for JFs is (hopefully) dwindling somewhat - I know we've turned from a net importer of t2 ships to a net exporter. but that doesn't mean we can survive without logistical lines to empire: you end jfs and we'll move to torrinos and supply ourselves with npc freighters like i said i've got no fundamental opposition to making jfing somewhat riskier by making it no longer possible to cyno onto docking rings, but the idea of freighter ops as the standard for logitics is madness
SFM Hobb3s Wrecking Shots Black Legion. 150	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:26:00 - [257] - Quote I'm not going to point fingers but I found this announcement hilarious after a mass petition was submitted a week ago for shenanigans involving bumping your own cyno carrier into your pos shields for lulz. I guess I'm lulzing now.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 447	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:29:00 - [258] - Quote SFM Hobb3s wrote: I'm not going to point fingers but I found this announcement hilarious after a mass petition was submitted a week ago for shenanigans involving bumping your own cyno carrier into your pos shields for lulz. I guess I'm lulzing now. you seem to be unfamiliar with how we play eve: online, a spaceship game
Dread Nanana Action Super Dupper Test Corp 29	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:46:00 - [259] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: you cannot simply rely on local hubs because the eve economy is set up to require trading: ice, moon minerals, and regular minerals are regional. you simply must import low-ends, non-regional moon minerals, and the non-local isotopes at a bare minimum. that's not even including other stuff like datacores, faction mods, deadspace mods, decryptors and the like that all must be imported from somewhere else but aren't as big volume-wise What? There is no Veldspar in 0.0? I think you may be wrong on that! I think Chribba can confirm that there is veldspar in 0.0.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 447	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:47:00 - [260] - Quote Dread Nanana wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: you cannot simply rely on local hubs because the eve economy is set up to require trading: ice, moon minerals, and regular minerals are regional. you simply must import low-ends, non-regional moon minerals, and the non-local isotopes at a bare minimum. that's not even including other stuff like datacores, faction mods, deadspace mods, decryptors and the like that all must be imported from somewhere else but aren't as big volume-wise What? There is no Veldspar in 0.0? I think you may be wrong on that! I think Chribba can confirm that there is veldspar in 0.0. hella offtopic but even completely discounting minerals, you still have to deal with the other crap he talked about 0.0 cannot exist in a vacuum, the whole of the economy is predicated on inter-regional trade

Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.18 21:50:00 - [261] - Quote SFM Hobb3s wrote: I'm not going to point fingers but I found this announcement hilarious after a mass petition was submitted a week ago for shenanigans involving bumping your own cyno carrier into your pos shields for lulz. I guess I'm lulzing now. you know i suspect the actual impetus was the bowling titans out of pos, not cyno carriers using a trick that's existed since 2007
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 22:04:00 - [262] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: man if the most fun you had in 2007 was freighter ops i hope you got the mental health treatment you needed because that's just a horrible life to be living, a completely pleasureless year is a sign something is seriously wrong i have had to organize and attend freighter ops recently - short ones, relatively speaking - and every bit of it sucked. there were no redeeming features whatsoever. you cannot simply rely on local hubs because the eve economy is set up to require trading: ice, moon minerals, and regular minerals are regional. you simply must import low-ends, non-regional moon minerals, and the non-local isotopes at a bare minimum. that's not even including other stuff like datacores, faction mods, deadspace mods, decryptors and the like that all must be imported from somewhere else but aren't as big volume-wise crius made it a lot more managable to do local production so the need for JFs is (hopefully) dwindling somewhat - I know we've turned from a net importer of t2 ships to a net exporter. but that doesn't mean we can survive without logistical lines to empire: you end jfs and we'll move to torrinos and supply ourselves with npc freighters like i said i've got no fundamental opposition to making jfing somewhat riskier by making it no longer possible to cyno onto docking rings, but the idea of freighter ops as the standard for logitics is madness True enough about ICE and local moon mins that you simply cant get in each region. though this could be fixed by making ice belts more random in the type of ice they have and adding more r8 and r32 moons to non racial space. I am sure the warp speed changes have made frieghters ops rather dull incomparion so what they were back in the day. For me the ops typically lead to content in form of being chaced or leading to fights. The best was when FREGE had to leave its space and we did a 15 frieghter escape op... that was so freaky i almost had a heart attack. i do agree removing the JF ability to jump to POS but i think think this should be enhaced to outposts too. that would give us the risk of old school frighter ops without killing todays jf There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 22:09:00 - [263] - Quote Dread Nanana wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: you cannot simply rely on local hubs because the eve economy is set up to require trading: ice, moon minerals, and regular minerals are regional. you simply must import low-ends, non-regional moon minerals, and the non-local isotopes at a bare minimum. that's not even including other stuff like datacores, faction mods, deadspace mods, decryptors and the like that all must be imported from somewhere else but aren't as big volume-wise What? There is no Veldspar in 0.0? I think you may be wrong on that! I think Chribba can confirm that there is veldspar in 0.0. hes talking about regional ice mins and regional r32 mins. though this could be solved with ring mining and making ice mins non regional. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1922	Posted - 2014.09.18 22:19:00 - [264] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: hella offtopic but even completely discounting minerals, you still have to deal with the other crap he talked about 0.0 cannot exist in a vacuum, the whole of the economy is predicated on inter-regional trade is that not part of the problem? i think if it was actually inter-regional trade that would be awesome... but inreality dont the major groupd n3/pl/cfc just end up taking all the regional moon mins in low sec anyways? if there was some ability so that this was not actionable... like force projection nerfs so they cant protect all the low sec moons. would be a step in the right direction to impliment real inter-regional trade. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
oohthey ioh Republic University Minmatar Republic 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 22:51:00 - [265] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno). am i the only one read it?
oohthey ioh Republic University Minmatar Republic 23	Posted - 2014.09.18 22:58:00 - [266] - Quote Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there CCP Fozzie wrote: (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno).
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 808	Posted - 2014.09.19 00:05:00 - [267] - Quote oohthey ioh wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: (if the cyno was lit before the password was entered for instance) then any ships jumping to that cyno will appear within 5km of a point that is a minimum of 25km from the forcefield (instead of appearing around the cyno). am i the only one read it? no, but im going to bet you were the only person who misinterpreted it in whatever way you just did
Captain StringfellowHawk Forsaken Reavers Rim Worlds Protectorate 153	Posted - 2014.09.19 00:43:00 - [268] - Quote Azami Nevinyrall wrote: Anthar Thebess wrote: Azami Nevinyrall wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Now, do the same for Titan Bridging... You know you want too... It'll instantly kill the Blue Doughnut! Don't forget about capital jump range. Block their ability to jump between regions, and force them to use XL sized regional gates. Every one wins! Even blocking ability to bridge between regions could be good. Actually, ranges are fine! Move the Titans outside POSs for bridging! I'm more then willing to bet every Nullsec CSM will foam at the mouth at the thought of it! Agreed Do the same restriction for Cyno's as for Bridging. X amount away from the Shield. If EVE is truly supposed to be a game of RISK, do it across the board.
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 5875	Posted - 2014.09.19 01:18:00 - [269] - Quote Finally, a move towards putting risk and difficulty back into null sec logistics and fleet movement. Jump freighter logistics and easy long distance movement of capital assets has been crippling the game for far too long. An excellent first step, hopefully only the first of many. Keep this up and our noble null sec players might actually start enjoying the game again, despite what they think at the moment. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
Vigilanta S0utherN Comfort DARKNESS. 40	Posted - 2014.09.19 02:13:00 - [270] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Finally, a move towards putting risk and difficulty back into null sec logistics and fleet movement. Jump freighter logistics and easy long distance movement of capital assets has been crippling the game for far too long. An excellent first step, hopefully only the first of many. Keep this up and our noble null sec players might actually start enjoying the game again, despite what they think at the moment. Yea, except this change adds zero risk to the game, it in fact makes nullsec unironically safer, by creating a larger permanent cyno jamming effect around pos shields. The changes should be focused around the core issue, titan bump field mechanics, not poses or cynos. Anyone who think this is a change that adds risk in the game, does not understand how to use a cyno beacon properly, if at all. I in fact will spell it out to you since you don't seem to understand. Step 1, creat bookmark @ warp distance from the beacon, with your pos shield in the middle Step 2: jump in cap Step 3: warp to bookmark at range, land in pos shield

Caldess The Executives Executive Outcomes 4	Posted - 2014.09.19 02:52:00 - [271] - Quote Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there Please by all means stop posting my eyes are bleeding. but im a nice guy so i solve your pubbie problem. throw away that cyno inhib and scan inhibitor no one needs that **. Take a noobship fit a cyno and 2 webs. Make a bookmark 200 of one of you poses (you can literally make a bookmark anywhere in system) . warp to bookmark light cyno Jump JF in fleetwarp JF to a POS @ 10 and web the freighter. that leaves anyone like 5 seconds (its actually less but who gives a ) to catch your JF. Just because you lost your illusion of safty because you can no longer light the cyno right next to the shields doesnt mean you were ever safe while doing so. So in the end what changes for you? Nothing..you might have to do some extra work, but if some work is to much for you. Then for the love of ***** god you should not run any towers anyways.
Caldess The Executives Executive Outcomes 4	Posted - 2014.09.19 02:55:00 - [272] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Finally, a move towards putting risk and difficulty back into null sec logistics and fleet movement. Jump freighter logistics and easy long distance movement of capital assets has been crippling the game for far too long. An excellent first step, hopefully only the first of many. Keep this up and our noble null sec players might actually start enjoying the game again, despite what they think at the moment. Please explain yourself why this in any way stops me from moving my 250 man cap fleet from the North to the South just a second slower than i can now? And while you are on it explain to me why Jump Freighter logistics (which you obviously never did) will be any harder now?
Caldess The Executives Executive Outcomes 4	Posted - 2014.09.19 03:10:00 - [273] - Quote vikari wrote: Fozzie, a few issues this causes that should be considered. POS attacking with Dreads - the use of short range guns just became less viable, unless you want to slowboat the distance required to get into or at least close to optimal. Risk/Benefit of cyno beacons - you're greatly changing this ratio. This might be a good idea, but could lead to them being less likely to be used in favor of simply station cyno characters, and that would result in actually less conflict over all, as the risk would be lower then it is even now with cyno beacons. I understand the problem, but isn't this fix impacting a lot of things so solve one issue? It seems the goal here should be to solve the problem with as minimal impact to other parts of game play as possible. If you cant think of a way how you can cyno in on a tower grid and get your dreads into optimal distance of the tower without slowboating (hint: warp?!) then you shouldnt shoot at them. Or tell all your pilots to train into Pheonixes im sure i can find enough people who would trade their phoenix for a nag or a moros ;) Not to help you but to stop me teasing them. Please explain to me why the simple fact that beacons get moved 25km will change anything when i jump to it? right now i do it like : jump blind to the beacon (because who needs a scout) warp to my bookmark @ 100 after the patch i do it like : jump blind to the beacon (because who needs a scout) warp to my bookmark @ 100. Can you find the difference? If yes then please let me know. im always open for new things
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1923	Posted - 2014.09.19 03:39:00 - [274] - Quote Caldess wrote: right now i do it like : jump blind to the beacon (because who needs a scout) warp to my bookmark @ 100 after the patch i do it like : jump blind to the beacon (because who needs a scout) warp to my bookmark @ 100. Can you find the difference? If yes then please let me know. im always open for new things Anyone else sense the inspiration for clarion call v? Cloaky dictor Cyno ? Profit There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Caldess The Executives Executive Outcomes 4	Posted - 2014.09.19 03:51:00 - [275] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Caldess wrote: right now i do it like : jump blind to the beacon (because who needs a scout) warp to my bookmark @ 100 after the patch i do it like : jump blind to the beacon (because who needs a scout) warp to my bookmark @ 100. Can you find the difference? If yes then please let me know. im always open for new things Anyone else sense the inspiration for clarion call v? Cloaky dictor Cyno ? Profit Yea i should have known better before posting something ironical here. But i will edit it to prevent further irritation. However since you are busy with your feighter ops i could also just give no fucks and jump blind ;)
Inslander Wessette primordial star Universal Paranoia Alliance 3	Posted - 2014.09.19 04:08:00 - [276] - Quote Caldess wrote: Inslander Wessette wrote: Dear CCP fozzie, I'll give a situation which u will solve for me ? Assuming U own 5 poses in a system say in "Khanid" region say "Upt" which has no stations 3 jumps out . And u wanna do maintenance on ur pos .. fuel , taking moon goo etc .. So u cyno in ur JF 150km from the tower cos i'm sure ur not gonna slow boat 25km in a Rhea into the shields.. u use an alt to deploy Cyno Jammer , Scan inhibitor yada yada yada .. U even use a Rapier to web ur JF to warp from 150km . Le me scouting systems .. see u doing this i pass by .. i jus add u to watch list . 1 month later .. U do the same thing .. jus that i'll b having a 30 man ishtar fleet with 6 guardians cyoned in the adjacent system.. enuf to kill u b4 the pos guns even target us .. cos u cant call back up thru cyno ..cos ur own cyno jammer is up and running for good effect . Ur rapier is toast as well . ur pos goes outta fuel soon cos ofc u cant fuel it buddy . Might as well write down ur pos to me . cos if u are gonna run 10 jumps to high sec in an iteron 5 with moon goo and fuel i'm gonna enjoy camping u . CCP trolling on the little guys as usual . guys who are about to face this situation - end subscription as soon as possible best solution there is . or join a power block u'll eventually get there Please by all means stop posting my eyes are bleeding. However im a nice guy so i solve your pubbie problem. throw away that cyno inhib and scan inhibitor no one needs that **. Take a noobship fit a cyno and 2 webs. Make a bookmark 200 of one of you towers (you can literally make safespot anywhere in system and us that) . warp to bookmark light cyno Jump JF in fleetwarp JF to a POS @ 10 and web the freighter. that leaves anyone like 5 seconds (its actually less but who gives a ) to catch your JF. Just because you lost your illusion of safty because you can no longer light the cyno right next to the shields doesnt mean you were ever safe while doing so. So in the end what changes for you? Nothing..you might have to do some extra work, but if some work is to much for you. Then for the love of ***** god you should not run any towers anyways. Lol do it in SISI and post it .. all usless talk and babbles .. from the point of lighting cyno - JF jumping - Rapier decloaking - Targeting - Inititating warp - 5 sec my ass.. u have been playing the game wrong ..sadly .. lol when u lose ur Jf's i'll make sure to link it in KB ...
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1923	Posted - 2014.09.19 04:26:00 - [277] - Quote Caldess wrote: Yea i should have known better before posting something ironical here. But i will edit it to prevent further irritation. However since you are busy with your feighter ops i could also just give no fucks and jump blind ;) i still say there should be a standard ironic font. the one thing i liked about the old system of frieghter ops was that the "big guys" would live closer to lowsec/hi sec and leave the deep space for us small guys... as you said who wants to go that many jumps amirite? now adays every 0.0 system can be reached with less risk then undocking from Jita. plus you might poke fun at me but back in the day you constantly had stuff to do that was not just roams and strat ops. by escorting the frighters you were being involved in helping your little empire grow. it meant something i remember when everyone belt ratted and there were miners everywhere and vegabonds trying to kill everyone. it was fun saving your buddy from a rat or fight off with the kitchen sink in system from a roaming gang. it was a great time before SRP when loosing your domi meant something. those times were great because you could have escalating pvp without the batphone... There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Falin Whalen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 723	Posted - 2014.09.19 05:45:00 - [278] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Caldess wrote: Yea i should have known better before posting something ironical here. But i will edit it to prevent further irritation. However since you are busy with your feighter ops i could also just give no fucks and jump blind ;) i still say there should be a standard ironic font. the one thing i liked about the old system of frieghter ops was that the "big guys" would live closer to lowsec/hi sec and leave the deep space for us small guys... as you said who wants to go that many jumps amirite? now adays every 0.0 system can be reached with less risk then undocking from Jita. plus you might poke fun at me but back in the day you constantly had stuff to do that was not just roams and strat ops. by escorting the frighters you were being involved in helping your little empire grow. it meant something i remember when everyone belt ratted and there were miners everywhere and vegabonds trying to kill everyone. it was fun saving your buddy from a rat or fight off with the kitchen sink in system from a roaming gang. it was a great time before SRP when loosing your domi meant something. those times were great because you could have escalating pvp without the batphone... Dude, You got some really wicked rose colored glasses there. Freighter ops were boring unfun shite, and if they did become "exciting" you done goofed. Belt ratting was the only option before Dominion, and after the Drone regions opened up you would be stupid to mine in nullsec. Stop lying about how "great it was" in the past. We did it in the past because it was necessary, not because it was "fun." I'm glad the unfun shitefest is dead and buried. The only people who want to go back to those "glory days" have a real problem in the way they remember things, and should seek medical help for their impaired memory. "it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka-á
Alvatore DiMarco Capricious Endeavours Ltd 2694	Posted - 2014.09.19 06:57:00 - [279] - Quote Azami Nevinyrall wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. Now, do the same for Titan Bridging... You know you want too... It'll instantly kill the Blue Doughnut! I don't know about instantly killing it, but I agree that titan and blops bridging being restricted to >25km of a POS would be an amazing and extremely amusing change that would really "shake up the meta" as CCP likes to put it. It certainly wouldn't be bad for the health of nullsec in any possible way. At the very least, prod the CSM about it. Come on, Fozzie. You know you want to do it. I know you want to do it. Everyone knows you want to do it. Pull the trigger.
I dont troll Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation 19	Posted - 2014.09.19 08:26:00 - [280] - Quote Came expecting **** tons of nullbear tears!!! Wasn't too disappointed however you nullbears are slacking - go look at the whinethread of dirty wormholers and the kick-from-WH mechanic that's how you whine

Thatt Guy Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 117	Posted - 2014.09.19 08:40:00 - [281] - Quote This actually makes sense. GJ for finally fixing something. Haters gonna hate, Trolls gonna troll.
Tora Bushido EVE Corporation 987654321-POP The Marmite Collective 1240	Posted - 2014.09.19 10:25:00 - [282] - Quote Where is that 1000 MN Afterburner ? YOU EITHER LOVE US OR WE HATE YOU - ADAPT OR DIE - DELETE THE WEAK
Arya Regnar Darwins Right Hand 586	Posted - 2014.09.19 11:39:00 - [283] - Quote CCP screwed WH guys over and added basically same type of mechanic. About 3% of them liked it. CCP does same thing to null. THIS MUST BE CHANGED, WE MUST SAVE NULLSEC. EvE-Mail me if you need anything.
Worrff Viziam Amarr Empire 15	Posted - 2014.09.19 11:50:00 - [284] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Worrff wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: Worrff wrote: Nice to see the prompt responses from Fozzie addressing the points raised here. Oh wait......... You mean while he would be asleep? He is sleeping at 1.30 PM ? i want a job like that. It's only 12:42 PM. Learn 2 clock. LOL Learn to listen to the players. It would be a refreshing change.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 810	Posted - 2014.09.19 12:29:00 - [285] - Quote Arya Regnar wrote: CCP screwed WH guys over and added basically same type of mechanic. About 3% of them liked it. CCP does same thing to null. THIS MUST BE CHANGED, WE MUST SAVE NULLSEC. we're not all SOMEONE HAS MOVED MY CHEESE aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa the vast majority of the response is positive, there's just a minor tweak to the idea to eliminate some odd and probably unintended effects necessary (or some explanation of the goals so we can suggest changes that meet those as well) if we were wormholers this thread would be 100 pages of unsub threats and poorly spelled ranting instead of a lot of "good idea! just needs a tweak"
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.19 13:08:00 - [286] - Quote Fozzie, would you be so kind to comment on whether the NC. guys that have taken part in the killing of Graham Jackson's Avatar are going to be punished, now that the titan was restored and the exploit is being fixed?
Absolutely Not Analt Caldari Provisions Caldari State 139	Posted - 2014.09.19 13:50:00 - [287] - Quote JIeoH Mocc wrote: Fozzie, would you be so kind to comment on whether the NC. guys that have taken part in the killing of Graham Jackson's Avatar are going to be punished, now that the titan was restored and the exploit is being fixed? Since CCP rarely comments on specific punishments regarding specific players, I'm gonna look into my crystal ball and say No, he probably won't be commenting on that. Eve is a multi player game.-áAnd you are the content. - Ralph King-Griffin Being meh at two things is not better than being great at one. - Lugh Crow-Slave
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:00:00 - [288] - Quote Can your crystal ball shed some light on my question then?
S'No Flake Brave Newbies Inc. Brave Collective 40	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:10:00 - [289] - Quote Krystyn wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: I've been in meetings with the CSM all morning, and amongst all the topics we did some further discussion around this change taking the public feedback into account. The conclusion of the discussion was satisfactory for all parties. So tell us what the conclusion was then. I think he already told you the conclusion. You just have to inject and train comprehension skill to lvl 1!
JIeoH Mocc brotherhood of desman Southern Federation 282	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:12:00 - [290] - Quote You people aren't any fun. AT ALL.

Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 5876	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:36:00 - [291] - Quote Vigilanta wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Finally, a move towards putting risk and difficulty back into null sec logistics and fleet movement. Jump freighter logistics and easy long distance movement of capital assets has been crippling the game for far too long. An excellent first step, hopefully only the first of many. Keep this up and our noble null sec players might actually start enjoying the game again, despite what they think at the moment. Yea, except this change adds zero risk to the game, it in fact makes nullsec unironically safer, by creating a larger permanent cyno jamming effect around pos shields. The changes should be focused around the core issue, titan bump field mechanics, not poses or cynos. Anyone who think this is a change that adds risk in the game, does not understand how to use a cyno beacon properly, if at all. I in fact will spell it out to you since you don't seem to understand. Step 1, creat bookmark @ warp distance from the beacon, with your pos shield in the middle Step 2: jump in cap Step 3: warp to bookmark at range, land in pos shield The fact that you need to take that extra step adds an element of risk that was not present before. You should probably consider how a prepared enemy can disrupt your proposed method... it wouldn't be difficult. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1642	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:46:00 - [292] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Caldess wrote: Yea i should have known better before posting something ironical here. But i will edit it to prevent further irritation. However since you are busy with your feighter ops i could also just give no fucks and jump blind ;) i still say there should be a standard ironic font. the one thing i liked about the old system of frieghter ops was that the "big guys" would live closer to lowsec/hi sec and leave the deep space for us small guys... as you said who wants to go that many jumps amirite? now adays every 0.0 system can be reached with less risk then undocking from Jita. plus you might poke fun at me but back in the day you constantly had stuff to do that was not just roams and strat ops. by escorting the frighters you were being involved in helping your little empire grow. it meant something i remember when everyone belt ratted and there were miners everywhere and vegabonds trying to kill everyone. it was fun saving your buddy from a rat or fight off with the kitchen sink in system from a roaming gang. it was a great time before SRP when loosing your domi meant something. those times were great because you could have escalating pvp without the batphone... yup 0.0 was trillion times more interestign back then. Jump freighters and supercapitals (at least those beign so cheap to build) were the largest mistakes in additions that ccp ever made to this game. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 5876	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:48:00 - [293] - Quote Caldess wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Finally, a move towards putting risk and difficulty back into null sec logistics and fleet movement. Jump freighter logistics and easy long distance movement of capital assets has been crippling the game for far too long. An excellent first step, hopefully only the first of many. Keep this up and our noble null sec players might actually start enjoying the game again, despite what they think at the moment. Please explain yourself why this in any way stops me from moving my 250 man cap fleet from the North to the South just a second slower than i can now? And while you are on it explain to me why Jump Freighter logistics (which you obviously never did) will be any harder now? Any time you bring that fleet into a POS you're going to have to take an extra (unprotected) jump to get inside the POS shields, which adds a layer of vulnerability (albeit a small one). As a small first step, it's a good one.... hopefully not the last one. Good game play comes from activities being risky, not from activities being easy... and right now it is far too safe and easy to move a cap fleet (or jump freighter) anywhere you like. It's ironic, people mock those that say yes to the though of needing to do freighter ops again to move logistics out to null. And yet those freighter ops used to provide more good fights in a single night than you currently see in Null in a week or more. Harder and more time consuming? Yes. More fun, more fights, more unexpected surprises (both good and bad)? Absolutely. For those that claim they never got a fight transporting goods back and forth to null in a freighter op either: 1: Never actually did one. 2: Did one or two, got bored halfway through and logged off (conveniently forgetting to mention that part). 3: Had opponents so wimpy at that time you wouldn't get a good fight no matter what you did. Time to stop listening to your lazy industry pilots. If you want to have more fun, let CCP start interjecting some of the risk back into null sec daily activities. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 5876	Posted - 2014.09.19 14:54:00 - [294] - Quote Arya Regnar wrote: CCP screwed WH guys over and added basically same type of mechanic. About 3% of them liked it. CCP does same thing to null. THIS MUST BE CHANGED, WE MUST SAVE NULLSEC. Heh, try not to make the mistake of believing that a long thread actually equates to the majority of the affected players. Most often that is not the case. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 55	Posted - 2014.09.19 15:10:00 - [295] - Quote The biggest issue I have with this is that the exclusion zone prevents cynos from being lit at all, instead of just allowing it but placing incoming ships 25+km. Titans dying without being able to bring in backup after being bumped out is less content generation than a titan being bumped out and bringing a fleet in to help. Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]
Ruse Lander M. Corp Engineering Fatal Ascension 18	Posted - 2014.09.19 15:16:00 - [296] - Quote I don't know very much about coding, but if I were tasked with this problem I would work along the lines of doing a collision check based on the landing coordinates for incoming ships (allowing for ship radial size) and the POS coordinates (plus forcefield radius). If true then invert, rotate, or randomize the landing coordinate until the collision check is false. I believe this would be an actual fix to the issue instead of the jury-rigging the announced change feels like.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 815	Posted - 2014.09.19 15:22:00 - [297] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Any time you bring that fleet into a POS you're going to have to take an extra (unprotected) jump to get inside the POS shields, which adds a layer of vulnerability (albeit a small one). As a small first step, it's a good one.... hopefully not the last one. Good game play comes from activities being risky, not from activities being easy... and right now it is far too safe and easy to move a cap fleet (or jump freighter) anywhere you like. The only time you'd ever do this would be if there were simply no lowsec stations that you could route through whatsoever, because you'd much rather jump to a docking ring (perfect safety) and dock up to recap. For supercaps, yeah i suppose you have to warp instead but who the **** slowboats a titan instead of warping it into the pos - I sure don't, if my titan is getting cynoed anywhere it's getting cynoed so that I can mwd-warp into the pos (which you can do pretty close to the pos by having a bookmark/alt on the other side you warp to at 100km) instead of take 30s or more to slowboat.
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 815	Posted - 2014.09.19 15:28:00 - [298] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: For those that claim they never got a fight transporting goods back and forth to null in a freighter op either: 1: Never actually did one. 2: Did one or two, got bored halfway through and logged off (conveniently forgetting to mention that part). 3: Had opponents so wimpy at that time you wouldn't get a good fight no matter what you did. Time to stop listening to your lazy industry pilots. If you want to have more fun, let CCP start interjecting some of the risk back into null sec daily activities. We have organized and ran two large freighter ops relatively recently. It was unfun crap for all involved, and naturally because we were moving huge, expensive **** we made very, very sure there would be no fights whatsoever. All of the nullsec empires have been doing freighter ops on and off because we have to in order to get outpost upgrades or large ihub upgrades. We still haven't had any interesting content and anyone who thinks they ever were fun hasn't done one since 2007 and has their memories of what they actually were utterly addled by the tendency to remember only the interesting stuff and forget the soul-crushing drudgery.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 455	Posted - 2014.09.19 16:49:00 - [299] - Quote man you can tell who in this thread has actually run freighter ops and who is making up fanfic about it
Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 55	Posted - 2014.09.19 17:00:00 - [300] - Quote I had fun on a freighter op once. But that was also the day I took lsd. Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]

Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 817	Posted - 2014.09.19 17:11:00 - [301] - Quote I do not believe that a single Goonswarm freighter op since Dominion forced nullsec to start doing them again (for ihubs and upgrades) has ever generated a fight. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am.
Falin Whalen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 725	Posted - 2014.09.19 18:16:00 - [302] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I do not believe that a single Goonswarm freighter op since Dominion forced nullsec to start doing them again (for ihubs and upgrades) has ever generated a fight. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am. Nope you are not wrong there. I thought I was going on a lowsec roam fun fleet, but I was tricked, it was a freighter op. Any way, Fozzie is doing his typical, taking a sledgehammer to kill a fly, solution to the titan bumping problem. Blunt, clumsy, crude, and effective, but a little overkill, with no regard to unexpected consequences. "it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka-á
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 18:52:00 - [303] - Quote Ranger 1 wrote: Caldess wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Finally, a move towards putting risk and difficulty back into null sec logistics and fleet movement. Jump freighter logistics and easy long distance movement of capital assets has been crippling the game for far too long. An excellent first step, hopefully only the first of many. Keep this up and our noble null sec players might actually start enjoying the game again, despite what they think at the moment. Please explain yourself why this in any way stops me from moving my 250 man cap fleet from the North to the South just a second slower than i can now? And while you are on it explain to me why Jump Freighter logistics (which you obviously never did) will be any harder now? Any time you bring that fleet into a POS you're going to have to take an extra (unprotected) jump to get inside the POS shields, which adds a layer of vulnerability (albeit a small one). As a small first step, it's a good one.... hopefully not the last one. Good game play comes from activities being risky, not from activities being easy... and right now it is far too safe and easy to move a cap fleet (or jump freighter) anywhere you like. It's ironic, people mock those that say yes to the thought of needing to do freighter ops again to move logistics out to null. And yet those freighter ops used to provide more good fights in a single night than you currently see in Null in a week or more. Harder and more time consuming? Yes. More fun, more fights, more unexpected surprises (both good and bad)? Absolutely. For those that claim they never got a fight transporting goods back and forth to null in a freighter op either: 1: Never actually did one. 2: Did one or two, got bored halfway through and logged off (conveniently forgetting to mention that part). 3: Had opponents so wimpy at that time you wouldn't get a good fight no matter what you did. Time to stop listening to your lazy industry pilots. If you want to have more fun, let CCP start interjecting some of the risk back into null sec daily activities. Amen brother. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 18:55:00 - [304] - Quote Primary This Rifter wrote: The biggest issue I have with this is that the exclusion zone prevents cynos from being lit at all, instead of just allowing it but placing incoming ships 25+km. Titans dying without being able to bring in backup after being bumped out is less content generation than a titan being bumped out and bringing a fleet in to help. Imo titans were never meant to be used solo. You deserve to die if you don't travel with friends. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 19:00:00 - [305] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: Any time you bring that fleet into a POS you're going to have to take an extra (unprotected) jump to get inside the POS shields, which adds a layer of vulnerability (albeit a small one). As a small first step, it's a good one.... hopefully not the last one. Good game play comes from activities being risky, not from activities being easy... and right now it is far too safe and easy to move a cap fleet (or jump freighter) anywhere you like. The only time you'd ever do this would be if there were simply no lowsec stations that you could route through whatsoever, because you'd much rather jump to a docking ring (perfect safety) and dock up to recap. For supercaps, yeah i suppose you have to warp instead but who the **** slowboats a titan instead of warping it into the pos - I sure don't, if my titan is getting cynoed anywhere it's getting cynoed so that I can mwd-warp into the pos (which you can do pretty close to the pos by having a bookmark/alt on the other side you warp to at 100km) instead of take 30s or more to slowboat. Plz ccp add the no cyno ring to low sec npc stations and all outposts. The increased risk of landing 25km vrs right next to the pos is if you are hot dropped there is a chance you will live cuss you can slow boat to the pos. This wont happen when you have 25km to travel. The dreads will eat you in one cycle There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 19:04:00 - [306] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: For those that claim they never got a fight transporting goods back and forth to null in a freighter op either: 1: Never actually did one. 2: Did one or two, got bored halfway through and logged off (conveniently forgetting to mention that part). 3: Had opponents so wimpy at that time you wouldn't get a good fight no matter what you did. Time to stop listening to your lazy industry pilots. If you want to have more fun, let CCP start interjecting some of the risk back into null sec daily activities. We have organized and ran two large freighter ops relatively recently. It was unfun crap for all involved, and naturally because we were moving huge, expensive **** we made very, very sure there would be no fights whatsoever. All of the nullsec empires have been doing freighter ops on and off because we have to in order to get outpost upgrades or large ihub upgrades. We still haven't had any interesting content and anyone who thinks they ever were fun hasn't done one since 2007 and has their memories of what they actually were utterly addled by the tendency to remember only the interesting stuff and forget the soul-crushing drudgery. Dude there was a major difference between 07 and 14. Back then you would be attacked and harassed. But with the game mechanics today with power projection and blue doughnut there is no incentive to attack a freoghter op. Chances are peeps interpreted the op as bait. I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 19:10:00 - [307] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: I do not believe that a single Goonswarm freighter op since Dominion forced nullsec to start doing them again (for ihubs and upgrades) has ever generated a fight. I could be wrong, but I don't think I am. Didnt you loose a freighter last year cuss PL found out about it. It was when you were busy killing n3 so the russians could take the space. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Falin Whalen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 725	Posted - 2014.09.19 19:19:00 - [308] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were Dude, seek medical attention imediately. You might be having a stroke or something that is seriously screwing with your memory, also get to an ophthalmologist to see about the rose tinted lenses in your eyes. "it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka-á
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 19:22:00 - [309] - Quote Falin Whalen wrote: MeBiatch wrote: I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were Dude, seek medical attention imediately. You might be having a stroke or something that is seriously screwing with your memory, also get to an ophthalmologist to see about the rose tinted lenses in your eyes. Yay ad hominem attacks. There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
Falin Whalen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 725	Posted - 2014.09.19 20:53:00 - [310] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Falin Whalen wrote: MeBiatch wrote: I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were Dude, seek medical attention imediately. You might be having a stroke or something that is seriously screwing with your memory, also get to an ophthalmologist to see about the rose tinted lenses in your eyes. Yay ad hominem attacks. An Imbecile, who doesn't know the difference between plesurable and painful activities, or masochist, where you derive pleasure from painful activities. Which one are you? Since you are very articulate in your speach in these forums I have to go with the latter of the two, but this last quote of yours throws that into doubt. That is an ad homeinem attack. What I said earlier was genuine concern for a fellow human being who is obviously confused about things as they happened in the past. You painted a whistful, rosey, happy time, about freighter ops in the past, and how they sparked "gud fights," and were "exciting." I don't have rose tinted galsses on, and I can tell you that freighter ops were boring unfun shitefests, and if things got "exciting" or a fight broke out because of the op, it was because someone goofed. You are moving a significant amount of corp/alliance assets in a slow vulnerable freighter, no one wants an "exciting" time, not the freighter pilot, not the corp/alliance leaders, no one. "Yay, we had a good fight on the freighter op." No, someone F'ed up, and put a significant amount of corp/alliance assets at risk. The only one claiming "gud fights" and "fun" is you, and I want you to get checked out by a professional to see if your brain is okay. Either your brain is messed up, or you have some wicked rose tinted glasses. Those are the only options since freighter ops, in my personal experience and inherently by design, are supposed to be boring, unfun, shitefests, where nothing is supposed to happen except the freighter gets to its destination, both in the past, now, and continuing on into the foreseeable future. "it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka-á

Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 817	Posted - 2014.09.19 21:26:00 - [311] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Dude there was a major difference between 07 and 14. Back then you would be attacked and harassed. But with the game mechanics today with power projection and blue doughnut there is no incentive to attack a freoghter op. Chances are peeps interpreted the op as bait. I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were making power projection harder makes it harder to attack a freighter op, not easier. our power is in place before the op starts, to **** with us you've got to get there when you find out about it our overriding goal with any freighter op is the freighters not be shot at and we will organize them to ensure this happens, as will anyone else. it is much EASIER to attack a freighter op now, not harder
Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 55	Posted - 2014.09.19 22:05:00 - [312] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Primary This Rifter wrote: The biggest issue I have with this is that the exclusion zone prevents cynos from being lit at all, instead of just allowing it but placing incoming ships 25+km. Titans dying without being able to bring in backup after being bumped out is less content generation than a titan being bumped out and bringing a fleet in to help. Imo titans were never meant to be used solo. You deserve to die if you don't travel with friends. What part of my post implied anything about traveling? Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]
Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 819	Posted - 2014.09.19 22:11:00 - [313] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Primary This Rifter wrote: The biggest issue I have with this is that the exclusion zone prevents cynos from being lit at all, instead of just allowing it but placing incoming ships 25+km. Titans dying without being able to bring in backup after being bumped out is less content generation than a titan being bumped out and bringing a fleet in to help. Imo titans were never meant to be used solo. You deserve to die if you don't travel with friends. titans were designed with the idea they were so expensive only a handful would ever exist (lawl)
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 23:09:00 - [314] - Quote Falin Whalen wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Falin Whalen wrote: MeBiatch wrote: I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were Dude, seek medical attention imediately. You might be having a stroke or something that is seriously screwing with your memory, also get to an ophthalmologist to see about the rose tinted lenses in your eyes. Yay ad hominem attacks. An Imbecile, who doesn't know the difference between plesurable and painful activities, or masochist, where you derive pleasure from painful activities. Which one are you? Since you are very articulate in your speach in these forums I have to go with the latter of the two, but this last quote of yours throws that into doubt. That is an ad homeinem attack. What I said earlier was genuine concern for a fellow human being who is obviously confused about things as they happened in the past. You painted a whistful, rosey, happy time, about freighter ops in the past, and how they sparked "gud fights," and were "exciting." I don't have rose tinted galsses on, and I can tell you that freighter ops were boring unfun shitefests, and if things got "exciting" or a fight broke out because of the op, it was because someone goofed. You are moving a significant amount of corp/alliance assets in a slow vulnerable freighter, no one wants an "exciting" time, not the freighter pilot, not the corp/alliance leaders, no one. "Yay, we had a good fight on the freighter op." No, someone F'ed up, and put a significant amount of corp/alliance assets at risk. The only one claiming "gud fights" and "fun" is you, and I want you to get checked out by a professional to see if your brain is okay. Either your brain is messed up, or you have some wicked rose tinted glasses. Those are the only options since freighter ops, in my personal experience and inherently by design, are supposed to be boring, unfun, shitefests, where nothing is supposed to happen except the freighter gets to its destination, both in the past, now, and continuing on into the foreseeable future. Holy wall of garbage. Imgoing to say it again and several non goons tend to agree with me. There should be opurtunity to **** up but with jf and such this aint gonna happen. Everything in eve should have risk. If you wamt to own an entire region it should be ultra risky to do so. Otherwise all it does is insentify empire sprawl. Also you say ops like that are boring and with zero risk uou are cprrect. Nut I guess anyone who mines iyo is also a lunatic There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
MeBiatch GRR GOONS 1927	Posted - 2014.09.19 23:12:00 - [315] - Quote Retar Aveymone wrote: MeBiatch wrote: Primary This Rifter wrote: The biggest issue I have with this is that the exclusion zone prevents cynos from being lit at all, instead of just allowing it but placing incoming ships 25+km. Titans dying without being able to bring in backup after being bumped out is less content generation than a titan being bumped out and bringing a fleet in to help. Imo titans were never meant to be used solo. You deserve to die if you don't travel with friends. titans were designed with the idea they were so expensive only a handful would ever exist (lawl) I know right I still have my eve mag issue 6 that says this. Too bad poor game design like drone regions and jb and jf made construction a joke. Death to all supercaps right? There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote: Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.

ISD Ezwal ISD Community Communications Liaisons 2294	Posted - 2014.09.19 23:55:00 - [316] - Quote I have removed a rule breaking post and those quoting it. As always I let some edge cases stay. Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil! The Rules: 4. Personal attacks are prohibited. Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated. ISD Ezwal Vice Admiral Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department

Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 58	Posted - 2014.09.20 00:49:00 - [317] - Quote Oh Fozzie I know this has been asked many times in this thread but it bears repeating until you acknowledge it: Are you going to leave null corps with hundreds of jump bridge bookmarks that need to be updated, or do you have some method of updating these automatically? Actually come to think of it, why are you moving the minimum distances for jump bridges and cyno gens anyway? Obviously the change to cynos lit from ships is intended to prevent the bumping exploit (which is imo a really crude and hacky way of dealing with the problem) but it's not like alliances are going to do this on their own towers. You never gave any justification for this particular change, which I think is unfair considering you're most likely asking us to deal with hundreds of bookmarks that are suddenly inaccurate. Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 144	Posted - 2014.09.20 12:44:00 - [318] - Quote "Oh noez! Hundreds of bookmarks!" Lol, that's about the number of bookmarks an active wh corp makes every single day. Bookmarks can be copied, so you only need to send one of your pets to do it.
Rowells Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans 1350	Posted - 2014.09.20 13:05:00 - [319] - Quote I'm honestly excited to here the rage from people who have no idea this is going to happen. "THEY MOVED MY JB/CYNOGENERATOR WITHOUT ASKING ME?!?!? GRRRRRRRRR CCP!"
Irya Boone Never Surrender. 381	Posted - 2014.09.20 16:01:00 - [320] - Quote Or no Titan bridge under 50 km near FF CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and to Put Them on Killmail TOO, same for Logi....Open that damn door !!

Johann Rascali Crunchy Crunchy The Obsidian Front 102	Posted - 2014.09.20 16:08:00 - [321] - Quote Didn't we used to have some thing where even if you lit a cyno on the edge of the shield the resulting ships would land some distance away? Where did that go and why? Why is it being replaced with essentially the same thing but more annoying? Being a lowsec scrub I could really care less about the change since I only ever cyno standard caps onto stations (though requiring dreads to maneuver to hit towers will be a bit annoying), but it still seems a bit nonsensical. Welcome to our universe where cooldown timers are a mystery, the PLEX menu is just an advertisement, shrapnel bombs deal explosive force, concussion bombs are somehow kinetically penetrative, and who left all these prototype Inferno modules all over the place?
Aiyshimin Imperial Collective Unsettled. 70	Posted - 2014.09.20 17:15:00 - [322] - Quote This is a start, I guess, but you should really consider making titan bridges pull instead of push, and solving the cancer of disposable cyno alts.
Suzuka A1 Multiplex Gaming The Bastion 23	Posted - 2014.09.20 19:24:00 - [323] - Quote I cannot support a band-aid fix which changes cyno mechanics, POS sieging tactics, POS defense tactics, and makes some null and low sec logistics setups even more time consuming. All of this to "fix" an exploit which (especially now that it's been classified as an exploit) happens infrequently is not justifiable. Most likely this will go live (since CCP rarely scraps things they post about), I at least hope this change will be rolled back once the new POS system is put in place...if we ever live to see it. Never forget the battle of Z9PP-H-á What actually happened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgcUwTmHY74 Battle Report: http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?42836-They-Might-Be-Giants-The-Southwest&p=497626&viewfull=1#post497626
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 5881	Posted - 2014.09.20 19:36:00 - [324] - Quote Suzuka A1 wrote: I cannot support a band-aid fix which changes cyno mechanics, POS sieging tactics, POS defense tactics, and makes some null and low sec logistics setups even more time consuming. All of this to "fix" an exploit which (especially now that it's been classified as an exploit) happens infrequently is not justifiable. Most likely this will go live (since CCP rarely scraps things they post about), I at least hope this change will be rolled back once the new POS system is put in place...if we ever live to see it. I think it is more likely part of the "first steps" that have been mentioned as needing to be in place prior to the POS/Sov revamp. Obviously the bumping issue sparked its inclusion at this particular time, but I'd be very surprised if it hadn't already been part of the discussions. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
Suzuka A1 Multiplex Gaming The Bastion 23	Posted - 2014.09.20 19:39:00 - [325] - Quote Diivil wrote: Cynoing in to a POS with forcefields down and then putting them up has been ruled as an exploit right? People still do that all the time. Is it really an exploit?! Is there an actual list of exploits? It would be nice to know so I don't get banned for doing stuff unknowingly. Never forget the battle of Z9PP-H-á What actually happened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgcUwTmHY74 Battle Report: http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?42836-They-Might-Be-Giants-The-Southwest&p=497626&viewfull=1#post497626
Ranger 1 Ranger Corp 5881	Posted - 2014.09.20 19:44:00 - [326] - Quote MeBiatch wrote: Retar Aveymone wrote: Ranger 1 wrote: For those that claim they never got a fight transporting goods back and forth to null in a freighter op either: 1: Never actually did one. 2: Did one or two, got bored halfway through and logged off (conveniently forgetting to mention that part). 3: Had opponents so wimpy at that time you wouldn't get a good fight no matter what you did. Time to stop listening to your lazy industry pilots. If you want to have more fun, let CCP start interjecting some of the risk back into null sec daily activities. We have organized and ran two large freighter ops relatively recently. It was unfun crap for all involved, and naturally because we were moving huge, expensive **** we made very, very sure there would be no fights whatsoever. All of the nullsec empires have been doing freighter ops on and off because we have to in order to get outpost upgrades or large ihub upgrades. We still haven't had any interesting content and anyone who thinks they ever were fun hasn't done one since 2007 and has their memories of what they actually were utterly addled by the tendency to remember only the interesting stuff and forget the soul-crushing drudgery. Dude there was a major difference between 07 and 14. Back then you would be attacked and harassed. But with the game mechanics today with power projection and blue doughnut there is no incentive to attack a freoghter op. Chances are peeps interpreted the op as bait. I think with proper changes to powwr projection and occupancy based sov those boring ops would be fun like they once were I completely agree. The changes to power projection need to be sweeping before we'll start seeing the positive effects again, and also with Sov changes as well. The basic rule of thumb should simply be this. The larger the territory you own, the more profitable it will be for your residents. But also, the larger the territory you own, the MORE DIFFICULT it is to protect. This is the recipe for encouraging new null sec entities to develop while keeping established entities from freely being able to dominate. The ability to project power (including logistics) effortlessly (especially for larger territory owning entities) is extremely counter productive to this end. If you like EVE Online and War Thunder content stop by my YouTube channel.-á Ranger 1 Presents https://www.youtube.com/user/Ranger1Presents
Dread Nanana Action Super Dupper Test Corp 29	Posted - 2014.09.20 20:16:00 - [327] - Quote CCP, can you draw a line? Since distance for forcefield is calculated already, therefore the answer is Yes, you can. So, instead of making force field some sort of a cyno jammers, when someone lights a cyno within 25km of force field, just move the cyno along the line from the cyno generator to forcefield (you know, the distance line) such that the distance is at minimum 25km This does not add any significant calculations since this calculation is already done anyway. And this way anyone can continue to light any cyno within 25km, but the cyno would still appear 25km from the force field.
Dread Nanana Action Super Dupper Test Corp 29	Posted - 2014.09.20 20:19:00 - [328] - Quote Suzuka A1 wrote: Diivil wrote: Cynoing in to a POS with forcefields down and then putting them up has been ruled as an exploit right? People still do that all the time. Is it really an exploit?! Is there an actual list of exploits? It would be nice to know so I don't get banned for doing stuff unknowingly. It takes some time for the force field to appear. You know, you have to offline the tower, then online it again.
Suzuka A1 Multiplex Gaming The Bastion 23	Posted - 2014.09.20 23:44:00 - [329] - Quote Jessica Duranin wrote: If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them. Oh, so then small Alliances should have no caps or JFs. Got it. Never forget the battle of Z9PP-H-á What actually happened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgcUwTmHY74 Battle Report: http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?42836-They-Might-Be-Giants-The-Southwest&p=497626&viewfull=1#post497626
Suzuka A1 Multiplex Gaming The Bastion 23	Posted - 2014.09.20 23:58:00 - [330] - Quote I dont troll wrote: Came expecting **** tons of nullbear tears!!! Wasn't too disappointed however you nullbears are slacking - go look at the whinethread of dirty wormholers and the kick-from-WH mechanic that's how you whine Thanks for adding nothing to the conversation/debate. Please post something productive next time. Never forget the battle of Z9PP-H-á What actually happened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgcUwTmHY74 Battle Report: http://www.kugutsumen.com/showthread.php?42836-They-Might-Be-Giants-The-Southwest&p=497626&viewfull=1#post497626

Kenneth Feld Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 151	Posted - 2014.09.21 00:02:00 - [331] - Quote Maybe, just maybe we should PROHIBIT ALL MODULES in this zone, that way no more repping carriers hugging the shields, no more links hugging the shields etc I would say this should apply to inside the shields, but a bridging Titan in lowsec for FW wouldn't last 12 seconds if it had to bridge outside the shields, so for that reason, I would say that is OK for now.
Burl en Daire M.O.M.S. Corp 40	Posted - 2014.09.21 02:47:00 - [332] - Quote Is this the WH thread about the new mechanics? Yesterday's weirdness is tomorrow's reason why. Hunter S. Thompson
Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 63	Posted - 2014.09.21 03:48:00 - [333] - Quote Did nobody else notice that Fozzie didn't say anything about why he was moving jump bridges and cyno beacons? Are we supposed to guess? Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 151	Posted - 2014.09.21 08:02:00 - [334] - Quote Suzuka A1 wrote: Jessica Duranin wrote: If you can't protect your caps you shouldn't be using them. Oh, so then small Alliances should have no caps or JFs. Got it. Correct. At least that's what the nullbears told us in the wormhole spawn distance thread and CCP seems to agree.
NEONOVUS Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us 935	Posted - 2014.09.21 12:09:00 - [335] - Quote Dread Nanana wrote: CCP, can you draw a line? Since distance for forcefield is calculated already, therefore the answer is Yes, you can. So, instead of making force field some sort of a cyno jammers, when someone lights a cyno within 25km of force field, just move the cyno along the line from the cyno generator to forcefield (you know, the distance line) such that the distance is at minimum 25km This does not add any significant calculations since this calculation is already done anyway. And this way anyone can continue to light any cyno within 25km, but the cyno would still appear 25km from the force field. Expanding on this, move the cyno and the ship at a speed sufficient to get to that point in the calculating server tick or two This way there is no cyno shield huggers, and we get some fun as the cyno ship starbursts off grid Which could be a fun thing for battle, being able to remove cyno ships from the immediate area
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 151	Posted - 2014.09.21 13:42:00 - [336] - Quote NEONOVUS wrote: Expanding on this, move the cyno and the ship at a speed sufficient to get to that point in the calculating server tick or two This way there is no cyno shield huggers, and we get some fun as the cyno ship starbursts off grid Which could be a fun thing for battle, being able to remove cyno ships from the immediate area Go into Siege, light cyno, bump into hostile fleet at 25km/s....sounds fun.
NEONOVUS Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us 935	Posted - 2014.09.21 21:53:00 - [337] - Quote Indeed, would also help alleviate the well **** cage tactics Oh and the humor of any remaining approach fc + f1s But mostly I like the idea of moving the offender more than just cyno up, drop jump ins here
Sweet Times Riptide Riot 18	Posted - 2014.09.22 03:57:00 - [338] - Quote This is my question why make a huge problem for every1 else in the game who as to update all thise bookmarks an changes the mechanics around starbases when the solution to the problem is so easy if these players are using a stated exploit BAN them ...problem solved you come down hard on other exploits i dont understand your reasoning on this one it seems neejerk and franckl daft and badly tought out Ban the people who exploit problem solved
Kagura Nikon Mentally Assured Destruction The Pursuit of Happiness 1645	Posted - 2014.09.22 10:15:00 - [339] - Quote Kenneth Feld wrote: Maybe, just maybe we should PROHIBIT ALL MODULES in this zone, that way no more repping carriers hugging the shields, no more links hugging the shields etc I would say this should apply to inside the shields, but a bridging Titan in lowsec for FW wouldn't last 12 seconds if it had to bridge outside the shields, so for that reason, I would say that is OK for now. Not good as well. BEcause then enemy ships could not get close and tackle a carrier there if their own modules did nto work there. I understand your idea, but remember if it works for both ways it does nerf even more subcapitals. "If brute force does not solve your problem..... -áthen you are -ásurely not using enough!"
Bremmon Midnight Caretakers The Methodical Alliance 0	Posted - 2014.09.22 12:58:00 - [340] - Quote After reading people complaining, people with maybe viable solutions, and the overall theme of the update being "let's fix it till it breaks again". Seriously needs good amounts of testing before implemented. the bridges being moved is one hell of a nightmare alone, just from a bookmark perspective. Retool pos's totally, or at least clue us in as to what else you have planned for the future because as I see it it doesn't just break to fix stuff, it requires a major change on the part of everyone who utilizes what has just been changed for non-expolit and that number is far higher. I for one would love to see the transcript of the csm and how it got confirmed that this was still a good idea. How I fully understand risk vs reward, the situations which will now come up because of this will be rather large. The new system can potentially kill ships because oh look, the enemy can call in reinforcements because they are outside the range, but the slowboating (insert ship type here) is 15 km from either the shield or the edge of the no-cyno zone. I have no issue with the 25 km range, my issue is that a cyno (by the system) cannot be lit at all unless shield is down? You already require the cyno to be 25 km away, so force cynoing in ships to appear that far away in a 180 degree spread around that side of the pos.

NEONOVUS Diabolically Sexy Eureka-Secret Science R Us 935	Posted - 2014.09.22 15:51:00 - [341] - Quote Bremmon wrote: After reading people complaining, people with maybe viable solutions, and the overall theme of the update being "let's fix it till it breaks again". Seriously needs good amounts of testing before implemented. the bridges being moved is one hell of a nightmare alone, just from a bookmark perspective. Retool pos's totally, or at least clue us in as to what else you have planned for the future because as I see it it doesn't just break to fix stuff, it requires a major change on the part of everyone who utilizes what has just been changed for non-expolit and that number is far higher. I for one would love to see the transcript of the csm and how it got confirmed that this was still a good idea. How I fully understand risk vs reward, the situations which will now come up because of this will be rather large. The new system can potentially kill ships because oh look, the enemy can call in reinforcements because they are outside the range, but the slowboating (insert ship type here) is 15 km from either the shield or the edge of the no-cyno zone. I have no issue with the 25 km range, my issue is that a cyno (by the system) cannot be lit at all unless shield is down? You already require the cyno to be 25 km away, so force cynoing in ships to appear that far away in a 180 degree spread around that side of the pos. Your reward for being in a pos is the invulnerable shielding Your risk is that you dont get to summon bigger fish constantly This is just finally adding some risk to hiding out in a pos

CCP Fozzie C C P C C P Alliance 11323	Posted - 2014.09.22 17:58:00 - [342] - Quote Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. Game Designer \| Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie http://www.twitch.tv/ccp_fozzie/

Retar Aveymone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 829	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:00:00 - [343] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. that makes sense - so hostiles will know where people will be popping out of a cyno inside the exclusion zone instead of having to guess better solution than the one commonly proposed here, I like it
Altrue Exploration Frontier inc Brave Collective 1300	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:02:00 - [344] - Quote What happens if the tower is online but without password? (Thus without forcefield) Signature Tanking - Best Tanking
Querns GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 791	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:08:00 - [345] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. Very nice -- I wouldn't have thought to move the beacon itself. That makes a lot of sense and is very simple to implement. Thanks for considering this compromise. This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
BadAssMcKill ElitistOps 885	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:09:00 - [346] - Quote Wow You actually listened Am I in a dream .
Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 91	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:13:00 - [347] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. Superdupe change. thanks for listening
Georgik Sojik SniggWaffe WAFFLES. 6	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:16:00 - [348] - Quote Forgive the question if it has been previously asked. Does this exclusion zone only affect normal cynofields? Would it be still possible to bridge bombers/recons/cloaky T3s and BlackOps within the 25km zone?
Powers Sa 1376	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:28:00 - [349] - Quote Here i was looking forward to all the would be cyno pilots trying to rage light and getting errors. lol
Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 63	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:29:00 - [350] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. You still haven't explained why you're moving jump bridges and cyno gen arrays. Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]

Tarsas Phage Freight Club 327	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:32:00 - [351] - Quote Math is hard, but I guess this is an ok substitute.

CCP Fozzie C C P C C P Alliance 11325	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:36:00 - [352] - Quote Georgik Sojik wrote: Forgive the question if it has been previously asked. Does this exclusion zone only affect normal cynofields? Would it be still possible to bridge bombers/recons/cloaky T3s and BlackOps within the 25km zone? This applies to all cynos, including covert cynos. Game Designer \| Team Five-0 https://twitter.com/CCP_Fozzie http://www.twitch.tv/ccp_fozzie/

Current Habit Get LP or Die Trying 9	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:38:00 - [353] - Quote BadAssMcKill wrote: Wow You actually listened Am I in a dream CCP also just used the idea of a player when it came to jump fuel increase (decrease tope volume by 50% instead of increasing fuel bays)
Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 91	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:39:00 - [354] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. Now about that decision to shift Cyno Beacons and Jump Bridges out to the 25km position? Whyyyyyyyyyy? That does nothing with regard to this bumping issue and really nothing to create a shift in risk. What is does do is create the changing of millions of bookmarks.
Eldwinn SomeWhat SophiSticateD Shadow Cartel 18	Posted - 2014.09.22 18:54:00 - [355] - Quote It is always good to find that we are making a small progress in regards to the Cyno Bumping of Titans. However the details regarding bumping in general with a POS involved have yet to be clarified upon. We recently lost one of our pilots to a permaban. The pilot was bumping a titan that was sticking it's head out of the shield. He did not have the POS password and was using a tornado to bump with. The thread is found from, link . In that regard is there any plans to revise or properly adjust the policies so this information is properly conveyed?
Tarsas Phage Freight Club 327	Posted - 2014.09.22 19:26:00 - [356] - Quote Eldwinn wrote: It is always good to find that we are making a small progress in regards to the Cyno Bumping of Titans. However the details regarding bumping in general with a POS involved have yet to be clarified upon. We recently lost one of our pilots to a permaban. The pilot was bumping a titan that was sticking it's head out of the shield. He did not have the POS password and was using a tornado to bump with. The thread is found from, link . In that regard is there any plans to revise or properly adjust the policies so this information is properly conveyed? This, and CCP needs to make it crystal clear that they are indeed able to accurately verify - after the fact - the circumstances of a titan getting bumped... simply because I foresee a day when someone will discover a titan sitting outside of a POS, is bumped further off and killed and the pilots involved are banned because all the dead titan pilot needs to do is merely insinuate that s/he was inside (in part or in whole) of the force field. Part of this is the edge case of a Titan's model sticking partially (either substantially or minimally) outside of a forefield, allowing it to be bumped by an external ship. CCP should clarify that IN the forcefield means completely inside in a verifiable manner. In short - A titan pilot who is unaware of his ship's position in relation to a very visible boundary should not be covered by nebulous and arbitrarily-enforced rules which carry the most extreme consequences.
Klyith GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 144	Posted - 2014.09.22 19:45:00 - [357] - Quote Tarsas Phage wrote: I foresee a day when someone will discover a titan sitting outside of a POS, is bumped further off and killed and the pilots involved are banned because all the dead titan pilot needs to do is merely insinuate that s/he was inside (in part or in whole) of the force field. Hysterics much? One guy that we know of has received some sort of punishment, for bumping in a manner that was declared an exploit. The rule as originally set out is pretty clear: bump a ship out of the field when you don't have the password, get banned. It just got muddied as people found ways to exploit without getting caught / being punished. The game just has a weird grey area because different people -- including different GMs evidently -- have different opinions on what "inside the forcefield" means. It is the targeting box? The ship's collision sphere? The model as drawn by client graphics, which isn't always consistent from client to client? Quote: Part of this is the edge case of a Titan's model sticking partially (either substantially or minimally) outside of a forefield, allowing it to be bumped by an external ship. CCP should clarify that IN the forcefield means completely inside in a verifiable manner. Or clarify that a ship is inside the forcefield when the game says "you fail to target ship because it is inside the forcefield". The new rules may come down to don't bump if you can't lock. If you want to prevent those lying titan pilots from insinuating that they were inside the shields, lock them and screenshot before bumping them further out. The main reason we are having this discussion in a thread about cynos around starbases is that cyno-bumping gave people way too much plausible deniability.
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 439	Posted - 2014.09.22 19:56:00 - [358] - Quote By "listened to feedback", do you mean "my PL buddies told me on Mumble they'd lose out on a bunch of dread kills if they couldn't just warp to zero on the targets and light a cyno without trouble"? You finally added a minor measure of skill to hot dropping stationary targets and all it takes is a bit of lobbying from your old pals for you to completely cave in. Weak ****.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 464	Posted - 2014.09.22 20:13:00 - [359] - Quote Dirk MacGirk wrote: Now about that decision to shift Cyno Beacons and Jump Bridges out to the 25km position? Whyyyyyyyyyy? That does nothing with regard to this bumping issue and really nothing to create a shift in risk. What is does do is create the changing of millions of bookmarks. because otherwise you could anchor a cyno beacon or jump bridge to circumvent the 25km restriction also do they not have corp bookmarks where you live, even we in the cfc, largest jump bridge havers in the game, can fit our entire catalog in 200 bookmarks or so
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 464	Posted - 2014.09.22 20:25:00 - [360] - Quote also this is nothing, were you there when they seeded new r64s, requiring that we re-scan EVERY MOON IN EVE rebookmarking 250 jump bridges is peanuts compared to that

Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 91	Posted - 2014.09.22 21:09:00 - [361] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Dirk MacGirk wrote: Now about that decision to shift Cyno Beacons and Jump Bridges out to the 25km position? Whyyyyyyyyyy? That does nothing with regard to this bumping issue and really nothing to create a shift in risk. What is does do is create the changing of millions of bookmarks. because otherwise you could anchor a cyno beacon or jump bridge to circumvent the 25km restriction also do they not have corp bookmarks where you live, even we in the cfc, largest jump bridge havers in the game, can fit our entire catalog in 200 bookmarks or so Yeah thanks, those CFC bookmarks are my bookmarks too. Coalition and all that. Corp bookmarks, yada yada. Someone still has to go do it for no good reason relevant to the underlying issue of POS bumping. Where a cyno beacon or jump bridge is anchored today has absolutely zero to do with what drove this change: bumping a ship inside the POS using a ship outside the shield that does not have the password. Jump bridges certainly had nothing to do with it and it would be an absolute stretch to say beacons did or even could. So linking them to the underlying POS bumping issue is unwarranted. Perhaps they just wanted to change them anyway, which is fine. But that's not what happened. They linked it to the POS bumping issue/solution.
Dez Affinity Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 649	Posted - 2014.09.22 21:11:00 - [362] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: By "listened to feedback", do you mean "my PL buddies told me on Mumble they'd lose out on a bunch of dread kills if they couldn't just warp to zero on the targets and light a cyno without trouble"? You finally added a minor measure of skill to hot dropping stationary targets and all it takes is a bit of lobbying from your old pals for you to completely cave in. Weak **. At least PRETEND you're interested in fixing the supercap plague infesting this game, **. Is my voice worth less just because I don't have a supercap hogging one of my accounts? Controlling your game. :smug:
Hendrick Tallardar Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 233	Posted - 2014.09.22 21:37:00 - [363] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: By "listened to feedback", do you mean "my PL buddies told me on Mumble they'd lose out on a bunch of dread kills if they couldn't just warp to zero on the targets and light a cyno without trouble"? You finally added a minor measure of skill to hot dropping stationary targets and all it takes is a bit of lobbying from your old pals for you to completely cave in. Weak **. At least PRETEND you're interested in fixing the supercap plague infesting this game, . Is my voice worth less just because I don't have a supercap hogging one of my accounts? Mate, no need for such butthurt. You guys lost the flag event and cried hard until it was put up next to PL's. To then go about and *** about people voicing their critiques of something which ultimately changed it from the original inception is pretty hypocritical. Your voice is worth less and less each time you accuse someone of breaking their company's NDA and other policies and quickly claim a grand conspiracy like you're the runt of the litter that spawned Gevlon Goblin. You seem like you could use a hug, would you like a hug? LeeSsang. Never Forget.
Grarr Dexx Snuff Box 439	Posted - 2014.09.22 22:03:00 - [364] - Quote you're still going on about that flag thing? lol but apparently forcing a cyno frigate to make a choice between hard tackling a target inside the exclusion zone and lighting a cyno is too much for a game where cooperation is so heavily promoted, all remote effects are better than local effects
Ned Black Driders 84	Posted - 2014.09.22 22:36:00 - [365] - Quote This may be a tad bit better than the previous version... but it is still like applying a bandaid to the head when trying to fix a broken leg... Why not just make it so that anything outside the POS shield that lacks either roles or password can only interact with the POS force field and not with anything inside the POS?
Hendrick Tallardar Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 233	Posted - 2014.09.22 22:57:00 - [366] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: you're still going on about that flag thing? lol but apparently forcing a cyno frigate to make a choice between hard tackling a target inside the exclusion zone and lighting a cyno is too much for a game where cooperation is so heavily promoted, all remote effects are better than local effects. do you really think the nda covers oog comms, or would actually be capable of enforcing anything said there? can you ***** blame me where every goddamned decision this idiot makes equals '** the small guys, here have some more advantages, my null comrades' You still look like you need a hug. That or to log off the computer for a few days and not be so antagonistic with the accusations of collusion. If you have evidence though contact CCP's Internal Affairs Division. LeeSsang. Never Forget.
Schmell Russian Thunder Squad The Afterlife. 41	Posted - 2014.09.22 23:12:00 - [367] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: Hey everyone. Like I said before, we incorporated the feedback from this thread last week and discussed a modified version of the plan with the CSM. We're now ready to announce the results. In this new version of the plan, you will be able to activate the Cyno Field Gen module anywhere outside the shields, but if the ship lighting the cyno is within 25km of a starbase forcefield, the actual beacon will appear at least 25km away from the forcefield. Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. The OP has been updated. Thanks for the feedback and keep it coming. Quote: Ships jumping to the cyno field will appear around that beacon 25km away instead of beside your ship. Is this by chance a fix/nerf to cyno bumping mechanics, when you can kill a carrier or jump freighter by bumping cyno ship off station, before said carrier/freighter loads into the system? Or will it work that way on poses exclusively?
Calypso Warsmith Strata Dynamics Power Absolute Inc. 23	Posted - 2014.09.22 23:50:00 - [368] - Quote For the love of all things holy PLEASE add this change to all stations, to the effect a Cyno can be set up within XYZ km of docking range. With all this sweet sweet looting moving around eve inside of Jump freighters, and the fact that players have almost completely removed the risk of jumping a JF around lows sec Do to the mapping of none kick out stations and the record of where and how to place cynos for instant jump and docking, Rarely do the professional logistics guys get caught. They are more likely to die from a Gank in highsec than moving there JF in Low/Null sec.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 465	Posted - 2014.09.23 00:47:00 - [369] - Quote Calypso Warsmith wrote: For the love of all things holy PLEASE add this change to all stations, to the effect a Cyno can be set up within XYZ km of docking range. With all this sweet sweet looting moving around eve inside of Jump freighters, and the fact that players have almost completely removed the risk of jumping a JF around lows sec Do to the mapping of none kick out stations and the record of where and how to place cynos for instant jump and docking, Rarely do the professional logistics guys get caught. They are more likely to die from a Gank in highsec than moving there JF in Low/Null sec. not sure what this is trying to solve if you can't light a cyno safely at a station, we'll just light them on gates into highsec and onto jump bridges (titan bridged freighters) instead especially us in the cfc because we own all the 0.0 close to jita and lawl if you think that putting displacement zones on gates is going to fly, imagine the gatecamp, 100% safe from hotdrop all this does is bend over non-sov-havers and non-cfc havers so that you can fantasize about endless jf kills
Kenneth Feld Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 152	Posted - 2014.09.23 01:37:00 - [370] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: you're still going on about that flag thing? lol but apparently forcing a cyno frigate to make a choice between hard tackling a target inside the exclusion zone and lighting a cyno is too much for a game where cooperation is so heavily promoted, all remote effects are better than local effects. do you really think the nda covers oog comms, or would actually be capable of enforcing anything said there? can you ***** blame me where every goddamned decision this idiot makes equals '** the small guys, here have some more advantages, my null comrades' The problem is if he makes a decision to help the little guys, it GREATLY benefits larger guys TYPICALLY, then you cry about favoritism Dang if you do, dang if you dont BTW: nothing prevent the tackling frigate from lighting a cyno anywhere now, or can't you read??

Hendrick Tallardar Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion 233	Posted - 2014.09.23 01:45:00 - [371] - Quote Kenneth Feld wrote: Grarr Dexx wrote: you're still going on about that flag thing? lol but apparently forcing a cyno frigate to make a choice between hard tackling a target inside the exclusion zone and lighting a cyno is too much for a game where cooperation is so heavily promoted, all remote effects are better than local effects. do you really think the nda covers oog comms, or would actually be capable of enforcing anything said there? can you ***** blame me where every goddamned decision this idiot makes equals '** the small guys, here have some more advantages, my null comrades' The problem is if he makes a decision to help the little guys, it GREATLY benefits larger guys TYPICALLY, then you cry about favoritism Dang if you do, dang if you dont BTW: nothing prevent the tackling frigate from lighting a cyno anywhere now, or can't you read?? I'm afraid he can read, it's just the comprehension of what he read that seems to be the issue. LeeSsang. Never Forget.
Primary This Rifter 4S Corporation Goonswarm Federation 63	Posted - 2014.09.23 02:21:00 - [372] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Dirk MacGirk wrote: Now about that decision to shift Cyno Beacons and Jump Bridges out to the 25km position? Whyyyyyyyyyy? That does nothing with regard to this bumping issue and really nothing to create a shift in risk. What is does do is create the changing of millions of bookmarks. because otherwise you could anchor a cyno beacon or jump bridge to circumvent the 25km restriction So what? Why do they have to be subject to the same restriction? That's the part that wasn't specified. Alt of [redacted on advice from a reputable internet spaceships lawyer]
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 465	Posted - 2014.09.23 03:15:00 - [373] - Quote Primary This Rifter wrote: Promiscuous Female wrote: Dirk MacGirk wrote: Now about that decision to shift Cyno Beacons and Jump Bridges out to the 25km position? Whyyyyyyyyyy? That does nothing with regard to this bumping issue and really nothing to create a shift in risk. What is does do is create the changing of millions of bookmarks. because otherwise you could anchor a cyno beacon or jump bridge to circumvent the 25km restriction So what? Why do they have to be subject to the same restriction? That's the part that wasn't specified. because otherwise you have a bunch of one-off bullcrap that you have to compensate for, doing it this way is easier to implement you all need to calm the heck down, i'm going to have to redo all of my bookmarks for GBS LOGISTICS AND FIVES SUPPORT [MY 5S] personally and I don't care because the number of bookmarks is just not that large, not even for us interceptors exist and they warp fast it just isn't important enough to have a conniption about it
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 465	Posted - 2014.09.23 03:19:00 - [374] - Quote in fact updating the bookmarks is even easier than you think because it's not like the old ones are being deleted you warp to the old bookmark, if the jb has been moved, magically you are already on grid with the thing you need to bookmark delete old bookmark (protip: do this by right clicking in space to filter your bookmarks to the ones in system) then rebookmark new one then warp to next system, rinse and repeat get half a dozen nerds doing this and it'll go by fast
Dirk MacGirk Specter Syndicate Tactical Narcotics Team 92	Posted - 2014.09.23 03:37:00 - [375] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Primary This Rifter wrote: Promiscuous Female wrote: Dirk MacGirk wrote: Now about that decision to shift Cyno Beacons and Jump Bridges out to the 25km position? Whyyyyyyyyyy? That does nothing with regard to this bumping issue and really nothing to create a shift in risk. What is does do is create the changing of millions of bookmarks. because otherwise you could anchor a cyno beacon or jump bridge to circumvent the 25km restriction So what? Why do they have to be subject to the same restriction? That's the part that wasn't specified. because otherwise you have a bunch of one-off bullcrap that you have to compensate for, doing it this way is easier to implement Completely agree that re-doing bookmarks isn't that big of an issue. Combined across everyone it adds up, but the point is that shifting the locations has absolutely nothing to do with the POS bumping issue. AFAIK there is no "one-off bullcrap" to compensate for, but if you have examples that would be helpful. In the end, its really no big deal. It's just that there is no good reason to do it in the first place. IDK, maybe its easier for them to code if they can just copy/paste for cynos, cyno gens and jump bridges. But I'm not sure "it's easier for CCP to code it" should be the driving force behind a change. If that was the case, just saying "it's an exploit and you WILL be banned" will likely halt those trying to skirt the edge. No coding involved.
Calypso Warsmith Strata Dynamics Power Absolute Inc. 23	Posted - 2014.09.23 05:11:00 - [376] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Calypso Warsmith wrote: For the love of all things holy PLEASE add this change to all stations gates, to the effect a Cyno can be set up within XYZ km of docking/jumping range. With all this sweet sweet looting moving around eve inside of Jump freighters, and the fact that players have almost completely removed the risk of jumping a JF around lows sec Do to the mapping of none kick out stations and the record of where and how to place cynos for instant jump and docking, Rarely do the professional logistics guys get caught. They are more likely to die from a Gank in highsec than moving there JF in Low/Null sec. not sure what this is trying to solve if you can't light a cyno safely at a station, we'll just light them on gates into highsec and onto jump bridges (titan bridged freighters) instead especially us in the cfc because we own all the 0.0 close to jita and lawl if you think that putting displacement zones on gates is going to fly, imagine the gatecamp, 100% safe from hotdrop all this does is bend over non-sov-havers and non-cfc havers so that you can fantasize about endless jf kills Lol adding a Cyno exclusion zone to gates would make gate camps unkillable? Really? Being unable to light a Cyno inside the 5km jump zone. Make's you unable to attack the guys that are more than likely all ready sitting OUTSIDE of the jump zone... Sure Bridge them freighters and slow boat them to the jump range of the gate, see how many times you can do that with out support on had before someone starts dropping on you. Also i personalty have moved a normal freighter 10 to 15 jumps in low sec with only 4 scouts on multiple occasions. So I'm 100% sure everything you typed is just useless words you didn't even think about before you sperged them out.
Yun Kuai Justified Chaos Spaceship Bebop 189	Posted - 2014.09.23 06:03:00 - [377] - Quote Honestly the changes are okay as they introduce a bit more tactical skills when dropping on a POS and/or jumping into a POS for safety (apart from cyno'ing at 175km and warping down). However, that being said the days of dropping short range dreads like the Moros is now going to require even more gimped fits. Especially when you factor in the earlier changes to dreads optimal and falloff + the changes to TE/TC. These will struggle to actively engage in a fight on a pos now. The other issue that needs to be addressed is allowing capitals to stick their baby toe out of the shields and be able to assign fighters, rep, etc. The cyno zone should go both ways for the attacker and defender. A complete rebalance of measuring how a ship is deemed inside/outside of the shields; your ship must be 100% out of the shields (remember each ship has an actual length) before they can lock targets themselves and must be 100% inside the shields before they become unlockable. Fix that and the changes will be fine. --------------------------------------------------------::::::::::::--:::-----:::---::::::::::::--------------:::----------:::----:::---:::----------------------:::::::-------:::---:::----::::::-------------------:::-----------:::--:::----:::---------------------::::::::::::----:::::::----:::::::::::::-------
Skia Aumer Atlas Research Group 92	Posted - 2014.09.23 07:48:00 - [378] - Quote CCP Fozzie wrote: This applies to all cynos, including covert cynos. This is wrong. Why? I dont see any reason for this. And how are we supposed to deal with (super)carriers, assisting fighters from the edge of the field?
Bluemelon Oblivion Watch HYDRA RELOADED 81	Posted - 2014.09.23 10:46:00 - [379] - Quote Think this has been said before but i'll restate it. This change makes hugging forcefield with carriers/supers/titans nearly impossible to punish. For all your 3rd party needs join my ingame channel Blue's 3rd Party! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=365230&find=unread
Anthar Thebess 702	Posted - 2014.09.23 11:15:00 - [380] - Quote Skia Aumer wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: This applies to all cynos, including covert cynos. This is wrong. Why? I dont see any reason for this. And how are we supposed to deal with (super)carriers, assisting fighters from the edge of the field? Can similar mechanic can be applied to drone assist? So if you enter this zone , fighters are auto recalled. Still this is not perfect solution, but it is still better than current possibility to bump every thing from pos , as long as you know how. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes

Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe 6406	Posted - 2014.09.23 15:42:00 - [381] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: get half a dozen nerds doing this and it'll go by fast You dirty blobber. So basically the pain is reduced with more blues on the job. ^^ Delicious goon ((tech nerf, siphon, drone assist, supercap)) tears. Taking a wrecking ball to the futile hopes and broken dreams of skillless blobbers.
Frostys Virpio The Mjolnir Bloc The Bloc 1261	Posted - 2014.09.23 16:36:00 - [382] - Quote How about a boat anchor function can only activate when your ship is granted the immunity from a POS shield? You get a shiny button and you anchor your ship to the tower. It would prevent the bumping without having to go through a bunch of interdiction zone and cyno rules modification. It's not like the function "thou shall not move" does not exist in the game in an applicable way for ships. Then you let the game code decide if a ship is protected or not. Other player will also easyly be able to identify if a ship is protected or not without having to test a bump by trying to target the damn thing. Can't target it, then it's in the "protected" zone and can't be messed wit. Can be targeted? GJ, you found a badly parked ship and it's the ship owner fault for not checking if his anchor function was available or not. Is this really impossible?
Klyith GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 145	Posted - 2014.09.23 20:25:00 - [383] - Quote Dirk MacGirk wrote: Edit - IDK, maybe its easier for them to code if they can just copy/paste for cynos, cyno gens and jump bridges. But I'm not sure "it's easier for CCP to code it" should be the driving force behind a change. If that was the case, just saying "it's an exploit and you WILL be banned" will likely halt those trying to skirt the edge. No coding involved. Ease of implementation is always going to be a consideration, there's no way around it. If you use up all your dev time doing fixes for old problems in the best, most comprehensive way possible, you have no time left for new features. (Same for vise versa if you only do new content, gotta have a balance.) We also get triaged based on how many people the problem affects -- like it or not people with caps and cynos are a minority of the game population. The issue with continuing try to regulate it with exploit rules is that they tried it and it didn't work. It's pretty obvious that this doesn't show up well in logs. And for cyno-bumping you run into a very difficult question of who to ban. The cyno player is the only one who definitely intends to set up a bump, the other guys can't see where they're going. But the cyno guy could be a disposable account. Plus it's totally random which supercap gets pushed into the bump, so do you ban one of them or all? Frostys Virpio wrote: How about a boat anchor function can only activate when your ship is granted the immunity from a POS shield? You get a shiny button and you anchor your ship to the tower. It would prevent the bumping It would also prevent bumping by people who do have your password, which is one of the bits of the game that most people want to preserve.
Anthar Thebess 703	Posted - 2014.09.24 08:55:00 - [384] - Quote "Anchoring ship" within pos shields could be some solution. This would require a lot of work , and creating cyno free zone is probably much easier. Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Captain StringfellowHawk Forsaken Reavers Rim Worlds Protectorate 153	Posted - 2014.09.24 12:32:00 - [385] - Quote Why not instead of just Changing the Cyno Location.. Force the bumpable ships out of the Shield to Bridge. If these changes are supposed to Force Risk and Conflict, with other ships slowly being moved out from behind a shield like Command ships and stated in the command ship log, Industrial boosters as well. Why not Push the titans and Blops ships that much further out also. Stop these ships from having a reason to Hug the edge of a shield. Make them Partake in the risk also and move outside of the shield Fully. Put a X range of tower activation range. Will make more roles in active fleets from protecting the titan and create new strategies and remove yet another level of hiding from the Game. If you want risk and conflict.. Push it..
Amantus Snuff Box 349	Posted - 2014.09.24 13:01:00 - [386] - Quote Grarr Dexx wrote: you're still going on about that flag thing? lol Good to know you're not the only one who goes on about the flag constantly.
Serendipity Lost Repo Industries Chelonaphobia 505	Posted - 2014.09.24 17:54:00 - [387] - Quote By the looks of this thread "shield hugger bumping" appears to be one of the best forms of pvp null has to offer. If the highlight of your night is A) doing something while hugging a POS shield or B) trying to punish someone doing something while hugging a POS shield - maybe examine what you are doing in the eve universe. POS shield bumping seems like a rather small slice of eve to have this much hoo haw devoted to it. They didn't just fix a sploit here, they made eve better.
Anthar Thebess 703	Posted - 2014.09.25 08:24:00 - [388] - Quote Can we at the same time get bigger siphon distance from the pos shield? So we can easily place it outside cyno free zone , and covert cyno hotdrop person that will come to kill this siphon. At the same time can we get pos structure that will work on pos like MCI ? Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 154	Posted - 2014.09.25 10:37:00 - [389] - Quote Skia Aumer wrote: And how are we supposed to deal with (super)carriers, assisting fighters from the edge of the field? You do know that it's possible to move your ship without the help of a titan, right? Bluemelon wrote: Think this has been said before but i'll restate it. This change makes hugging forcefield with carriers/supers/titans nearly impossible to punish. I've killed plenty of force field hugging carriers in w-space. You don't need to use exploits to kill them.
Anthar Thebess 704	Posted - 2014.09.25 11:20:00 - [390] - Quote Webs + dps , nothing more needed Support Needed : Jump Fuel Consumption Support Needed : Faction Crystal Changes

Vincintius Agrippa F L O O D 61	Posted - 2014.09.25 20:39:00 - [391] - Quote I don't know how I feel about this. On one hand a lot of people are going to get hotdropped attempting to burn 25km back to their pos. Of course, they can light at a station and just slow warp to the pos if they aren't supers. On the other hand, this could prevent spies from grief bumping Capitals and supercaps out of pos shields. Hmm wait, cant you dock ships in ship maintenance arrays? Only YOU can prevent internet bullying!
Serendipity Lost Repo Industries Chelonaphobia 514	Posted - 2014.09.26 14:22:00 - [392] - Quote Anthar Thebess wrote: Skia Aumer wrote: CCP Fozzie wrote: This applies to all cynos, including covert cynos. This is wrong. Why? I dont see any reason for this. And how are we supposed to deal with (super)carriers, assisting fighters from the edge of the field? Can similar mechanic can be applied to drone assist? So if you enter this zone , fighters are auto recalled. Still this is not perfect solution, but it is still better than current possibility to bump every thing from pos , as long as you know how. Removing drone assist would make this a non issue. Keeping the assignment of fighters intact, I would be on board w/ the 'no cyno' zone also being a 'no assignment' zone. Another approach would be that you lose (permanant) contact w/ any assigned fighters if your dock or enter a pos shield. Just make it so you can't reconnect if you dock or pos up. The assigning pilot can then make the choice to hang in there until the fighters return or save his bacon at the expense of his fighters. Oddly enough it would add a mechaninc where you could intentionally bump a carrier into the pos shields to relieve him of his fighters. What's not to like about that?? If you want to play pos shield hero then you risked your fighters/bombers being bumped out of your posession.
Amyclas Amatin Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation 351	Posted - 2014.09.27 21:49:00 - [393] - Quote Why not take this up to 11 and prevent cynos on stations? Null and low sec Jump-freight will become killable and difficult to move solo again. For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/ High-Sec has a future, But do You? Buy a Mining Permit to Secure yours today.
Jessica Duranin Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 164	Posted - 2014.09.27 22:48:00 - [394] - Quote Amyclas Amatin wrote: Why not take this up to 11 and prevent cynos on stations? Null and low sec Jump-freight will become killable and difficult to move solo again. THIS Moving caps is currently way too save.
FT Diomedes The Graduates Forged of Fire 548	Posted - 2014.09.28 19:40:00 - [395] - Quote Amyclas Amatin wrote: Null and low sec Jump-freight will become killable and difficult to move solo again. You do know that no one moves a jump freighter in low sec and null sec "solo," right? Using a cyno already makes it not a "solo" activity. This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Amyclas Amatin Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation 356	Posted - 2014.09.28 22:27:00 - [396] - Quote FT Diomedes wrote: Amyclas Amatin wrote: Null and low sec Jump-freight will become killable and difficult to move solo again. You do know that no one moves a jump freighter in low sec and null sec "solo," right? Using a cyno already makes it not a "solo" activity. You know what I mean. Cynos on stations reduce most of the risk of moving caps. For more information on the New Order of High-Sec, please visit: http://www.minerbumping.com/ High-Sec has a future, But do You? Buy a Mining Permit to Secure yours today.
Patty Loveless Minute to Midnight 5	Posted - 2014.10.01 17:27:00 - [397] - Quote Firstly, I fully agree that the change was good, but I also disagree that the cyno-bumping was/is the only exploit happening here. At least when assigning fighters, the carrier in question needs to be outside the forcefield. How is it not an exploit when a titan, inside a forcefield, bridges ships from outside the forcefield? Surely if CCP deems that any form of interaction between a ship outside the forcefield and inside the forcefield is not intended and an exploit, than these types of titan bridges should be considered exploits as well. If a Titan wished to bridge pilots outside the forcefield, it should have to be outside the forcefield as well, right?
MMak Nex Exercitus Northern Coalition. 1	Posted - 2014.10.02 03:16:00 - [398] - Quote CCP Fozzie is raving


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