Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 [19] 20 30 40 50 60 .. 64 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.11.30 12:18:00 -
[541]
Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 30/11/2007 12:18:24
Originally by: PeacefullNub
Minmatars and amarrs have allmost no direct changes. But it is 2 races that need them. It is not even Trinity - it is Power of Two
Amarr EW will be getting a 50% reduction nerf on both atributes. Scripts will juggle the 50% around between atributes though.
This makes tracking disruptrers compleatly useless.... Unless of course, it could effect missles and falloff. If it did that then Amarr EW would be useful.
Amarr are getting a EW frig. Its EW power is Neuts. I have no idea why anyone would fly such a thing since there are better ships that outclass it, as the frig lack cap to sustain any proper role /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Talio ZomB
|
Posted - 2007.11.30 19:19:00 -
[542]
I would just like to say thats a nice analyisis if gank vs gank, tank vs tank, but a lot of your setups arent practical, they might see use on sisi, but on tq toys are needed.
didnt see the trimark plate setups getting tested, I did skim read
|
BekStorm
|
Posted - 2007.11.30 20:29:00 -
[543]
Originally by: The ArchWarder Significant points raised Interesting Approach Great read Not really all the long Energy weapon ships definatly need SOMETHING Dont think CCP can ignore this one
Ditto. well written and constructive post.
|
Veng3ance
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
|
Posted - 2007.11.30 20:52:00 -
[544]
WOW
**** anyone who disagrees with the op.
If you don't fly Amarr don't argue.
The frustration of running out of cap from ONLY firing weapons is BEYOND ANNOYING.
Actually, just thinking about it makes me want to BURN THIS MOTHER****** DOWN!
|
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.11.30 23:51:00 -
[545]
I dont agree with the OP
|
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 00:09:00 -
[546]
Originally by: Goumindong I dont agree with the OP
What is it that you dont agree with? /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 08:04:00 -
[547]
Originally by: Jonny JoJo
Originally by: Goumindong I dont agree with the OP
What is it that you dont agree with?
The part about it being blatantly misleading.
If there is one area that Amarr dont have problems in, its ganking battleships with pulse lasers.
|
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 10:13:00 -
[548]
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Jonny JoJo
Originally by: Goumindong I dont agree with the OP
What is it that you dont agree with?
The part about it being blatantly misleading.
If there is one area that Amarr dont have problems in, its ganking battleships with pulse lasers.
I dont understand. Before EANM's, lasers did same damage as they do now. EANM's nerfed laser damage, as everyone who wanted to remain competitive changed their tank setups. So lasers do 25-35% less damage than they used to when they were balanced (calculating the EM potion of extra resist people now have). To deny this now is not logical /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Error404
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 11:03:00 -
[549]
You are sad and have no life, i suggest you go out and get laid Virgin.
|
Ooyama
Caldari Rastana CMP
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 11:12:00 -
[550]
Edited by: Ooyama on 01/12/2007 11:12:42 Well,,, being a (now) mostly Amarr specced char, and flying a baddon, which i enjoy,, i feel it's about time something IS done. I've reached a point where i can fire my lasers for quite a while before running outta cap, but if i need to run reppers at the same time i'm screwed! I know that problems occur on other ships aswell,, but not as fast!
To anyone disagreeing ; imagine your rails/blasters/arty's/autoshotties/launchers using cap like lasers,, while offcourse using cap for reppers/shieldbosters!!
If you don't see any problem there, start flying Amarr!!!
Ooyama.
Originally by: Bimjo
you sir are quite right my humble apologies I shall park my navy raven in 0.0 for you to come and destroy with your ducktaped missile launcher on your shuttle
|
|
Frug
Zenithal Harvest
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 11:32:00 -
[551]
Originally by: Error404 You are sad and have no life, i suggest you go out and get laid Virgin.
Quoting the lamest post I've seen all day.
- - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles |
Liam Liam
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 11:40:00 -
[552]
Amarr has had it . It isn't getting fixed yes it might get a small boost here and there but the devs don't see a fundemental problem.
What to do
1. Advise all new starts not to train Amarr ships / weapons 2. Crosstrain into something else ... just got minmitar frigate 5 .. lol
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world The unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself
|
Laechyd Eldgorn
Caldari Karjala Inc. Onnenpyora
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 12:14:00 -
[553]
Quote: bear in mind here that Caldari ships also require no cap
I detect epic fail there. Anyone?
|
PeacefullNub
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 12:21:00 -
[554]
Originally by: Liam Liam yes it might get a small boost here and there
amarrs is only race that need many small boosts allmost in all aspects of their ships and guns. (only khanid ships are relativly ballanced... for caldary) but many smal boosts = average
Originally by: Liam Liam
1. Advise all new starts not to train Amarr ships / weapons 2. Crosstrain into something else ... just got minmitar frigate 5 .. lol
We also do so. But its not the solution of a problem.
Originally by: Liam Liam
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world The unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself
You want an easy life? Go play caldary from start - no need to cross-train from amarr build at all. This phrase does not concern to amarr. Amarrinas adapt world to themselves. We choose the most difficult way - to be proud of our victory in the end.
|
nthexwn
Amarr
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 13:08:00 -
[555]
Heh,
I remember when I played EVE. It's that game where you pay CCP to let your Amarr character sit around training skills while you wait for Gallente to be nerfed so you'll stand a fighting chance in PVP, and in the meantime you play other games right?
|
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 13:26:00 -
[556]
Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 01/12/2007 13:26:13
Originally by: Error404 You are sad and have no life, i suggest you go out and get laid Virgin.
I would, were it not for the fact that my Geddon caps out after 30 seconds! /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 13:30:00 -
[557]
Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 01/12/2007 13:36:17
Originally by: Liam Liam Amarr has had it . It isn't getting fixed yes it might get a small boost here and there but the devs don't see a fundemental problem.
What to do
1. Advise all new starts not to train Amarr ships / weapons 2. Crosstrain into something else ... just got minmitar frigate 5 .. lol
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world The unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself
hello Mr "One should take punishment with a smile"
Sorry - that only works if you have the power to control the subject matter. If I went into Pizza hut and found the pizza's to be great but the coke to be flat, do I adapt myself by drinking flat cola? In that case, I have no power to get fresh cola, therefore I make my view knowns so that the business can fix its problems, because if you dont have problems, then you are not a business!
Same thing here. Amarr are flat, though the pizza is nice. Therefore I am making my views known. Being asertive is very important, and the person who adapts passively to everthing is nothing more than a fool.
After all, look at every nerf to have hit over the past year - each and every one was a result of someone spotting a flat coke.
Eve will never have perfect balace. Its not ment to, and even for the next 10 years, there will always be things to change. But what is happening with Amarr is a complete joke, and needs to be looked at. The fizz has long gone, and the Devs needs to re-balance Amarr in todays PvP climate. Not boost, or OMGWTF, but just make sure that the coke I am buying is actually a fizzy drink and not a stale fluid. /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Potes
Amarr Dkiller Delta Force Corp. Knights Of the Southerncross
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 14:04:00 -
[558]
signed!! Amarr need balancing love! specifically laser using cap gimped ships! and for f*s sakes fix the bldy recons!
Altho following statistics us amarrians make up a piddly small percentage of the playerbase CCP MUST HEAR US?!??! and if they arnt doing anything r they just ignoring a percentage of the playerbase cos they all fly caldari?
rgrds Potes
|
Legio Praetor
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 15:53:00 -
[559]
I just realised i made the same mistake in EvE as i did in WoW... I picked the Amarr in EvE, and i made a paladin in WoW.
They both have the same problem it seems... Underpowered, unloved and ignored by the devs.
Signed.
|
Trind2222
Amarr Celestial Pillagers Brutally Clever Empire
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 16:18:00 -
[560]
To have a cap bonus on lasers so we can use same amount of cap as low skilled hybryd turrets do not work this ccp cal balance? Mids sloth and to much high sloth we want more mids sloth. Abandon is best ship amarr have why it do not have cap bonus but a damage bonus hmm how odd is bs before trinty that have damagebounus. Ok there another one but because you use so much cap it do not help is famous geddon whit rof bonus so it can spew out cap.
Some solusion is remove the utility high slot add mid sloth remove cap bonus is do not balance amarr it kills amarr reduce fitting req on laser cap req and fix amarr listen to players flying amarr.
|
|
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 16:46:00 -
[561]
Originally by: Jonny JoJo
I dont understand. Before EANM's, lasers did same damage as they do now. EANM's nerfed laser damage, as everyone who wanted to remain competitive changed their tank setups. So lasers do 25-35% less damage than they used to when they were balanced (calculating the EM potion of extra resist people now have). To deny this now is not logical
Before comp skills lasers were horribly overpowered, ships had 64% of the hit points they did now[or possibly less], and heat sinks were not heavily stacking penalized.
|
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 17:26:00 -
[562]
Originally by: Goumindong
Originally by: Jonny JoJo
I dont understand. Before EANM's, lasers did same damage as they do now. EANM's nerfed laser damage, as everyone who wanted to remain competitive changed their tank setups. So lasers do 25-35% less damage than they used to when they were balanced (calculating the EM potion of extra resist people now have). To deny this now is not logical
Before comp skills lasers were horribly overpowered, ships had 64% of the hit points they did now[or possibly less], and heat sinks were not heavily stacking penalized.
Oh yeah, thats true. I forgot when they boosted every ships hitpoints by 50%. This means more cap needed to make a kill, even if you ignore the high EM resist on armour /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Goumindong
Amarr Merch Industrial GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2007.12.01 18:28:00 -
[563]
Cap isnt the issue to make a kill, its time relative to time to close.
|
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 00:52:00 -
[564]
Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 02/12/2007 00:53:03
Originally by: Goumindong Cap isnt the issue to make a kill, its time relative to time to close.
Time to close is an issue since for a amarr to fight, it has to MWD away from the hostile while keeping it in scrambler range at 20-24k. Except your guns use so much cap that you need 2 cap boosters to support this style of play. Cap is a big issue and even for a sniper Abaddon, that can sustain 1 gun with max cap skills, do you really expect people to beleive cap is not a issue for Amarr? /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
NUKUNNI TRADING
Amarr Antares Frontier The Fifth Race
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 01:38:00 -
[565]
1) Please sort out beam laser range so that they can compare with other sniper weapons 2) A little bit more damage for lasers so that they can hurt the 85% of PvPers who armor tank 3) Repair the damage that's been done to the Curse / Pilgrim 4) Stop making us learn heathen weapon systems (ie rockets, HAMs) 5) A real bonus to ships instead of a cap 'bonus' that doesnt go nearly half way to resolving the cap issues that the supposed 'cap race' suffers from
I think that covers it as far as I know..... oh yeah, tracking disruptors suck too (apparently) but tbh, they seem such a stupid system compared to other EW systems that I've never bothered with them. A damp seems far more useful, but oh, not really enough slots considering you need to use what few meds you have for cap mods to 'try' to keep your guns going while you soak up damage.
|
John Blackthorn
Foundation R0ADKILL
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 02:25:00 -
[566]
Very Interesting post but I'd like to point out that:
In your statement about shield tanking allows you to do anything you like in the lows is an advantage will so is armor tanking were you can use mid slots for offensive modules like web,scram, painter, tracking disruptors..etc etc..
And the fact that you used all 8 slots of a scorpion for tank which no one would do.. whats the point if you use it and not jam something?
And final point is armor tanking is better than shield tanking in fleet fights for the most part because of lag. By the time your shield starts showing your being hit your normally already in armor :P at least when your armor tanking and see your shield taking its you know its time to turn on the armor rep and align for warp out.
-John
|
Aranbaal
Minmatar Malevolent Intentions
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 02:58:00 -
[567]
Well having read the OP i desided to crunch the numbers .. With al skills at lvl 5 and 3 dmg mods fitted on each ship heres what i get with the tier 3 bs's. These are all with highest dmg t2 ammo.
Dmg
Mega - 949dps Abaddon - 929dps Mael - 890dps rokh - 867dps
So the abaddon comes second in the dmg stakes here by a mere 20dps. Ina fight the abaddon (and all amarr ships) have one advantage over every other race which everyone seems to forget. They can switch ammo types to the best one for teh job in a fraction of the time. Which means there guns are active more maing them the most effective. Also factor in that lasers dont need regular reloads in the fight (and if if your crystals do pop it is a fraction of the ime to add new ones) gives the abaddon a better effective dps. If the other ships had to reload 3 times during the fight thats 30 seconds of not shooting.. so thats 929x30 = 27870 extra dmg the abaddon does in that fight over any of the other ships.
I havent included drones in this dmg because i for one never get to use drones. I am a low sec pirate and drones get popped by gate guns so arent worth using to teh averae pirate.
Range
Abaddon - 25km Rokh - 16.3km Mega - 13.1km Mael - 13km
So abaddon is clear winner here with lasers having much better range than other guns.
Tank
Well you cant really compare armor tanks with shield tanks. Tere are far too many difference's to factor in.
Armor 1st Abaddon 2nd Mega
Shield 1st Rohk 2d Mael
usin the omni tank of 2x eanm 1xdcu and 1 repper on the armor tankers teh abaddon is far better than the mega its resist bonus's give it a much more effective tank.
So in conclusion, after doin the maths myself i cannot see what is worng with amarr and lasers. Do the maths yourself and you will see that in a normal fight the abaddon is far better than the other tier 3 battleships.
Am i missing something here ? whats broken?
|
Jonny JoJo
Amarr Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 03:12:00 -
[568]
Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 02/12/2007 03:14:15
Originally by: Aranbaal Well having read the OP i desided to crunch the numbers .. With al skills at lvl 5 and 3 dmg mods fitted on each ship heres what i get with the tier 3 bs's. These are all with highest dmg t2 ammo.
Dmg
Mega - 949dps Abaddon - 929dps Mael - 890dps rokh - 867dps
So the abaddon comes second in the dmg stakes here by a mere 20dps. Ina fight the abaddon (and all amarr ships) have one advantage over every other race which everyone seems to forget. They can switch ammo types to the best one for teh job in a fraction of the time. Which means there guns are active more maing them the most effective. Also factor in that lasers dont need regular reloads in the fight (and if if your crystals do pop it is a fraction of the ime to add new ones) gives the abaddon a better effective dps. If the other ships had to reload 3 times during the fight thats 30 seconds of not shooting.. so thats 929x30 = 27870 extra dmg the abaddon does in that fight over any of the other ships.
I havent included drones in this dmg because i for one never get to use drones. I am a low sec pirate and drones get popped by gate guns so arent worth using to teh averae pirate.
Range
Abaddon - 25km Rokh - 16.3km Mega - 13.1km Mael - 13km
So abaddon is clear winner here with lasers having much better range than other guns.
Tank
Well you cant really compare armor tanks with shield tanks. Tere are far too many difference's to factor in.
Armor 1st Abaddon 2nd Mega
Shield 1st Rohk 2d Mael
usin the omni tank of 2x eanm 1xdcu and 1 repper on the armor tankers teh abaddon is far better than the mega its resist bonus's give it a much more effective tank.
So in conclusion, after doin the maths myself i cannot see what is worng with amarr and lasers. Do the maths yourself and you will see that in a normal fight the abaddon is far better than the other tier 3 battleships.
Am i missing something here ? whats broken?
1. Crystal take longer than conventional ammo to change if you have more than 4 turrets. This is because all slots load up the same crystal, as crystals load up differently from conventional ammo, as t2/faction crystals (i.E pvp crystals) they load up in different stacks. Also, players need to carry 16 minimum, sometimes as much as 32 or 48 crystals (to cover long and shortrange, and a backup set should they blow) this is 40-60mil in ammo.
Next, DPS. What is the DPS does Amarr do? Thats right, EM, which is the highist resist on Armour tankers and the second highist resit on Shield tankers. (2 invul II = 1 EM hardner) Now work out the real DPS done after resist - you will see Amarr doing almost half real damage.
Range. your chart is inaccurate. Rokh is longest range, able to hit 249km in sniper mode. Amarr with long range ammo need 3-4 tracking mods to be able to hit 160+. Except they have no slots free after fitting mods and heatsinks/cap mods. unless they want to cut back on recharge/damage, which is what they are doing currently. other races do not have this as a problem.
Tank. Abaddon has resist bonus, so does rokh. Shield tankers are better than armour tankers for tank function, so Rokh wins here. Abaddon resist bonus does not mean much if it has to throw slots away for cap recharge/fitting as a player could put in a EANM and get the same effect.
In your post, if we follow your logic, a Rokh using tach is the best ship for range + tank. Obviously this is not correct, now is it? /CCP fix for Amarr is in EVE Trinity - The Trinity of training either Caldari, Gallente or Minmatar! |
Terianna Eri
Amarr STK Scientific Black-Out
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 03:36:00 -
[569]
Originally by: Aranbaal stuff
Mega is not a teir 3 battleship. __________________________________
|
daemorhedron
|
Posted - 2007.12.02 03:38:00 -
[570]
Edited by: daemorhedron on 02/12/2007 03:39:08
Originally by: NUKUNNI TRADING 1) Please sort out beam laser range so that they can compare with other sniper weapons
Sorry, can't agree with this one. You have your unique benefits and draw backs, you can't exactly go around demanding to have the benefits of the other races in addition to your own.
Originally by: NUKUNNI TRADING 2) A little bit more damage for lasers so that they can hurt the 85% of PvPers who armor tank
Again, just can't agree. You absolutely slaughter shields and have a tough time with armor. It's the trade off you make. Fit drones, ewar, nos, neuts, etc to compliment your damage if you're having such a tough time.
Originally by: NUKUNNI TRADING 3) Repair the damage that's been done to the Curse / Pilgrim
Iffy on this one. To be brutally honest, Nos went from a 'must have' to 'who cares'. I feel it's balanced, but it did take away from the uniqueness of the Amarr recons. Most curse/pilgrim pilots have been able to adapt, but there are other minor issues with the ship in general. Rework yes, but you don't be getting your unstoppable recon back, sorry.
Originally by: NUKUNNI TRADING 4) Stop making us learn heathen weapon systems (ie rockets, HAMs)
Truth for sure here. This is a relatively lame addressing of some really serious issues that was pretty insulting. Fix lasers already, it's really not that hard.
Originally by: NUKUNNI TRADING 5) A real bonus to ships instead of a cap 'bonus' that doesnt go nearly half way to resolving the cap issues that the supposed 'cap race' suffers from
abso-farkin-lutely YES PLEASE. Again this is the only immediate Amarr related issue that NEEDS fixing. Everything else lies in lasers, and we can argue further minutia down the road.
Originally by: NUKUNNI TRADING oh yeah, tracking disruptors suck too (apparently)
Not at all. I can't really speak as to what's coming with trinity, but they're incredibly handy and really one of the few EW systems that are already balanced and make 'sense'. Whole other issue to get into though, so that's all I'll say on it for now.
Long story short, fix laser fittings, fix laser cap usage, change the amarrian laser cap usage bonus to something useful plskthx.
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 [19] 20 30 40 50 60 .. 64 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |