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C4w3 Minmatar Corp 1 Allstars	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:30:00 - [991] Originally by: Athena Attom Originally by: C4w3 GOD blees Chribbster and eve-search, And if this is TRUE! Shame on you CCP! and Expose the moneyprinting four!!! taken from eve-search http://eve-search.com/thread/216634/page/2#47 Maltroc Take me to the EVE-Online forum thread View author employment history View author posting habits View only posts by author Posted - 2005.09.01 16:30:00 - [47] Edited by: Maltroc on 01/09/2005 16:31:30 Originally by: kieronWhat Hakera said is spot on. The directives for claim reimbursement that CCP has given the GM team is the most fair based on the tools available. To be honest, most companies have a zero reimbursement policy, so EVE is a bit more free than the others. Kieron could you check your email (I know you receive loads and are quite busy :) because our corp suffered from POS exploit some time ago. We petioned the event with quite a bit of evidence (fraps, howto). The GM closed the petition while providing another "solution" for the events. This caused a lot of frustration. Their solution isn't possible the given game mechanics. A second unanswered petition is still going this ages without answer while the first was lost... Now some days ago the same exploit happened again with another G POS. Well you can guess that we are a bit frustrated since we provided information how it happened while we get told something that doesn't even work. </understatement> PS: I won't go into the details because it would just get the thread locked. stop stealing my posts! Sorry m8te Confirming you R O C K ANGRY INTERNET GAMING MOBS IRL are bad MKAY!
Johncrab Minmatar XBeyond	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:31:00 - [992] Originally by: LoganFire One thing that CCP are not telling you is that this exploit was used and abused by Gms, thats why it never been spotted till now This is starting to look like the most likelly scenario tbh. Hard to believe it but everything I've seen so far on this subject points in that direction.
MyOwnSling Gallente Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:33:00 - [993] Originally by: LoganFire One thing that CCP are not telling you is that this exploit was used and abused by Gms, thats why it never been spotted till now lol proof? ------------- Stop whining. Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face... Originally by: MooKids I have an elite rating in HULL TANKING! That is like saying I can block punches with my face.
ZXohne	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:33:00 - [994] This is one absolutely excellent game with so many mechanics it will keep us talking forever and of course we have the "old women" who like to moan, the brats that like to feel better about their poverty by saying "aha that is how they got so rich!!!!!11" the list of ppl goes on. We really should see this for the human error that it has been and add some logic and reason to it. Speculating here but it sounds like a petition got deleted a few times which means that CCP is reliant on Dev's/GM's etc. which is perfectly acceptable since this is a game with many mechanics and it is impossible to take responsibility for everything and watch over every single detail i.e. it is very possible for something like this to happen. Yet CCP has shown that they are handling it - even though it is a scandal. Imho we should ask ourselves "do I enjoy this game" and then add some fun and ask for heads to roll in the light of this fraud (yarr). But to say that you will quit EVE for an exploit that was covered up by individuals inside EVE??? You are the reason why CCP have to handle us like customers and not as gamers. You are the reason some dev's go home tonight cussing at EVE cos certain brats just have to throw a tantrum cos they cannot accept the things they cannot change. Can you not think that certain things are just unreasonable to ask (rollback the game to before the exploit, I want to keep my skill point emo)? CCP has shown their attitude by facing all the moaning emo brats and saying that there was an exploit etc. etc. Stop being such *****s and think from their perspective THEN ask your questions. Relax EVE is a game that favor brains, a cheater in EVE can never win forever :P - suddenly no more free moon minerals and too many POS's where does the fuel come from? Suddenly the rich titan pilot isn't so care-free anymore and he has to do something for isk - killmail. Don't you think it will be fun to take the prized POS's down? Then where do those illegal titans go? on our killmails ofcourse - the list goes on, use your imagination. My point is that the cheating WILL come our way in one form or another and this is just a game. CCP I love you \o/
Karla Kay	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:34:00 - [995] CCP alt spotted
Razer Morphis Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:37:00 - [996] Originally by: SilverSoldier Edited by: SilverSoldier on 10/12/2008 21:41:28 dang.. 2nd page.. 4years is allot of iskies... ALLOT! share the wealth! or will i get banned for that?:P No, but you should get banned for making up such a dreadful typo. ----------------------
Gamer4liff Caldari Metalworks THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:37:00 - [997] Well there's your 4 year's proof right there.
Deva Blackfire coracao ardente	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:37:00 - [998] Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 11/12/2008 19:38:49 Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 11/12/2008 19:38:01 Originally by: Aramith oh yes tribute is a crap region. i gues 11+ systems with crockite (3 that also contain mercoxit and have atleast 18 belts) including one with 30+ belts is complete and total crap. not to mention the complexes mentioned earlier by an MM member (atleast one 10/10 and one 8/10). yeah that is a real crap region. If that is not good enough of a region for you then maybe your standards for what is a good region are a little too high. belts are crap - they dont give much isk even if you take 10% from renters refines. They have no chance to actually compete with plexes. And when it comes to plexes: nu-uh. Tribute didnt have 8/10 nor 10/10. Closest 8/10 was in VENAL and it was farmed by RZR/MM/omen more-less same amount of time. Thus income from that plex for MM alone was pretty low. Another 8/10 was around KW-. This one was farmed by RZR (well actually me + lovekebab) and later was "given" to russkies so they could farm it. Last 8/10 in the area was in tenal-branch pathway and it was farmed by D2. When it comes to 10/10 there was one in aa- area (systems where razor have 3-4 outposts, sov4 and stuff) but almost noone did it - because at the time 10/10 plexes were MUCH harder (random respawns which pretty much locked down compy) and dropped crap (x-type loot but about 10% drop rate or less). This plex got fixed after my petitions (both loot and respawns) tho it was just before exploration kicked in and statics were removed. From "good" thingies in the area there was 6/10 plex 1 jump from EOY (tenal) but it was bugged and wasnt dropping loot. It got fixed at same time as 10/10 - just before exploration kicked in (or even at the same time). So no, when it comes to plexes tribute was crap - Tenal and Venal were goldmines. No idea how it is with moons, im not a moon miner.
Madius	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:38:00 - [999] Edited by: Madius on 11/12/2008 19:38:08 Originally by: ZXohne :words: My point is that the cheating WILL come our way in one form or another and this is just a game. CCP I love you \o/ You're right, it is "just a game". And maybe it's time to hit the reset button.
Razer Morphis Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:39:00 - [1000] Originally by: Highpriest Aden I dont belive for a single second that CCP hasent know this for quite some time, there is a fixed number of C64 moons ingame, and they are all beeing harvestet 24/7. So with some reverse Enginering it would have been foolishing easy to see exactly how much is beeing produced. CCP do not "reverse engineer", that's a bit illegal. They are busy for the last 4 years fixing the lag. ----------------------
Allanah Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:41:00 - [1001] Originally by: C4w3 GOD blees Chribbster and eve-search, And if this is TRUE! Shame on you CCP! and Expose the moneyprinting four!!! taken from eve-search http://eve-search.com/thread/216634/page/2#47 Maltroc Take me to the EVE-Online forum thread View author employment history View author posting habits View only posts by author Posted - 2005.09.01 16:30:00 - [47] Edited by: Maltroc on 01/09/2005 16:31:30 Originally by: kieronWhat Hakera said is spot on. The directives for claim reimbursement that CCP has given the GM team is the most fair based on the tools available. To be honest, most companies have a zero reimbursement policy, so EVE is a bit more free than the others. Kieron could you check your email (I know you receive loads and are quite busy :) because our corp suffered from POS exploit some time ago. We petioned the event with quite a bit of evidence (fraps, howto). The GM closed the petition while providing another "solution" for the events. This caused a lot of frustration. Their solution isn't possible the given game mechanics. A second unanswered petition is still going this ages without answer while the first was lost... Now some days ago the same exploit happened again with another G POS. Well you can guess that we are a bit frustrated since we provided information how it happened while we get told something that doesn't even work. </understatement> PS: I won't go into the details because it would just get the thread locked. If this has indeed been going on for 4 years as suggested by the SH forums and this eve-o post, then the whole market is completly ... i dont even know what to say. The market, the 0.0 mechanics, just about everything in the game would be VERY affected by this. This is bad... TeamSpeak/Vent and forum hosting services
Charles Javeroux Gallente INTERSTELLAR CREDIT	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:41:00 - [1002] So the bad guys were caught. I speculate that after this incident, 2-3 trillions of ISK were written off with banned accounts and assets. Just like that...one big ISK sink. Quite a big impact on EVE market ---- - INTERSTELLAR CREDIT - your trade, our finance ----
Bimjo Caldari Domination. Sc0rched Earth	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:42:00 - [1003] Can we have a list of offenders please ? ====================
MyOwnSling Gallente Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:43:00 - [1004] Originally by: Allanah If this has indeed been going on for 4 years as suggested by the SH forums and this eve-o post, then the whole market is completly ... i dont even know what to say. The market, the 0.0 mechanics, just about everything in the game would be VERY affected by this. This is bad... Yeah, pretty much, considering the sheer volume that would have been injected into the market. ------------- Stop whining. Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face... Originally by: MooKids I have an elite rating in HULL TANKING! That is like saying I can block punches with my face.
Serrin Shamandar	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:43:00 - [1005] Originally by: Madius Edited by: Madius on 11/12/2008 19:31:58 Edited by: Madius on 11/12/2008 19:30:46 Originally by: Serrin Shamandar Yes, but also the one that continually only caught many, some, or just a few of them. Numbers as far as "rusted" items were released, but once you lose track of duped materials - you might as well have either one or two of them - or a million. Good auditing decreases the millions down to something manageable before it wrecks the game environment. I honestly don't see how they could've done any better given the framework. They pretty much have to go through the entire server item list and compare IDs, which would be enormously stressful to do all at once. Remember, D2/battle.net wasn't a "true" MMO and was never designed as such; it was a single-player game that could also be played online, and the data structures reflected that, for better or for worse. Also, when I referred to Blizzard, I meant WoW in particular, which has a far better internal tracking system than D2, and I'd bet a good deal better than EVE's. Er, sorry 'bout that - Blizzard to me usually means the Diablo and StarCraft franchises. I never really got in to Wow, and really don't know or want to know much about it. I'm aware that the framework in D2 imposed some limitations - but nothing says that you couldn't do a slower constantly running ruststorm that would probably shake and/or destroy the market rather than an hours long insanely resource intensive one that happened long after the market had glutted with cheap and easily available dupes.
Vigilant Gallente Vigilant's Vigilante's	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:43:00 - [1006] Originally by: Millenia Fallenwing Edited by: Millenia Fallenwing on 11/12/2008 19:02:18 Band of Brothers alliance have always known about exploits and have always known and used them to their advantage. 20 Large towers in 3 different systems. With the Same setup as listed how to get this exploit. So i would request. Can someone please prove that BoB did not exploit this, nor were they involved with this. I have no solid proof. However all of the towers are exact same setup, in 3 different systems. Over the past 6 months HUGE amounts of dyspro has been stolen by directors defecting. So only asking who is involved and how that effects other alliance growth. Proof or STFU Also post with your alliance main you twit ! (Damm now I am defending BoB, and I can 't alliances)
drondo	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:45:00 - [1007] i know in addition to banning said players, corps and alliances CCP should donate all of their seized/impounded/forefitted items, ships and materials to the rest of the eve world. i know i would love to have a shiny new ror or a cool high dollar bpo hehehehe see we all would win from their screw up
Miss Ticca	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:45:00 - [1008] Jita market is going crazy All tech2 modules are gone.... run while you can!
Solomon XI Hoist The Colors. Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:46:00 - [1009] Quote: On December 7th 2008, a date which will live in infamy, a petition from a concerned player alerted us to a serious problem with Starbase reactors. The petition had been filed five days earlier, a far longer waiting time than we can accept with our current queue status and we have now taken measures to fix that. We immediately started investigating the issue and found that there was indeed a problem and that it was being exploited to gain unfair advantages. We discovered seven corporations with multiple Starbases set up for the express purpose of exploiting the issue. Three of those corporations were members of two alliances. We took immediate action against the offenders and banned over 70 accounts and destroyed all the Starbases run by the corporations in question. All the offending corporations are now effectively inactive as a result of our actions. The corporations were producing high end materials for T2 production. Working with the Research & Statistics team we have established that the effects on the markets have been considerable and far reaching. The effects of our actions against the exploiters will also be felt on the market as the production of the materials has been cut substantially. However, supply should increase again once players have mastered the alchemy process. We are still conducting operations to deal with this matter and we will keep you posted on the progress and results as things develop. Update: This matter will be brought up at a CSM and CCP meeting this upcoming weekend. Alright, that is a good start. However you've failed to address other important issues, CCP. Obviously, the impact on the economy was significant. But you reset all market history, thus hurting the innocent and honest players. What form of ... restitution is planned? Outposts, Super-Capitals, and the like. We KNOW this exploit funded them. And won some 0.0 sov wars. How do you handle the huge 0.0 political mess this has created? I have unanswered questions.
Calleb	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:48:00 - [1010] This is bad m'kay no doubt about it. But 4 years? - Has it even been possible to do POS reactions for 4 years? If so then my life has been completely sucked away and I am going to petition that - lol
MyOwnSling Gallente Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:49:00 - [1011] Originally by: Solomon XI Quote: On December 7th 2008, a date which will live in infamy, a petition from a concerned player alerted us to a serious problem with Starbase reactors. The petition had been filed five days earlier, a far longer waiting time than we can accept with our current queue status and we have now taken measures to fix that. We immediately started investigating the issue and found that there was indeed a problem and that it was being exploited to gain unfair advantages. We discovered seven corporations with multiple Starbases set up for the express purpose of exploiting the issue. Three of those corporations were members of two alliances. We took immediate action against the offenders and banned over 70 accounts and destroyed all the Starbases run by the corporations in question. All the offending corporations are now effectively inactive as a result of our actions. The corporations were producing high end materials for T2 production. Working with the Research & Statistics team we have established that the effects on the markets have been considerable and far reaching. The effects of our actions against the exploiters will also be felt on the market as the production of the materials has been cut substantially. However, supply should increase again once players have mastered the alchemy process. We are still conducting operations to deal with this matter and we will keep you posted on the progress and results as things develop. Update: This matter will be brought up at a CSM and CCP meeting this upcoming weekend. Alright, that is a good start. However you've failed to address other important issues, CCP. Obviously, the impact on the economy was significant. But you reset all market history, thus hurting the innocent and honest players. What form of ... restitution is planned? Outposts, Super-Capitals, and the like. We KNOW this exploit funded them. And won some 0.0 sov wars. How do you handle the huge 0.0 political mess this has created? I have unanswered questions. From some of the unsubstantiated posts I have read, the offenders have apparently lost titans, poses, and of course all assets due to bans. Take that as you will. ------------- Stop whining. Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face... Originally by: MooKids I have an elite rating in HULL TANKING! That is like saying I can block punches with my face.
Razer Morphis Minmatar Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:49:00 - [1012] Originally by: XxHey BabyxX well you will know soon though bob and exe are to stupid to do something like this And you are too stupid to spell "too" correctly. ----------------------
Orree Shiva Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:50:00 - [1013] Originally by: Dianabolic Originally by: Orree snip Orree, take it from me - it doesn't matter what you say. To some, you are guilty, to others, you are innocent, nothing you say will change that. To the rest of us, you're innocent until proven guilty / banned. May as well save your breath mate, CCP are the only people that can clear / condemn you... and even then, the first paragraph still holds true ;) Originally by: Shadoo Originally by: Kuar Z'thain So... wheres the lynch mob to go after Evoke? Guess it's not fun when the target isn't BoB. I say we form a lynch mob to go after BoB anyway. You know, just because! +1!!! Sage advice, no doubt and I appreciate it, bud. I have to try (at least once), though. It's in my blood. So interesting the way EVE turns... "How much easier it is to be critical than to be correct." ---Benjamin Disraeli
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:50:00 - [1014] Originally by: Allanah Originally by: C4w3 GOD blees Chribbster and eve-search, And if this is TRUE! Shame on you CCP! and Expose the moneyprinting four!!! taken from eve-search http://eve-search.com/thread/216634/page/2#47 ... If this has indeed been going on for 4 years as suggested by the SH forums and this eve-o post, then the whole market is completly ... i dont even know what to say. The market, the 0.0 mechanics, just about everything in the game would be VERY affected by this. This is bad... I can't see anything about reactors there. Only some 'pos exploits' were mentioned. That could have been everything and nothing. It says "the corp suffered from pos exploit". I can't see how the producing materials out of thing air makes a corp suffer in any way. Throwing some vague bit of story here and there together, ignoring the vast lack of background information and then twisting and bending it so that it fits into ones pre-occupied perception is not the right way to approach this matter. It is good to see that people started digging and found such posts like the linked one. I hope that CCP will investigate all this. CCP should do it right and that needs time, time to follow all those links and traces. So, give them the time! Keep digging! But be careful with incomplete information.
Madius	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:50:00 - [1015] Originally by: Serrin Shamandar Er, sorry 'bout that - Blizzard to me usually means the Diablo and StarCraft franchises. I never really got in to Wow, and really don't know or want to know much about it. I'm aware that the framework in D2 imposed some limitations - but nothing says that you couldn't do a slower constantly running ruststorm that would probably shake and/or destroy the market rather than an hours long insanely resource intensive one that happened long after the market had glutted with cheap and easily available dupes. I could've sworn they had a system that would erase dupes detected in the same game... maybe I'm thinking of something else. Anyways, what remains is that hopefully CCP is capable (and willing) to track down and punish anyone involved in this exploit and not just those directly responsible. If they aren't...
Ryel Theon Epiphyte Mining and Exploration Combined Planetary Union	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:51:00 - [1016] Originally by: MyOwnSling Originally by: Ryel Theon Originally by: Millenia Fallenwing Can someone please prove that BoB did not exploit this, nor were they involved with this. You know you can't prove a negative, right? Sure you can, but that's not how it works in the real world. Innocent until proven guilty. You, sir, are either the greatest philosopher who ever lived or an idiot. I know which one my money is on.
SPIONKOP Caldari Warp Core Tech	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:51:00 - [1017] Edited by: SPIONKOP on 11/12/2008 19:51:46 I am not sure if this has been raised, I read some pages but not reading them all. I would assume the accounts that did this were alts paid for by the huge amount of ISK at their disposal. The loss of which will not affect CCP's income, nor will it affect those that are responsible for this mess. The 4 non alliance corps must have been linked to an alliance. So all in all over 70 alts baned from the game, big deal. Question is will CCP trace the ISK. There is always a trail and this amount of ISK can be traced. I don't think CCP have the balls to take this as far as they should. I think they are scared of what they may find. It would be nice for those alliances implicated in this act to admit it and work on a solution. Sad thing is, most alliances are s****and care little for well being of the game. I suspect those high up the food chain are well insulated from this, even if their game time, titan and characters have been paid for by cheats. Chase the money, find them, remove their titans and moms and ban them. If any T2 BPO's have been bought by this ISK what will happen to them I wonder. --------------------------------------------- Space For Rent. 100mil ISK/Week.
bow locks UK Corp Mostly Harmless	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:52:00 - [1018] Hi Meriones!!!! dfgsd
MyOwnSling Gallente Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:52:00 - [1019] Originally by: Gnulpie Keep digging! But be careful with incomplete information. I couldn't agree more. Much digging to still be done. I am actually quite interested to see what happens to the economy and the 0.0 dynamic. ------------- Stop whining. Originally by: Puupuu dude... your face... Originally by: MooKids I have an elite rating in HULL TANKING! That is like saying I can block punches with my face.
Solomon XI Hoist The Colors. Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.12.11 19:55:00 - [1020] Originally by: MyOwnSling From some of the unsubstantiated posts I have read, the offenders have apparently lost titans, poses, and of course all assets due to bans. Take that as you will. At the same time, by MM own admission, your alliance suffered losses because this exploit was being, well, exploited. We know that the offending corporations have suffered asset freezes, pos-removal, bannings, and the like. However. What we do not currently know is if these exploits contributed to super-capitals & outposts (which, in all likelihood, they did). I cannot help but wonder if some 0.0 wars have been won because of this exploit. If so, the alliances which were involved in one way or another with corporations using this exploit should have their full 0.0 SOV reset. We also do not know for sure the devastation CCP has caused when they reset the eve-market price histories for a number of various items. People have lost money due to an action CCP failed to announce in advance. Restitution is owed.

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