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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 11 post(s) |
Luigi Thirty
GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
40
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:07:54 -
[601] - Quote
I think CCP should add a PvP flag. A literal flag on your ship. Think of it, we can all have little flags stuck to our ships at all times and CCP can sell like $100 monocle flags. The bonus is it would be a big flag so it would make your ship easier to see against the blackness of space. This might be a nerf to recon ships (how are you going to cloak a flag???) but I don't really care because who is suicide ganking with a recon ship anyway? |
Master Apollyon
BLACK REGIMENT
0
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:08:45 -
[602] - Quote
Lickem Lolly wrote: CCP, the real problem is not making the old players happy - it is attracting and keeping the new players.
So much this! No doubt about that.
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MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
2015
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:10:16 -
[603] - Quote
CCP Rise wrote:baltec1 wrote:CCP Rise wrote:Alright, added quite a bit of base hp (mostly in shield, some in structure) and changed the max velocity bonus to agility. OP is updated with new numbers. Could you run the numbers on a bulkhead fit?, I dont have any fitting tools or paper with me. 1 DCU, 2 t2 bulkhead, 3 t1 transverse, 3 t2 invuln is around 420k EHP, is that the numbers you were hoping for?
You expecting these ships to be "stoned" TO DEATH?
There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people...
CCP Goliath wrote:
Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
24681
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:10:35 -
[604] - Quote
Master Apollyon wrote:Dont put words in my text. Good thing that I didn't then.
Quote:I never wrote that it was happening. I wrote that "It stops new players from getting into the game. Its a fact (know several personally)". So is it happening or isn't it?
Quote:They knowing that this is possible is enough to think twice about playing Eve... and thats a fact. They only GÇ£knowGÇ£ this because people who should know better keep perpetuating this very nonsensical myth, rather than teach them the hilariously and trivially easy methods that can be employed by anyone to make themselves 100% safe from ganks.
Quote:About my comment to the Bowhead again youre too fast criticizing my phrase. I was just pointing the obvious. No, you made up a completely nonsensical claim that goes directly against the facts and history of the game, not to mention the explicit mention of those who are already planning to use it.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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Master Apollyon
BLACK REGIMENT
0
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:12:32 -
[605] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Quote:CCP, the real problem is not making the old players happy - it is attracting and keeping the new players. You don't attract new players by offering them a watered down version of what they've read about that only feebly replicates an experience they can have in a bajillion other games.
You obviously dont know/play other MMO-¦s |
Master Apollyon
BLACK REGIMENT
0
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:15:46 -
[606] - Quote
Ahahahah. Right... wahtever makes you happy.
What you like more... trolling or ganking? |
Valterra Craven
320
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:16:05 -
[607] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:because criminal activity should in no way be possible to be a permanent career. Why?
Then on the flip, why shouldn't it be that way? |
Valterra Craven
320
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:18:01 -
[608] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:because criminal activity should in no way be possible to be a permanent career. That is probably the most nonsensical thing I have ever seen on these forums. Not only should it be a possible permanent career GÇö it must be a possible permanent career, or the game is broken on a fundamental level and in dire need of a redesign to make the destruction/production/trade cycle work again.
Your flare for exaggeration aside, what is your supporting evidence/argument to make that work? I'm pretty sure that if you compared the destruction amounts from hi sec ganking to low sec and null sec destruction that the numbers would be laughably far apart. If you are going to make that claim then by all means prove it.
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Master Apollyon
BLACK REGIMENT
0
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:19:27 -
[609] - Quote
Dont feed the troll Valterra |
Valterra Craven
320
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:19:55 -
[610] - Quote
Now come back to me when you've run the numbers for people that are not caught after repeatedly doing the same activity for decades or more. Keep in mind that those numbers are for all crimes, which a lot of them could be once or a few times. |
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Querns
GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation
990
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:22:08 -
[611] - Quote
I love this constant assertion that being in highsec is somehow a requirement for new players. My organization is one of the most effective in the game at recruiting brand new players (to the exclusion of all over forms of recruitment, even!) and our policy is to tell newbies to abandon highsec entirely, the second they land in our corporation, and never look back. Hell GÇö I, myself, having only played the game for four years, did exactly this when I was recruited.
This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
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Valterra Craven
320
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:24:44 -
[612] - Quote
Querns wrote:I love this constant assertion that being in highsec is somehow a requirement for new players. My organization is one of the most effective in the game at recruiting brand new players (to the exclusion of all over forms of recruitment, even!) and our policy is to tell newbies to abandon highsec entirely, the second they land in our corporation, and never look back. Hell GÇö I, myself, having only played the game for four years, did exactly this when I was recruited.
Well to be fair, it depends on how far you want to take the argument high sec is a requirement. Its not like you start the game in null sec with all the tutorials there... |
Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans
1662
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:28:10 -
[613] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:Rowells wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:because criminal activity should in no way be possible to be a permanent career. Why? Then on the flip, why shouldn't it be that way? I'm sorry, no. I don't have to explain why someones preferred career is enjoyable. Thats a major aspect as to why to keep it around. Good try flipping the question on me.
So back to you. I'll elaborate as well. For what reasons, should a criminal career option be removed from Eve? Why should an RPG remove the 'R'? How can you justify entirely removing a major part of Eve, and in fact an aspect along the lines I remember signing up for? Granted, I found something else along the way.
So, I ask for the second time. Why? |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
24681
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:28:57 -
[614] - Quote
Master Apollyon wrote:You obviously dont know/play other MMO-¦s You mean those other games that consistently fail almost instantly because they offer nothing new and only ape whatever is already on the market? No, I don't play those and neither do most new players for the very reason I listed. Trying to join that crowd is not a particularly intelligent way to goGǪ
EVE did the impossible and survived for a over a decade by deliberately and specifically not doing that. There is absolutely no reason why it should start now, especially given the ample evidence that it will kill the game in a heartbeat.
Valterra Craven wrote:Your flare for exaggeration aside, what is your supporting evidence/argument to make that work? I'm pretty sure that if you compared the destruction amounts from hi sec ganking to low sec and null sec destruction that the numbers would be laughably far apart. If you are going to make that claim then by all means prove it. It has nothing to do with what is destroyed where (and incidentally, highsec systems sit at the top of the list of destroyed capital, see the FF2012 economy presentation) GÇö it has to do with how you cannot allow one part of the game that level of safety without breaking the industrial-economical balance or the core design principle of letting players dictate how they play and where.
We have only very recently made strides towards letting players actually make that choice, free of moronic and damaging restrictions that have long proven to suffocate the game. What you are suggesting is that they not only return, but are made worse than ever.
Quote:Then on the flip, why shouldn't it be that way? No. Answer his question: why?
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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War Kitten
Panda McLegion
5481
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:29:35 -
[615] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:Now come back to me when you've run the numbers for people that are not caught after repeatedly doing the same activity for decades or more. Keep in mind that those numbers are for all crimes, which a lot of them could be once or a few times.
Keep in mind that as capsuleers, we're like superheros (or super-villains) to the average citizen in the Eve universe. We're Bill Gates-rich - even the poorest newbie that started the game last week has more money and more earning capability than the top 1% of standard citizens. We have the means to nearly any end. Concord can only hope to punish, not prevent. Death does not stop us - we have clones.
So yeah, throw me in jail... give me the death penalty... I'll be back...
EDIT: Oh, and there probably aren't many statistics to run for people that repeat the same crime successfully for decades.... because they're successful at it by definition.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
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Rowells
Unknown Soldiers Fidelas Constans
1662
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:29:48 -
[616] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:Now come back to me when you've run the numbers for people that are not caught after repeatedly doing the same activity for decades or more. Keep in mind that those numbers are for all crimes, which a lot of them could be once or a few times. Maybe you could supply those numbers then? Or do you not have them? |
Valterra Craven
320
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:34:37 -
[617] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:Rowells wrote:Valterra Craven wrote:because criminal activity should in no way be possible to be a permanent career. Why? Then on the flip, why shouldn't it be that way? I'm sorry, no. I don't have to explain why someones preferred career is enjoyable. Thats a major aspect as to why to keep it around. Good try flipping the question on me.
Sorry, but that's not how debates work. I've offered an argument with supporting evidence as to why something shouldn't be a certain way. If you want to make a point other than just to say you are wrong, then go ahead, but otherwise I'm not interested in anything else.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
13854
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:37:04 -
[618] - Quote
CCP could give the damn thing the same tank as the veldnought and they would still bleat that its not enough.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
24681
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:38:21 -
[619] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:Sorry, but that's not how debates work. I've offered an argument with supporting evidence as to why something shouldn't be a certain way. No, you didn't. That's why he asked you why it should be the way you're suggesting.
But you're quite right: what you attempted is now how debates work. When someone asks you GÇ¥whyGÇ¥, returning with a GÇ£why notGÇ¥ means you lost the debate. You have no argument. If you want the debate to end in a different way, you answer the question with an explanation of why the massive and fundamental change you're suggesting is a good one.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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GeeBee
Paragon Fury Tactical Narcotics Team
59
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:38:29 -
[620] - Quote
When first hearing about this thing i was hoping for something a bit bigger / better. It appears this is being balanced towards high sec, is there any chance of another of this class that is bigger better and oriented more towards null? |
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Valterra Craven
320
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:40:55 -
[621] - Quote
Rowells wrote: Maybe you could supply those numbers then? Or do you not have them?
Well that might be hard for modern crimes, but if you look at things historically for example at lets say pirates:
"Most pirates didnGÇÖt last very long. It was a tough line of work: many were killed or injured in battle or in fights amongst themselves, and medical facilities were usually non-existent. Even the most famous pirates, such as Blackbeard or Bartholomew Roberts, only were active in piracy for a couple of years. Roberts, who had a very long and successful career for a pirate, was only active for about three years from 1719 to 1722"
Or we could look at something like mob crime that used to be a big problem back in the day, but the laws changed and today things are different (for the record I've had a lot of experience with "conspiracy" laws and just how easy it is to prosecute someone under them, but if on the other hand you've also gotten to visit your friends in prison, then please don't let me step on your toes)
(As an aside The Daily show just did a skit on this recently about how ineffective the FBI is at actually tracking things http://redalertpolitics.com/2014/10/08/daily-show-searches-one-police-shooting-statistic-doesnt-exist/) |
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
260
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:41:35 -
[622] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:CCP could give the damn thing the same tank as the veldnought and they would still bleat that its not enough.
The tank needs to be enough to incentivize incursion runners to use this ship instead of 100% safe highsec travel with cloak + mwd + travel fit. To the extent that this ship is vulnerable to the Uedama/Niarja gank folks it's not going to be used regularly, and will serve little purpose.
And the only way to give it a good chance to not end up like the blown up freighters is
1) a brink tank
AND
2) the ability to withstand being pinned down by bumping. |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
13854
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:41:41 -
[623] - Quote
GeeBee wrote:When first hearing about this thing i was hoping for something a bit bigger / better. It appears this is being balanced towards high sec, is there any chance of another of this class that is bigger better and oriented more towards null?
Cant let one ship literally transport entire fitted fleets around null. This is as big as it is going to get.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
13854
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:43:22 -
[624] - Quote
Veers Belvar wrote:baltec1 wrote:CCP could give the damn thing the same tank as the veldnought and they would still bleat that its not enough. The tank needs to be enough to incentivize incursion runners to use this ship instead of 100% safe highsec travel with cloak + mwd + travel fit. To the extent that this ship is vulnerable to the Uedama/Niarja gank folks it's not going to be used regularly, and will serve little purpose. And the only way to give it a good chance to not end up like the blown up freighters is 1) a brink tank AND 2) the ability to withstand being pinned down by bumping.
And yet, a 450k ehp tank is not enough for some.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
24681
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:44:59 -
[625] - Quote
Veers Belvar wrote:The tank needs to be enough to incentivize incursion runners to use this ship instead of 100% safe highsec travel with cloak + mwd + travel fit. To the extent that this ship is vulnerable to the Uedama/Niarja gank folks it's not going to be used regularly, and will serve little purpose. The ship already fulfils that prerequisite before we even take the 450k EHP it has into account.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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War Kitten
Panda McLegion
5483
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:49:09 -
[626] - Quote
Valterra Craven wrote:Rowells wrote: Maybe you could supply those numbers then? Or do you not have them?
Well that might be hard for modern crimes, but if you look at things historically for example at lets say pirates: "Most pirates didnGÇÖt last very long. It was a tough line of work: many were killed or injured in battle or in fights amongst themselves, and medical facilities were usually non-existent. Even the most famous pirates, such as Blackbeard or Bartholomew Roberts, only were active in piracy for a couple of years. Roberts, who had a very long and successful career for a pirate, was only active for about three years from 1719 to 1722" Or we could look at something like mob crime that used to be a big problem back in the day, but the laws changed and today things are different (for the record I've had a lot of experience with "conspiracy" laws and just how easy it is to prosecute someone under them, but if on the other hand you've also gotten to visit your friends in prison, then please don't let me step on your toes) (As an aside The Daily show just did a skit on this recently about how ineffective the FBI is at actually tracking things http://redalertpolitics.com/2014/10/08/daily-show-searches-one-police-shooting-statistic-doesnt-exist/)
That's not data, those are anecdotes.
Also, medical technology has seen a few improvements in the Eve world of piracy compared to the 18th century.
I find that without a good mob to provide one for them, most people would have no mentality at all.
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Valterra Craven
320
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:49:50 -
[627] - Quote
Tippia wrote:It has nothing to do with what is destroyed where (and incidentally, highsec systems sit at the top of the list of destroyed capital, see the FF2012 economy presentation) GÇö it has to do with how you cannot allow one part of the game that level of safety without breaking the industrial-economical balance or the core design principle of letting players dictate how they play and where.
We have only very recently made strides towards letting players actually make that choice, free of moronic and damaging restrictions that have long proven to suffocate the game. What you are suggesting is that they not only return, but are made worse than ever.
So my argument was that hi sec ganking should not be a permanent career. Your counter was that if it wasn't that it would destroy the game because it would imbalance the cycle needed for things to work out properly, aka things created need to be destroyed.
But the problem is that this argument is nonsensical because the items destroyed in hi sec ganking do not equal, nor do they account for more than a few percentage points of the total output that hi sec produces. Further to the point, if what you say IS true, then all of the recent nerfs to ganking would have started a death spiral in the economy, when that has clearly not happened.
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Fruckton Haulalot
Imperial Academy Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:51:04 -
[628] - Quote
again.... the ehp is not highe enough..... again at present... an ORCA fitt right can have over 450k ehp.... the BOWHEAD will be hauling far more valuble cargo... so it should be around 550k ehp at a minimum..... |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
24681
|
Posted - 2014.11.11 19:54:03 -
[629] - Quote
War Kitten wrote:That's not data, those are anecdotes.
Also, medical technology has seen a few improvements in the Eve world of piracy compared to the 18th century. Not to mention that EVE is not real life, nor would it be improved by being like real life. Presumably, we should remove space ships and stations as wellGǪ
Valterra Craven wrote:So my argument was that hi sec ganking should not be a permanent career. Your counter was that if it wasn't that it would destroy the game because it would imbalance the cycle needed for things to work out properly, aka things created need to be destroyed.
But the problem is that this argument is nonsensical because GǪyou have decided to not look up the facts of the matter and are just guessing and hoping for the best. More than that, you also skipped over a significant portion of my actual argument GÇö the one concerning the need for everything to be destructible everywhere, or the game breaks from the imbalance.
Oh, and you still didn't answer the question GÇ£why?GÇ¥
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
Get a good start: Newbie skillplan 2.2.
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Valterra Craven
320
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Posted - 2014.11.11 19:56:42 -
[630] - Quote
Tippia wrote:
GǪyou have decided to not look up the facts of the matter and are just guessing and hoping for the best. More than that, you also skipped over a significant portion of my actual argument GÇö the one concerning the need for everything to be destructible everywhere, or the game breaks from the imbalance.
Oh, and you still didn't answer the question GÇ£why?GÇ¥
Facts of what matter? That nerfs to hi sec ganking haven't destroyed the economy? Also I never addressed that part of the argument because A. I never said they shouldn't and B. I agree with you.
Oh and I did answer the question. Look at my original post. Its stated pretty clearly there for anyone taking the time to read it.
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