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Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:17:00 - [1] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 20:34:36 if yes...hahahaha... if not, still very funny, enjoyed the quotes and persona-descriptions. Linkage Quotes i liked: "Right now you can store 50 personal fittings..., thats more than enough for the average EVE player..., why not be able to add more storage for a small amout of money?" - EVE Lead Game Designer "We're going to face an uphill struggle, and the reason many of us never talk about this publically is that we'd be burned at the stake by the players" - EVE Lead Game Designer "...i think that's prett goddamn cool, and i'm not entirely sure why that makes me **** to some EVE players" - EVE Lead Game Designer (a tip Mr, if you feel noone understands you, maybe its you) "Giving people small amounts of micro-currency for beeing loyal subscribers, or even as a reward for high level gameplay like taking sovereignty..." - EVE Lead Game Designer (lol this quote made my day, you wan't to pay me for taking sov, like the russians do?) From plain text: "...: we give players the means to buy stuff in addition to their base subscription, offering things like new "nano-paints", that allow one to customize ships while docked; new articles of virtual clothing, tattoos, and other avatar customizations, tokens for customizing Captain's Quarters and so on." "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization, some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright."**
Katrina Cortez	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:27:00 - [2] oh snap...lol
Kronir	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:27:00 - [3] Edited by: Kronir on 22/06/2011 20:28:18 Looks like the download link is timing out. Anyone able to share a copy? EDIT: It's working now.
Cyaxares II	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:35:00 - [4] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku "Giving people small amounts of micro-currency for beeing loyal subscribers, or even as a reward for high level gameplay like taking sovereignty..." - EVE Lead Game Designer (lol this quote made my day, you wan't to pay me for taking sov, like the russians do?) this would certainly help small alliances gain a foothold in 0.0 ... NOT
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:37:00 - [5] Entropia... That is a name you should fear... It's comming.
Masjheira Minmatar Cursed Inc. Not Found.	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:38:00 - [6] If not fake, at least I know my subscription will end soon enough. Islandic morons
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:42:00 - [7] The thing about it is that the quotes coming out of this are exactly in line with what's being said and done by CCP for the last little while... it has to be real? -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Myxx Atropos Group	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:43:00 - [8] if it is real, i am completely justified in what ive said so far. -- Originally by: CCP Explorer (and if you guys would also stop using Drakes it would be really appreciated, kthxbye). Originally by: Tom Gerard Then again... I am a moron.
Arec Bardwin	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:45:00 - [9] It's pretty rude to discuss/quote a CCP leaked document on their own forums. Just sayin'
Zachstar	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:47:00 - [10] Edited by: Zachstar on 22/06/2011 20:47:53 CCP can you comment on this controversy? Edit: While I never open any leaked documents the things posted on this thread are rather disturbing. Especially considering the recent actions taken by the biz department.
Kristal Meth	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:49:00 - [11] That PDF contains what may be the most obnoxious font I've ever encountered, anywhere. That said, it is probably the all new CCP font that they'll use everywhere in game.
Nuhm DeAra	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:50:00 - [12] Edited by: Nuhm DeAra on 22/06/2011 20:50:48 If it were real it wouldn't have so many horrible spelling and grammar errors. (the article in the link)
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:55:00 - [13] Quote: Virtual goods sales are a hot topic these days, and more and more companies are moving toward them, CCP included. If handled well, virtual goods sales are far from a grey money-grab that impoverishes the players. Well, that's a pretty big if. Spoiler alert; you failed right there and then.
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:57:00 - [14] Apparently, its real. The writing on the wall could not be more clear. This is, a sad, sad day. But really, what I think is that you should be tipping news sites about this instead of complaining on the message board. Shame is powerful. http://massively.joystiq.com/contact/tips/
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:57:00 - [15] Lol, obvious fake is obvious. The guy that had the idea probably didnt think the possible legal consequences through tho, this could end pretty bad...
Marbella Wilson	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:57:00 - [16] Since it's pretty much in line with what we have witnessed the past two years or so, I'd say it's legit. Furthermore sources close to CCP have confirmed this to be the real deal.
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:58:00 - [17] This is outright scary. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Katrina Cortez	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:59:00 - [18] Originally by: Tutskii But really, what I think is that you should be tipping news sites about this instead of complaining on the message board. Shame is powerful. Already done.
Milo Caman Gallente Anshar Incorporated	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:59:00 - [19] Originally by: Nuhm DeAra Edited by: Nuhm DeAra on 22/06/2011 20:50:48 If it were real it wouldn't have so many horrible spelling and grammar errors. (the article in the link) EN24 are known for not proofreading their articles. The question here is whether or not the .pdf is genuine or not. Why it had to go in a passworded .RAR file I don't know. No-one has time for this cloak and dagger crap anymore. ---
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:59:00 - [20] Originally by: Omara Otawan Lol, obvious fake is obvious. The guy that had the idea probably didnt think the possible legal consequences through tho, this could end pretty bad... that depends entirely on what country he/she resides in. not everywhere in the world law is as bad as in the us.
Hra Neuvosto The 8th Order Mean Coalition	Posted - 2011.06.22 20:59:00 - [21] >paying ISK for more saved fittings
Aineko Macx	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:00:00 - [22] I was never so close to cancelling my 3 accounts. Also inb4l. ________________________ CCP: Where fixing bugs is a luxury, not an obligation.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:01:00 - [23] Originally by: Nuhm DeAra If it were real it wouldn't have so many horrible spelling and grammar errors. (the article in the link) So all those typos, grammar errors, spelling mistakes in skills, ships, drones, ammo, all these years was fake too? As to the authenticity of this, who knows. CCP will likely never confirm outwardly. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Strrog Caldari Zero Excavations	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:03:00 - [24] I just saved this in a word format, in case this gets deleted Sounds like crap hit the fan big time.
Strecs Moliko	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:04:00 - [25] Why is it in English? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_language
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:05:00 - [26] Mynxee said on twitter she's glad this has gone public. Sounds to me like she believes it is real - maybe for a reason. If this is a fake it is an extremely labor intensive one. It's a real eye opener if it's real. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Digital Messiah Oregami Ultd	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:05:00 - [27] This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. Quote: "Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn"
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:05:00 - [28] make sense that it would have grammar errors if english is not there mother tongue but used as a universal language within the company for email notes etc.
Moolti Gallente Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:05:00 - [29] WTB WoD Clothing for Eve. . @)}---^----- The Jove are a warning to us all. We must remember to live and Love and feel. Fall in Love, make Love, be beautful and see the beautiful. For we mustn't loose our human spark
Cancel Align NOW	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:06:00 - [30] Kristoffer makes a ****** reference. He should therefore have a 3 day ban placed on his access to the eve servers.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:06:00 - [31] CCPs internal language is English (makes sense once you have international workers)
Quetazoid	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:07:00 - [32] Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game).
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:07:00 - [33] You missed a big one: "Second, we must sell our units of virtual currency - the AUR - at appropriate rates. No pair of pants, no matter how cool, should cost the same as a new Maserati; similarly, it would be silly to buy sunglasses for my avatar and pay the same price that I would for a faction battleship." ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:08:00 - [34] Originally by: Myra2007 Mynxee said on twitter she's glad this has gone public. Sounds to me like she believes it is real - maybe for a reason. If this is a fake it is an extremely labor intensive one. It's a real eye opener if it's real. TeaDaze says that we haven't seen anything yet, and current CSM members are saying the CSM minutes are going to ignite another wave of rage. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:08:00 - [35] Originally by: Strecs Moliko Why is it in English? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_language Because CCP is a global business with tons of people who don't speak the native tongue? -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Tobiaz Spacerats	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:08:00 - [36] That's truly a disheartening read. Withholding basic functionality like being able to store +50 fittings just so CCP can make money of it? It's clear how deep they have fallen. Kristoffer Touborg is CCP Soundwave by the way. It's really troubling that one of the main devs of team BFF, tasked with hammering out fixes and rebalancing, is so in love with MT. And his attitude towards the community is disgusting. He makes himself sound like a Jehova's Witness trying to convert us to his lord and saviour: Macro-Transaction. And the part about buying faction standing or sov... WTF?! they really don't understand their own game if they don't see why it's important for the game of this being hard to get and NOT to be simply bought for RL.
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:08:00 - [37] Originally by: Strecs Moliko Why is it in English? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Icelandic_language CCP has departments in other countries, so English is probably the corporate language i.e. all written materials must be in English. It's a common policy for businesses in small countries.
Janus Talmash Talmash Imports and Exports Group	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:08:00 - [38] As stated in the other thread; CCP Soundwave can go die in a fire, and any and all other CCP jokers that think like him. ________ Amat victoria curam.
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:09:00 - [39] Originally by: Hra Neuvosto >paying ISK for more saved fittings It's a good idea. Paying more for a virtual shirt than a real life one, is not, and generally the reason I unsubbed. This level of incompetence has me believing I can throw all the valuta (micro, macro or subscription fees) I want at this game, it's not going to get any better (in fact, lack of balancing and generally not fixing what actually needs fixing will just slowly erode this game and it's playerbase -given the fact how many bittervets and lame memes we have to endure on this forum).
SilentSkills Gallente Tax Evaders Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:09:00 - [40] Originally by: stoicfaux You missed a big one: "Second, we must sell our units of virtual currency - the AUR - at appropriate rates. No pair of pants, no matter how cool, should cost the same as a new Maserati; similarly, it would be silly to buy sunglasses for my avatar and pay the same price that I would for a faction battleship." a monocle is worth more than a vindicator gasps
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:09:00 - [41] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 21:09:43 @Quetazoid please for the love of sanity, go play one of those MT games and come back, you don't seem to understand the implications and risks (CCP even talks about the risks in the document, they know, but they think they can do it better then EVERYONE ELSE...as we have seen he?).
Arrs Grazznic Poena Executive Solutions	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:10:00 - [42] The second microtransactions can be used to gain real advantage (ships, ammo, etc.) rather than Ken and Barbie fashion I will let my account expire and retire from Eve.
Zachstar	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:11:00 - [43] Folks please remain calm and wait for CCP to say something first. A) We know their biz department has not exactly done good for the company's image lately. I suspect in my opinion this may be a continuation of it and possibly employment termination is on the horizon again in my opinion. B) For those of us who keep up with tech. BS "Leaks" are as common as stars in the sky. Don't post defamation based on a document that could be suspect.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:12:00 - [44] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 21:12:51 Originally by: Zachstar Folks please remain calm and wait for CCP to say something first. A) We know their biz department has not exactly done good for the company's image lately. I suspect in my opinion this may be a continuation of it and possibly employment termination is on the horizon again in my opinion. B) For those of us who keep up with tech. BS "Leaks" are as common as stars in the sky. Don't post defamation based on a document that could be suspect. You don't seem to understand:(IF THIS IS LEGIT) CCP Soundwave is THE EVE LEAD GAME DESIGNER appointed and appraised at fanfest by Hilmar. This is not a slip, this is where EVE will go, end of story.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:12:00 - [45] Edited by: Selene D''Celeste on 22/06/2011 21:13:36 It's also probably good that this is public. CCP has been less than forward with letting its core playerbase know what they are planning. The sad thing is that they could probably go ahead with many of their plans if they weren't both insulting and incompetent with it all. Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Zachstar Folks please remain calm and wait for CCP to say something first. A) We know their biz department has not exactly done good for the company's image lately. I suspect in my opinion this may be a continuation of it and possibly employment termination is on the horizon again in my opinion. B) For those of us who keep up with tech. BS "Leaks" are as common as stars in the sky. Don't post defamation based on a document that could be suspect. You don't seem to understand: CCP Soundwave is THE EVE LEAD GAME DESIGNER appointed and appraised at fanfest by Hilmar. This is not a slip, this is where EVE will go, end of story. Yep, CCP has already committed to their path. They just weren't willing to admit what it was because, as it mentions in the newsletter, they get cruicified when they're honest. They probably should have thought about this more. ______________________________
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:13:00 - [46] This truly does make me sad if this is indeed real. I have played eve for so long because its different, because its harsh because you don't have instant wins and short-cuts. I have always liked the vision and ideas and the whole complete sci-fi experience but this if real is starting to go down the wrong path IMO and if this is what is coming and going to be implemented it will be the end for me. I'm not against change and development to add and progress but this is a fundamental change of the foundations of what EVE means to myself and I am sure a lot of players.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:14:00 - [47] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:14:12 Can somebody check the META DATA in the PDF? Can somebody post the meta data here please so I can see it? I cannot download it it keeps saying size mistmatch.
Arrs Grazznic Poena Executive Solutions	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:15:00 - [48] Originally by: Quetazoid lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? In the first example the POS is magicked into existence through the MT. In the second example the POS BPC would have to be found by a player, then built with minerals mined or refined by players and put on the market for sale.
Alexas Kateiwa Caldari Aikoku Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:16:00 - [49] Originally by: Arrs Grazznic The second microtransactions can be used to gain real advantage (ships, ammo, etc.) rather than Ken and Barbie fashion I will let my account expire and retire from Eve.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:16:00 - [50] HTTP Error 503: The requested service is unavailable The service you requested is temporarily unavailable The service may be unavailable because the server has reached the limit of the number of requests it is willing to serve in parallel. This number depends on the type of request you were submitting. If the document you requested was a dynamic document it may be that the application generating these documents is currently not running.
Alley Specter	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:16:00 - [51] Judging from the less than flattering descriptions of the authors in the pdf, I'm inclined to believe this is fake. Quote: "Kristoffer is a driving force in CCP's Game Design Department. The vast majority of his free time is spent buying dresses for his characters (using microtransactions) in League of Legends and reading authentic Japanese Manga comic books." And you guys are falling for this? Really?
Barakkus	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:16:00 - [52] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku "One other service we're looking at is selling faction standings. We want to offer convenience"...(hahaha) Hope not, this would put me out of business. - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:17:00 - [53] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:14:12 Can somebody check the META DATA in the PDF? Can somebody post the meta data here please so I can see it? I cannot download it it keeps saying size mistmatch. only info is that it has been created with InDesign CS5 - no authero/title/... fields
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:17:00 - [54] Originally by: Alley Specter And you guys are falling for this? Really? Never underestimate you fellow eve players.
Alexas Kateiwa Caldari Aikoku Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:18:00 - [55] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:14:12 Can somebody check the META DATA in the PDF? Can somebody post the meta data here please so I can see it? I cannot download it it keeps saying size mistmatch. The PDF was created 5/20/2011 3:47:40 PM and modified 6/22/2011 12:22:57
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:18:00 - [56] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:14:12 Can somebody check the META DATA in the PDF? Can somebody post the meta data here please so I can see it? I cannot download it it keeps saying size mistmatch. only info is that it has been created with InDesign CS5 - no authero/title/... fields Load it up into Notepad and browse / search there. You could also grep out PDF markup keywords to make it easier.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:19:00 - [57] Originally by: Alley Specter Judging from the less than flattering descriptions of the authors in the pdf, I'm inclined to believe this is fake. Quote: "Kristoffer is a driving force in CCP's Game Design Department. The vast majority of his free time is spent buying dresses for his characters (using microtransactions) in League of Legends and reading authentic Japanese Manga comic books." And you guys are falling for this? Really? First, its nothing new that internal documents contain jokes about ppl that everyone knows (no need to describe who he is, its an internal document, we do this alot where i work too). And if its fake, so what, it was a good read.
Ira Theos	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:19:00 - [58] Well I guess Eve really IS dieing now... I guess it really is time time to pull the plug on the account.
Cancel Align NOW	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:19:00 - [59] I really like the swimming pool analogy: Quote: Summer is coming and people are flocking to swimming pool. You usually have to pay an entrance fee, but at least in Reykjavik you get free towels now, I hear. Next summer people will be flocking to play DUST 514. There will be an entrance fee, but we will make sure to also provide some proverbial free towels. We will be charging for the swimming goggles, though. When I go to the swimming pool I take my own goggles. I take it that means I will be allowed to import my own "vanity" and my own "win game" items into the game.
Quetazoid	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:20:00 - [60] Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:22:38 Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 21:09:43 @Quetazoid please for the love of sanity, go play one of those MT games and come back, you don't seem to understand the implications and risks (CCP even talks about the risks in the document, they know, but they think they can do it better then EVERYONE ELSE...as we have seen he?). Hi, I understand things like buying more ship load-out saves and features that add functionality will kill the game (even for me), as I see that as withholding features from the players. 'buying' faction is also game breaking for me, I swear I'll quit should that happen, as these are CCP endorsed 'hacks' to gameplay (that includes magic'ing ships out of the air). But please explain to me the evil in inflation of PLEX prices (which is really the end result here). x isk = x aurm IF I buy items for Aurm then PLEX prices go up. If Plex prices go up then people who choose to buy plex (ALOT of which do already) get a better deal. The bottom line here is, those who buy PLEX with ISK to sub to their account will find it harder to afford, and the rich don't want to share thier ISK with poor people who sell plex for ISK; so I ask you also who is greedy? If you argue that buying a T-shirt or eyeglass is pointless waste of ISK, well, I could sell a PLEX, buy a faction ship and get it blobbed in one night; read ' I'll get the same amount of enjoyment out of a T-shirt or Ship'
Bacchhus	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:22:00 - [61] CCP I love your game. I love the promise that it would one day be the ultimate science fiction simulator. I have always defended the game and have tried my best to get others involved in it. This broke my heart a little.
Tautut The Union Of The Snake	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:24:00 - [62] Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. The spelling was so bad - surely it has to be fake. I guess we should wait a couple of days until things calm down and then see what CCP have to say officially. -TT / Peace Sells - But Who's Buying The Union of the Snake [SNAKE]
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:24:00 - [63] CCP are going to TRY and be greedy, we see that now, in the AUR prices for vanity items. They WILL SUCCEED, if you let them, and you let them by buying the items. There is only one way to prevent it succeeding, don't buy them. Or would you prefer to play Entropia?
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:24:00 - [64] Originally by: Miilla Load it up into Notepad and browse / search there. You could also grep out PDF markup keywords to make it easier. (search online for a markup keyword spec and dangly bits so you can use that as a removal list). too lazy to remove encryption...
Quetazoid	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:25:00 - [65] Now we know why the viewing standings got removed. So you don't feel guilty when buying faction!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:26:00 - [66] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:26:23 Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Miilla Load it up into Notepad and browse / search there. You could also grep out PDF markup keywords to make it easier. (search online for a markup keyword spec and dangly bits so you can use that as a removal list). too lazy to remove encryption... Attach WinHex to the memory or VS debugger to the adobe process and search / browse the memory. It has already been decrypted. ALternatively save the memory out and grep that. It's not hard, I would but I am unable to dl the pdf.
Khira Kitamatsu	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:27:00 - [67] Originally by: Miilla CCP are going to TRY and be greedy, we see that now, in the AUR prices for vanity items. They WILL SUCCEED, if you let them, and you let them by buying the items. There is only one way to prevent it succeeding, don't buy them. Or would you prefer to play Entropia? Hey Miilla quit all ready. Your incessant whining is like the droning of a katydid. Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors.
Nak hak	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:28:00 - [68] I love how hard EVE Online customers fight for a game they believe in. CCP management it is you. Not your staff. Not me. You.
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:30:00 - [69] Any chance someone can post the contents on the pdf on here as im having problems opening it, All hail the king of the potato people
Janus Talmash Talmash Imports and Exports Group	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:30:00 - [70] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Originally by: Miilla CCP are going to TRY and be greedy, we see that now, in the AUR prices for vanity items. They WILL SUCCEED, if you let them, and you let them by buying the items. There is only one way to prevent it succeeding, don't buy them. Or would you prefer to play Entropia? Hey Miilla quit all ready. Your incessant whining is like the droning of a katydid. Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. OP retyped it, if you had actually read the PDF you'd realise that it has no spelling errors like the OP. ________ Amat victoria curam.
Reilly Duvolle	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:31:00 - [71] Edited by: Reilly Duvolle on 22/06/2011 21:30:56 Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Hey Miilla quit all ready. Your incessant whining is like the droning of a katydid. Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. Spelling errors in an internal magazige written by non-native english speakers (you've heard them on the vids right?). Shocker. This document looks legit to me, I am sad to say.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:31:00 - [72] Originally by: Miilla CCP are going to TRY and be greedy, we see that now, in the AUR prices for vanity items. They WILL SUCCEED, if you let them, and you let them by buying the items. There is only one way to prevent it succeeding, don't buy them. Or would you prefer to play Entropia? Look, there is a class of customers that WILL BUY this, its naturall and many businesses try to cater to them. Thats not the problem i have with CCP, if they want to build WoD for this class of customers, feel free. What buggers me is that they build a game called EVE for a DIFFERENT class of customers, and now after 8 years they think it a good idea to CHANGE the game to cater to another class of customers. Thats disrespectful, greedy, and outright impudent BECAUSE they count on the fact that ppl who invested alot in the game already (few years or alot of time) will keep subbing for a period of time (notice they mention a slow change over a long period of time to ease customers into it). This are customer-unfriendly practices, yes, sanctioned and often used int he industry (not just IT, everywhere), and still SO WRONG if you have any kind of morale.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:31:00 - [73] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. i wouldnt expect people that had english as a second languages to get the grammar spot on
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:31:00 - [74] Originally by: Bacchhus CCP I love your game. I love the promise that it would one day be the ultimate science fiction simulator. I have always defended the game and have tried my best to get others involved in it. This broke my heart a little. Yup. This. I like the idea of WIS, I looked forward to the possibility of it actually being completed. However, doing it this way doesn't work, or at least doesn't build someplace worth visiting at the end.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:32:00 - [75] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. The PDF has copy disabled. You have to manually type the text if you want to quote it. I wonder if you can OCR a PDF document... ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Khamal Jolstien Caldari Sick Tight BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:32:00 - [76] After looking it over, it legit to me. Going to be showing this to everyone I can. Originally by: McKinlay When you get on the batphone and the only people left in the phone book are Aeternus and BLAST it might be time to hang up.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:34:00 - [77] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:34:47 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. i wouldnt expect people that had english as a second languages to get the grammar spot on Tell me this... Are they using Scandinavian grammer in an English language? That is the telltale sign that their first language is Scandinavian. I see these errors daily at work, I can even tell when somebodies 1st language is Russian; Ukranian, Romanin etc by the grammer they ues. Everybody uses their native grammer but only translate the words, but apply the wrong grammer, or fall back to their grammer when in doubt. Having been surrounded and had to learn a few languages myself :P Paste a snippet here maybe I can tell you.
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:34:00 - [78] Originally by: Khamal Jolstien After looking it over, it legit to me. Going to be showing this to everyone I can. This! Look at the pdf and judge for yourself. Then show it to all your eve friends so they can do the same. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:34:00 - [79] SOMEONE (not me) uploaded an unencrypted copy to Mediafire: http://www.mediafire.com/?n8ohtufd1mtamgb -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Aeril Loft	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:34:00 - [80] If this is real, i SINCERELY HOPE that Lulzsec or Anon DDoS the hell out of CCP and destroy them like they did with sony, except CCP won't be able to recover from two months without services.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:35:00 - [81] Originally by: stoicfaux Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. The PDF has copy disabled. You have to manually type the text if you want to quote it. I wonder if you can OCR a PDF document... It takes all of 5 minutes to unlock a PDF, alter it and re-lock. Just FYI Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:35:00 - [82] mod locked other thread saying "no need to have multiple threads" have we not had multiple threads all day on here with none being locked ???? why now lol
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:36:00 - [83] That was a whole lot less scandalous than the hype made it out to be. If it's fake, then I have to wonder who would bother to fake something so banal. CCP is interested in expanding microtransactions? What a scoop!
Karunel Princeps Corp	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:36:00 - [84] In the nine and a half years I've been following/testing/playing EVE I've never read something so depressing from CCP. You really were different but it's plainly obvious the designers in charge have lost the vision and drive the company first had. I guess all's left is to assume CCP has started 'growing slower', soon they'll reach their peak and only downhill wll follow. I guess it's commendable that's taken you so long to become so focused on money instead of quality products and customer satisfaction. Originally by: elbenito The problem with large fleet engagements is that the hamsters stop to watch.
Gigante Toralen	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:36:00 - [85] You guys are more gullable than the WoW community, and I didn't think that was possible.
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:36:00 - [86] LOL Instead of locking threads for trolls or other reasons, ccp is locking threads for "Multiple posts" and pointing them here. They aren't even denying it!
Barakkus	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:36:00 - [87] Originally by: leth ghost mod locked other thread saying "no need to have multiple threads" have we not had multiple threads all day on here with none being locked ???? why now lol Because the mods just got around to it. I'm having this strange feeling that this is real since this hasn't been locked for "lulz rumorz hahah"... ...well then...I have to make up my mind about some things it seems... - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
Alissa Solette	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:38:00 - [88] The day you can buy ANY sort of "performance enhancers" with RL money in EVE will be the day I quit my accounts. If the 3000+ USD I've spent on this game in the past 6 years have not been enough then you can go **** yourselves. I really hope this is a fake... but somehow it would fit really well with the picture I've got of CCP in the last while.
Galane The Interstellar Lunatic Asylum	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:38:00 - [89] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. The article may be full of them but the pdf itself isn't. In fact the way the document is worded, especially the first section, is very similar to how the devs talked about Incarna during the AT. So it's either a very clever fake or legit. Either way, it's an entertaining read
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:39:00 - [90] Originally by: Emperor Cheney That was a whole lot less scandalous than the hype made it out to be. If it's fake, then I have to wonder who would bother to fake something so banal. CCP is interested in expanding microtransactions? What a scoop! It was the first totally honest thing that came from CCP since a long time, that alone makes it news-worthy.
Dr Geiger	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:39:00 - [91] Edited by: Dr Geiger on 22/06/2011 21:40:07 Boycot the next fanfest. Let CCP know they have gone too far.
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:40:00 - [92] Originally by: Dr Geiger Edited by: Dr Geiger on 22/06/2011 21:40:07 Boycot the next fanfest. Let CCP know they have gone too far. /signed
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:41:00 - [93] Originally by: leth ghost mod locked other thread saying "no need to have multiple threads" have we not had multiple threads all day on here with none being locked ???? why now lol That's my question. They're letting the other Incarna/macrotransaction/hardware failure/lost bonus threads stay, but squashing this down to one thread? Hoping it'll fall off of the front page?
Baraka Saibot	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:41:00 - [94] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:34:47 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. i wouldnt expect people that had english as a second languages to get the grammar spot on Tell me this... Are they using Scandinavian grammer in an English language? That is the telltale sign that their first language is Scandinavian. I see these errors daily at work, I can even tell when somebodies 1st language is Russian; Ukranian, Romanin etc by the grammer they ues. Everybody uses their native grammer but only translate the words, but apply the wrong grammer, or fall back to their grammer when in doubt. Having been surrounded and had to learn a few languages myself :P Paste a snippet here maybe I can tell you. Grammar.
Acac Sunflyier Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:41:00 - [95] Originally by: Dr Geiger Edited by: Dr Geiger on 22/06/2011 21:40:07 Boycot the next fanfest. Let CCP know they have gone too far. +1
Khamal Jolstien Caldari Sick Tight BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:42:00 - [96] Originally by: Acac Sunflyier Originally by: Dr Geiger Edited by: Dr Geiger on 22/06/2011 21:40:07 Boycot the next fanfest. Let CCP know they have gone too far. +1 Originally by: McKinlay When you get on the batphone and the only people left in the phone book are Aeternus and BLAST it might be time to hang up.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:42:00 - [97] i'm still wondering its not locked, i fully expected it to be within minutes. maybe they are just happy its finally out, so they can move on. it would be the right thing to do, i would even write a devblog laying out the way EVE will go. So every customer can choose.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:42:00 - [98] There's no such thing as bad publicity. Given the drama surrounding the Incarna launch, you have to wonder if CCP didn't decide to go ahead and "leak" the document on the grounds that the emo-rage-butthurt can't get any worse. All things said, it is a pretty slick and well presented document. It makes it sound as if CCP has a plan, a plan that they've put serious thought into it. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Katrina Cortez	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:43:00 - [99] Well CCP is aware of the post and its claims...yet there is no official comment. If it was fake then they would have just said "Its a fake" and it would have been done.
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:43:00 - [100] It almost doesn't matter if it's real or fake. The fact that we can't tell shows just how far into the depths CCP has plunged with this expansion. This is convenient for me, since I was looking at TOR and Secret World anyway.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:43:00 - [101] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:47:10 Some points to note (from the document) One other service weÆre looking at is selling faction standings. We want to offer convenience for a price If you happen to be economically challenged or just donÆt trust the PlayStation Network with your credit card details, you can trade ISK with other players for some real money currency, just like you can with PLEX today. You can also do the opposite and exchange purchased realmoney currency for ISK, too. Both work for us as long as money is being spent. The 2nd point is the most interesting and benificial to players who dont want to pump in real money (like me) because it isn't "disposable" in the amounts they want or are repulsed by it. They don't care, as long as money is being spent, fine.
Livini Naship	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:44:00 - [102] lulz, everyone that bought something in that shop should really read that pdf from that link. especially that part about the comparison between the golf player and the eve pirate made me laugh hard. when this piece of paper is really confirmed as true, i regret i started to play this game 3 month ago, because so far it is really good. o/
Khira Kitamatsu	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:44:00 - [103] Originally by: Katrina Cortez Well CCP is aware of the post and its claims...yet there is no official comment. If it was fake then they would have just said "Its a fake" and it would have been done. It's about as real as the people claiming I am a developer for CCP. LOL!
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:44:00 - [104] its like a brochure you would hand to inverters to show them how much úúú your gunna make to keep them happy
Diomedes Calypso	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:46:00 - [105] i can't read the downloaded file. I have a newer version of adobe but no matter how many times i download it I get some encryption message
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:46:00 - [106] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Originally by: Katrina Cortez Well CCP is aware of the post and its claims...yet there is no official comment. If it was fake then they would have just said "Its a fake" and it would have been done. It's about as real as the people claiming I am a developer for CCP. LOL! yep ccp alt spotted
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:47:00 - [107] Originally by: Diomedes Calypso i can't read the downloaded file. I have a newer version of adobe but no matter how many times i download it I get some encryption message PW is in the article.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:47:00 - [108] At first I was like :\| but then I was like >:\| www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Janus Talmash Talmash Imports and Exports Group	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:47:00 - [109] Originally by: Diomedes Calypso i can't read the downloaded file. I have a newer version of adobe but no matter how many times i download it I get some encryption message Non-protected version, linked earlier. ________ Amat victoria curam.
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:47:00 - [110] Originally by: stoicfaux There's no such thing as bad publicity. Given the drama surrounding the Incarna launch, you have to wonder if CCP didn't decide to go ahead and "leak" the document on the grounds that the emo-rage-butthurt can't get any worse. All things said, it is a pretty slick and well presented document. It makes it sound as if CCP has a plan, a plan that they've put serious thought into it. What business school did you graduate from? if you are still in school then you should just get out more, maybe get a job down at the grocers?
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:48:00 - [111] Haha, oh wow. ** this and ** CCP.
Thaylon Sen Dynamic International Solutions	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:48:00 - [112] Well, if that's where EVE is going, count me out. I've played EVE since beta, and followed CCP as it's grown as a company. If that document is the real deal, coupled with macro-transactions, then the CCP I 'grew up' with is no more. Reynir Har=arson, ¦orolfur Beck and -var Kristjßnsson, is this the game you envisioned while you were playing Ultima? When did you give up on careing?
Cylide Askald	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:48:00 - [113] Originally by: Aeril Loft If this is real, i SINCERELY HOPE that Lulzsec or Anon DDoS the hell out of CCP and destroy them like they did with sony, except CCP won't be able to recover from two months without services. So you hope your data'll get compromised?
Cave Lord	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:49:00 - [114] Originally by: Arec Bardwin It's pretty rude to discuss/quote a CCP leaked document on their own forums. Just sayin' I agree. But it's even MORE rude for CCP to do any kind of RMT at all - plex included. So yea, I think we, investors of EVE have a right to be a little ticked off about our product - EVE Online is being handled and the direction it is taking.
VaMei Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:50:00 - [115] Originally by: stoicfaux There's no such thing as bad publicity. Tell that to John Smedley.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:51:00 - [116] Originally by: Thaylon Sen Well, if that's where EVE is going, count me out. I've played EVE since beta, and followed CCP as it's grown as a company. If that document is the real deal, coupled with macro-transactions, then the CCP I 'grew up' with is no more. Reynir Har=arson, ¦orolfur Beck and -var Kristjßnsson, is this the game you envisioned while you were playing Ultima? When did you give up on careing? Perhaps they just got themselves in a bad financial position, and the company things this is the only way out/forward? ______________________________
Siigari Kitawa Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:51:00 - [117] Originally by: Thaylon Sen Well, if that's where EVE is going, count me out. I've played EVE since beta, and followed CCP as it's grown as a company. If that document is the real deal, coupled with macro-transactions, then the CCP I 'grew up' with is no more. Reynir Har=arson, ¦orolfur Beck and -var Kristjßnsson, is this the game you envisioned while you were playing Ultima? When did you give up on careing? I think when Kieron lef is about when we entered this mess. Maybe he saw something like this coming in his position and jumped ship far before we saw anything about it. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Typecast	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:52:00 - [118] Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer LOL Instead of locking threads for trolls or other reasons, ccp is locking threads for "Multiple posts" and pointing them here. They aren't even denying it! This. As soon as CCP offer items that go beyond vanity items I'll stop playing (and I don't mean that as an idle threat that so many people throw around these days). I play F2P games that have MT and I spend money on them (World of Tanks being one), but I couldn't justify paying a subscription fee and then some micro-transactions on top of that just to be competitive with my peers. I fear that's the way CCP will go. If you look at MMOs that use MT, many of them make more money now than they did when they had a standard subscription model. Turbine's Dungeons and Dragons Online and Lord of the Rings Online and Star Trek Online being 3 examples. Funcom's Age of Conan is going F2P, so they are also jumping on the bandwagon. There are probably more examples that I have missed. These are baby steps, if they are successful why wouldn't they try and take it further? Wouldn't you from a business standpoint? And you wanna know the real kicker? I just subbed for 3 months, about 10 hours ago...
flapie 2 Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:53:00 - [119] Edited by: flapie 2 on 22/06/2011 21:55:12 Hmm good read tbh, not really much to worrie about. Most quotes are made in a **ty way and just take all the negative comments. The Yes section, of Kristoffer Touborg, makes me kinda worried tho, he seems to have a lot of cash so he can keep up with other wealthy players once they implant more important items to that store. How ever, the No from John Turbefield, makes it a bit better cause he seems to know what the fack hes talking about. The middle part however makes me shiver only because of the tittle "Fighting wars with perseverance and real money". Dint read it cause Dust isnt my thing, tho i still have to see how this is gonna affect my gameplay later on. Might read it tomorrow. How ever after reading the last part i kinda calmed down and started to see that most people are indeed over reacting. Aslong as we keep giving feedback about what we want, they ball will eventually begin to roll our way. Since the micro transaction are gonna be CCP its main income after a period of time. And thus iff they dont listen that income will drop and eve comes to a stand still. Over all it was a good read tbh, much like reading a Tech-Net folder tbh. There are indeed some wierd quotes and lines in it, and iff you put them all in one line they indeed dont look good. But together it isnt half that bad, besides the title that is. The Gordon Gekko Issue - I mean come on, we all know how that movie ended. Thats just intentionally spreading fear iff you ask me. Annyways i'm still not to botherd with most changes, maybe its good that some whiners and gankers left the game to find themself back into WoW or guildwars where they came from in the first place. Im seeing something i missed out on with EnB, and waited for a long time in eve, Station Walking (well ok room walking, but it has to start somewhere). Looks a lot better then EnB aswell iff you ask me so im a happy vet. The rest of you can suck my big E-Peen im not going to leave my **load of investements till its all blown up, or so booring that i can be arsed to login. just my 2aur PS: not gonna edit for typo's just deal with them
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:55:00 - [120] Originally by: flapie 2 Hmm good read tbh, not really much to worrie about. You're ****ing kidding me right? MT for ships/ammo whatever isn't something to worry about in a PvP game focused on a player driven economy? Haha ok.
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:56:00 - [121] Edited by: Emperor Cheney on 22/06/2011 21:56:14 Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 21:34:47 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. i wouldnt expect people that had english as a second languages to get the grammar spot on Tell me this... Are they using Scandinavian grammer in an English language? That is the telltale sign that their first language is Scandinavian. I see these errors daily at work, I can even tell when somebodies 1st language is Russian; Ukranian, Romanin etc by the grammer they ues. Everybody uses their native grammer but only translate the words, but apply the wrong grammer, or fall back to their grammer when in doubt. Having been surrounded and had to learn a few languages myself :P Paste a snippet here maybe I can tell you. I don't know Icelandic, but in my experience Icelanders speak English with very few grammatical errors.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:56:00 - [122] Three things: - CCP Soundwave confirmed on twitter that he is watching the reaction. He did not deny it being real. http://twitter.com/#!/ktouborg - CSM member Seleene, formerly CCP Abathur, confirmed seeing this on a desk in Iceland at the CSM summit. linkage - Its close enough to the direction CCP has been going that we can't tell if its real or fake on its own. -Liang -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Diomedes Calypso	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:57:00 - [123] Originally by: Janus Talmash Originally by: Diomedes Calypso i can't read the downloaded file. I have a newer version of adobe but no matter how many times i download it I get some encryption message Non-protected version, linked earlier. ty .. don't know how i missed it... now i gotta go back again through the newly longer thread and try to understand who this document was for.. what was the intended audience and do internal documents really look this flashy at companies these days..?
Larik Olen	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:58:00 - [124] Edited by: Larik Olen on 22/06/2011 21:58:26 So all that hurf-blurf about 'vanity only' turned out to be a lie after all: "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization, some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright." Assuming this is legit, this is disgusting. Outright lies about the future direction of the MT model within EVE. When was the U-turn going to happen I wonder? Seriously reconsidering my sub. I also might have tried WoD, but if it's going to be an MT paradise then you can count me out. I understand that CCP need to make money, but the implementation of the MT model in the face of so much player rage over so long a time leaves me wondering if they're even on the same planet as the rest of us. How can they get something like this so wrong, so consistently? Some of us always feared that the slippery slope hadn't really gone away with the 'vanity only' claim - now we know for sure.
Iulia Badr Marinela	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:58:00 - [125] If CCP puts in microtransactions for things that can influence the game, such as mods, weapons, skill enhancements or whatever, and not purely cosmetic, I know I and a lot of other players will bail out. See Combat Arms, this is a game where you can do exactly that, buy better guns, body enhancements where you are super fast, etc. etc. It turns into a dominance of those who have money and that is not why I play EVE.
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:59:00 - [126] The DUST bit in particular looks worrying. Essentially it proposes having the RMT weapons become outdated or obsolete, so players have to constantly use MT to keep up, creating a pseudo subscription for anyone who doesn't want to die horribly...
Domoso	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:59:00 - [127] Miilla, contact me in game about the PDF please.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:59:00 - [128] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:05:30 Having more than "seen" fake PR releases my self I know what Im talking about. g They would take an original one so all the fonts, layout and metadata is the same and less a red flag. Then edit the main points or article. So, really it would be hard to tell if it is real or fake. Without it being digitally signed that is. It smells real, given their recent actions, it smells like the beheviour of CCP, trying to be different and handle the real life money life circle so they can profit and we can accept it (read my previous points in yellow last page) that i pulled out of the document that give me the most signifigance. They where also at this "summit" and obviously want to play a lead role here in this MT arena. Also note, they also make reference to their other Products so this MT strategy is CORPORATE wide, not just a single product and therefore not a "test" it is their corporate GOAL.
Jo Blot	Posted - 2011.06.22 21:59:00 - [129] Edited by: Jo Blot on 22/06/2011 22:03:26 Some things that can be sold to players: - Fast-track upgrades that install first time - Downtime compensation insurance - CCP-appoved custom bots, made to order for high net worth clients. - Real-time market data feeds - Energy Trading: Allow players to configure their defences to automatically purchase extra sheilds whenever they go into armoue. - Level-Up! Skill point sales to be introduced ASAP. - Scam protection. - Local obfuscation: Players will be able to keep themselves from appearing in local chat. - Idiot-free, fact-checked forums (alas, unavailable at any price) - Alt-discovery agents. In-space agents that will divulge the identies of other player's alts in exchange for RL cash. - And last but not least, bribeable developers who will add TII BPOs to corporate hangers for cold, hard, under the table cash (or beer).
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:01:00 - [130] Originally by: Xervish Krin The DUST bit in particular looks worrying. Essentially it proposes having the RMT weapons become outdated or obsolete, so players have to constantly use MT to keep up, creating a pseudo subscription for anyone who doesn't want to die horribly... As Dust was F2P, or close to, and free (or close to) to download based on the presentations, that was inevitable. F2P = microtransactions, and not just for pretty clothes.
Barakkus	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:01:00 - [131] Originally by: flapie 2 How ever after reading the last part i kinda calmed down and started to see that most people are indeed over reacting. No, they are trying to turn it into Perfect World International, which is a horrendous game and EVERYTHING costs $$, someone tried to get me to play that ****, uninstalled within 20 minutes of figuring out how their whole thing worked. - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:02:00 - [132] Originally by: Liang Nuren The thing about it is that the quotes coming out of this are exactly in line with what's being said and done by CCP for the last little while... it has to be real? Finally did it, Liang. Headed for the hills with my two accounts. Only way to make sense out of CCP's particular brand of craziness.
Dr Djago Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:03:00 - [133] CCP if this is real, then throw in the PLEX fore remap, you really have nothing to loose at this point really.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:04:00 - [134] Both of my accounts got 3 days remaining... I hope that your monocles sell well and that next game I play has zero ties to CCP (no excellence, just lies). ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:04:00 - [135] The biggest fear for an MMO is to be like Entropia I think. You cannot do ANYTHING without a credit card in that game. People go "oh ill try that" then their friends say "yeah i tried that, cant do anything without real money", then they say "sod it, I cancelled my client download"
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:04:00 - [136] Originally by: Dr Djago CCP if this is real, then throw in the PLEX fore remap, you really have nothing to loose at this point really. LMAO! Nicely done, couldn't have said it better.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:05:00 - [137] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Hey Miilla quit all ready. Your incessant whining is like the droning of a katydid. Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. So all the ship, ammo, drone, item descriptions in Eve, that for all these years have had spelling and grammar errors were fake? Does that mean I have to give back the ISK I got from killing a rat BS with fake ammo? Do clear that up for us, thanks! My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Khysanth Onyx	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:05:00 - [138] Edited by: Khysanth Onyx on 22/06/2011 22:06:04 That string of quotes started to read like The Final Solution to the Jewish Question, and whoa the irony.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:06:00 - [139] Isn't it fun? It's the same path that led my former employer's corporation to default and close. The economist (akin to John Turbefield in the PDF) kept warning about the dangerous path and about the risks. The marketeer (in this case it's worse as Kristoffer Touborg is Lead Game Designer => more powerful) laughed in his face. Result: when marketeers trump economists things go downhill fast. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:07:00 - [140] Originally by: Khysanth Onyx Edited by: Khysanth Onyx on 22/06/2011 22:06:04 That string of quotes started to read like The Final Solution to the Jewish Question, and whoa the irony. **** you. Seriously.
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:08:00 - [141] cool. we are offered to download a faked pdf file linked through eve-o. not that acrobat reader is the number one security hole software of the world and eve-o consists of nasty people...
Iamien Democracy of Klingon Brothers	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:08:00 - [142] This is legitimate. If it weren't it would be closed by now as CCP would not allow disinformation to be spread and go viral.
Khysanth Onyx	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:08:00 - [143] Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: Khysanth Onyx Edited by: Khysanth Onyx on 22/06/2011 22:06:04 That string of quotes started to read like The Final Solution to the Jewish Question, and whoa the irony. **** you. Seriously. OMG can you ever avoid crucifying yourself you bloody wailing idiot.
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:09:00 - [144] CCP is a business and it exists to make a profit. With that in mind I don't see why we should be surprised that CCP have an internal discussion document in place - in fact you could argue that the presence of said document is a good thing: internally CCP are judging what is, and what is not, acceptable in terms of generating revenue from its customers (both current and future). Quite a lot of the document makes logical sense. We might find it distasteful too be poked and prodded by a market analysis but all business do this. CCP Soundwaves deductions don't accord with my own, but then he seems a different style of consumer to me. On one point however I would agree - CCP are going to be burned at the stake here. C. the hydrostatic capsule blog
Dograzor The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:09:00 - [145] Fake or not fake, I am concerned about how CCP is trying to squeeze us for money. As I mentioned earlier in the monetizing apps post: If you keep this up CCP, WoW actually starts to look appealing. You pay your sub, can log in, and do what you want to do without having to deal with broken crap, half finished features, and some company trying to sell me my own leg for which I already payed. I'm glad Deus Ex: HR, ME2, GW2 are all coming out in the next 18 months. After that, I can see if there is anything left of Eve. - "We don't gank, we just apply force in a disproportionate manner during an uneven tactical combat situation to maximize revenue and increase shareholder value"
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:09:00 - [146] if this is true and it's the direction CCP wants to take EvE... I wont renew my subs. It's been a nice few years, with an incredible experience, but I do not wish to be around when one of the greater games of all time becomes a monster. _________________________________________________
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:09:00 - [147] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow Both of my accounts got 3 days remaining... I hope that your monocles sell well and that next game I play has zero ties to CCP (no excellence, just lies). My bet is they will never tell us how many monocles sold the first week because it will be a startling, and yet entirely predictable to anyone with common sense, total failure.
flapie 2 Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:09:00 - [148] Originally by: Barakkus Originally by: flapie 2 How ever after reading the last part i kinda calmed down and started to see that most people are indeed over reacting. No, they are trying to turn it into Perfect World International, which is a horrendous game and EVERYTHING costs $$, someone tried to get me to play that ****, uninstalled within 20 minutes of figuring out how their whole thing worked. Sure and king-kong is comming to Amsterdam tomorrow .... My ship aint gonna cost isk, my trow away mission setup wont either, and my "i can afford to lose" PvP setups wont either. So why would i care about other people that want to trow away there money on crap ???
Rixiu The Inuits	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:10:00 - [149] This seem real enough to me. 38 days left... Originally by: RensPriceChecker2 cool. we are offered to download a faked pdf file linked through eve-o. not that acrobat reader is the number one security hole software of the world and eve-o consists of nasty people... Because there is no such thing as non-adobe pdf readers?
Planetary Genocide Gallente Nebulosus Malum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:10:00 - [150] Edited by: Planetary Genocide on 22/06/2011 22:11:44 Originally by: Miilla Entropia... That is a name you should fear... It's comming. I used to play that. If EVE turns into Planet Calypso IN SPACE! i will quit. Quote: No, they are trying to turn it into Perfect World International, which is a horrendous game and EVERYTHING costs $$, someone tried to get me to play that **, uninstalled within 20 minutes of figuring out how their whole thing worked. PWI is actually the company. I've played two of their games, Perfect World, and Jade Dynasty... I quit Perfect World because it was boring as **, and Jade Dynasty went to hell when every update was a new cash shop item.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:11:00 - [151] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:14:53 Originally by: Cailais CCP is a business and it exists to make a profit. With that in mind I don't see why we should be surprised that CCP have an internal discussion document in place - in fact you could argue that the presence of said document is a good thing: internally CCP are judging what is, and what is not, acceptable in terms of generating revenue from its customers (both current and future). Quite a lot of the document makes logical sense. We might find it distasteful too be poked and prodded by a market analysis but all business do this. CCP Soundwaves deductions don't accord with my own, but then he seems a different style of consumer to me. On one point however I would agree - CCP are going to be burned at the stake here. C. CCP are saying the "subscription model" has failed, all the F2P games say the same. So they all dump the subscription model and go MT model, currently CCP are doing both models concurrently. I found two key points that are both a worry and maybe a good thing http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=4#101 1st is a bad thing, 2nd could be good
Obviously Confidential Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:12:00 - [152] Dear CCP, Please note that the original mindset that made Gordon Gekko so awesome back in the good old yuppie 80's lead to many disastrous consequences and that this kind of thinking is now a bit outdated to say the least, not only by the zealous Keynesians but also by new and intelligent neo liberals that are much more concerned with sustainability and introducing long term incentives into capitalism so as to prevent short term individualistic disastrous behavior ("greed is good but in the long term" being the new neo liberal meme). Mr. Stone himself, whose father was a stock broker and intended Gekko as a showcase of all that he despised about the financial system, was surprised when instead of people understanding how that kind of behavior is crappy and leads to misery, apparently instead decided to use Gekko as some some sort of dystopian role model. These days, this is not the kind of stuff the current world rewards or associates with. For a case study of why "greed is good" is a bad way of thinking, I would suggest investigating the recent financial troubles in Iceland, a country located in the North of the Atlantic. So apparently your efforts at savage capitalism are now outdated since responsible/sustainable capitalism seems to be the way to go, and this kind of stuff, which I hope didn't involve a high investment when measured in terms of monthly subscriptions, is sadly inconsequential. Not to mention using money from people that love your game to finance ways to rip them off. You guys should focus on building our wonderful sci fi universe and the love you put into your creation, that extends to the player community. You are good at this. And yes, you can do parallel stuff and introduce micro transactions - I also heard the CEO speaking about what he saw at E3 - but can you please do it with some amount of sanity and common sense, not to mention respect for your own selves or at the very least for what you created? You are not very good at this kind of stuff, it shows, and if you have a good thing going that you do well, why change and start doing crazy stupid things that have like 1% of possibility of generating extra income and 99% possibility of destroying what you have buit, on top of the respect of your players and what really matters in terms of revenue generation? Also, even for savage capitalists you are doing poorly. This looks like starting class material from an MBA business case ages ago, there were better and smarter ways of doing this being taught at business schools even at the time. If this is true, it's a sad day. Not for us. For you.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:12:00 - [153] The issue of paying a subscription fee and being "required" to buy MT items to remain competitive did come up as being bad (i.e. double dipping into the player's wallet.) The document does not directly address that issue with any kind of solution. However, because Eve lets use ISK to buy micro-transaction items, I got the fuzzy impression that the ISK-Plex-Aurum cycle would be the work-around/justification to the sub fee + "mandatory" MT purchases double dipping problem. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:12:00 - [154] Originally by: Khysanth Onyx Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: Khysanth Onyx Edited by: Khysanth Onyx on 22/06/2011 22:06:04 That string of quotes started to read like The Final Solution to the Jewish Question, and whoa the irony. **** you. Seriously. OMG can you ever avoid crucifying yourself you bloody wailing idiot. Oh no they might change my toys this is just like the holocaust!
Khysanth Onyx	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:14:00 - [155] Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: Khysanth Onyx Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: Khysanth Onyx Edited by: Khysanth Onyx on 22/06/2011 22:06:04 That string of quotes started to read like The Final Solution to the Jewish Question, and whoa the irony. **** you. Seriously. OMG can you ever avoid crucifying yourself you bloody wailing idiot. Oh no they might change my toys this is just like the holocaust! lol yeah the inevitable outcome is the death of a million people, this is what I'm talking about
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:14:00 - [156] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Isn't it fun? It's the same path that led my former employer's corporation to default and close. The economist (akin to John Turbefield in the PDF) kept warning about the dangerous path and about the risks. The marketeer (in this case it's worse as Kristoffer Touborg is Lead Game Designer => more powerful) laughed in his face. Result: when marketeers trump economists things go downhill fast. Exactly right the only sense in that document comes from John.
Disturbed Pilot	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:15:00 - [157] As much as i love eve im 99% sure the day they start selling weapons for real money (plex) I will cancel both accounts. It is scary to see that they are already heading down this path with the ability to buy clothing with plex.
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:15:00 - [158] Originally by: Miilla CCP are saying the "subscription model" has failed its no wonder the subscription model fails if you develop three games with the subscriptions from just one. not the payment model is the issue.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:16:00 - [159] OH GOOD HEAVENS IF ONLY SOMEBODY COULD HAVE PREDICTED THIS
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:16:00 - [160] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Cailais CCP is a business and it exists to make a profit. With that in mind I don't see why we should be surprised that CCP have an internal discussion document in place - in fact you could argue that the presence of said document is a good thing: internally CCP are judging what is, and what is not, acceptable in terms of generating revenue from its customers (both current and future). Quite a lot of the document makes logical sense. We might find it distasteful too be poked and prodded by a market analysis but all business do this. CCP Soundwaves deductions don't accord with my own, but then he seems a different style of consumer to me. On one point however I would agree - CCP are going to be burned at the stake here. C. CCP are saying the "subscription model" has failed, all the F2P games say the same. So they all dump the subscription model and go MT model, currently CCP are doing both models concurrently. No, theyre saying that the MT model is popular in other games which suggests some (but not all) consumers prefer that mechanism: discreet spending on specific elements - customized if you will. Offering both models however might work - each suited to different consumers. C. the hydrostatic capsule blog
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:17:00 - [161] Originally by: Iamien This is legitimate. If it weren't it would be closed by now as CCP would not allow disinformation to be spread and go viral. This. Look at how fast they have closed troll threads with claims of what CCP said that were false. Notice how all the threads with this are still open. Also, Seleene confirmed it was real and she saw it at the summit. Where were you when Eve died?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:17:00 - [162] Originally by: RensPriceChecker2 Originally by: Miilla CCP are saying the "subscription model" has failed its no wonder the subscription model fails if you develop three games with the subscriptions from just one. not the payment model is the issue. They want to GROW GROW GROW and big a BIG PLAYER in the MMO space, but that comes at a cost, usually loyal customers. Change can be too great for some, and too expensive for others. But read my prior "2nd" point from my other post in yellow. I think they want to "complete the circle" of the money life cycle in the MMO.
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:18:00 - [163] make up your own mind - does this look like something CCP Marketing could have produced? Hint: search for the now closed thread that contains a transcript of what CCP Zinfandel was letting out in help channel last night.
Drifnir Mnemonic Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:18:00 - [164] For fanden CCP... Patience is running out with this BS...you can only make me /facepalm so many times before i get sore. Also, i like how this ever so subtly ignores what the CSM evidently told you at the last summit...looks like you've made the decision already, and now we get fed this ill-considered refuse? For shame...
Raid'En	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:18:00 - [165] Originally by: Iamien This is legitimate. If it weren't it would be closed by now as CCP would not allow disinformation to be spread and go viral. you forgot the time it is on the EU ; there's only GMs left at this time, and GMs have neither the knowledge, nor the power to decide to lock or not a thread this dangerous for the company. the actions taken here have great importance, they need to wait for big heads to give them orders on what to do. i don't really know if this is a fake or not however... i read it, and it's pretty well written... which let think it is real. however there's contradictions ; the devil economist saying they can buy a plex for more fitting, would like saying this cost an entire plex. but at another place they talk about putting monocle cheap enough... that is the opposite to what was told, and is also the opposite to what have happened yerterday... that's strange. but given all the argumentation about microtransaction, which is pretty well written, and staying honest, i really think it's real. a fake wouldn't had written things like that. however there's an error on dust model ; at E3 it was said there were NO fee for the game itself. on this document it is said there is one. and this document is from before the E3... but not that much before. meaning either it was a change made on last minute... either it's a FAKE. i'm not that chocked by what is written however. the paid weapongs on dust is what have shocked me the most, but anyway... i don't have and don't plan to have a PS3 so... not that shocked about what was told for eve, most is okay, and the rest is only ideas. hope is not lost.
Medidranda Livoga	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:19:00 - [166] I`d be ok with microtransaction model if no subscription was required for basic game access. You could sell "premium" account with double training speed or something too...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:20:00 - [167] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:20:57 Originally by: Medidranda Livoga I`d be ok with microtransaction model if no subscription was required for basic game access. You could sell "premium" account with double training speed or something too... No thanks. I would rather subscribe, I can budget for a subscription, with MT's you cannot budget this as easily as it is "impulse" driven or driven by the "desire to keep up or win". I know what I spend with a subscription. MT is too big a risk financially as a customer.
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:21:00 - [168] Edited by: Eliniale on 22/06/2011 22:25:01 the rage, the feast, the glory, this is the digital human at it's best(or worst depending on your POV), i've got to say i'm LOVING this. The funniest thing, however, is that you could have seen this coming miles away. (granted the NEX is overpriced as hell, but no one is forcing anyone to spend Ç25 or more on a vest) As long as they don't give any edge to people pumping RL money in this game, i don't really care (although PLEX, sorta just do that, whoopsy, must've missed that). EDIT: corrected grammar or spelling mistakes
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:21:00 - [169] I really can't bring myself to login after reading that... Really considering un-subscribing both my accounts, and i'm sure other people are as well after this... what have you done to our game ccp? OUR GAME! WE PAY YOUR **ING WAGES!!! Quote:** You can develop a friendship by "Spending" your time, or you can pay to get the same benefits that friendship would otherwise allow This is probably the most telling statement of the whole document... paying for something instead of working for it? OUT OF GAME STATUS SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO AFFECT IN GAME MECHANICS! You're lucky you got away with the plex system for so long... Eve is no longer art... it's a profit making exercise
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:21:00 - [170] Originally by: Medidranda Livoga I`d be ok with microtransaction model if no subscription was required for basic game access. You could sell "premium" account with double training speed or something too... stackable training speed multiplicators.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:22:00 - [171] Originally by: Bacchhus CCP I love your game. I love the promise that it would one day be the ultimate science fiction simulator. I have always defended the game and have tried my best to get others involved in it. This broke my heart a little. You said it perfect. I really hope this is either fake, or one of those things that Bob in marketing put out to get a feel but nobody is taking seriously. I don't like the new market crap to begin with, but I realize I'm far from the only player in this game, and some might like it. Selling faction standings though? That isn't vanity, that's a direct shortcut in game play. I'm still reading the document, but most of this sounds really dissapointing. I'm not saying I'll quit, but if this goes into play I'll have some really hard choices about where I want to spend my money.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:22:00 - [172] Originally by: Raid'En Originally by: Iamien This is legitimate. If it weren't it would be closed by now as CCP would not allow disinformation to be spread and go viral. you forgot the time it is on the EU ; there's only GMs left at this time, and GMs have neither the knowledge, nor the power to decide to lock or not a thread this dangerous for the company. the actions taken here have great importance, they need to wait for big heads to give them orders on what to do. Yea except for the fact the CCP Soundwave has tweeted he is monitoring the forums in response to people inquiring about this very topic.
oldmanst4r Minmatar oldmanst4r's Corporation	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:24:00 - [173] Wow, just wow. Originally by: CCP Shadow snip Castration successful. Shadow.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:24:00 - [174] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:25:09 Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Raid'En Originally by: Iamien This is legitimate. If it weren't it would be closed by now as CCP would not allow disinformation to be spread and go viral. you forgot the time it is on the EU ; there's only GMs left at this time, and GMs have neither the knowledge, nor the power to decide to lock or not a thread this dangerous for the company. the actions taken here have great importance, they need to wait for big heads to give them orders on what to do. Yea except for the fact the CCP Soundwave has tweeted he is monitoring the forums in response to people inquiring about this very topic. CCP are fishing reactions, plain and simple. All this was discussed at the summit and not confidential. We all know this is their goal, we can smell it in the wind like rotten shark fin.
Ophelia Ursus	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:25:00 - [175] Holy crap, they have gone utterly insane. If consumerism builds loyalty and emotional ties, what do you think are the effects of bait-and-switch tactics, naked manipulation, and outright lies? Someone needs to conduct a purge within CCP. Signature removed.
Mahnmut Orphu	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:25:00 - [176] Edited by: Mahnmut Orphu on 22/06/2011 22:26:14 Edited by: Mahnmut Orphu on 22/06/2011 22:25:06 "Right now you can store 50 personal fittings..., thats more than enough for the average EVE player..., why not be able to add more storage for a small amout of money?" Why not make an epic mission arc that offers these sorts of perks as rewards? I feel that as a customer, my "emotional attachment" would be impacted in a much more positive way if earning the extended storage involved more than opening up my wallet. Rather, I'd much prefer to blow up some spaceships and save a small moon colony or something, and receive the perk as a reward. Even if it took me MANY MANY hours as a casual player. THAT is a story worth telling friends. THAT is a positive emotional experience. THAT is good publicity. Not: "Oh yeah you can totally have as much fitting storage as me dude, only 3.99 in the game store!" The argument that casual players would prefer convenience over a large time investment is worth consideration. However, the developers should consider this issues to be one of convenience vs content. Should the game be convenient to play, or designed in such a way that players always want to devote a LITTLE MORE time to it? A playerbase supported by convenience would seem to be ephemeral while a playerbase supported by content would seem to be much more permanent. One should assume that a game developing company would prefer not only the security that comes with customers interested in a long-term game experience, but also the added bonus of a product that is enhanced by a deeper and more profound emotional experience resulting from more content and yes, more time investment required from the players in order to experience the game more completely. The time investment of the players is more crucial to the EVE universe and CCP than microtransactions will ever be. The low-hanging fruit of microtransactions may seem like a positive addition, but the added convenience comes at the cost of immersion; the cost of a game experience with depth; the cost of cheapening the EVE Universe which player and developer alike have worked so hard to build. THIS IS BAD M'KAY? Don't turn Chess into tic-tac-toe (an extreme analogy) because "casual" gamers call for more convenient and less time consuming ways to advance in the game. Screw them. If they don't enjoy EVE enough to earn the vast array of experiences it offers, they aren't worth catering to. In EVE, CCP offers a unique and rich universe, lightyears beyond any other MMO that this player has come across. I believe it is for this reason that capsuleers around the world have chosen to give their money and time to CCP rather than other game developers. I also believe it is for this reason that CCP needs to move convenience to the very bottom of their list of priorities. Before I get off my soapbox I'd like to add that I am a new EVE player, and I think this game is F*kin' awesome. It is the negative point of view that so many players are taking that disturbs me. I do not know the game's history as well as most players, but all I can say is that I severely hope that the reaction this forum has had to Incarna is an overreaction, and not an indication that CCP is jumping on the bandwagon with certain other game developers that produce sensationalist BS. Also...Captain's Quarters are sweet but leave much more to be desired obviously. Noble Exchange wouldn't suck if there were missions that offered AURUM as a reward instead of ISK. That way I could earn the shnazzy vanity items through some aspect of the game that involves content. (Admittedly, I could grind until I saved enough ISK to buy a PLEX to split. But yeah...those prices.) TL;DR - Reading is for suckers and microtransactions are awesome!**
Axemaster	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:26:00 - [177] This must not be allowed to happen. Also, CCP needs to suck it up and fire the eggheads who came up with this garbage. GARBAGE.
Barakkus	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:27:00 - [178] Originally by: BeanBagKing I'm not saying I'll quit, but if this goes into play I'll have some really hard choices about where I want to spend my money. - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:27:00 - [179] for heavens sake can somebody at ccp tell us this is a load of trolling nonsense please. Join the Revolution!
Medidranda Livoga	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:28:00 - [180] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:20:57 Originally by: Medidranda Livoga I`d be ok with microtransaction model if no subscription was required for basic game access. You could sell "premium" account with double training speed or something too... No thanks. I would rather subscribe, I can budget for a subscription, with MT's you cannot budget this as easily as it is "impulse" driven or driven by the "desire to keep up or win". I know what I spend with a subscription. MT is too big a risk financially as a customer. That`s your own personal problem. I have no complaints if you want to give even more money to CCP that you already do. High time that you learned how to budjet your life if you haven`t already.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:28:00 - [181] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:29:47 Let's not forget this point.. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=4#101 If you happen to be economically challenged or just donÆt trust the PlayStation Network with your credit card details, you can trade ISK with other players for some real money currency, just like you can with PLEX today. You can also do the opposite and exchange purchased realmoney currency for ISK, too. Both work for us as long as money is being spent. In reading that they want to complete the money life cycle and allow us to take currency OUT of the game? That is their way to gain acceptance.. However the gameplay impacting purchases are a sickening. Basically, ENTROPIA but allowing money to flow out?
Paul Clavet Suddenly Ninjas Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:28:00 - [182] Dear CCP: My five accounts, and a relatively popular blog at http://mylootyourtears.com are in jeopardy because of this issue and the $99 developer licenses. Tread carefully. -Paul Clavet ---- Blog: My Loot, Your Tears
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:30:00 - [183] Originally by: Cyber Duck what have you done to our game ccp? OUR GAME! WE PAY YOUR ****ING WAGES!!! Well basically it's still their game, but the part of them being nowhere without our money is indeed very true. We paid for everything they have... but ignoring their playerbase is a growing trend with CCP it seems. Man, feels like I'm full of rage right now I started playing this game and kept playing it because it was different, not because it was a clone of everything else!!! As has been said before, sad is the day when concidering a WoW account isn't even half bad _________________________________________________
Max Cooper	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:30:00 - [184] I do hope this is a troll. I really really do.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:31:00 - [185] I wanted to post this as someone asked. Meta data from the document shows some hard work went into its creation. It was initially created 4/14/11 at 12:56 in Adobe InDesign 7.0. It had 414 revision saves. The last main save was 5/20/11 at 15:47 using Adobe InDesign 7.0. No Author information.
Aina O'Sinnor	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:31:00 - [186] This saddens the **** out of me. I was looking forward, now I am stuck. I won't quit yet. If there is money to make, they'll go for it.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:32:00 - [187] subscription cancelled. Don't worry about my stuff, I'm sure CCP will sell it to you for AUR. I am really depressed about this now. AG *** Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
TedStriker The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:32:00 - [188] Money and power corrupts, always. Thx for proving that point again, CCP. And no, greed lead to the many financial crashes, the exploitation and alot of other nasty stuff on this planet, GREED IS NOT GOOD, except for the few on the winning side. And they have to hire bodyguards and lock themselves in, usually.
Maximus Trollus Amarr The Village Idiots	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:33:00 - [189] Originally by: Medidranda Livoga Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:20:57 Originally by: Medidranda Livoga I`d be ok with microtransaction model if no subscription was required for basic game access. You could sell "premium" account with double training speed or something too... No thanks. I would rather subscribe, I can budget for a subscription, with MT's you cannot budget this as easily as it is "impulse" driven or driven by the "desire to keep up or win". I know what I spend with a subscription. MT is too big a risk financially as a customer. That`s your own personal problem. I have no complaints if you want to give even more money to CCP that you already do. doesn't matter much buddy, you're outnumbered anyway...
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:33:00 - [190] Well im glad i canceled my subscription this morning as this has really been the worst expansion ever. F#ck you CCP i hope someone strings you up by the balls with piano wire you c#nts All hail the king of the potato people
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:34:00 - [191] Edited by: leth ghost on 22/06/2011 22:35:57 Originally by: Caladan Broood I wanted to post this as someone asked. Meta data from the document shows some hard work went into its creation. It was initially created 4/14/11 at 12:56 in Adobe InDesign 7.0. It had 414 revision saves. The last main save was 5/20/11 at 15:47 using Adobe InDesign 7.0. No Author information. well if this is true i dont think its a hoax then and the files getting around now being shared on twitter ccp must be holding there head in there hands
Makko Gray Nexus Aerospace Corporation	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:35:00 - [192] Think I prefered EVE when it was just LulzSec trying to **** it.
Howdy Kitty Minmatar Sebiestor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:35:00 - [193] Originally by: Caladan Broood I wanted to post this as someone asked. Meta data from the document shows some hard work went into its creation. It was initially created 4/14/11 at 12:56 in Adobe InDesign 7.0. It had 414 revision saves. The last main save was 5/20/11 at 15:47 using Adobe InDesign 7.0. No Author information. interesting, gotta love the PDF/A standard and metadata. *conspiracy theory - the author, when faking this, changed her system date
Borun Tal Minmatar Just Abide	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:35:00 - [194] Edited by: Borun Tal on 22/06/2011 22:35:46 Originally by: Jo Blot Edited by: Jo Blot on 22/06/2011 22:03:26 Some things that can be sold to players: - Fast-track upgrades that install first time A good QA department can ensure that the software installs on least-common denominator systems. To ask for "install first time" is just silly, unless every subscriber uses the same computer on the same OS with the same configuration. Originally by: Jo Blot - Downtime compensation insurance - CCP-appoved custom bots, made to order for high net worth clients. - Level-Up! Skill point sales to be introduced ASAP. - Scam protection. That's just silly. Originally by: Jo Blot - Real-time market data feeds That would be good for developers, but then you get into the Twitter problem: database queries, speed of updating disconnected recordsets, BANDWIDTH OPTIMIZATION. Real-time feeds are awesome in theory; unfortunately in most consumer situations it's completely unrealistic. Originally by: Jo Blot - Energy Trading: Allow players to configure their defences to automatically purchase extra sheilds whenever they go into armoue. What? So, basically, everyone can buy whatever armor/shield/ammo they need AS THEY NEED it, in any situation. You didn't really think this one out, didja? Originally by: Jo Blot - Idiot-free, fact-checked forums (alas, unavailable at any price) Welcome to teh Intarwebz... Originally by: Jo Blot - Alt-discovery agents. In-space agents that will divulge the identies of other player's alts in exchange for RL cash. What, exactly, is an "alt" to my toon Borun Tal? Alt?? Alt what? What are you talking about? Ah, I see, you want to enable griefing on a personal level, not on a game level. Yeah, that's awesome. Maybe indemnify all subscribers from local, state, and national stalking laws, too?
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:35:00 - [195] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:29:47 Let's not forget this point.. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=4#101 If you happen to be economically challenged or just donÆt trust the PlayStation Network with your credit card details, you can trade ISK with other players for some real money currency, just like you can with PLEX today. You can also do the opposite and exchange purchased realmoney currency for ISK, too. Both work for us as long as money is being spent. In reading that they want to complete the money life cycle and allow us to take currency OUT of the game? That is their way to gain acceptance.. However the gameplay impacting purchases are a sickening. Basically, ENTROPIA but allowing money to flow out? Allowing money to flow out would put them under various nations banking and gambling laws. Not going to happen. It's just a lazily worded paragraph. I think they mean buying PLEX or equivalent with real money in DUST.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:35:00 - [196] Originally by: Mahnmut Orphu Before I get off my soapbox I'd like to add that I am a new EVE player, and I think this game is F*kin' awesome. It is the negative point of view that so many players are taking that disturbs me. I do not know the game's history as well as most players, but all I can say is that I severely hope that the reaction this forum has had to Incarna is an overreaction, and not an indication that CCP is jumping on the bandwagon with certain other game developers that produce sensationalist BS. Also...Captain's Quarters are sweet but leave much more to be desired obviously. Noble Exchange wouldn't suck if there were missions that offered AURUM as a reward instead of ISK. That way I could earn the shnazzy vanity items through some aspect of the game that involves content. (Admittedly, I could grind until I saved enough ISK to buy a PLEX to split. But yeah...those prices.) TL;DR - Reading is for suckers and microtransactions are awesome! CCP have a long history of not delivering on promises and this expansion which has been hyped for 6 years at this point is just the straw that broke the camels back. Adding in a cash shop with what amounts to nothing more than a poorly coded tech demo has rightly ed a lot of us off. MT are against the spirit of the game to many veteran players and this leak goes to show just how right we were to be ed about the introduction of them at all. CCP will be more than happy to push non-vanity items through their cash shop for a buck and have lied to our faces about it. How was it worded in the pdf? Items of Power or some **? Pathetic
Bloodpetal Mimidae Risk Solutions	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:36:00 - [197] I take everything back that HYDRA did to embarass CCP. Good job. CCP deserved to be embarassed for the joke that event was. So, the whole "we'll give server side fittings" was just a ploy to provide an inconvenience under the guise of convenience to provide it as an RMT item? Disgusting. I expect CCP will burn for this. ____________________________________________________ Bastet :: Captain
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:36:00 - [198] Originally by: Lord Cath Originally by: Cyber Duck what have you done to our game ccp? OUR GAME! WE PAY YOUR ****ING WAGES!!! Well basically it's still their game, but the part of them being nowhere without our money is indeed very true. We paid for everything they have... but ignoring their playerbase is a growing trend with CCP it seems. Man, feels like I'm full of rage right now I started playing this game and kept playing it because it was different, not because it was a clone of everything else!!! As has been said before, sad is the day when concidering a WoW account isn't even half bad Your sig, hurts my feelings and crashes my hopes ... Oh WOE IS ME!!! WHY CCP??? WHY???????? ---Archipelago Theory---
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:36:00 - [199] Originally by: Caladan Broood I wanted to post this as someone asked. Meta data from the document shows some hard work went into its creation. It was initially created 4/14/11 at 12:56 in Adobe InDesign 7.0. It had 414 revision saves. The last main save was 5/20/11 at 15:47 using Adobe InDesign 7.0. No Author information. That is the US data format. Just to note.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:37:00 - [200] Originally by: Mahnmut Orphu Why not make an epic mission arc that offers these sorts of perks as rewards? I feel that as a customer, my "emotional attachment" would be impacted in a much more positive way if earning the extended storage involved more than opening up my wallet. Some counter-arguments: * Creating an epic arc just for more fitting space requires dev/art/writing resources. * It's also a very specific quest which has the risk of being of limited appeal. * It's a grind. Do you really want to have to run the same content on multiple characters to get the additional fitting space? An alternative would be to let you buy the extra space with ISK (i.e. the ISK-Plex-Aurum cycle.) The advantages are: * the market can place a better value on the extra space. (CCP doesn't have to worry about balancing the effort of the Epic Arc to match the rewards.) * you can do things you like or that are more convenient for you to earn the ISK to buy the Plex to buy the Aurum to buy the space. * no Dev/Art/Writing resources are required, * those Dev/Art/Writing resources can instead create a more generic Epic Arc that appeals to a wider audience and not just the few people who need more than 50 fitting slots. Meaning, they can use the isk from the Epic Arc to buy the MT items that they're interested in instead of a static reward of extra fitting slots. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:38:00 - [201] Originally by: Jade Constantine for heavens sake can somebody at ccp tell us this is a load of trolling nonsense please. They could tell you that, but it wouldn't be true.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:40:00 - [202] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:41:14 Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:29:47 Let's not forget this point.. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=4#101 If you happen to be economically challenged or just donÆt trust the PlayStation Network with your credit card details, you can trade ISK with other players for some real money currency, just like you can with PLEX today. You can also do the opposite and exchange purchased realmoney currency for ISK, too. Both work for us as long as money is being spent. In reading that they want to complete the money life cycle and allow us to take currency OUT of the game? That is their way to gain acceptance.. However the gameplay impacting purchases are a sickening. Basically, ENTROPIA but allowing money to flow out? Allowing money to flow out would put them under various nations banking and gambling laws. Not going to happen. It's just a lazily worded paragraph. I think they mean buying PLEX or equivalent with real money in DUST. Unless CCP are gona apply for Icelandic Bank status :) PayPal became a bank in Luxembourg so the standard isnt high these days.
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:41:00 - [203] Its obviously fake. the guy that runs that site is a Pink eye'd, neckbeard, journalism school dropout, that never leaves his basement. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity Doesn't have an iPhone.
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:42:00 - [204] Originally by: Bloodpetal So, the whole "we'll give server side fittings" was just a ploy to provide an inconvenience under the guise of convenience to provide it as an RMT item? Disgusting. I expect CCP will burn for this. Nah, enough users will play this new stations and spaceships game. Probably more, in fact. Hardcore doesn't pay.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:43:00 - [205] Edited by: Caladan Broood on 22/06/2011 22:44:55 Anyone who wants the entire meta dump to see if you can see other goodies here is the xmp file: http://www.2shared.com/file/mcUilKUc/ccp_bulletin.html You can verify all the saves, that is all it tracks. I'm thinking someone kept pressing ctrl-s while working out of habit. But you can see the timeline for the creation process, the password was added 2 days ago, I'm assuming by the blog.
Cosmoes Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:43:00 - [206] So anyone know a good MMO out there? ------------------- piccy
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:44:00 - [207] Originally by: Jerry Pepridge Its obviously fake. the guy that runs that site is a Pink eye'd, neckbeard, journalism school dropout, that never leaves his basement. Brown-nose some more, haven't seen you defend CCP's incompetence enough yet today.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:44:00 - [208] Originally by: Pat Morrison Originally by: Bloodpetal So, the whole "we'll give server side fittings" was just a ploy to provide an inconvenience under the guise of convenience to provide it as an RMT item? Disgusting. I expect CCP will burn for this. Nah, enough users will play this new stations and spaceships game. Probably more, in fact. Hardcore doesn't pay. Space / scifi genre is still very niche market, it is no where near as big a market as WoW is. Never will be. So CCP are banking on farming loyal emotional customers. Plain and simple.
Picard Facepalm Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:44:00 - [209] For the second time in 24 hours, this is directed at CCP. /facepalm
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:46:00 - [210] Originally by: Brujo Loco Originally by: Lord Cath Originally by: Cyber Duck what have you done to our game ccp? OUR GAME! WE PAY YOUR ****ING WAGES!!! Well basically it's still their game, but the part of them being nowhere without our money is indeed very true. We paid for everything they have... but ignoring their playerbase is a growing trend with CCP it seems. Man, feels like I'm full of rage right now I started playing this game and kept playing it because it was different, not because it was a clone of everything else!!! As has been said before, sad is the day when concidering a WoW account isn't even half bad Your sig, hurts my feelings and crashes my hopes ... Oh WOE IS ME!!! WHY CCP??? WHY???????? wow, I had show sigs turned off for quite some time didn't even know I still had that one in there. Pretty ironic in these times now that I come to think of it :s _________________________________________________
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:46:00 - [211] Edited by: ExcalibursTemplar on 22/06/2011 22:46:34 Originally by: Picard Facepalm For the second time in 24 hours, this is directed at CCP. /facepalm Lmao thank you thats about the only thing ive laughed at all day to do with this game. All hail the king of the potato people
Dr Lebroi	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:46:00 - [212] Golf eh CCP, know how a golf club works? You have to mow the grass and keep the bunkers clean, you have to respond to the suggestions of your players and members and you have to keep the people that pay to play the game happy because they ARE your club. If you don't, then all you've got it a big frackin empty field that no one is interested in at all.
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:46:00 - [213] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Tears QQ more nerd, i got a long day of work ahead of me & i need to laugh at saps like you crying about ** that makes no difference to actual gameplay. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity** Doesn't have an iPhone.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:46:00 - [214] Originally by: Picard Facepalm For the second time in 24 hours, this is directed at CCP. /facepalm Nobody cares, given the price of AUR items and CCP's recent behaviours. Everybody expects the worst now.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:47:00 - [215] There's a huge problem with the idea of microtransactions in any MMO, especially one with a subscription fee. The problem - it betrays the idea of a MMORPG as a whole. An RPG's purpose is to allow a person to become as great and awesome as he can, regardless of who he is in real life. I can be anyone I want to be. Even if you aren't a "Roleplayer", you still participate in that basic part of an RPG. In an MMORPG, you develop that person through hard work and time spent in the virtual world. The only real-life constraint is time, and that's even alleviated by EVE's awesome real-time skill training system. If CCP does indeed continue down this path, then the MMORPG status of EVE will be a lie. Sure, there are lots of people. But now the idea of being a whole new person is being thrown out. Your in-game character is just an extension of who you are in real life. If you're a person who can afford these added costs, you can do anything in the microtransaction model. However, this inevitably cheats those who do not want to invest anything besides time. If non-vanity microtransactions make a rise in EVE, it will be more about who has the most free cash, and not about who really learns and puts time into the game. Also, the argument that PLEX from in-game -> AURUM makes this legitimate is bogus, seeing as the PLEX comes from a GTC bought in real money anyway. However, we can't react to this junk by all ragequitting at the earliest mention of mass-implementation of microtransactions. If the OP's quotes from the article in question are correct, that's what the people pushing the microtransactions want. This game is still fun. This latest expansion hasn't killed it, although I do miss spinning my ship in station... Really, what we need to do is make it clear that the EVE playerbase is still committed to the old EVE, even if a majority of CCP developers and business consultants are not. Just wait and be ready to give CCP feedback on this junk, and let them know that we will not stand an unfair game advantage from microtransactions.
Dograzor The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:47:00 - [216] Reading through all the stuff that has been going on, I just wonder, howcome CCP manages to screw themselves over 3x in the last weeks? Arum, monetizing apps, and now this leak. Seriously, are you on a shoot yourself in the foot Guinness book of records tour? At this point I just wonder if any damage control is going to cut it... bah. - "We don't gank, we just apply force in a disproportionate manner during an uneven tactical combat situation to maximize revenue and increase shareholder value"
J'J'J'Jita Ch'Ch'Ch'Chia Corp	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:49:00 - [217] Edited by: J''J''J''Jita on 22/06/2011 22:48:56 Ya'll are getting pretty angry about a document that just says "we're gonna give microtransactions for things which do not provide an in-game advantage a try." I'd like to see the statistics about the percent of trolls which say they are unsubbing versus those who actually do (hint: people are raging just to prevent CCP from taking it into the realm of affecting game balance, or because they're unhappy CCP isn't giving everyone 1 AUR vanity items which would instantly make incarna valueless as an expansion).
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:49:00 - [218] Originally by: J'J'J'Jita Ya'll are getting pretty angry about a document that just says "we're gonna give microtransactions for things which do not provide an in-game advantage a try." I'd like to see the statistics about the percent of trolls which say they are subbing versus those who actually do (hint: people are raging just to prevent CCP from taking it into the realm of affecting game balance, or because they're unhappy CCP isn't giving everyone 1 AUR vanity items which would instantly make incarna valueless as an expansion). Didn't you read this bit? "One other service weÆre looking at is selling faction standings. We want to offer convenience for a price"
George Gallante	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:50:00 - [219] all you guys on this forum complaining and quitting their n accounts are just a very small number in ccp's wallet. most players will continue to play and pay subs, buy the vanity items no matter how expensive they are and swallow anything that comes in the next years always been like that, always will be. you won't make a change, spam the forums, quit your accounts or boycot the fanfest. ccp will walk this path to the end, like it or not
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:50:00 - [220] Originally by: Jerry Pepridge Originally by: Isil Rahsen Tears QQ more nerd, i got a long day of work ahead of me & i need to laugh at saps like you crying about ** that makes no difference to actual gameplay. Who's crying **? I don't give a ** what CCP do, only used my 4 hour reactivation to get in some lulz with idiots like you.
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:51:00 - [221] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Who's crying ****? I don't give a what CCP do, only used my 4 hour reactivation to get in some lulz with idiots like you. Your crying. teach me. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity** Doesn't have an iPhone.
Mr Kidd	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:51:00 - [222] Originally by: J'J'J'Jita Edited by: J''J''J''Jita on 22/06/2011 22:48:56 Ya'll are getting pretty angry about a document that just says "we're gonna give microtransactions for things which do not provide an in-game advantage a try." I'd like to see the statistics about the percent of trolls which say they are unsubbing versus those who actually do (hint: people are raging just to prevent CCP from taking it into the realm of affecting game balance, or because they're unhappy CCP isn't giving everyone 1 AUR vanity items which would instantly make incarna valueless as an expansion). Don't forget the bit about new ammo for aur purchase. Somehow I don't think it's going to be snowballs.
Ms Freak Amarr Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:52:00 - [223] Originally by: Picard Facepalm For the second time in 24 hours, this is directed at CCP. /facepalm lol - seriously - lol
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:52:00 - [224] Originally by: George Gallante all you guys on this forum complaining and quitting their n accounts are just a very small number in ccp's wallet. most players will continue to play and pay subs, buy the vanity items no matter how expensive they are and swallow anything that comes in the next years always been like that, always will be. you won't make a change, spam the forums, quit your accounts or boycot the fanfest. ccp will walk this path to the end, like it or not Absolute truth, but if the changes are legit and the gravy pipe is neigh on the horizon i'm packin up half a dozen accounts. Drop in the bucket for sure, but as long as i'm not wasting my cash on the new second-life I really don't care. vOv
QT McWhiskers EdgeGamers Situation Normal.	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:52:00 - [225] The problem right now is this. This bulletin, whether true or not, has shown CCP in a very bad light. No matter what they SAY right now, no one will believe them. However the silence over this bulletin is more damning than a denial. CCP, right now you need to clarify some things to your customers. Are the topics of this bulletin true? Did this bulletin get leaked from one of your employees? Has the bulletin been altered? These are all questions that need an answer. But not just words either. They need actions too. First and foremost being the fact that the only thing to enter the plex store are vanity oriented and provide no game bonus whatsoever no matter how minute or no matter how small. No items every being sold in the plex market that people can use in game for PVE or PVP, other than paint jobs. This bulletin is very bad for your PR department, and something needs to be said soon or you risk losing several high profile customers and the throngs of people who will follow them.
Brainless Bimbo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:52:00 - [226] You guys ever google the name of the CCP Global Chief Financial Officer Joe Gallo made me chuckle.. ...... continues overleaf.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:52:00 - [227] Originally by: Ms Freak Originally by: Picard Facepalm For the second time in 24 hours, this is directed at CCP. /facepalm lol - seriously - lol Yeah, lets give CCP ideas like this... that can't be bad at all.
Whim Aqayn	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:53:00 - [228] Saw this coming. Will take actions to never let this happen if possible. If it goes life EVE will be a thing of the past.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:53:00 - [229] Originally by: Jerry Pepridge Originally by: Isil Rahsen Who's crying ****? I don't give a ** what CCP do, only used my 4 hour reactivation to get in some lulz with idiots like you. Your crying. teach me. Can't teach a derp like you anything but to faceroll the keyboard with I TROLOLOL U!!1 but that's ok, it's not your fault you're special.
Nimbat	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:54:00 - [230] Wow this thread is growing so freaking fast now.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:54:00 - [231] Originally by: Nimbat Wow this thread is growing so freaking fast now. It's not called a Threadnaught for nothing :)
Kelsi Corynn	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:54:00 - [232] Just going to leave this here...... Spaceville!
Estephania Independent Political Analysts	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:55:00 - [233] No idea if it's legit, but it is certainly in line with CCP latest actions. I was saying it from the start - you let MT in and in no time MT will devour the whole game. It's called greed. Skirts and boots are not the last - there will be ammo, ships and modules (and faction standings). BizDev is working extra hours to destroy Eve.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:56:00 - [234] ccp's silence says alot i think lol
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:56:00 - [235] Originally by: Estephania No idea if it's legit, but it is certainly in line with CCP latest actions. I was saying it from the start - you let MT in and in no time MT will devour the whole game. It's called greed. Skirts and boots are not the last - there will be ammo, ships and modules (and faction standings). BizDev is working extra hours to destroy Eve. I say let them destroy eve. It's the only way to be sure. Just sit back and enjoy the train wreck.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:57:00 - [236] The slope is too steep here. If you allow faction standing to be bought then SP will be right around the corner. How about buying sov points next?
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:57:00 - [237] Originally by: Whim Aqayn Saw this coming. Will take actions to never let this happen if possible. If it goes life EVE will be a thing of the past. The very sad truth of the matter is that you are wrong, what will happen is that eve as we know it will end. And instead will be filled up with a lot of snobs pumping money in this game and showing off their golden sneakers to one another. It doesn't need to be that way ofc. But it's one of the many possiblilties that might happen
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:57:00 - [238] The funny thing is that CCP is sacrificing their userbase for a mythical one that will magically come from the ether and give out ponies and unicorns for everyone. CQ is supposedly the bait for this. Now lets think, for every person that quits, a bunch of alt accounts go too. Whether those alts are paid with money or PLEX, CCP is getting money. To replace them, they need to get one new account per every account that quits, then. But look around. There is EVE marketing everywhere but EVE player growth is linear at best. Despite massive marketing, EVE just doesn't seem to pull new people, and when it does, to retain them. Will a single room with nothing to do, which looks terrible even at max settings, and microtransactions that are completely out of whack with reality change this? I have a hard time believing so. Where were you when Eve died?
Garrick Konquero ImmCo	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:58:00 - [239] Of all the expansions I've experienced, this one has been the least fun to play, but the most entertaining to "watch".
Ricardo Gonzalo Montalban	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:58:00 - [240] If this is real, I'm quiting and going back to Elite.
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:58:00 - [241] Originally by: J'J'J'Jita Edited by: J''J''J''Jita on 22/06/2011 22:48:56 Ya'll are getting pretty angry about a document that just says "we're gonna give microtransactions for things which do not provide an in-game advantage a try." You must have missed the bit where it says "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: Some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships etc. that can be purchased outright."
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 22:58:00 - [242] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 23:02:52 Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 23:02:14 Originally by: Caladan Broood The slope is too steep here. If you allow faction standing to be bought then SP will be right around the corner. How about buying sov points next? It is JUST vanity items... Ignore the man (bizdev, marketing, accountants, banks, creditors, russian mafia)... behind the curtain.
Iyuvai Myoisi Minmatar Calx Holding	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:01:00 - [243] Originally by: Barakkus Originally by: leth ghost mod locked other thread saying "no need to have multiple threads" have we not had multiple threads all day on here with none being locked ???? why now lol Because the mods just got around to it. I'm having this strange feeling that this is real since this hasn't been locked for "lulz rumorz hahah"... ...well then...I have to make up my mind about some things it seems... Not fake. Trial balloon, maybe, but not fake.
diaufop	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:01:00 - [244] Edited by: diaufop on 22/06/2011 23:03:00 Originally by: Raid'En however there's an error on dust model ; at E3 it was said there were NO fee for the game itself. on this document it is said there is one. and this document is from before the E3... but not that much before. meaning either it was a change made on last minute... either it's a FAKE. Just going to jump in here and point something out to you that you may not be aware of: Company employees say whatever they're paid to say, not "the truth". As a specific, verifiable example in the MMO genre: Turbine were actively stating that there was no intention of Lord of The Rings Online going f2p less than 2 weeks before the official announcement was made. The various PR people and Devs were standing up in public and lying to their customer's faces, knowing full well that the f2p+microtransactions model had worked so well in DDO that they'd started implementing a changeover for LoTRO months previous to the official announcement. It isn't beyond the realms of possibility that they're saying one thing right now for the sake of PR, and will announce something completely different when the crunch time comes and the product goes on release. An internal document such as this might differ from the public party line on a number of points. In my own personal experience (of course, anecdote=/=data), I've been told to lie to customers on more occasions than I can count, as do many (I'd even venture to say most) people who are in a customer-facing role in any sort of large company. I have no idea whether this "leak" is genuine or fake, but discrepancies such as this can't really be used to say it's a fake.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:03:00 - [245] Full unedited version from CCP -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:03:00 - [246] Originally by: Liang Nuren Full unedited version from CCP Emphasis. ______________________________
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:04:00 - [247] Originally by: Liang Nuren Full unedited version from CCP Can you summarise what is in this verison that was edited out? Good, bad, ugly? Key points?
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:04:00 - [248] Edited by: Tutskii on 22/06/2011 23:07:10 EDIT: This thread is moving TOO FAST! http://www.mediafire.com/?ccl135embyb6c2v Here is the unedited version with TOC, etc. Eve is real. Where were you when Eve died?
Yumar Almasy	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:05:00 - [249] Edited by: Yumar Almasy on 22/06/2011 23:05:51 Looks like two more accounts will be heading out as well. Shame, as I have only been playing for a few months and was really enjoying myself. Unfortunately, this is not the future I expected for Eve. I will wait for an official response from CCP, but something tells me it is just going to be damage control with no apology/epiphany.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:05:00 - [250] Originally by: Liang Nuren Full unedited version from CCP Epic
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:06:00 - [251] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Liang Nuren Full unedited version from CCP Emphasis. Just checked the meta data on that, the same as the one going around that is missing the index page. All the save data is same for time and amount (414)
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:06:00 - [252] Quote: And it couldnÆt come at a better time. As EVE edges closer to being the grand dame of gaming, turning 8 years old this month, and our other game titles continue their prodigious growth (yes, World of Darkness too û you got the t-shirt to prove it), our development road map is shaping up stronger and better. However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you. The model also supports the notion of creating a meaningful experience and identity for the player (more in our main feature on page 4). What is the thing they say about golden geese? Where were you when Eve died?
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:07:00 - [253] Originally by: Liang Nuren Full unedited version from CCP **** just got real. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:07:00 - [254] Originally by: Tutskii The funny thing is that CCP is sacrificing their userbase for a mythical one that will magically come from the ether and give out ponies and unicorns for everyone. CQ is supposedly the bait for this. Now lets think, for every person that quits, a bunch of alt accounts go too. Whether those alts are paid with money or PLEX, CCP is getting money. To replace them, they need to get one new account per every account that quits, then. But look around. There is EVE marketing everywhere but EVE player growth is linear at best. Despite massive marketing, EVE just doesn't seem to pull new people, and when it does, to retain them. Will a single room with nothing to do, which looks terrible even at max settings, and microtransactions that are completely out of whack with reality change this? I have a hard time believing so. I'd wager they're riding on DUST being at least enough of a boost to offset vet losses, allowing them to ride the truly dedicated "until the server shuts off," crowd into the ground and/or until they can crap out WoD and try their hand at a pure-bread microtransaction game. vOv
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:07:00 - [255] Is this getting any news coverage? If not, start linking to the games news sites (including this threadnaught).
handige harrie	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:08:00 - [256] Edited by: handige harrie on 22/06/2011 23:12:44 Edited by: handige harrie on 22/06/2011 23:08:52 lol CCP, You can develop a friendship by ôspendingö your time, or you can pay to get the same benefits that friendship would otherwise allow. I really hope this isn't someones personal experience with people, because it's kinda sad. Because it translates to 'if you have money, you don't need friendship'. Does that mean that theyÆre universally good, and we should slap a pricetag on everything? Probably not Than why do you state you want to MT every last damn non-vanity thing in this game then? (Ships/Ammo/Sov) I donÆt really understand the logic behind it [players against MT and Cash Shops to get an advantage], but thatÆs probably because IÆve been using virtual goods sales for a long time now and actually prefer them over subscriptions. Why? Because they let me manage my spending, and IÆll sometimes prefer to buy a better experience when engaging in my hobby. If you play any competitive sport as a hobby, you'll realize how dumb this argument is. You can't buy a smaller goal in soccer, you can't buy a higher PAR in golf. You can't MT better Champion skills in League of Legends, the only you can buy is Fluff and some nice shoes and bag, while the player skill makes the difference. I shop therefore I am presented as a fact, but is wrong. Only applies to certain sub groups who caress their vanity not as a negative trait, but as a way of life. so as a subbed player, am I lesser a player now than someone who buys his Ships for real money? Apparently, EVE's lead designer thinks so... Now does this mean that we should go for unbridled evil consumerism, trying to squeeze every single penny from our hapless customers? Of course not. Then why write a large piece about how you want to do this? or $60,- monocle anyone?
Linar Mardolak Minmatar Phlogiston Absorption	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:09:00 - [257] Originally by: Jerry Pepridge Your crying. teach me. Okay, I'll teach you. Here is today's lesson: The word you are likely looking for is You're. It's short for "You are", and that's called a contraction. The word you used, "Your", indicates possession - "The crying that belongs to you."
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:09:00 - [258] Originally by: Tutskii Quote: And it couldnÆt come at a better time. As EVE edges closer to being the grand dame of gaming, turning 8 years old this month, and our other game titles continue their prodigious growth (yes, World of Darkness too û you got the t-shirt to prove it), our development road map is shaping up stronger and better. However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you. The model also supports the notion of creating a meaningful experience and identity for the player (more in our main feature on page 4). What is the thing they say about golden geese? So we are funding games we probably will not play. That is reason right there to not support MT. Ofcourse they WILL increase subs to compensate. Either way, CCP will lose revenue in the short term. Does this also mean that the price for eve will drop once these other games are "self funding?" I doubt it.
Nimbat	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:10:00 - [259] Guess we don't need an official CCP response anymore...
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:10:00 - [260] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Liang Nuren Full unedited version from CCP Can you summarise what is in this verison that was edited out? Good, bad, ugly? Key points? Mostly just header, footer, staff pictures, etc. Proves it's real but not relevant to the MT stuff. ______________________________
Ai Mei Starfish Operating Syndicate	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:10:00 - [261] wheeee posting!
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:10:00 - [262] Originally by: Axemaster This must not be allowed to happen. Also, CCP needs to suck it up and fire the eggheads who came up with this garbage. GARBAGE. Thatt would be the lead game designer among others. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:11:00 - [263] "....as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue" Golden goose eh? Cute. C. the hydrostatic capsule blog
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:11:00 - [264] Perhaps not the apocalypse. DISCLAIMER: The views put forward in this magazine do not refl ect general CCP company policies or decisions and are strictly individual opinions, written by CCPers or about CCPers who feel strongly about these issues. I want to believe...
Dr Lebroi	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:11:00 - [265] Kjartan Emilsson, The reason people enjoy buying things is because they become their own personal property. They are free to treat them in anyway they like, sell them, break them or put them in a box under the stairs for posterity. As you are so fond of reminding us, everything in Eve belongs to the company we are only borrowing or renting things until CCP sees fit to take them away. Your golf analogy is flawed as we cannot take anything out of the game as we would take our own equipment off the golf course.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:12:00 - [266] Originally by: Cailais "....as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue" Golden goose eh? Cute. C. û revenue to fund our other titles
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:12:00 - [267] Wait, so... Someone makes a PDF and everyone assumes it's authentic?
Kalvunia IV Mercenaries of Andosia	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:12:00 - [268] I don't think find it important whether this leak is real or not. But I think it's important, now that MT has come up on the agenda I think we as a community need to let CCP know that MT for anything other then vanity items are not OK
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:12:00 - [269] Originally by: Linar Mardolak Originally by: Jerry Pepridge Your crying. teach me. Okay, I'll teach you. Here is today's lesson: The word you are likely looking for is You're. It's short for "You are", and that's called a contraction. The word you used, "Your", indicates possession - "The crying that belongs to you." i love you and want to have your babies. (ow snap, i'm female as well. (is it possible for two females in eve to have children)
Illwill Bill For a fistful of Veldspar	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:13:00 - [270] Free Riverini is a go! Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Revenge is a dish best served with auto-cannons.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:13:00 - [271] Originally by: Miilla Is this getting any news coverage? If not, start linking to the games news sites (including this threadnaught). im sure its gunna get some but sending a few tweets to some big mmo sites wouldnt go a miss lol
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:14:00 - [272] Originally by: Tla Atij Wait, so... Someone makes a PDF and everyone assumes it's authentic? It is authentic so far by aligning with CCP's actions. Their actions have been in line with this document so far. Actions speak louder than words, so far it is real.
Average Black Woman	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:14:00 - [273] i think CCPs pretty cool guy eh MT's his game and doesn't afraid of anything
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:14:00 - [274] The Disclaimer on page 1 is quite interesting. If these are private opinions of employees then any intellectual property clauses in contracts are void ... more importantly, the responsible director is an arse hat.
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [275] Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy?
Bologna Brains	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [276] CCP hasnt denied it in 10 pages, and something like this, if easily fake, would be denied by CCP quickly.
Iyuvai Myoisi Minmatar Calx Holding	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [277] Originally by: Nimbat Guess we don't need an official CCP response anymore... Yes, we've got it from the horse's mouth.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:15:00 - [278] Originally by: Hesperius Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy? Not a whole lot tbh. Its not going to tie me down and ** me at night, fortunately. -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:16:00 - [279] Originally by: Hesperius Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy? our fears, that we have been shouting loud all along and being called naysayers.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:17:00 - [280] For those that missed the editor's post in the unedited full version of the pdf: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." The sale pitch internally is.. "EVE has to subsidize the costs of the other games otherwise we can't pay your salary, trusted developer." I'm a realist but let's face it. MT is just a vehicle to fund development of other titles.
Linar Mardolak Minmatar Phlogiston Absorption	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:17:00 - [281] Originally by: Hesperius Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy? Real money for game-changing options. Selling faction standings. Aurum rewards for gaining sov. Real-money direct purchase ships and ammo.
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [282] Edited by: Emperor Cheney on 22/06/2011 23:18:04 Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:41:14 Originally by: Emperor Cheney Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 22:29:47 Let's not forget this point.. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=4#101 If you happen to be economically challenged or just donÆt trust the PlayStation Network with your credit card details, you can trade ISK with other players for some real money currency, just like you can with PLEX today. You can also do the opposite and exchange purchased realmoney currency for ISK, too. Both work for us as long as money is being spent. In reading that they want to complete the money life cycle and allow us to take currency OUT of the game? That is their way to gain acceptance.. However the gameplay impacting purchases are a sickening. Basically, ENTROPIA but allowing money to flow out? Allowing money to flow out would put them under various nations banking and gambling laws. Not going to happen. It's just a lazily worded paragraph. I think they mean buying PLEX or equivalent with real money in DUST. Unless CCP are gona apply for Icelandic Bank status :) PayPal became a bank in Luxembourg so the standard isnt high these days. I know you're being tongue in cheek, but in case anyone is thinking this is a possibility - there are miles between what this would entail v. what Paypal does. And paypal is in compliance (to the best of my knowledge. I know they have programs to this effect) with all the annoying U.S. banking laws (Bank Secrecy Act, Patriot Act, etc). For CCP to comply with those would be unimaginable. And that's just one country. And that's not even getting started on the gambling laws. . . Plus, MMO money being 'virtual currency' has long shielded MMO's from litigation for, say, a game glitch or unjust banning causing a player harm. Turning into an ISK/cash two way exchange would shatter that. It's just not going to happen.
Ophelia Ursus	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [283] Originally by: Hesperius Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy? How about this, from the section talking about microtransactions in Eve: Quote: Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright. "Vanity only" my arse. Signature removed.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [284] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 23:23:04 Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 22/06/2011 23:22:51 Originally by: Xervish Krin Perhaps not the apocalypse. DISCLAIMER: The views put forward in this magazine do not refl ect general CCP company policies or decisions and are strictly individual opinions, written by CCPers or about CCPers who feel strongly about these issues. Well, if it wasn't the lead game designer for EVE Online that had this opinions....
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [285] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Tla Atij Wait, so... Someone makes a PDF and everyone assumes it's authentic? It is authentic so far by aligning with CCP's actions. Their actions have been in line with this document so far. Actions speak louder than words, so far it is real. It is authentic, so far? It is real, so far? Put down the propaganda machine and take a course in logic. If I was working for other MMOs' PR dep. I'd make a PDF like this too. "Authentic so far" doesn't cut it.
Joao Duarte Selflessness	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [286] I don't know what to think of all this. To be fair, players ALREADY CAN buy isk, using the plex system. A player with money to spend in eve can get any amount of isk he wants. Noone seems very concerned about it. I think the question for me is: the instant I'm required to pay more money besides my 2 subscriptions to be competetive in eve, the game died for me. So. Preemptive measures: 1. switched my long term subscriptions to 1 month recurring. 2. scouting for new long term, player-run market, sci fi MMOs (Perpetuum is not bad and has lots of room to grow; Black Prophecy maybe; SWTOR will try it for sure but I doubt it will keep my brain as exercised as Eve does. 3. be sad.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:18:00 - [287] Originally by: Linar Mardolak Originally by: Hesperius Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy? Real money for game-changing options. Selling faction standings. Aurum rewards for gaining sov. Real-money direct purchase ships and ammo. But it isn't going to tie you down and ** you. Life - and Eve - will likely go on. Just without me. Or you, most likely. Or Hesp, to be fair. -Liang -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:19:00 - [288] Well, check this out said by The Mittani LOL <originally by Seelene in its blog> ** Our never boring CSM Chairman, The Mittani, had this to day about it all: "I think the island culture has to do with it. It's very easy to develop a consensus about how the world works when you're in a rinky-dink town like Reykjavik (which is lovely, but it's *** tiny) and you drink with/hang out with/bump into your coworkers all the goddamned time. Iceland also has a very charming culture of Just Not Giving A About Trivial . 'Trivial ' in the Icelandic view seems to include smashing glasses in the street, ing on walls like you just don't care in front of other people, parking your car in a way which blocks traffic/parking your car on a sidewalk, and just doing basically whatever the you feel like because you're on an island full of ** supermodels and there's nothing to do but drink, **, do drugs and party. It's a great island, but there's a serious cultural disconnect between Reyk and the rest of reality." Seems what is happening here har har har ---Archipelago Theory---
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:19:00 - [289] Quote: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:20:00 - [290] Disclaimer that those are only the personal opinoins of the company. Who the hell do you think makes up the company? Is it some robot that randomly selects what to do or is it the developers who pitch their "great ideals" to the managers on how to make the game better (read: profitable and draw more money). These are the personal opinions of the CCPers but they are the opinions being pushed the hardest and suprisingly implemented in the game.
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:20:00 - [291] the fact that they say MT will only be vanity items, while at the same time they are planning to introduce items that have a major influence on the game
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [292] I'm not so sure that they would be quick to deny a fake. Think how much we jump upon anything CCP says and tear it to shreds, sometimes deservingly, sometimes not. If I were them, I'd want to be very careful about how to approach responding to this; even if it's a fake, most of us here believe it's real at least to a small degree. That means a crapload of planning, drafts and redrafts to ensure that nothing can be taken the wrong way, to ensure that the reply doesn't create even more rage, and so on.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [293] Originally by: Brujo Loco Well, check this out said by The Mittani LOL <originally by Seelene in its blog> ** Our never boring CSM Chairman, The Mittani, had this to day about it all: "I think the island culture has to do with it. It's very easy to develop a consensus about how the world works when you're in a rinky-dink town like Reykjavik (which is lovely, but it's *** tiny) and you drink with/hang out with/bump into your coworkers all the goddamned time. Iceland also has a very charming culture of Just Not Giving A About Trivial . 'Trivial ' in the Icelandic view seems to include smashing glasses in the street, ing on walls like you just don't care in front of other people, parking your car in a way which blocks traffic/parking your car on a sidewalk, and just doing basically whatever the you feel like because you're on an island full of ** supermodels and there's nothing to do but drink, **, do drugs and party. It's a great island, but there's a serious cultural disconnect between Reyk and the rest of reality." Seems what is happening here har har har You also forgot that they are wreckless with money.
flapie 2 Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [294] Edited by: flapie 2 on 22/06/2011 23:21:53 Originally by: Howdy Kitty Originally by: Caladan Broood I wanted to post this as someone asked. Meta data from the document shows some hard work went into its creation. It was initially created 4/14/11 at 12:56 in Adobe InDesign 7.0. It had 414 revision saves. The last main save was 5/20/11 at 15:47 using Adobe InDesign 7.0. No Author information. interesting, gotta love the PDF/A standard and metadata. *conspiracy theory - the author, when faking this, changed her system date They only removed somenames and personal data from the file, i have the original and it doesnt change that much tbh.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:21:00 - [295] Originally by: Ophelia Ursus Originally by: Hesperius Not to be a lynch mob pooper, but what in that document is really that nasty that its news worthy? How about this, from the section talking about microtransactions in Eve: Quote: Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization: some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright. "Vanity only" my arse. Exactly, it's nothing less than a bald face lie.
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [296] BUT, that is CCP Soundwave talking liberally in a company news letter. Even the way it is structured, it sounds like he has some fighting internally to do to even get to bring it in front of us. I really don't care what they do with dust and wod, and outside of showing their hand of viewing us as numbers they can use and abuse more than customers, there is nothing that revealing in that document.
ovenproofjet Caldari Therapy.	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [297] Originally by: CCP Document similarly, it would be silly to buy sunglasses for my avatar and pay the same price that I would for a faction battleship Guess this logic doesn't apply to Monocles costing the same as dreadnaughts then? I'll be honest, I'm all for Microtransactions in Eve, just (for lack of a better quote) "never go full r*tard" about it...
Skogen Gump The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [298] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Quote: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected. This just in, CCP is a company ... sheesh. Star Fraction
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:22:00 - [299] Originally by: Xervish Krin I'm not so sure that they would be quick to deny a fake. Think how much we jump upon anything CCP says and tear it to shreds, sometimes deservingly, sometimes not. If I were them, I'd want to be very careful about how to approach responding to this; even if it's a fake, most of us here believe it's real at least to a small degree. That means a crapload of planning, drafts and redrafts to ensure that nothing can be taken the wrong way, to ensure that the reply doesn't create even more rage, and so on. A denial would have to come from someone pretty high up in the food chain and posted here. A simple denial by some CSM would be laughed at since they repeatedly said before they don't know what the developers are thinking.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:23:00 - [300] 8 accounts canceled, around two weeks of time left on most to see how much CCP can backpeddal/damage control before I biomass the lot of my characters. Thanks to whomever leaked this, the community has a right to know when it's going to get ****ed. See you all in the next mmo worth playing (not WoW).
Iyuvai Myoisi Minmatar Calx Holding	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:23:00 - [301] Originally by: Tla Atij It is authentic, so far? It is real, so far? Put down the propaganda machine and take a course in logic. If I was working for other MMOs' PR dep. I'd make a PDF like this too. "Authentic so far" doesn't cut it. Other MMOs PR departments? Seriously? Do you actually think that Eve is enough of a threat to any other MMO to warrant this sort of effort? Really? Really?
Manos Heimenbarger	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:23:00 - [302] I knew it, this is how cash shops start. Vanity only stuff, promises it won't impact game play... Then they slowly turn on their word and things go downhill.
Ysolde Xen The Causality Electus Matari	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:23:00 - [303] For what it's worth, I have had confirmation from a reliable source that the .pdf is not a fake. ----- Everyone knows Derek.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:24:00 - [304] Originally by: Ysolde Xen For what it's worth, I have had confirmation from a reliable source that the .pdf is not a fake. The only question that we really need answered is the TIMELINE.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:24:00 - [305] Originally by: Skogen Gump Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Quote: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected. This just in, CCP is a company ... sheesh. Companies need to treat their customers well and not squeeze them for all they're worth. Otherwise those customers leave. Unless they've given us EVE mind-altering drugs that keep us addicted to this.....
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:25:00 - [306] Originally by: Hesperius BUT, that is CCP Soundwave talking liberally in a company news letter. Even the way it is structured, it sounds like he has some fighting internally to do to even get to bring it in front of us. I really don't care what they do with dust and wod, and outside of showing their hand of viewing us as numbers they can use and abuse more than customers, there is nothing that revealing in that document. The only thing that it reveals - to me - is that CCP's focus has shifted from making a game (as small "indie" game companies tend to do) to making money through any possible means. The rushing out of CQ so that they can ** out a half finished MT store sooner really just underscores the point. /shrug -Liang -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:26:00 - [307] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Originally by: Skogen Gump Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Quote: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected. This just in, CCP is a company ... sheesh. Companies need to treat their customers well and not squeeze them for all they're worth. Otherwise those customers leave. Unless they've given us EVE mind-altering drugs that keep us addicted to this..... It's in the Quafe Ultra they gave us!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:26:00 - [308] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Originally by: Skogen Gump Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Quote: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." That there shows that CCP clearly sees the EVE community as a way to get money, not as a loyal customer base that should be respected. This just in, CCP is a company ... sheesh. Companies need to treat their customers well and not squeeze them for all they're worth. Otherwise those customers leave. Unless they've given us EVE mind-altering drugs that keep us addicted to this..... Sure companies may be feeling the pinch in a recession, but so are the customers. And you do NOT want to lose customers during a recession, you want to hold onto what you have, not MILK IT DRY, but keep it steady.
Ophelia Ursus	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:26:00 - [309] Edited by: Ophelia Ursus on 22/06/2011 23:26:56 Originally by: Hesperius BUT, that is CCP Soundwave talking liberally in a company news letter. Even the way it is structured, it sounds like he has some fighting internally to do to even get to bring it in front of us. I really don't care what they do with dust and wod, and outside of showing their hand of viewing us as numbers they can use and abuse more than customers, there is nothing that revealing in that document. Actually, that quote isn't from Soundwave and it's not from an opinion piece. It's written by someone called Scott Holden, in a full-page piece explaining that "CCP is in the process of adopting a virtual sales model for its game products" and detailing how "this new strategy [will] unfold in Incarna." "Vanity only" was a lie from the get-go. Signature removed.
Illwill Bill For a fistful of Veldspar	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:27:00 - [310] It's interesting that CCP's hasn't been activated yet. Originally by: CCP Zymurgist Revenge is a dish best served with auto-cannons.
Ashlyn Shi'jun	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:28:00 - [311] Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:28:00 - [312] ccp have realy shat on there own door step, trod in it then walk through the house with the $99 thing, incarna not pollished and these leaks
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:28:00 - [313] Edited by: Black Dranzer on 22/06/2011 23:29:01 Currently listening to "The Green Nebula". It sounds more mournful than usual. Originally by: Illwill Bill It's interesting that CCP's hasn't been activated yet. Honestly, not even CCP has the hull tank for this.
Raid'En	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:28:00 - [314] Edited by: Raid''En on 22/06/2011 23:28:57 Originally by: Miilla So we are funding games we probably will not play. That is reason right there to not support MT. Ofcourse they WILL increase subs to compensate. Either way, CCP will lose revenue in the short term. Does this also mean that the price for eve will drop once these other games are "self funding?" I doubt it. well you realize they don't have much choice to fund these others games right ? when we had tyrannis or incusion, which were mostly pve oriented it was done with both the money of pve and pvp players. sure some raged about this, but it's normal. it's normal that a game company try to get more money for this others projects. the problem is not here. i'll either quote them xD : Originally by: Greed is good The question of virtual goods sales is not ôto do, or not to do?ö Rather, itÆs ôhow do we do this?ö and they have totally ****ed their answer here ^^ at 10 aurum everyone and their mother would have bough some bulk. at 100 aurum the monocle and others clothes, maybe more than half of eve would have bough it. at 1000 aurum a few guys would have done it, lots would have raged, but would have not made a scandal.
Wintz Sudden Buggery	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:29:00 - [315] TL;DR MT squeezes are quite disrespectful.
Dograzor The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:29:00 - [316] How about we get paid to play your game CCP? - "We don't gank, we just apply force in a disproportionate manner during an uneven tactical combat situation to maximize revenue and increase shareholder value"
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:30:00 - [317] CCP DID 911 **** YOU CCP. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Tejal Charu	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:30:00 - [318] Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. So you are going to buy some EVE ammunition and guns with perks too? How about a ship with default 200k shield HP for the low price of Ç99.99!
Dr Lebroi	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:31:00 - [319] Consumable goods raise a unique problem. In EVE today, once a player buys a blueprint original (BPO) or a new skill, that asset or benefit cannot really be taken away; the asset neither depreciates in value nor degrades. Destroyed ships and modules must be replaced, though, and we want to ensure that the market for most virtual purchases is similarly renewable. And in cases where a virtual item or service is perpetual or unchanging, such as with avatar recustomization, for example, we will most likely levy a small brokerÆs fee or tax on the sale. This is the gravy train in full effect - sell em something but make sure they don't have it for long so they'll have to buy more. Just not very nice.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:31:00 - [320] Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. You need a reality check girl/boy. There is no conspiracy, CCP is managing very well by its own, sadly.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:31:00 - [321] Originally by: Bologna Brains CCP hasnt denied it in 10 pages, and something like this, if easily fake, would be denied by CCP quickly. They can't deny it because it's true. This document honestly indicates that there are serious INTERNAL problems at CCP. It reads like a sales brochure that is trying to sell their own employees on this "bold new direction" into killing the sandbox of EVE by placing tollbooths everywhere an eye can see. I think that it was written because there is a lot of dissension in the ranks, much as we found out later there was on the Star Wars Galaxies Dev team when SOE ordered them to ditch the sandbox and do the NGE. Just as happened then, with SOE, I expect this "bold new direction" is going to cause a brain drain at CCP. Their top talent is going to leave as quickly as they can get new jobs. And why not, they have people who could work for anyone, who could probably command much higher salaries working for other publishers, some of the best talent THERE IS, who probably stayed on that frigid little island because they loved their job, and EVE and CCP were different from everyone else, cooler than everyone else. Now CCP is just another publisher looking to suck the maximum amount of cash out of their customer's wallets for a minimal amount of effort. Everything that made CCP respectable is now gone, perhaps irreparably. Indeed, DEFINITELY irreparably. They saw our reaction when all this was proposed. They ignored us. They see our reactions now. $60 for monocle? REALLY? How is that NOT pure greed? About the only thing that is going to save this game at this point is an announcement TOMORROW that they realize this was a terrible idea, Aurum is being dropped and everyone who bought any is having their money refunded, and all the cash shop items are going to be seeded in game as blueprints, along with a promise to NEVER do something like this again. They won't do it. They are too busy spending all that extra money they are never going to get to see what is happening.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:31:00 - [322] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Hesperius BUT, that is CCP Soundwave talking liberally in a company news letter. Even the way it is structured, it sounds like he has some fighting internally to do to even get to bring it in front of us. I really don't care what they do with dust and wod, and outside of showing their hand of viewing us as numbers they can use and abuse more than customers, there is nothing that revealing in that document. The only thing that it reveals - to me - is that CCP's focus has shifted from making a game (as small "indie" game companies tend to do) to making money through any possible means. The rushing out of CQ so that they can **** out a half finished MT store sooner really just underscores the point. /shrug -Liang The drama of course comes from the years-old community-developer relationship that has been eroding faster and faster in recent years. EVE was always sold to its community and constructed as something different than other MMOs that did not have to follow the same model. CCP had done a lot of things right -- GTC/PLEX system and their take on scamming as a couple of examples -- and this was all part of the EVE experience. A community with heavy interaction with its developers, doing things that no other MMO would dare to, because CCP could make a great game, be financially stable, and experiment risk-free. This went to hell when CCP lost that vision, grew too fast, became unable to manage itself, and bloated itself with too many projects and people at once. The train is heading for a cliff, and recent events are just a sign that more and more people are noticing the destination. ______________________________
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:32:00 - [323] All I can say is, I bask in the Chaos of this Fail ---Archipelago Theory---
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:32:00 - [324] Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Lets be quite clear here - no one here entitled their internal marketing review document "GREED IS GOOD" C. the hydrostatic capsule blog
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:32:00 - [325] Originally by: Tejal Charu Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. So you are going to buy some EVE ammunition and guns with perks too? How about a ship with default 200k shield HP for the low price of Ç99.99! I want to blow up your Ç99.99. Yes CCP DO IT!
Satallius	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:32:00 - [326] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Ysolde Xen For what it's worth, I have had confirmation from a reliable source that the .pdf is not a fake. The only question that we really need answered is the TIMELINE. Well it contains a joke which references Navy seals burying people at sea, no doubt a reference to the US finally killing Osama Bin Laden, so it was created after May 2nd, the day that event happened.
Wintz Sudden Buggery	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:33:00 - [327] inb4 CCP Devs play Spiral knights and get the idea to charge Aurum for gate activations.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:33:00 - [328] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Bologna Brains CCP hasnt denied it in 10 pages, and something like this, if easily fake, would be denied by CCP quickly. They can't deny it because it's true. This document honestly indicates that there are serious INTERNAL problems at CCP. It reads like a sales brochure that is trying to sell their own employees on this "bold new direction" into killing the sandbox of EVE by placing tollbooths everywhere an eye can see. I think that it was written because there is a lot of dissension in the ranks, much as we found out later there was on the Star Wars Galaxies Dev team when SOE ordered them to ditch the sandbox and do the NGE. Just as happened then, with SOE, I expect this "bold new direction" is going to cause a brain drain at CCP. Their top talent is going to leave as quickly as they can get new jobs. And why not, they have people who could work for anyone, who could probably command much higher salaries working for other publishers, some of the best talent THERE IS, who probably stayed on that frigid little island because they loved their job, and EVE and CCP were different from everyone else, cooler than everyone else. Now CCP is just another publisher looking to suck the maximum amount of cash out of their customer's wallets for a minimal amount of effort. Everything that made CCP respectable is now gone, perhaps irreparably. Indeed, DEFINITELY irreparably. They saw our reaction when all this was proposed. They ignored us. They see our reactions now. $60 for monocle? REALLY? How is that NOT pure greed? About the only thing that is going to save this game at this point is an announcement TOMORROW that they realize this was a terrible idea, Aurum is being dropped and everyone who bought any is having their money refunded, and all the cash shop items are going to be seeded in game as blueprints, along with a promise to NEVER do something like this again. They won't do it. They are too busy spending all that extra money they are never going to get to see what is happening. Nice post. ______________________________
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:33:00 - [329] Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Ahahahahaha cough cough ... Oh, you're serious? Get a grip, EVE has no competition in this niche.
White Tree	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:34:00 - [330] _______________________________________
Lord Fargo Amarr GoonWaffe	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:35:00 - [331] Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up
San Severina Minmatar Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:35:00 - [332] ::sadpanda:: regardless of the authenticity of the meme, we/i can see where this is heading! That direction is downwards at a rate of knots.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:35:00 - [333] Originally by: Republica Winder About the only thing that is going to save this game at this point is an announcement TOMORROW that they realize this was a terrible idea, Aurum is being dropped and everyone who bought any is having their money refunded, and all the cash shop items are going to be seeded in game as blueprints, along with a promise to NEVER do something like this again. Would you believe them? Didn't think so. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:35:00 - [334] Originally by: White Tree omg i nearly wet myself laughing! C. the hydrostatic capsule blog
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:35:00 - [335] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Ahahahahaha cough cough ... Oh, you're serious? Get a grip, EVE has no competition in this niche. And that is all Eve is, NICHE, TINY, WoD is their BIG REVENUE generator once it is live. Eve is just to get it started. Once WoD goes live, it is going to bring in much more revenue than Eve ever did, as WoD has a larger potential audience than "niche scifi".
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:36:00 - [336] Originally by: Lord Fargo Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up I've got a better idea How about me and everybody else who shares my opinions take our money and stop giving it to CCP How about that How does that sound
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:37:00 - [337] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Lord Fargo Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up I've got a better idea How about me and everybody else who shares my opinions take our money and stop giving it to CCP How about that How does that sound Excellent. Vote with your wallet people.
Smoking Blunts	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:37:00 - [338] burn ccp burn
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:38:00 - [339] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Ahahahahaha cough cough ... Oh, you're serious? Get a grip, EVE has no competition in this niche. And that is all Eve is, NICHE, TINY, WoD is their BIG REVENUE generator once it is live. Eve is just to get it started. Once WoD goes live, it is going to bring in much more revenue than Eve ever did, as WoD has a larger potential audience than "niche scifi". That's what they're betting the farm on, at least. Doesn't make it true though. ______________________________
Satallius	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:38:00 - [340] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Ahahahahaha cough cough ... Oh, you're serious? Get a grip, EVE has no competition in this niche. And that is all Eve is, NICHE, TINY, WoD is their BIG REVENUE generator once it is live. Eve is just to get it started. Once WoD goes live, it is going to bring in much more revenue than Eve ever did, as WoD has a larger potential audience than "niche scifi". Really? How big can WoD's base be? If I am correct, WoD is supposed to be based on the world of Vampire: The Masquerade? How big of a niche is that? The two single player Vampire games made by troika games didn't even sell that well. So how will an MMO based on the same table top RPG do well?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:38:00 - [341] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Lord Fargo Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up I've got a better idea How about me and everybody else who shares my opinions take our money and stop giving it to CCP How about that How does that sound Excellent. Vote with your wallet people. They are targeting those that already do buy EXTRA CHARACTER ACCOUNTS. Those people already pay extra "to win" packages, it is called the POWER OF TWO (or sometimes 5 or 8). we can thank those idiots for making the player base look LOADED with DISPOSABLE MONEY that now CCP want.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:38:00 - [342] Originally by: White Tree great to know you CSM ppl have everything sorted hm?
Olleybear Minmatar I R' Carebear	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:39:00 - [343] Considering CCP are watching this thread, I figured I'd put in a comment or two. Very first thing I want to say: I love you guys, I love Eve, and through all the ups and downs I've enjoyed my time in Eve. Hell, I even laughed at the cost of the vanity items you've introduced to fleece the rich and not too bright. The money I have spent on Eve so far over nearly 7 years has been worth the ride. Now, saying all that, if you at CCP implement any real money transactions that give players abilities/advantages over other players in game, you are going to break Eve. I will not stick around while you destroy something I love. The CSM has already told you their view on microtransactions and the player bases view. We are currently telling you yet again what our view on microtransactions are. No in-game advantage due to real money. This includes Dust514 that you plan on integrating into our Eve universe. Do I need to scream that into your ears untill they bleed? You business guys at CCP who think you are so much smarter than the player base had better read all of these negative replies the Eve community are giving you. This is another turning point for the game fellas. Put simply, you are very close to losing it all on your bet that the players will stay. No in-game advantage due to real money in both Eve and Dust514 because Dust is going to have an effect on Eve. Are your ears bleeding yet? No Faction pos for real money, no special ammo for real money, no 1 day old superheros that can go around ganking 7 year vets because they spent $1000 to do so. Are we making ourselves clear? Or do we have to strip you naked and beat you with a sack of pickles before you start hearing us?
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:41:00 - [344] the X series is kind of competing to eve in way that they are both supposed to be grand scale space simulations and both are heavily inspired by elite. So they dont have the multiplayer/mmo aspect. The new X-game X:Rebirth is to be released this fall. www.egosoft.com
Maximus Trollus Amarr The Village Idiots	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:41:00 - [345] Originally by: Lord Fargo Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up aaww a little troll... Can I take it home mommy? please? pleeeaaaasse?? bambi eyes
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:41:00 - [346] Originally by: Olleybear Considering CCP are watching this thread, I figured I'd put in a comment or two. Very first thing I want to say: I love you guys, I love Eve, and through all the ups and downs I've enjoyed my time in Eve. Hell, I even laughed at the cost of the vanity items you've introduced to fleece the rich and not too bright. The money I have spent on Eve so far over nearly 7 years has been worth the ride. Now, saying all that, if you at CCP implement any real money transactions that give players abilities/advantages over other players in game, you are going to break Eve. I will not stick around while you destroy something I love. The CSM has already told you their view on microtransactions and the player bases view. We are currently telling you yet again what our view on microtransactions are. No in-game advantage due to real money. This includes Dust514 that you plan on integrating into our Eve universe. Do I need to scream that into your ears untill they bleed? You business guys at CCP who think you are so much smarter than the player base had better read all of these negative replies the Eve community are giving you. This is another turning point for the game fellas. Put simply, you are very close to losing it all on your bet that the players will stay. No in-game advantage due to real money in both Eve and Dust514 because Dust is going to have an effect on Eve. Are your ears bleeding yet? No Faction pos for real money, no special ammo for real money, no 1 day old superheros that can go around ganking 7 year vets because they spent $1000 to do so. Are we making ourselves clear? Or do we have to strip you naked and beat you with a sack of pickles before you start hearing us? What kind of pickles?
handige harrie	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:41:00 - [347] Edited by: handige harrie on 22/06/2011 23:42:31 I think CCP is in the wrong business, if you want to handle crap loads of money and not care about a thing in the world, start a bank, an Oil Company or do something shady with real life weapons.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:43:00 - [348] Originally by: Olleybear Are we making ourselves clear? Or do we have to strip you naked and beat you with a sack of pickles before you start hearing us? Now that sounds like a fun exercise, i would pay 9,99$ for the pleasure.
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:43:00 - [349] Originally by: Lord Fargo Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up Its "put out or get out".
Pure Tabasco	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:43:00 - [350] Edited by: Pure Tabasco on 22/06/2011 23:43:56 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Bologna Brains CCP hasnt denied it in 10 pages, and something like this, if easily fake, would be denied by CCP quickly. They can't deny it because it's true. This document honestly indicates that there are serious INTERNAL problems at CCP. It reads like a sales brochure that is trying to sell their own employees on this "bold new direction" into killing the sandbox of EVE by placing tollbooths everywhere an eye can see. I think that it was written because there is a lot of dissension in the ranks, much as we found out later there was on the Star Wars Galaxies Dev team when SOE ordered them to ditch the sandbox and do the NGE. Just as happened then, with SOE, I expect this "bold new direction" is going to cause a brain drain at CCP. Their top talent is going to leave as quickly as they can get new jobs. And why not, they have people who could work for anyone, who could probably command much higher salaries working for other publishers, some of the best talent THERE IS, who probably stayed on that frigid little island because they loved their job, and EVE and CCP were different from everyone else, cooler than everyone else. Now CCP is just another publisher looking to suck the maximum amount of cash out of their customer's wallets for a minimal amount of effort. Everything that made CCP respectable is now gone, perhaps irreparably. Indeed, DEFINITELY irreparably. They saw our reaction when all this was proposed. They ignored us. They see our reactions now. $60 for monocle? REALLY? How is that NOT pure greed? About the only thing that is going to save this game at this point is an announcement TOMORROW that they realize this was a terrible idea, Aurum is being dropped and everyone who bought any is having their money refunded, and all the cash shop items are going to be seeded in game as blueprints, along with a promise to NEVER do something like this again. They won't do it. They are too busy spending all that extra money they are never going to get to see what is happening. Well for all sake this gives again the example that "whats on paper dosent allways apply in reality". Or "Your amazing idea its not amazing or even good" Or "What is going inside your head only works in your head" Or "What you think its cool actually its not" Or "The costumer allways got the reason" Or "This is Madness! This is Sparta!" Or "I think they dont gonna mind.... Whoops!" Or "+Por quT? yo no entiendo por que" Or JUST CHECK THE H!TLER MOVIE THAT MANY PEOPLE USES FOR GIVING IT OTHER SUBTITLES! H!TLER DIDNT KNOWN WHAT WAS HAPPENING UNTIL TOO LATE!!! You can keep knowing what follows
Urgg Boolean	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:44:00 - [351] I'm all for going with the flow. I happen to have a spare $100US. Can I get my own personal instanced 0.0 region? Oh wait, I only have $100, guess I better think smaller, like a 6-pack of Quaff. But ya know, if I took out a 2nd mortgage ... This all reminds of the story behind the rock musician Alice Cooper. A group of LA businessmen auditioned for rock band members, and told them, essentially, you play what we say, dress like we say, act like we say, say what we tell you to say, and we'll all become millionaires. Alice Cooper was born. It's all about the money. It's based upon market research. It's business with no pretense of creativity with the ethics and morals of capitalism. Capitalists tend to forget the French Revolution because of modern laws preventing commoners from beheading the gentry. But it seems there may be a revolt afoot...
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:44:00 - [352] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Illwill Bill It's interesting that CCP's hasn't been activated yet. Honestly, not even CCP has the hull tank for this. Honor Tank! Honor Tank! CCP has a low rack full of cargo expanders so they can haul their bull **** around. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:45:00 - [353] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow Originally by: Republica Winder About the only thing that is going to save this game at this point is an announcement TOMORROW that they realize this was a terrible idea, Aurum is being dropped and everyone who bought any is having their money refunded, and all the cash shop items are going to be seeded in game as blueprints, along with a promise to NEVER do something like this again. Would you believe them? Didn't think so. No. Having been porked in the ass once already by SOE in a similar fashion, now this, I'm not only never touching EVE again if they don't undo all this crap, I think I'm through with MMOs period. This industry is corrupt and greedy. The publisher that WONT stab you in the back and ruin your game for the sake of some easy money doesn't exist. I used to think that publisher was CCP. Which is what makes this so tragic. Look, guys, most here haven't even realized what the second shoe that has yet to hit the floor is going to be... If they are going to be selling $60 monocles to people who have lots more money than sense, who do you think CCP is going to favor? Are they going to tell those customers, who are making them a HELLUVA LOT MORE MONEY than YOU are "tough" when that item blows up with their ship? Or are they going to DO AWAY WITH open pvp? Anyone who thinks that EVE's sandbox won't give ground EVERY TIME it comes in conflict with the cash shop is someone who is in the market for beach front property in Nevada.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:46:00 - [354] http://failheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?p=121298#p121298
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:48:00 - [355] Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 23:47:49 So, who's up for playing Eve? Nah, didn't think so.
Grog Barrel	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:48:00 - [356] tl;dr j3ws
Jonathan Malcom Gallente Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:49:00 - [357] Aha....HAHAHAHAHAHAhahahaha.... ** this bull**. You've really jumped the shark with this one. Goddamn.
Mahnmut Orphu	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:50:00 - [358] Originally by: stoicfaux Edited by: stoicfaux on 22/06/2011 22:38:29 Some counter-arguments: * Creating an epic arc just for more fitting space requires dev/art/writing resources. * It's also a very specific quest which has the risk of being of limited appeal. * It's a grind. Do you really want to have to run the same content on multiple characters to get the additional fitting space? An alternative would be to let you buy the extra space with ISK (i.e. the ISK-Plex-Aurum cycle.) The advantages are: * the market can place a better value on the extra space. (CCP doesn't have to worry about balancing the effort of the Epic Arc to match the rewards.) * you can do things you like or that are more convenient for you to earn the ISK to buy the Plex to buy the Aurum to buy the space. * no Dev/Art/Writing resources are required, * those Dev/Art/Writing resources can instead create a more generic Epic Arc that appeals to a wider audience and not just the few people who need more than 50 fitting slots. Meaning, the players can use the isk from the generic Epic Arc to buy the MT items that they're interested in instead of a static reward of extra fitting slots. Good points, but the idea of extra fitting space was just a very specific example...and honestly not a very exciting one. It is easy to imagine a much more enticing reward than this. Also, it shouldn't be considered a grind. I'm working under the assumption that the content would be well designed. This means that the mission would have an intriguing story and more importantly be fun and challenging to carry out. A little flexibility within the story or how the missions are completed is a realistic goal to set, even when considering the Dev/Art/Writing resources. Something like this sounds like much less of a grind than normal ISK earning. Further, a given mission or mission arc does not have to be confined to a single reward. The concept of selectable rewards is not exactly groundbreaking. And what if you want more than one of the offered rewards? Well you'd have to do it again. I do not feel it is unrealistic to create a mission arc that has replay value. I do agree that this would have to appeal to a wide audience not only in gameplay but in rewards offered. If you look beyond the whole fitting slot example you ought to be able to imagine much more favorable ways of advancing through the game than microtransactions and yes, even the ISK-Plex-Aurum cycle. This cycle shouldn't necessarily be considered the only option for game advancement, even if it is a vital game mechanic. Obviously, mission rewards could be sold on the market, where they would inherit a value dictated by players, just as you said. In sum... I agree with most of what you said. Buying extra space (or whatever) with ISK should be an alternative but not the only way. There ought to be some balance between the ISK-Plex-Aurum economy and the part of the game that involves pretending you're an epic capsuleer/demi-god who has all eternity to create yourself. Not all, but some demi-gods might prefer a little variety and storyline to spice up their eternal existence. Also - SOME amount of Dev/Art/Writing resources should be required for just about everything in this game, I think.
I Legionnaire Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:50:00 - [359] poasting in an epic thread Damn, I can't wait for SWTOR to come out. ------------ Monocles for nothing, ships for free.
Nilania Telshua Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:50:00 - [360] This is like watching a trainwreck happen. The fact that there is no proper denial and that this thread is still going alone lends credibility to the material. We cannot be sure if there have been text edits though. Yet the fact that CCP dedicated such an internal communication instrument to selling the idea of Money Transaction to its employees proves that they are of central importance to the companies long-term strategy. That this document was leaked and even necessary to produce shows, how divided the internal culture of CCP is about Real-Money-Transactions. Incarna more and more turns into an example of a Public-Relations-Failcascade.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:50:00 - [361] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 22/06/2011 23:47:49 So, who's up for playing Eve? Nah, didn't think so. Same phenomenon is happening that I remember on the SOE boards back in 2005, what they did to the game is so awful that posting on the forums, especially reading the LOL defenses of their actions by the fanbois is more fun than the game.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:51:00 - [362] Originally by: I Legionnaire poasting in an epic thread Damn, I can't wait for SWTOR to come out. Gold farmers are in SWTOR too http://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=navclient&gfns=1&q=the+old+republic+gold+farmers
Pharos Pharos	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:53:00 - [363] Never actually participated in a protest thread before, always rather white knighted CCP... but now I'm really starting to question playing EVE. Hard to keep the faith these days.
Mister Smithington	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:53:00 - [364] I ****ing hate this. And that's all I have to say about that.
Hyperforce99 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:54:00 - [365] Edited by: Hyperforce99 on 22/06/2011 23:54:44 Damn, I never expected this. Its like some cancer has taken hold inside CCP. I hope the CSM can shake up CCP, cause if the guy that wrote this gets his way, there won't be an EVE to save. I'll Re sub when the doctor has determined the patient can be saved. --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/
Obsidian Hawk RONA Legion RONA Directorate	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:54:00 - [366] Originally by: White Tree Quoting CSM for postarity.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:54:00 - [367] I pay yearly by CC. I have 20b worth of PLEX, I shall now start paying by PLEX, monthly just incase once the 150days runs out. I will let some other idiot pay my way.
Moolti Gallente Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:54:00 - [368] Edited by: Moolti on 22/06/2011 23:56:19 All those comparing this to SWG NGE are wrong.... this is the SWG CU... NGE is coming soon(tm Editied to add, I do still enjoy Eve-O.. the new store doesn't actually change that.. I do think Incarna is a good first step and i hope it works out well. But that's why this isn't quite NGE, Eve online is still the same. But some bad omens are in the air. . @)}---^----- The Jove are a warning to us all. We must remember to live and Love and feel. Fall in Love, make Love, be beautful and see the beautiful. For we mustn't loose our human spark
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:54:00 - [369] Originally by: Nilania Telshua This is like watching a trainwreck happen. The fact that there is no proper denial and that this thread is still going alone lends credibility to the material. We cannot be sure if there have been text edits though. Yet the fact that CCP dedicated such an internal communication instrument to selling the idea of Money Transaction to its employees proves that they are of central importance to the companies long-term strategy. That this document was leaked and even necessary to produce shows, how divided the internal culture of CCP is about Real-Money-Transactions. Incarna more and more turns into an example of a Public-Relations-Failcascade. History repeating itself because of the failure to learn from it. The same radical "F the players" action as the NGE is happening now. CCP is too fixated on the diamond encrusted gold rings they all think they are going to get. Or they are as insane as SOE was in 2005, thinking that they are going to replace us in toto with some new RMT lovin "target audience" and what we think doesn't matter. Which would be even more insane than SOE thinking they could pull that off. EVE is a niche. The largest of the niche games, but nevertheless a NICHE. We are here because we want a PLAYER DRIVEN SCI-FI SANDBOX. Not cash shops where "iWin" buttons are for sale. Not even SOE did the NGE for THAT reason... And this internal document certainly suggests that the public stance that the cash shop will NOT have anything that has more than a cosmetic ingame effect IS A LIE.
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:55:00 - [370] Originally by: Mister Smithington I ****ing hate this. And that's all I have to say about that. could you care to be a tad more specific at to what 'this' you refer?
Manos Heimenbarger	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:55:00 - [371] Spreading the word in-game, encouraging others to link to this thread too. Get the rest of the playerbase informed.
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:55:00 - [372] Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. "No but liang did, and they saw me link it on twitter. They then sent me a bogus warning mail about some tame post I made earlier today, and then 30 minutes later I was banned without a mail about that." I always supported CCP, but I smell failscade...
Iurnan Mileghere Singularity Foundation	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:56:00 - [373] I saw this, mirrored it on my blog, and hoped it wasn't real. Apparently it is. I don't even know what to say or do, except that unless CCP somehow didn't actually do this, then I'm done. And I just don't have the energy to rant anymore. Though I suppose I can get my last ravings in at EVE Vegas. Already paid, might as well see the show.
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:56:00 - [374] Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Painfully so, there are no competitors. Part of the problem really.
Mr LaForge	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:56:00 - [375] This **ing blows. Its like seeing ** dry. its not fun.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:56:00 - [376] Originally by: Xervish Krin Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. Where are you seeing this?
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:56:00 - [377] My gawd i dont know if this doc is real, but if it is, this just put the last nail in the coffin of my anticipation of World of Darkness.
Dr Lebroi	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:57:00 - [378] we have strong evidence that selling performance enhancers, in moderation, works. Come on guys?? There must be someone left at the company who remembers why you made this game the way it was. It was supposed to be special, unique for rewarding things that mattered and took effort, hard work, committment, teamwork. Don't you love it any more? I know it's a bit old and clanky but do you really want to turn it into a pixel supermarket full of 12 year old brats with their mums credit card? People use to refer to this game as 'art', that made me proud to play it and proud of you guys. In the last couple of years, all I've seen of CCP employees are a bunch of glassy eyed estate agent types who appear to be more interested in business plans than the heart of the game. SAD.
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:57:00 - [379] And ÇÇP strikes again! Ah lolz, you are turning into a big joke.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:57:00 - [380] Originally by: Xervish Krin Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. "No but liang did, and they saw me link it on twitter. They then sent me a bogus warning mail about some tame post I made earlier today, and then 30 minutes later I was banned without a mail about that." I always supported CCP, but I smell failscade... glad some one else got it
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:57:00 - [381] Originally by: Satallius Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Ahahahahaha cough cough ... Oh, you're serious? Get a grip, EVE has no competition in this niche. And that is all Eve is, NICHE, TINY, WoD is their BIG REVENUE generator once it is live. Eve is just to get it started. Once WoD goes live, it is going to bring in much more revenue than Eve ever did, as WoD has a larger potential audience than "niche scifi". Really? How big can WoD's base be? If I am correct, WoD is supposed to be based on the world of Vampire: The Masquerade? How big of a niche is that? The two single player Vampire games made by troika games didn't even sell that well. So how will an MMO based on the same table top RPG do well? It's pretty big. Head down to your local bookstore, and look at the stacks that are vamp **** - oh, wait, "Supernatural Romance". Look at the numbers for Twilight. This is what CCP think they're going to get from V:TM.
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:57:00 - [382] Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Xervish Krin Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. Where are you seeing this? Failheap http://failheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?p=121298#p121298 Not permanent I'm sure, just a 'shut up' nudge
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:57:00 - [383] Originally by: Xervish Krin Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. "No but liang did, and they saw me link it on twitter. They then sent me a bogus warning mail about some tame post I made earlier today, and then 30 minutes later I was banned without a mail about that." I always supported CCP, but I smell failscade... CCP has a history of dealing harshly with whistleblowers. This is a hubris most publishers have, they think they can conceal the rising sun with clever PR.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.22 23:58:00 - [384] Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 22/06/2011 23:58:13 Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Xervish Krin Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. Where are you seeing this? http://failheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?p=121327#p121327
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:00:00 - [385] twitter is getting interesting lol LiangNuren Liang Nuren yeah helicity was banned earlier today. I expect I'm not far behind.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:00:00 - [386] Bahahaha! OK I take back my earlier fanboyism. Lol:
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:01:00 - [387] THE PLOT THICKENS
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:01:00 - [388] Well, there is your confirmation.
Tutskii	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:01:00 - [389] The funny thing is that three months ago I was white knighting CCP against Akita and Estel who were warning of the writing on the wall. Ah how flavorful humble pie is. Where were you when Eve died?
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:01:00 - [390] I think CCP overheated their Damage Control II and burnt it out. Not even possible in game, but they goddamn found a way.
Tobiaz Spacerats	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:01:00 - [391] Originally by: Lord Fargo Can't see what the fuss is all about, get a real life job so you can pay for all of this, simply put, put up or shut up It's not about the money, it's about this 'new' CCP that is so focused on trying to getting our money. A CCP that thinks selling vanity items and adding eyecandy deserves more attention then fixing bugs and adding actual content. A CCP that could come up with an embarrassing expansion like Incarna without ever really listening to the concerns of the community. Al we heard from CCP the last few weeks on AT was how 'great' Incarna was going to be, yet they are completely blown away by the negative response. This shows how much devs like Soundwave and Zinfandel are disconnected from the community and thus the direction the game SHOULD take. A game like EVE simply does not exist without it's community, yet the current leading devs seem to think all they need from us is our money.
Urgg Boolean	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:02:00 - [392] Originally by: Olleybear Considering CCP are watching this thread, I figured I'd put in a comment or two. Very first thing I want to say: I love you guys, I love Eve, and through all the ups and downs I've enjoyed my time in Eve. Hell, I even laughed at the cost of the vanity items you've introduced to fleece the rich and not too bright. The money I have spent on Eve so far over nearly 7 years has been worth the ride. Now, saying all that, if you at CCP implement any real money transactions that give players abilities/advantages over other players in game, you are going to break Eve. I will not stick around while you destroy something I love. The CSM has already told you their view on microtransactions and the player bases view. We are currently telling you yet again what our view on microtransactions are. No in-game advantage due to real money. This includes Dust514 that you plan on integrating into our Eve universe. Do I need to scream that into your ears untill they bleed? You business guys at CCP who think you are so much smarter than the player base had better read all of these negative replies the Eve community are giving you. This is another turning point for the game fellas. Put simply, you are very close to losing it all on your bet that the players will stay. No in-game advantage due to real money in both Eve and Dust514 because Dust is going to have an effect on Eve. Are your ears bleeding yet? No Faction pos for real money, no special ammo for real money, no 1 day old superheros that can go around ganking 7 year vets because they spent $1000 to do so. Are we making ourselves clear? Or do we have to strip you naked and beat you with a sack of pickles before you start hearing us? The overwhelming reality for us as players who do not want game-changing MT, is that CCP counts it's subscriber base in 10K's while many other games count in the millions. Don't get defensive, but by sheer numbers comparison, EvE is not that popular (a fact that most of us like). CCP can make a lot more money by doing all the marketable things that other games do. They can lose all current players, and still make increasing profits by attracting fans from LOTRO, WoW, Guild Wars, KotOR, StarTrek Online, and whatever else. Bottom line: their game design so far has attracted players in the 10Ks; to take a bigger market share, they need to change their model to accommodate the market research. It's business, pure and simple. <visions of Ebenezer Scrooge>
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:03:00 - [393] Originally by: Miilla I pay yearly by CC. I have 20b worth of PLEX, I shall now start paying by PLEX, monthly just incase once the 150days runs out. I will let some other idiot pay my way. As long as you are playing you are helping to keep the game alive.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:03:00 - [394] Originally by: Urgg Boolean Originally by: Olleybear Considering CCP are watching this thread, I figured I'd put in a comment or two. Very first thing I want to say: I love you guys, I love Eve, and through all the ups and downs I've enjoyed my time in Eve. Hell, I even laughed at the cost of the vanity items you've introduced to fleece the rich and not too bright. The money I have spent on Eve so far over nearly 7 years has been worth the ride. Now, saying all that, if you at CCP implement any real money transactions that give players abilities/advantages over other players in game, you are going to break Eve. I will not stick around while you destroy something I love. The CSM has already told you their view on microtransactions and the player bases view. We are currently telling you yet again what our view on microtransactions are. No in-game advantage due to real money. This includes Dust514 that you plan on integrating into our Eve universe. Do I need to scream that into your ears untill they bleed? You business guys at CCP who think you are so much smarter than the player base had better read all of these negative replies the Eve community are giving you. This is another turning point for the game fellas. Put simply, you are very close to losing it all on your bet that the players will stay. No in-game advantage due to real money in both Eve and Dust514 because Dust is going to have an effect on Eve. Are your ears bleeding yet? No Faction pos for real money, no special ammo for real money, no 1 day old superheros that can go around ganking 7 year vets because they spent $1000 to do so. Are we making ourselves clear? Or do we have to strip you naked and beat you with a sack of pickles before you start hearing us? The overwhelming reality for us as players who do not want game-changing MT, is that CCP counts it's subscriber base in 10K's while many other games count in the millions. Don't get defensive, but by sheer numbers comparison, EvE is not that popular (a fact that most of us like). CCP can make a lot more money by doing all the marketable things that other games do. They can lose all current players, and still make increasing profits by attracting fans from LOTRO, WoW, Guild Wars, KotOR, StarTrek Online, and whatever else. Bottom line: their game design so far has attracted players in the 10Ks; to take a bigger market share, they need to change their model to accommodate the market research. It's business, pure and simple. <visions of Ebenezer Scrooge> For eve not being popular, it seems to be 1) funding Eve, 2) funding WoD and 3) funding Dust. But 2) WoD - is a HUGE revenue generator, far more potentially than EVE can ever dream of.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:03:00 - [395] So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:05:00 - [396] Originally by: Xervish Krin I think CCP overheated their Damage Control II and burnt it out. Not even possible in game, but they goddamn found a way. 350,000 subscribers have a nasty habit of turning into 35,000, then 3,500 in a hurry over moves like this... That is what happened quickly after the NGE. A former SWG Dev I communicated with later told me that they lost over 100,000 subscribers THE FIRST WEEK. I remember the account servers pretty much lagged out when you tried to cancel back then too.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:05:00 - [397] Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. Space is black, how many shades of brown make black? I'm pretty sure you don't need the graphics hardware demands of Incarna to display them all.
Col Howitzer	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:05:00 - [398] Edited by: Col Howitzer on 23/06/2011 00:05:37 I guess from my viewpoint Dust Dies with Eve simple as that...WoD - not even interested in it with this document out
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [399] Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. its not gonna matter really. in a few days things will have settled. ccp will keep quiet for a while and then release some half assed blog post where they will downplay stuff and fanboys will go "oh thank you ccp for taking the time and explain why we all suck and you are the glorios masters. when i meet you at fanfest, can i get you blowjob pleaaaaase ?".
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [400] Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. challenge accepted, link the link here :p, and all over new eden, i bet 2/3 of the playerbase would they have to be 'jettisoned'
Hannibal Ord Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [401] You money grabbing bastards.
Nilania Telshua Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [402] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 22/06/2011 23:58:13 Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Xervish Krin Wait, they BANNED Helicity? Confirmed as a genuine leak, then. http://failheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?p=121327#p121327 That is such an unbeliveable incompetent thing to do. I can not even start to comment on it.
Iurnan Mileghere Singularity Foundation	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [403] Originally by: Hesperius Originally by: Miilla I pay yearly by CC. I have 20b worth of PLEX, I shall now start paying by PLEX, monthly just incase once the 150days runs out. I will let some other idiot pay my way. As long as you are playing you are helping to keep the game alive. But we WANT to keep the old game alive. Before the dark times. Before Summer 2010.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [404] More hilarity from the document:
LIOZTH Caldari Divide By Zero Emergent Dawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [405] This article pretty much sums things up (...if completely accurate), and if this is the attitude CCP is going to be taking, I only see a major fail cascade it their future. As it stands I will maintain a "wait and see attitude", but if things don't start looking up soon, me and my hard earned cash are a'walking. I like EvE but it's not the first game I've played, nor the last, there are is always other options and this is something CCP should carefully consider.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [406] Originally by: RensPriceChecker2 Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. its not gonna matter really. in a few days things will have settled. ccp will keep quiet for a while and then release some half assed blog post where they will downplay stuff and fanboys will go "oh thank you ccp for taking the time and explain why we all suck and you are the glorios masters. when i meet you at fanfest, can i get you blowjob pleaaaaase ?". How much AUR do they cost?
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [407] Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. Lol it won't be the first time I'll be on the end of a CCP ban but it will be the last. Haha
Liner Xiandra	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:07:00 - [408] Thread and associated documents marked for full reading tomorrow.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:08:00 - [409] i think ccp must have taken note how there new buddys sony dealt with the psn pr and try to emulate it lol
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:08:00 - [410] Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. Does anyone even care at this point? Why would anyone care about being banned from a game that no longer appeals to them because the publisher has decided that they know what we like more than we do?
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:10:00 - [411] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Caladan Broood So how many of us will be banned for linking to the document and providing complete meta data Bring it on CCP, the more you try to silence us the more and more it shows your true colors. Space is black, how many shades of brown make black? I'm pretty sure you don't need the graphics hardware demands of Incarna to display them all. You're on my fav list now.
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:10:00 - [412] the times they are a'changin'
FunzzeR The Wyld Hunt Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:11:00 - [413] MY GODS, WE'RE DOOMED... PRAISE THE SCOTTISH FOLD!! THEIR WILL SHALL BE DONE!!
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:12:00 - [414] BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ****heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced.
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:12:00 - [415] There are some real idiots at CCP, I wanted to play WOD when it came out, I no longer will consider paying any money for that game either to get it or for any cash shop **. Free to play/download I'll run it and when it is obvious that the game model is to you out of $$ to not look like a dork or spend hours on hours doing that which another *** can pay $ for I'll log out and uninstall. I was thinking of getting a PS3 for DUST514 in a year or so if the vanity items were kept in check in EVE and the not yet finished Dust didn't taint our market with their cash shop . It seems clear now that there is no chance that EVE won't get ed over through DUST and CCP's plans to monetize every aspect of our gameplay and not just through incarna. The idea that players want to spend lots of money on games is pretty stupid. People spend lots of money on real hobbies because they have to, you have to buy the stupid golf clothes, you have to pay for membership to a course or pay a cover charge, you have to pay for this and that. In the end you've actually accomplished something that can't be 'erased' or taken away from you like in a game you don't own. Games are great because you don't have to deal with that , you pay your sub or sale price and are done you already paid for the PC, the OS, Antivirus, firewall, internet etc there aren't extra charges except in free to play hell. Making games more like the real world consumer experience is stupid. I don't want to be nickeled and dimed to death, or in this case $20 and $50 billed to death for that isn't real, I don't own and not having makes me look like a second class 'citizen' in the ing game. Why should I log in to pay for that experience, anyone of us can experience that by putting on a t-shirt and a pair of shorts and showing up to a nice restaurant or the like. There is a place for free to play and there is a place where a sub covers everything. It is better to stick to the one that you built your game around unless it is failing and you've tried a few real changes to fix it. In that case you make the change and hope you don't go out of business. Eve isn't failing and you haven't tried real changes to 'fix' the problem that doesn't exist yet you are grabbing for cash shop revenue. Thank you to the people at CCP who made a good experience with their work and vision and you to those pieces of ** that want to squish out another drop of milk from the cash cow they call eve, sadly some of you are one in the same at different periods in time.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:13:00 - [416] Originally by: leth ghost i think ccp must have taken note how there new buddys sony dealt with the psn pr and try to emulate it lol Or John Smedley convinced Hillmar that your customers love you more and spend more money when you do things to their game that they don't want.
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:14:00 - [417] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. Go buy a monocle ...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:14:00 - [418] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ****heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. So, why the bans?
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:14:00 - [419] Lol http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/22/rumour-leaked-document-shows-ccps-microtransaction-plans/
Manos Heimenbarger	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:14:00 - [420] What concerns me the most is that CCP has not made any reply to these claims... In the aftermath of the mess this latest expansion made, and with the degree of community backlash so far, this couldn't have come out at a worse time for CCP (real or fake). I would think they would have quickly prepared some kind of statement by now.
Mike deVoid Firebird Squadron Terra-Incognita	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:15:00 - [421] I almost love how there is as much politics and butthurt about RL EVE as there is in the fcking game. ----- Quote:* The maximum acceptable limit of MT in EVE is vanity items + the ability to buy things already created legitimately by another player.
Tejal Charu	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:15:00 - [422] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore **heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. Then let them prove us wrong! Where are their voices? I want to hear CCP say "No, this is bull, we will never bend EVE over and ** it."
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:15:00 - [423] Originally by: Manos Heimenbarger What concerns me the most is that CCP has not made any reply to these claims... In the aftermath of the mess this latest expansion made, and with the degree of community backlash so far, this couldn't have come out at a worse time for CCP (real or fake). I would think they would have quickly prepared some kind of statement by now. The only statement I've seen from CCP was from CCP Soundwave, confirming that he is reading this thread and monitoring the player feedback. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Jitaherp Derp	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:15:00 - [424] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ****heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. Did you miss the part where Liang confirmed it, or the part where the original unedited version confirmed it, or the part where the document file information confirmed it, or the part where Riverini confirmed it, or the part where CSM confirmed it, or the part where CCP Soundwave confirmed that hes monitoring it, or the part where Chribba confirmed it? So which one is it?
Hannibal Ord Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:16:00 - [425] Seriously CCP. You money grabbing bastards.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:16:00 - [426] Edited by: Judicator Saturnius on 23/06/2011 00:17:10 Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ****heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. White knight ITT Also, accounts sacked. Thank you for the fun while it lasted CCP. But we no longer see eye to eye. vOv
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:18:00 - [427] Originally by: Jitaherp Derp Did you miss the part where Liang confirmed it, or the part where the original unedited version confirmed it, or the part where the document file information confirmed it, or the part where Riverini confirmed it, or the part where CSM confirmed it, or the part where CCP Soundwave confirmed that hes monitoring it, or the part where Chribba confirmed it? So which one is it? Where is Chribba's post, I missed that one?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:18:00 - [428] So, what happens when we click on CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION in account management? Does that`just stop the REOCCURRING PAYMENT? The remanining game time continues, does the CC details get removed? What happens once the time is up? We just have to select a new method of payment to continue?
FunzzeR The Wyld Hunt Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:19:00 - [429] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ****heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. CCP Zinfandel alt spotted PRAISE THE SCOTTISH FOLD!! THEIR WILL SHALL BE DONE!!
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:19:00 - [430] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Lol http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/22/rumour-leaked-document-shows-ccps-microtransaction-plans/ Oh boy, here we go! Internet MMOG media go for it.
Hannibal Ord Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:19:00 - [431] And to think that most of this rage could have been avoided if you just listened to the people who wanted a ****ing hanger view as well as CQ....
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:20:00 - [432] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Originally by: Isil Rahsen Lol http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/22/rumour-leaked-document-shows-ccps-microtransaction-plans/ Oh boy, here we go! Internet MMOG media go for it. All this Press is going to TURN OFF potential NEW CUSTOMERS. Bad news for CCP.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:20:00 - [433] Edited by: Tla Atij on 23/06/2011 00:20:34 Anyone got matches? Isn't that CCP Soundwave?
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:20:00 - [434] Originally by: Urgg Boolean They can lose all current players, and still make increasing profits by attracting fans from LOTRO, WoW, Guild Wars, KotOR, StarTrek Online, and whatever else. Bottom line: their game design so far has attracted players in the 10Ks; to take a bigger market share, they need to change their model to accommodate the market research. It's business, pure and simple. <visions of Ebenezer Scrooge> Niche players are willing to put up with horrible bugs, horrible interface, etc. Mainstream game players, no. I agree though, that what you say may be what CCP is thinking. They're insane to think that, but then the past week has made me realize that they really are, very likely, insane.
Jitaherp Derp	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:20:00 - [435] Originally by: Miilla So, what happens when we click on CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION in account management? Does that`just stop the REOCCURRING PAYMENT? The remanining game time continues, does the CC details get removed? What happens once the time is up? We just have to select a new method of payment to continue? I heard cancelling your subscription now requires a 10000 Aurum processing fee.
Faelune	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:20:00 - [436] I think they don't grade how are so muddy and cristaline their E3 prices, and their fake duty is unfair for little sharky jaws who're here incoming because a day, these healthy eaters, like me, heard: "Eve is harsh, Eve is Bloody, Eve is pain, Eve is toughness, Eve is honor, Eve is brutal, etc..." Can I repell now with a bloody meat saltying by angel dust?
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:20:00 - [437] Originally by: Miilla So, what happens when we click on CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION in account management? Does that`just stop the REOCCURRING PAYMENT? The remanining game time continues, does the CC details get removed? What happens once the time is up? We just have to select a new method of payment to continue? My accounts are canceled and they show the remaining game time. At any time I can click "undo cancel subscription" from drop down menu, this is new. Or I can add game time via plex without need for credit card. Or I can change my subscription plan and CCP will generously reactivate my account and immediately charge my credit card (thus kept on file).
45 Longslide	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:21:00 - [438] Bump to make sure this stays up top.
Kuronaga Kantian Principle	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:21:00 - [439] Rofl you guys have an employee loyalty score? That's about as bad as it gets. I wouldn't even consider working for a company that pulled that kind of ****. Maybe if your methods weren't so underhanded and greedy lately you wouldn't have to test your employees for loyalty...
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:22:00 - [440] Originally by: Manos Heimenbarger What concerns me the most is that CCP has not made any reply to these claims... In the aftermath of the mess this latest expansion made, and with the degree of community backlash so far, this couldn't have come out at a worse time for CCP (real or fake). I would think they would have quickly prepared some kind of statement by now. They would have closed/deleted this thread and posted a denial if it were fake. It's real alright. Just as real as the backlash CCP is getting. Really, in the wake of what Incarna is, a CASH SHOP (and wildly overpriced one at that) NOT AN EXPANSION, is this internal newsletter really any worse for CCP than the game itself at this moment? It really just amounts to some gasoline on the already raging fire. As I said earlier, NOTHING but an apology and an IMMEDIATE withdraw of the cash shop, the refund of Aurum, and the seeding of all items as blueprints is going to save EVE at this point. Incarna has reached critical mass.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:22:00 - [441] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 00:24:55 Originally by: Caladan Broood Originally by: Miilla So, what happens when we click on CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION in account management? Does that`just stop the REOCCURRING PAYMENT? The remanining game time continues, does the CC details get removed? What happens once the time is up? We just have to select a new method of payment to continue? My accounts are canceled and they show the remaining game time. At any time I can click "undo cancel subscription" from drop down menu, this is new. Or I can add game time via plex without need for credit card. Or I can change my subscription plan and CCP will generously reactivate my account and immediately charge my credit card (thus kept on file). Thanks. It's a bad sign when the rat's erm, TROLLS, leave the ship first. (I have also suspended my Eve Sdk and Apps development) Get the hint.
Nilania Telshua Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:23:00 - [442] Edited by: Nilania Telshua on 23/06/2011 00:24:19 Actually this is passage is pretty much in line with the propaganda Zinfandel fed us. It saddens me to say so, but the document becomes more and more authentic to me. The worst thing is, the last line: "If players can spend money more directly on our game, their enjoyment will heighten and they'll bond more strongly with it." Is CCP really that unaware about the nature of its playerbase. We are not the average MMO crowd. Most people here are rather well educated and have a certain degree of self-reflection, even if we often choose not to use it on the forums... The most insulting thing about that text is its absolute character: The Players Will... F.U. CCP Originally by: Tla Atij More hilarity from the document: Quote: [ 2011.06.22 00:00:44 ] CCP Zinfandel > The Looking Glass Ocular Implant (right/gold) is fairly expensive. It's also a machine being installed into your eye and one would not want to buy a cheap version of something to go in your face. [ 2011.06.22 00:04:15 ] CCP Zinfandel > Hello Kyle - we have been talking about the prices regularly in here. There are expensive items in the shop. Noble Appliances Corporation opened these shops particularly to target the wealthy capsuleer community.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:23:00 - [443] Originally by: Miilla So, what happens when we click on CANCEL SUBSCRIPTION in account management? Does that`just stop the REOCCURRING PAYMENT? The remanining game time continues, does the CC details get removed? What happens once the time is up? We just have to select a new method of payment to continue? I canceled just the day before the new site, so mileage may vary - Cancel simply turns of recurring subscription, you have however many days would have been left till your next payment. I suspect, in your case, adding a PLEX will push that date out. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
XIRUSPHERE Gallente The 8th Order Mean Coalition	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:23:00 - [444] Edited by: XIRUSPHERE on 23/06/2011 00:24:31 Hey CCP, when you guys tank as you deserve, can you at least have the decency to release the IP and give us the client circa RMR so we can play this game the way it was meant to be?
Jerry Pepridge	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:24:00 - [445] Quote: Their newsletter isn't actually all that secret, there are copies lying around the lobby of their Iceland office. QQ more *s lmao. _________________________________________________ Misty McGinnity** Doesn't have an iPhone.
Grog Barrel	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:24:00 - [446] Edited by: Grog Barrel on 23/06/2011 00:24:38 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: leth ghost i think ccp must have taken note how there new buddys sony dealt with the psn pr and try to emulate it lol Or John Smedley convinced Hillmar that your customers love you more and spend more money when you do things to their game that they don't want. In europe is commonly to see companies giving a flying fnck about customer's satisfaction; probably an issue bound to the continent (i blame the rome empire for the matter, as scandinavians seem to be an exception). Companies here are so well protected and confederated with eachother "against" customers so to speak, that, if Adam Smith was still alive, he would never, ever have put a single word out outside of his mouth regarding the competitiveness, "free market" and everything what it implies. It's somehow continetal-wide issue if you ask me. Probably stronger in loliceland, if you care to read the cultural observations by the mittani and read some background of their pre- economic crisis welfare.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:24:00 - [447] Originally by: Kuronaga Rofl you guys have an employee loyalty score? That's about as bad as it gets. I wouldn't even consider working for a company that pulled that kind of ****. Maybe if your methods weren't so underhanded and greedy lately you wouldn't have to test your employees for loyalty... Telling your bosses that this change of direction amounts to company suicide is showing more company loyalty than chanting along with management that this is the greatest thing EVAH!
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:24:00 - [448] Originally by: Tla Atij Edited by: Tla Atij on 23/06/2011 00:20:34 Anyone got matches? Isn't that CCP Soundwave? yup. C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 [yellow]the hydrostatic capsule blog[/yellow
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:26:00 - [449] just counted 20 people ITT cancelling their accounts... Can't say I blame them! CCP devs are OMINOUSLY quiet tonight... even more than usual for this time of night... Also ITT: People realising that X:Rebirth is coming out this winter! >:D the only massive sandbox space game to ever even closely rival eve: http://www.deepsilver.com/en/news/ I'll be buying at release... especially if this ccp episode continues... I'm just waiting for one of eve's major players to quit now... Milia already psuedo-has done... Can't say i'm far behind if CCP doesn't come up with a REALLY good explanation. And an explanation it will be... because if they try to justify it all? it's bye bye internet space ships and bye bye over-inflated icelandic games company. -------
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:26:00 - [450] Originally by: Tla Atij Edited by: Tla Atij on 23/06/2011 00:20:34 Anyone got matches? Isn't that CCP Soundwave? It would appear so ... An uphill battle hmm?
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:26:00 - [451] Originally by: Jerry Pepridge Quote: Their newsletter isn't actually all that secret, there are copies lying around the lobby of their Iceland office. QQ more ***s lmao. How cute my special handicapped friend is back in this thread. Gonna faceroll your keyboard some more buddy?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:26:00 - [452] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 00:28:14 I think it's time to remove EVE and CCP adwords from our fan sites.
Kuronaga Kantian Principle	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:27:00 - [453] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Kuronaga Rofl you guys have an employee loyalty score? That's about as bad as it gets. I wouldn't even consider working for a company that pulled that kind of ****. Maybe if your methods weren't so underhanded and greedy lately you wouldn't have to test your employees for loyalty... Telling your bosses that this change of direction amounts to company suicide is showing more company loyalty than chanting along with management that this is the greatest thing EVAH! True dat. Unfortunately the man up top never agrees, they think you are simply trying to subvert their precious vision. God forbid you talk some sense into the idiot with the megaphone.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:27:00 - [454] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Manos Heimenbarger What concerns me the most is that CCP has not made any reply to these claims... In the aftermath of the mess this latest expansion made, and with the degree of community backlash so far, this couldn't have come out at a worse time for CCP (real or fake). I would think they would have quickly prepared some kind of statement by now. They would have closed/deleted this thread and posted a denial if it were fake. It's real alright. Just as real as the backlash CCP is getting. Really, in the wake of what Incarna is, a CASH SHOP (and wildly overpriced one at that) NOT AN EXPANSION, is this internal newsletter really any worse for CCP than the game itself at this moment? It really just amounts to some gasoline on the already raging fire. As I said earlier, NOTHING but an apology and an IMMEDIATE withdraw of the cash shop, the refund of Aurum, and the seeding of all items as blueprints is going to save EVE at this point. Incarna has reached critical mass. I don't think i'd go for even that at this point, to be quite honest. vOv
Hyperforce99 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:27:00 - [455] Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: Tla Atij Edited by: Tla Atij on 23/06/2011 00:20:34 Anyone got matches? Isn't that CCP Soundwave? It would appear so ... An uphill battle hmm? I never throught that guy would be responsible for this RMT mess --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:28:00 - [456] Originally by: Grog Barrel Edited by: Grog Barrel on 23/06/2011 00:24:38 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: leth ghost i think ccp must have taken note how there new buddys sony dealt with the psn pr and try to emulate it lol Or John Smedley convinced Hillmar that your customers love you more and spend more money when you do things to their game that they don't want. In europe is commonly to see companies giving a flying fnck about customer's satisfaction; probably an issue bound to the continent (i blame the rome empire for the matter, as scandinavians seem to be an exception). Companies here are so well protected and confederated with eachother "against" customers so to speak, that, if Adam Smith was still alive, he would never, ever have put a single word out outside of his mouth regarding the competitiveness, "free market" and everything what it implies. It's somehow continetal-wide issue if you ask me. Probably stronger in loliceland, if you care to read the cultural observations by the mittani and read some background of their pre- economic crisis welfare. Yeah, but you'd have to have Lindsey Lohan's instinct for responsible behavior to pull something like this when the only thing separating you from poverty is 350,000 players deciding to keep their subscription going the next month...
Tejal Charu	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:28:00 - [457] You can try to win the uphill battle, CCP, but you can't win the war.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:30:00 - [458] As much as it pains me to see this happen, I believe that the players are taking a very immature route of going about this. First of all, if you guys are all truly upset and ****ed off at CCP then quit. So many rude, mean and uncalled for things have been said here against CCP that if you really are going to back your words then you should stop paying them your subscription fees. Stop buying PLEXes and stop logging in. Only then will you send CCP a true message. I personally am disheartened, but I understand that we only have one side of the story. Because CCP is unwilling to comment on this (and it will probably be the way this winds up,) speculation is at its peak and we can only speculate. We could stir ourselves into a typhoon of anger and it would result in a lot of broken hearts, angry players and developers and a game left in an even worse state than before all this chaos began. I just want to remind you guys that if you are truly going to berate CCP with your words on a forum, then do not let it be empty, for you will look like a fool when next month rolls around and you're still posting. Just wanted to throw that out there. I'm in this for the long haul, because I want to see what happens. I believe CCP will try to make the best decisions that balance both player interests and company interests. We just have to watch and wait, patiently. www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:30:00 - [459] Edited by: Judicator Saturnius on 23/06/2011 00:32:21 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Grog Barrel Edited by: Grog Barrel on 23/06/2011 00:24:38 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: leth ghost i think ccp must have taken note how there new buddys sony dealt with the psn pr and try to emulate it lol Or John Smedley convinced Hillmar that your customers love you more and spend more money when you do things to their game that they don't want. In europe is commonly to see companies giving a flying fnck about customer's satisfaction; probably an issue bound to the continent (i blame the rome empire for the matter, as scandinavians seem to be an exception). Companies here are so well protected and confederated with eachother "against" customers so to speak, that, if Adam Smith was still alive, he would never, ever have put a single word out outside of his mouth regarding the competitiveness, "free market" and everything what it implies. It's somehow continetal-wide issue if you ask me. Probably stronger in loliceland, if you care to read the cultural observations by the mittani and read some background of their pre- economic crisis welfare. Yeah, but you'd have to have Lindsey Lohan's instinct for responsible behavior to pull something like this when the only thing separating you from poverty is 350,000 players deciding to keep their subscription going the next month... LOL Originally by: Siigari Kitawa As much as it pains me to see this happen, I believe that the players are taking a very immature route of going about this. This is a game forum, not a legislature podium. Blunting rage here is like watching your language at a pub. vOv
Optional Patch	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:31:00 - [460] OMFG, The author of the PDF thinks it would be a great idea to charge players RL money to store more than 50 fittings on the server. So first take away what the player HAD, then charge them to get it back.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:31:00 - [461] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa As much as it pains me to see this happen, I believe that the players are taking a very immature route of going about this. First of all, if you guys are all truly upset and ****ed off at CCP then quit. So many rude, mean and uncalled for things have been said here against CCP that if you really are going to back your words then you should stop paying them your subscription fees. Stop buying PLEXes and stop logging in. Only then will you send CCP a true message. I personally am disheartened, but I understand that we only have one side of the story. Because CCP is unwilling to comment on this (and it will probably be the way this winds up,) speculation is at its peak and we can only speculate. We could stir ourselves into a typhoon of anger and it would result in a lot of broken hearts, angry players and developers and a game left in an even worse state than before all this chaos began. I just want to remind you guys that if you are truly going to berate CCP with your words on a forum, then do not let it be empty, for you will look like a fool when next month rolls around and you're still posting. Just wanted to throw that out there. I'm in this for the long haul, because I want to see what happens. I believe CCP will try to make the best decisions that balance both player interests and company interests. We just have to watch and wait, patiently. Don't worry, we will keep your words on file to use against you later. Filed under "we told you so".
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:32:00 - [462] Originally by: Judicator Saturnius Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Manos Heimenbarger What concerns me the most is that CCP has not made any reply to these claims... In the aftermath of the mess this latest expansion made, and with the degree of community backlash so far, this couldn't have come out at a worse time for CCP (real or fake). I would think they would have quickly prepared some kind of statement by now. They would have closed/deleted this thread and posted a denial if it were fake. It's real alright. Just as real as the backlash CCP is getting. Really, in the wake of what Incarna is, a CASH SHOP (and wildly overpriced one at that) NOT AN EXPANSION, is this internal newsletter really any worse for CCP than the game itself at this moment? It really just amounts to some gasoline on the already raging fire. As I said earlier, NOTHING but an apology and an IMMEDIATE withdraw of the cash shop, the refund of Aurum, and the seeding of all items as blueprints is going to save EVE at this point. Incarna has reached critical mass. I don't think i'd go for even that at this point, to be quite honest. Neither would I, at least until they stuck with it long enough to prove their sincerity. But it represents THE ONLY WAY they can stop digging this hole deeper at this point.
Grog Barrel	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:32:00 - [463] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Grog Barrel Edited by: Grog Barrel on 23/06/2011 00:24:38 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: leth ghost i think ccp must have taken note how there new buddys sony dealt with the psn pr and try to emulate it lol Or John Smedley convinced Hillmar that your customers love you more and spend more money when you do things to their game that they don't want. In europe is commonly to see companies giving a flying fnck about customer's satisfaction; probably an issue bound to the continent (i blame the rome empire for the matter, as scandinavians seem to be an exception). Companies here are so well protected and confederated with eachother "against" customers so to speak, that, if Adam Smith was still alive, he would never, ever have put a single word out outside of his mouth regarding the competitiveness, "free market" and everything what it implies. It's somehow continetal-wide issue if you ask me. Probably stronger in loliceland, if you care to read the cultural observations by the mittani and read some background of their pre- economic crisis welfare. Yeah, but you'd have to have Lindsey Lohan's instinct for responsible behavior to pull something like this when the only thing separating you from poverty is 350,000 players deciding to keep their subscription going the next month... I concur.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:33:00 - [464] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa As much as it pains me to see this happen, I believe that the players are taking a very immature route of going about this. First of all, if you guys are all truly upset and **ed off at CCP then quit. So many rude, mean and uncalled for things have been said here against CCP that if you really are going to back your words then you should stop paying them your subscription fees. Stop buying PLEXes and stop logging in. Only then will you send CCP a true message. I personally am disheartened, but I understand that we only have one side of the story. Because CCP is unwilling to comment on this (and it will probably be the way this winds up,) speculation is at its peak and we can only speculate. We could stir ourselves into a typhoon of anger and it would result in a lot of broken hearts, angry players and developers and a game left in an even worse state than before all this chaos began. I just want to remind you guys that if you are truly going to berate CCP with your words on a forum, then do not let it be empty, for you will look like a fool when next month rolls around and you're still posting. Just wanted to throw that out there. I'm in this for the long haul, because I want to see what happens. I believe CCP will try to make the best decisions that balance both player interests and company interests. We just have to watch and wait, patiently. Unfortunately history shows us that CCP doesn't **ing listen until the playerbase blows up in rage at them. Although this time I think a fair few people really will leave and not return.
Soi Mala Whacky Waving Inflatable Flailing Arm Tubemen	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:34:00 - [465] Originally by: Optional Patch OMFG, The author of the PDF thinks it would be a great idea to charge players RL money to store more than 50 fittings on the server. So first take away what the player HAD, then charge them to get it back. I called this a while back, and the same will happen for third party apps - restrict people making them until they just don't bother, then use their open source code, modify it, then sell it yourself... Whats that? why yes, that initial version of the ingame agent finder is pretty good...
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:34:00 - [466] Originally by: Tejal Charu You can try to win the uphill battle, CCP, but you can't win the war. The effort to get us to accept our sandbox being polluted with RMT turds amounts to p---ing up a rope.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:34:00 - [467] Originally by: Miilla So, why the bans? It's a simply matter of harassment. Be a **head, slander the company through every internet media outlet you can get your cheeeto covered fingers on, and BAM expect a ban. So much outrage against Eve and the developers is rooted in two things: 1)Ignorance. Take for example, everyone who reads that bulletin and thinks its real. The philosophy espoused in that fake article directly contradicts what CCP is ACTUALLY DOING with the NeX. Read the article, look at the NeX store. They dont match up at all. 2) Bigotry. EvE players have a long-standing feeling of superiority over WoW players. Internet spaceships pilots thinking they're cooler and smarter than internet mages. Whatever. I dont give a crap whether you're into spaceships, wizards, vampires, or fantasy football, you still have a nerdy hobby. Just take ownership of it and stop inflating your ego by tearing down those with a different nerd streak than yourself. This is a huge driving factor over the hysteria with MT and incarna - if it bears the slightest resemblance to WoW, and the WoW bigotry takes over and nerdrage blinds emo-forum-warriors from actually taking an intelligent, informed, opinion based on a summary piecing together of all the facts and CCP statements on the table. Same with WoD and Dust - if you can relate it to Call of Duty or Twilight, you can place into categories hated on by bigoted eve players with an inflated sense of nerd superiority. Rational sense goes out the window, OMGWTFVAMPIRESNOOOO takes over. CCP isn't banning people that are offering simple, constructive, respectful criticism. They are banning **heads who spam them from every angle with emotion filled hateful rants that have little use or bearing on reality, or who condone and spread fake CCP material like the stuff that sparked this thread.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:34:00 - [468] You know, thinking back, yesterday when the prices came out for the vanity items, I thought to myself, this is bad, but it probably won't hurt subscriber numbers. This.. this might actually hurt subscriber numbers.
Hyperforce99 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:36:00 - [469] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Although this time I think a fair few people really will leave and not return. You can count me in on one of those people. Unless CCP finally comes out and tells us it will not go this route and return to the right path, I probably won't resub either. --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/
Xervish Krin	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:36:00 - [470] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa As much as it pains me to see this happen, I believe that the players are taking a very immature route of going about this. First of all, if you guys are all truly upset and ****ed off at CCP then quit. So many rude, mean and uncalled for things have been said here against CCP that if you really are going to back your words then you should stop paying them your subscription fees. Stop buying PLEXes and stop logging in. Only then will you send CCP a true message. I personally am disheartened, but I understand that we only have one side of the story. Because CCP is unwilling to comment on this (and it will probably be the way this winds up,) speculation is at its peak and we can only speculate. We could stir ourselves into a typhoon of anger and it would result in a lot of broken hearts, angry players and developers and a game left in an even worse state than before all this chaos began. I just want to remind you guys that if you are truly going to berate CCP with your words on a forum, then do not let it be empty, for you will look like a fool when next month rolls around and you're still posting. Just wanted to throw that out there. I'm in this for the long haul, because I want to see what happens. I believe CCP will try to make the best decisions that balance both player interests and company interests. We just have to watch and wait, patiently. I really hope that you're right, and that this reaction doesn't spiral into a failscade for the entire game. Hopefully CCP will have some kind of explanation for this, and for their ban happy response, but I can't for the life of me figure out what it could be.
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:37:00 - [471] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa As much as it pains me to see this happen, I believe that the players are taking a very immature route of going about this. First of all, if you guys are all truly upset and ****ed off at CCP then quit. So many rude, mean and uncalled for things have been said here against CCP that if you really are going to back your words then you should stop paying them your subscription fees. Stop buying PLEXes and stop logging in. Only then will you send CCP a true message. I personally am disheartened, but I understand that we only have one side of the story. Because CCP is unwilling to comment on this (and it will probably be the way this winds up,) speculation is at its peak and we can only speculate. We could stir ourselves into a typhoon of anger and it would result in a lot of broken hearts, angry players and developers and a game left in an even worse state than before all this chaos began. I just want to remind you guys that if you are truly going to berate CCP with your words on a forum, then do not let it be empty, for you will look like a fool when next month rolls around and you're still posting. Just wanted to throw that out there. I'm in this for the long haul, because I want to see what happens. I believe CCP will try to make the best decisions that balance both player interests and company interests. We just have to watch and wait, patiently. You aren't a player you are a customer and as a customer you belive 'I shop therefore I am', now STFU and buy something.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:37:00 - [472] Originally by: Optional Patch OMFG, The author of the PDF thinks it would be a great idea to charge players RL money to store more than 50 fittings on the server. So first take away what the player HAD, then charge them to get it back. OMFG another person that actually takes this fake article seriously.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:37:00 - [473] Originally by: Soi Mala Originally by: Optional Patch OMFG, The author of the PDF thinks it would be a great idea to charge players RL money to store more than 50 fittings on the server. So first take away what the player HAD, then charge them to get it back. I called this a while back, and the same will happen for third party apps - restrict people making them until they just don't bother, then use their open source code, modify it, then sell it yourself... Whats that? why yes, that initial version of the ingame agent finder is pretty good... I have no suspended the work I was doing to make an Eve SDK for app building. I have also suspended 2 other Eve apps I was working on that where to be built on top of it, along with other ideas. I see no compelling reason now to continue with them.
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:37:00 - [474] Originally by: Cailais Originally by: Tla Atij Edited by: Tla Atij on 23/06/2011 00:20:34 Anyone got matches? Isn't that CCP Soundwave? yup. C. Well now comes the question, how much of this rage and insanity could have been avoided if they simply decided to say in a full public statement to the media and the playerbase this was the direction they were taking? I bet despite some flames and uproar a lot of people would have remained still just to see how the game changed? Why do they have to hide and naysay everything that makes them "look" bad? I'd rather prefer a games company that purposely blurted out it was doing it for the money than one that stood behind a silk curtain saying it's a company run "by gamers for gamers". Honesty guys, it's not overrated, it's the only real coin of exchange in the PR world of today. They should check the latest trends in company human resources. Honesty, brutal and sheer honesty, in a world where you can surf to a site and see decapitated women, mutilated animals, satanic cultists eating innards of recently deceased corpses, people still pretend the regular userbase of the internet is not prepared to deal with the raw implications of a companies business goal? After all of this what is beginning to irk me the most is the lack of honesty from CCP. If they WANT their game to turn into a Play to Win or Free 2 play with Pay 2 win model, GOOD FOR THEM, but come out and say it so, before I waste my time here. Who knows, I might even want to stay if they come out and say it in the OPEN. We are not 13 year old summer**** , we might act or scream or squeal like them, but most of us here are people with enough IQ to understand things if spoken bluntly with the possibility to foresee consequences. Just come out of the Closet guys, and be free, it will be up to us to decide later how to react. ---Archipelago Theory---
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:38:00 - [475] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Optional Patch OMFG, The author of the PDF thinks it would be a great idea to charge players RL money to store more than 50 fittings on the server. So first take away what the player HAD, then charge them to get it back. OMFG another person that actually takes this fake article seriously. shame then that two CSMs have confirmed having had access to these in physical form, isn't it mr. spindoctor?
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:38:00 - [476] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Miilla So, why the bans? It's a simply matter of harassment. Be a **head, slander the company through every internet media outlet you can get your cheeeto covered fingers on, and BAM expect a ban. So much outrage against Eve and the developers is rooted in two things: 1)Ignorance. Take for example, everyone who reads that bulletin and thinks its real. The philosophy espoused in that fake article directly contradicts what CCP is ACTUALLY DOING with the NeX. Read the article, look at the NeX store. They dont match up at all. 2) Bigotry. EvE players have a long-standing feeling of superiority over WoW players. Internet spaceships pilots thinking they're cooler and smarter than internet mages. Whatever. I dont give a crap whether you're into spaceships, wizards, vampires, or fantasy football, you still have a nerdy hobby. Just take ownership of it and stop inflating your ego by tearing down those with a different nerd streak than yourself. This is a huge driving factor over the hysteria with MT and incarna - if it bears the slightest resemblance to WoW, and the WoW bigotry takes over and nerdrage blinds emo-forum-warriors from actually taking an intelligent, informed, opinion based on a summary piecing together of all the facts and CCP statements on the table. Same with WoD and Dust - if you can relate it to Call of Duty or Twilight, you can place into categories hated on by bigoted eve players with an inflated sense of nerd superiority. Rational sense goes out the window, OMGWTFVAMPIRESNOOOO takes over. CCP isn't banning people that are offering simple, constructive, respectful criticism. They are banning **heads who spam them from every angle with emotion filled hateful rants that have little use or bearing on reality, or who condone and spread fake CCP material like the stuff that sparked this thread. So yea... CCP is charging 60$ for a monocle. Did you hear?
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:39:00 - [477] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Miilla So, why the bans? It's a simply matter of harassment. Be a **head, slander the company through every internet media outlet you can get your cheeeto covered fingers on, and BAM expect a ban. So much outrage against Eve and the developers is rooted in two things: 1)Ignorance. Take for example, everyone who reads that bulletin and thinks its real. The philosophy espoused in that fake article directly contradicts what CCP is ACTUALLY DOING with the NeX. Read the article, look at the NeX store. They dont match up at all. 2) Bigotry. EvE players have a long-standing feeling of superiority over WoW players. Internet spaceships pilots thinking they're cooler and smarter than internet mages. Whatever. I dont give a crap whether you're into spaceships, wizards, vampires, or fantasy football, you still have a nerdy hobby. Just take ownership of it and stop inflating your ego by tearing down those with a different nerd streak than yourself. This is a huge driving factor over the hysteria with MT and incarna - if it bears the slightest resemblance to WoW, and the WoW bigotry takes over and nerdrage blinds emo-forum-warriors from actually taking an intelligent, informed, opinion based on a summary piecing together of all the facts and CCP statements on the table. Same with WoD and Dust - if you can relate it to Call of Duty or Twilight, you can place into categories hated on by bigoted eve players with an inflated sense of nerd superiority. Rational sense goes out the window, OMGWTFVAMPIRESNOOOO takes over. CCP isn't banning people that are offering simple, constructive, respectful criticism. They are banning **heads who spam them from every angle with emotion filled hateful rants that have little use or bearing on reality, or who condone and spread fake CCP material like the stuff that sparked this thread. just imagine... for one second... that this is a ccp alt... -------
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:40:00 - [478] Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Miilla So, why the bans? It's a simply matter of harassment. Be a **head, slander the company through every internet media outlet you can get your cheeeto covered fingers on, and BAM expect a ban. So much outrage against Eve and the developers is rooted in two things: 1)Ignorance. Take for example, everyone who reads that bulletin and thinks its real. The philosophy espoused in that fake article directly contradicts what CCP is ACTUALLY DOING with the NeX. Read the article, look at the NeX store. They dont match up at all. 2) Bigotry. EvE players have a long-standing feeling of superiority over WoW players. Internet spaceships pilots thinking they're cooler and smarter than internet mages. Whatever. I dont give a crap whether you're into spaceships, wizards, vampires, or fantasy football, you still have a nerdy hobby. Just take ownership of it and stop inflating your ego by tearing down those with a different nerd streak than yourself. This is a huge driving factor over the hysteria with MT and incarna - if it bears the slightest resemblance to WoW, and the WoW bigotry takes over and nerdrage blinds emo-forum-warriors from actually taking an intelligent, informed, opinion based on a summary piecing together of all the facts and CCP statements on the table. Same with WoD and Dust - if you can relate it to Call of Duty or Twilight, you can place into categories hated on by bigoted eve players with an inflated sense of nerd superiority. Rational sense goes out the window, OMGWTFVAMPIRESNOOOO takes over. CCP isn't banning people that are offering simple, constructive, respectful criticism. They are banning **heads who spam them from every angle with emotion filled hateful rants that have little use or bearing on reality, or who condone and spread fake CCP material like the stuff that sparked this thread. just imagine... for one second... that this is a ccp alt... imagine?
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:40:00 - [479] Originally by: Black Dranzer You know, thinking back, yesterday when the prices came out for the vanity items, I thought to myself, this is bad, but it probably won't hurt subscriber numbers. This.. this might actually hurt subscriber numbers. Hurt? It's going to hurt like jumping out of a plane onto the peak of Mt. Everest without a parachute. Given the incredibly high prices they put on their baubles can you imagine what they plan to charge us for the stuff being mentioned in the leaked internal newsletter? This expansion has already cost CCP far more money in the subscribers they have lost AND WILL LOSE SOON than RMT will make them. And they have already lost their reputation. Like virginity, it can't be regained.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:41:00 - [480] lots of CCP alts around these days on the forums, and not even hiding that well
Olleybear Minmatar I R' Carebear	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:41:00 - [481] Originally by: Urgg Boolean The overwhelming reality for us as players who do not want game-changing MT, is that CCP counts it's subscriber base in 10K's while many other games count in the millions. Don't get defensive, but by sheer numbers comparison, EvE is not that popular (a fact that most of us like). CCP can make a lot more money by doing all the marketable things that other games do. They can lose all current players, and still make increasing profits by attracting fans from LOTRO, WoW, Guild Wars, KotOR, StarTrek Online, and whatever else. Bottom line: their game design so far has attracted players in the 10Ks; to take a bigger market share, they need to change their model to accommodate the market research. It's business, pure and simple. <visions of Ebenezer Scrooge> I do understand what your saying about market research showing a better way of making money. I really do. I'm ok with MT for trivial things. For example, different colored hull on exact same ship, or some fancy eye candy for your avatar, both of which should be destroyable in game. I'd buy a 5x pack of a pink skin with a carebear on it for my rupture, IF the word micro was really at the begining of the word transaction. Monetary transactions for abilities that offer in game advantages over other people is an entirly different thing. Thats the danger, even in Dust514, its a danger to the entire game of Eve. As for all current people being replaced by the MT crowd... Thats a big bet, a very big bet, to make with a game that has around 300k subs in a hard to learn game that most people dont play because people like the simplicity of WoW and farmville better.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:41:00 - [482] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku "Right now you can store 50 personal fittings..., thats more than enough for the average EVE player..., why not be able to add more storage for a small amout of money?" - EVE Lead Game Designer Finally they're showing their true colors -- be it unintentionally. Quote: "One other service we're looking at is selling faction standings. We want to offer convenience" Extremely disturbing news. Quote: Dust: "Selling 'weapons' for real money is very tempting. ...we are planning on doing so...but the real reason is that we have strong evidence that selling performance enhancers, in moderation, works." Even more disturbing! Douches! --
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:42:00 - [483] They're probably gonna say something like "Hai guise, this is just an internal magazine, look there's even a disclaimer in it that the views exposed therein aren't official CCP policies." and maybe backpedal for a month or two. Then put turrets with 10% bonus damage in the NeX, for 15,000 AUR.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:42:00 - [484] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Black Dranzer You know, thinking back, yesterday when the prices came out for the vanity items, I thought to myself, this is bad, but it probably won't hurt subscriber numbers. This.. this might actually hurt subscriber numbers. Hurt? It's going to hurt like jumping out of a plane onto the peak of Mt. Everest without a parachute. Given the incredibly high prices they put on their baubles can you imagine what they plan to charge us for the stuff being mentioned in the leaked internal newsletter? This expansion has already cost CCP far more money in the subscribers they have lost AND WILL LOSE SOON than RMT will make them. And they have already lost their reputation. Like virginity, it can't be regained. Actually, they have an operation for that. It uses needles and thread.
Galane The Interstellar Lunatic Asylum	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:42:00 - [485] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku lots of CCP alts around these days on the forums, and not even hiding that well Well soundwave did say he'd be keeping an eye on this thread. He just forgot to mention it would be as an alt
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:43:00 - [486] Originally by: Liang Nuren The only thing that it reveals - to me - is that CCP's focus has shifted from making a game (as small "indie" game companies tend to do) to making money through any possible means. No.....ish. Or rather that's not quite fair. Eve isn't supposed to be just about internet spaceships. Eve is supposed to be an entire universe. CCP has always wanted to expand the vision into the Barbie and FPS niches and beyond, no? Yes, CCP could have sat on their laurels by staying focused on internet spaceships for quite some time and most of us would have been content. However, if CCP wants to stay true to their vision of Eve encompassing all things scifi, then they need a plan and money. If you put on your glass-is-half-full monocle, MTs seem to be the way to fund the expansion of EVE into a full-fledged universe instead of just being a niche internet spaceship game. Expansion requires players. Not everyone who plays internet spaceships will cross over into the Barbie or FPS market and vice versa. Therefore, Eve needs a way to attract new blood into playing Barbie and DUST. Subs are Barriers. MTs are a risk-free gateway drug. Subscriptions are nice, but given how many other MMOs are out there, a subscription could be seen as a barrier to entry for new players. People will easily pay a sub fee for big names like SWTOR without hesitation, but for a "no-name" brand like WiS or DUST, a sub fee is too much of a commitment for an unknown. MTs would allow new players/markets to get their feet wet without the risk of committing. This gives CCP a chance to suck in those tentative players with engaging content. Long story short, CCP has chosen to grow into something grander and they've picked MTs to finance that growth and as a means to pull in future players from a hyper-competitive MMO market. So I would say the MTs are less about greed, and more about being competitive and attractive to the future Barbie and DUST market in order to fulfill a vision. But otherwise, yeah, grognards will always hate change. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:43:00 - [487] Originally by: Republica Winder Hurt? It's going to hurt like jumping out of a plane onto the peak of Mt. Everest without a parachute. Yeah, see, I'm more cynical. On the one hand, we're in an uproar (or denial), but we're the hardcore elite. Most players don't frequent the forums. Chances are a lot of people won't give a damn. And even if they do, our lost subscriptions will probably be compensated for by the people who are going to buy monocles and pants and, when the time comes, whatever else CCP puts out there. It'll damage reputation, probably. The question is, how much is reputation worth? Time will tell, I guess. Assuming this leak is legit, of course.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:44:00 - [488] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen It's a simply matter of harassment. Be a **head, slander the company through every internet media outlet you can get your cheeeto covered fingers on, and BAM expect a ban. Then ban me, because I'm hosting the leaked memo on my personal website and have been distributing links to it. But really, its entirely consistent with the direction you're taking the company. We no longer see eye to eye about what Eve is. I expect an internet spaceship game with fantastic PVP. You expect to anally my wallet for $60 monacles. Ban me. -Liang -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:44:00 - [489] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku lots of CCP alts around these days on the forums, and not even hiding that well Can you blame them for being upset? They were all promised brand new gold plated Rolls-Royces every year and all the lines of ******* they can snort off the hoods of them because of this bold new move into RMT! Where did you think the money from those $60 monocles was going to go, into game development? HA! They are angrier than we are to see it all crash down in less than 24 hours!
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:44:00 - [490] Originally by: Brujo Loco Well now comes the question, how much of this rage and insanity could have been avoided if they simply decided to say in a full public statement to the media and the playerbase this was the direction they were taking? I bet despite some flames and uproar a lot of people would have remained still just to see how the game changed? Why do they have to hide and naysay everything that makes them "look" bad? I'd rather prefer a games company that purposely blurted out it was doing it for the money than one that stood behind a silk curtain saying it's a company run "by gamers for gamers". Honesty guys, it's not overrated, it's the only real coin of exchange in the PR world of today. They should check the latest trends in company human resources. Honesty, brutal and sheer honesty, in a world where you can surf to a site and see decapitated women, mutilated animals, satanic cultists eating innards of recently deceased corpses, people still pretend the regular userbase of the internet is not prepared to deal with the raw implications of a companies business goal? After all of this what is beginning to irk me the most is the lack of honesty from CCP. If they WANT their game to turn into a Play to Win or Free 2 play with Pay 2 win model, GOOD FOR THEM, but come out and say it so, before I waste my time here. Who knows, I might even want to stay if they come out and say it in the OPEN. We are not 13 year old summer**** , we might act or scream or squeal like them, but most of us here are people with enough IQ to understand things if spoken bluntly with the possibility to foresee consequences. Just come out of the Closet guys, and be free, it will be up to us to decide later how to react. It's the disconnect between the vision that players have had for years and the new(?) direction of CCP that are at odds, and thus the rage. ______________________________
Waylan Yutani Gallente Order of the Seraphim	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:45:00 - [491] "No, no no. It's allready out there don't lock or delete the thread or we look even more of an a-hole than we allready does - better just let the rage settle and everybody will be a happy consumer within a month" And this is excactly what was being thought or said with ccp, and this is excatly whats going to happen lol
Siigari Kitawa Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:45:00 - [492] Originally by: Liang Nuren Ban me. -Liang You realize if this was SA you'd be banned already? www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:46:00 - [493] Originally by: stoicfaux Originally by: Liang Nuren The only thing that it reveals - to me - is that CCP's focus has shifted from making a game (as small "indie" game companies tend to do) to making money through any possible means. No.....ish. Or rather that's not quite fair. Eve isn't supposed to be just about internet spaceships. Eve is supposed to be an entire universe. CCP has always wanted to expand the vision into the Barbie and FPS niches and beyond, no? Yes, CCP could have sat on their laurels by staying focused on internet spaceships for quite some time and most of us would have been content. However, if CCP wants to stay true to their vision of Eve encompassing all things scifi, then they need a plan and money. If you put on your glass-is-half-full monocle, MTs seem to be the way to fund the expansion of EVE into a full-fledged universe instead of just being a niche internet spaceship game. Expansion requires players. Not everyone who plays internet spaceships will cross over into the Barbie or FPS market and vice versa. Therefore, Eve needs a way to attract new blood into playing Barbie and DUST. Subs are Barriers. MTs are a risk-free gateway drug. Subscriptions are nice, but given how many other MMOs are out there, a subscription could be seen as a barrier to entry for new players. People will easily pay a sub fee for big names like SWTOR without hesitation, but for a "no-name" brand like WiS or DUST, a sub fee is too much of a commitment for an unknown. MTs would allow new players/markets to get their feet wet without the risk of committing. This gives CCP a chance to suck in those tentative players with engaging content. Long story short, CCP has chosen to grow into something grander and they've picked MTs to finance that growth and as a means to pull in future players from a hyper-competitive MMO market. So I would say the MTs are less about greed, and more about being competitive and attractive to the future Barbie and DUST market in order to fulfill a vision. But otherwise, yeah, grognards will always hate change. This would be a much better argument if CCP wasn't showing obvious signs of management problems, financial problems, and in general being overstretched with too many risky projects. There was no reason for this. CCP should have focused on EVE, made it shine, and worked on one side projects at a time -tops-. Chasing the dream is fine, selling your customers to the devil to get there quicker and risk losing it all, that is unacceptable. ______________________________
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:47:00 - [494] EVE IS ~~FOREVER~~ until you allow shield/armor/damage bonuses for euros and dollars.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:47:00 - [495] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Black Dranzer You know, thinking back, yesterday when the prices came out for the vanity items, I thought to myself, this is bad, but it probably won't hurt subscriber numbers. This.. this might actually hurt subscriber numbers. Hurt? It's going to hurt like jumping out of a plane onto the peak of Mt. Everest without a parachute. Given the incredibly high prices they put on their baubles can you imagine what they plan to charge us for the stuff being mentioned in the leaked internal newsletter? This expansion has already cost CCP far more money in the subscribers they have lost AND WILL LOSE SOON than RMT will make them. And they have already lost their reputation. Like virginity, it can't be regained. Actually, they have an operation for that. It uses needles and thread. True, but it tends to be exposed as fake when the experience past the repaired maidenhead is like throwing a hot dog down a hallway... That's as reamed out as CCP's integrity is at this point...
Hyperforce99 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:47:00 - [496] CCP might have chosen to grow into something different, but even if they are to include RMT, they should NEVER, EVER alienate the playerbase that made them what they are today. Thats like blowing up your main powerline trying to install a secondary feed. --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:48:00 - [497] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Black Dranzer You know, thinking back, yesterday when the prices came out for the vanity items, I thought to myself, this is bad, but it probably won't hurt subscriber numbers. This.. this might actually hurt subscriber numbers. Hurt? It's going to hurt like jumping out of a plane onto the peak of Mt. Everest without a parachute. Given the incredibly high prices they put on their baubles can you imagine what they plan to charge us for the stuff being mentioned in the leaked internal newsletter? This expansion has already cost CCP far more money in the subscribers they have lost AND WILL LOSE SOON than RMT will make them. And they have already lost their reputation. Like virginity, it can't be regained. Actually, they have an operation for that. It uses needles and thread. what you plan on doing after your subs up milia? any games out there you're thinkin of? (genuinely interested) -------
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:48:00 - [498] When the rats/trolls leave the ship first. Worry.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:48:00 - [499] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Originally by: Liang Nuren Ban me. -Liang You realize if this was SA you'd be banned already? This is me caring? -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:49:00 - [500] Just effin' brilliant... great way to treat your customers, you know, the ones that pay your frickin wages? Soo... what's the future holding in store? Lemme go crazy here for a sec... 1. Overpriced vanity items. Just vanity items. No, we will not sell stuff that has game impact... 2. Extra saved fittings. Next up, cap bookmarks and sell extra bookmark slots. 3. Ammo. Normal ammo? Screws economy and industrial players, no? Faction ammo? Screws LP market, I'd expect. Uber-AUR-only ammo? 4. Standings. Doesn't hurt nothing, right? Oh wait.... Datacore market? 5. Ships. Again normal ones screwing the economy and industry? Faction? uber-AUR-only imbalanced-mobiles? 6. There is none... 7. While we're at it, some uber-AUR-only mods? Or officer/deadspace/faction mods, why not? 8. How about +10 attribute implants? +10% hardwires... oh wait, +10 attribute enhanced Crystal sets? 9. Instant SP boost! BS V in just 30 seconds! 10. Extra hardwire slots, maybe? 11. Buy-a-POS, anchoring service included. Instant Sov for a reasonable price for discriminating customers! 12. CONCORD-for-hire! Turn your Sov 0.0 into your own personal HiSec with full CONCORD protection! 13. CONCORD Bribes! Make sure they're eating doughnuts while you SB the hell out of Jita 4-4! 14. HiSec supercaps! So I went a bit overboard...Worst part is, I'm not sure exactly where CCP would draw the line anymore...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:50:00 - [501] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 00:50:20 At CCP's current store prices, I could buy a real spaceship. Why would I buy a pretend thing?
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:50:00 - [502] Originally by: Hyperforce99 CCP might have chosen to grow into something different, but even if they are to include RMT, they should NEVER, EVER alienate the playerbase that made them what they are today. Thats like blowing up your main powerline trying to install a secondary feed. The real tragedy is that there was no need for it, they would have made WoD into MT heaven and that was it. EVE was going strong on this business model, but greed is evil, it changes you into thinking you can get more and more out of something, missing that it works fine as it is.
Dante024781 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:50:00 - [503] Edited by: Dante024781 on 23/06/2011 00:52:51 Originally by: stoicfaux Subs are Barriers. MTs are a risk-free gateway drug. Subscriptions are nice, but given how many other MMOs are out there, a subscription could be seen as a barrier to entry for new players. People will easily pay a sub fee for big names like SWTOR without hesitation, but for a "no-name" brand like WiS or DUST, a sub fee is too much of a commitment for an unknown. I subscribed to a no name MMO called EVE based on the free 15 day trial. If CCP are planing on moving to MT payment model for EVE that's fine, It's their game they can do what they want with it. But they will do it without me as a customer.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:51:00 - [504] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste This would be a much better argument if CCP wasn't showing obvious signs of management problems, financial problems, and in general being overstretched with too many risky projects. There was no reason for this. CCP should have focused on EVE, made it shine, and worked on one side projects at a time -tops-. Chasing the dream is fine, selling your customers to the devil to get there quicker and risk losing it all, that is unacceptable. From what I recall from EVE history, the original Dev team worked without pay for quite a long time to get the company started and the game released. After their wonderful decisions of the past year which culminated with this "expansion" at least a part of that history is about to repeat itself.
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:52:00 - [505] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen 2) Bigotry. EvE players have a long-standing feeling of superiority over WoW players. Internet spaceships pilots thinking they're cooler and smarter than internet mages. Whatever. I dont give a crap whether you're into spaceships, wizards, vampires, or fantasy football, you still have a nerdy hobby. Just take ownership of it and stop inflating your ego by tearing down those with a different nerd streak than yourself. CCP isn't banning people that are offering simple, constructive, respectful criticism. They are banning **heads who spam them from every angle with emotion filled hateful rants that have little use or bearing on reality, or who condone and spread fake CCP material like the stuff that sparked this thread. first of all if it's fake, I'm pretty sure CCP will tell us. By now we haven't heard a word from them and two csm members have mentioned having seen that "thing" before... second. I started playing this game, because there was nothing like it. Nothing. Nothing at all... Ive never participated in the expected gotry after every new patch with people going ape* over nothing and then like it anyway after a week. I can understand 0.0 people being **ed off with the lag tho (among other things, but anyway...). But this, this would change EvE in such a way, that it becomes something realy ugly, something, quite like... well... all the rest really. Rich nerds having an advantage over everyone else. I don't feel like being part of something like that. It offers me no immersion. There is no immersion to be found when you realise that a lot of people have an advantage over you not because theyre better, but because they have acces to rich parents visa's... I like this game, and I'd rather have a fond memory of it by leaving it when it's still good than a bitter one. _________________________________________________
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:52:00 - [506] GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't ****ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon)
Montmazar Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:53:00 - [507] Edited by: Montmazar on 23/06/2011 00:56:21 Dear idiots, Hans Jagerblitzen is not a CCP alt. I suspect some of those raging here, however, are. I kid, I kid. We all know CCP employees don't play the game. But, what we see in the twittering, the full document and the gossip is that it seems CCP is arguing amongst itself over the vision of the game. And what worries me is, in this latest expansion, the side I don't want to see win, seems to have won. $70 monocles. This game is now a laughing stock. More of one, I mean. But this fundamentally hurts the EVE brand. I've canceled one of my accounts (mostly because I just didn't use it) but this is pushing me to just pay with ISK until I run out on my main. If EVE gets on the right track, with iteration on Incarna and not going whole-hog on Microtransactions, then I'll start paying for this game again. And to any friends who ask me if this is worth playing - given that it takes a year or so to really come into being a fully realized player - I just don't have faith this game is even going to last that long. CCP's actions look worryingly like a company trying to pump and dump for cash while they still can. And I was actually planning to buy space clothes for isk too. . . *I definitely believe it is real, per Seleene's affirmation and per its edit history. Plus, if EVEnews24 wrote it, it would be completely unreadable and full of emoticons.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:54:00 - [508] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't ****ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon) Reported for impersonating a CCP employee. Against the rules.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:54:00 - [509] Originally by: Liang Nuren The only thing that it reveals - to me - is that CCP's focus has shifted from making a game (as small "indie" game companies tend to do) to making money through any possible means. We don't always agree on everything, but I'd say you pretty much nailed it here, buddy. Gawd, I'm so disgusted with CCP now, it's not even funny any more. :( N.B. And no, y'all can't haz my stuff. --
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:54:00 - [510] Originally by: Sakura Zendragon Just effin' brilliant... great way to treat your customers, you know, the ones that pay your frickin wages? 12. CONCORD-for-hire! Turn your Sov 0.0 into your own personal HiSec with full CONCORD protection! Okay edit that one out, don't give them that kind of ideas. RMT markets and bringing items into game will equal most development geared towards the RMT items. Why put that much into new "free" content where there is no return for the time devoted to development. Instead you can now monetize the developer's time and tie it to their bonus. So developer works on free projects and updates with little bonus. But if developer starts producing RMT items at break neck speed their bonus is increased by a factor based on the sale and demand of that RMT items. Don't think this won't happen, it already occurs in the industry. Brain talent will go towards helping themselves. They will put minimal effort into fixing anything or testing anything that they give out free.
Khamelean	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:55:00 - [511] Quoting part sentences out of context in order to increase the effect of what your trying to say is at best juvenile, at worst, plain dishonest.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:55:00 - [512] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't ****ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon) Don't worry, we don't hate you, and we don't think you are a CCP-Dev. You are just one of the usual suspects who counter-argument even obvious stuff just to feel important. Thats ok, we know the type.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [513] I will say it again :) When the trolls start to leave the game. WORRY. It's a bad sign.
Aricaan Gallente Cobra Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [514] I take it no one here has actually had a job in sales....
Bruenor Danovan Xabregas Biochemicals S.A.	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [515] Hope all this clears up soon. Way I see it now is Eve is going SWG on us.
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [516] Originally by: Khamelean Quoting part sentences out of context in order to increase the effect of what your trying to say is at best juvenile, at worst, plain dishonest. Reading them in context doesn't make them better I'm afraid.
Grog Barrel	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [517] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't ****ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon) just... stop doing it even worse.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [518] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't **ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon) I am not accusing you, I am pis$ed at CCP, and I LOVE Incarna (the concept). * Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Mister Smithington	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [519] FOR ALL THOSE CONTEMPLATING QUITTING myself included: Before you go, buyout every plex you can afford AND REDEEM THEM. Currently every unredeemed plex is a $15 loan to CCP. In other words, it's game time bought and payed for, but as of yet undelivered. I realize adding more game time to your account when you're trying to leave is counter-intuitive. But if you want to send a message about our opinions on the NeX and MT, nothing rings louder than opting for game time over vanity items. Force CCP to deliver the service that players have already payed for REDEEM YOUR DAMN PLEX!
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:56:00 - [520] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't ****ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon) Reported for impersonating a CCP employee. Against the rules. LOL
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:58:00 - [521] Originally by: Khamelean Quoting part sentences out of context in order to increase the effect of what your trying to say is at best juvenile, at worst, plain dishonest. Oh please, go read it and tell me if it sounds better then i quoted it? No really...don't be lazy.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:59:00 - [522] Edited by: Republica Winder on 23/06/2011 00:59:52 At this point, CCP is going to need to merge with two other scumbag industry hated publishers with histories of producing crap and screwing customers over to survive. They also have had more success with RMT than CCP. SOE+Craptic+CCP The new company will be called: Sony Craptic Control Productions SCCP
Nilania Telshua Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:59:00 - [523] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen GASP you found me out. My secret identity (CCP FANBOI) has been uncovered. Y'all are geniuses. I was waiting for someone to accuse me of that :) Here's a dirty little secret - everyone else who isn't ****ed at Incarna and posts in support of CCP is a fellow CCP alt. They just dont have the ballz to whistleblow like I do. Sooooo.....now that its out of the bag and my time is limited before CCP fires me for revealing my true identity, I will now host Q&A session until the moment of my banning from this thread and forum. Ask away, community, and I shall leak all our master plans!! (Limited time only....price is 1 plex per requested leak. You can contract all your plex, with your question or desired leaked document, to this toon) Reported for impersonating a CCP employee. Against the rules. Have my babies.
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 00:59:00 - [524] On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 [yellow]the hydrostatic capsule blog[/yellow
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:00:00 - [525] Originally by: Republica Winder At this point, CCP is going to need to merge with two other scumbag industry hated publishers with histories of producing crap and screwing customers over to survive. SOE+Craptic+CCP The new company will be called: Sony Craptic Control Productions SCCP But then they would start controlling my network protocols? ______________________________
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:00:00 - [526] Originally by: Mister Smithington FOR ALL THOSE CONTEMPLATING QUITTING myself included: Before you go, buyout every plex you can afford AND REDEEM THEM. Currently every unredeemed plex is a $15 loan to CCP. In other words, it's game time bought and payed for, but as of yet undelivered. I realize adding more game time to your account when you're trying to leave is counter-intuitive. But if you want to send a message about our opinions on the NeX and MT, nothing rings louder than opting for game time over vanity items. Force CCP to deliver the service that players have already payed for REDEEM YOUR DAMN PLEX! I've cancelled my sub, it runs out at the end of summer, I am considering turning all my wealth to plex and doing a big plex for good drive, at least I would have gotten something from my amassing the wealth of nations. Maybe I can buy a few people REAL glasses, they have to be cheaper than this crap. AG *** Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:00:00 - [527] Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 01:02:29 Originally by: Mister Smithington FOR ALL THOSE CONTEMPLATING QUITTING myself included: Before you go, buyout every plex you can afford AND REDEEM THEM. Currently every unredeemed plex is a $15 loan to CCP. In other words, it's game time bought and payed for, but as of yet undelivered. I realize adding more game time to your account when you're trying to leave is counter-intuitive. But if you want to send a message about our opinions on the NeX and MT, nothing rings louder than opting for game time over vanity items. Force CCP to deliver the service that players have already payed for REDEEM YOUR DAMN PLEX! I think he might be onto something... this'd drive plex prices higher as well... devaluing the rest of the in game economy... and making those who buy plex with $$'s at more of an advantage, emphasizing the Richboi gaining advantage over other players effect... while players who use plex to fund their accounts... become unable to afford plex because of the inflated prices and thus cancel subs... edit: could bring down the eve economy if enough people do it... -------
Thomas Turnpoint	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:00:00 - [528] I'll admit to being quite a bit frustrated by this mess, but I can't say that I haven't seen it before. The common pattern now days, one that works, sadly, seems to be a simple roadmap. phase 1: create a game, get a loyal user base, get their faithfulness to the game entrenched by fixing bugs and given them features they request. phase 2: talk about the 'vision' for the game, and release some expansions that have features that people don't want but can ignore phase 3: ignore bugs, and focus on new features designed to grab the shiny attention of "casual gamers" and "the WoW crowd". phase 4: nerf the hell out of everything so that new players can log in and from day one feel like they own the place. Maybe they don't all follow that exact roadmap, but it seems to be a common thread. Start by getting hardcore loyal fans, then **** all over them by destroying the game to attract people who don't care what the game is about, so long as they get their shiny reward within 10minutes of gametime. This happened in Vanguard, it happened with Second Life (though it is not a game), and among other games, it appears to be happening to EVE. As much as I hate some of the things that happen in EVE (i.e. being on the wrong end of a gank), the fact is that I came back to EVE because it was different, and appeared to be bucking that trend of WoWification. It must work really well as a business practice, because game after game after game is following the same path. Just really sad to see EVE follow them over the cliff. PS: no, you can't have my stuff, I gave it away already :P
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:00:00 - [529] Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. It'd be awesome if you're right... somehow I doubt it _________________________________________________
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:01:00 - [530] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Republica Winder At this point, CCP is going to need to merge with two other scumbag industry hated publishers with histories of producing crap and screwing customers over to survive. SOE+Craptic+CCP The new company will be called: Sony Craptic Control Productions SCCP But then they would start controlling my network protocols? Yes, for $60 a pop.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:01:00 - [531] Originally by: Apollo Gabriel Originally by: Mister Smithington FOR ALL THOSE CONTEMPLATING QUITTING myself included: Before you go, buyout every plex you can afford AND REDEEM THEM. Currently every unredeemed plex is a $15 loan to CCP. In other words, it's game time bought and payed for, but as of yet undelivered. I realize adding more game time to your account when you're trying to leave is counter-intuitive. But if you want to send a message about our opinions on the NeX and MT, nothing rings louder than opting for game time over vanity items. Force CCP to deliver the service that players have already payed for REDEEM YOUR DAMN PLEX! I've cancelled my sub, it runs out at the end of summer, I am considering turning all my wealth to plex and doing a big plex for good drive, at least I would have gotten something from my amassing the wealth of nations. Maybe I can buy a few people REAL glasses, they have to be cheaper than this crap. AG I plan on going on a GANK FEST on NEW PLAYERS. All 20 BILLION ISK WORTH OF PAIN ON THEM.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:01:00 - [532] On a glass-half-full note, has anyone considered that a MT model might make it cheaper to maintain alts? Pay the sub fee for your main, skill up your alts to meet a specific goal, and then maintain the alts on free2play/MTs instead of paying a full sub fee or PLEX for each. It would be an interesting option if CCP pursued it, but somehow I think CCP would lose money on the deal. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:02:00 - [533] Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. I know you wish it was fake, alot of us do, but tbh, at this point, very unlikly.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:02:00 - [534] Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. Even if the writing does appear suspicious, that doesn't change the confirmations by the CSM members, nor the fact that CCP hasn't yet come in and denied it. If this were false, there would be absolutely no reason not to deny it, even if they were planning to do something exactly like it in the future anyway.
Kallehd Norse'Storm Battle Group Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:03:00 - [535] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 00:50:20 At CCP's current store prices, I could buy a real spaceship. Why would I buy a pretend thing?
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:03:00 - [536] Yeah, let's stay focussed here, and not derail on whether some idiot thinks CCP FANBOI is a real dev. We're talking about documents revealing some truly disturbing intentions on the part of CCP, in which they announe MT practices for things other than cosmetic changes -- something they promised never to do! I, for one, find this a VERY serious matter. --
I Love Boobies Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:03:00 - [537] Edited by: I Love Boobies on 23/06/2011 01:05:02 For those doubting the authenticity of this .pdf, ask yourself this. Why hasn't CCP chimed in, or made a release, that this is not a real internal document? You would think if something like this came to light, and wasn't real, they would be posting dev blogs and everything else denying it was real, especially with the crap load of negative publicity they are getting at the moment.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:03:00 - [538] Originally by: Lord Cath Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. It'd be awesome if you're right... somehow I doubt it How does this not fit in with the outrageous statement by a CCP manager some months back about "data not supporting" that (paraphrasing) making quality additions to the game leads to sales? And them basically telling us to wait 18 months for them to fix Dominion's problems? It's consistent.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:04:00 - [539] Originally by: Ranka Mei Yeah, let's stay focussed here, and not derail on whether some idiot thinks CCP FANBOI is a real dev. We're talking about documents revealing some truly disturbing intentions on the part of CCP, in which they announe MT practices for things other than cosmetic changes -- something they promised never to do! I, for one, find this a VERY serious matter. The crappy part though -- if the philosophy is being this engrained into the company that there is an entire newsletter about it, is there even a chance to recover the EVE dream that was? ______________________________
Bizazedo Caldari No Trademark	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:04:00 - [540] Unacceptable. If I wanted this, I'd be playing a Zynga game.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:05:00 - [541] Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. Thank you for actually using your brain and some critical thinking skills when examining this hilarious document. I salute you o7 Not to mention that the article specifically describes Incarna implemented items as going to be cheap and disposeable, creating an infinite plex and thus $$$ sink OH WAIT. Turns out you cant blow up avatar clothes unless in your ship cargohold (you're an idiot if you do this) and the prices are in no way cheap.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:05:00 - [542] I have 112days remaining. Trolls are leaving the ship people :)
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:05:00 - [543] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. Even if the writing does appear suspicious, that doesn't change the confirmations by the CSM members, nor the fact that CCP hasn't yet come in and denied it. If this were false, there would be absolutely no reason not to deny it, even if they were planning to do something exactly like it in the future anyway. The CSM saw a similar document, on a desk - they didnt read it or have it in hand to confirm it. CCP rarely dive straight in to these flames (if ever). Perhaps I'm wrong. Let's hope I'm not. C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 [yellow]the hydrostatic capsule blog[/yellow
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:07:00 - [544] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 01:08:46 Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. Thank you for actually using your brain and some critical thinking skills when examining this hilarious document. I salute you o7 Not to mention that the article specifically describes Incarna implemented items as going to be cheap and disposeable, creating an infinite plex and thus $$$ sink OH WAIT. Turns out you cant blow up avatar clothes unless in your ship cargohold (you're an idiot if you do this) and the prices are in no way cheap. This document is from May, and if you actually followed the newsbits (dev postings, hints, interviews, AT9), it was supposed to be destructible when podded. Man, do your homework at least before trolling yes? EDIT: oh and btw if you don't make them destructible, you have to up the price, or you saturate the market too fast. And even that is mentioned in the document. Yes, they really thought about all this for some time.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:07:00 - [545] Originally by: Cailais CCP rarely dive straight in to these flames (if ever). Saying that this document is fake wouldn't pose any risk; if anything, it'd quell the flames. The forum flames are only dangerous if interaction would add fuel.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:08:00 - [546] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:08:25 This is their intentions, not all may be implemented, it depends on the reactions. They will implement what they can get away with. That is the game plan. I will say again, once trolls leave the ship. WORRY. PS: I have 112 days remaining.
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:08:00 - [547] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Thank you for actually using your brain and some critical thinking skills when examining this hilarious document. I salute you o7 stop being an arrogant twit. Most of us here are just really concerned people with a lot of love for this game... _________________________________________________
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:08:00 - [548] topics getting alot of views, i think there are alot of people keeping an eye on this thread
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:08:00 - [549] http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534830 everyone get in this thread and sign it now :)
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:09:00 - [550] Originally by: Miilla This is their intentions, not all may be implemented, it depends on the reactions. They will implement what they can get away with. That is the game plan. Given how they threw out the insane $99 developer license and then backpedaled, as well as other recent changes, that seems to be the entirety of their business plan: "Do the worst thing possible, packpedal until the rage calms down to acceptable levels". ______________________________
Anoobis Aivoras	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:09:00 - [551] Originally by: Dante024781 Edited by: Dante024781 on 23/06/2011 00:52:51 Originally by: stoicfaux Subs are Barriers. MTs are a risk-free gateway drug. Subscriptions are nice, but given how many other MMOs are out there, a subscription could be seen as a barrier to entry for new players. People will easily pay a sub fee for big names like SWTOR without hesitation, but for a "no-name" brand like WiS or DUST, a sub fee is too much of a commitment for an unknown. I subscribed to a no name MMO called EVE based on the free 15 day trial. If CCP are planing on moving to MT payment model for EVE that's fine, It's their game they can do what they want with it. But they will do it without me as a customer. Originally by: Tla Atij EVE IS ~~FOREVER~~ until you allow shield/armor/damage bonuses for euros and dollars. Sorry. Lazy. I was happy to pay subs once I'd seen how Eve was set up, boosting isk with plex is ok, ish. But to sell further advantages? No, if I wanted to compete with wallet warriors I'd go back to Dark Orbit. Hope it's not time to look for a new game, I liked this one. If it's real, oh well. Game Over. If it's fake, could be released to test the water... who knows. Can't beat a beer and a conspiracy theory.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:09:00 - [552] Originally by: Bizazedo Unacceptable. If I wanted this, I'd be playing a Zynga game. Ok, I am revising my idea of merging CCP with SOE and Craptic... That wouldn't be the ultimate combination of evil "F-the customer" publisher... Sony Craptic Control ProductionZ SCCPZ
Mag'nal	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:09:00 - [553] I loved how they used the Korean game market as their basis on whether or not MT and/or F2P-P2W games work. Cause I'm pretty sure, at least here in the US, Korean games don't last but for a handful of months. --------------------------------- It's all in your head. You're living a lie. There is nothing money can't buy.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:10:00 - [554] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Ranka Mei Yeah, let's stay focussed here, and not derail on whether some idiot thinks CCP FANBOI is a real dev. We're talking about documents revealing some truly disturbing intentions on the part of CCP, in which they announe MT practices for things other than cosmetic changes -- something they promised never to do! I, for one, find this a VERY serious matter. The crappy part though -- if the philosophy is being this engrained into the company that there is an entire newsletter about it, is there even a chance to recover the EVE dream that was? You know, I'm all for Barbie In Space, and going to a virtual mall and play dress-up and such. And all in good fun. But buyimg faction standing and such? No effing way we should put up with that! That's a deal-breaker for me, on a very deep level. --
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:10:00 - [555] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. Thank you for actually using your brain and some critical thinking skills when examining this hilarious document. I salute you o7 Not to mention that the article specifically describes Incarna implemented items as going to be cheap and disposeable, creating an infinite plex and thus $$$ sink OH WAIT. Turns out you cant blow up avatar clothes unless in your ship cargohold (you're an idiot if you do this) and the prices are in no way cheap. This document is from May, and if you actually followed the blogs, it was supposed to be destructible when podded. Man, do your homework at least before trolling yes? True. But why have those stupid images next to the DUST article. Why not use a DUST image? C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 [yellow]the hydrostatic capsule blog[/yellow
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:10:00 - [556] Originally by: Mag'nal I loved how they used the Korean game market as their basis on whether or not MT and/or F2P-P2W games work. Cause I'm pretty sure, at least here in the US, Korean games don't last but for a handful of months. think that goes for anywhere outside of Korea _________________________________________________
Siigari Kitawa Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:11:00 - [557] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Given how they threw out the insane $99 developer license and then backpedaled, as well as other recent changes, that seems to be the entirety of their business plan: "Do the worst thing possible, packpedal until the rage calms down to acceptable levels". So, CCP said they were not doing with the $99 dev license for API AFTER they said it was going to be? www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:11:00 - [558] Originally by: Anoobis Aivoras If it's real, oh well. Game Over. Pretty much the opinion of every EVE player I know. vOv
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:11:00 - [559] Post a link to this thread wherever you can in EVE. The more players who see this and post, the better!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:12:00 - [560] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:12:05 Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Given how they threw out the insane $99 developer license and then backpedaled, as well as other recent changes, that seems to be the entirety of their business plan: "Do the worst thing possible, packpedal until the rage calms down to acceptable levels". So, CCP said they were not doing with the $99 dev license for API AFTER they said it was going to be? I have suspended my Apps and SDK work as CCP are now too risky to develop for, constant lies, backpeddling. General mistrust. Not worth the risk even if it is now free.
Nilania Telshua Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:12:00 - [561] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Cailais CCP rarely dive straight in to these flames (if ever). Saying that this document is fake wouldn't pose any risk; if anything, it'd quell the flames. The forum flames are only dangerous if interaction would add fuel. You are right, but only in the case that this document is a fake. In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise...
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:12:00 - [562] Originally by: Judicator Saturnius Originally by: Anoobis Aivoras If it's real, oh well. Game Over. Pretty much the opinion of every EVE player I know. Time to get those amongst us together who can pull it off and start writing an EVE Emulator server. So we can have Pre-Dominion EVE.
Not-Apsalar	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:14:00 - [563] Originally by: Miilla I have 112days remaining. Trolls are leaving the ship people :) l 1) You're annoying 2) No one cares how many days you have left. You don't need to say it in every post
William Walker Amarr House Aratus Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:15:00 - [564] Microtransactions? More like *macrotransactions*. ________________________________________________
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:15:00 - [565] Originally by: Nilania Telshua You are right, but only in the case that this document is a fake. In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise... Yes, that's my point. They could safely deny it if it weren't real. Denying it would only be dangerous if it WERE real.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:15:00 - [566] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:16:12 Originally by: William Walker Microtransactions? More like *macrotransactions*. Micro-transactions, for LARGE values of Micro. Seriously, at the prices CCP charge in the NEX store, you could pop down to NASA and buy some ex Apollo hardware, maybe even cheaper from the Russians.
Mag'nal	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:17:00 - [567] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Nilania Telshua You are right, but only in the case that this document is a fake. In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise... Yes, that's my point. They could safely deny it if it weren't real. Denying it would only be dangerous if it WERE real. I think it's safe to say that we can call out CCP Soundwave with the general question of "WTF?!" CCP, there's a hole in your foot, blood on the floor and a smoking gun. Just come out an admit ya shot yourself in the foot already. SHEESH --------------------------------- It's all in your head. You're living a lie. There is nothing money can't buy.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:17:00 - [568] Originally by: Cailais Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Cailais On re reading this document I think it may well be a fake, a carefully edited one. The same style and syntax appears throughout - despite having differing authors for example - "In short, itÆs the same in Incarna as elsewhere:..." "That is actually not a bad definition for us:..." "One such convention is of special importance to us:..." Now you might expect a similar stylistic approach for any document created for an internal business audience but it just feels 'off' somehow. C. Thank you for actually using your brain and some critical thinking skills when examining this hilarious document. I salute you o7 Not to mention that the article specifically describes Incarna implemented items as going to be cheap and disposeable, creating an infinite plex and thus $$$ sink OH WAIT. Turns out you cant blow up avatar clothes unless in your ship cargohold (you're an idiot if you do this) and the prices are in no way cheap. This document is from May, and if you actually followed the blogs, it was supposed to be destructible when podded. Man, do your homework at least before trolling yes? True. But why have those stupid images next to the DUST article. Why not use a DUST image? C. Common, i don't know where you work (not trolling here), but have you ever been involved in this kind of internal newsletters? Its not that strikt a matter, its for internal use only. Pictures get used, jokes are made, things that only insiders get. Sure, if the company is really big (CCP has 600ppl in 3-4 countries) then you refine it a bit (like making it magazin-style instead of cheap html-mail), but its still for internal use only. The picture doesn't matter AT ALL, you use what you can find.
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:18:00 - [569] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ***heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. I for one believe it's real, and I'm done. My monthly, paid, non-gtc/PLEX accounts running since 2006 (except for a couple-month lapse due to a death in the family) are cancelled. I've never actively canceled an MMO account, either, so it's not a flounce. However, the news leaking from inside suggests that CCP aren't looking at account cancellations as a meaningful metric here. It's all about the PLEX and MT. I'm not going to stop posting though, at least until the bans for disagreeing with this NGE start flying. The game's not* horrible. I like the station idea and immersion, but real money for in-game benefit? Ships and ammo, bypassing the player economy? Payments for gaining sov? Selling faction standings? Yeah, that pretty much kills what was once Eve. And no, you can't have my stuff. Barring some drastic change, I'll likely liquidate assets and characters, then give the proceeds to something like PLEX For Good, though not until the market settles out - so one more account activation per account at some future point unless the market settles before my current months expire. I'm also not biomassing. I like Eve, and I want to stay in the sandbox if this slide down the MT slippery slope changes. I reserve the right to reactivate if the real-money-for-ingame-benefit goes away, because I enjoy Eve. The sad thing is that it looks like the entirety of PLEX for Good collected for Japan would buy just 743 monocles.
XIRUSPHERE Gallente The 8th Order Mean Coalition	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:18:00 - [570] Keep taking the p.iss out of em, it's unfortunate the player base cannot demand an audit of the company as a whole. Id rather watch this place go up in flames then sit by idly while market interest say screw your benefactor.
Barakkus	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:19:00 - [571] Originally by: Ranka Mei You know, I'm all for Barbie In Space, and going to a virtual mall and play dress-up and such. And all in good fun. But buyimg faction standing and such? No effing way we should put up with that! That's a deal-breaker for me, on a very deep level. This in a nutshell. I don't give a **** if the boots and monocles cost like $800 or whatever...as long as regular game mechanics can't be bought, then I don't care. - [SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:20:00 - [572] Originally by: Nilania Telshua In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise... So one more time, what is so terrible about this news letter?
AkJon Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:20:00 - [573] Sorry if it's been pointed out already but I liked this bit from the editor's spiel at the beginning: "See this issue's virtual goods sales argument on monetization versus design integrity on page 6." Soundwave came down on the monetization side. Integrity was on the other side.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:20:00 - [574] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:21:10 So, who wants to play Eve? Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? Me, I kinda feel sick of it and not wanting to bother with the game atm.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:22:00 - [575] Originally by: Hesperius Originally by: Nilania Telshua In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise... So one more time, what is so terrible about this news letter? The idea that someone, in the future, might destroy my ship because they paid $50 for turrets with 10% extra damage.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:22:00 - [576] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:21:10 So, who wants to play Eve? Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? Me, I kinda feel sick of it and not wanting to bother with the game atm. Sorta refreshing and not playing. Saw your edit for larger text too
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:23:00 - [577] Originally by: Caladan Broood Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:21:10 So, who wants to play Eve? Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? Me, I kinda feel sick of it and not wanting to bother with the game atm. Sorta refreshing and not playing. Saw your edit for larger text too I also kinda needed more bandwidth for the forum :) I even disabled pictures for faster loading :) lol
Le Sabre Gallente Forced aggressions Lawful Insanity	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:24:00 - [578] I don't like mt's in any online game even if its free to play, its worse when we already pay a sub per acc in the first place. If that pdf or its content is genuine then my acc's will be unsubbed along with the many other loyal eve player acc's. Seriously CCP, this is Eve not the endless bloody 'Sim's' expansions. Listen to the guys that have kept your company profitable during one of, if not 'the' worst recession ever to hit modern society, if you sell out today then you'll be sold off tomorrow.
Grog Barrel	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:24:00 - [579] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Miilla This is their intentions, not all may be implemented, it depends on the reactions. They will implement what they can get away with. That is the game plan. Given how they threw out the insane $99 developer license and then backpedaled, as well as other recent changes, that seems to be the entirety of their business plan: "Do the worst thing possible, packpedal until the rage calms down to acceptable levels". Elasticity. Isn't it wonderful?
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:24:00 - [580] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:21:10 So, who wants to play Eve? Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? Me, I kinda feel sick of it and not wanting to bother with the game atm. yeah i'm not.... just waiting on ccp to come clean with its customers (us)... -------
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:24:00 - [581] Originally by: Miilla Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? I'm not logged in. Incarna has nothing for me. The forums on the other hand? Fire pretty.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:25:00 - [582] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Given how they threw out the insane $99 developer license and then backpedaled, as well as other recent changes, that seems to be the entirety of their business plan: "Do the worst thing possible, packpedal until the rage calms down to acceptable levels". So, CCP said they were not doing with the $99 dev license for API AFTER they said it was going to be? Sorry, I thought this was public. There are rumors this will be revised / backpedaled, but I guess CCP decided not to fix that blunder until after they made these as well? ______________________________
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:25:00 - [583] Originally by: AkJon Ferguson Sorry if it's been pointed out already but I liked this bit from the editor's spiel at the beginning: "See this issue's virtual goods sales argument on monetization versus design integrity on page 6." Soundwave came down on the monetization side. Integrity was on the other side. So the Associate Game Designer chooses monetization over design integrity... just great.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:26:00 - [584] Originally by: XIRUSPHERE Keep taking the p.iss out of em, it's unfortunate the player base cannot demand an audit of the company as a whole. Id rather watch this place go up in flames then sit by idly while market interest say screw your benefactor. Then the CSM should demand a clarification. Because if ft's real, then, indeed, it's Game Over. Pure & Simple. --
Cosmoes Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:27:00 - [585] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:21:10 So, who wants to play Eve? Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? Me, I kinda feel sick of it and not wanting to bother with the game atm. Me, not logging in just refreshing this thread while I cancel my accounts. Gonna study for exam in meantime. Probably try out perpetuum or maybe talk to my friends who've been trying to drag me into WoW for a long time. At least until Skyrim comes out. ------------------- piccy
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:27:00 - [586] How is the Icelandic economy doing CCP? Is it doing that well that you can do big gambles and potentially lose?
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:27:00 - [587] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 01:28:45 Originally by: Hesperius Originally by: Nilania Telshua In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise... So one more time, what is so terrible about this news letter? If you need us to explain it for you , then i congratulate you, as you will be truly happy with everything CCP will do to the EVE franchise. Good for you, have fun. But forgive me (and others) who we are unwilling to let go so easely on a hobby that worked perfectly fine (it even grew) for 8 years. They want to experiment? WOD is that way...they can test it there, make MT-heaven out of it.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:28:00 - [588] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:21:10 So, who wants to play Eve? Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate? Me, I kinda feel sick of it and not wanting to bother with the game atm. Uninstalled on my primary pc, keeping a copy on the laptop to biomass when the time is right. vOv
DickbeardThePirate Gallente Broski Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:28:00 - [589] Y'know what this reminds me of www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBPYdgy35KA at 2:15
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:28:00 - [590] They are.. they just want you to pay for development for it with MT.
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:29:00 - [591] Originally by: Hesperius Originally by: Nilania Telshua In any other case denying the existence of a document distributed between 500 employees in open circulations would be... unwise... So one more time, what is so terrible about this news letter? It's been pointed out to you over and over. Buying advantage by paying to manipulate game mechanics and bypass the player-run economy will destroy that economy, through direct damage and by making the industrialists that keep things going leave. Are you willfully ignoring this? Vanity items only are mostly meaningless, except that making the real-money items immune to destruction/drop is a slippery slope as well.
Kueijin Legion Caldari Perkone	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:29:00 - [592] So if a lame ass looking monocle is going for as high as it is, and they plan to sell ammo and other useful items just WTH are they gonna charge? They really hired an economist to help them and come out with crap like this? What did they get the elcheapo economist that had zero experience with MMOs? I quit WoW after playing for six years because the devs currently in charge are such obnoxious asshats. I put a lot of time into my characters over those six years and I never thought I would quit WoW until Blizz closed the servers down. Just goes to show what happens when game companies refuse to listen to their customers while acting like condescending and rude little elitists. I've spent years playing EVE as well, but crap like this makes me wonder if I'll stick around EVE let alone the WoD MMO which before now I was anxiously awaiting. EVE is a niche game as will the WoD one be. Alienating your loyal fanbase that stuck with you for all these years just as you are risking a lot on multiple ventures simultaneously is a pretty boneheaded decision IMO. CCP learn from the mistakes of previous MMOs. NGE crippled SWG because the devs didn't listen to their players. Cataclysm has driven away more players from WoW than running ICC for a year did because the Blizz devs didn't listen. Noticing a trend here? When devs think they know what's better for players than the players do or just don't give a ** and go for the money grab game quality be damned lots of players get ed and leave. EVE players are a pretty no BS bunch. If you ** up they're gonna call you on it. Ignore them at your own risk CCP.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:31:00 - [593] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 01:33:27 How dependant on EVE is CCP? From that document, EVE is EXTREMELY VERY dependant on it. At what levels of cancellations will it affect them financially? Will it make WoD unfeasible? Dust die? We know that Dust is soon to be released, how about WoD? Can our cancellations affect that hard? Where is that red line?
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:32:00 - [594] Originally by: Kueijin Legion Alienating your loyal fanbase that stuck with you for all these years just as you are risking a lot on multiple ventures simultaneously is a pretty boneheaded decision IMO. [...] EVE players are a pretty no BS bunch. If you **** up they're gonna call you on it. Ignore them at your own risk CCP. What he said. "FEARLESS" could be "bankrupt" too.
Monstress	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:33:00 - [595] Originally by: Kueijin Legion So if a lame ass looking monocle is going for as high as it is, and they plan to sell ammo and other useful items just WTH are they gonna charge? They really hired an economist to help them and come out with crap like this? What did they get the elcheapo economist that had zero experience with MMOs? The issue with selling ammo, ships or similar is not the price, it's that it foregoes the industry process and eliminates the player economy.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:34:00 - [596] Originally by: Miilla How dependant on EVE is CCP? At what levels of cancellations will it affect them financially? Will it make WoD unfeasible? Dust die? Where is that red line? Tbh, if things go sour, they will try to licence "Carbon" out to get WoD rolling. Dust would just become a nobrain-shooter on the PS3 without EVE connection, maybe selling enough copies to get half dev-costs back in. CCP could survive, if WoD is on track, which i doubt at this point (read the last page, where they state a few times that for now there is no gamedesign in place).
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:36:00 - [597] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Miilla How dependant on EVE is CCP? At what levels of cancellations will it affect them financially? Will it make WoD unfeasible? Dust die? Where is that red line? Tbh, if things go sour, they will try to licence "Carbon" out to get WoD rolling. Dust would just become a nobrain-shooter on the PS3 without EVE connection, maybe selling enough copies to get half dev-costs back in. CCP could survive, if WoD is on track, which i doubt at this point (read the last page, where they state a few times that for now there is no gamedesign in place). WoD has no gamedesign? Sounds like it hasn't started yet lol In short, Carbon offers what over competitors? They would have to compete on price, something which we know CCP cannot do. I think they would go under.
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:37:00 - [598] Indeed... fearless.... kind of an ironic title for their internal newsletter... Fearless: Bold, Brave, Intrepid But there's a fine line between bravery and stupidity... best not take risks with your "golden goose" now ccp... delete this Aurum and NeX store from the game and be done with this nonsense. -------
AkJon Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:37:00 - [599] I also liked this bit from the editor: "However as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for future revenue -- revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer..." Someone remind me how that goose story ends? Doesn't the farmer redeem a few plex and buy an overpriced axe from the noble exchange or something?
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:37:00 - [600] Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Indeed... fearless.... kind of an ironic title for their internal newsletter... Fearless: Bold, Brave, Intrepid But there's a fine line between bravery and stupidity... best not take risks with your "golden goose" now ccp... delete this Aurum and NeX store from the game and be done with this nonsense. The more accurate word is Hubris.
Jehvan Sunburnadire The Forgotten Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:38:00 - [601] Honestly, I'm not at all surprised. I used to work at last.fm; we made changes that went against the user base, and the general consensus within the company usually was 'OH, they'll whine, but no-one will cancel their subscription. And **** those who do, they don't deserve to be here.' So yeah... the contents of that internal newsletter just fit in so perfectly with the kind of biz-dev plan that brought us the $99 api licensing, and the aurum store and all that good stuff. I think I'd be more surprised if it turned out to be fake. I'll keep my account around until they start implementing this stuff - for me, the game is currently still fun, and I see no reason to rage quit right now. When it changes though, that'll be ú40+/mo in my pocket that I can spend on another hobby instead. The key thing that most biz-dev and creatives miss when coming up with these 'good ideas', is that customers do actually possess free-will to choose where their cash goes. It'll certainly be interesting to watch CCP's death-by-1000-cuts scheme take place though!
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:41:00 - [602] Bumpity bump bump
Zedrik Cayne Gallente Standards and Practices	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:42:00 - [603] Well...I've done it: I've pulled the Trigger. It has been a hell of a ride. Got less than sixty days left. If the boat doesn't turn around by then. And before anyone asks before reading it all...No, you can't have my stuff. -- Originally by: "RedSplat" You're the internet equivalent of a Deepfried Mars bar filled with stupid.
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:43:00 - [604] CCP's silence on the matter is just making things worse. I really love this game, but I pay a SUBSCRIPTION so I don't have to deal with all that MT crap.
Katrina Cortez	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:44:00 - [605] Edited by: Katrina Cortez on 23/06/2011 01:46:19 Well I for one plan on spending my money elsewhere. I buy cash shop stuff on occassion in other games so the MT really doesnt bother me. CCPs attitude does however. PS - looks like Eve lost another player and potentially his app too. :( Sad days ahead for Eve I'm afraid
Pace eGuerra	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:44:00 - [606] An interesting read. Based on my own experiences with EVE players I'd say we play EVE to get away from life, not to extend it. You, dear CCP, trade in TRUST. We, up until now, have trusted you to maintain our world of escape. If you turn our world into yet another place where we are encouraged or enticed or chased to part with money for items that we don't care about you'll turn us off big time. I (and all of the players I know) do not play EVE to gain some level of validation. Most of us have extremely validating careers and lifestyles. In fact, many of us are working in industries that are typically populated with exactly the type of people who turn their back on that sort of "buy your self esteem" crap. Just take a look at the average EVE player (fan fest, EVE TV, etc. etc.). We are not into vanity items. We're actually quite happy with a black t-shirt and a pair of jeans. Ok, we might have a nice watch, car, house and some super hot gaming PC and a lovely woman on our arm but generally we're not your average sheep-like consumer who wants to look like they just dropped out of Second Life. For us there is no rush in owning a virtual leather jacket and I doubt many of us would want an RL equivalent. The rush comes from making that perfect intercept, or devising a strategy that manages to take out that annoying Drake gang, or predicting a rush on a given mineral and making a mint out of the market. It's about taking out that POS, seeing your Corp name on a station or watching your alliance colours spread through the influence map. It has bugger all to do with anything but getting away from life, having a beer, swapping crude jokes on TS and blowing **** up. And we do this in the rough, unforgiving universe that is EVE. We won't buy into vanity items so don't bother please.
Vyktor Abyss The Abyss Corporation	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:44:00 - [607] Helicity banned apparently for linking this... CCP appear to be on full damage control... Whoever the "clever" marketing/PR guy was who thought it clever to use Gordan Ghecko's "Greed is Good!" will undoubtably be the first out the door, but definately not the last as this may just be the final nail in the coffin of Eve after Incarna. I've been 'playing' Eve for the last year via PLEX anyway so if I get banned for this well shucks, I'll be in good company. Ciao. Time to wake up and try X3. I hear its a fun spaceship game. o/
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:45:00 - [608] Originally by: Zedrik Cayne Well...I've done it: I've pulled the Trigger. It has been a hell of a ride. Got less than sixty days left. If the boat doesn't turn around by then. And before anyone asks before reading it all...No, you can't have my stuff. So ends another legend of what we once called EVE. o7 Hope to read of your exploits in another mmo.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:46:00 - [609] Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer CCP's silence on the matter is just making things worse. Assuming it's true, what can they even say? I mean, really? Any spin will be seen as an attempt at spin. Any "confession" will be spread around just the same and touted as doomsday evidence. Their best bet right now is probably to let us burn ourselves out and then once things have calmed down post something along the lines of "Hey guys yeah things are changing give it time it's going to be great we swear we'll be careful we're looking into things just looking".
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:47:00 - [610] I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:47:00 - [611] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Originally by: Zedrik Cayne Well...I've done it: I've pulled the Trigger. It has been a hell of a ride. Got less than sixty days left. If the boat doesn't turn around by then. And before anyone asks before reading it all...No, you can't have my stuff. So ends another legend of what we once called EVE. o7 Hope to read of your exploits in another mmo. I want to hear what Chribba and Wollari have to say about this...
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:50:00 - [612] Originally by: Vyktor Abyss Helicity banned apparently for linking this... CCP appear to be on full damage control... Whoever the "clever" marketing/PR guy was who thought it clever to use Gordan Ghecko's "Greed is Good!" will undoubtably be the first out the door, but definately not the last as this may just be the final nail in the coffin of Eve after Incarna. I've been 'playing' Eve for the last year via PLEX anyway so if I get banned for this well shucks, I'll be in good company. Ciao. Time to wake up and try X3. I hear its a fun spaceship game. o/ They have to ban me an quite a few others right along with you, lets see how many of us are still posting tomorrow.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:50:00 - [613] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer CCP's silence on the matter is just making things worse. Assuming it's true, what can they even say? I mean, really? Any spin will be seen as an attempt at spin. Any "confession" will be spread around just the same and touted as doomsday evidence. Their best bet right now is probably to let us burn ourselves out and then once things have calmed down post something along the lines of "Hey guys yeah things are changing give it time it's going to be great we swear we'll be careful we're looking into things just looking". I don't think a soft sell is going to cut it after that leak. They would need a full-on hell-purge the likes of wich would make the most seasoned coalition leader blush, followed by an about-face set of dev-blogs and a follow-up content patch dedicated solely to spaceship content that's languished for years. vOv
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:50:00 - [614] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Originally by: Zedrik Cayne Well...I've done it: I've pulled the Trigger. It has been a hell of a ride. Got less than sixty days left. If the boat doesn't turn around by then. And before anyone asks before reading it all...No, you can't have my stuff. So ends another legend of what we once called EVE. o7 Hope to read of your exploits in another mmo. I want to hear what Chribba and Wollari have to say about this... Chribba since his last post was very angry, wonder if he will post here again at all for a while. ---Archipelago Theory---
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:50:00 - [615] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer CCP's silence on the matter is just making things worse. Assuming it's true, what can they even say? I mean, really? Any spin will be seen as an attempt at spin. Any "confession" will be spread around just the same and touted as doomsday evidence. Their best bet right now is probably to let us burn ourselves out and then once things have calmed down post something along the lines of "Hey guys yeah things are changing give it time it's going to be great we swear we'll be careful we're looking into things just looking". As I have said, there is only one thing they can say that will deflect any of the damage they've created with Incarna: "We realize now this was a bad idea, we are eliminating Aurum, the cash shop and refunding all purchases. In addition, we will be seeding the market with blueprints for all the cash shop items. We promise to never explore this road in EVE again"
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:51:00 - [616] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading. I would be surprised if anyone gets fired. This is part of CCP's core goal right now, you would have to remove all of management and reorganize the company completely to purge this. ______________________________
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:52:00 - [617] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading. I would be surprised if anyone gets fired. This is part of CCP's core goal right now, you would have to remove all of management and reorganize the company completely to purge this. I'm thinking that would be nice if not totally feasible....
Baraka Saibot	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:52:00 - [618] This mess sorta reminds me of Company of Heroes : Online it was developed over the regular Company of Heroes, but aimed for the Chinese market. They added RPG elements and items to it and just making all the abilities from the original game ridiculously strong once you reached higher levels. The game was so unbalanced and completely unfair from the original if you played an opponent with higher level than you. So of course you wanted to reach those as fast as possible. Seems like they just used their time not working on gameplay or balance, but instead nifty and cool new items, features and a new interface for the lobby. It was free to play, but with micro-transactions for the special items that would give certain units a certain bonus, special "hero" units etc. that would decay as you used them. So you would need points to replenish these items, these points were either bought or you would gain some after each match. You could also buy special items that would give you more XP, more points gained per match to replenish your items and so fourth. But - They tried to launch it in the Western world. It never got out of Beta before it was canned, maybe because their policy was to make such a unbalanced. Maybe because nobody ever really bought any of those, actually not required play, real money items. I believe the game still runs in China.
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:53:00 - [619] Edited by: Patient 2428190 on 23/06/2011 01:56:20 Their PR engine is just as terrible to their staff as it is to their customers. Ouch. Edit: I almost want to make a thread to point to everybody who thought the World of Darkness was going to be dark and edgy.. by linking the picture of chick in a tophat. Welcome to Twilight. ...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:53:00 - [620] Originally by: Pace eGuerra An interesting read. Based on my own experiences with EVE players I'd say we play EVE to get away from life, not to extend it. You, dear CCP, trade in TRUST. We, up until now, have trusted you to maintain our world of escape. If you turn our world into yet another place where we are encouraged or enticed or chased to part with money for items that we don't care about you'll turn us off big time. I (and all of the players I know) do not play EVE to gain some level of validation. Most of us have extremely validating careers and lifestyles. In fact, many of us are working in industries that are typically populated with exactly the type of people who turn their back on that sort of "buy your self esteem" crap. Just take a look at the average EVE player (fan fest, EVE TV, etc. etc.). We are not into vanity items. We're actually quite happy with a black t-shirt and a pair of jeans. Ok, we might have a nice watch, car, house and some super hot gaming PC and a lovely woman on our arm but generally we're not your average sheep-like consumer who wants to look like they just dropped out of Second Life. For us there is no rush in owning a virtual leather jacket and I doubt many of us would want an RL equivalent. The rush comes from making that perfect intercept, or devising a strategy that manages to take out that annoying Drake gang, or predicting a rush on a given mineral and making a mint out of the market. It's about taking out that POS, seeing your Corp name on a station or watching your alliance colours spread through the influence map. It has bugger all to do with anything but getting away from life, having a beer, swapping crude jokes on TS and blowing **** up. And we do this in the rough, unforgiving universe that is EVE. We won't buy into vanity items so don't bother please. well said... structural engineer over here, making more money than any of the ccp devs, (if money's the language ccp are talking now). As soon as creative content is overtly monetized... its inherent quality diminishes... this is the case for everything. Eve will die if you go through with the plans in those documents... if not through players unsubscribing? then through the failure of the ingame market when industrialists are royally screwed over.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:53:00 - [621] I second that. The only way to go for them would be to tell ppl that EVE will stay EVE, basically the mechanic that worked for 8 years will stay. And Dust, well, we would have to see about that. If they need the money, than cut of the cord to sov-changes. Dust will still be fun, and if not, it wouldn't have lasted anyway. But DUST-MT influencing EVE? Common... And Hilmar would have to say it. But you wish. Its never that easy, and once you start something in a company, backpadeling is rarely something management does, its usually called "revising strategy", meaning "we will do it anyways, we just have to sell it better".
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:54:00 - [622] Very troubling. I begin to regret taking CCP on their recent resub promotion. A F2P game without the F part doesn't appeal to me at all. This may look like a great course for the smartest guys in the room over at CCP, but if they follow through with it, I doubt it'll end well. I'm not an expert or insider though. It just seems to me that CCP won't be able to add enough elements to EVE that will give it the mass market appeal it needs to overcome the "spreadsheets in space" stigma. That may be OK as long as they can squeeze their existing players for some extra cash without too many jumping ship, but it seems like they'd have a hard time weathering a substantial loss in subscriptions if the vets that are vehemently opposed to the destruction of the integrity of the game and sandbox start leaving in droves. It seems like a very risky strategy and one that will tear their remaining good will to shreds regardless of how successful it ends up being. I wonder what the time frame for all of this is. They did back down on the Ishukone Watch Scorpion and claimed to want to do it as a Scorpion + aurum exchange, and apparently that is still the plan. Eventually they'll have to stop stringing us along and say "deal with it." Do they think they can change our point of view with a clever release schedule and some good PR?
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:54:00 - [623] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading. I would be surprised if anyone gets fired. This is part of CCP's core goal right now, you would have to remove all of management and reorganize the company completely to purge this. If they stick to this no one will get fired. What will happen though is everyone who is against this (and I will repeat, this internal newsletter seems to me to be INTERNAL damage control, an attempt to sell THEIR STAFF on these changes) will LEAVE CCP and seek other jobs. In other words, CCP is about to lose the bulk of their talent (as SOE did after the NGE). The Devs left will be the ones who thinks the endgame is looting customer wallets, not 0.0 gameplay...
Algathas The Revenge of Auntie Freeze	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:54:00 - [624] Sadly lots of poor innocent kittens are being slaughtered by god.
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:57:00 - [625] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading. I would be surprised if anyone gets fired. This is part of CCP's core goal right now, you would have to remove all of management and reorganize the company completely to purge this. If they stick to this no one will get fired. What will happen though is everyone who is against this (and I will repeat, this internal newsletter seems to me to be INTERNAL damage control, an attempt to sell THEIR STAFF on these changes) will LEAVE CCP and seek other jobs. In other words, CCP is about to lose the bulk of their talent (as SOE did after the NGE). The Devs left will be the ones who thinks the endgame is looting customer wallets, not 0.0 gameplay... We also don't really know how many people have already left in recent years for this reason, and we just never heard about it. I can think of a few beloved CCP staffers who no longer work there off hand. ______________________________
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:57:00 - [626] goodnight my beloved eve-o rage thread. tommorow maybe youll allready be a threadnaut.
XIRUSPHERE Gallente The 8th Order Mean Coalition	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:57:00 - [627] Originally by: Vyktor Abyss Helicity banned apparently for linking this... CCP appear to be on full damage control... Whoever the "clever" marketing/PR guy was who thought it clever to use Gordan Ghecko's "Greed is Good!" will undoubtably be the first out the door, but definately not the last as this may just be the final nail in the coffin of Eve after Incarna. I've been 'playing' Eve for the last year via PLEX anyway so if I get banned for this well shucks, I'll be in good company. Ciao. Time to wake up and try X3. I hear its a fun spaceship game. o/ Would hate to see you go Vyktor, the biggest part of a lot of players staying with this game is the people they meet. X3 is a great game if you want to explore space and have some fun, don't forget to try some of the awesome mods out there too! o7
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:58:00 - [628] someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that?
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 01:59:00 - [629] Originally by: Erichan someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that? I don't see a post on eve-search, so this was probably not true. Chribba is never one to make such posts quickly or lightly. ______________________________
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:01:00 - [630] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading. I would be surprised if anyone gets fired. This is part of CCP's core goal right now, you would have to remove all of management and reorganize the company completely to purge this. If they stick to this no one will get fired. What will happen though is everyone who is against this (and I will repeat, this internal newsletter seems to me to be INTERNAL damage control, an attempt to sell THEIR STAFF on these changes) will LEAVE CCP and seek other jobs. In other words, CCP is about to lose the bulk of their talent (as SOE did after the NGE). The Devs left will be the ones who thinks the endgame is looting customer wallets, not 0.0 gameplay... We also don't really know how many people have already left in recent years for this reason, and we just never heard about it. I can think of a few beloved CCP staffers who no longer work there off hand. True. This current Dev team is a bunch of T20's.
Chiggy W	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:02:00 - [631] I'm also extremely impressed by the subtle hint CCP has given when disabling CQ. There's the door if you don't like it. I hope many of us use it.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:02:00 - [632] Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned.
Tarikan Minmatar Naughty 40	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:03:00 - [633] if this is true, then i will be thinking hard on leaving eve-o. i have liked...a bit of Incarna, the turrets. i know, nothing huge, but the turrets dazzle me, as for the CQ and the MT? i'm not a big fan of it... i await to see how big this thread gets to be tomorrow and if the Devs and GMs create a devblog or respond to this thread to confirm what we are all thinking.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:04:00 - [634] Yep, i missed a few faces on fanfest. But just look at the document, the "worst employee scores" are all about "not payed enough", "no training"... thats like killig of your young employees.
Wizard Yoko	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:04:00 - [635] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. If you're not careful you might provide more content than was included in Incarna. Don't want to make CCP look bad.
Verrer	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:04:00 - [636] as for those 2b sweepstakes=P im guessing post #1104 im hoping its the next one though.. and im hoping they will say its all a joke:(
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:04:00 - [637] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Erichan someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that? I don't see a post on eve-search, so this was probably not true. Chribba is never one to make such posts quickly or lightly. True. But he was very strong in objecting to the "hey let's profit off our dedicated players who have done stuff our inbred Devs couldn't to make our game better" scheme. I believe he will respond to this too. What I'd love to see Chribba do is announce he is terminating his websites and support for EVE until the cash shop is undone and CCP ENDS RMT in EVE. CCP could not survive the bad PR of a ****ed off Chribba.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:04:00 - [638] the irony of course is that who would want the isk if we're leaving also lol.
RiskyFrisky Interrobang Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:05:00 - [639] If this is true, you're lame CCP, very lame. I too will be quitting after a year and a few months of playing if this is true.
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:05:00 - [640] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. Very nice.
Thomas Turnpoint	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:06:00 - [641] The fact that they are willing to consider allowing users to purchase faction standings says a lot about the individuals running the company. They are willing to allow people to pay them for an advantage. That mindset does not generally going hand in hand with honesty and integrity, that's for sure.
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:06:00 - [642] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor I think the staff changes that might happen as a result of this will be telling regarding the direction CCP plans to take with this MT junk. If Soundwave is still in the higher echelons, then we know where they're heading. I would be surprised if anyone gets fired. This is part of CCP's core goal right now, you would have to remove all of management and reorganize the company completely to purge this. If they stick to this no one will get fired. What will happen though is everyone who is against this (and I will repeat, this internal newsletter seems to me to be INTERNAL damage control, an attempt to sell THEIR STAFF on these changes) will LEAVE CCP and seek other jobs. In other words, CCP is about to lose the bulk of their talent (as SOE did after the NGE). The Devs left will be the ones who thinks the endgame is looting customer wallets, not 0.0 gameplay... People these days still have integrity? I would be amazed at seeing people leaving CCP and the speaking in the public about this, but who knows, they might even force them to sign legalese documents forbidding them to speak about internal CCP's working policies and anything related to Incarna ---Archipelago Theory---
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:06:00 - [643] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Erichan someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that? I don't see a post on eve-search, so this was probably not true. Chribba is never one to make such posts quickly or lightly. True. But he was very strong in objecting to the "hey let's profit off our dedicated players who have done stuff our inbred Devs couldn't to make our game better" scheme. I believe he will respond to this too. What I'd love to see Chribba do is announce he is terminating his websites and support for EVE until the cash shop is undone and CCP ENDS RMT in EVE. CCP could not survive the bad PR of a ****ed off Chribba. Boy are you wrong (thats sad, really). But in business terms, EVERYONE is replacable. Yes, even Chribba. If CCP decides to not care, they won't.
Cosmoes Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:06:00 - [644] First CCP post guess #937 and oh I can't wait for Skyrim to come out now. ------------------- piccy
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:07:00 - [645] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. I'm going to go with 932
Everseeker Caldari Northgate	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:07:00 - [646] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. Well heck... why not, just a guess... 1273 -- EverSeeker
Axemaster	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:08:00 - [647] Originally by: Cosmoes First CCP post guess #937 and oh I can't wait for Skyrim to come out now. Amen to that. #1234
Elliott Calvadeux	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:08:00 - [648] Holy crap CCP, I'm speechless. Also way to turn me off WoD before its even released. Tea Ester I'll take post #888, should be #666 but I doubt they'll have something to say by then.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:08:00 - [649] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. You should ask people to take bets on CCP's type of response, not the post number.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:09:00 - [650] First CCP post will be N/A. They won't post in this thread. Their first open statement will be a dev blog or a sticky.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:10:00 - [651] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. Plex or monocle? haha i doubt CCP will answer this, maybe #1000 will lock it down (should be reached till they weak up).
Cosmoes Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:10:00 - [652] Originally by: Tla Atij Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. You should ask people to take bets on CCP's type of response, not the post number. I'll take that bet 200 mil says their first post is moderation, tidying up, stay on topic post AKA general cleaning but no actual response ------------------- piccy
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:11:00 - [653] can I have 2b if they never respond?
Miss Yanumano Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:11:00 - [654] Veeery glad now I decided against reactivating my second account and not to use my credit card for my primary instead of PLEX'es.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:11:00 - [655] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Erichan someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that? I don't see a post on eve-search, so this was probably not true. Chribba is never one to make such posts quickly or lightly. True. But he was very strong in objecting to the "hey let's profit off our dedicated players who have done stuff our inbred Devs couldn't to make our game better" scheme. I believe he will respond to this too. What I'd love to see Chribba do is announce he is terminating his websites and support for EVE until the cash shop is undone and CCP ENDS RMT in EVE. CCP could not survive the bad PR of a ****ed off Chribba. Boy are you wrong (thats sad, really). But in business terms, EVERYONE is replacable. Yes, even Chribba. If CCP decides to not care, they won't. I don't think they can. EVE is a game of scams. Of distrust. Of backstabbing. The one counter force to all that has always been Chribba. He's the indispensable man because he's been the ONLY RELIABLY TRUSTWORTHY PERSON in this game. You know anyone else who would be able to hold a station in 0.0 on reputation alone? If he left EVE it would be like dropping a nuke on the economy with respect to really really valuable things.
Thomas Turnpoint	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:12:00 - [656] Don't know what post # it will be, but I bet it's the last post. They'll toss up an "official" post regarding the issues, and then, as previously, close every other related thread with a "please continue this discussion in [thread link]". numbers-wise, I'll guess #1013.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:12:00 - [657] CCP 1st Post No. 1549 :p Also... most of that document is based around the (false) assumption that ccp have made saying they sell "Experiences and Identity"... they do NOT sell us identity... they sell us Experiences... and unfortunately for them... they'll struggle to EVER monetise the experiences we have with our corp mates... Gaming guilds are more than prepared to switch games and cancel subs and one would hope that a major alliance drops sov in game over this, to completely submit to the metagame this has become.
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:15:00 - [658] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Erichan someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that? I don't see a post on eve-search, so this was probably not true. Chribba is never one to make such posts quickly or lightly. True. But he was very strong in objecting to the "hey let's profit off our dedicated players who have done stuff our inbred Devs couldn't to make our game better" scheme. I believe he will respond to this too. What I'd love to see Chribba do is announce he is terminating his websites and support for EVE until the cash shop is undone and CCP ENDS RMT in EVE. CCP could not survive the bad PR of a ****ed off Chribba. Boy are you wrong (thats sad, really). But in business terms, EVERYONE is replacable. Yes, even Chribba. If CCP decides to not care, they won't. Hah! Chribba? Replaceable? He's done more for the Playability of eve than ccp ever did -------
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:16:00 - [659] CCP first post...how about 1254?
Sgt Maru Shadowed Command Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:16:00 - [660] I understand the whole "greed" factor in a way, but there has to be other options, I'm OK with the expensive vanity items, even though I have WoW, TF2, and NFS:World in particular...But paying real money for extra firepower, etc. just breaks a game, if the effects were limited to PvE that wouldn't be as disgusting, maybe annoying because some noob can clear an extravaganza or something faster than me, but at least tolerable compared to losing what should be a fair PvP fight. To make a RL connection, it feels kind of like those stupid store cards, where you get discounts for handing over personal information. The "preferred customer" treatment is a bad business model and should be avoided at all costs. A loyal customer base generally yields more profits than a small customer base that is willing to shell out cash constantly just to bypass all the real work the loyal customers put into the game. Just look at NFS: World, does anybody even play that? I gave it a whirl when it first came out, but the ability to buy the best cars drove everyone away, and those that fell for the marketing scheme are few and far between left to wallow in their own false elitism. And while I like the idea of DUST, it's going to be a very careful balancing act, it might not be so bad if the cover charge is full retail game price, but maybe a yearly renewal fee or something would work better than relying on players constantly pay for boosts to provide profits. Again I can understand the pay for unique vanity items, and maybe vanity weapons, but the weapons would have to be VERY well balanced, looking at the TF2 model would be a good idea, sure the unlockable weapons are cool, but the uneven stats make them on par or only a sliver better than the base weapons. I could go on forever on the DUST topic, but I'll cut it off here and shift back to the core element. As for Incarna, many players have been waiting for "walking in stations" for a LONG time. I personally like Incarna, being able to chillax off my ship, and the new guns and stuff is nice too, and I understand that Incarna is a long evolving road with many updates to be made. But it's another very careful balancing act, CCP mustn't loose sight of what brought the game to where it is today; the community. Greed corrupts and absolute greed corrupts absolutely, no human being is perfect and able to resist the power and greed potential of a market like this, but breaking from community opinions doesn't help CCP's case, I can accept the slander against the customer and how we're stupid (I get a lot worse directly spoken to me working for Boeing), but it's the concept that is so repulsive. EVE was built on the community by the community for the community. To make amends, and redeem our trust in CCP, and to strengthen the bond between the community and CCP, some sacrifices on both ends have to be made. Maybe getting rid of the hanger view was a bad idea (I can live without it, but will miss it deeply), maybe some people's computers can't handle the CQ graphics, maybe the NeX is overpriced. Some simple happy medians could be made; - Make a "Un-Board Ship" and "Board Ship" option. This would quell the people that want ship spinning and don't have computers that can handle CQ content. - Balance NeX item prices, the need for being unique and different is important to people, NeX items should perhaps become free in time, but for those who can't wait, can pay to get the items early, but don't rob us. - DUST should cost full retail console game price. This would up profits, and perhaps justify free updates. An occasional but not non-subscription might be an answer to profit margin, a yearly token of X dollars could keep ROI nice and level. - Standing/Rep, Damage/Tank, etc. boosts for money is not acceptable in a PvP environment. And extreme limitations on the theory applied to PvE might be an acceptable alternative. - Up the subscription cost by $1-$2, if your profits are hurting so much, just do it.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:17:00 - [661] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. Um ... 1253! If I win, I'll give it back cause my sub is up in 16 days or so. Just promise not to give it to anyone who has ever posted "can i have your stuff". My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:17:00 - [662] Originally by: Republica Winder I don't think they can. EVE is a game of scams. Of distrust. Of backstabbing. The one counter force to all that has always been Chribba. He's the indispensable man because he's been the ONLY RELIABLY TRUSTWORTHY PERSON in this game. You know anyone else who would be able to hold a station in 0.0 on reputation alone? If he left EVE it would be like dropping a nuke on the economy with respect to really really valuable things. don't get me wrong, i LOVE Chribba (well, i don't know the person, but what he represents) for all he has done ALL the years, like hosting and beeing a reliable person. But trust me on this, business doesn't care about ppl, you are a drop in an ocean of possible customers. Nothing more. Maybe, if you are a larger drop, you will make some waves, but they die off eventually.
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:18:00 - [663] I had already quit because of the stupid MT prices combined with Dust only coming out for PS3. To me the line "We are pitching for another market" regarding dust always smelled of bull**** because im pretty sure alot of eve players would have wanted to play it on a 15 day skill queue. So there you go, you can now buy a 60$ monocle to go with your 350$ expansion
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:20:00 - [664] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku i doubt CCP will answer this, maybe #1000 will lock it down (should be reached till they weak up). Nice My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Siigari Kitawa Gallente Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:20:00 - [665] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Erichan someone mentioned earlier that chribba had posted.. does anyone have a link to that? I don't see a post on eve-search, so this was probably not true. Chribba is never one to make such posts quickly or lightly. Pretty sure he's talking about this. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1528607&page=6#176 www.siigarikitawa.com ò www.eohpoker.com ò Buy a GTC
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:21:00 - [666] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Republica Winder I don't think they can. EVE is a game of scams. Of distrust. Of backstabbing. The one counter force to all that has always been Chribba. He's the indispensable man because he's been the ONLY RELIABLY TRUSTWORTHY PERSON in this game. You know anyone else who would be able to hold a station in 0.0 on reputation alone? If he left EVE it would be like dropping a nuke on the economy with respect to really really valuable things. don't get me wrong, i LOVE Chribba (well, i don't know the person, but what he represents) for all he has done ALL the years, like hosting and beeing a reliable person. But trust me on this, business doesn't care about ppl, you are a drop in an ocean of possible customers. Nothing more. Maybe, if you are a larger drop, you will make some waves, but they die off eventually. Sure, I'm not saying they will care. They won't. But I am saying is that losing Chribba would have such a bad effect on EVE that they'd lose more money than those monocles will make them....
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:22:00 - [667] Originally by: BeanBagKing Edit: what happens if CCP locks it without a post? They're known to ignore an issue or two. But if they think this is just going away by itself, or by force, then they're sorely mistaken. We're on the eve of the day that EVE will either be recorded to continue to grow, or will go down in history as the day CCP's greed killed the game. Ball is in their corner. --
Algathas The Revenge of Auntie Freeze	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:23:00 - [668]
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:25:00 - [669] Edited by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor on 23/06/2011 02:26:35 Originally by: Algathas Isn't that CCP Soundwave?
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:26:00 - [670] Originally by: Algathas
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:26:00 - [671] now this may trigger a moderation...cheater ;)
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:26:00 - [672] Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: BeanBagKing Edit: what happens if CCP locks it without a post? They're known to ignore an issue or two. But if they think this is just going away by itself, or by force, then they're sorely mistaken. We're on the eve of the day that EVE will either be recorded to continue to grow, or will go down in history as the day CCP's greed killed the game. Ball is in their corner. In other words, CCP's November 15, 2005 (the day the NGE was forced on SWG). The pessimist in me predicts they will cling to their delusions and greed. Which means that today represents the high water mark for EVE subscriptions from this day forward... Next month will represent the same from THAT day forward... Next month after that and that and so on. Until people are complaining that whole swaths of space are empty. Until 0.0 is so empty that individual vanity empires dot the maps Until people complain about no one in Jita in prime time... Think that is crazy? That is the path they are set upon.
Fractal Muse	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:27:00 - [673] It's weird. I've cancelled my accounts and now am just waiting out the time. I was never sank a huge amount of time into EVE but I enjoyed being connected with it. Now, I don't want to be associated with EVE online at all. Good luck to all who stick with it. I may reactivate depending on CCP's responses. As an aside, I am understanding of RMT in online environments and I don't mind it when it is done well. Typically I wouldn't bother with it but, who knows, with enough time and temptation I probably would give in. After all, what's tossing in an extra dollar, or two, or ten into a hobby? But, the way that CCP started out with it makes me want nothing to do with this game. When real-life clothing can cost more than in-game clothing I balk at that. I'm a believer of merit based rarity of items as opposed to cost based rarity. But, that's me. I believe in working for something in an in-game environment to obtain something in an in-game environment.
Mars Theran Caldari EVE Rogues EVE Rogues Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:27:00 - [674] Rather than type it twice: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534723&page=2#56
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:29:00 - [675] My god... how sad would it be to lose a community like this I gasped for air laughing more than once today
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:29:00 - [676] Originally by: Chribba ok seriously, I've like Ctrl+A, backspace this post 5 times now, tbh I'm out of words. I would like to know how many 3rd party developer/sites are doing it for the **ing awesome income it generates?! Seriously, this if anything WILL kill development of sites and services. As a creator of sites/applications/services for New Eden since well over 6 years now, I can tell you that I have never once created something with the goal to make money off it, this whole thing about needing a license to make something for the community is just ing **ed! Just hearing this makes my interest/will for developing things crash. This is not about the $99, this is about how you want to charge me because I want to do something for the community out of my free will - does that sense? Do you feel I am stealing your IP, making massive amounts of money off your IP? Then tell me straight up, don't try to bind it into some fluffy clouds and call it "great news". Every IPO in Market Discussions will now require a license, since after all, it's donations. Corporations should get a license too, I mean having a corp tax of >0.0% could be seen as a donation to the corporation... And yeah, I guess me and everyone else with an EVE IP tattoo will need a license, I mean, some other geek may think it's awesome and want to buy me a beer... I'm just very sad to see this even being discussed, talk about a punch in the face. Don't get me wrong, I see your point of EVE IP, and yes I can agree that it may** need to be controlled to some extent, but this is not the way. Not by far. /c Posted from other thread. -------
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:30:00 - [677] For context, the above Chribba post was made a week ago.
Janus Talmash Talmash Imports and Exports Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:30:00 - [678] Edited by: Janus Talmash on 23/06/2011 02:30:53 Originally by: Algathas Pic is fake, he looks to be alive still. ________ Amat victoria curam.
Vincardi Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:30:00 - [679] Edited by: Vincardi on 23/06/2011 02:33:35 I dont like the fact that I would have to put up PLEXES to get AUR to buy clothing. I believe that is the most reetaarded thing CCP has ever done. Instead of making it a PI thing, where people have to make and combine several things along with ORE to create something special that gets sold to CONCORD, and CONCORD in retaurn gives you AUR for the special item you created. then you can take that AUR and spend it on clothing. But no, CCP is trying to monopolize EVE and they will lose a lot of paying customers. Also, 1 - can't scroll completely out on CQ. 2 - no floor lights on the catwalk. 3 - Can't walk down to your POD and get in it to then get in your ship. 4 - CQ is so cold, no warmth and everything is all metal like a prison cell. 5 - No fridge with food and no quafe to purchase at cheap prices to drink in CQ that gives you a boost for like 2 hours like boosters do. 6 - Can not sit on bed or lay down on it. 7 - Can not play radio or TV screen audio. 8 - CQ does not have Hub Stock Ticker showing JITA and other Hub prices above the screens in CQ. 9 - Can not change light color of your CQ. huuum... food for thought. imho
Alara IonStorm	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:33:00 - [680] Originally by: Algathas At 02:23 EVE Time the first Burning in Effigy was posted. CCP Employee's should avoid going out late at night or leaking RL Plans to there ingame friends. A Forum Rage Alert Level Orange was issued: Threat Level High.
Serenity Frye Gallente Heretic Army B A N E	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:34:00 - [681] Edited by: Serenity Frye on 23/06/2011 02:36:14 nuke iceland.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:37:00 - [682] Originally by: Republica Winder In other words, CCP's November 15, 2005 (the day the NGE was forced on SWG). The pessimist in me predicts they will cling to their delusions and greed. Which means that today represents the high water mark for EVE subscriptions from this day forward... Next month will represent the same from THAT day forward... Next month after that and that and so on. Until people are complaining that whole swaths of space are empty. Until 0.0 is so empty that individual vanity empires dot the maps Until people complain about no one in Jita in prime time... Think that is crazy? That is the path they are set upon. Wish I could just laugh at you, and brush this off as ludicrous. And I would have, if not for today's revelations. But now I fear you may be right. CCP has caught the MT fever, and it's more persistent and ineradicable than the ehec infection, it would appear. Blatant greed, while sleazy perhaps, is tolerable even. MT, to purchase in-game advantages, however, is not. And I haven't met a single EVE player yet to whom that is acceptible. --
Kellaen Samurai Salvaging Stellar Defense Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:38:00 - [683] Three cheers for BizDev!
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:39:00 - [684] Edited by: Carmine Lady on 23/06/2011 02:39:56 Originally by: Vyktor Abyss Helicity banned apparently for linking this... CCP appear to be on full damage control... Whoever the "clever" marketing/PR guy was who thought it clever to use Gordan Ghecko's "Greed is Good!" will undoubtably be the first out the door, but definately not the last as this may just be the final nail in the coffin of Eve after Incarna. I've been 'playing' Eve for the last year via PLEX anyway so if I get banned for this well shucks, I'll be in good company. Ciao. Time to wake up and try X3. I hear its a fun spaceship game. o/ only just reactivated, came back to see all this, regret I had reactivated, editish is there a way to delete my account?
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:39:00 - [685] Originally by: Serenity Frye Edited by: Serenity Frye on 23/06/2011 02:36:14 nuke iceland. nah, just tell GB to demand their money back...oh wait
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:40:00 - [686] Originally by: Serenity Frye Edited by: Serenity Frye on 23/06/2011 02:36:14 nuke iceland. Is that actually necessary? Their economy is in such terrible shape you could throw a stack of $20's over Reykjavik into the ocean and half the population would drown trying to retrieve it. And that is saying something given the dollar's collapse in the past year... Given how terrible job prospects are there, why is CCP intentionally destroying themselves?
Hojj0	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:40:00 - [687]
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:41:00 - [688] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Serenity Frye Edited by: Serenity Frye on 23/06/2011 02:36:14 nuke iceland. nah, just tell GB to demand their money back...oh wait Maybe BOE would be interested in some mockules? Could pay off the English and the Dutch! My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Alara IonStorm	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:41:00 - [689] Originally by: Carmine Lady only just reactivated, came back to see all this, regret I had reactivated, I was on my way to pick up a prepaid Credit Card to resub for another month, figured I got till the 16th to do it and will wait. Got home, saw thread...
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:42:00 - [690] In the now very-likely event the thread gets locked prior to ccp response, nobody wins. Sorry I can't put /effort into anything EVE related.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:44:00 - [691] Edited by: Ranka Mei on 23/06/2011 02:45:09 Originally by: Serenity Frye nuke iceland. Hell no! They still owe my country several bil they continue to refuse to pay back. --
Ancyker Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:44:00 - [692] Food for thought: Chargeback Friendly Fraud S'all I'm saying.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:45:00 - [693] Its just sad. SWG all over again. Any other decent MMO's around?
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:46:00 - [694] Originally by: Alara IonStorm Originally by: Carmine Lady only just reactivated, came back to see all this, regret I had reactivated, I was on my way to pick up a prepaid Credit Card to resub for another month, figured I got till the 16th to do it and will wait. Got home, saw thread... I really wasn't goingto do it but I just gave in to temptation to see whether incarna would work under linux through wine (it DOES! Hooray) if only this thread had come a day earlier
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:47:00 - [695] LOL http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility Look at the all time graph, not only does this expansion not have the usual jump in users, but there are actually fewer users logging in! And the trend just seems to be getting steeper!! EVE IS DEAD. CCP might rescue some of it if they come clean and start over very soon, but they don't have much time.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:48:00 - [696] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Its just sad. SWG all over again. Any other decent MMO's around? Nope. The whole MMO industry is full of WoW clones and MACROtransactions (there is nothing small about their ambitions towards your wallet). I expect the whole industry to crash, like the Videogame Crash of 1983.
Panda Name Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:48:00 - [697] don't worry guys, we are just the vocal minority. eve is doing well!
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:49:00 - [698] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Its just sad. SWG all over again. Any other decent MMO's around? IMHO, there are not. There are, however, several worthwhile games out there depending on your tastes (rts, rpg, fps, etc.) most of which can be obtained for less than the price of a monocle.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:49:00 - [699] Originally by: Cailais The CSM saw a similar document, on a desk - they didnt read it or have it in hand to confirm it. CCP rarely dive straight in to these flames (if ever). Perhaps I'm wrong. Let's hope I'm not. C. And we all trust the CSM implicitly? I gotta point out that the forum is also up in arms about how the CSM's credibility has been destroyed by goons and metagaming. All sarcasm and lulz aside, here's where I'm coming from. A moment of sincerity, lest I too get wrapped up in all the emo-rage I hate to see. I know everyone thinks I'm a simple-minded counter-troll, CCP alt/fanboi, or worse, but in the end I'm just a long-term EvE gamer like the rest of you. I have multiple accounts, play regularly, and am your stereotypical eve subscriber. No, I'm not rushing out to buy a monocle. Not a shirt or boots either. But not out of rage or protest, not cause I can't afford it, but because I simply like the clothes given to us in the character creator better. And, as its been said, this is more like Incarna-beta, and the lack of social interaction kills my interest in buying avatar clothes much more than their price, which is the same as ships you see getting blown up by the hundreds every day in New Eden. So no, I'm not thrilled about Incarna in its current form. But I refuse to have my enjoyment taken away it either. Its a game, and a hobby. If predictions are true, and Monoclepocolypse comes true and MT destroys the economy, that's when i'll say enough is enough. In the mean time, I'm going to keep on keeping on. EvE is about community. The community is divided at the moment. We will no doubt lose a chunk of subscriptions, and that's fine. My only motivation in sharing my opinion on the matter is to try to convince those on the fence, to simply relax and wait this out a bit, rather than quit the game and encourage others to quit the game before we've had a chance to see what actually happens. This is all nothing more than rumor, and stacks of rumor upon rumor. If I can convince a few people here to just take a deep breath, ignore that NeX button in station, turn off the CQ if they don't like it, and continue playing the spaceship game we all know and love, than I'll consider my efforts a success. Every pilot counts in the end. So very few pilots have actually said, "You know what? I'll give this a few months and see if the things that MIGHT happen that MIGHT hurt the game, actually come true. My friends and the battles we make for ourselves and fun to be had, are more important than some avatar clothes i don't have to buy if i don't want." That's what kills me, the lack of patience, or unwillingness to ignore something like a vanity item that is completely unobtrusive if you choose to ignore it. There will be those amongst us that need to own a monocle to feel like EvE is worth paying for, or need monocles to be removed to feel like Eve is worth paying for, and for those players, I can only say it's sad that all this peripheral nonsense is more important to you than your friends, corpmates, your enemies you enjoy fighting, and all the pretty spaceships that are still there and look better than ever. If you think that the lack of transactions and vanity items is the defining factor seperating EvE from the other games out there, I just don't know what to say. Eve is so much more than that, I wish we could remember this during these times of extreme emotional duress.
Bane Necran Furtim Vigilans	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:50:00 - [700] Well, i went from first suspecting the worst and doing a bit of fearmongering myself about microtransactions with a thread, to calming down, thinking everything will work out fine, and even defending CCP during that stupid monocle debacle yesterday, to right back up to fearing the worst. If even half of those quotes are true, i'm a memory.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:50:00 - [701] Originally by: Sciencegeek deathdealer LOL http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility Look at the all time graph, not only does this expansion not have the usual jump in users, but there are actually fewer users logging in! And the trend just seems to be getting steeper!! EVE IS DEAD. CCP might rescue some of it if they come clean and start over very soon, but they don't have much time. this is interesting.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:51:00 - [702] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Its just sad. SWG all over again. Any other decent MMO's around? Nope. The whole MMO industry is full of WoW clones and MACROtransactions (there is nothing small about their ambitions towards your wallet). I expect the whole industry to crash, like the Videogame Crash of 1983. Oh well, thank god I still have my football manager... And I had resubbed a few weeks back. Cheerio CCP
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:53:00 - [703] Its not that easy Hans. You know, MMOs are long lasting time investments. If you don't see a future you will enjoy, how are you supposed to relax and wait it out? If you know the game that is envisioned is not for you, how are you supposed to still login and build up your corp and plan for the future? What point would there be in that? This is no console-shooter for 1h of fun, EVE, if at all, gives you satisfaction over days, weeks, months.
Krelian Lann Caldari The Zohar Project	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:54:00 - [704] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen My only motivation in sharing my opinion on the matter is to try to convince those on the fence, to simply relax and wait this out a bit, rather than quit the game and encourage others to quit the game before we've had a chance to see what actually happens. Well, Hans, the problem with this is that if no one says a word and we just wait it out, then nothing will change. They will just go with whatever and think "Our players seem ok with that, they aren't complaining or anything". The only 2 languages companies like CCP seem to understand are Money, and Outrage. I'm not being a troll, i'm just saying that just "waiting it out" won't show them that we care, and we don't accept these changes.
riverini Gallente Reliables Inc BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:54:00 - [705] Sup punks. CCP should had flooded the market with cheap stuff, these articles aren't unique, people has been clothing themselves since the stone ages =__= If you offer me 100 shirt for 200 aur each, i can swear you i'll get addicted to that **. Regarding CSM knowledge of this, am pretty sure they did knew, but being muffled by NDA's and such must be a *** for them. R
Elisia Brey	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:56:00 - [706] Was looking forward to WoD, too. And Fallout Online looks like it's in trouble too...
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 02:59:00 - [707] this is a mess
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:00:00 - [708] Riverini, I don't know you and I have only recently become aware of your site which I quite enjoy. I think that thanks are in order for your reporting of this and disclosure of the document. Also, thanks to whoever sent this to you for opening this to the community. I know you have your critics, but I, sir, am not one of them. E
Maul555 Amarr Reliables Inc BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:04:00 - [709] If this is true, and CCP is planning on selling in-game advantages, then someone in CCP needs to be fired. Or at the very least put in a position where they cant do any more harm. The EVE Personality Test
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:07:00 - [710] Originally by: Maul555 If this is true, and CCP is planning on selling in-game advantages, then someone in CCP needs to be fired. Or at the very least put in a position where they cant do any more harm. Hilmar promoted the guy and he is now Lead Game Designer for EVE...so, don't count on it. They made a funclip at fanfest with the other guy (competitor) losing out. Man, we now wish that one got the job, hm?
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:09:00 - [711] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Maul555 If this is true, and CCP is planning on selling in-game advantages, then someone in CCP needs to be fired. Or at the very least put in a position where they cant do any more harm. Hilmar promoted the guy and he is now Lead Game Designer for EVE...so, don't count on it. They made a funclip at fanfest with the other guy (competitor) losing out. Man, we now wish that one got the job, hm? I think we need to axe Hilmar, and the rest of the snake dies
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:10:00 - [712] Originally by: Maul555 If this is true, and CCP is planning on selling in-game advantages, then someone in CCP needs to be fired. Oh, let it be CCP Fallout, please!? Then I can have my unprobable Tengu back too. :P In all seriousness, though, if even half of this turns out to be true, they won't be able to find me anywhere, Virtue implants or no, as I will simply be gone. And I'm sure I won't be the only one. --
elnukeo Minmatar Heretic Army	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:11:00 - [713] if this is true eve will die almost overnight... Please re-size your signature as per forum rules. Maximum height: 120 pixels; maximum width: 400 pixels; maximum file size: 24,000 bytes. Thank you. Shadow.
Slatiska Wolfovna	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:12:00 - [714] Quote: On the opposite end of the scale to vanity goods are performancebased items such as weapons. They are consumed through gameplay, making them a potentially powerful source of renewable income. Selling them for real money is very tempting. They are highly desired by the player audience and yield lower development costs, as variation can be achieved through numbers rather than unique art assets. Selling them though, is highly controversial. We are planning on doing so. I would be tempted to say it is because we are fearless, but the real reason is that we have strong evidence that selling performance enhancers, in moderation, works. From the evenews24 doc :D Aren't they crazy ?
Roderak Pleem Minmatar Abandoned Land	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:12:00 - [715] Eve Online: The game where scamming is encouraged. Scammers working their scam for years before pulling it off. Has this been a scam in the making since 2003? Suckering us in, getting us addicted, making us want to add account after account, only for the scam to be hatched in June 2011, for great laughs at CCP headquarters? MUAHAHAHAHA we sure scammed our customers good! oh wai......
Rust Rat	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:14:00 - [716] I'm not unsubbing. I want to see what happens. If they sell shiny ships for AUR, given the price of the Looking Glass, they will be very expensive. Just can't wait for a noob to show up in a blob with it. Want to guess what the first ship trageted will be. Imagine the EMO when it goes pop. Eve is and also has been self correcting. CCP makes the player base upset; the player base will f*ck with CCP.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:15:00 - [717] Originally by: Roderak Pleem Eve Online: The game where scamming is encouraged. Scammers working their scam for years before pulling it off. Has this been a scam in the making since 2003? Suckering us in, getting us addicted, making us want to add account after account, only for the scam to be hatched in June 2011, for great laughs at CCP headquarters? MUAHAHAHAHA we sure scammed our customers good! oh wai...... They kinda did, now with their new MMO almost out, they completely used us. Dust 514 being for a new market, a totally new MMO, and now RMT?
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:18:00 - [718] Go show your support for the anti-MT view in the CCP John Turbefield appreciation thread.
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:18:00 - [719] Originally by: Miilla Entropia... Not that Entropia is doing particularly well: Originally by: Wikipedia On June 15, 2010, parent company MindArk AB released its 2009 annual report. They reported a cash flow of -18.6 Million SEK (-$2.4M). I think a huge negative cash flow would be a bad thing, don't you? -- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel]
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:19:00 - [720] Sure, but "its the trend in the industry". Remember 2 years back, Second Life and Entropia got hyped up even on regular news media. Hearing anything anymore from them?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:20:00 - [721] Originally by: Republica Winder Which means that today represents the high water mark for EVE subscriptions from this day forward... The stats show high water mark was almost a year ago. Players started to leave the moment CCP set themselves on this current path. Some of us were dumb enough to think they might actually pull it off and get back to developing the game we pay for. Now we too have unsubscribed. Next it's the new customers who realise the game has no dedicated players anymore. Then it's F2P.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:23:00 - [722] Edited by: Tachibana Kanade on 23/06/2011 03:26:24 I'm only holding back on unsubbing because I'm awaiting for an official response on all this. Want to see what damage control CCP pulls off. Anyways I'll unsub 99.8% sure. 0.2 % is wishful thinking on my part. That being CCP turns around, FINISHES incarna, REMOVES this BS aurum, puts the ISK ON THE LEFT and stop lying to us straight in the face. One can wish, right?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:23:00 - [723] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade I'm only holding back on unsubbing because I'm awaiting for an official response on all this. Delusional.
Vhaine Vhindiscar Origin. Black Legion.	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:25:00 - [724] CCP, please sell eve. Where you are going we don't want to follow.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:25:00 - [725] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade I'm only holding back on unsubbing because I'm awaiting for an official response on all this. Want to see what damage control CCP pulls off. Anyways I'll unsub 99.8% sure. 0.2 % is wishful thinking on my part. That being CCP turns around, FINISHES incarna, REMOVES this BS aurum, puts the ISK ON THE RIGHT and stop lying to us straight in the face. One can wish, right? We'll miss you, of course we do it from afar, as I unsubbed too. *** Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Mathrin	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:26:00 - [726] I have to agree. If ccp brings Micro-transactions out of the station and into space I'm gone. Till then I will be playing eve and crossing my fingers
Redblade Reikoku Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:30:00 - [727] So CCP talks internally about MT, what a shocker. Doubt this is any different than any other game developers discussions out there, they are a business and want to make money, nothing strange about that. At the end of the day they will only implement things that the customers allow them to, and only way to tell them it's not acceptable is to NOT buy anything, quite simple.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:31:00 - [728] just have to put this in here Devblog its just too good
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:33:00 - [729] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku just have to put this in here Devblog its just too good Props, i was looking for that
Klingon Admiral Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:39:00 - [730] "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010 Well, I would have no problem if CCP would allow us to store more fittings on their servers or some other convenience fuctions. But things like faction standings for sale DIRECTLY AFFECT THE GAMEPLAY! Nowadays, generating standing with one faction results in losing standing with various other factions. If you don't take care you will sooner or later drop past the magical -5.00 barrier and not be allowed to enter this factions sovereignty. If you invest some bucks every few months you will be able to keep your standings well above the -5.00. And I don't want to know how many transport-alts were created for the specific purpose to be able to enter the area of hostile factions. And if you include some extra-powerful ships for real world-money you will create a serious problem for the game's balance. Because we all know that probably every powerblock has some RMT-guys in high-ranking positions, creating considerable amounts of money. And if they would use (a part of) this money to supply their allies with this uberfkngpwnage-ships, it will come down who generates the most rmt-money. And probably some people who aren't rmt'ing these days will start to. A single one of this ships will not be that much of a problem (just blob it), a fleet of 500 will be. Even today 0.0 is caught in a vicious circle (you need sov to build scaps, and to hold sov of your own you need scaps, and the money needed to buy scaps can be most efficenctly grinded in 0.0). With ships for money it will be amplified beyond imagination.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:41:00 - [731] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku just have to put this in here Devblog its just too good ROFL! ahhhhh... it's too bad this isn't April 1st though
Captain Alcatraz Invicta. Rooks and Kings	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:43:00 - [732] Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku just have to put this in here Devblog its just too good ROFL! ahhhhh... it's too bad this isn't April 1st though It's been April 1 since June 21 2011
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:44:00 - [733] Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010 This will be my signature.... Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Neo160	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:46:00 - [734] to be honest, CCP is going to-do whatever they want, as it seems they already clearly understand the commuinties point of view. we can play that game too, because we are going to make MT as EXCRUCIATING AS POSSIBLE to implement. people wonder why there's a thread for blacklisting Aurum buyers from joining corporations or alliances, well consider it the beginning. i expect to see alot of resistance from the entire community over this.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:47:00 - [735] And so it begins...
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:47:00 - [736] FREE HELICITY! Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Illwill Bill It's interesting that CCP's hasn't been activated yet. Honestly, not even CCP has the hull tank for this. Honor Tank! Honor Tank! CCP has a low rack full of cargo expanders so they can haul their bull **** around. I wish I could laugh at this. I came into this thread prepared to rage. I didn't expect to be sad. CCP, this is you: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofV_iFBw2YE "LOLCUSTOMERS NEWFEATURES VANITYMTS!" smack
Ultan Rova	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:47:00 - [737] TL;DR - There are too many long-term players in EVE. It's not healthy. CCP has to do something or EVE is just going to run down like a watch someone forgot to wind up. The main problem - even beyond the unfinished game expansions and broken mechanics - is this: there are too many vets and too few noobs. Too many players are sitting on too much ISK because there's nothing out there for them to spend their billions of ISK on. Not enough ships are getting blowed up because the vets are shy about taking their titan/supercaps into harm's way. Noobs hug Empire space because venturing into lowsec/nullsec is a death-warrant -- vets with years more experience permacamp gates, waiting in boredom for some hapless noob to wander through. So nullsec/lowsec turn into a boring dead-zone, and so the vets turn to Empire space themselves. And again, their higher skills and purchasing power depress the ability of new players to compete. EVE sometimes strikes me as a conveyor belt where the older players are forever far ahead of me -- even as I progress, they progress faster, having started far earlier. It's impossible to catch up. One thing many MMO players forget about single-player RPG's is that single-player RPG's end. The character progression stops at some point. You level up to become almost Godlike, you slay the dragon (or whatever), and then...the game ends. But MMOs just go on, and on, and on. Developers have to find ever new ways to appeal to high-level players, long past the point where it really makes any sense to do so. It's comparatively easy to create challenging content for new players; it's vastly harder for longtime players who have leveled up nearly every skill there is to the maximum point. CCP has been trying to balance the game for a long time, but it's obvious that something is going to have to give -- if EVE is going to thrive, it's going to have to become friendlier to new players. And that means changing the game such that new players are not just cannon-fodder or griefing targets. It means adopting a more "fair play" attitude towards the game (even among CCP devs). It means placing more emphasis on the "social" and "missioning" aspects of the game rather than on large-fleet PVP. I realize that a lot of vets hate the whole idea behind Incarna and micro-transactions and whatnot, but I think CCP sees the writing on the wall: new players are the lifeblood of an MMO. CCP doesn't host EVE as a hobby or a public service; they run it as a business venture that must turn a profit to survive. (You'd think that EVE players would intuitively understand this, but I guess not.) I guess what I'm saying is: if you're a vet and you're feeling bored and frustrated and like the game isn't fun any more...maybe it's time to leave. Let the game end. You won!
Words Words Words	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:49:00 - [738] ccp? no, its just me, gabe newell
Alara IonStorm	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:49:00 - [739] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku just have to put this in here Devblog its just too good So thats there Dev Plan, going back and turning all there April Fools Dev Blogs into Game Play... Mounts, Pets and Acheivements December 2011.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:50:00 - [740] Originally by: Ultan Rova TL;DR - There are too many long-term players in EVE. It's not healthy. CCP has to do something or EVE is just going to run down like a watch someone forgot to wind up. The main problem - even beyond the unfinished game expansions and broken mechanics - is this: there are too many vets and too few noobs. Too many players are sitting on too much ISK because there's nothing out there for them to spend their billions of ISK on. Not enough ships are getting blowed up because the vets are shy about taking their titan/supercaps into harm's way. Noobs hug Empire space because venturing into lowsec/nullsec is a death-warrant -- vets with years more experience permacamp gates, waiting in boredom for some hapless noob to wander through. So nullsec/lowsec turn into a boring dead-zone, and so the vets turn to Empire space themselves. And again, their higher skills and purchasing power depress the ability of new players to compete. EVE sometimes strikes me as a conveyor belt where the older players are forever far ahead of me -- even as I progress, they progress faster, having started far earlier. It's impossible to catch up. One thing many MMO players forget about single-player RPG's is that single-player RPG's end. The character progression stops at some point. You level up to become almost Godlike, you slay the dragon (or whatever), and then...the game ends. But MMOs just go on, and on, and on. Developers have to find ever new ways to appeal to high-level players, long past the point where it really makes any sense to do so. It's comparatively easy to create challenging content for new players; it's vastly harder for longtime players who have leveled up nearly every skill there is to the maximum point. CCP has been trying to balance the game for a long time, but it's obvious that something is going to have to give -- if EVE is going to thrive, it's going to have to become friendlier to new players. And that means changing the game such that new players are not just cannon-fodder or griefing targets. It means adopting a more "fair play" attitude towards the game (even among CCP devs). It means placing more emphasis on the "social" and "missioning" aspects of the game rather than on large-fleet PVP. I realize that a lot of vets hate the whole idea behind Incarna and micro-transactions and whatnot, but I think CCP sees the writing on the wall: new players are the lifeblood of an MMO. CCP doesn't host EVE as a hobby or a public service; they run it as a business venture that must turn a profit to survive. (You'd think that EVE players would intuitively understand this, but I guess not.) I guess what I'm saying is: if you're a vet and you're feeling bored and frustrated and like the game isn't fun any more...maybe it's time to leave. Let the game end. You won! What the **** ?
Dante024781 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:51:00 - [741] "Thus we will not and cannot focus on virtual sales only within the Incarna evironment, nor build that environment around such sales, rather we will effect a universal strategy of micro-sales throughout the EVE experience."
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:57:00 - [742] Originally by: handige harrie Edited by: handige harrie on 22/06/2011 23:42:31 I think CCP is in the wrong business, if you want to handle crap loads of money and not care about a thing in the world, start a bank, an Oil Company or do something shady with real life weapons. Well, i got news for ya, they did,... ever heard of I-Safe (it was an Islandic bank that went down some 2 years ago). Several countries in europe had to pump in BILLIONS of euro's to prevent the stinking island from going bankrubt. But when it comes to listening to the countries request to repay the debt that's open, the Islandic massively voted NO to repay their debt to Europe. If you want to know more about this, just google "i-safe bank" The same **-you mentality can also be seen in EVE. CSM the voice of the player? Bull-crap, they don't give a damn about your voice. How many years has this community been begging for a complete and working patch or update? How many times have we asked to not release something if it's not working. And what do we get time and time again? Content that post release needs more patchin up than Cher's face. CCP already knew incarna was not working properly, they already had this much information from the test-server (sisi). As for all the crap going around, do you realy think they give a damn? Not likely,... I have not seen any reaction from the US office of CCP, not a sign of life comming from their office in Asia. Do you guys remember the "Sandbox" trailer for EVE. This is just the biggest joke i can think of after witnessing this EPPIC FAIL called INCARNA, wich puts all other CCP-fails in the shade like a solar eclyps. It's true EVE ive is a sandbox game to a certain degree, though i would rather call it an ANTFARM where the player community are the ants and CCP is the hand that's feeding us a ton of crap just to see how much we will take before calling it a day. There is only one thing they care about and thats their wallet and howuch money they can whip out of our wallets. They don't care about quality anymore, if they did they would fix the problems eve was having long before starting work on INCARNA. They don't give a rat's B-hind about immersion, if they did, they would not have dropped a half-baked quarter-working thing called INCARNA on Tranquility. They don't give a damn about the community that's paying their wage. If they did give a damn they would not concidder force feeding us the ** they've cooked up in that document. Last but not least, they don't give jack-dong about EVE, bwcouse if they did they would have invested more time, money and assets in EVE. After all, persumably they already stated this is their goose with the golden eggs. What ever is going to happen, untill there's going to be some substantial improvement i'm suspending all my alternate accounts and only gona keep my main up to see what will happen,... I'm not paying over 140 euro a month for this bull-crap. Lol, i wonder how much money they think CCP will make when they take in account all the canceld profiles in their effort to dig for more gold. Looks like the egga from this goose are turning from gold to dirt. Come to think of it,...
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:58:00 - [743] Originally by: Neo160 to be honest, CCP is going to-do whatever they want, as it seems they already clearly understand the commuinties point of view. Yet have the hubris to believe they can ignore the community because they "know better".
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:59:00 - [744] Dont know how to quote from another forum topic, this is the blue post from "Where are the moderators? " topic Posted - 2011.06.22 18:47:00 - [35] - Quote Report We are forever watching from the shadows. Lurking behind the blue bars. Usually on days like today we are interested in reading feedback. I know I know, don't faint.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 03:59:00 - [745] Originally by: Ultan Rova stuff Multiple solutions have been presented by players to resolve these issues, CCP never listens. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:01:00 - [746] Originally by: Ultan Rova TL;DR - There are too many long-term players in EVE. It's not healthy. CCP has to do something or EVE is just going to run down like a watch someone forgot to wind up. The main problem - even beyond the unfinished game expansions and broken mechanics - is this: there are too many vets and too few noobs. Too many players are sitting on too much ISK because there's nothing out there for them to spend their billions of ISK on. Not enough ships are getting blowed up because the vets are shy about taking their titan/supercaps into harm's way. Noobs hug Empire space because venturing into lowsec/nullsec is a death-warrant -- vets with years more experience permacamp gates, waiting in boredom for some hapless noob to wander through. So nullsec/lowsec turn into a boring dead-zone, and so the vets turn to Empire space themselves. And again, their higher skills and purchasing power depress the ability of new players to compete. EVE sometimes strikes me as a conveyor belt where the older players are forever far ahead of me -- even as I progress, they progress faster, having started far earlier. It's impossible to catch up. One thing many MMO players forget about single-player RPG's is that single-player RPG's end. The character progression stops at some point. You level up to become almost Godlike, you slay the dragon (or whatever), and then...the game ends. But MMOs just go on, and on, and on. Developers have to find ever new ways to appeal to high-level players, long past the point where it really makes any sense to do so. It's comparatively easy to create challenging content for new players; it's vastly harder for longtime players who have leveled up nearly every skill there is to the maximum point. CCP has been trying to balance the game for a long time, but it's obvious that something is going to have to give -- if EVE is going to thrive, it's going to have to become friendlier to new players. And that means changing the game such that new players are not just cannon-fodder or griefing targets. It means adopting a more "fair play" attitude towards the game (even among CCP devs). It means placing more emphasis on the "social" and "missioning" aspects of the game rather than on large-fleet PVP. I realize that a lot of vets hate the whole idea behind Incarna and micro-transactions and whatnot, but I think CCP sees the writing on the wall: new players are the lifeblood of an MMO. CCP doesn't host EVE as a hobby or a public service; they run it as a business venture that must turn a profit to survive. (You'd think that EVE players would intuitively understand this, but I guess not.) I guess what I'm saying is: if you're a vet and you're feeling bored and frustrated and like the game isn't fun any more...maybe it's time to leave. Let the game end. You won! Maybe they could try fixing all the stuff they left broken and abandon in the game, that might keep the watch running. Opening up areas of play, careers, for new players could help them too but CCP isn't interested in that. They want to lure new players in but not keep them. Eve is a fisherman fishing all the fish out of a lake never tossing any back. There are only so many people who will 'get' eve and leaving them with one broken mechanic after the other and piling more on isn't going to keep players. Incarna is a possible way to attract new players but there has to be content or it will just become a mirror of 'eve space' lots of buggy/broken/abandon things to frustrate and bore players. The fact that they start it out with a primary aspect of selling you **** isn't a good sign.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:01:00 - [747] Originally by: Ultan Rova CCP has to do something or EVE is just going to run down like a watch someone forgot to wind up. That was actually an interesting read. :) Yet, whereas the need for change is commonly understood and accepted, MT for in-game advantages, however, is crossing a line which creates such a fundamental imbalance in the Force, that it's literallly game-breaking. From the recently linked blog, 'AmmoAnywhere'?! And so it begins... Wtf is wrong with them? Let people buy their ammo in Jita 4-4, like a normal person! --
Iamien Democracy of Klingon Brothers	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:03:00 - [748] Stop using the term MT as it is assumed to mean micro-transaction. CCP is implementing macro-transactions.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:04:00 - [749] Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Ultan Rova From the recently linked blog, 'AmmoAnywhere'?! And so it begins... Wtf is wrong with them? Let people buy their ammo in Jita 4-4, like a normal person! Check the date stamp on that, its april fools post.
foxnod Brotherhood of the Coast	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:04:00 - [750] For the first time I've actually considered closing my 2 accounts. CCP; if this is true, then you are in error; correct yourself.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:05:00 - [751] Originally by: Iamien Stop using the term MT as it is assumed to mean micro-transaction. CCP is implementing macro-transactions. How about BST? I think we can all figure that one out. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Alara IonStorm	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:05:00 - [752] Originally by: Iamien Stop using the term MT as it is assumed to mean micro-transaction. CCP is implementing macro-transactions. Sir that is down right witty of you. Wit of that calibur costs 2000 AUR per Post. Your Account has been billed.
Lord Kazuhiro	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:07:00 - [753] Please tell me this is just some frustrated player making a epic troll, and not a legit leak. So far it looks like it's either completely true. Or a very well planned/elaborate troll. I'm really hoping the latter. If CCP doesn't start talking soon about this last patch soon, I'm going to jump on the unsub train myself. So for god sake CCP, post something... ANYTHING, that says this is a complete fabrication. You talk about far less important crap all the time. And this is actually important.
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:09:00 - [754] Originally by: Lord Kazuhiro Please tell me this is just some frustrated player making a epic troll, and not a legit leak. So far it looks like it's either completely true. Or a very well planned/elaborate troll. I'm really hoping the latter. If CCP doesn't start talking soon about this last patch soon, I'm going to jump on the unsub train myself. So for god sake CCP, post something... ANYTHING, that says this is a complete fabrication. You talk about far less important crap all the time. And this is actually important. You sound really desperate to be coddled with lies, you might want to look into that.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:10:00 - [755] Originally by: MrSteack Check the date stamp on that, its april fools post. LOL. Me falling for it, though, you think that's a commentary on CCP's current greed model? --
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:12:00 - [756] Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku just have to put this in here Devblog its just too good Props, i was looking for that Are you ****ting me? when there's a crap-storm raging on the forum they are daft enough to let a post like that hang around??? So wtf will become of my bpo's? Their gona screw everyone there as well???
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:13:00 - [757] Well, Hammer is no more, alot of old CCPer are no more. Their vision to create the best GAME (not money grabbing scam software) faded away with them. The result is visible, more then ever.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:13:00 - [758] You have the commentary on their greed model right there in pdf format. Look at it for yourself.
Malias Yakusto	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:14:00 - [759]
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:15:00 - [760] Originally by: Lord Kazuhiro So far it looks like it's either completely true. Or a very well planned/elaborate troll. I'm hoping it's an elaborate troll myself. I have reverse redeemed a bunch of PLEX to my accounts, ensured that they are cancelled so there will be no renewal through my credit card, and will wait to see what happens in the meantime. Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive - http://v.gd/tm28yT
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:16:00 - [761] Originally by: Malias Yakusto I lol'd.
Acac Sunflyier Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:17:00 - [762] CCP,the community is calling you out! Respond to us already. Stop trying to come up with a smooth over statement. Stop talking to PR guys. Just come out and tell us. This isn't going away. If this thread gets locked more will appear. We are unhappy and deserve some kind of answer today!
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:18:00 - [763] Originally by: Ultan Rova I realize that a lot of vets hate the whole idea behind Incarna and micro-transactions and whatnot, but I think CCP sees the writing on the wall: new players are the lifeblood of an MMO. CCP doesn't host EVE as a hobby or a public service; they run it as a business venture that must turn a profit to survive. (You'd think that EVE players would intuitively understand this, but I guess not.) There is nothing about MT itself that will get new players to flock to your game. Having an avatar that can walk around and do nothing isn't a big draw either. Games like The Sims and Second Life fill this niche in a far more satisfying way. I've been known to play The Sims from time to time, but when I fire up EVE, it's because I want to immerse myself in a living sci-fi universe with spaceships. What other reason is there to play EVE, really? If this universe expands into new areas, including person-to-person combat, exploring the wreckage of ancient Talocan ships to excavate valuable salvage, etc. -- a more WoW-like gameplay experience -- I'd be even down for that, providing the execution is solid and the integrity of the sandbox is preserved. But the things that are being talked about in this (hopefully hoax) newsletter don't suggest anything so ambitious, nor do they solve any of problems you lament. They're cash grabs that will outright kill aspects of the sandbox (pay for faction standings boosts? there goes an entire sub-profession in EVE) and likely alienate many old and new players alike.
graphitemaster Darkstar Defense Industries Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:18:00 - [764] Originally by: Malias Yakusto
Anna Maziarczyk	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:19:00 - [765] Serious. 1. Someone created fake CCP newsletter. leaks it. 2. Its legit. Leaked. Who the hell do you think leaked it? Serious>? Read it.
Sciencegeek deathdealer	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:21:00 - [766] LOL In protest, we should declare war on C C P Alliance!!! Follow the example of: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534995 It will be brilliant if we can get a few major alliances in on it.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:21:00 - [767] Originally by: Wanda Wong Are you ****ting me? when there's a crap-storm raging on the forum they are daft enough to let a post like that hang around??? They only moderate complaints when it can be done without people noticing. Usually by moving them to "Out of Pod Experiences" or "Feature and Idea Discussion" blackholes.
Murdah Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:22:00 - [768] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku (obsolescence referring to the deliberate shortening of a product's lifespan) Is this what they're trying to do with EVE? They want us all to leave and go play DUST?
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:23:00 - [769] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 04:24:17 Who leaked it? Well, for one Seleene told us upfront that this stuff is laying around in their offices...random ppl can grab that stuff. Or my favorite: a disgruntled employee who loves EVE for what it is and was, not this crap layed out in the document. Take your pick. Originally by: Murdah Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku (obsolescence referring to the deliberate shortening of a product's lifespan) Is this what they're trying to do with EVE? They want us all to leave and go play DUST? More like: your monocle degrades over time, buy it again
Londo Cebb Official Market Discussions Troll	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:24:00 - [770] I think the only way they could moderate the rage at this point would be to take the forums off-line. Taking bets on when that happens.
Anna Maziarczyk	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:25:00 - [771] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 04:24:17 Who leaked it? Well, for one Seleene told us upfront that this stuff is laying around in their offices...random ppl can grab that stuff. Or my favorite: a disgruntled employee who loves EVE for what it is and was, not this crap layed out in the document. Take your pick. Originally by: Murdah Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku (obsolescence referring to the deliberate shortening of a product's lifespan) Is this what they're trying to do with EVE? They want us all to leave and go play DUST? More like: your monocle degrades over time, buy it again Yeah, cuz i can GUARANTEE you it wasnt something talked about for weeks, months, and even WHITEBOARDED. The iceland mans had no knowledge of incriminating documents...... You are getting sleepy......
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:27:00 - [772] Cut me some slack, it was a long, but funny night
democrities Zebra Corp BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:28:00 - [773] Originally by: Anna Maziarczyk Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 04:24:17 Who leaked it? Well, for one Seleene told us upfront that this stuff is laying around in their offices...random ppl can grab that stuff. Or my favorite: a disgruntled employee who loves EVE for what it is and was, not this crap layed out in the document. Take your pick. Originally by: Murdah Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku (obsolescence referring to the deliberate shortening of a product's lifespan) Is this what they're trying to do with EVE? They want us all to leave and go play DUST? More like: your monocle degrades over time, buy it again Yeah, cuz i can GUARANTEE you it wasnt something talked about for weeks, months, and even WHITEBOARDED. The iceland mans had no knowledge of incriminating documents...... You are getting sleepy...... incriminating documents? Get real. This isn't the ENRON scandal. It's not like people are going to jail over this.."incriminating" bah..they are documents that discuss a video game. Not hedge fund managers discussing how to hide profit and evade taxes. Quit being so melodramatic.
Barlaka Amarr Thermopile Systems	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:29:00 - [774] Originally by: Londo Cebb I think the only way they could moderate the rage at this point would be to take the forums off-line. Taking bets on when that happens. No, this is when they launch the "new forums".
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:30:00 - [775] Originally by: Barlaka Originally by: Londo Cebb I think the only way they could moderate the rage at this point would be to take the forums off-line. Taking bets on when that happens. No, this is when they launch the "new forums". Yea, sometimes a little brilliance still shines through, its a nice move.
Anna Maziarczyk	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:34:00 - [776] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Cut me some slack, it was a long, but funny night \|........ ..... :)
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:36:00 - [777] Appears the rage is subsiding. Your move CCP...
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:37:00 - [778] Originally by: MrSteack Appears the rage is subsiding. Your move CCP... Sleeeeep zzzz My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Anna Maziarczyk	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:38:00 - [779] Quote: incriminating documents? Get real. This isn't the ENRON scandal. It's not like people are going to jail over this.."incriminating" bah..they are documents that discuss a video game. Not hedge fund managers discussing how to hide profit and evade taxes. Quit being so melodramatic. Melodramas' my middle nayme... 0o \_\|_/
General Xenophon	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:41:00 - [780] Originally by: Hra Neuvosto >paying ISK for more saved fittings Yea that's like paying for extended bookmark space.... someone in CCP perks up "AHA! New Business strategy!" ----------------------------------------------- One stupid item in a 'pay to play' game shouldn't cost 5 months worth of playtime to buy in an item shop!
General Xenophon	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:44:00 - [781] Originally by: graphitemaster Originally by: Malias Yakusto This picture is missing a monacle ----------------------------------------------- One stupid item in a 'pay to play' game shouldn't cost 5 months worth of playtime to buy in an item shop!
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:45:00 - [782] Originally by: General Xenophon Originally by: Hra Neuvosto >paying ISK for more saved fittings Yea that's like paying for extended bookmark space.... someone in CCP perks up "AHA! New Business strategy!" Haha, how god damn pathetic is that?
Marcus Caspius Caldari Vitriol Ventures BLACK-MARK	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:47:00 - [783]
Hannibal Ord Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:50:00 - [784] I suppose it's what you get for putting a Goonswarm pilot on your design team.
Duchy Duke	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:50:00 - [785] Looks like the family farm is up for sale
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:51:00 - [786] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: General Xenophon Originally by: Hra Neuvosto >paying ISK for more saved fittings Yea that's like paying for extended bookmark space.... someone in CCP perks up "AHA! New Business strategy!" Haha, how god damn pathetic is that? Don't give them ideas.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:55:00 - [787] lol ... corp bookmarks finally implemented, $1 per bookmark! *** Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Xa Fel	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:56:00 - [788] Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 04:56:27 It's from EVE News 24... How the ** are you people eating this bull up? Have any of you even read half the these guys write? It's downright Grade A FUD. Near every bit. Look at the way they word their articles and how you can highlight all the text in this amateur looking document. This is Rivertini driving up his ad revenue on his laggy ing blog. For serious. I'm pretty sure there are way more reputable places to leak this than his site, by the way. Why him? Bull**. That's why.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 04:58:00 - [789] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 04:59:23 I suspect that even with all the outrage at this possibly real, possibly fake "leaked" document, CCP's reaction is,"You mad bro?" Until we have our angry mob on their door step with torches and pitchforks ready it's likely this whole MicroTransaction world of ***gotry will persist. Just sayin'.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:00:00 - [790] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 04:59:23 I suspect that even with all the outrage at this possibly real, possibly fake "leaked" document, CCP's reaction is,"You mad bro?" Until we have our angry mob on their door step with torches and pitchforks ready it's likely this whole MicroTransaction world of ***gotry will persist. Just sayin'. 600,000 AUR to titan bridge an angry mob.
Vandrion Gallente The Collective B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:01:00 - [791] Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 04:59:23 I suspect that even with all the outrage at this possibly real, possibly fake "leaked" document, CCP's reaction is,"You mad bro?" Until we have our angry mob on their door step with torches and pitchforks ready it's likely this whole MicroTransaction world of ***gotry will persist. Just sayin'. 600,000 AUR to titan bridge an angry mob. Pitchfork ready!
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:01:00 - [792] Originally by: Xa Fel Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 04:56:27 It's from EVE News 24... How the ** are you people eating this bull up? Have any of you even read half the these guys write? It's downright Grade A FUD. Near every bit. Look at the way they word their articles and how you can highlight all the text in this amateur looking document. This is Rivertini driving up his ad revenue on his laggy ing blog. For serious. I'm pretty sure there are way more reputable places to leak this than his site, by the way. Why him? Bull**. That's why. You're an idiot. The full unedited version was released on twitter by Helicity and several former CSM members also had full copies a month ago.
Justin Cody Caldari T.A.L.O.N. Company	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:02:00 - [793] Originally by: Hannibal Ord I suppose it's what you get for putting a Goonswarm pilot on your design team. Goons trolling all of EVE at once? BRILLIANT! Remind people that profit is the difference between revenue and expense. This makes you look smart. Scott Adams
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:02:00 - [794] Breaking news!!! CCP responds to playerbase outrage!! Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:03:00 - [795] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Xa Fel Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 04:56:27 It's from EVE News 24... How the ** are you people eating this bull up? Have any of you even read half the these guys write? It's downright Grade A FUD. Near every bit. Look at the way they word their articles and how you can highlight all the text in this amateur looking document. This is Rivertini driving up his ad revenue on his laggy ing blog. For serious. I'm pretty sure there are way more reputable places to leak this than his site, by the way. Why him? Bull. That's why. You're an idiot. The full unedited version was released on twitter by Helicity and several former CSM members also had full copies a month ago. It is noble you try to respond to him, but if he hasn't read anything at all tonight, why do you think he'll start here? We can't fix stupid, but I wish we could. AG * Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:05:00 - [796] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Breaking news!!! CCP responds to playerbase outrage!! Have to admit, I chuckled.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:06:00 - [797] And btw...
Cpt Xao	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:07:00 - [798] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Breaking news!!! CCP responds to playerbase outrage!! Have to admit, I chuckled. LOL THIS DOOR ??
Xa Fel	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:11:00 - [799] Calm down there, Keyboard Warrior. Which CSM members had it? Which guys confirmed it? Please disclose. I'm not going to sort the Threadnaught to find out, personally. But you seem well-informed, so enlighten me. Why should I digest Rivertini's bull**** this time?
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:12:00 - [800] Originally by: Xa Fel Calm down there, Keyboard Warrior. Which CSM members had it? Which guys confirmed it? Please disclose. I'm not going to sort the Threadnaught to find out, personally. But you seem well-informed, so enlighten me. Why should I digest Rivertini's bull**** this time? I'm not going to rehash a threadnaught for you either. http://failheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2434
Half Cocked Jack	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:17:00 - [801] This whole affair is entirely too full of "he said she said" monkey business. I don't really think this little pamphlet is legit. God, I hope it isn't.
Justin Cody Caldari T.A.L.O.N. Company	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:22:00 - [802] Remind people that profit is the difference between revenue and expense. This makes you look smart. Scott Adams
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:24:00 - [803] I shall, for the time being, remain optimistic that the paper is indeed a fake, however, there is a distinct lack of anyone saying it is not, and when I was scrolling through the pages I also noted that a CSM confirmed it, and there has been an article written already Still no reply CCP? And not a peep from anyone at CCP other than, "we are monitoring the situation."
Xa Fel	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:25:00 - [804] Awesome, another Threadnaught. It's a Threadnaught in a Threadnaught! I've noticed Helicity is in pretty close contact with EVE News 24, sir. I've been glancing over his twitter feed. I'm considering him in on this little hoax. I can't take his word and I've never even heard of this guy. I just can't. I have seen zero solid proof of this being real and people are going ape **. Sure, you can go ahead and throw your account away. You totally could. i'm sure as hell not going to stop you, but it's a game. I see everyone losing their **ing mind over it. Rather than waiting to see if this was a joke the staff played on one another or an edited document. (Photoshop is easy, bro.) I mean, that's not exactly tough... So, let's try this again. Which CSM guys had it? Who confirmed it? Is it just rumors? Has CCP said anything, yet? In what way does this seem solid? I'm just trying to look at this logically, rather than going "OMFGRAGE" and closing my account...
Panda Name Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:27:00 - [805] canceling isn't quitting. it's just simply the most effective way to send a message to CCP, given that there is no way in hell they are going to read through all of these threads. if this internal document is proven to be a troll (it isn't), then i'm sure many people that claim they are quitting will simply click the renew button. otherwise, those that cancelled simply are just waiting for a sign from the amarrian gods that our worst fears will not be realized (they will).
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:27:00 - [806] Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 05:28:30 Originally by: Xa Fel Awesome, another Threadnaught. It's a Threadnaught in a Threadnaught! I've noticed Helicity is in pretty close contact with EVE News 24, sir. I've been glancing over his twitter feed. I'm considering him in on this little hoax. I can't take his word and I've never even heard of this guy. I just can't. I have seen zero solid proof of this being real and people are going ape **. Sure, you can go ahead and throw your account away. You totally could. i'm sure as hell not going to stop you, but it's a game. I see everyone losing their ing mind over it. Rather than waiting to see if this was a joke the staff played on one another or an edited document. (Photoshop is easy, bro.) I mean, that's not exactly tough... So, let's try this again. Which CSM guys had it? Who confirmed it? Is it just rumors? Has CCP said anything, yet? In what way does this seem solid? I'm just trying to look at this logically, rather than going "OMFGRAGE" and closing my account... God you're such a douche. It's all in the first 5 pages of the scrapheap thread, Helicity runs the ing Hulkageddon and has nothing to do with Riverini's **ed . Seleene confirmed it looks legit and he ing worked for CCP, TeaDaze and Mynxee both had copies of this on the 28th of May. Learn to Read ffs EDIT: AAAAND Helicity also exposed how badly CCP **ed up the new forums and has been banned from this forum for posting the unedited version to twitter.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:30:00 - [807] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 05:32:11 Originally by: Xa Fel Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 05:27:16 Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Xa Fel Calm down there, Keyboard Warrior. Which CSM members had it? Which guys confirmed it? Please disclose. I'm not going to sort the Threadnaught to find out, personally. But you seem well-informed, so enlighten me. Why should I digest Rivertini's bull**** this time? I'm not going to rehash a threadnaught for you either. http://failheap-challenge.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2434 Awesome, another Threadnaught. It's a Threadnaught in a Threadnaught! I've noticed Helicity is in pretty close contact with EVE News 24, sir. I've been glancing over his twitter feed. I'm considering him in on this little hoax. I can't take his word and I've never even heard of this guy. I just can't. I have seen zero solid proof of this being real and people are going ape **. Sure, you can go ahead and throw your account away. You totally could. i'm sure as hell not going to stop you, but it's a game. I see everyone losing their **ing mind over it. Rather than waiting to see if this was a joke the staff played on one another or an edited document. (Photoshop is easy, bro.) I mean, that's not exactly tough... So, let's try this again. Which CSM guys had it? Who confirmed it? Is it just rumors? Has CCP said anything, yet? In what way does this seem solid? I'm just trying to look at this logically, rather than going "OMFGRAGE" and closing my account... ^^ these are the people that caused things like LMGTFY to be created. And on a side note, it's a shop, you can tell by the pixels, right? RIGHT?
Ren Nekk Dead Eye Dogs	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:35:00 - [808] lolccp... but honestly this is sad. Despite following all the Incarna/MT crap pretty closely for a long time, it has been my feeling that CCP would never cross EVE over into the crazy, F2P, $-for-faction-standing business. So I have not been very worried about all the love and tears I've put into the game. I guess I have considered it a sound investment. I really don't want to think about leaving EVE and letting my subs lapse - don't want to think about all my wonderful pilots quickly fading in oblivion. However, if that PDF is legit, I'm outta here. :( ...sort of awaiting CCP response...
Xa Fel	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:41:00 - [809] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 05:28:30 Originally by: Xa Fel Awesome, another Threadnaught. It's a Threadnaught in a Threadnaught! I've noticed Helicity is in pretty close contact with EVE News 24, sir. I've been glancing over his twitter feed. I'm considering him in on this little hoax. I can't take his word and I've never even heard of this guy. I just can't. I have seen zero solid proof of this being real and people are going ape **. Sure, you can go ahead and throw your account away. You totally could. i'm sure as hell not going to stop you, but it's a game. I see everyone losing their ing mind over it. Rather than waiting to see if this was a joke the staff played on one another or an edited document. (Photoshop is easy, bro.) I mean, that's not exactly tough... So, let's try this again. Which CSM guys had it? Who confirmed it? Is it just rumors? Has CCP said anything, yet? In what way does this seem solid? I'm just trying to look at this logically, rather than going "OMFGRAGE" and closing my account... God you're such a douche. It's all in the first 5 pages of the scrapheap thread, Helicity runs the ing Hulkageddon and has nothing to do with Riverini's **ed . Seleene confirmed it looks legit and he ing worked for CCP, TeaDaze and Mynxee both had copies of this on the 28th of May. Learn to Read ffs EDIT: AAAAND Helicity also exposed how badly CCP ed up the new forums and has been banned from this forum for posting the unedited version to twitter. And you're such a tooled out sucker. I got a bridge to sell you in Brookyln, bro. By the way, the word Gullible is written on your ceiling. :P Teadaze says it could be a reworked version, doesn't confirm authenticity and barely read the version laying around the offices, Helicity is ban evading repeatedly and stirring up a bunch of . Somehow he's leaking and in-possession of unedited copies and has the ability to remove locks on the document? He's also bouncing a lot of tweets towards EN24 on twitter. Seems to be in-contact. Mynxee isn't present in that thread. Can't find confirmation on your claims. Her twitter feed is kind of jacked with @ replies and I can't find anything relating to this. Helicity seems to be a drama queen. Look, I'm willing to be proven wrong. Calm the down and act like a damned adult. I'm just trying to look at this logically. So far I see no proof, just he said, she said. Little more. Stop getting worked up over a **ing game.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:44:00 - [810] Originally by: Xa Fel Originally by: Isil Rahsen Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 05:28:30 Originally by: Xa Fel Awesome, another Threadnaught. It's a Threadnaught in a Threadnaught! I've noticed Helicity is in pretty close contact with EVE News 24, sir. I've been glancing over his twitter feed. I'm considering him in on this little hoax. I can't take his word and I've never even heard of this guy. I just can't. I have seen zero solid proof of this being real and people are going ape **. Sure, you can go ahead and throw your account away. You totally could. i'm sure as hell not going to stop you, but it's a game. I see everyone losing their ing mind over it. Rather than waiting to see if this was a joke the staff played on one another or an edited document. (Photoshop is easy, bro.) I mean, that's not exactly tough... So, let's try this again. Which CSM guys had it? Who confirmed it? Is it just rumors? Has CCP said anything, yet? In what way does this seem solid? I'm just trying to look at this logically, rather than going "OMFGRAGE" and closing my account... God you're such a douche. It's all in the first 5 pages of the scrapheap thread, Helicity runs the ing Hulkageddon and has nothing to do with Riverini's **ed . Seleene confirmed it looks legit and he ing worked for CCP, TeaDaze and Mynxee both had copies of this on the 28th of May. Learn to Read ffs EDIT: AAAAND Helicity also exposed how badly CCP ed up the new forums and has been banned from this forum for posting the unedited version to twitter. And you're such a tooled out sucker. I got a bridge to sell you in Brookyln, bro. By the way, the word Gullible is written on your ceiling. :P Teadaze says it could be a reworked version, doesn't confirm authenticity and barely read the version laying around the offices, Helicity is ban evading repeatedly and stirring up a bunch of . Somehow he's leaking and in-possession of unedited copies and has the ability to remove locks on the document? He's also bouncing a lot of tweets towards EN24 on twitter. Seems to be in-contact. Mynxee isn't present in that thread. Can't find confirmation on your claims. Her twitter feed is kind of jacked with @ replies and I can't find anything relating to this. Helicity seems to be a drama queen. Look, I'm willing to be proven wrong. Calm the down and act like a damned adult. I'm just trying to look at this logically. So far I see no proof, just he said, she said. Little more. Stop getting worked up over a ing game. So in the last 8 hours, CCP just decided NOT to say, oh yeah that's fake? * Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:45:00 - [811] Just popping in to say if this MT **** goes beyond vanity items I will quit EVE the next moment regardless of how much I`ll regret it. From the monetizing 3rd party apps blog moment I have stopped trying to persuade people to play this game. Keep going this way and I`ll leave. I may be a drop in the pond , but there are already many drops ready to form a torrent.
YouShouldntEatIt Caldari Interstellar Waste Management Committee	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:47:00 - [812] I, like many greats before me, have unsubbed all 3 of my accounts. CCP has until they die to change my mind.
Xa Fel	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:49:00 - [813] Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 05:50:53 Originally by: Apollo Gabriel Originally by: Xa Fel Originally by: Isil Rahsen Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 05:28:30 Originally by: Xa Fel Awesome, another Threadnaught. It's a Threadnaught in a Threadnaught! I've noticed Helicity is in pretty close contact with EVE News 24, sir. I've been glancing over his twitter feed. I'm considering him in on this little hoax. I can't take his word and I've never even heard of this guy. I just can't. I have seen zero solid proof of this being real and people are going ape **. Sure, you can go ahead and throw your account away. You totally could. i'm sure as hell not going to stop you, but it's a game. I see everyone losing their ing mind over it. Rather than waiting to see if this was a joke the staff played on one another or an edited document. (Photoshop is easy, bro.) I mean, that's not exactly tough... So, let's try this again. Which CSM guys had it? Who confirmed it? Is it just rumors? Has CCP said anything, yet? In what way does this seem solid? I'm just trying to look at this logically, rather than going "OMFGRAGE" and closing my account... God you're such a douche. It's all in the first 5 pages of the scrapheap thread, Helicity runs the ing Hulkageddon and has nothing to do with Riverini's **ed . Seleene confirmed it looks legit and he ing worked for CCP, TeaDaze and Mynxee both had copies of this on the 28th of May. Learn to Read ffs EDIT: AAAAND Helicity also exposed how badly CCP ed up the new forums and has been banned from this forum for posting the unedited version to twitter. And you're such a tooled out sucker. I got a bridge to sell you in Brookyln, bro. By the way, the word Gullible is written on your ceiling. :P Teadaze says it could be a reworked version, doesn't confirm authenticity and barely read the version laying around the offices, Helicity is ban evading repeatedly and stirring up a bunch of . Somehow he's leaking and in-possession of unedited copies and has the ability to remove locks on the document? He's also bouncing a lot of tweets towards EN24 on twitter. Seems to be in-contact. Mynxee isn't present in that thread. Can't find confirmation on your claims. Her twitter feed is kind of jacked with @ replies and I can't find anything relating to this. Helicity seems to be a drama queen. Look, I'm willing to be proven wrong. Calm the down and act like a damned adult. I'm just trying to look at this logically. So far I see no proof, just he said, she said. Little more. Stop getting worked up over a ing game. So in the last 8 hours, CCP just decided NOT to say, oh yeah that's fake? It's 5:44 AM in Iceland and almost 2:00 AM on the East Coast where their Atlanta offices are. I wouldn't be in a hurry to jump back on the clock at that hour to solve some groundless drama, either. Hell, they're probably out living their lives or something. The moderators likely don't have the authority to denounce things like this to the public, either. I mean, if you had a major PR Issue going on and you weren't exactly of the authority with your company, would you go spouting off about things without really knowing? If this pamphlet even is real, how many employees do you think honestly gave enough of a to read it? I don't read half the ** my company hands out to me. Most of it ends up in the waste bin... On a lighter note, please don't un-sub, Carebears. I need someone to keep shooting at me in High Sec when I yoink their loot. :( Who will I ninja if you all leave?!
Dograzor The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:51:00 - [814] TBH at this point no damage control is going to save them. - "We don't gank, we just apply force in a disproportionate manner during an uneven tactical combat situation to maximize revenue and increase shareholder value"
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:52:00 - [815] And WRONG again...CCP did say on twitter (Soundwave himselve) he saw the thread and was monitoring it. If it was fake, no way it wouldnt be closed by now. And lets say, it is FAKE, so what? Nothing better then a this to show what we DONT want. Time not wasted, not at all.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:53:00 - [816] Originally by: Ren Nekk ...sort of awaiting CCP response... You are correct. Don't bother waiting around for the bull****.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 05:55:00 - [817] Originally by: Xa Fel So far I see no proof, just he said, she said. Little more. Stop getting worked up over a **ing game. You're an idiot like I originally said. Not only can you not read but you can't work out how someone can strip a PDF of encryption. Mynxee confirmed on twitter and in several places on failheap. Not my problem you can't find it. FROM THE THREAD Originally by:** "Mynxee" Originally by: "Joe Appleby" I saw this pop up on rss via evenews24, glanced over it, went holy crap. It is one hell of an effort to fake it at this level. What I am wondering though is, how old is this? The guy at massively, could he give a publication date for this? The document is dated May 2011. I received a copy on 28 May 2011. The properties of my copy show the document created date as 20 May 2011 at 11:48 AM. :) Originally by: "Mynxee" Originally by: "Aypse" Originally by: "Mynxee" Originally by: "Joe Appleby" I saw this pop up on rss via evenews24, glanced over it, went holy crap. It is one hell of an effort to fake it at this level. What I am wondering though is, how old is this? The guy at massively, could he give a publication date for this? The document is dated May 2011. I received a copy on 28 May 2011. The properties of my copy show the document created date as 20 May 2011 at 11:48 AM. :) Did you receive it from an official source? Or a leak source? I'll just say I got it from a source who has provided extremely reliable and spot-on information in the past. But it's irrelevant now that the document has been released into the wild apparently via multiple channels. And incidentally, I shared it with no one, yet Helicity's linked "complete" document is a bit-for-bit identical copy to the one I was given. Also, I'm not worked up over anything. I find this whole situation hilarious. Haven't even been subbed since 26/04. So keep telling me to calm down as I laugh at this whole ****ed up fiasco.
Lisbo	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:07:00 - [818] Edited by: Lisbo on 23/06/2011 06:07:09 and uppppp...yours...no really, wtf.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:07:00 - [819] boing *** Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Kuronaga Kantian Principle	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:07:00 - [820] At least we get hookers soon.
Ulmon Aulen	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:08:00 - [821] "We're going to face an uphill struggle, and the reason many of us never talk about this publically is that we'd be burned at the stake by the players" - EVE Lead Game Designer As well you should. I'll add my hat to the ring and say that if this gets implemented then I'm done with Eve.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:08:00 - [822] Originally by: Kuronaga At least we get hookers soon. Cost more than real ones, and you have to do all the work your self. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Mag'nal	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:10:00 - [823] Originally by: Ulmon Aulen "We're going to face an uphill struggle, and the reason many of us never talk about this publically is that we'd be burned at the stake by the players" - EVE Lead Game Designer Exactly, CCP, quick, take a quick pause and... LISTEN TO YOURSELF! --------------------------------- It's all in your head. You're living a lie. There is nothing money can't buy.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:12:00 - [824] Edited by: Black Dranzer on 23/06/2011 06:16:45 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oClM8tja5-o Sad nostalgic music, anyone? An Ibis in Todaki, all those years ago... I guess all good things have to end, though. Edit: Updated to the newer version of the song.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:14:00 - [825] Originally by: Ulmon Aulen "We're going to face an uphill struggle, and the reason many of us never talk about this publically is that we'd be burned at the stake by the players" - EVE Lead Game Designer Did someone say burn? Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:17:00 - [826] We need more kindling! The Fire of Hatred appears to be dying out. Resuscitate the fire of a thousand angry nerds!
HoboWithAShip	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:22:00 - [827] Edited by: HoboWithAShip on 23/06/2011 06:22:48 Originally by: Ulmon Aulen "We're going to face an uphill struggle, and the reason many of us never talk about this publically is that we'd be burned at the stake by the players" - EVE Lead Game Designer As well you should. I'll add my hat to the ring and say that if this gets implemented then I'm done with Eve. Sooner or later someone is going to go ahead and make a picture of a crucified Soundwave. That's when **** is going to get real... and hilarious.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:22:00 - [828] We will be strong till the weak timezone is over
Edisonn Trent	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:24:00 - [829] Originally by: Black Dranzer Edited by: Black Dranzer on 23/06/2011 06:16:45 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oClM8tja5-o Sad nostalgic music, anyone? An Ibis in Todaki, all those years ago... I guess all good things have to end, though. Edit: Updated to the newer version of the song. +1
Alexingeras	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:27:00 - [830] Just canceled my subscriptions. No you can't have my stuff.
MrShooter Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:28:00 - [831]
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:35:00 - [832] Slackers, don't let this slip, ppl have to know
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:36:00 - [833] New mantra: Micro Transactions will turn EVE into STO. (Cancelled my sub to STO to play more EVE. Mostly due to the fact that to have anything really cool in the game you had to buy it with ***tari tokens so the game lost it's appeal, even though my inner nerd was sad to say bye to Star Trek themed game that was fun for a while.)
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:38:00 - [834] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Slackers, don't let this slip, ppl have to know Oops
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:41:00 - [835] You know what's going to be more miserable than anything? When they put out a compromising "Oh it's still early days we'll see where it all goes" post and everybody resubs and cheers as if it'll never happen again.
FunzzeR The Wyld Hunt Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:42:00 - [836] The Scottish Fold does not approve.. PRAISE THE SCOTTISH FOLD!! THEIR WILL SHALL BE DONE!!
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:47:00 - [837]
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:47:00 - [838] As it currently is with the ridiculous pricing, CCP has left a bad taste in my mouth. However, I'm not so rash and blinded by rage to unsub yet when things become truly ludicrous, and if our words go unheeded, then yes, I too will be gone with all of my accounts.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:48:00 - [839] A lot of what's said I don't have a major problem with. It's the items of power bit... the ammunition, ships and one assumes modules appearing in this store. A Hello Kitty Apoc is still just a reskinned Apoc, it looks different but has the exact same stats as any other non-T2, non-Navy Apoc. The 'Total Hell Death' Apoc and it's associated guns & crystals in that store won't. It will be superior to the standard versions a player can get in game, a fair assumption to make where MTing for "items of power" is concerned. That means I'm at a disadvantage because my, theoretical max SP for flying an Apoc can't push the tank or damage as hard as someone who has both the same amount of SP AND disposable income to burn on such. Winning becomes a function of who has the most RL money, not who has the better tactics/stratergy/spies/whatever. And that I can not abide. Whatever appears in that store I should have the ability, even with silly amounts of grind & random drops, to get without using my CC.
Moss Rose	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:51:00 - [840] Eve online is dead on " 1st December 2009 "
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:52:00 - [841] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Winning becomes a function of who has the most RL money, not who has the better tactics/stratergy/spies/whatever. This right here is what the apologists will never understand, to them it's too hard to develop gameplay skills (real ones) and it's instant gratification or nothing. It's really sad/pathetic to think about.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:54:00 - [842] Its the ppl who put a cheatcode in a game to master it because they feel entitled to after buying it. And thats why every game today seems to play itself, you don't have to do alot anymore, just lean back.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:57:00 - [843] Originally by: Black Dranzer Edited by: Black Dranzer on 23/06/2011 06:16:45 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oClM8tja5-o Sad nostalgic music, anyone? An Ibis in Todaki, all those years ago... I guess all good things have to end, though. Edit: Updated to the newer version of the song. You're killing me
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 06:59:00 - [844] Originally by: Xa Fel Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 04:56:27 It's from EVE News 24... How the ** are you people eating this bull up? Have any of you even read half the these guys write? It's downright Grade A FUD. Near every bit. Look at the way they word their articles and how you can highlight all the text in this amateur looking document. This is Rivertini driving up his ad revenue on his laggy ing blog. For serious. I'm pretty sure there are way more reputable places to leak this than his site, by the way. Why him? Bull**. That's why. How much you like to belee it's fake,... This here is copy pasted straight from the Devblog,... Deffinatly no fake,.. Read it through and call it a bluff. This crap clearly shows the catatonic state of mind CCP resides in. "subscription 2.0 reported by CCP Hammer \| 2008.04.01 00:38:57 \| Comments Here at CCP we care very strongly about our product, and we're constantly evaluating new paradigms and thoughtspaces in order to better realize our Total Market Potential. Our goal is to enhance the customer experience by offering new product channels and opportunities, allowing our customers to participate through selective transactional channels and fully realize their potential as Valued Income Partners û VIPs! Today we're announcing an exciting new service family, which we're calling "Subscription 2.0". In the spirit of Web 2.0, this new Integrated Business Bundle will allow VIPs û that's you! û to participate in the global product community, creating your own Tailored Product Packages in a way which best matches your Ideal Product Experience. Just as Web 2.0 is built on top of Web 1.0, Subscription 2.0 will be built on top of Subscription 1.0. We're not changing the underlying Service Provision Model û you'll still be paying a monthly fee as part of your Community Participation Agreement û although certain product areas will be migrated across to Subscription 2.0 in order to enhance user choice through Selective Resourcing. Subscription 2.0 will allow you to invest in optional product areas on an ad-hoc basis, so you only pay for what you actually want! Our launch product for Subscription 2.0 will be AmmoAnywhere!, which will be fully integrated into the client next week. It does exactly what it says on the tin û simply click the new "AmmoAnywhere!" button in the UI, and a new stack of ammunition will appear in your cargo hold. We've done everything we can to streamline this process, so there's no fiddling about with details and authorization: once you've set up your account to enable Subscription 2.0, clicking "AmmoAnywhere!" will automatically bill your credit card for the transaction as part of the Customer Experience Process. No hassle, no fuss, instant ammunition! Of course, we've had to make a few changes in order to fully realize the Product Delivery Potential of this new service. First up, all weapons will now use "NanoAmmo", which automatically morphs into the desired ammunition type at the point of firing. This ensures that there's no confusion over what ammo types you need to buy, streamlining the customer experience. Secondly, as we're projecting universal uptake for this service, we're removing the ability to manufacture ammunition in order to prevent people from erroneously utilizing manufacturing lines to build ammunition. This means more manufacturing capacity for everyone! Contingent upon a fully realized Product Delivery Potential, we have an additional range of Subscription 2.0 services in the pipeline which will further enhance the Customer Experience Process. These include InstaClone, Dock-O-Matic, T1 and T2 releases of BlueprintNow!, and many more. Subscription 2.0 û the future is TODAY!"
Adacia Calla Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:00:00 - [845] I've given CCP enough money, later.
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:01:00 - [846] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bb6cBKE3WzQ&feature=related I find it appropriate.
Alley Specter	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:01:00 - [847] Originally by: Wanda Wong Originally by: Xa Fel Edited by: Xa Fel on 23/06/2011 04:56:27 It's from EVE News 24... How the ** are you people eating this bull up? Have any of you even read half the these guys write? It's downright Grade A FUD. Near every bit. Look at the way they word their articles and how you can highlight all the text in this amateur looking document. This is Rivertini driving up his ad revenue on his laggy ing blog. For serious. I'm pretty sure there are way more reputable places to leak this than his site, by the way. Why him? Bull**. That's why. How much you like to belee it's fake,... This here is copy pasted straight from the Devblog,... Deffinatly no fake,.. Read it through and call it a bluff. This crap clearly shows the catatonic state of mind CCP resides in. "subscription 2.0 reported by CCP Hammer \| 2008.04.01 00:38:57 \| Comments Here at CCP we care very strongly about our product, and we're constantly evaluating new paradigms and thoughtspaces in order to better realize our Total Market Potential. Our goal is to enhance the customer experience by offering new product channels and opportunities, allowing our customers to participate through selective transactional channels and fully realize their potential as Valued Income Partners û VIPs! Today we're announcing an exciting new service family, which we're calling "Subscription 2.0". In the spirit of Web 2.0, this new Integrated Business Bundle will allow VIPs û that's you! û to participate in the global product community, creating your own Tailored Product Packages in a way which best matches your Ideal Product Experience. Just as Web 2.0 is built on top of Web 1.0, Subscription 2.0 will be built on top of Subscription 1.0. We're not changing the underlying Service Provision Model û you'll still be paying a monthly fee as part of your Community Participation Agreement û although certain product areas will be migrated across to Subscription 2.0 in order to enhance user choice through Selective Resourcing. Subscription 2.0 will allow you to invest in optional product areas on an ad-hoc basis, so you only pay for what you actually want! Our launch product for Subscription 2.0 will be AmmoAnywhere!, which will be fully integrated into the client next week. It does exactly what it says on the tin û simply click the new "AmmoAnywhere!" button in the UI, and a new stack of ammunition will appear in your cargo hold. We've done everything we can to streamline this process, so there's no fiddling about with details and authorization: once you've set up your account to enable Subscription 2.0, clicking "AmmoAnywhere!" will automatically bill your credit card for the transaction as part of the Customer Experience Process. No hassle, no fuss, instant ammunition! Of course, we've had to make a few changes in order to fully realize the Product Delivery Potential of this new service. First up, all weapons will now use "NanoAmmo", which automatically morphs into the desired ammunition type at the point of firing. This ensures that there's no confusion over what ammo types you need to buy, streamlining the customer experience. Secondly, as we're projecting universal uptake for this service, we're removing the ability to manufacture ammunition in order to prevent people from erroneously utilizing manufacturing lines to build ammunition. This means more manufacturing capacity for everyone! Contingent upon a fully realized Product Delivery Potential, we have an additional range of Subscription 2.0 services in the pipeline which will further enhance the Customer Experience Process. These include InstaClone, Dock-O-Matic, T1 and T2 releases of BlueprintNow!, and many more. Subscription 2.0 û the future is TODAY!" That was an April Fool's Joke. The only reason I'm not calling you an idiot is because it WAS. Now...it's no longer a joke.
Rob Stark Minmatar Nemzeti Front	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:04:00 - [848] Way to go... More and more outrageous f*ckup (new forum, anomaly nerf, 99 dollar, etc) Less and less feature (Minmatar Captain's Cell as expansion) More and more greed. That's how you lose your "greatest asset"
El'Niaga Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:05:00 - [849] Originally by: Tobiaz That's truly a disheartening read. Withholding basic functionality like being able to store +50 fittings just so CCP can make money of it? It's clear how deep they have fallen. Kristoffer Touborg is CCP Soundwave by the way. It's really troubling that one of the main devs of team BFF, tasked with hammering out fixes and rebalancing, is so in love with MT. And his attitude towards the community is disgusting. He makes himself sound like a Jehova's Witness trying to convert us to his lord and saviour: Macro-Transaction. And the part about buying faction standing or sov... WTF?! they really don't understand their own game if they don't see why it's important for the game of this being hard to get and NOT to be simply bought for RL. The attitude and viewpoints expressed in it does match well CCP Soundwaves public comments. If it is fake its a very good likeness of him. However I lean that this is probably real.
El'Niaga Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:08:00 - [850] Originally by: stoicfaux There's no such thing as bad publicity. Given the drama surrounding the Incarna launch, you have to wonder if CCP didn't decide to go ahead and "leak" the document on the grounds that the emo-rage-butthurt can't get any worse. All things said, it is a pretty slick and well presented document. It makes it sound as if CCP has a plan, a plan that they've put serious thought into it. Yeah all that bad publicity in Nov/Dec 2005 didn't hurt SWG or SOE, oh wait.....
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:12:00 - [851] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A lot of what's said I don't have a major problem with. It's the items of power bit... the ammunition, ships and one assumes modules appearing in this store. A Hello Kitty Apoc is still just a reskinned Apoc, it looks different but has the exact same stats as any other non-T2, non-Navy Apoc. The 'Total Hell Death' Apoc and it's associated guns & crystals in that store won't. It will be superior to the standard versions a player can get in game, a fair assumption to make where MTing for "items of power" is concerned. That means I'm at a disadvantage because my, theoretical max SP for flying an Apoc can't push the tank or damage as hard as someone who has both the same amount of SP AND disposable income to burn on such. Winning becomes a function of who has the most RL money, not who has the better tactics/stratergy/spies/whatever. And that I can not abide. Whatever appears in that store I should have the ability, even with silly amounts of grind & random drops, to get without using my CC. You can already buy a 'Total Hell Death' apoc with real money. Just buy timecodes, convert them to isk and get all officer fitted apoc. While you're at it you can buy a dozen titans and a hundred or so supercarriers for your alliance. Don't forget to buy a supercap capable char for every member also. Or you could just do it with silly amounts of grind & random drops. Am I missing something here?
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:13:00 - [852] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 07:14:33 Yes, alot. How about you start reading...or better, understanding. ATM you can't buy anything thats not involved in the EVE economy (mining, production, market). If these plans are real, you will directly purchase stuff for aurum = no mining, no production, no market. Its out of the loop of the EVE econonmy. If this still doesn't worry you, don't bother. Be happy with what is there to come.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:14:00 - [853] Originally by: Mikaaro Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A lot of what's said I don't have a major problem with. It's the items of power bit... the ammunition, ships and one assumes modules appearing in this store. A Hello Kitty Apoc is still just a reskinned Apoc, it looks different but has the exact same stats as any other non-T2, non-Navy Apoc. The 'Total Hell Death' Apoc and it's associated guns & crystals in that store won't. It will be superior to the standard versions a player can get in game, a fair assumption to make where MTing for "items of power" is concerned. That means I'm at a disadvantage because my, theoretical max SP for flying an Apoc can't push the tank or damage as hard as someone who has both the same amount of SP AND disposable income to burn on such. Winning becomes a function of who has the most RL money, not who has the better tactics/stratergy/spies/whatever. And that I can not abide. Whatever appears in that store I should have the ability, even with silly amounts of grind & random drops, to get without using my CC. You can already buy a 'Total Hell Death' apoc with real money. Just buy timecodes, convert them to isk and get all officer fitted apoc. While you're at it you can buy a dozen titans and a hundred or so supercarriers for your alliance. Don't forget to buy a supercap capable char for every member also. Or you could just do it with silly amounts of grind & random drops. Am I missing something here? Yea you are, someone was out there possibly getting ships blown up or atleast putting in gameplay to get the mods/minerals/everything for all those ships/mods/and isk. Big difference.
Malcanis Caldari Vanishing Point. The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:17:00 - [854] Well this is disappointing. Just as I was starting to really enjoy EVE again, this happens. I can't be bothered raging again, I don't have the energy or :care: left after last time. If that prize idiot Soundwaves ideas get implemented, it's the end. Pity, really. EVE could have been good. Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players.
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:19:00 - [855] Originally by: Alley Specter That was an April Fool's Joke. The only reason I'm not calling you an idiot is because it WAS. Now...it's no longer a joke. No, indeed you are right becouse by the looks of things this is exactly what CCP is heading moving to. Be it a joke or not i suggest you read the whole document that started this ****storm, how much of a difference is buying standing opposed to buyin ammo on a whim? You answer me this.
Flamewave Crimson Moon Society	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:20:00 - [856] Originally by: Words Words Words ccp? no, its just me, gabe newell Items in TF2 can be found or crafted through normal gameplay without spending one cent. Items in the NeX shop can only be created by spending real money. It's kinda sad, really. __________
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:20:00 - [857] Originally by: Malcanis Well this is disappointing. Just as I was starting to really enjoy EVE again, this happens. I can't be bothered raging again, I don't have the energy or :care: left after last time. If that prize idiot Soundwaves ideas get implemented, it's the end. Pity, really. EVE could have been good. I know how you feel, just kick back an enjoy the ride down. Should at least be good for some laughs right? right...?
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:20:00 - [858] Now I know for sure what made Teadaze quit. I think I'll probably do the same, need a think about it first. Oh and its the same document that was on a table during one of the last CSM meetings. Its very real.
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:22:00 - [859] Now that we're getting something other than emorage, we can actually start to discuss. So this would basically crash EVEs economy model. Now think about that for a second. You guys actually think CCP would do this? Really? You think they're that stupid? For me this just proves that this is a very epic troll.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:23:00 - [860] Originally by: Kristal Meth That PDF contains what may be the most obnoxious font I've ever encountered, anywhere. That said, it is probably the all new CCP font that they'll use everywhere in game. I really didn't think there could be a font worse then Eve in-game. Just wow. Nearly unreadable.
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:23:00 - [861] Edited by: Norian Lonark on 23/06/2011 07:24:09 Originally by: Mikaaro You can already buy a 'Total Hell Death' apoc with real money. Just buy timecodes, convert them to isk and get all officer fitted apoc. While you're at it you can buy a dozen titans and a hundred or so supercarriers for your alliance. Don't forget to buy a supercap capable char for every member also. Or you could just do it with silly amounts of grind & random drops. Am I missing something here? Yes you are missing something so many people expressing their views here (me included this is the first point that has really got me on the forums with anger) arnt doing it because they hate EVE they are doing it because they love EVE. Read the document even CCP employees are questioning the MT route with the same fears that people expressing themselves on the forum have.
Shoot2kilI Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:23:00 - [862] Another six accounts reporting in for bio-mass / unsubbing when/if this get's implemented. At least they'll kill the game before Vuk can buy an RMT'd house, right? Oh wait.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:25:00 - [863] Originally by: Mikaaro Now that we're getting something other than emorage, we can actually start to discuss. So this would basically crash EVEs economy model. Now think about that for a second. You guys actually think CCP would do this? Really? You think they're that stupid? For me this just proves that this is a very epic troll. Umm, have you seen any of the other stupid **** they've done to the economy or the game period?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:25:00 - [864] Originally by: Shoot2kilI Another six accounts reporting in for bio-mass / unsubbing when/if this get's implemented. Forget this "when/if" stuff. It's done. CCP ARE completely, 100%, ****ed. It's over.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:28:00 - [865] Ok, some people apparently seem to believe that all items on the market appear out of thin air. 1) all ships are built by industrial characters 2) all mods that you cannot get a blueprint for come from fighting NPCs 3) all faction/deadspace/officer gear comes from mission/exploration/complex runners 4) while AURUM comes from PLEXes, the AURUM does not have to directly involve the market in any way, and the items that come from the NEX DO in fact, come from thin air. Even though a PLEX can be sold for ISK, the original ISK, and all items subsequently bought with that ISK came from players actively playing. THIS is why it has always been said that PLEX is different than MT.
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:31:00 - [866] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Mikaaro Now that we're getting something other than emorage, we can actually start to discuss. So this would basically crash EVEs economy model. Now think about that for a second. You guys actually think CCP would do this? Really? You think they're that stupid? For me this just proves that this is a very epic troll. Umm, have you seen any of the other stupid **** they've done to the economy or the game period? The economy still works way better than any other MMO and in the years I've played the game has improved a lot. Granted incarna as it is is just stupid, but I'll at least stick around to see where it actually goes before I condemn it.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:31:00 - [867] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Ok, some people apparently seem to believe that all items on the market appear out of thin air. 1) all ships are built by industrial characters 2) all mods that you cannot get a blueprint for come from fighting NPCs 3) all faction/deadspace/officer gear comes from mission/exploration/complex runners 4) while AURUM comes from PLEXes, the AURUM does not have to directly involve the market in any way, and the items that come from the NEX DO in fact, come from thin air. Even though a PLEX can be sold for ISK, the original ISK, and all items subsequently bought with that ISK came from players actively playing. THIS is why it has always been said that PLEX is different than MT. THIS THIS THIS Holy tap dancing christ THIS a million times. FFS How do you people play a game like this and not know how things are made?!
Patches Donnarblizen	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:32:00 - [868] this is really sad... just to make an example: if I play chess and I lose my Queen I would not want to buy her back with real money, even if the game would allow it. It destroys the immersion a game should reflect and the illusion of somehow equal playing grounds for everyone participating in a game. This will result definitely in an account unsub from my side...
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:32:00 - [869] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 07:33:54 Originally by: Mikaaro Now that we're getting something other than emorage, we can actually start to discuss. So this would basically crash EVEs economy model. Now think about that for a second. You guys actually think CCP would do this? Really? You think they're that stupid? For me this just proves that this is a very epic troll. i know i sound like an arrogant prick, but damn, just put 10min into google and search for MT-games and how they work. They will add items ON TOP of the current ones, so ppl buy them. Its the usual 2 way street in MT games, some stuff for the plebs who don't pay (or try to) and are the sheep/victims for the other ones, who pay, and get better items. Its like all T3 stuff would be AURUM only (incl frigs, BS, caps). Without production and WH, the items spawn once you buy them. Now tell me that would be a great sandbox to play in? EDIT: btw, CCP knows this is risky, they talk about this in the PDF. They just think they can do it better then all the other companies that tried.
Shoot2kilI Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:33:00 - [870] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Shoot2kilI Another six accounts reporting in for bio-mass / unsubbing when/if this get's implemented. Forget this "when/if" stuff. It's done. CCP ARE completely, 100%, **ed. It's over. What are you, some apostle of *gotry? It's not a done thing until it's confirmed, all you buttmad kids hanging out in the same thread crying about some potentially-self-invented-internet-spaceships-apocalypse need to get a bit of a grip on this thing you are so vehemently angry against, real money, and go spend it out there on something aside from the super-serious space ships that have at least 50% of the people in this thread e-raging like I'm playing counter-strike again. Seriously. The last thing CCP wants to do is kill their game. They enjoy the VERY LARGE amounts of money that drivel into it by means of subscription, PLEX, events, merchandise, etc. If you guys honestly think that they will look at this thread and/or take a massive hit to their subscription base and be OK with it, just to please a small, totally unrepresented, FIGURATIVE minority, you have your head shoved so far up the Doomsayer's ass to be much use to anyone.
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:35:00 - [871] Originally by: Malcanis Well this is disappointing. Just as I was starting to really enjoy EVE again, this happens. I can't be bothered raging again, I don't have the energy or :care: left after last time. If that prize idiot Soundwaves ideas get implemented, it's the end. Pity, really. EVE could have been good. Yea, and with you a ton of people. I'm a miner and have trained vor god knows how long and still am training up all the required crap after nearly 1 1/2 years of maxing out the relavant skills. and what will it all bould down to? Mining and everything associated with it becomes a dead art. Looks like a lot of this stink going round will end up just as obsolete as the deletion of the learning skills. their taking away part by part what made EVE unique and are implementing bit by bit more ways to slap money out of the pocket of their fanbase. Seriousely, they've eaten to much Hakarl becouse this update and the perspactives of eve start to stink as bad as their national delecacy. If you don't know what i'm saying,... just wach the clip here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwJYWEEL6wc
Azahni Vah'nos Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:36:00 - [872] One thing to note regarding the validity of the document in question is after having worked at a corporate level before I can guarantee you that a statement would have been made long ago if it was a complete fabrication. What will probably occur is CCP will turn around and say that the views expressed in the document were those of the individual and not those of the company. We'll wait and see.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:37:00 - [873] Edited by: BeanBagKing on 23/06/2011 07:37:42 Regarding the PLEX is MT argument, I'll self quote from here Quote: Yes I know there's a lot of gray area, people have been talking about PLEX -> ISK -> Ships for a while now. Vanity items are another gray area. At some point a dark enough shade of grey turns to black for me, that's where this is headed. It's not about some clear definition (not for me), of where this item comes from and where it goes for me, it's... a feeling. This is MT, this is not. This is a vanity item, this one creates an advantage. Perhaps for you this line hasn't been reached yet, good, keep playing. Evaluate whether you care about this, what it will do for the game, and where that line is for you. -IF- CCP goes ahead with something like faction standings for cash, I'll be evaluating that myself. I'm not saying I will quit, but I will be looking very closely at what actions like that do to a game that I love. I suspect not-good-things, but that's me. I also suspect that if they ever do offer cash for clear advantages as an option, even for something minor, that more and more will shortly follow.
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:38:00 - [874] Originally by: Mikaaro Now that we're getting something other than emorage, we can actually start to discuss. So this would basically crash EVEs economy model. Now think about that for a second. You guys actually think CCP would do this? Really? You think they're that stupid? For me this just proves that this is a very epic troll. Yes, i do,.. i've seen them do more stupid stuff,... i honestly would not be surprised.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:38:00 - [875] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 07:38:50 Originally by: Azahni Vah'nos One thing to note regarding the validity of the document in question is after having worked at a corporate level before I can guarantee you that a statement would have been made long ago if it was a complete fabrication. What will probably occur is CCP will turn around and say that the views expressed in the document were those of the individual and not those of the company. We'll wait and see. hehe, they are faster then you, its in the disclaimer of the document problem is, the view is of EVE's lead game designer, so...
Typhado3 Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:38:00 - [876] 3 accounts oldest of which is from 2005 all cancelled. Honestly Eve is still OK for the MMO industry, a lot of MMOs are doing this sort of thing. However just cause all your friends are rolling in **** doesn't mean you should jump in and roll around with them. I think it's time I give up on the MMO industry all together for a while. ------------------------------ God is an afk cloaker I'm keeping the Silhouette till I have tats - I HAVE TATS \o/, behold mortals
Malias Yakusto	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:39:00 - [877] A picture says 1000 words. Caption "CCP's new talent".
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:39:00 - [878] Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 07:40:30 Originally by: Shoot2kilI Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Shoot2kilI Another six accounts reporting in for bio-mass / unsubbing when/if this get's implemented. Forget this "when/if" stuff. It's done. CCP ARE completely, 100%, **ed. It's over. What are you, some apostle of gotry? It's not a done thing until it's confirmed, all you buttmad kids hanging out in the same thread crying about some potentially-self-invented-internet-spaceships-apocalypse need to get a bit of a grip on this thing you are so vehemently angry against, real money, and go spend it out there on something aside from the super-serious space ships that have at least 50% of the people in this thread e-raging like I'm playing counter-strike again. Seriously. The last thing CCP wants to do is kill their game. They enjoy the VERY LARGE amounts of money that drivel into it by means of subscription, PLEX, events, merchandise, etc. If you guys honestly think that they will look at this thread and/or take a massive hit to their subscription base and be OK with it, just to please a small, totally unrepresented, FIGURATIVE minority, you have your head shoved so far up the Doomsayer's ass to be much use to anyone. HEH, like them enjoying the money they get now precludes them from making a cash grab due to investor pressure or any other reason? I think you're the one with your head shoved up your ass. Is it confirmed? No. Is it likely? Possibly. I do know it's better to vehemently express just how much we don't want it in the game rather than just saying "* it, who knows if it'll happen" like you. Either way I'm not resubbing for any reason (even if the cash for items of power is bull**) until the space game gets fixed/balanced.
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:40:00 - [879] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Ok, some people apparently seem to believe that all items on the market appear out of thin air. 1) all ships are built by industrial characters 2) all mods that you cannot get a blueprint for come from fighting NPCs 3) all faction/deadspace/officer gear comes from mission/exploration/complex runners 4) while AURUM comes from PLEXes, the AURUM does not have to directly involve the market in any way, and the items that come from the NEX DO in fact, come from thin air. Even though a PLEX can be sold for ISK, the original ISK, and all items subsequently bought with that ISK came from players actively playing. THIS is why it has always been said that PLEX is different than MT. And all the stuff bought with AURUM will be put on market for isk. This really is a problem only if stuff that is already in the market can be bought for AURUM as that would make producing that stuff by traditional means pointless (unless it would cost more than when bought with isk, but why wouldn't you just convert straight to isk) and break the economy for that item basically putting a fixed price on it (don't think they'd do that). New items that affect gameplay could be put on sale for AURUM, but they would also be then put to market for isk. The price would have to be comparable to the power of the item or traditional items would be obsolete. Most likely the stuff would be more like the limited issue ships (like the ones won from AT or gold magnate or such) with insane prices and no real value in gameplay.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:40:00 - [880] Originally by: Malias Yakusto Yo dawg, like, that's pretty counter productive to a serious conversation about srs bizness internet spaceships. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Shoot2kilI Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:41:00 - [881] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Shoot2kilI Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Shoot2kilI Another six accounts reporting in for bio-mass / unsubbing when/if this get's implemented. Forget this "when/if" stuff. It's done. CCP ARE completely, 100%, **ed. It's over. What are you, some apostle of gotry? It's not a done thing until it's confirmed, all you buttmad kids hanging out in the same thread crying about some potentially-self-invented-internet-spaceships-apocalypse need to get a bit of a grip on this thing you are so vehemently angry against, real money, and go spend it out there on something aside from the super-serious space ships that have at least 50% of the people in this thread e-raging like I'm playing counter-strike again. Seriously. The last thing CCP wants to do is kill their game. They enjoy the VERY LARGE amounts of money that drivel into it by means of subscription, PLEX, events, merchandise, etc. If you guys honestly think that they will look at this thread and/or take a massive hit to their subscription base and be OK with it, just to please a small, totally unrepresented, FIGURATIVE minority, you have your head shoved so far up the Doomsayer's ass to be much use to anyone. HEH, like them enjoying the money they get now precludes them from making a cash grab due to investor pressure or any other reason? I think you're the one with your head shoved up your ass. Is it confirmed? No. Is it likely? Possibly. I do know it's better to vehemently express just how much we don't want it in the game rather than just saying "* it, who knows if it'll happen" like you? Either way I'm not resubbing for any reason (even if the cash for items of power is bull**) until the space game gets fixed/balanced. Cool story bro. While you're unsubbed and :mad: you can enjoy copious amounts of not posting on this forum to tell us just how mad you are. I also said "If this happens (RM) I will biomass/unsub all 6 of my accounts". So yeah, I'm pretty much the definition of apathy.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:42:00 - [882] @Malias common man, there are limits of what i want to see early in the morning.
Caldreean Dawnwalkers	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:44:00 - [883] Ah well, this was as good a reason as any to finally stop playing. My account expires within the next 10 hours or so, and I'm not renewing. And no, my stuff is not leaving my hangar/wallet you greedy bastards (no, not you CCP). The thing is, I actually liked the whole idea of the plex/timecode. Of the 55 months I've subscribed to this game, only 3 were paid for by me. The rest were from plex/timecodes my isk brought from others. It was a great idea you guys had that I spent a few years defending in the Help channel. You could have stopped there, but you didn't. Now I feel foolish. Suppose we all should have seen this coming. So long, and thanks for all the Quafe.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:45:00 - [884] This is just the beginning : http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/06/22/eve-online-now-sells-70-monocles/ http://www.kotaku.com.au/2011/06/eve-online-is-selling-horse-armour-in-space/ http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/21/controversy-brewing-over-eve-online-microtransactions/ http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/news/eve-incarna-cosmetic-item-prices-spark-controversy http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/06/22/eek-eves-clothing-and-cash-crisis/ http://games.on.net/article/12949/CCP_Under_Fire_Over_Microtransactions_Licensing_Fees http://www.evenews24.com/2011/06/22/greed-is-good-purportedly-leaked-internal-bulletin-shows-ccps-refreshing-new-direction/ http://www.vg247.com/2011/06/22/eve-online-economy-upset-by-avatar-items/ http://blog.mmoga.com/2011/06/eve-online-charging-68-real-dollars-for-space-monocles/ http://massively.joystiq.com/2011/06/22/rumour-leaked-document-shows-ccps-microtransaction-plans/ http://www.gbgamer.net/2011/06/22/eve-online-economy-upset-by-avatar-items/ There are many more but you get the idea...
Flex Carter Caldari Independant Mining Association	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:45:00 - [885] Ok,ok... Where the hell are the Moderators?
Malias Yakusto	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:46:00 - [886]
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:47:00 - [887] Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 07:47:41 Originally by: Shoot2kilI Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Shoot2kilI What are you, some apostle of *gotry? It's not a done thing until it's confirmed, all you buttmad kids hanging out in the same thread crying about some potentially-self-invented-internet-spaceships-apocalypse need to get a bit of a grip on this thing you are so vehemently angry against, real money, and go spend it out there on something aside from the super-serious space ships that have at least 50% of the people in this thread e-raging like I'm playing counter-strike again. Seriously. The last thing CCP wants to do is kill their game. They enjoy the VERY LARGE amounts of money that drivel into it by means of subscription, PLEX, events, merchandise, etc. If you guys honestly think that they will look at this thread and/or take a massive hit to their subscription base and be OK with it, just to please a small, totally unrepresented, FIGURATIVE minority, you have your head shoved so far up the Doomsayer's ass to be much use to anyone. HEH, like them enjoying the money they get now precludes them from making a cash grab due to investor pressure or any other reason? I think you're the one with your head shoved up your ass. Is it confirmed? No. Is it likely? Possibly. I do know it's better to vehemently express just how much we don't want it in the game rather than just saying " it, who knows if it'll happen" like you? Either way I'm not resubbing for any reason (even if the cash for items of power is bull**) until the space game gets fixed/balanced. Cool story bro. While you're unsubbed and :mad: you can enjoy copious amounts of not posting on this forum to tell us just how mad you are. I also said "If this happens (RM) I will biomass/unsub all 6 of my accounts". So yeah, I'm pretty much the definition of apathy. :mad:? LOL sure. I'm already well outside my paid gametime (expired 26/04) and still postin. (4 hour reactivation to check just how bad the CQ was checkin in)
Cancel Align NOW	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:49:00 - [888] 30 Pages in a thread that according to the EULA should be locked by page one along with some very disturbing posting - what has happened at ccp?
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:49:00 - [889] Hah,.. what will happen if you can buy faction standing? people would not ahve to worry anymore about fighting for one faction and **ing of an other. It will completely kill the entire idea behing the ou tick them off, you deal with the consequences" idea behind running missions. You get the dnemies abound"arc,.. sure, go ahead and kill off a ton of calentean navies. you got bad rep becouse you chose to ** them off, don't worry, just buy some rep and all is good again. Right now you actualy have to turn around and manage your standing with Gallente when you do this arc and tick them off if you ever want to pass through their space again. and do missions for them. I'm seriouse,.. that rotten shark went to their brains,.. they lost it. Someone in here a bunch of pages back said, CCP should sell EVE... you know what,.. that would not even be such a half bad idea. for the last year and a half or two, all i've been seeing is more and more stink hitting the game. Give it a little time and i'm sure their gona come out with a patch where they will manage to mess up even more aspects of the game that are already starting to ride on loose screws. I'm already hating the stink of this Incarna patch,... but i tell you,.. if this does not end here and people let them selves be forcefed the dong CCP is pushing down our necks, this game is gona sting worse than analkissing a skunk
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:50:00 - [890] sitting it out, looking away, pretending it doesn't happen. the usual stuff
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:51:00 - [891] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku sitting it out, looking away, pretending it doesn't happen. the usual stuff lol if I ignore it, it will go away!
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:54:00 - [892] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku sitting it out, looking away, pretending it doesn't happen. the usual stuff lol if I ignore it, it will go away! yea well, its the credo of alot of gamers in here too, so...not much different
Evanga Amarr Trust Doesn't Rust Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:55:00 - [893] desubbed two accounts, giving away everything to a 1 day old toon soon in Jita. Keep eyes on local! [secure] Cause i will triple the amount of isk you sent to me as im leaving! [/secure]
Al Gabraith	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:55:00 - [894] Originally by: Aineko Macx I was never so close to cancelling my 3 accounts. Also inb4l. I second this .. me also .. 3 accounts..
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:58:00 - [895] I agree that bying faction standings would be bad. Propably this too would be implemented so that you could also put it in market. Then people who don't like to use real money can gather the isk and buy a "get out of gallente jail" -card. I wouldn't like it but I could live with it. What really would bother me is getting UI improvements like the +50 saved fittings. This would undoubtedly lead to things like "Special offer: a readable font for EVE now only 29,99"
i hatechosingnames Gallente Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:58:00 - [896] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku sitting it out, looking away, pretending it doesn't happen. the usual stuff counting their $$$ and thinking up a way they can accidentally on purpose wipe the database and make us pay to get our individual characters "salvaged"
Azahni Vah'nos Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 07:59:00 - [897] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 07:38:50 Originally by: Azahni Vah'nos One thing to note regarding the validity of the document in question is after having worked at a corporate level before I can guarantee you that a statement would have been made long ago if it was a complete fabrication. What will probably occur is CCP will turn around and say that the views expressed in the document were those of the individual and not those of the company. We'll wait and see. hehe, they are faster then you, its in the disclaimer of the document problem is, the view is of EVE's lead game designer, so... Didn't see the disclaimer And yes if this guy has complete autonomy over the games direction, then it's going to be a pretty scary future for EvE.
Donatella D'Tren Harbingers of Chaos Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:00:00 - [898] Greed is good. Blind, stupid greed at this level is just meh. wtb new CCP ceo, offering 50 PLEX.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:02:00 - [899] So, it should be about 8AM now, anyone care to start making bets on whether this threadnaught will get a response, lock, or both?
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:02:00 - [900] Edited by: Isil Rahsen on 23/06/2011 08:02:35 Originally by: Jonny Utrigas So, it should be about 8AM now, anyone care to start making bets on whether this threadnaught will get a response, lock, or both? Betting just a lock. and some Bans
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:03:00 - [901] Originally by: Al Gabraith Originally by: Aineko Macx I was never so close to cancelling my 3 accounts. Also inb4l. I second this .. me also .. 3 accounts.. had three accounts but i've also discontinued payments on two of them to keep them up as the indecisiveness and absence of any and all CCPers is realy starting to anoy me to no extent. Someone said that CCP loves their game and would not allow anything to downgrade the experiance? Just check the effort their making to stand up for their actions and statements. Where's CCP now? I know! In a corner with their heads stuck..... well you get my drift,...
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:03:00 - [902] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas So, it should be about 8AM now, anyone care to start making bets on whether this threadnaught will get a response, lock, or both? Tomorrow, just to make me waste the time staying up late
Kunming T.H.U.G L.I.F.E ROMANIAN-LEGION	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:04:00 - [903] Originally by: Donatella D'Tren Greed is good. Blind, stupid greed at this level is just meh. wtb new CCP ceo, offering 50 PLEX. I'll give you 1 PLEX, take it or leave it.
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:05:00 - [904] Originally by: Azahni Vah'nos Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 07:38:50 Originally by: Azahni Vah'nos One thing to note regarding the validity of the document in question is after having worked at a corporate level before I can guarantee you that a statement would have been made long ago if it was a complete fabrication. What will probably occur is CCP will turn around and say that the views expressed in the document were those of the individual and not those of the company. We'll wait and see. hehe, they are faster then you, its in the disclaimer of the document problem is, the view is of EVE's lead game designer, so... Didn't see the disclaimer And yes if this guy has complete autonomy over the games direction, then it's going to be a pretty scary future for EvE. I'd like to think that no one man can have autonomy over a games direction in a company as big as CCP.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:05:00 - [905] Originally by: Kunming Originally by: Donatella D'Tren Greed is good. Blind, stupid greed at this level is just meh. wtb new CCP ceo, offering 50 PLEX. I'll give you 1 PLEX, take it or leave it. You're doing it wrong. If you had volunteered to be the new CEO, you would RECEIVE 50 PLEX.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:07:00 - [906] Originally by: Mikaaro The economy still works way better than any other MMO and in the years I've played the game has improved a lot. Granted Incarna as it is is just stupid, but I'll at least stick around to see where it actually goes before I condemn it. Thanks for making me feel not like the only in here willing to see this to the bitter end... and I agree. Incarna in its current forum, feels...unnecessarily early. No social interaction means the CQ are confining, not liberating as emerging from a pod should be, or a place to unwind with friends and show off your monocles. The choice to favor one race, even my own, was bound to invite a ****storm. Everyone pointing out that this was a mistake, I'm with you. I think the fan base could have dealt better with putting Incarna's release off even a few months, than putting it out this early, and having everyone go through a meltdown. Incarna could and probably will bring great things, with enough time and development, but I think it was just a bit too early to prevent a PR explosion. On the other hand, I have no qualms simply ignoring the NeX in the mean time, using the same item and hangar buttons that were always there to do my ship fitting, and continuing on blowing up spaceships with my friends. They mean more to me than any activism against CCP over a controversial, yet relatively unobtrusive, addition to the game in its current form. New Eden will get through this in the end, transitions are tough, I encourage players to think about responding to this thread, which is very constructive, informative in terms of feedback to CCP, and will likely have a far greater impact on their response to this kerfluffle than threads like this one, which are filled with so much venom and anger and trash talk it can hardly be responded to seriously. Even I have had a hard time responding to it seriously, even though I care a lot about the game and its community.
Tamahra Gallente Apina. United Pod Service	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:08:00 - [907] Originally by: Cancel Align NOW 30 Pages in a thread that according to the EULA should be locked by page one along with some very disturbing posting - what has happened at ccp? an internal war is raging in the ccp office perhaps. 50% of the Devs are ragequitting over their idiot lead designer
Slatiska Wolfovna	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:08:00 - [908] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Mikaaro The economy still works way better than any other MMO and in the years I've played the game has improved a lot. Granted Incarna as it is is just stupid, but I'll at least stick around to see where it actually goes before I condemn it. Thanks for making me feel not like the only in here willing to see this to the bitter end... and I agree. Incarna in its current forum, feels...unnecessarily early. No social interaction means the CQ are confining, not liberating as emerging from a pod should be, or a place to unwind with friends and show off your monocles. The choice to favor one race, even my own, was bound to invite a ****storm. Everyone pointing out that this was a mistake, I'm with you. I think the fan base could have dealt better with putting Incarna's release off even a few months, than putting it out this early, and having everyone go through a meltdown. Incarna could and probably will bring great things, with enough time and development, but I think it was just a bit too early to prevent a PR explosion. On the other hand, I have no qualms simply ignoring the NeX in the mean time, using the same item and hangar buttons that were always there to do my ship fitting, and continuing on blowing up spaceships with my friends. They mean more to me than any activism against CCP over a controversial, yet relatively unobtrusive, addition to the game in its current form. New Eden will get through this in the end, transitions are tough, I encourage players to think about responding to this thread, which is very constructive, informative in terms of feedback to CCP, and will likely have a far greater impact on their response to this kerfluffle than threads like this one, which are filled with so much venom and anger and trash talk it can hardly be responded to seriously. Even I have had a hard time responding to it seriously, even though I care a lot about the game and its community. The problem is that they plan on selling ships for aurums.
Koskovf	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:09:00 - [909] So this just underlines how irrelevent the CSM is - CCP agreed microtransactions for vanity items only, yet in their internal policy documents they've allready decided to do it. So did they deliberatly lie or is the CSM utterly toothles, because one of those options as to be true. I'm absolutely fine with micortransactions in a F2P game, or for vanity/convenience items in a subscription game - but it sounds high-lvl equipment will need RL money to buy. CCP - your subscribers are not the same demographic that play F2P games, this model will not work for eve.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:11:00 - [910] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 08:12:20 Hans, rage is good. Its needed to mobilize masses. Its that easy. If you want to change something, you have to get attention. Ppl are lazy, they would rather lean back and wait and hope for the best. But nothing changes if you behave like that. If you see that the road leads to a place you don't want to go, getting out early or trying to convince the driver to change road is what its needed. It may not always be pleasant, but it works.
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:11:00 - [911] Originally by: Slatiska Wolfovna Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Mikaaro The economy still works way better than any other MMO and in the years I've played the game has improved a lot. Granted Incarna as it is is just stupid, but I'll at least stick around to see where it actually goes before I condemn it. Thanks for making me feel not like the only in here willing to see this to the bitter end... and I agree. Incarna in its current forum, feels...unnecessarily early. No social interaction means the CQ are confining, not liberating as emerging from a pod should be, or a place to unwind with friends and show off your monocles. The choice to favor one race, even my own, was bound to invite a ****storm. Everyone pointing out that this was a mistake, I'm with you. I think the fan base could have dealt better with putting Incarna's release off even a few months, than putting it out this early, and having everyone go through a meltdown. Incarna could and probably will bring great things, with enough time and development, but I think it was just a bit too early to prevent a PR explosion. On the other hand, I have no qualms simply ignoring the NeX in the mean time, using the same item and hangar buttons that were always there to do my ship fitting, and continuing on blowing up spaceships with my friends. They mean more to me than any activism against CCP over a controversial, yet relatively unobtrusive, addition to the game in its current form. New Eden will get through this in the end, transitions are tough, I encourage players to think about responding to this thread, which is very constructive, informative in terms of feedback to CCP, and will likely have a far greater impact on their response to this kerfluffle than threads like this one, which are filled with so much venom and anger and trash talk it can hardly be responded to seriously. Even I have had a hard time responding to it seriously, even though I care a lot about the game and its community. The problem is that they plan on selling ships for aurums. And if the ships are as crazily overpriced as the monocle they will end up being in effect vanity items as they will have no meaningfull use in the game (Good luck undocking that guardian-vexor without being ganked)
Leneerra Minmatar Sebiestor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:13:00 - [912] Personally I do not think this is a real document. We have seen well crafted hoaxes before, often based on the real thing. I do think it is very telling that people are willing to believe this one. It shows how differently people view ccp now compared to a year ago. It shows how hard their credibility has been hit by events recently. Also how much more damaging a few clumsy mistakes in a row can be, compared to finally realizing features that have been in popular demand for a while or even many years (discernable bpc's, server lag reduction, probing unprobable ships, etc). But there is also a silver lining, people still care about eve. You do not get this kind of response if the people affected do not realy care about it.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:13:00 - [913] Originally by: Koskovf CCP - your subscribers are not the same demographic that play F2P games, this model will not work for eve. THIS. I've left every MMO I played that introduced MT, because it was always something that was just not for me.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:14:00 - [914] Originally by: Mikaaro And if the ships are as crazily overpriced as the monocle they will end up being in effect vanity items as they will have no meaningfull use in the game (Good luck undocking that guardian-vexor without being ganked) But as they want to sell it, they will make it so you can't get ganked, at least in highsec, anymore. See, once the priority is set (MT), the path is layed out, and they would be fools not to do it (business is business)
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:15:00 - [915] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Koskovf CCP - your subscribers are not the same demographic that play F2P games, this model will not work for eve. THIS. I've left every MMO I played that introduced MT, because it was always something that was just not for me. +1
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:16:00 - [916] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Mikaaro And if the ships are as crazily overpriced as the monocle they will end up being in effect vanity items as they will have no meaningfull use in the game (Good luck undocking that guardian-vexor without being ganked) But as they want to sell it, they will make it so you can't get ganked, at least in highsec, anymore. See, once the priority is set (MT), the path is layed out, and they would be fools not to do it (business is business) :shudder: jesus christ
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:17:00 - [917] Originally by: Leneerra Personally I do not think this is a real document. We have seen well crafted hoaxes before, often based on the real thing. Its an exact copy of a document seen by CSM members. The full version (with company metrics) is online. Its no hoax.
Candi Storm	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:19:00 - [918] EPIC FAIL CCP!!!!! Think it's time to go back to WoW.
Gothikia Regeneration	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:20:00 - [919] Originally by: Cancel Align NOW 30 Pages in a thread that according to the EULA should be locked by page one along with some very disturbing posting - what has happened at ccp? I'm guessing they're pooing themselves for causing the biggest blowback since RMR... Join Regeneration!
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:22:00 - [920] Originally by: Mikaaro Now that we're getting something other than emorage, we can actually start to discuss. So this would basically crash EVEs economy model. Now think about that for a second. You guys actually think CCP would do this? Really? You think they're that stupid? For me this just proves that this is a very epic troll. Boot.ini. next? It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:23:00 - [921] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 08:23:53 Originally by: Leneerra Its no hoax. Whether or not it's a hoax, I pity the person selected to deal with this PR disaster. This has gone well beyond the EVE forums now. I don't the DC2 is going to save them at this point, nor will having 80 guardians and 120 basilisks to repair this mess.
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:24:00 - [922] Originally by: Othran Originally by: Leneerra Personally I do not think this is a real document. We have seen well crafted hoaxes before, often based on the real thing. Its an exact copy of a document seen by CSM members. The full version (with company metrics) is online. Its no hoax. Ok, ok...so a little clarification please. (and no, I'm not being sarcastic this time) If this is an exact copy, what do you mean by "full version with company metrics" ? Is this an abbreviated version, or an exact copy? And I'm sure everyone's terrified to link publically more documents that might get them permabanned if the conspiracy turns out to be true, but I welcome private evemails with linkage to any more detailed versions than the one posted on the original Evenews24 site. If there is more to this than what is shown on EveNews24's Chribba files link pdf, please get me that info. Though I've been pretty blatant I think this is either a) a forgery and troll attempt or b) a joking, tongue-in-cheek internal memo that was meant for company laughs, not embarassing public distribution, I will keep an open mind as long as there are more facts to draw on.
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:24:00 - [923] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Othran Originally by: Leneerra Its no hoax. Whether or not it's a hoax, I pity the person selected to deal with this PR disaster. This has gone well beyond the EVE forums now. I don't the DC2 is going to save them at this point, nor will having 80 guardians and 120 basilisks to repair this mess. they are honor tanking this one It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:25:00 - [924] Originally by: Cancel Align NOW 30 Pages in a thread that according to the EULA should be locked by page one along with some very disturbing posting - what has happened at ccp? In the spirit of remaining hopeful: Maybe they have actually learned somethingà No, I have gone beyond believing that myself, but like I said: "hopeful"à ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Mikaaro	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:26:00 - [925] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Mikaaro And if the ships are as crazily overpriced as the monocle they will end up being in effect vanity items as they will have no meaningfull use in the game (Good luck undocking that guardian-vexor without being ganked) But as they want to sell it, they will make it so you can't get ganked, at least in highsec, anymore. See, once the priority is set (MT), the path is layed out, and they would be fools not to do it (business is business) This pretty much proves you're a troll.
Elzon1 Caldari Shadow Boys Corp White Angels.	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:26:00 - [926] Wow, look at all the drama llamas. Alright, now its the time for a voice of reason. Most of you are complaining about how this has a possibility of making EVE Online a rich kids playground full of golden overpowered ships and instant gratification. But, have you given any thought to how such a thing would be implemented into the existing market? Do you really think its going to be the case that you turn a plex into aurum and then buy a overpowered battleship with it and it just poofs it into existence. Everyone knows that is far too simple for the market in EVE. Instead of poofing a ship, module, or ammo into existence... don't you think it would simply give you a bpc instead, just like everything else? So in order to build the ship you still need the minerals for it don't you? What about the skill requirements to build it? The skill requirements to fly it? Sure, as long as CCP doesn't allow the purchasing of SP they could just buy a character with isk and PLEX from the character bizzare right? So that costs them more PLEX. Then they would probably have to buy minerals off the market from other players, am I right? And after getting all of that together one still has to take the materials to the right place so as to wait for it's contruction to complete. After all of that they probably end up with a shiny ship with only a little more firepower/capabilities than its counterparts for possibly two or three times the cost! What if the bpc wasn't in the new shop, but was in the respective loyalty point store? Then that person would have take the time to grind up enough loyalty points and isk in order to make the purchase of the bpc. I really don't think some rich snob will be able to come up in here and hit an "I win button" its not going to be that simple. I'm sure if a snob came into EVE and thought he was going to win because he was rich would learn a few lessons about EVE fairly quickly. If he decides to undock in one of the new ships with a full fitting of the new shinies he will be ganked pretty quickly. EVE Online is a very harsh game and is not the easiest to "win" and I'm sure most of us would like to give a warm 1400mm welcome to those bold enough to show off their wealth. This is EVE not some garden variety MMO. Even with aurum we will still have the player driven market and all the lovely pirates. Most of this stuff will be vanity only, so it really doesn't matter that much. And for the devs to come up with new ships, modules, and ammunition it will take some time to tie them into the existing base of items as well as properly balancing them to thier counterparts. It's not like there will be a huge selection of new stuff immediately it will take lots of time for each non-vanity item to come out and we will have time to flame the devs on their decisions if we think they are doing something wrong. Of course, the only way they could screw this up is if they made aurum into its own seperate market and that would be hard since it's based on PLEX. Nonetheless, non-vanity items should be subject to the existing game and market mechanics, NO EXCEPTIONS. So have no fear my fellow capsuleers EVE will still be here. I don't know where, I don't know when... but something awful is going to happen xD
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:26:00 - [927] Originally by: Koskovf So this just underlines how irrelevent the CSM is - CCP agreed microtransactions for vanity items only, yet in their internal policy documents they've allready decided to do it. So did they deliberatly lie or is the CSM utterly toothles, because one of those options as to be true. If accurate, this is what should really raise the ire of player in the game who has a shred of concern about the integrity of the game and the people they're paying to maintain and develop it. So just to make sure it's accurate, I dug up the source for what you're saying here. Originally by: CCP Zulu Itæs clear that itæs the will of the community to keep virtual goods sales outside the spectrum of what we classify as the "merit economy". That refers to skills gained over time or items that have a gameplay impact. So after discussions, designs, brainstorming and all sorts of processes weæve come up with a strategy that weæve already polished with the help of the CSM and would now want to present to the larger community. Virtual goods sales in EVE Online will evolve through sales of vanity items, first in Incarna but later in-space features. The scope will be (and thereæs no design has been done around this, weære just talking strategy now) that anything that doesnæt affect gameplay directly can be, potentially, sold for PLEX or other means. Ideas that have come up include Incarna clothing and furniture, logos on spaceships and swapping out portraits. This is by no means a comprehensive list, nor is it a commitment that said items will be available for sale, I mention these as an example for what type of items weære thinking about. Note that there is a little wiggle room here. He says "evolve through the sale of vanity items", but doesn't say where that evolution will end. It does strongly suggest that item sales that interfere with the "merit economy" are off the table, at the very least for the duration of the Incarna era. If the "evolve through the sale of vanity items" bit was a carefully chosen phrase to open the door for the sorts of things mentioned in the OP's link, well, that's sneaky and deceptive enough to basically be considered a lie in my book anyway. Either way, I think it would be fair to say that, at best, CCP is exploiting a loophole in a commitment made to the players and CSM, and they should be regarded as having absolutely zero credibility.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:26:00 - [928] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Othran Originally by: Leneerra Personally I do not think this is a real document. We have seen well crafted hoaxes before, often based on the real thing. Its an exact copy of a document seen by CSM members. The full version (with company metrics) is online. Its no hoax. Ok, ok...so a little clarification please. (and no, I'm not being sarcastic this time) If this is an exact copy, what do you mean by "full version with company metrics" ? Is this an abbreviated version, or an exact copy? And I'm sure everyone's terrified to link publically more documents that might get them permabanned if the conspiracy turns out to be true, but I welcome private evemails with linkage to any more detailed versions than the one posted on the original Evenews24 site. If there is more to this than what is shown on EveNews24's Chribba files link pdf, please get me that info. Though I've been pretty blatant I think this is either a) a forgery and troll attempt or b) a joking, tongue-in-cheek internal memo that was meant for company laughs, not embarassing public distribution, I will keep an open mind as long as there are more facts to draw on. Ain't skeert: Full unedited version from CCP -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:27:00 - [929] From what I've gathered there are two versions, the evenews24 version missing a few pages, and a "complete" version someone linked in their twitter. Now I know searching through this threadnaughts 49 pages sucks but, it's there. I'm not logged into my EVE client currently or I would mail you with the pertinent info.
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:27:00 - [930] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Othran Originally by: Leneerra Personally I do not think this is a real document. We have seen well crafted hoaxes before, often based on the real thing. Its an exact copy of a document seen by CSM members. The full version (with company metrics) is online. Its no hoax. Ok, ok...so a little clarification please. (and no, I'm not being sarcastic this time) If this is an exact copy, what do you mean by "full version with company metrics" ? Is this an abbreviated version, or an exact copy? And I'm sure everyone's terrified to link publically more documents that might get them permabanned if the conspiracy turns out to be true, but I welcome private evemails with linkage to any more detailed versions than the one posted on the original Evenews24 site. If there is more to this than what is shown on EveNews24's Chribba files link pdf, please get me that info. Though I've been pretty blatant I think this is either a) a forgery and troll attempt or b) a joking, tongue-in-cheek internal memo that was meant for company laughs, not embarassing public distribution, I will keep an open mind as long as there are more facts to draw on. read VIA twitter from quite a few people it's an exact duplicate of a hardcopy they had received prior. i'll try and dig up links. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:29:00 - [931] Originally by: Mikaaro Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Mikaaro And if the ships are as crazily overpriced as the monocle they will end up being in effect vanity items as they will have no meaningfull use in the game (Good luck undocking that guardian-vexor without being ganked) But as they want to sell it, they will make it so you can't get ganked, at least in highsec, anymore. See, once the priority is set (MT), the path is layed out, and they would be fools not to do it (business is business) This pretty much proves you're a troll. Keep telling you that, it may help. After a while, when you get this nagging feeling, you may have a look around on how we do this stuff in the industry.
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:30:00 - [932] Originally by: Liang Nuren Ain't skeert: Full unedited version from CCP thanks for that. saved for future reference. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:30:00 - [933] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Whether or not it's a hoax, I pity the person selected to deal with this PR disaster. This has gone well beyond the EVE forums now. I don't the DC2 is going to save them at this point, nor will having 80 guardians and 120 basilisks to repair this mess. As do I. Regardless of whether the memo was real, or a fake, someone will undoubtedly come forth and become a sacrifical lamb at the altar of the eve forum community, which is out for blood. CCP just needs time to draw the straws, or calculate which employee can either a)safely field the response, cause they are respected and thus chosen to buffer fears, or more likely b) someone who can take the blame, and either be demoted, or placed in another capacity, or let go in an attempt to pacify the community who will clearly not stop until someone "pays" for this. But again, i dont see much point in speculation. They'll respond to this, sooner or later, they can't afford not to. It just won't be in this thread, which is filled with too much trolling for endorse with a response.
Candi Storm	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:31:00 - [934] CCP = completely concieved for profit
Ix Forres Caldari Righteous Chaps	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:32:00 - [935] Going off the metadata, this document dates back to April. The 14th, to be specific. That's when it was first created, at least. http://pastie.org/2110039 is the metadata I pulled out of the full version. http://assets.talkunafraid.co.uk/gig_images.tar contains all the images found in the file. -- Ix Forres - Used to be a third party developer, now a full-time bittervet
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:32:00 - [936] Originally by: Tippia In the spirit of remaining hopeful: Maybe they have actually learned somethingà No, I have gone beyond believing that myself, but like I said: "hopeful"à Well done, you've made progress escaping their bull****.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:33:00 - [937] Originally by: Elzon1 Wow, look at all the drama llamas. Alright, now its the time for a voice of reason. Most of you are complaining about how this has a possibility of making EVE Online a rich kids playground full of golden overpowered ships and instant gratification. But, have you given any thought to how such a thing would be implemented into the existing market? Do you really think its going to be the case that you turn a plex into aurum and then buy a overpowered battleship with it and it just poofs it into existence. Everyone knows that is far too simple for the market in EVE. Instead of poofing a ship, module, or ammo into existence... don't you think it would simply give you a bpc instead, just like everything else? So in order to build the ship you still need the minerals for it don't you? What about the skill requirements to build it? The skill requirements to fly it? Sure, as long as CCP doesn't allow the purchasing of SP they could just buy a character with isk and PLEX from the character bizzare right? So that costs them more PLEX. Then they would probably have to buy minerals off the market from other players, am I right? And after getting all of that together one still has to take the materials to the right place so as to wait for it's contruction to complete. After all of that they probably end up with a shiny ship with only a little more firepower/capabilities than its counterparts for possibly two or three times the cost! What if the bpc wasn't in the new shop, but was in the respective loyalty point store? Then that person would have take the time to grind up enough loyalty points and isk in order to make the purchase of the bpc. I really don't think some rich snob will be able to come up in here and hit an "I win button" its not going to be that simple. I'm sure if a snob came into EVE and thought he was going to win because he was rich would learn a few lessons about EVE fairly quickly. If he decides to undock in one of the new ships with a full fitting of the new shinies he will be ganked pretty quickly. EVE Online is a very harsh game and is not the easiest to "win" and I'm sure most of us would like to give a warm 1400mm welcome to those bold enough to show off their wealth. This is EVE not some garden variety MMO. Even with aurum we will still have the player driven market and all the lovely pirates. Most of this stuff will be vanity only, so it really doesn't matter that much. And for the devs to come up with new ships, modules, and ammunition it will take some time to tie them into the existing base of items as well as properly balancing them to thier counterparts. It's not like there will be a huge selection of new stuff immediately it will take lots of time for each non-vanity item to come out and we will have time to flame the devs on their decisions if we think they are doing something wrong. Of course, the only way they could screw this up is if they made aurum into its own seperate market and that would be hard since it's based on PLEX. Nonetheless, non-vanity items should be subject to the existing game and market mechanics, NO EXCEPTIONS. So have no fear my fellow capsuleers EVE will still be here. If I remember correctly, it was stated in another post, earlier before Incarna was released, by a CCP rep, that things like the new battleships (Ishokune Scorpion for example) would be bought as a whole item, and would not consume a conventional Scorpion. This constitutes "poofing" from thin air.
Copine Callmeknau Kangaroos With Frickin Lazerbeams The KWFL Republic	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:33:00 - [938] This PDF has disturbed me greatly :/ ...oh wait Stunning EVE Online Theme for PS3
RJBlues	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:34:00 - [939] I do hope that this is not real. I really dont want to stop playing :( But if this is the direction the game is going in, then **** it. I pay to play a subscription game because I cant stand the microtransaction model.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:34:00 - [940] So many things just dropped into place for me. I could never understand how CCP managed to do any effective financial planning with the number of PLEX there must be in the system. When they made PLEX destroyable last year I wondered if the number of PLEX in the system was becoming unmanageable. This document confirms it has become an issue - an urgent one at that. Ah well Eve had to fall apart at some point. Looks like now might be the time to get out completely.
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:35:00 - [941] Originally by: Elzon1 Do you really think its going to be the case that you turn a plex into aurum and then buy a overpowered battleship with it and it just poofs it into existence. Everyone knows that is far too simple for the market in EVE. Yes. Everyone knows that. Everyone except CCP. That's why one of the first trial items in the NeX was going to do almost exactly that: poof a ship into existence. Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Ok, ok...so a little clarification please. (and no, I'm not being sarcastic this time) If this is an exact copy, what do you mean by "full version with company metrics" ? Is this an abbreviated version, or an exact copy? [à] If there is more to this than what is shown on EveNews24's Chribba files link pdf, please get me that info. It's linked on the first page, a few posts down. The EN24 version cuts out some preamble and a few pages dealing with non-MT related, general company news. This is the version people have seen at the CCP offices. Personally, I find the company survey at the end rather interesting, containing things like the following "lowest score" list: Professional development is well organized within CCP.2.9 I am satisfied with the air-conditioning at my office.3.0 I feel that my pay is in line with the position that I occupy3.1 Communication with other offices is good.3.1 CCP ́s salary policy is fair.3.2 Communication a low-scorer? Who'd'a thunk it? ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:37:00 - [942] Originally by: Liang Nuren Ain't skeert: Full unedited version from CCP Thanks. That is certainly a more substantial document (in terms of info) than the one posted on Evenews24, and real or fake I appreciate the heads up.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:38:00 - [943] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 08:40:21 Why do people have questions about the authenticity of this document? It simply states the sames things we've been hearing from CCP via official channels for some time now. i.e. PLEX for remap. PLEX for ships etc. There is no question of authenticity. It matches their stated position. It perfectly matches the strategy they have been implementing for near 2 years now.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:38:00 - [944] Originally by: Tippia Communication a low-scorer? Who'd'a thunk it? :CCP:
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:39:00 - [945] It's true business is business, but in this trent it's also common to be aware of what your customers want. Hell,.. how long has the talk and wish for "stationwalk" been out there,... 5 years, 6 years? I call anyone's bluff that has the guts to say they would not have been willing to wait a little bit longer still. That said,.. it's obviouse CCP had utterly lost track of the interest of the community. It's also said that customer is king. WEll,.. not time ans passed by at two of CCP's offices and still not a single reply? It's clear to see how much CCP values their customers. It's a simple demand and supply issue,... and what CCP is forcing us to supply is clearly not what is in demand. If anyhting, this much is clear as crystal.
Stegas Tyrano	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:39:00 - [946] "I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of voices suddenly cried out in terror and were suddenly silenced." Obi-Wan Kenobi, on current issue's
Dante024781 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:39:00 - [947] For some reason I get the impression this is how CCP feels about me. www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVVZaZ8yO6o
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:41:00 - [948] Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Tippia Communication a low-scorer? Who'd'a thunk it? :CCP: Collapsing Communications Post = CCP
Dratic Muppet Ninja's Ninja Unicorns with Huge Horns	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:42:00 - [949] I really want to see what CCP says about this. Another NGE on the way, i just can't see their pride being swayed on this, no U-turn, no saving this trainwreck.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:47:00 - [950] Fully expect thread to be locked without a word.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:48:00 - [951] Originally by: Dratic I really want to see what CCP says about this. Another NGE on the way, i just can't see their pride being swayed on this, no U-turn, no saving this trainwreck. If it's an issue of pride, then they have truly lost touch with their customers.
Grifthin	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:48:00 - [952] If this comes to pass - both my accounts get cancelled. Sad panda.
Hyperforce99 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:49:00 - [953] There has been not a single response from CCP about this mess... You know CCP, you can't stick your head into the sand and simply wish it away. --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:51:00 - [954] Edited by: Ranita Drell on 23/06/2011 08:51:50 Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Why do people have questions about the authenticity of this document? It simply states the sames things we've been hearing from CCP via official channels for some time now. i.e. PLEX for remap. PLEX for ships etc. There is no question of authenticity. It matches their stated position. They recanted on the PLEX for remap before this document was published, and claimed that they'd be pursuing vanity items only. They were going to go ahead with PLEX for ships, but only with a single ship, for limited span of time, until they got the NEX functionality working, after getting the CSM's OK. They bowed to the ensuing player backlash on that one too, I believe. CCP has been inconsistent on the issue (even if it's arguably clear where their "heart" lies), but it's understandable that people would want to give CCP the benefit of the doubt and not call them bald-faced liars.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:53:00 - [955] Originally by: Hyperforce99 There has been not a single response from CCP about this mess... You know CCP, you can't stick your head into the sand and simply wish it away. QFT infact by not responding you are only making it worse for yourselves. so please respond.
Jowen Datloran Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:56:00 - [956] Am I the only person here who works for a company?... Accidently I just read CCPs newsletter after having read the ones in my company e-mail and will conclude that it is genuine enough. In fact, the ones from my company executives contain a lot fancy marketing talk and short sighted predictions. That is just the way those are written and should always be taken with a grain of salt. For one, I give CCP props for both showing the thoughts of developers both for (Kristoffer) and against (John) virtual sales. I think John echoes a lot of the concerns people present here. Secondly, I like how CCP tries to break the normal virtual goods sales philosophy by demanding that all virtual goods should be re-sellable within the game allowing people access to them with virtual money too. I do not entirely agree on the first section of the news letter and I would be very careful to put equation between people who enjoy spending money on improving their personal golf performance (by buying better clubs) and people who spend their free time on computer games. It is far from all people who do sports who spend enormous amounts of money to improve their performance, especially in more group conducted sports such as football which I think EVE is much more comparable to than golf. Besides the major danger for CCP is not whether people will spend time playing EVE or golf but if they will chose other computer games than EVE. As example, CCP should be much more concerned about products like Impulse and Steam which allows me to easily buy and install a whole game at prices that right now equals CCP price on a pair of virtual boots. Sure those games are not always (rarely) superior but they will certainly provide me with some hours/days of entertainment which CCPs virtual boots will be hard pressed to compete with. Still, the world of MMOs are moving towards more virtual goods sales as can be seen by the increased number of games going ôfree to playö every week. This is certainly not the fault of CCP and it is quite understandable and even reasonable that they are trying to make a business strategy for this. -- Mr. Science & Trade Institute - EVE Lorebook - Mysteries of W-space
Adrie Atticus Tactical Vendor of Services and Goods Partners of Industrial Service and Salvage	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:57:00 - [957] Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Tippia Communication a low-scorer? Who'd'a thunk it? :CCP: Collapsing Communications Post = CCP From the previous threadnaught: Cannot Communicate Properly
Slaqer	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:57:00 - [958] Wow, more people have viewed this thread than there were people on Tranquility today. If that doesn't convince CCP that this is a bad idea, then they have lost all respect from me as a gamer in general. As I hate any gaming company that sells out its player-base for more money, and I wish you a slow painful death.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 08:58:00 - [959] Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Hyperforce99 There has been not a single response from CCP about this mess... You know CCP, you can't stick your head into the sand and simply wish it away. QFT infact by not responding you are only making it worse for yourselves. so please respond. Chances are, they are hoping for the FIRE OF A THOUSAND NERDS to die down. Now, even if it is only 1000 individuals, that's gotta be at least 10% of the accounts for EVE. (Assuming an average of 4, since many have stated they have 6, 3, 4, 5, 2 etc. and the CCP claims to have 400,000 subscribers.)
Angst IronShard Minmatar Sense of Serendipity Echoes of Nowhere	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:01:00 - [960] Subscription Cancelation Completed. No you'll not avec my stuff. I'll burn it as an offrand to the great Matari God expecting CCP's fall ! And may yours skins be burnt by Quafe T-shirt, CCP ! o7 goodby capsuleers, it was a real pleasure to play with you all those past times. . ____________________________________________ Freedom is nothing but a chance to be better.
Cpt Iwan 4S Corporation Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:01:00 - [961] Originally by: Anoobis Aivoras If it's real, oh well. Game Over. Fail CCP!
equcin meey Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:01:00 - [962] if this is fact then prove that it is. and seeing how just about every other news compays would have put this out before the event. also this is eve and there has been 0.0 leadership stating that some of the information that has been given to eve news 24 is fake and we all know how easy it is to fake a document eg:chat log's anybody . so until you can prove to me that this pdf is real and this is what these CCP staff have really said i tend to doubt this. also there has been a great deal of bitter old vet's hating on this an so it wouldn't suprise me that one of them wrote this an claied that they are a CCP staff memeber and after reading your artical all i can see is that a bitter old vet has written it that hate's Incarna. like is said prove it is real not just claim that it is and expect me to believe you.
Elzon1 Caldari Shadow Boys Corp White Angels.	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:01:00 - [963] Edited by: Elzon1 on 23/06/2011 09:02:08 Originally by: Jonny Utrigas If I remember correctly, it was stated in another post, earlier before Incarna was released, by a CCP rep, that things like the new battleships (Ishokune Scorpion for example) would be bought as a whole item, and would not consume a conventional Scorpion. This constitutes "poofing" from thin air. Now, that wouldn't make much sense as that runs the risk of aurum creating it's own special market separate from the rest of EVE. If that was done you could have whole fleets of these more powerful ships flying around without effecting the market. Normally the market would equalize because of another material or ship being effected by it's excessive production and everyone would rush to fill the gaps. However, even with them "poofing" into existence I am sure in terms of pvp such ships would be subdued due to more efficient fleet setups being used against them. What would really anger me would be if such ships were both made through aurum and cheaper than their counterparts while having the same or better firepower/capabilities. But of course, since they would be cheaper everyone would buy them instead of the regular ships and then the prices of the regular ships would fall due to low demand. The market eventually figures out a state of equilibrium at some point. I would rather see non-vanity items tied to the existing market, not create it's own new one. The market would eventually equalize the effects of the aurum market, but it would be something that would be watched very closely. I don't know where, I don't know when... but something awful is going to happen xD
Maximus Trollus Amarr The Village Idiots	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:07:00 - [964] Edited by: Maximus Trollus on 23/06/2011 09:07:02 Originally by: equcin meey if this is fact then prove that it is. and seeing how just about every other news compays would have put this out before the event. also this is eve and there has been 0.0 leadership stating that some of the information that has been given to eve news 24 is fake and we all know how easy it is to fake a document eg:chat log's anybody . so until you can prove to me that this pdf is real and this is what these CCP staff have really said i tend to doubt this. also there has been a great deal of bitter old vet's hating on this an so it wouldn't suprise me that one of them wrote this an claied that they are a CCP staff memeber and after reading your artical all i can see is that a bitter old vet has written it that hate's Incarna. like is said prove it is real not just claim that it is and expect me to believe you. you're proly one of those people that believe god is real unless someone can prove you wrong, right ?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:07:00 - [965] > Would you like to play a game of Thermonuclear War? > NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN > G A M E O V E R
Zverofaust Gallente Incompertus INC Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:09:00 - [966] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Hyperforce99 There has been not a single response from CCP about this mess... You know CCP, you can't stick your head into the sand and simply wish it away. QFT infact by not responding you are only making it worse for yourselves. so please respond. Chances are, they are hoping for the FIRE OF A THOUSAND NERDS to die down. Now, even if it is only 1000 individuals, that's gotta be at least 10% of the accounts for EVE. (Assuming an average of 4, since many have stated they have 6, 3, 4, 5, 2 etc. and the CCP claims to have 400,000 subscribers.) 1000 people would actually account for 1% of the Eve population.
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:11:00 - [967] Of course it is real, otherwise CCP would have been already in, yelling and screaming that it is fake. Only question is if it was "leaked" intentionally or not. Could have been a test run to try and see how the playerbase reacts. A pretty stupid one though, but these days even the most stupid things seem to be possible at CCP.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:11:00 - [968] Originally by: Zverofaust Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Hyperforce99 There has been not a single response from CCP about this mess... You know CCP, you can't stick your head into the sand and simply wish it away. QFT infact by not responding you are only making it worse for yourselves. so please respond. Chances are, they are hoping for the FIRE OF A THOUSAND NERDS to die down. Now, even if it is only 1000 individuals, that's gotta be at least 10% of the accounts for EVE. (Assuming an average of 4, since many have stated they have 6, 3, 4, 5, 2 etc. and the CCP claims to have 400,000 subscribers.) 1000 people would actually account for 1% of the Eve population. doh, you are correct. My excuse is sleep deprivation, as I'm going on to hour 22 now.
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:11:00 - [969] Originally by: equcin meey if this is fact then prove that it is. and seeing how just about every other news compays would have put this out before the event. also this is eve and there has been 0.0 leadership stating that some of the information that has been given to eve news 24 is fake and we all know how easy it is to fake a document eg:chat log's anybody . so until you can prove to me that this pdf is real and this is what these CCP staff have really said i tend to doubt this. also there has been a great deal of bitter old vet's hating on this an so it wouldn't suprise me that one of them wrote this an claied that they are a CCP staff memeber and after reading your artical all i can see is that a bitter old vet has written it that hate's Incarna. like is said prove it is real not just claim that it is and expect me to believe you. TAke a seat and start reading teh whole post,... there's ample of links and pages that refere to this strategy and more than enough evidence that clearly shows it's not a hoax but an actualy marketing strategy tehy are implementing. For one,.. go back a couple of pages and download the CCP newsletter,... Don't dive in a post just to have your name there, read some of it for a change,.. at elast show some interest in a topic when you want to mingle.
Heanna	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:12:00 - [970] If it was fake you would see a blue post saying -> Fake pdf is fake, we only plan to sell you vanity clothes. But there is no post like that.....
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:12:00 - [971] There's activity from CCP Spitfire. No posts though, just moderation.
ThirdEyeBlenny	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:13:00 - [972] Originally by: equcin meey if this is fact then prove that it is. and seeing how just about every other news compays would have put this out before the event. also this is eve and there has been 0.0 leadership stating that some of the information that has been given to eve news 24 is fake and we all know how easy it is to fake a document eg:chat log's anybody . so until you can prove to me that this pdf is real and this is what these CCP staff have really said i tend to doubt this Of course it's not real, it's pure fantasy, created by people with far too much time on their hands. People who sorely need to leave the house more often. I completely agree, if it was real, it would have been leaked in the run up to the deployment of incarnation, not afterwards. Anyone could produce this document, and make it look authentic. also there has been a great deal of bitter old vet's hating on this an so it wouldn't suprise me that one of them wrote this an claied that they are a CCP staff memeber and after reading your artical all i can see is that a bitter old vet has written it that hate's Incarna. like is said prove it is real not just claim that it is and expect me to believe you.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:14:00 - [973] So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:16:00 - [974] Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye On the one hand, thats the 4th or 5th time youve said that (yes, ive been here for half a day now) On the other, you show more attention to this cluster**** than CCP is. Props!
Istyn Tactical Knightmare Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:17:00 - [975] Originally by: Black Dranzer OH GOOD HEAVENS IF ONLY SOMEBODY COULD HAVE PREDICTED THIS
RJBlues	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:18:00 - [976] I do hope the best when it comes to my favorite mmo developer, but I admit disapointment with the way they are handling this. All we want is a reassurance for the future or confirmation as to what direction the game is going in. I aint canceling until they respond or the game is finally crippled with RMT issues. Until then the game does still have fun gameplay contained within. Better than wow certainly.
IskPlease	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:20:00 - [977] No blue bar yet? I guess they just got caught feeding us lies in the devblog "Vanity items only". Time to really contract CCP Guard that damage control II and start looking for another sandbox game. Greed **ed up Ultima Online for me and it seems it'll ** up Eve Online aswell.
Reloadin	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:20:00 - [978] Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye I'm really going to miss your attention whoring, large type, bolded witticisms.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:20:00 - [979] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 09:22:10 Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye On the one hand, thats the 4th or 5th time youve said that (yes, ive been here for half a day now) On the other, you show more attention to this cluster**** than CCP is. Props! Just woke up to check the thread lol.. Still not in the mood to load up the client.. Does'nt feel fun anymore. When a game loses its "fun", its dead. When the trolls of eve don't want to even play the game, that's a bad sign.
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:21:00 - [980] Edited by: Wanda Wong on 23/06/2011 09:25:42 Originally by: Zverofaust 1000 people would actually account for 1% of the Eve population. Actualy your dead wrong since most of the people in here are die hard EVE and have multiple accounts,.. some have up to 8 accounts running, personaly i have three accounts (correction,... one now couse i canceled the other two couse CCP is killing EVE and i am only interestes in keeping the one account up to see it burn). My corp leader has 5 accounts,.. hell,.. there's not one person i know on eve that is a seriouse player and doesn't have an Alt. Also,.. look at your login screen when you go out and play,.. you'll see that on average there's some 40.000 people on EVE at any given time,... that means that these 1000 people pose about 2.5% of the active comunity, with each having an average of 3 accounts (wich is a reasonable estiamte) means that you'r already talking about 7.5% of the player base being ****ed of and quitting. Hell,.. if you have nothing better to do,.. count the number of people and number of accounts they have and do the math your selve on how many accounts have been suspended becouse of this stroke of brilliance on CCP's part. multiply that number of accounts by the fee that they bring in on a monthly basis and you will get the picture. Good morning,.. time to smell the coffey.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:22:00 - [981] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye On the one hand, thats the 4th or 5th time youve said that (yes, ive been here for half a day now) On the other, you show more attention to this cluster**** than CCP is. Props! Just woke up to check the thread lol.. Still not in the mood to load up the client.. Does'nt feel fun anymore. When a game loses its "fun", its dead. EVE is not "fun". EVE is serious buisness! Well, less serious and more buisness lately.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:23:00 - [982] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 09:26:16 Then 100x for all the people who just silently leave without making a complaint. edit: lol that's actually everyone, so fast!
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:23:00 - [983] Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 23/06/2011 09:26:51 Booooom...headshot!! 9 days left on 2 accounts. Go ahead and ** up your game..I will be waiting for bioware to release swtor and crush what little there is left of your bull game. Funny that ccp thinks that they can even compete in the world of mt....bioware might do it too but at least they are honest and admit it. And I'm sure they will impement it better than ccp. For those waiting..see you there. http://www.swtor.com/ I will not resub even after they come on here and figure out what bull** they want to feed us. Remove your stupid store and fix the game and I will maybe think about giving it another try. And if that doc is true (and I'm 99% sure it is) get rid of the porky pig looking lead game designer as he has no idea what this game is about. Edit: For the 1% chance that it is fake..you have my apologies but It doesn't change a thing as you have been fighting us about this for the longest time. I know where the game will end up at the end of the day.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:26:00 - [984]
ThirdEyeBlenny	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:26:00 - [985] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Then 100x for all the people who just silently leave without making a complaint. This, wholeheartedly. Go silently the lot of you,
Houdian Black	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:27:00 - [986] Well it seems like there are quiet a few unhappy people at CCP who I could see leaking this. Linkage
Shoot2kilI Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:28:00 - [987] Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Miilla Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye On the one hand, thats the 4th or 5th time youve said that (yes, ive been here for half a day now) On the other, you show more attention to this cluster**** than CCP is. Props! Just woke up to check the thread lol.. Still not in the mood to load up the client.. Does'nt feel fun anymore. When a game loses its "fun", its dead. EVE is not "fun". EVE is serious buisness! Well, less serious and more buisness lately. FFS steak go to sleep man.
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:29:00 - [988] Originally by: ThirdEyeBlenny This, wholeheartedly. Go silently the lot of you, Do not go gentle into that good night, Old age should burn and rave at close of day; Rage, rage against the dying of the light. Though wise men at their end know dark is right, Because their words had forked no lightning they Do not go gentle into that good night. Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay, Rage, rage against the dying of the light. Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight, And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way, Do not go gentle into that good night. Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay, Rage, rage against the dying of the light. And you, my father, there on the sad height, Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray. Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light. - Dylan Thomas (1914û1953)
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:30:00 - [989] Originally by: Shoot2kilI FFS steak go to sleep man. NO I MUST WATCH THIS
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:31:00 - [990] Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye Miilla needs a helmet for her avatar, if she were to stick around. You know, the kind of helmet the kids on the shortbus wear. So they don't cause further brain damage when they drool, bang their head against the rusty duct tayped bulkhead, and punch the copy/paste button into the forum ONE....MORE....TIME. 112 days.....sigh
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:31:00 - [991] Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Shoot2kilI FFS steak go to sleep man. NO I MUST WATCH THIS It's like a train wreck... can't look away
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:34:00 - [992]
Diotima Saraki	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:34:00 - [993] Originally by: Urgg Boolean The overwhelming reality for us as players who do not want game-changing MT, is that CCP counts it's subscriber base in 10K's while many other games count in the millions. Don't get defensive, but by sheer numbers comparison, EvE is not that popular (a fact that most of us like). CCP can make a lot more money by doing all the marketable things that other games do. They can lose all current players, and still make increasing profits by attracting fans from LOTRO, WoW, Guild Wars, KotOR, StarTrek Online, and whatever else. Bottom line: their game design so far has attracted players in the 10Ks; to take a bigger market share, they need to change their model to accommodate the market research. It's business, pure and simple. <visions of Ebenezer Scrooge> your post reminds me of something I read a long time ago... Quote: So we were given the directive to make Galaxies better. Not just make Galaxies better, but make it succesful. Not the 200k subs it had, but really succesful. The idea was that we had the most valuable IP in the entire world, and we ****ed it up to the point of having 200k subs. And yes, all 200k of you were important, but 200k means nothing in the scheme of things. I worked on Galaxies for around 5 and a half years. ThatÆs a long time. [...] So, when the NGE push came along, we were asked to reimagine the game. Not just small changes, but rebuild it. And it was needed. When we were asked, we were bleeding subscribers. If I remember correctly, somewhere around 10k a month. LOSING 10,000 subs a month. Note û I think our subs were closer to 160-180 than 200k. It was a bad financial situation no matter how you look at it. [...] We were told to imagine something new and unique. To push it to the next level. Originally, it was specced as a tutorial. A tutorial paired with a new marketing push, new and grandiose relaunch that would recapture the magic that we missed when we first released. Linkage
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:34:00 - [994] Originally by: Hyperforce99 Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: Tla Atij Edited by: Tla Atij on 23/06/2011 00:20:34 Anyone got matches? Isn't that CCP Soundwave? It would appear so ... An uphill battle hmm? This is part of the newsletter for CCP-ers I'm searching for the whole thing so you can download it your selve and just see how much of it is true for your selve and teh path come of the CCP-employees want to take. I never throught that guy would be responsible for this RMT mess
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:34:00 - [995] Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 23/06/2011 09:35:24 Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen Originally by: Miilla So, who's in the mood to play Eve? Nah, neither am I, and havn't been since yesterday. 112days remaining then bye bye Miilla needs a helmet for her avatar, if she were to stick around. You know, the kind of helmet the kids on the shortbus wear. So they don't cause further brain damage when they drool, bang their head against the rusty duct tayped bulkhead, and punch the copy/paste button into the forum ONE....MORE....TIME. 112 days.....sigh And you reply every time. You know..your char would look really good with one of those monocles..have you thought about getting one?
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:37:00 - [996] this thread underperforms to my expectations. i was estimating we'd be at page ~50 today when i went to sleep yesterday.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:39:00 - [997] CCP have remade the Eve website to reflect their new business model!!!!
Shintai Gallente Arx Io Orbital Factories Arx Io	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:39:00 - [998] High subscription cost+mandatory macro/microstransactions. F U CCP. Take your greed up where the sun doesnt shine. -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:39:00 - [999] here's the link to the complete Document. http://www.mediafire.com/?ccl135embyb6c2v There's some more links in the early 10 pages of this post as well that you can (and in my oppinion should) check out as well to get a grasp of what's going on. Some people argue that the post that has set this rampage off is an aprisl fool joke, but in fact i highly doubt it,.. and if it should be an aprils fool troll than it's one that quite curatley describes the path CCP is walking with EVE.
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:40:00 - [1000] Originally by: RensPriceChecker2 this thread underperforms to my expectations. i was estimating we'd be at page ~50 today when i went to sleep yesterday. We need to spread the news..I think I will spend the rest of my days spamming this in jita and other high populated systems. If we are the "vocal minority" let's see what the silent majority thinks. Spam until your fingers bleed!!
Diomedes Calypso	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:41:00 - [1001] Originally by: Jowen Datloran Am I the only person here who works for a company?... Accidently I just read CCPs newsletter after having read the ones in my company e-mail and will conclude that it is genuine enough. In fact, the ones from my company executives contain a lot fancy marketing talk and short sighted predictions. That is just the way those are written and should always be taken with a grain of salt. For one, I give CCP props for both showing the thoughts of developers both for (Kristoffer) and against (John) virtual sales. I think John echoes a lot of the concerns people present here. Secondly, I like how CCP tries to break the normal virtual goods sales philosophy by demanding that all virtual goods should be re-sellable within the game allowing people access to them with virtual money too. I do not entirely agree on the first section of the news letter and I would be very careful to put equation between people who enjoy spending money on improving their personal golf performance (by buying better clubs) and people who spend their free time on computer games. It is far from all people who do sports who spend enormous amounts of money to improve their performance, especially in more group conducted sports such as football which I think EVE is much more comparable to than golf. Besides the major danger for CCP is not whether people will spend time playing EVE or golf but if they will chose other computer games than EVE. As example, CCP should be much more concerned about products like Impulse and Steam which allows me to easily buy and install a whole game at prices that right now equals CCP price on a pair of virtual boots. Sure those games are not always (rarely) superior but they will certainly provide me with some hours/days of entertainment which CCPs virtual boots will be hard pressed to compete with. Still, the world of MMOs are moving towards more virtual goods sales as can be seen by the increased number of games going ôfree to playö every week. This is certainly not the fault of CCP and it is quite understandable and even reasonable that they are trying to make a business strategy for this. prettty reasonable post... there is a lot i really don't like about the ideas of monetizing social relationships between people but thats about the reality of many fashion items and the article had a sort of intellectual truth to it... although its response was hardly a noble focus on making money providing a better product but finding a way to sell the most by not doing too much harm to a product. The one important compliment that your brought up and I also want to keep in my mind is that they are taking and maintaing an almost unprecedented stance in letting all items be trasferreable and available with game effort using game currency. Thats very very important to me and enough to cheer me up when i get glum about it
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:42:00 - [1002] Now that Miila is here to help reignite the FIRE OF A THOUSAND NERDS, I'm sure this thread will hit 50 pages in no time!
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:44:00 - [1003] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: RensPriceChecker2 this thread underperforms to my expectations. i was estimating we'd be at page ~50 today when i went to sleep yesterday. We need to spread the news..I think I will spend the rest of my days spamming this in jita and other high populated systems. If we are the "vocal minority" let's see what the silent majority thinks. Spam until your fingers bleed!! COMMENCE THE SPAM WAR!!
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:45:00 - [1004] This will be an interesting day, lets see what will get locked, who will get banned, and who at CCP will get sacrificed to clean this mess up (its always the little guys that pay the price).
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:46:00 - [1005] CCP need to realise that it is better to have a profitable business and not a greedy business than none at all. I would have to worry now If I was an employee there as too much hinges on 300k customers they are ****ing off. That would affect the company employee's salary, something will have to be cut, that would affact WoD development, Dust would have to pay for itself, so would Eve. WoD would need investors or sold or shut down. If Eve could not pay for itself after this, bye bye CCP. Keep an eye on their financials now, and their recruitment / head counts. That will be the tell tale sign of the impact.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:47:00 - [1006] Originally by: Mikaaro Am I missing something here? Yes. The hypothetical MTing 'Total Hell Death' Apoc would be superior in many, if not all, respects to a full on officer fit Apoc. Hypothetically, for the sake of argument, 9 low slots, 4 rig slot and enough points to fill each with T2 damage rigs when mated to 'Total Hell Death' Tachyon Beam Lasers. Throw on T2+DC2 resists as base for added giggles. True that is an extreme example, possibly unlikley, but the $$ Apoc will be the better item to have in the game, even when compared to current officer mods.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:47:00 - [1007] http://eve-offline.net/ surely there are usually about 40,000 on at this time. this is very telling.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:48:00 - [1008] Originally by: Miilla If Eve could not pay for itself after this, bye bye CCP. Most of the players of this game have seen a fail-cascade close up. Now the people who never left high-sec get to see one.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:49:00 - [1009] Originally by: Carmine Lady http://eve-offline.net/ surely there are usually about 40,000 on at this time. this is very telling. Usually at this time there is 26k ish players, EU timezone.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:52:00 - [1010] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 09:53:44 Eve is turning into the most expensive DLC milking game ever in the history of gaming. A single item can cost more then 30 days game time.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:54:00 - [1011] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Carmine Lady http://eve-offline.net/ surely there are usually about 40,000 on at this time. this is very telling. Usually at this time there is 26k ish players, EU timezone. When I logged on to see if I was banned last night, I'd say that we were down maybe 1000 people total from what I normally see. Well within statistical norms. HTH. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:54:00 - [1012] yup, but today is a holiday in a few EU countries, and right after an expansion....it didn't make an impact, thats for sure.
Isil Rahsen Gallente Ferrum Superum	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:55:00 - [1013] Welp time for me to hit the sack, look forward to seeing what kind of BS justification comes. (if it does) Good luck to people posting links to the pdf, hope no one else gets banned.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:56:00 - [1014] Everyone who stated they are going to quit and burn PLEXes or want to donate them in a next Emergency Relief campaign please notice how there's this Charity of mine that has even been showcased on Fanfest 2011. You may donate any amount of PLEX or ISK to Chribba or to the linked thread corp and they will be held until the next CCP PLEX for <Subject> emergency campaign happens. If you send to Chribba you MUST indicate the clause: "VAERT DONATION" and please also forward an eve-mail to me so I can include the donation in the accounting ledgers. If you send to the thread linked corp it'll all be done in automatic and your name shown in the Hall Of Fame. I will keep one subscription up just to hold the stuff till CCP starts the next campaign. Youtube proof of donation video. Thanks in advance to those who will do the only positive thing possible out of this fugly CCP mess. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:56:00 - [1015] Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Shoot2kilI FFS steak go to sleep man. NO I MUST WATCH THIS Glad I'm not the only one F5'ing this thread till the blue bars show up. Come on CCP, help me get to bed. Say something, anything.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:56:00 - [1016] CCP are going to make Entropia look good.
Fi1ippo Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:57:00 - [1017] the worst fake ive seen in a long long time. "The man behind the mask is a Maverik Letting off buck-ten shots for the hat trick." From the song Overtime (Maverik Lacrosse Commercial), by D.One. Life = Lax
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:57:00 - [1018] Edited by: Ranita Drell on 23/06/2011 09:57:40 Just an amusing note that I haven't seen mentioned here yet: According to one of the guys writing an article on MT in that newsletter, he thinks it would be silly if sunglasses for his avatar cost more than a faction battleship. Apparently the vision has changed since that article was written. Or sunglasses are totally different from monocles.
Wacktopia Dark Side Of The Womb	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:59:00 - [1019] Edited by: Wacktopia on 23/06/2011 09:59:55 I've said it before and I'm saying it again. Star Wars Galaxies 2.0
Goatse Girl	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:59:00 - [1020] More tears in this thread please! None of you drama queens have unsubscribed,
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 09:59:00 - [1021] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha If you send to Chribba you MUST indicate the clause: "VAERT DONATION" Is Chribba going to keep playing after they screwed him so bad?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:02:00 - [1022]
flapie 2 Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:07:00 - [1023] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 09:53:44 Eve is turning into the most expensive DLC milking game ever in the history of gaming. A single item can cost more then 30 days game time. Get a live dude, or atleast something to get you laid bro. Feels sucky to get scammed dont it, how does it feel to be on the other end of the beating stick for a change ? ontopic Reading the part about Dust makes me a bit worried indeed, specially the first part of it. Still think most people here should take a chil pill/sig or drink (or whatever get you going), cause all this forum PvP doesnt suit most of you at all. Repeating the same **** over and over isnt gonna help, leaving EVE wont help, spamming even more wont help (cause there hiding atm annyways). Maybe iff some people where a bit more mature about this, we might have allready had a responce from CCP in a mature way, thats how mature people work.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:10:00 - [1024] Originally by: flapie 2 Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 09:53:44 Eve is turning into the most expensive DLC milking game ever in the history of gaming. A single item can cost more then 30 days game time. Get a live dude, or atleast something to get you laid bro. Feels sucky to get scammed dont it, how does it feel to be on the other end of the beating stick for a change ? ontopic Reading the part about Dust makes me a bit worried indeed, specially the first part of it. Still think most people here should take a chil pill/sig or drink (or whatever get you going), cause all this forum PvP doesnt suit most of you at all. Repeating the same **** over and over isnt gonna help, leaving EVE wont help, spamming even more wont help (cause there hiding atm annyways). Maybe iff some people where a bit more mature about this, we might have allready had a responce from CCP in a mature way, thats how mature people work. So, a single item does not cost more than 30 days game time? I must be looking at the wrong NEX market.
Tejal Charu	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:10:00 - [1025] Originally by: flapie 2 Maybe iff some people where a bit more mature about this, we might have allready had a responce from CCP in a mature way, thats how mature people work. I agree, CCP are surely mature business men who will take a stance on this topic as soon as possible, right? That's why we already have an official statement from them saying this is true/false, right?
Randomize All	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:11:00 - [1026] When your government wants to raise the retirement age to 70, they don't tell you it's going up to 70. They tell you it's going up to 80. Then you threadnaught about 80. Then they have a review, and a few years of policy fine tuning, then they put the retirement age up to 66. And everybody goes "PHEW! THANKFULLY IT DIDN'T GO UP TO 80!" Then it goes up to 67, 68, 69 then 70. And you all go "WE WON! THEY DIDN'T GET TO 80!"
Alaric T'Sun Minmatar Aphelion T'Sun	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:12:00 - [1027] I'm glad CCP thinks they can do it better than SOE, but in the traditional sense, that's what we call 'hubris'. You should never presume that you're going to upend your game and hordes of people will come running back to you. It hasn't worked for a single game over the long term. It looks good on paper because thousands of bot/spam accounts log in, but eventually all the real players leave and you're left in the what not to do column like D&D Online and Galaxies. EvE has been around for 8 years, who in their right mind would think think this is a good idea?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:13:00 - [1028] Originally by: Randomize All When your government wants to raise the retirement age to 70, they don't tell you it's going up to 70. They tell you it's going up to 80. Then you threadnaught about 80. Then they have a review, and a few years of policy fine tuning, then they put the retirement age up to 66. And everybody goes "PHEW! THANKFULLY IT DIDN'T GO UP TO 80!" Then it goes up to 67, 68, 69 then 70. And you all go "WE WON! THEY DIDN'T GET TO 80!" Best way is to retire while working :) Every office training course and meeting is a retirement day out :)
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:15:00 - [1029] Hands up who Microtransaction PURCHASED a QUAFE T-shirt again? Feels good doesn't it?
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:16:00 - [1030] but..but...i wanted to see the stream in highquality :(((
Tetronomis	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:17:00 - [1031] ahahahaha this "fearless" newsletter is absolutely delightful. Working in a 5000+ collaborators company I laugh at this kind of boasty, full of horse**** internal communications every other month, but it's even more hilarious when a workshop like ccp try to look Google pretending to be bigger than they actually are. My HR doesn't put that much :effort: I'll send them a copy of your fearless. No lies, I really enjoyed yours. Not only the content of this letter is laughable for reasons you don't seem to comprehend (which is hilarious too), but the format makes it even more entertaining. Like the small hexagonal portraits of some "employees of the month": it's awesome. I can picture the employee shaping the pictures. That's my candy right there. The first paragraph of Peri Desai in the edito is typical. I mean if I were a "CCPer" I'd fantasize to smash her face with a shovel while whistling the 9th symphony, but from my perspective it's just pure gold. Oh CCP you bring the word failure to a whole new level. Well well with the great north war over the forum-sex was getting low and I feared I'd have to find some other source of fun for my morning coffee. But HEY! CCP you never fail to deliver I'll give you that! now I'd appreciate if someone release the older "fearless" newsletters... please
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:18:00 - [1032] ** didnt expect to see this topic still open when i got up and still no reply from ccp, must be knee deep in **e
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:20:00 - [1033] Originally by: leth ghost ** didnt expect to see this topic still open when i got up and still no reply from ccp, must be knee deep in **e They're looking for the waders still to get through it.
Vladimir Ilych Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:20:00 - [1034] "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization, some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright." "Incarna cannot be considered a product distinct from other parts of EVE. Incarna and flying in space are merely aspects of EVE...in virtual sales we must all adopt this way of thinking. Thus we will not and cannot focus on virtual sales only within the Incarna evironment, nor build that evironment around such sales, rather we will effect a universal strategy of micro-sales throughout the EVe experience." If the above becomes true then CCP will have lost themselves two accounts.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:21:00 - [1035] They're probably deciding on how :fearless: they actually are. From the looks of it, not very.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:22:00 - [1036] Edited by: Carmine Lady on 23/06/2011 10:24:55 still no blue bar, come on ccp say something. if you haven't said anything before the 40th page then well thats just you with your head in the sand. edit: and you should rename the company to Head In The Sand Productions with the tagline: "we run away from everything and what we dont run away from we whitewash with spin and rhetoric"
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:24:00 - [1037] I'm sitting here laughing at CCP Then I think I have paid for a remaining 111 days time :(
Datei Naru	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:24:00 - [1038] http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/JXY962D Here is a survey you can take to see how much we love the current attitude and direction of EVE online.
flapie 2 Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:25:00 - [1039] Originally by: Miilla So, a single item does not cost more than 30 days game time? I must be looking at the wrong NEX market. Lool just keep on being a 5 year old m8, youll get the kindergarden someday.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:27:00 - [1040] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas They're looking for the waders still to get through it. They're stuck at "ba" like the guy in Aliens 3 who drops the detonator in a hall full of accelerant. They'll be there for a few days yet while they figure out just how screwed they are. Some recent examples: BP Deepwater Horizon, Fukushma Nuclear Reactor.
Holy One Quiet.Storm Frater Adhuc Excessum	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:29:00 - [1041] Originally by: Arrs Grazznic The second microtransactions can be used to gain real advantage (ships, ammo, etc.) rather than Ken and Barbie fashion I will let my account expire and retire from Eve. Agreed. I'm not gonna rage lyrical just nod. Also, I should also point out that the moment I am asked to pay a sub AND pay for new features as MT, not as regular releases of content as we have enjoyed previously (which is the way its going now) I'll also quit. Thanks for the read and let's see how it goes. BBQ makes me hungry for more...
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:29:00 - [1042] Originally by: Miilla I'm sitting here laughing at CCP Then I think I have paid for a remaining 111 days time :( Quite similar feelings here
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:29:00 - [1043] I had an idea instead of everyone just canceling there accounts how about with any left over game time you have on your account we all crash the economy. Seriously remove all your goods from the market cancel all your trades and lets all f#ck up the market. If the economy goes ** up and no one can buy anything due to crazy crazy prices or lack of supply it could make the game unplayable and have even more people on here raging. All hail the king of the potato people**
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:30:00 - [1044] so euro gamer are on to the story thats good its getting out there how long can ccp just ignore everything Linkage
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:31:00 - [1045] Originally by: Saving Face Originally by: Miilla I'm sitting here laughing at CCP Then I think I have paid for a remaining 111 days time :( Quite similar feelings here luckily I dont have as long as that but i wish I could delete my account, i dont wish to be affiliated with CCP anymore.
Jaroslav Unwanted	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:33:00 - [1046] Read it, not the document but the posts there... Find it slightly disturbing. Hopefully i wont be alive at the time this project become reality, so i dont have to fear about finding some other game to play. PS. Please keep your vision of what to do in life is worth it and what is not. Its your opinion i dont share.
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:34:00 - [1047] I'm still really amused at contrast between NEX pricing and what Scott Holden says in the newsletter. I imagine a conversation like this took place: CCP Molock: OK, so what are we going to charge for these items? CCP Zinfandel: Well, first let's set the ceiling. Which item should we charge the most for? CCP Soundwave: The monocle is visible on your DED passport thing, right? The part that other players will actually see. So let's go with that. CCP Molock: I guess that makes sense. So how much should we charge? We decided that 1 PLEX would be 3500 aurum, so I'd say about a hundred and sev-- CCP Zinfandel: THIRTY THOUSAND AURUM! CCP Molock: What?! Oh -- you're joking, right? CCP Zinfandel: No, you see, it's a cybernetic monocle. You wouldn't want to put something cheap in your eye socket, right? CCP Molock: But do even the most expensive faction implants in the game cost that much I don't think? CCP Soundwave: Scott is right-- CCP Molock: Yeah, like I was saying, it really shouldn't be more than maybe two hun-- CCP Soundwave: I think it should only be about half that. CCP Molock: Half of two hund-- wait, what? You mean the monocle should cost 15000 aurum? CCP Zinfandel: Cybertech like this monocle is sacred to the Amarr, normally only available to the nobility. 15000 seems kind of cheap. CCP Molock: But that's still crazy -- you could buy a capital ship for that much -- or a monocle in real life. It needs to be way lower. CCP Soundwave: Let's just make it an even 12000. CCP Molock: But our players are going to think we've gone insane with greed ... only a handful of people will buy it and we won't even profit on it. CCP Soundwave: If that's the case we can just cut the prices by a third and we'll look reasonable and magnanimous. It's win/win. CCP Molock: Ugh, I guess ... CCP Soundwave: Plus, the when we start selling Noble Singularity L Charges for an aurum apiece, everyone will see it as a bargain, and won't think twice about making it their standard ammo!
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:34:00 - [1048] Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). Are you daft? In the latter you can get eth POS by ingame means only. In the former, someone needs to use RL money to unlock the item. Maybe not you spesifiaclly, but someone does. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:34:00 - [1049] Originally by: Saving Face Originally by: Miilla I'm sitting here laughing at CCP Then I think I have paid for a remaining 111 days time :( Quite similar feelings here Plus 20 billion isk worth of plex :) Thing is, I like Incarna, even if it runs slower than Crysis lol but this MT crap... makes me puke. It is so sickening I have suspended my Eve App SDK I was building and gona publish for app builders and 2 Eve apps and had a few more idea's that would grow with their API.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:35:00 - [1050] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Some recent examples: BP Deepwater Horizon, Fukushma Nuclear Reactor. [/quote Perhaps not that bad. Nodoby has died after all. But yes, they are probably looking at account information and figuring out just how many quitters have actually pushed bootan. Frankly and in all honestly I haven't, yet, done that. But depending on how CCP respond and resolve this I'm definetly cancelling further payments on an account that's been around since Exodus/Cold War or not if they get it right (obviously). It's that "if they get it right" bit they're probably trying to figure out. After all they pretty much just NGE'd their one product and that's going to take a lot of back pedaling.
Leijanna	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:38:00 - [1051] Wow... Sub runs out in a few days. Good timing. EVE is awesome in many ways, but things like this really ruins my confidence in ccp
Mikal Morataya	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:40:00 - [1052] Edited by: Mikal Morataya on 23/06/2011 10:46:11 Edited by: Mikal Morataya on 23/06/2011 10:44:03 Originally by: Vladimir Ilych "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization, some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright." "Incarna cannot be considered a product distinct from other parts of EVE. Incarna and flying in space are merely aspects of EVE...in virtual sales we must all adopt this way of thinking. Thus we will not and cannot focus on virtual sales only within the Incarna evironment, nor build that evironment around such sales, rather we will effect a universal strategy of micro-sales throughout the EVe experience." If the above becomes true then CCP will have lost themselves two accounts. I've only been in the game 10 months and while I expect older players to have an advantage, first in skills if nothing else. Once this happens I will also consider leaving. New ships, items and ammo purely for Aurum/microtransactions? No thanks. I was thinking of playing dust on my PS3 too. I might think again.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:41:00 - [1053] If CCP wanted press coverage, they got it.
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:42:00 - [1054] Originally by: Miilla Thing is, I like Incarna, even if it runs slower than Crysis lol but this MT crap... makes me puke. I like Incarna, CQ runs reasonably well on my computer, I even enjoy playing with dress-up dolls and all that, but it seems they're somehow, along the way, removing the game that I'm actually here to play.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:43:00 - [1055] I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:45:00 - [1056] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. If I wanted to play Entropia, I would have downloaded that client, I almost did, until a friend told me you cannot do anything in Entropia without paying for stuff. Then I immediately cancelled the client download and went back to Eve, seems I am getting the same Entropia, just a different client.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:45:00 - [1057] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. I expect CCP to treat the customers with respect and dignity. And to take into account that we are already paying them for a game. If you get too greedy, you tend to get burned eventually. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Mutnin Amarr Mutineers	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:46:00 - [1058] Edited by: Mutnin on 23/06/2011 10:46:34 Someone asked when did they stop caring? My guess when it became more profitable to stop caring. I will my toss "hat" in to the ring as yet another player whom will un-sub if CCP offers anything more than Vanity items for RMT. Something else that no one has mentioned in all the hurf burf with the new store and it's prices, ect. It wasn't so long ago that CCP put many of us on the back burner with their famous "18 months" quote. They claimed to not have enough developers to spread around. Meanwhile there are tons of broken & ignored things with-in EVE yet CCP has developers to make new shiny vanity items yet none to fix long lasting bugs & broken mechanics. Hey CCP how many AUR to fix the broken problems in FW or hey how about Blasters?
The Post Man	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:46:00 - [1059] It's rather telling that this thread is 36 pages in and there's still no dev response. Guess they must all be in a team meeting going dev 1 'OMGWTFDOWEDONOW!?!?!' dev 2 'Calm down, Eve players are dumb, they'll have forgotten about all this tomorrow' Hilmar 'Mmmmmmm..... Money! GIMME MONEY!'
Kuronaga Kantian Principle	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:46:00 - [1060] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. So you think it's perfectly cool to lie to your customers?
Thomas Kugisa	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:47:00 - [1061] Originally by: Tetronomis ahahahaha this "fearless" newsletter is absolutely delightful. Working in a 5000+ collaborators company I laugh at this kind of boasty, full of horse**** internal communications every other month, but it's even more hilarious when a workshop like ccp try to look Google pretending to be bigger than they actually are. My HR doesn't put that much :effort: I'll send them a copy of your fearless. No lies, I really enjoyed yours. Not only the content of this letter is laughable for reasons you don't seem to comprehend (which is hilarious too), but the format makes it even more entertaining. Like the small hexagonal portraits of some "employees of the month": it's awesome. I can picture the employee shaping the pictures. That's my candy right there. The first paragraph of Peri Desai in the edito is typical. I mean if I were a "CCPer" I'd fantasize to smash her face with a shovel while whistling the 9th symphony, but from my perspective it's just pure gold. Oh CCP you bring the word failure to a whole new level. Well well with the great north war over the forum-sex was getting low and I feared I'd have to find some other source of fun for my morning coffee. But HEY! CCP you never fail to deliver I'll give you that! now I'd appreciate if someone release the older "fearless" newsletters... please want to upvote this post so badly
Dr Diggabone	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:47:00 - [1062] If any of this turns out to be true, me and my friends are deffinately done with Eve. I love this game but you can't make those sorts of changes to the entity that is Eve and get away with it. Certainly not for long until the cracks start to appear. That and i'm sure everyone i know will make the jump to a certain upcoming MMO.
Angst IronShard Minmatar Sense of Serendipity Echoes of Nowhere	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:47:00 - [1063] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. and they are naive to think I'll continue to pay to play with such RMT craps. . ____________________________________________ Freedom is nothing but a chance to be better.
Rico Minali Gallente Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:48:00 - [1064] Eve is steadily becoming 'Gy with the fattest RL wallet wins' with plex etc, if microtransaction goods are going to give fighting advantages, then yeah, I will quit. Wonder if anyone on ebay wants to buy a paperclip... Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Josefine Etrange Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:48:00 - [1065] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku You don't seem to understand:(IF THIS IS LEGIT) CCP Soundwave is THE EVE LEAD GAME DESIGNER appointed and appraised at fanfest by Hilmar. This is not a slip, this is where EVE will go, end of story. With Soundwave can be dealt at the next fanfest, no problem to stop this from becoming the real future of eve. It is not like our lives are on stake about this issue. Why a forum in the year 2011 still has no automatic double post merge which can be done even with javascript mostly is beyond my understanding.
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:48:00 - [1066] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? There is nothing wrong with maximizing profits, but you don't usually do it by telling your existing customers that they'll have to pay more to fund other products that are more important to you than those your customers pay you for.
Arela Xen Gallente Evoke. Ev0ke	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:48:00 - [1067] I will instantly quit this game if there is any bonus for $ available, which makes the guy with the money stronger in pvp than the guy without. If that is the way this game evolves, it is over for me. Even if it is hard to leave after nearly 4 years of playing and loving, especially leaving my new cute avatar.
Anna Horibila	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:49:00 - [1068] Originally by: Dr Diggabone That and i'm sure everyone i know will make the jump to a certain upcoming MMO. Yup, after seeing what Incarna had to offer I went down to Game yesterday and pre-ordered a certain upcoming MMO. Oh BTW I can't read the download. 'Acrobat is unable to decrypt file' or some bull**** but I'm sure it's terrible, shocking and sickening. Just about everything about CCP recently is.
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:49:00 - [1069] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. EVE is already a cash cow - A BIG ONE. Not only does it have a subscription based model with decent player base. It ALSO has a built-in RMT model where players can buy extra game time via GTC/PLEX and sell it for ISK, which adds a lot of extra revenue for ÇÇP. So yea, we have a right to be angry when they introduce yet another layer of income. I can't think of any other game that wants to milk this much money from player-base.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:51:00 - [1070] Originally by: Mutnin Someone asked when did they stop caring? My guess when it became more profitable to stop caring. I will toss "hat" in to the ring as yet another player whom will unsub if CCP offers anything more than Vanity items for RMT. Something else that no one has mentioned in all the hurf burf with the new store and it's prices, ect. It wasn't so long ago that CCP put many of us on the back burner with their famous "18 months" quote. They claimed to not have enough developers to spread around. Meanwhile there are tons of broken & ignored things with-in EVE yet CCP has developers to make new shiny vanity items yet none to fix long lasting bugs & broken mechanics. Hey CCP how many AUR to fix the broken problems in FW or hey how about Blasters? Eve is seen as a payroll for WoD and Dust. That is their view of Eve. The money source for "other projects", which is true because Warewolves and vampires has a LARGE MASS APPEAL than Scifi. Furries are bigger customers then space pirates just as mages and dwarfs are bigger customers than space pirates. From a "wreckless gung ho" business perspective, I can see CCP's view and Icelanders are wreckless with money, that is the culture. It is one big party for them. Fine. I kind of had that life in Scandinavia too for a decade :) I can see that view. But as a customer who just wants to have fun, I am kind of sickened because if it goes through, Eve will be too expensive, sure it is optional, and I will not buy those "items" but other people will, and that will ruin the fun somewhat knowing that somebody somewhere paid for an advantage that I trained and skilled for and learned, it makes my previous game time a joke and really if I had known I could have waited and then paid a little more to get to where I am now, I could have SAVED A BUCKET LOAD OF MONEY. Plus as developer I was starting to build on their API. That has now stopped.
Joseph Vacher	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:51:00 - [1071] Originally by: Saving Face I like Incarna, CQ runs reasonably well on my computer, I even enjoy playing with dress-up dolls and all that, but it seems they're somehow, along the way, removing the game that I'm actually here to play. Spot on.
Tamahra Gallente Apina. United Pod Service	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:51:00 - [1072] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs I expect CCP to treat the customers with respect and dignity. And to take into account that we are already paying them for a game. If you get too greedy, you tend to get burned eventually.
Kuronaga Kantian Principle	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:52:00 - [1073] Originally by: Saving Face Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? There is nothing wrong with maximizing profits, but you don't usually do it by telling your existing customers that they'll have to pay more to fund other products that are more important to you than those your customers pay you for. To be fair, they were deliberately with holding that information.
Jackuu Bauwaah	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:53:00 - [1074] Originally by: Rico Minali Eve is steadily becoming 'Gy with the fattest RL wallet wins' with plex etc, if microtransaction goods are going to give fighting advantages, then yeah, I will quit. Wonder if anyone on ebay wants to buy a paperclip... I dont think youre the only one thinking about selling paper clips :) Several players I know have started liquidating hard. Ive spend alot isk on cheap stuff from desperat sellers just the few last days :)
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:54:00 - [1075] Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. EVE is already a cash cow - A BIG ONE. Not only does it have a subscription based model with decent player base. It ALSO has a built-in RMT model where players can buy extra game time via GTC/PLEX and sell it for ISK, which adds a lot of extra revenue for ÇÇP. So yea, we have a right to be angry when they introduce yet another layer of income. I can't think of any other game that wants to milk this much money from player-base. What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:54:00 - [1076] How is the PLEX market atm?
Miep Miep	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:56:00 - [1077] I had already 1 account unsubed after dominion, after tyrannis the next and here goes the last. May resubscribe after a while (if spaceship content) and remain skilling as long as it runs but iam done for a while at least. microtranse my ass ccp
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:56:00 - [1078] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. EVE is already a cash cow - A BIG ONE. Not only does it have a subscription based model with decent player base. It ALSO has a built-in RMT model where players can buy extra game time via GTC/PLEX and sell it for ISK, which adds a lot of extra revenue for ÇÇP. So yea, we have a right to be angry when they introduce yet another layer of income. I can't think of any other game that wants to milk this much money from player-base. What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing.
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:58:00 - [1079] Please look at this, and then look at this. Sums up the situation nicely, I think. Put the pitchforks down, undock, and kill things. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Morar Santee	Posted - 2011.06.23 10:58:00 - [1080] Well.. not sure how angry I can get about this. I got angry when they announced PLEX for remap. Community told them where they could stuff this idea and MTs in general, and CCP Shadow's reply was: "No plans for MTs in EVE!". (I'd provide the link, but eve-search is no longer functional. Go figure?) A few months later: "We listened to the community's concerns and introduce MTs for vanity items only!!" I got angry again and wanted to quit then.. but decided I'd keep playing for as long as it's fun to me. Not so much because of EVE as a game, but because of the people I played it with. Now this. Of course everyone with brains for 2 cents smelled this **** miles against the wind. So why get angry? Possibly because this game had so much potential and provided me with a lot of fun and good times over the years. But I'm playing this game to immerse myself with the EVE universe, and to compete with other players from all over the world. I don't play it to compete with a cash shop, or to spend additional money past my monthly subscription fee.
Istyn Tactical Knightmare Tear Extraction And Reclamation Service	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:00:00 - [1081] If a monocle costs $60, how much will a super cap cost?
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:00:00 - [1082] Greatly engineered. Fearless Vol 1... the gordon gekko issue... all the straight out badwill in the document, the humour. Already on the first page you get told its a spoof. Noone, makes a gordon gekko issue.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:00:00 - [1083] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 11:01:09 Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. EVE is already a cash cow - A BIG ONE. Not only does it have a subscription based model with decent player base. It ALSO has a built-in RMT model where players can buy extra game time via GTC/PLEX and sell it for ISK, which adds a lot of extra revenue for ÇÇP. So yea, we have a right to be angry when they introduce yet another layer of income. I can't think of any other game that wants to milk this much money from player-base. What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing. And if CCP remove the subscription and go F2MT (Free to Micro transaction - F2P) then it still would stink. The cost of Eve would rise, just by stealth, by the need to buy ingame stuff to survive/keep up. I would prefer a sub model because I can budget for it. Plain and simple. I know what I spend and that is that.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:00:00 - [1084] Originally by: Nikki West What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing. LOTRO had no other options left. Their subscriptions plummeted and not even expansions helped retention much. If they didn't go F2P and close the Euro servers then they were going bust. Anyway they were up-front and honest about it, unlike Eve's lead game designer
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:01:00 - [1085] Originally by: Miilla Eve is seen as a payroll for WoD and Dust. That is their view of Eve. The money source for "other projects", which is true because Warewolves and vampires has a LARGE MASS APPEAL than Scifi. Eve is such a horrible burden for them. $14.95/mo for so much work, so much grief, so much stress. There are much better activities to be involved in with the gaming industry beside trying to placate a bunch of tards month by month for no money. Thing is it was safe, secure, assured. CCP didn't have faith in it though, they saw the future coming and were afraid they couldn't stand up against competition. I would have kept being 3 of their customers....
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:01:00 - [1086] Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. EVE is already a cash cow - A BIG ONE. Not only does it have a subscription based model with decent player base. It ALSO has a built-in RMT model where players can buy extra game time via GTC/PLEX and sell it for ISK, which adds a lot of extra revenue for ÇÇP. So yea, we have a right to be angry when they introduce yet another layer of income. I can't think of any other game that wants to milk this much money from player-base. What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing. And they charge for expansions. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:03:00 - [1087] Originally by: Mutnin Edited by: Mutnin on 23/06/2011 10:46:34 Someone asked when did they stop caring? My guess when it became more profitable to stop caring. I will my toss "hat" in to the ring as yet another player whom will un-sub if CCP offers anything more than Vanity items for RMT. Something else that no one has mentioned in all the hurf burf with the new store and it's prices, ect. It wasn't so long ago that CCP put many of us on the back burner with their famous "18 months" quote. They claimed to not have enough developers to spread around. Meanwhile there are tons of broken & ignored things with-in EVE yet CCP has developers to make new shiny vanity items yet none to fix long lasting bugs & broken mechanics. Hahaha, they seem to have ample designers and staff as tehir able to use EVE (their goos with hte golden eggs) to create two more games on the side. My dad alwais told me to finish one thing before starting the next. Hmmm,... now that i'm looking at this,... maby they should also take this in considderation when someone comes up with "Incarna 2.0". Hey CCP how many AUR to fix the broken problems in FW or hey how about Blasters?
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:03:00 - [1088] Originally by: Verone Please look at this, and then look at this. Sums up the situation nicely, I think. Put the pitchforks down, undock, and kill things. Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:06:00 - [1089] Originally by: Bomberlocks Originally by: Verone Please look at this, and then look at this. Sums up the situation nicely, I think. Put the pitchforks down, undock, and kill things. Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill. QFT.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:08:00 - [1090] Originally by: Bomberlocks Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill. +1
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:09:00 - [1091] Originally by: Bomberlocks Originally by: Verone Please look at this, and then look at this. Sums up the situation nicely, I think. Put the pitchforks down, undock, and kill things. Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill. Nahà he gave them a well-deserved ***punch for the developer license and AUR store, if you have the stamina to dig through those threadnaughts. ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP*
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:09:00 - [1092] Originally by: Nikki West What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing. They had little choice. However Dungeons & Dragons Online (DDO) looks fascinating from a freemium/f2p perspective. Yes, you can sub if you want, if you do you get an allotment of turbine points (Arumun in EVE terms I guess) to spent on silly and you also get all the content. Or you can give someone a guest pass to get in to some dungeons/quest arcs and play together or you can buy some turbine points yourself and permamently unlock the content you want to play. If you unsub then the unlockables relock (unless you spent points on them previously I guess). I'm sure there are flaws in the system I've not heard about (I'm just going from the WTF is...) but I can't escape the bit about subscribers get everything being very applicable if what we are hearing is true.
Gnumpf	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:10:00 - [1093] Stardate 9522.6: I've never trusted CCP, and I never will. I can never forgive them for the death of my EVE.
DjLowballer Amarr Firebird Squadron	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:12:00 - [1094] If anything, the official response might be incredibly funny.
SNeAkYbRiT Gunslingers Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:14:00 - [1095] Since the patch all Ive done is watch the forum and laugh at CCP, and I havent stopped laughing yet...Im not bothered what happens to them now, Seen CCP screw the customers before in the past when they got caught helping BoB out years ago. I play via plex which was the intro to micro transactions, so I rely on greedy players who want to pay there way to the top of the pile, but over the last 6 months Ive seen the plex market be manipulated to increase the value...not saying this was just CCP. So I have a month left and all Im waiting for now is who will have the balls to post on the forums first and when lol Who will buy CCP out when they start going under? Sony or nVidia? or EA, I brought EA in to this cos CCP are starting to sound so much like them.
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:14:00 - [1096] Originally by: Tammarr Greatly engineered. Fearless Vol 1... the gordon gekko issue... all the straight out badwill in the document, the humour. Already on the first page you get told its a spoof. Noone, makes a gordon gekko issue. I'm tempted to agree. But then the assumption may have been made that it would never see public release and therefore would be a 'witty' internal document. Personally, if I were CEO, I'd sack who ever wrote/approved it if it were genuine as it demonstrates a clear lack of respect for the consumer which is a bad stance to take in whatever industry you work within. C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 the hydrostatic capsule blog
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:17:00 - [1097] Originally by: SNeAkYbRiT Who will buy CCP out when they start going under? Sony or nVidia? or EA, I brought EA in to this cos CCP are starting to sound so much like them. Start? No one. His name was John Turbefield!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:17:00 - [1098] There will probably be a CCP person posting on Friday... That way we get to rage even more over the weekend while they go boozing
SNeAkYbRiT Gunslingers Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:18:00 - [1099] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: SNeAkYbRiT Who will buy CCP out when they start going under? Sony or nVidia? or EA, I brought EA in to this cos CCP are starting to sound so much like them. Start? No one. lol
Wanda Wong	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:20:00 - [1100] Originally by: Bomberlocks Originally by: Verone Please look at this, and then look at this. Sums up the situation nicely, I think. Put the pitchforks down, undock, and kill things. Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill. OMGROFLMAO
DrDan21 Caldari Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:20:00 - [1101] The day they make things that matter available by micro payment is the day I press the cancel subscription button and start playing another game
ThirdEyeBlenny	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:20:00 - [1102] Originally by: Riflin' Betty Originally by: ThirdEyeBlenny This, wholeheartedly. Go silently the lot of you, Do not go gentle into that good night, Old age should burn and rave at close of day; Rage, rage against the dying of the light. Though wise men at their end know dark is right, Because their words had forked no lightning they Do not go gentle into that good night. Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay, Rage, rage against the dying of the light. Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight, And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way, Do not go gentle into that good night. Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay, Rage, rage against the dying of the light. And you, my father, there on the sad height, Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray. Do not go gentle into that good night. Rage, rage against the dying of the light. - Dylan Thomas (1914û1953) Nice one Betty, but bear in mind that it's likely that Dylan's father wasn't a pre-pubescent attention whoring **** :)
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:20:00 - [1103] Originally by: SNeAkYbRiT I brought EA in to this cos CCP are starting to sound so much like them. Activision. Bobby Kotick, CEO. A man who is proud to boast he does not play video games and has stated he prefers repeatable IP's and of those ones that have specialist controllers a player must pay extra for more so than others. Infogrames (now trading as Atari). Drove themselves in to the ground, ruined any good will and then rebranded themselves, they ban anyone on the forums who makes the connection between the two. Currently in the middle of repeating the good will ruining and will probably rebrand again sometimes in 2012. EA might not be the best of the best but their are far worse entities out there than Electronic Arts.
Perramas Caldari Pan Caldarian Ventures	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:22:00 - [1104] If the EVE24news bulletin was false CCP would have locked this thread and said something by now. CCPs silence on this matter is all the proof I need.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:23:00 - [1105] Originally by: Perramas If the EVE24news bulletin was false CCP would have locked this thread and said something by now. CCPs silence on this matter is all the proof I need. Why the bans?
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:24:00 - [1106] Originally by: DrDan21 The day they make things that matter available by micro payment is the day I press the cancel subscription button and start playing another game This Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:24:00 - [1107] Originally by: Bomberlocks Originally by: Verone Please look at this, and then look at this. Sums up the situation nicely, I think. Put the pitchforks down, undock, and kill things. Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill. For the record, I'm extremely disappointed with CCP, and I'm extremely disappointed with Incarna considering I'm an Eve Roleplayer who's been waiting for this expansion for half decade. I've played for 8 years, I've been a roleplayer for almost that long too, and I've sat back and watched its development for over half a decade. Five years later, what do we get in the initial, much anticipated release? > A single room, with zero options for customisation. > Restrictive clothing and character customisation options. > The ability to pay through the nose for character customisation options that are at best, mediocre. Ridiculous prices aside, Incarna on the whole leaves a lot to be desired. I do however accept the fact that it's an incremental release, which means the expansion needs the chance to build momentum over a number of patches before I cast judgement on it. I'm patient, I'll wait. I do agree with the outrage on prices. Considering most average people in the US working mediocre jobs earn <$10/hour, the prices are without a doubt, scandalous. A day's work for a virtual item that has no real effect other than changing the look of an Avatar? Yeah, I'll pass. I have more money than I know what to do with in Eve, and I earn a very healthy wage out of game, but like hell will I pay for any of these microtransaction based features. In the end, the outcome is simple : [ ] Load Station Environment I'll continue to pay to play internet spaceships, and I'll continue to actively RP in game. I've been doing that for the last 8 years without having to pay extra for them, and I'll continue to do so until Incarna meets a standard that I feel is acceptable enough for me to interact with it. Right now, it's broken and is at best in early beta stages. I'm sorely disappointed, I'm unhappy with the release, I'm astonished and appalled with the prices, and as someone who's devoted almost a decade to playing Eve I'm extremely concerned about the direction that CCP is headed and feel they're rapidly losing focus on their direction for Eve as other shiny new projects distract them and they need to find the money to fund them. I'm not however going to get bent out of shape, create a massive scene, threadnaught the hell out of the forums and be part of a huge drama. Instead I'm going to do what I've done for a long time : Enjoy the features in Eve that interest me, until those that don't are developed into something that catches my attention. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Iulia Badr Marinela	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:25:00 - [1108]
Captain Travaras	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:26:00 - [1109] Originally by: Perramas If the EVE24news bulletin was false CCP would have locked this thread and said something by now. CCPs silence on this matter is all the proof I need. yep, there has been no reply from devs today that i have spotted, and in the past few days there has been quite a few replies. I think the controversy with the leaked documents and their intentions for the future have caused a problem. We've had devs tell us recently on the forum that they will not offer ships and game changing items for real money, now the leaked documents suggest otherwise.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:27:00 - [1110] Can we get coverage on Slashdot for this? If CCP want press coverage, lets give it to em.
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:28:00 - [1111] Locking this thread would ensure that people would flame away about how real it is and how ccp is throwing to cover it up by disallowing discussion. Currently they are damned if they do, damned if they don't. Looking at other threads on other forums, the engineers behind this little hoax are less shy in their words about how they feel. There is alot of engineering in this thread with some faces with a wee bit of alts and great vocabularies, great people at having different personalities for the different chars they post with. Couple this with the outrage fail over the noble pricing and said faces being upset about this, the timing of this internal document finding its way out: is to good to be true. And what have we all learned from eve about things that are to good to be true? If this turns out to be true, I'll eat looks around for something thats not his socks, not his headset, not his monitor ...Can I just settle with eating a pack of broccoli? I hate broccoli :(
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:28:00 - [1112] Originally by: Bomberlocks Verone, you've been brownnosing CCP for so long that you wouldn't recognise a mountain if it slapped you in the face while you tripped over the molehill. rotfl
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:30:00 - [1113] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 11:30:51 Originally by: Iulia Badr Marinela http://i.imgur.com/5wiWj.jpg Moderators are slow today and CCP never bothered to take 5mins and edit the forum code to be secure. Use url tag, imgs can be used to cross site script, half the forum has them turned off. His name was John Turbefield!
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:32:00 - [1114] Originally by: Verone I have more money than I know what to do with in Eve, and I earn a very healthy wage out of game, but like hell will I pay for any of these microtransaction based features. Then why is it that you don't own a monocle?? Put your money where your eye is.
Yagen Sense of Serendipity Echoes of Nowhere	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:32:00 - [1115] If this is real (and it pretty much is, I believe), then the only way for CCP to get things right (and get me to resub) is to - Publicly apologise for all this - Fire those people whose opinion do not reflect those of CCP but proove they are utterly incompetent at what they do Furthermore, EvE has the highest sub price on the market, this is supposed to pay for content (2x sub per person = 24Ç/6 month = 1 fully-fledged expansion). Incarna has been 5 years in the making, and we should pay for aforementionned content when all we have been delivered is a joke? No "friday sales", give us all this content for free. This is the least you can do to atone for the immense failure of the last week. And while we are at it, don't screw up WoD with this kind of stupidity. I guess CCP failed at growing up, when even Hilmar doesn't have a clue. This company could never have dared to even print "Greed is Good" 5 years ago.
Aluchem	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:34:00 - [1116] This is copied from a thread on our internal forums about this. Seeing as it adequately sums up my views I felt I should paste it here on what I think must be my second ever Eve-O post: Anyone with half an ounce of business sense will tell you that in order to make money and satisfy repeat customers then your services offered and public perception need to be good. If people feel that they are being treated unfairly or ripped off then they will jump ship. The effects of this are easily noticeable; Using for example insurance companies, watch their adverts. Now answer me how many of those ads are saying "We offer the best insurance"? Not many. Now how many say "We have the best customer service and we care about our customers"? Nearly all of them. Customer perception matters a hell of a lot. It can make or break any business, and there are MMOs out there who serve as prime examples of what happened when they alienated their customers. The best way to improve your customer perception is simply communication coupled with a fair and good product. CCP is actively talking internally about completely reversing their promise to their active customers regarding Micro-Transactions. CCP wants to charge us $70 for a fake **ing monacle. Now maybe you see that as fine, but I feel like I was just on. My customer perception of CCP has been severely damaged by this, and if I see them break their promise I won't be willing to pay them for a game even if I enjoy it. And I'm far from the only one. So before you decide to make money off someone, you sure as hell better be careful what impact that has on your public image. CCP **ed this up in a big way.
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:35:00 - [1117] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Verone I have more money than I know what to do with in Eve, and I earn a very healthy wage out of game, but like hell will I pay for any of these microtransaction based features. Then why is it that you don't own a monocle?? Put your money where your eye is. That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
dibblebill Danneskjold Heavy Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:36:00 - [1118] I still say it looks fake, and more like a parody of CCP and its community than anything else. -------SIGNATURE------- I fly a Rook, Falcon, Blackbird and Widow. U MAD?
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:36:00 - [1119] Originally by: Yagen Furthermore, EvE has the highest sub price on the market People keep saying this, and yet, it's not particularly hard to find games that cost the same or (yes) moreà ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Lederstrumpf	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:37:00 - [1120] == Kristoffer Touborg == I would like virtual goods sales in EVE. [] I think theyÆre brilliant [..] our players don't [..] I donÆt really understand the logic behind it == snip == A manager who has no ****ing clue about customer needs should get fired - the earlier the better! He's putting his own personal belief above customer feedback despite even admitting to not understand what's going on. Following such path has one direction only: Downhill. He obviously does not care about EVE as a game either: If he would, he'd easily grasp that fairness within a given frame is one of the most fundamental rules for a game to be enjoyed. Causing havoc upon such relative fairness by giving paying/rich folks huge advantages only can damage the game. The game is your product. It is under attack. Fire the ones trying to damage it!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:37:00 - [1121] Originally by: Verone Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Verone I have more money than I know what to do with in Eve, and I earn a very healthy wage out of game, but like hell will I pay for any of these microtransaction based features. Then why is it that you don't own a monocle?? Put your money where your eye is. That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? You will the hell want one when it boosts your perception skills or something
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:38:00 - [1122] Originally by: Verone Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? You feel the same about buying standing changes or unique ammo? That IS what's coming as the lead game designer is proposing exactly that. This threadnaught may get it delayed a little but it IS going to happen.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:38:00 - [1123] Edited by: Grimpak on 23/06/2011 11:38:25 can't believe I read (sorta) the 38 pages of this thread anyways, I tried to come up with pros and cons of this debacle after I read the "supposedly leaked" pdf (of which the inaction from CCP seems to make it even more and more true), and I came up with nothing. CCP is pulling a SWG with this and, unlike SOE, it won't have the capital from some big publisher to absorb it. IF they go ahead with it I can expect it to go under within a year or smth. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:39:00 - [1124] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Verone Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Verone I have more money than I know what to do with in Eve, and I earn a very healthy wage out of game, but like hell will I pay for any of these microtransaction based features. Then why is it that you don't own a monocle?? Put your money where your eye is. That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? You will the hell want one when it boosts your perception skills or something Already has implants, thx :3 >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:39:00 - [1125] I can get an hour with a sex worker cheaper than a monacle.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:42:00 - [1126] Originally by: Aluchem This is copied from a thread on our internal forums about this. Seeing as it adequately sums up my views I felt I should paste it here on what I think must be my second ever Eve-O post: Anyone with half an ounce of business sense will tell you that in order to make money and satisfy repeat customers then your services offered and public perception need to be good. If people feel that they are being treated unfairly or ripped off then they will jump ship. The effects of this are easily noticeable; Using for example insurance companies, watch their adverts. Now answer me how many of those ads are saying "We offer the best insurance"? Not many. Now how many say "We have the best customer service and we care about our customers"? Nearly all of them. Customer perception matters a hell of a lot. It can make or break any business, and there are MMOs out there who serve as prime examples of what happened when they alienated their customers. The best way to improve your customer perception is simply communication coupled with a fair and good product. CCP is actively talking internally about completely reversing their promise to their active customers regarding Micro-Transactions. CCP wants to charge us $70 for a fake **ing monacle. Now maybe you see that as fine, but I feel like I was just on. My customer perception of CCP has been severely damaged by this, and if I see them break their promise I won't be willing to pay them for a game even if I enjoy it. And I'm far from the only one. So before you decide to make money off someone, you sure as hell better be careful what impact that has on your public image. CCP ed this up in a big way. QFT. CCP has shown that they don't give a flying ** about us; they see customers as walking wallets. This document shows that they are concerned with getting maximum MONEY for minimum SERVICE. Why should I give my money to a company like that? Better I spend my subscription fee on hookers rather than monocles; at least they pretend to care about me.
Chuckles Beeshaw Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:43:00 - [1127] man this is sad: Quote: There is a pretty overwhelming perception amongst EVE players that these changes are bad. I think they're brilliant, but our players don't. -- I don't really understand the logic behind it, but that's probably because I've been using virtual goods sales for a long time now .. Why? Because they let me manage my spending, and I'll sometimes prefer to buy a better experience when engaging in my hobby. so because THIS GUY^ likes spending real money on **ing pixels to make himself awesome on his own time, automatically assumes we'll just get used to it and love it in eve? the ** is this guy smoking ?
Cedric deBouilard Gallente EVE University Ivy League	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:44:00 - [1128] Originally by: dibblebill I still say it looks fake, and more like a parody of CCP and its community than anything else. If you consider CCP sells a monocle for $80, this doesn't look fake at all, at least it reflects their thinking with 100% accuracy. Also the game art assets in that PDF look pretty much authentic to me. Originally by: Ray McCormack Last Word Never, ever invest in a 'bank' again.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:44:00 - [1129] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 11:45:18 Originally by: dibblebill I still say it looks fake, and more like a parody of CCP and its community than anything else. You must be new. It mirrors their public statements and releases they've attempted, exactly, just the internal part of the dialog. Why does it look like a parody? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe's_law His name was John Turbefield!
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:45:00 - [1130] Originally by: Reed Tiburon QFT. CCP has shown that they don't give a flying ** about us; they see customers as walking wallets. This document shows that they are concerned with getting maximum MONEY for minimum SERVICE. Why should I give my money to a company like that? Better I spend my subscription fee on hookers rather than monocles; at least they pretend to care about me. PMSL Mind if a quote you in my sig as thats funny as hell. All hail the king of the potato people**
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:45:00 - [1131] Originally by: Chuckles Beeshaw man this is sad: Quote: There is a pretty overwhelming perception amongst EVE players that these changes are bad. I think they're brilliant, but our players don't. -- I don't really understand the logic behind it, but that's probably because I've been using virtual goods sales for a long time now .. Why? Because they let me manage my spending, and I'll sometimes prefer to buy a better experience when engaging in my hobby. so because THIS GUY^ likes spending real money on **ing pixels to make himself awesome on his own time, automatically assumes we'll just get used to it and love it in eve? the ** is this guy smoking ? Makes managing spending easier? It does the opposite. it is price rises by stealth, in the long run, the game costs MORE, you just don't see it that way until you check your bank at the end of the month and wonder where it went. Stable subs or not at all.
diaufop	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:46:00 - [1132] Edited by: diaufop on 23/06/2011 11:46:58 Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing. Just to clear this up as a player of both DDO and LoTRO for some time. DDO and LoTRO both use the same business model: Option A) Pay your monthly/6-monthly/yearly subscription fee, get access to all game content, all race/classes, and so on, and get 500 Turbine Points to spend in the cash shop every month on vanity stuff/consumables/whatever. Option B) Play for free - a few races/classes restricted, and have free access to approx 20% of the game's content. Buy the rest of the content (one-time fee), unlock races/clases, etc, with the cash shop. Prices in said cash shop range from 50 Turbine Points for some little trinket or consumable to 2995 Turbine Points for a +2 to all stats tome (an EVE equivalent would be an upgrade that boosts your ship's EHP, speed, agility, and DPS by 5%), content packs are around the 450-1500 mark. Swapping from a subscription-only game to the "hybrid model" as Turbine call it, DDO went from a dead game to one having more regular active players than EVE does by far (and almost none of them are bots). LoTRO went from a slowly dying game to having even more regular active users than DDO. Turbine made a ****ing fortune. I somehow doubt that CCP will actually follow this path however, looks like they're going subscription only + MEGAtransactions. Which I highly doubt will work as well for them as Turbine's change did.
Nimbat	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:46:00 - [1133] They locked the thread where we discussed the ban of helicity :(
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:47:00 - [1134] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 11:30:51 Originally by: Iulia Badr Marinela http://i.imgur.com/5wiWj.jpg Moderators are slow today and CCP never bothered to take 5mins and edit the forum code to be secure. Use url tag, imgs can be used to cross site script, half the forum has them turned off. They are here though..they locked this thread today. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534786&page=3
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1135] This issue goes further than CCP adding in DLC at an absurd price. The issue relates back to game companies now starting to think they don't need to make complete games or items any more. For whatever reason, the companies are starting to make the "basic" play code and then hold back "premium" content for DLC later. So you are paying for an unfinished product. CCP is just starting to get into this market but look around at all the other games where they release the product and within a day or two they have dozens of maps, mods, weapons, etc ready for you to pay extra. You have to ask, how much time went into the basic code and how much extra time was spent with DLC. Incarna has all the hallmarks of a new basic game frame ready to be plugged in with DLC. We can probably kiss goodbye anything good being added to the game in terms of content. Now if you want more exciting, difficult, better rewarding missions you can purchase them; new planets purchase; sov purchase it (in connection with Dust). CCP is retooling eve to be one huge DLC microtransaction universe where you also get the benefit of paying a monthly fee. Did you really want an incursion in Jita, well for the low low price of 200k AU it can be purchased
Cyaxares II	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1136] Edited by: Cyaxares II on 23/06/2011 11:49:46 Originally by: Tammarr There is alot of engineering in this thread with some faces with a wee bit of alts and great vocabularies, great people at having different personalities for the different chars they post with. Couple this with the outrage fail over the noble pricing and said faces being upset about this, the timing of this internal document finding its way out: is to good to be true. dude, it's all the mega-rich PLEX speculators that got burned by the NeX pricing... now PLEX prices dropped below 400m and they are losing money just look at this thread - of course they are mad at CCP
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1137] Originally by: Nimbat They locked the thread where we discussed the ban of helicity :( :( its a sad time when ccp start banning the likes of helicity this is low ccp.
Noferatu	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1138] Disturbing. I've been playing Eve since 2006, pretty much every day. I admit to having invested a disproportionate amount of time in Eve. And the more time I invest in my characters, the harder it would be to give the game up. But this... this is in one way worrying - and in another, hardly surprising. In any customer-centric business, there is a disparity between machinated "customer perception" and actual internal opinion toward customers. CCP's silence in this threadnaught is the worrying bit. Qui tacet consentire videtur - "He who is silent is seen to agree".
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1139] Originally by: Nimbat They locked the thread where we discussed the ban of helicity :( they finaly come out trying to do some damage limitation then lol
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1140] Originally by: Othran Originally by: Verone Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? You feel the same about buying standing changes or unique ammo? That IS what's coming as the lead game designer is proposing exactly that. This threadnaught may get it delayed a little but it IS going to happen. No, not at all. Then I most certainly WOULD be annoyed. I don't believe at all that someone's out of game wallet should determine how successful they are in a game or reflect their ability to get ahead in it. We should all pay out $14.95 a month and have a level playing field, sadly that's not the case in any MMO given the popularity of RMT, and the effective legalisation of it by CCP through PLEX trading. Hence the reason I've never gotten involved in territorial 0.0 warfare, I don't like the idea that I could put hundreds of man hours into creating an empire and colonising a region, only to have someone with a huge out of game bank balance fund their alliance from RMT to come steam-roll something built with actual effort. This is why I opposed PLEX so much, and this is why I dislike the entire concept of micro transactions overall. Personally I feel that micro transactions have no place in Eve, or any other sandbox MMO where the gameplay is emergent. I also feel that the whole concept of them in Eve is a way of producing extra funding solely to support the development of other projects, such as World of Darkness and DUST. That said, I'm not going to throw a fit about content that they're CONSIDERING and discussing. I'd rather wait to see what actually goes into the queue for development before I start getting a sandy vagina over future content. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1141] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 11:49:34 Originally by: diaufop Edited by: diaufop on 23/06/2011 11:46:58 Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: General Windypops What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. What did happen to LOTRO? They completely removed subscription fees and switched to a different model. They didn't add MTs on top of subscriptions because that would be insane - which is what ÇÇP is doing. Just to clear this up as a player of both DDO and LoTRO for some time. DDO and LoTRO both use the same business model: Option A) Pay your monthly/6-monthly/yearly subscription fee, get access to all game content, all race/classes, and so on, and get 500 Turbine Points to spend in the cash shop every month on vanity stuff/consumables/whatever. Option B) Play for free - a few races/classes restricted, and have free access to approx 20% of the game's content. Buy the rest of the content (one-time fee), unlock races/clases, etc, with the cash shop. Prices in said cash shop range from 50 Turbine Points for some little trinket or consumable to 2995 Turbine Points for a +2 to all stats tome (an EVE equivalent would be an upgrade that boosts your ship's EHP, speed, agility, and DPS by 5%), content packs are around the 450-1500 mark. Swapping from a subscription-only game to the "hybrid model" as Turbine call it, DDO went from a dead game to one having more regular active players than EVE does by far (and almost none of them are bots). LoTRO went from a slowly dying game to having even more regular active users than DDO. Turbine made a ****ing fortune. I somehow doubt that CCP will actually follow this path however, looks like they're going subscription only + MEGAtransactions. Which I highly doubt will work as well for them as Turbine's change did. LOTR naturally has a bigger following than spaceships too. different genere of game, apples to oranges. Also, are those 500 monthly points carried over or is it a use it or lose it affair like Pay as you go mobiles?
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:48:00 - [1142] Originally by: ExcalibursTemplar Originally by: Reed Tiburon QFT. CCP has shown that they don't give a flying ** about us; they see customers as walking wallets. This document shows that they are concerned with getting maximum MONEY for minimum SERVICE. Why should I give my money to a company like that? Better I spend my subscription fee on hookers rather than monocles; at least they pretend to care about me. PMSL Mind if a quote you in my sig as thats funny as hell. Go for it mate. The one good thing about this mess is that I've seen more funny ** created by the playerbase than ever before. You messed up a really good thing, CCP.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:50:00 - [1143] Originally by: Nimbat They locked the thread where we discussed the ban of helicity :( I've been banned by PR recently too. His name was John Turbefield!
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:52:00 - [1144] Originally by: Nimbat They locked the thread where we discussed the ban of helicity :( They are probably going to ban everyone associated with EN24 too. Now the idiotic licensing scheme makes sense, it would give them some measure of control of sites like that, as in, "oh, you inform people about our plans to turn our players into cash registers, we'll pull your "license" and now you can't sell ads for ISK". Revealing stuff like this to us is why sites should DO news. Seriously, if this is the direction CCP is going in (and they've been trying to ram new forms of RMT down our throats for the last year, remember the floated "stat remap for PLEX" scheme?) the sooner we know the better. An informed customer makes better decisions. This is like knowing about the impending NGE months in advance (instead of days which was what we got). We now know where CCP is going. RMT out our asses. Everything associated with Incarna will be RMT based. Dust will be RMT based. They plan to backfill the original EVE game with RMT. And items in the cash shop ARE NOT going to be cosmetic only.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:54:00 - [1145] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:55:06 Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:54:36 Originally by: Verone That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? See, thats where i'm disappointed, you are a nice guy and all, but man, try to focus on EVE as a whole and not just your little world. This argument is like "what do i care if the world around me burns down, as long as my nice little house is fine". If you can't see where CCP's vision is leading and why this is bad for EVE in the long run, i don't know what is? Do they have to ban your accounts for you to care? And sry if i single you out, you are just one of many with this attitude.
diaufop	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:57:00 - [1146] Originally by: Miilla LOTR naturally has a bigger following than spaceships too. different genere of game, apples to oranges. Also, are those 500 monthly points carried over or is it a use it or lose it affair like Pay as you go mobiles? They're carried over - my LoTRO account has about 3200 points on it atm, gets its 500 points on the same day every month nad not much left to spend them on.
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 11:57:00 - [1147] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:55:06 Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:54:36 Originally by: Verone That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? See, thats where i'm disappointed, you are a nice guy and all, but man, try to focus on EVE as a whole and not just your little world. This argument is like "what do i care if the world around me burns down, as long as my nice little house is fine". If you can't see where CCP's vision is leading and why this is bad for EVE in the long run, i don't know what is? Do they have to ban your accounts for you to care? And sry if i single you out, you are just one of many with this attitude. When you've been playing Eve for as long as I have, you come to expect things. One of those things is that not every part of Eve will be tailored to your enjoyment or gameplay needs. I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:01:00 - [1148] Edited by: Rex Liberium on 23/06/2011 12:01:42 Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:55:06 Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:54:36 Originally by: Verone That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? See, thats where i'm disappointed, you are a nice guy and all, but man, try to focus on EVE as a whole and not just your little world. This argument is like "what do i care if the world around me burns down, as long as my nice little house is fine". If you can't see where CCP's vision is leading and why this is bad for EVE in the long run, i don't know what is? Do they have to ban your accounts for you to care? And sry if i single you out, you are just one of many with this attitude. Indeed, and his little house isnt fine. Incarna and what is to follow, has turned every (subscription paying) eve-player into second rate customers. New content will come available but only if you pay more. Your subscription money will not be used to make eve better, just to run the servers and develop other games. His name was John Turbefield! Never forget!
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:03:00 - [1149] Originally by: Apollo Gabriel So in the last 8 hours, CCP just decided NOT to say, oh yeah that's fake? Problem is, what would they say? The easiest thing would just be to deny it... except then they don't get to 'coincidentally' implement anything on that list any more. So, damage control, in that regard, would halt their money-grubbing plans. And if it's real, we fry 'em regardless. So, I'd say that leaves CCP up that proverbial body of water made of excriment without a means of propulsion. --
Enuen Ravenseye Malevolence. Imperial 0rder	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:03:00 - [1150] Originally by: Houdian Black Well it seems like there are quiet a few unhappy people at CCP who I could see leaking this. Linkage Oh my, but that is hysterical. I especially liked: "There is a blatant lack of vision and direction for the project I work on and the people leading it are allowed to remain in their position on a basis of friendship rather than competence." Made me think: I guess we know where Brad is working now!
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:04:00 - [1151] I oppose all RMT in a full price subscription game. ALL of it. Even the PLEX system as it exists hasn't really set well with me, because it has had a very negative impact on the game. 2/3rds of 0.0 is now under the control of alliances that bot for the purposes of selling ISK and PLEX is the grease that makes that machine turn almost effortlessly. I have laughed at the term "microtransactions" since they were first proposed. Why? Because I realized very early on that there would never be anything "micro" (as in small) about them, nor their ambitions towards your wallet. So, some time back I coined a more realistic term: macrotranscam. Macro, meaning large. Scam, meaning a game that charges you $15/month AND has these things. Does anything say macrotranscam more than baubles and pixelated clothing that costs more to buy in a VIDEO GAME than they do in real life?
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:04:00 - [1152] Originally by: Republica Winder They are probably going to ban everyone associated with EN24 too. Now the idiotic licensing scheme makes sense, it would give them some measure of control of sites like that, as in, "oh, you inform people about our plans to turn our players into cash registers, we'll pull your "license" and now you can't sell ads for ISK". Yeah helicity is probably permabanned, I'd imagine that EN24 will go too. Whomever provided the leaked copy will probably get fired/sued. No tears for the EN news guys, this is what they always wanted with the boting articles. Quote: An informed customer makes better decisions. This is like knowing about the impending NGE months in advance (instead of days which was what we got). We now know where CCP is going. RMT out our asses. Everything associated with Incarna will be RMT based. Dust will be RMT based. They plan to backfill the original EVE game with RMT. And items in the cash shop ARE NOT going to be cosmetic only. LOTRO reviving itself from the dead and Blizzard making an ungodly amount off their MT transactions, the writing was on the wall. Its only going to get worse. ...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala.
Hot Stufff	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:05:00 - [1153] Well they are starting to quietly move and lock threads without leaving blue bars on them. Maybe we will get an answer soon.
sarah mcjimmy	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:06:00 - [1154] After reading the Greed is Good PDF, it gave me a wonderful insight in to the way CCP view their 'lolcustomers'. I'm letting all 3 accounts expire in August, I've had enough of this game and MMOs in general. Thanks CCP for putting things in to perspective.
gektor fox Ozuwara	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:08:00 - [1155] Originally by: Enuen Ravenseye Made me think: I guess we know where Brad is working now! You sir owe me a new keyboard, spit my drink out when I read that laughing.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:08:00 - [1156] Originally by: Verone Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:55:06 Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:54:36 Originally by: Verone That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? See, thats where i'm disappointed, you are a nice guy and all, but man, try to focus on EVE as a whole and not just your little world. This argument is like "what do i care if the world around me burns down, as long as my nice little house is fine". If you can't see where CCP's vision is leading and why this is bad for EVE in the long run, i don't know what is? Do they have to ban your accounts for you to care? And sry if i single you out, you are just one of many with this attitude. When you've been playing Eve for as long as I have, you come to expect things. One of those things is that not every part of Eve will be tailored to your enjoyment or gameplay needs. I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Ok, but why mock them then for their worries? They are as legitimate as yours when you reach your "limit".
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:09:00 - [1157] im trying to find where to end my subscription and i cant find it.... do i just let my time run out or what?
In System Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:09:00 - [1158] T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:10:00 - [1159] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. +1
Obviously Confidential	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:10:00 - [1160] I don't think anyone reasonably sane has a problem with vanity items being sold in EVE. If it generates extra income to fuel development I am all for it! The main concern here, for me at least, is the fact that CCP seems to be focused on other products (WoD, DUST), treats EVE like a "golden goose", and appears more interested in ways to make money through whatever fotm stuff the CEO saw at E3, rather than what they are good at, making awesome virtual spaceship game worlds. CCP should not attend E3 to mimic business stuff from other games. CCP should attend E3 and think "maybe we are small but we are awesome at what we do, have been around for ages and these guys should learn and respect us" I don't think many of the things from the MMO world are applicable to EVE, and that is not a bad thing since we are pretty awesome in our own right. Of course, looking at budget and sales from other games one might be tempted to daydream, but that is their reality and not ours. If EVE continues to be a good game, more people will come. It will develop and grow naturally if CCP remains focused on making it an even more awesome game. Introducing new and crappy business schemes that are not that relevant should not shift the focus from building a wonderful sci fi world and engaging universe. Differentiation is what makes EVE strive and grow, it already is one of the most expensive subscription MMO's out there. This is prime material and should be treated as such, nurtured and developed further. I would like to think that an internal magazine such as this would be focused on technology, ways to do more fun stuff, development of new ideas, etc. Instead it reads like a poor man's version of a zine from a bunch of nerds that just discovered business and are out of touch with their customers/market/product. A company encouraging free thinking among its employees is a good thing, but in between suggesting we should go for MT because some out of touch with reality dev plays LoL and likes to buy dresses (same dude now responsible for "the flying in space part" and "concerned about 0.0" per last week at9 interview ); and the physics dude sharing his keen money making insights about the MMO experience (we're not talking Feynman material here, neither Michael Porter for that matter ) I am a bit disappointed. The focus seems to be on finding better ways to milk EVE players in order to fuel other things that are totally irrelevant or extremely risky if compared with EVE. What is so wrong about being a small company but still making money and having a wonderful spaceship game that has been growing for years on end? Not all companies need to be large blockbuster sellers, and EVE has seen several of those rise and fall during it's history. We should stick to our guns and do what we are good at. CCP should look at Google, not only a technology company but the #1 brand in the world. Google is all structured around technology. The business people are treated as necessary but are generally outside the main company culture, and management encourages it to be that way. Google employs many smart managers and has several business areas but there is no doubt about what they should do and what their purpose is. Business is necessary to fuel more technology. But the focus is on technology. Google makes money! Considering the past EVE Gate fiasco, the quality issues with unfinished stuff, the $99 fee for licencing sites confusion, the lackluster Incarna expansion (thank you for the awesome turrets and cosmetics but CQ has crappy performance, looks terrible and is useless) and now this, I feel this internal philosophy shift is having a detrimental impact on product quality and the community has grown aware of this. CCP should get it's act together and focus on what matters. For their own good.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:11:00 - [1161] Originally by: Verone That said, I'm not going to throw a fit about content that they're CONSIDERING and discussing. I'd rather wait to see what actually goes into the queue for development before I start getting a sandy vagina over future content. Let me paste a relevant section of Scott Holdens article : Incarna cannot be considered a product distinct from other parts of EVE. Incarna and ôflying-in-spaceö (and in due course DUST514) are merely aspects of the EVE Online experience; in virtual sales, as in development as a whole, we must all adopt this way of thinking. Thus, we will not and cannot focus on virtual sales only within the Incarna environment, nor build that environment around such sales; rather, we will effect a universal strategy of micro-sales throughout the EVE experience. That tells me that it IS going to happen and that its going to be consistent across Dust and Eve. Dust is going to be driven by MTs on everything from weapons to influence. Eve will do the same. I'm very grateful to whoever leaked this PDF. It has at least allowed me to see what CCP wish to do with the game but won't tell us officially. Its also allowed me to realise that you shouldn't listen to a single thing Soundwave says again - sorry matey but your credibility is shot to bits.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:11:00 - [1162] Hey Spitfire! Hey Navigator! Hey Zymurgist! I know you gits are reading this thread. I know it's more comfortable to stick your head in the sand, but at the risk of blowing your minds, I have a suggestion: How about a statement for the people? I'm sorry, I had you confused with someone who gave a ****. Won't happen again.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:11:00 - [1163] Originally by: Atreus Venom im trying to find where to end my subscription and i cant find it.... do i just let my time run out or what? You go in Account Management and there you will find a option to disable payment via card. Then the sub will be canceled one payed time runs out.
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:12:00 - [1164] Edited by: Rex Liberium on 23/06/2011 12:14:40 Originally by: Enuen Ravenseye Originally by: Houdian Black Well it seems like there are quiet a few unhappy people at CCP who I could see leaking this. Linkage Oh my, but that is hysterical. I especially liked: "There is a blatant lack of vision and direction for the project I work on and the people leading it are allowed to remain in their position on a basis of friendship rather than competence." Made me think: I guess we know where Brad is working now! Cons The lack of communication and transparency can be quite frustrating. Managers tend to hide things from the staff and are more reactive than proactive. The company has asked for trust yet has done nothing but hide facts and information from the staff to create a level of distrust and anxiety never seen before. There exists no employee handbook or procedural handbook to help codify the systems of all three offices. A huge discrepancy on how various members in the company are treated and respect for outstanding performance is nonexistent. Outstanding work is expected and not rewarded. Salary is a joke. Lol not only is outside communication lacking, its the same on the inside. And another: Cons Communication and knowledge sharing is a disaster, there is little or no documentation for older areas of development and documentation is still considered optional by many. There are multiple braking points in communication, especially on the vertical (between upper management and the work floor). There is a blatant lack of vision and direction for the project I work on and the people leading it are allowed to remain in their position on a basis of friendship rather than competence. Structure and process are anathema to many employees, including management. There is an irrational fear of becoming "too corporate" or losing the "company culture" (which pretty much equals to partying) and so management refuses to implement or even consider sorely needed order in the organizational chaos. 3drealms anyone?
Vandrion Gallente The Collective B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:12:00 - [1165] Edited by: Vandrion on 23/06/2011 12:12:20 If true (and I believe it probably is) then this is what just happened: CCP has completed the coat hanger abortion of Eve...................
Jonas Glim	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:15:00 - [1166] Quote: "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization, some will simply be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright." "One other service we're looking at is selling faction standings. We want to offer convenience" ^^ This is why I've cancelled my subs untill someone from CCP says this document is fake. I've only played for 2 years or so, but in all that time I've never felt at a disadvantage next to the vets, never bought into the whole "you can't compete with the high SP characters" rubbish, and always believed in the strength of the sandbox and that it would allow me to carve out my own little bit of Empire. Not if this happens. MT for anything other than vanity items fundamentally changes the game I signed up for 2+ years, and it's not one I want to play. Having read the document I have one question for the normally likeable CCP Soundwave: Just because you've "been using virtual goods sales for a long time now and actually prefer them over subscriptions" what makes you think we do too, and are willing to change to that business model?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:16:00 - [1167] Originally by: Vandrion Edited by: Vandrion on 23/06/2011 12:12:20 If true (and I believe it probably is) then this is what just happened: CCP has completed the coat hanger abortion of Eve................... coat hanger abortion is best abortion His name was John Turbefield!
Aruken Marr Gallente Noctiscion Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:17:00 - [1168] The hell is this ****?
Maul555 Amarr Reliables Inc BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:18:00 - [1169] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. +2 The EVE Personality Test
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:19:00 - [1170] this thread is getting close to the amount of views a 2 year old sticky has in a day !!!!!!!!!!
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:20:00 - [1171] Edited by: Tehlana Riolis on 23/06/2011 12:19:55 Originally by: Jonas Glim the normally likeable CCP Soundwave Not a recent opinion , comes from something I learned across the years. Those who come across as extremely likeable are fake , even mroe so when he is a figurehead for a corporation. Do not trust one thing they say , in fact believe the opposite. They will lie and bend the truth at will. Latest example is this PDF , before that at the end of AT9 he started boasting about the new PCU for the feed of 28k and not a word about the abysmal 47k online ingame. :)) You are all proudly 'wittily' replying to those scammed that this is EVE , when this is actually RL. Why are you forgetting that?
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:20:00 - [1172] Originally by: Patient 2428190 LOTRO reviving itself from the dead and Blizzard making an ungodly amount off their MT transactions, the writing was on the wall. Its only going to get worse. In the case of DDO and LOTRO, Turbine turned around a failed game, and a game that had failed to live up to expectations. And their model allows two choices: Free+RMT or subscription and get everything. Their model is by far the most fair and player friendly of all the "Free To Pay" (that is the truthful term for free to play) schemes. In the case of EVE, CCP is CREATING failure, this game has grown almost continually since launch, which no other game has done. I think we can safely say that those days are over from this point forward. You dont' introduce RMT in this manner as a way of saving a game, you introduce it out of arrogance, hubris, and pure greed. The most dangerous omen to come from all this is clearly CCP no longer has any understanding whatsoever of what their game is, why it has been successful, and what will keep their customers coming back. I would like to thank the employee who leaked this document. Clearly the reason it was made to begin with is that there must be some heated internal disagreement within the staff on this ripoff scheme. As I said earlier in this thread, it reads more like a sales brochure aimed at selling THEIR OWN PEOPLE on how awesome monetizing every aspect of EVE will be.
SNeAkYbRiT Gunslingers Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:20:00 - [1173] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. LMAO best post ever!
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:21:00 - [1174] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: Verone Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:55:06 Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 23/06/2011 11:54:36 Originally by: Verone That's what I don't understand. Why the hell do I want one, and what is the incentive to buy one regardless of price when it has absolutely NO impact on my game play at all? See, thats where i'm disappointed, you are a nice guy and all, but man, try to focus on EVE as a whole and not just your little world. This argument is like "what do i care if the world around me burns down, as long as my nice little house is fine". If you can't see where CCP's vision is leading and why this is bad for EVE in the long run, i don't know what is? Do they have to ban your accounts for you to care? And sry if i single you out, you are just one of many with this attitude. When you've been playing Eve for as long as I have, you come to expect things. One of those things is that not every part of Eve will be tailored to your enjoyment or gameplay needs. I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Ok, but why mock them then for their worries? They are as legitimate as yours when you reach your "limit". I'm not mocking them at all, I'm simply of the opinion that people are reacting too drastically, to soon. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:22:00 - [1175] Originally by: Verone I'm not mocking them at all, I'm simply of the opinion that people are reacting too drastically, to soon. When would you have us react? When it's too late?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:22:00 - [1176] If CCP want to kill eve. Let's help them by wardeccing new corps and ganking new players endlessly on our way out. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535334 20 Billion isk will be spent from me on these activities.
Prince Kobol	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:22:00 - [1177] To those that have talked about Turbines approach to the MT Store in Lotro in greatly differs in so far as you do not have to spend 1 penny to gain TP. You can gain TP in game by playing the game... i.e completing deeds, epic quests etc etc. Also VIP member receive 500 points points per month so at the moment since I haven't played for nearly 6 months I have 3000+ TP points to spend should I choose to. The reason Turbine/Warner Brothers went down the Road of F2P and in game Store is simply because Lotro was a dying game. It had no major update close to 18 months, next to no end game content and more people leaving then joining. As much as I hate to say to the move to F2P has been a huge financial success and the game is doing better then ever. I criticised the way Turbine went about it and to some of the items they have put in the store but the prices are very reasonable and the fact that you can earn TP points whilst playing the game also helps.
Cutter Isaacson Minmatar Fearsome Engine	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:22:00 - [1178] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. I am going to assume that you are somewhat enraged dear boy?
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:23:00 - [1179] Originally by: Verone I'm not mocking them at all, I'm simply of the opinion that people are reacting too drastically, to soon. If people didn`t react drastically immediately you now would be able to buy Isukone Scorpions out of thin air! Just one example ...unfortunately.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:23:00 - [1180] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. +3
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:23:00 - [1181] Originally by: Verone I'm not mocking them at all, I'm simply of the opinion that people are reacting too drastically, to soon. Too soon? Mate.... You've been around long enough to know the history. His name was John Turbefield!
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:25:00 - [1182] Originally by: Miilla If CCP want to kill eve. Let's help them by wardeccing new corps and ganking new players endlessly on our way out. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535334 20 Billion isk will be spent from me on these activities. might as well do something un till the sub or isk runs out lol
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:25:00 - [1183] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. +4 billion
Snake Scofield	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:26:00 - [1184] Just turn off the servers for a week CCP and go take a holiday for the good work on Incarna. I'll still be here.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:27:00 - [1185] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. They are probably currently debating and coming up with a idea to get them out of this. You can`t come up with compelling bull to convince us and fix this in a blink.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:27:00 - [1186] Looks like they've woken up... The thread is starting to lose post count. Post faster, *****es!
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:28:00 - [1187] Originally by: Republica Winder Looks like they've woken up... The thread is starting to lose post count. Post faster, *****es! lol
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:28:00 - [1188] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 12:28:51 Originally by: Tehlana Riolis Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. They are probably currently debating and coming up with a idea to get them out of this. You can`t come up with compelling bull to convince us and fix this in a blink. They will post on Friday, then we get to emorage more all over the weekend, they come back monday hungover and we are easier to deal with as we have raged the hot air out of ourselves over the weekend. IF we all use H2 TAGS IN OUR POSTS; the moderators will have to reformat each post by post to remove the markup tags
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:29:00 - [1189] their silence says more than their words ever could...
Sandviched	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:29:00 - [1190] This thread
SHAG ALOT Arthie	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:31:00 - [1191] Hi guys welcome to WoW!
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:32:00 - [1192] Originally by: Republica Winder ned around a failed game, and a game that had failed to live up to expectations. And their model allows two choices: Free+RMT or subscription and get everything. Their model is by far the most fair and player friendly of all the "Free To Pay" (that is the truthful term for free to play) schemes. In the case of EVE, CCP is CREATING failure, this game has grown almost continually since launch, which no other game has done. I think we can safely say that those days are over from this point forward. You dont' introduce RMT in this manner as a way of saving a game, you introduce it out of arrogance, hubris, and pure greed. The most dangerous omen to come from all this is clearly CCP no longer has any understanding whatsoever of what their game is, why it has been successful, and what will keep their customers coming back. CCP has weathered worse storms. :18months:, T20/Kugu, Moongate Their metrics support this change and worse yet, they are convinced its only the way they can be cutting edge/innovative/fearless is by using microtransactions. Its going to be a cornerstone of EVE, of Dust514 and Twilight Online. To them, micro-transactions is CCP's god given revenue stream they need to exploit. I used to get really upset about it, but its not going to change. Acceptance time. Quote: I would like to thank the employee who leaked this document. Clearly the reason it was made to begin with is that there must be some heated internal disagreement within the staff on this ripoff scheme. As I said earlier in this thread, it reads more like a sales brochure aimed at selling THEIR OWN PEOPLE on how awesome monetizing every aspect of EVE will be. He/She is going to getting fired, sued and pretty much going to get ejected out of the game development business. ****ty for an act that changes nothing in CCP's gameplan. ...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:32:00 - [1193] Originally by: SHAG ALOT Arthie Hi guys welcome to WoW! More like ENTROPIA.
i hatechosingnames Gallente Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:32:00 - [1194] Edited by: i hatechosingnames on 23/06/2011 12:32:50 CCP is too full of yes men... not enough of them have the balls to stand up and say no - this is a bad idea... when the majority are only thinking with their wallets and not what is best for the game this **** happens.
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:33:00 - [1195] test
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:34:00 - [1196] Originally by: i hatechosingnames Edited by: i hatechosingnames on 23/06/2011 12:32:50 CCP is too full of yes men... not enough of them have the balls to stand up and say no - this is a bad idea... when the majority are only thinking with their wallets and not what is best for the game this **** happens. So when you are at work, you don't think about holding onto your months pay?
Bluespot85	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:35:00 - [1197] Two 8 year subs cancelled since theres no blue response. Honestly thought CCP was a better company than sony. Would be a good idea to include more reasons for quitting in your cancellation process. Something along the lines of "were a bunch of greedy ****ing scumbags" covers alot. Thanks to the people who leaked the pdf doc. Cya in the next sandbox. Farewell
Kalissa Sacred Templars RED.OverLord	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:35:00 - [1198] Well I've asked around and the general word on the grapevine that this document is legit, it reads pretty legitimate too, seems CCP just see us as wallets to plunder. Pay cash for weapons??? I'll do that, when hell freezes over. Bet the hunt is on in CCP for whoever leaked this baby!
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:36:00 - [1199] Edited by: Atreus Venom on 23/06/2011 12:36:40 Edited by: Atreus Venom on 23/06/2011 12:36:10 im tired of them i have a lvl 85 paladin on WOW that needs better gear... i think nows as good a time as any
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:36:00 - [1200] Originally by: Atreus Venom their silence says more than their words ever could... They're stuck in the headlights. His name was John Turbefield!
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:38:00 - [1201] Edited by: leth ghost on 23/06/2011 12:38:30 Originally by: Kalissa Well I've asked around and the general word on the grapevine that this document is legit, it reads pretty legitimate too, seems CCP just see us as wallets to plunder. Pay cash for weapons??? I'll do that, when hell freezes over. Bet the hunt is on in CCP for whoever leaked this baby! yeah i bet they are mad at ccp for who ever let this out , but thank god they did
G0rdon Gekko	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:39:00 - [1202] Edited by: G0rdon Gekko on 23/06/2011 12:40:38 Just thought I'd swing by and say that I have no idea why you guys are getting so angry about all this. Personally I think it's good to see that CCP are engaging their staff with publications like this and encouraging them to explore innovation. The two articles were clearly polarised and deliberately provocative to provoke debate. Those of you who are taking them literally really need to loosen up your neckties.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:40:00 - [1203] It doesn't matter that it was leaked out or not. If we seen it comming or it arrived, it would have the same effect. Sinking ship. If anything this is a good thing for CCP that it got leaked, they can now guage the reaction. And get the message before it goes live and then see their money wasted down the toilet.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:41:00 - [1204] Edited by: Jade Constantine on 23/06/2011 12:47:10 Originally by: Verone I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Join the Revolution!
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:41:00 - [1205] Originally by: G0rdon Gekko Just thought I'd swing by and say that I have no idea why you guys are getting so angry about all this. Heh that made me grin. Back to topic - BURN HIM!
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:43:00 - [1206] Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 23/06/2011 12:46:12 The average CCP employee has moved to a small, rocky island to work for below-average wages. What does he think about these changes and why does CCP have to convince him with this bulletin? some selected metrics from the employee satisfaction survey: topic: 2009, 2010, 2011 (perfect score is 5) Employee Satisfaction: 4.2, 4.2, 4.1 Employee Loyalty: 4.7, 4.5, 4.4 Morale and Cooperation: 4.1, 4.1, 3.9 Management - CEO: 4.6, 4.4, 4.4 Management - Executive Board: 4.0, 3.7, 3.7 Company Vision and Business Goals: 4.1, 4.1, 3.9 question: 2010, 2011 "Professional development is well organized within CCP.": 3.1, 2.9 "I feel that my pay is in line with the position that I occupy.": 3.2, 3.1 "Communication with other offices is good.": 3.3, 3.1 "CCP's salary policy is fair.": 3.3, 3.2 I call bull**** on everyone claiming that CCP's employees in general are "out of touch" - they see very clearly what's going on and could be our best allies. If you don't care what game you are working on you would be stupid to hire with CCP. The problem is that it is very easy for management to say "we just cannot pay you a competitive wage unless we increase revenue with MTs".
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:43:00 - [1207] Originally by: Miilla If anything this is a good thing for CCP that it got leaked, they can now guage the reaction. This. Sometimes things are just a bad idea but people cant see it. I hope our voices and the voice of John is heard and CCP can get back on track leaving this nonsense out of the game.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:44:00 - [1208] So guys.... How much liquid do you think CCP have in them? ;-) How many weeks of negative cashflow before they just close the door and kick everyone out? His name was John Turbefield!
DeBingJos Minmatar Jukebox Warriors	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:44:00 - [1209] Originally by: Jade Constantine Originally by: Verone I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. ^^ Best post in this topic.
Redblade Reikoku Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:45:00 - [1210] Originally by: Miilla If CCP want to kill eve. Let's help them by wardeccing new corps and ganking new players endlessly on our way out. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535334 20 Billion isk will be spent from me on these activities. Does that mean you will finally stop posting your nonsense here then?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:46:00 - [1211] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 12:46:41 The most damaging thing that could probably happen is people stop paying and THE PLEX PRICES RISE. Those with stockpiles could RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money. Wouldnt that hurt?
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:47:00 - [1212] Originally by: Miilla The most damaging thing you can do probably is stop paying and SCREW THE PLEX PRICES. Those with stockpiles should RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money. Make em hurt. The fact you're trying to sell 50 has of course got nothing to do with this initiative right?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:49:00 - [1213] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 12:49:07 Originally by: Othran Originally by: Miilla The most damaging thing that could probably happen is people stop paying and THE PLEX PRICES RISE. Those with stockpiles could RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money. Wouldnt that hurt? The fact you're trying to sell 50 has of course got nothing to do with this initiative right? There are lots of people with much more than that in aggregate Imagine if that did happen, that would be PAIN CCP would have to step in and control the prices. That would force their hand.
Caldari Meatbag	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:50:00 - [1214] Originally by: Jade Constantine :words: where is the +rep butan?
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:51:00 - [1215] Originally by: Jade Constantine ...lots of things... I tend to agree on all counts (a scary notion for the pair of us, I know). The fact of the matter is that it's been just over a day since release of Incarna. I'll wait to see what gets fixed, rolled out, polished and repaired in the coming patches before I resort to throwing my toys around. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:52:00 - [1216] Originally by: Miilla CCP would have to step in and control the prices. That would force their hand. They always have controled the price. Last xmas I bought myself a GTC for some unknown reason. Shattered-crystal told me they were out and had to wait for next month when CCP gives them more stock of codes. His name was John Turbefield!
Keitaro Baka Babylon Scientific and Industrial Enterprises Babylon Project	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:52:00 - [1217] Originally by: Verone I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Sadly, unless you do not enjoy eve, this affects everything in eve. Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. +1 Sure it's another 'eve is dieing' thread, but this is one of maybe 3 times I'm actually contemplating just giving up on the game. Ignore me Drone Guide EON 21 & 22
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:54:00 - [1218] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 12:56:14 Originally by: Verone Originally by: Jade Constantine ...lots of things... I tend to agree on all counts (a scary notion for the pair of us, I know). lol same... wtg Jade! I take back any time I've trolled SF :-) edit: immolation... always learn a new word with Jade around. His name was John Turbefield!
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:54:00 - [1219] Originally by: General Windypops What utter nonsense. You honestly didn't expect game developers to be looking at options like this? Every single MMO developer is having exactly the same conversations that CCP are. And some of them are changing already - look at what happened with LOTRO's F2P. CCP always prided themselves for being DIFFERENT. This is why we support them. Going "exactly like" is going to remove the DIFFERENT. Like Apple caved in and switched into some worst China made, stock UI and cheapest components around. It'd be their undoing. Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Is Chribba going to keep playing after they screwed him so bad? Well, he's a very nice guy, he'd certainly figure out a solution with me. Furthermore, Grendell is also certified to accept donations of PLEXes and ISK on my behalf. If you are totally desperate you can just send stuff to my listed VAERT charity corp. I demonstrated I reliably kept 91B on behalf of donors, therefore as long as you don't surpass such amount you'd feel safe. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Meester Pink	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:56:00 - [1220] Wow. Charging more described as being "fearless." That's some serious spin there. Appalling.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:57:00 - [1221] Originally by: G0rdon Gekko Edited by: G0rdon Gekko on 23/06/2011 12:40:38 Just thought I'd swing by and say that I have no idea why you guys are getting so angry about all this. Personally I think it's good to see that CCP are engaging their staff with publications like this and encouraging them to explore innovation. The two articles were clearly polarised and deliberately provocative to provoke debate. Those of you who are taking them literally really need to loosen up your neckties. 8/10 HEY CCP! Valued members of your community are expressing their displeasure. Former CSMs have vowed to unsub if this document is true. People who contribute so much to your player-driven marketing, like: Helicity Boson (organizer of Hulkageddon) Liang Nuren (the best damn forum *** I've ever seen) Malcanis (creator of the infamous Malcanis' Law) and many others are fed up with your bull**. The least this great playerbase - which has taken you so much further than you ever thought you could go - deserves is a response.
Morwennon	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:58:00 - [1222] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really don't have much of a clue in business Holy crap, a good post by Jade.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:58:00 - [1223] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha If you are totally desperate you can just send stuff to my listed VAERT charity corp. Why do CCPs tax write-offs for them? Let them sort out their own tax ****. His name was John Turbefield!
Pistonbroke D00M. Northern Coalition.	Posted - 2011.06.23 12:59:00 - [1224] 100% agree with Jade. greedy slippery slope here. make it go away.
Ric Darn	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:00:00 - [1225] Originally by: Jade Constantine ...true words... This!
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:00:00 - [1226] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha If you are totally desperate you can just send stuff to my listed VAERT charity corp. Why do CCPs tax write-offs for them? Let them sort out their own tax ****. old troll is old CCP stated they don't use the charities for tax benefits as they don't donate in the name of CCP but in the name of the EVE players.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:01:00 - [1227] Originally by: Miilla There are lots of people with much more than that in aggregate This is a large part of whats driving the changes IMHO. People always say "someone has paid for your PLEX, so CCP get paid". This is quite true but he might have paid for it a year ago - at worst it is a one month service liability for CCP and they have no idea when that might be used. Making it an in-game item last year probably means it ceased to be a liability on the books in accounting terms but its still a potential liability regarding a future unspecified obligation to provide the service. It makes financial planning a bloody nightmare as you have no idea whether someone will use it for a sub or not in any given month. So first CCP make it destroyable (making it properly in-game) so there's the possibility of never having to provide anything for the RL cost of the PLEX. Now we have vanity items - there's another "doesn't cost CCP anything" option. Then if that hasn't solved it then go nuclear by selling ships. faction ammo, standings etc. The very best thing you could do if you wish to **** off CCP is to keep all your PLEX and then use them to pay for subs in an organised manner such that it deprived CCP of income over a period of months. Not something I'd bother with myself but its an option.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:01:00 - [1228] Originally by: Meester Pink Wow. Charging more described as being "fearless." That's some serious spin there. Appalling. It does take bravery to not fear being unemployed in the worst world wide economy and job market in 80 years. But it is a bravado that is several miles across the border of stupidity. CCP has (or had) a good thing going in EVE, something that would have retained customer loyalty and continued to make them money for many more years. They just dumped all that in the toilet for a quick shameless cash grab. Surely they can't be that dumb? Could CCP have seriously overstretched their resources in trying to do DUST and World of Twilight at the same time? As in spent themselves into debt, and only overly monetizing EVE will allow them to survive? If they were that stupid, let them fail. I sure as hell aren't paying them to develop games I have no interest in playing whatsoever. And I resent my money that has gone into EVE not going BACK into EVE.
Niraia Zaratha Zarati Aggravated Assault..	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:01:00 - [1229] Originally by: Verone Originally by: Jade Constantine ...lots of things... I tend to agree on all counts (a scary notion for the pair of us, I know). The fact of the matter is that it's been just over a day since release of Incarna. I'll wait to see what gets fixed, rolled out, polished and repaired in the coming patches before I resort to throwing my toys around. Isn't the issue here the attitude and opinion of some senior CCP employees, rather than the patch itself? Looking for a job?
Adrie Atticus Tactical Vendor of Services and Goods Partners of Industrial Service and Salvage	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:02:00 - [1230] Edited by: Adrie Atticus on 23/06/2011 13:02:01 May I remind you all that nordic dwellers have this thing called "Midsummer Festival" which kinda started today and will span until monday? There's a chance that CCP offices in europe have already been turned into a huge bonfire and they just "misplaced" their computers onto that heap of burning fail.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:04:00 - [1231] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha If you are totally desperate you can just send stuff to my listed VAERT charity corp. Why do CCPs tax write-offs for them? Let them sort out their own tax **. old troll is old CCP stated they don't use the charities for tax benefits as they don't donate in the name of CCP but in the name of the EVE players. Really? wow that's just dumb, throwing away free money! Bet that's just more of the same bull** from CCP. His name was John Turbefield!
EVIL SYNNs Wrath of Fenris Narwhals Ate My Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:04:00 - [1232] Long, LONG time player, first time complainer. First they said CQ would be a solo experience ... AND I SAID NOTHING Then they said MT would be for vanity items only ... AND I SAID NOTHING Then they make it hard for me to run my 4 accounts ... AND I SAID NOTHING Now they are talking about MT for stuff in game, that effects me ... AND I CAN NO LONGER SAY NOTHING.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:05:00 - [1233] Originally by: Verone I tend to agree on all counts (a scary notion for the pair of us, I know). The fact of the matter is that it's been just over a day since release of Incarna. I'll wait to see what gets fixed, rolled out, polished and repaired in the coming patches before I resort to throwing my toys around. The newsletter was more of a shock to my system than the CQ/noble store fiasco has been in truth. And that was out there in ccp land for a while (allegedly) I desperately hoped it was faked but it is looking increasinly likely it was not and it sells a brand of clueless that I find frankly staggering. How somebody can rise to such a senior position in an online game without possessing any apparent understanding of the community the game was based on boggles my mind. HereÆs the reality Verone û CCP stand to lose more revenue in lost multi-account users via the mandatory/ un-optimized CQ than they gain from forcing people to view the 3d environment vanity display case. If there was a quick fix in the works shouldn't we have heard about it ? Or does the fact that this issue was raised often and loudly during SISI testing but entirely ignored tell you that this aspect is not going to be fixed. We need to raise a storm to get CCP to backtrack on the removal of the mandatory CQ view and get a disembark from hanger view option to restore the eve client to former multi client/medium performance rig capabiliy. This is not a argument for mutely saying "lets wait and see." The irony is its for their good AND ours. Forcibly dumping (showing the door) to large sections of multi client using player base is commercial nonsense. And on the Noble Store. If they had set the Aurum store at a sensible level they would have made considerably more money from day one. I myself had prepped a billion isk worth of plexes to buy my character clothes and chances are would have spent the money happily were it possible to buy a whole outfit for that price. But the outrageous greed ôthe gorden gecko effectö meant that I took one look at the monocle and skirts and said screw that û let it rot. And IÆm pretty damned sure IÆm not the only one feeling this way. This is indicative of bad business decision-making on the part of developers who have now shown they have no real idea what they are doing. Unless we as a community make a noise and protest this then these bad decision-makers will drag the Eve we know and love to an early grave and it will be a great shame and tragedy for us all. That leaked internal newsletter gives us insight into the rot that has taken hold in the minds here. Question to us is whether we sit down and take it or get up and do something about it. I'm not a player to talk idly about quitting this game and truthfully I don't intend to - but I'm damned if I'm going to sit down and let my hobby go quietly into the night because some marketing numpty got his back of a beermat sums wrong to such disastrous impact. Join the Revolution!
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:07:00 - [1234] Hmmm. As been suggested to me now. The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Viewing the document in the light off an inhouse, start a debate source. Yeah, quite plausible and shouldnt be used to judge ccp. But rather 'hey, how do you all feel about this. were should we be going with mt' What do they actually say in the document? No they are arguing different points of views; They are saying precious little if you dont take qoutes out of context.
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:08:00 - [1235] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. +1 Well said.
Jason1138	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:11:00 - [1236] CCP employees have posted on several other threads this morning. the fact that they haven't posted on this one saying this document is fake should confirm its totally real for those of you still in doubt
G0rdon Gekko	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:11:00 - [1237] Originally by: Tammarr Hmmm. As been suggested to me now. The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Viewing the document in the light off an inhouse, start a debate source. Yeah, quite plausible and shouldnt be used to judge ccp. But rather 'hey, how do you all feel about this. were should we be going with mt' What do they actually say in the document? No they are arguing different points of views; They are saying precious little if you dont take qoutes out of context. Precisely. I wasn't joking when I said that. I think some people are just too dumb and overexcited to notice that.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:12:00 - [1238] Originally by: Tammarr Hmmm. As been suggested to me now. The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Viewing the document in the light off an inhouse, start a debate source. Yeah, quite plausible and shouldnt be used to judge ccp. But rather 'hey, how do you all feel about this. were should we be going with mt' What do they actually say in the document? No they are arguing different points of views; They are saying precious little if you dont take qoutes out of context. CCP alts should at least remember to log into their damn game and create an avatar before posting. Know how I know you haven't been into the game recently?? Second look at the opinion of one of the lead game designers carries more weight than a junior junior associate. Who do you think plays directly with management and has the most influence?
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:13:00 - [1239] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs Long, LONG time player, first time complainer. First they said CQ would be a solo experience ... AND I SAID NOTHING Then they said MT would be for vanity items only ... AND I SAID NOTHING Then they make it hard for me to run my 4 accounts ... AND I SAID NOTHING Now they are talking about MT for stuff in game, that effects me ... AND I CAN NO LONGER SAY NOTHING. Cheers, Synns. Flying with you and DUCK this past month has been the most fun I've had in the 1.2 years or so I've been playing this game. That cap gank was awesome, huh? Shame about this mess, here. All we'll have in the end is memories.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:13:00 - [1240] Originally by: G0rdon Gekko Precisely. I wasn't joking when I said that. I think some people are just too dumb and overexcited to notice that. You might care to note that one of the viewpoints (pro MT) was the lead game designer for Eve. The other wasn't. Also post with your main if you're going to do damage control for your company.
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:14:00 - [1241] I for one am enjoying my monocle and look forward to a matching tophat of +5 awesomeness.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:15:00 - [1242] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra I for one am enjoying my monocle and look forward to a matching tophat of +5 awesomeness. you clearly aren't a normal human then.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:16:00 - [1243] Originally by: G0rdon Gekko Originally by: Tammarr Hmmm. As been suggested to me now. The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Viewing the document in the light off an inhouse, start a debate source. Yeah, quite plausible and shouldnt be used to judge ccp. But rather 'hey, how do you all feel about this. were should we be going with mt' What do they actually say in the document? No they are arguing different points of views; They are saying precious little if you dont take qoutes out of context. Precisely. I wasn't joking when I said that. I think some people are just too dumb and overexcited to notice that. Says the man named "Gordon Gekko" commenting on a leaked PDF titled "Greed is Good"
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:17:00 - [1244] Originally by: Othran Originally by: G0rdon Gekko Precisely. I wasn't joking when I said that. I think some people are just too dumb and overexcited to notice that. You might care to note that one of the viewpoints (pro MT) was the lead game designer for Eve. The other wasn't. Also post with your main if you're going to do damage control for your company. I don't get what the hell your point has to do with it. I am the Online Marketing Director for a very large UK company and at one of my last direct report away days I led a discussion on why we should immediately take down our websites. The purpose was for us to help understand exactly what role our web presence played, and what our priorities were. It's actually fairly good management practice to encourage your staff to explore radical, sometimes shocking options to encourage them to think more creatively. Lots of people misquoting and partially quoting what was in essence a very artificial agent provocateur style article. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:18:00 - [1245] If only we could fit monocles and tophats to our super caps.
Enuen Ravenseye Malevolence. Imperial 0rder	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:19:00 - [1246] Originally by: Republica Winder Several miles across the border of stupidity! It's the new CCP motto!
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:19:00 - [1247] Originally by: Caladan Broood Originally by: Tammarr garbage CCP alts should at least remember to log into their damn game and create an avatar before posting. LOL! His name was John Turbefield!
Sloshyblooms	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:20:00 - [1248] Edited by: Sloshyblooms on 23/06/2011 13:20:20 CCP: I decided to cancel my accounts a few days ago. It's looking like a better decision every day. I didn't cancel my subscriptions because you're game sucks or because I got bored of it. I canceled because of the direction you are taking it. Over the last few weeks (fan site licenses, adding walking in stations while neglecting the actual game, micro transactions, new forums disaster, this newsletter, etc.) it's become clear to me that CCP no longer values or understands the experience that makes EVE great. I don't know whether you are out of touch or have actually become that greedy, but I have had enough. Your business plan needs to be looked at. P.S. $60 for a monocle made of pixels on the internet? WTF are you smoking.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:20:00 - [1249] Originally by: General Windypops Lots of people misquoting and partially quoting what was in essence a very artificial agent provocateur style article. Irony overload. GTFO muppet.
Liza la'fabre Gallente Keep It Simple Stupid	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:20:00 - [1250] 1.4Bil isk for a god-damn monocle!? really is the economy that bad in iceland after the Landsbanki debacle.
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:24:00 - [1251] No one is forcing you to get a monocle, if you are rich then get one and if you are a poor scrub who shouldnt be wearing a monocle then dont because you cant and are poor.
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:25:00 - [1252] Originally by: Caladan Broood Originally by: Tammarr Hmmm. As been suggested to me now. The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Viewing the document in the light off an inhouse, start a debate source. Yeah, quite plausible and shouldnt be used to judge ccp. But rather 'hey, how do you all feel about this. were should we be going with mt' What do they actually say in the document? No they are arguing different points of views; They are saying precious little if you dont take qoutes out of context. CCP alts should at least remember to log into their damn game and create an avatar before posting. Know how I know you haven't been into the game recently?? Second look at the opinion of one of the lead game designers carries more weight than a junior junior associate. Who do you think plays directly with management and has the most influence? This is an alt, I dont play with this alt much, but its my forum posting alt =) If you read my other posts, you'll find alot of criticism about cq and some moves by ccp. I nerdraged alittle about this document and the supposed findings, I read it quickly first time. I then reevaluate my stance seeing certain people getting banned and promises of 'youll soon know why this was bad' as well as other forums posts, suggesting this is fake to harm ccp out of nerdrage. Then I read it once more when told by the most logical man I know to read it as two debate articles in one. My stance changes, my pov adapts, I see a document quite plausible meant for creating inhouse debate, the document says nothing. It argues for various points in order for the intended readers(CCP employees) to form a opinion of their own. Noone calls a document gordon gekko edition if its not highly satirical. Gordon gekko being a name most will link directly to overwhelming greed: Its either faked/satir or its light heartedly meant to get you thinking with such a shocker for a name =) Read the document. Read it as a doc meant for creating debate. Don't take qoutes out of context. Any rage you feel atm will quite quickly give way as your rational mind and logic takes control and tells you the actual truth. Have some valium before reading if fellings are running high.
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:26:00 - [1253] Originally by: Caladan Broood Originally by: Tammarr Hmmm. As been suggested to me now. The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Viewing the document in the light off an inhouse, start a debate source. Yeah, quite plausible and shouldnt be used to judge ccp. But rather 'hey, how do you all feel about this. were should we be going with mt' What do they actually say in the document? No they are arguing different points of views; They are saying precious little if you dont take qoutes out of context. CCP alts should at least remember to log into their damn game and create an avatar before posting. Know how I know you haven't been into the game recently?? Second look at the opinion of one of the lead game designers carries more weight than a junior junior associate. Who do you think plays directly with management and has the most influence? ccp alt it is.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:26:00 - [1254] Originally by: Verone Originally by: Jade Constantine ...lots of things... I tend to agree on all counts (a scary notion for the pair of us, I know). The fact of the matter is that it's been just over a day since release of Incarna. I'll wait to see what gets fixed, rolled out, polished and repaired in the coming patches before I resort to throwing my toys around. I do understand, but JC never jadeposted something as good as this. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:26:00 - [1255] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra No one is forcing you to get a monocle, if you are rich then get one and if you are a poor scrub who shouldnt be wearing a monocle then dont because you cant and are poor. it will be people like you that stay and get milked for your $$ as ccp carry out there plans for the future
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:27:00 - [1256] At first I jokingly thought: "Cool, I'll give CCP some Aurum and get my unprobable Tengu back!" :) Then I realized that, if this came really true, I wouldn't be the only one: people would buy ships, ammo, faction standing, all out of thin air, all over Empire. Blueprint production? Screw that! We got Aurum! Never mind that it ruins the EVE economy! We are The Greedy Bunch at CCP! Wee! Chaos would ensue: massive lulz suicide ganks, for example. Faction standing loss? Who cares? Aurum to the rescue! Russian bot alliances will get even more supercaps -- courtesy of Aurum! It would literally break the game almost overnight. People my age don't ragequit. I got 2 years invested in this game, and the thought of quitting never ever occured to me. Today, for the first time, I'm seriously contemplating it, though. Buying in-game advantages simply cannot be. Period. --
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:27:00 - [1257] Edited by: Rex Liberium on 23/06/2011 13:27:43 Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Othran Originally by: G0rdon Gekko Precisely. I wasn't joking when I said that. I think some people are just too dumb and overexcited to notice that. You might care to note that one of the viewpoints (pro MT) was the lead game designer for Eve. The other wasn't. Also post with your main if you're going to do damage control for your company. I don't get what the hell your point has to do with it. I am the Online Marketing Director for a very large UK company and at one of my last direct report away days I led a discussion on why we should immediately take down our websites. The purpose was for us to help understand exactly what role our web presence played, and what our priorities were. It's actually fairly good management practice to encourage your staff to explore radical, sometimes shocking options to encourage them to think more creatively. Lots of people misquoting and partially quoting what was in essence a very artificial agent provocateur style article. Your priorities as a company?? Make money by selling stuff. Sub-priorities (that's where you come in): Make people think they actually need your product to be happy. Maybe I should go into marketing....
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:27:00 - [1258] Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra No one is forcing you to get a monocle, if you are rich then get one and if you are a poor scrub who shouldnt be wearing a monocle then dont because you cant and are poor. it will be people like you that stay and get milked for your $$ as ccp carry out there plans for the future Sounds good. Would be nice to get rid of all the whining cheapskate bleaters. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:28:00 - [1259] Originally by: Liza la'fabre 1.4Bil isk for a god-damn monocle!? really is the economy that bad in iceland after the Landsbanki debacle. Bj÷rg=lfur Thor Bj÷rg=lfsson = Landsbanki = Novator Partners = CCPGames Picture getting clearer? His name was John Turbefield!
Celd Drakkar	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:28:00 - [1260] This is yet again another instance of Game Company X thinking they know more about gaming than the majority of the gaming populace. To top it off it is happening in a game which is far more intellectual than probably any other MMO on the market today (ie. people here aren't dumb sheep for the most part). I found it highly ironic that this is happening as SWG is celebrating its anniversary, and we all remember the way SOE handled the NGE debacle. I thought I would never be as disgusted with a company as I was back then. CCP needs to remember who made this game successful (it wasn't the developers). In an MMO it is the community that will cause a game to thrive or fail, and when you go in a direction completely opposite from what the community wants well... We all remember the mass exodus away from SWG, and if this is handled as badly as that was then we may see another.
Cyriel Longinus Caldari XERCORE	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:29:00 - [1261] Whether it's a fake or not is irrelevant at this point. The "hill" has become Everest. At the peak is the dead zone. [Cy + blog] This song sums up my current feelings about NeX.
backtrace Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:29:00 - [1262] The ** is that ** CCP?! -- Some men just want to watch the world burn.
dermannmitdemkoks	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:31:00 - [1263] The general complaining and the worries about the possible development of the game after every patch may sometimes become grotesque. But this time it seems to be different and legitimate. If the PDF is authentic there is a true risk for CCP to lose an unique selling proposition of their game: the chance to reach everything with ingame means and being independant from pure grinding at the same time. Soft skills have always been the key factor for success in EVE. Not the time you spent ingame and not the RL money you were spending. They really should listen to their customers community and concentrate on improving the existing game mechanics/looks/operability instead of just adding new (and buggy) stuff just to attract some new players - cause: how long will they stay? Is it worth to drive out long term customers just to reach a very temorarily peak of new customers and then die within a year? btw: thumbs up for JCs comments.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:31:00 - [1264] Originally by: Celd Drakkar To top it off it is happening in a game which is far more intellectual than probably any other MMO on the market today (ie. people here aren't dumb sheep for the most part). Looking at Rens local I would guess its about 50:50. Plenty of people saying that they'd rather pay than "grind". Unfortunately these are probably the least imaginative people in-game, so Eve will have to be dumbed-down a bit more. Time to go sell stuff.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:32:00 - [1265] Originally by: EVIL SYNNs Long, LONG time player, first time complainer. First they said CQ would be a solo experience ... AND I SAID NOTHING Then they said MT would be for vanity items only ... AND I SAID NOTHING Then they make it hard for me to run my 4 accounts ... AND I SAID NOTHING Now they are talking about MT for stuff in game, that effects me ... AND I CAN NO LONGER SAY NOTHING. succinct. Join the Revolution!
riverini Gallente Reliables Inc BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:32:00 - [1266] 43 pages and still no CCP response of this?
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:32:00 - [1267] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra No one is forcing you to get a monocle, if you are rich then get one and if you are a poor scrub who shouldnt be wearing a monocle then dont because you cant and are poor. 0/10, too obvious. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:32:00 - [1268] Originally by: riverini 43 pages and still no CCP response of this? No only trolling CCP alts.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:33:00 - [1269] Edited by: General Windypops on 23/06/2011 13:33:07 Originally by: Othran Looking at Rens local I would guess its about 50:50. Plenty of people saying that they'd rather pay than "grind". You've clearly never been to Deklein. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:33:00 - [1270] So, a couple of threadnaughts have been spawned, most of what should've been said has been said, repeated, memefied, etc. Let's quiet down a bit, let things sink in, look back at what's been said both here and pretty much all the outlets we (don't) care about. We know CCP is in dismay, most of them are or at least used to be players, so more funky stuff, like this leak, is bound to happen. Personally, the entertainment over the last few days following those first few moments after TQ went back online, are just priceless. Dominion, Tyrannis and what the hell Incursion was be damned, this little CCP breakdown is priceless. Like I said, cool down the presses a bit, let them have their say. It's going to be worth it. Donations accepted: 1BpQEYT7aSUNM863BV67FPxyv1cpxr74uu
Siiee Recycled Heroes	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:34:00 - [1271] Originally by: Verone I'll wait to see what gets fixed, rolled out, polished and repaired in the coming patches before I resort to throwing my toys around. The problem with that as I see it is these sort of problems are not technical mishaps or silly programming blunders. Breaking gatejumps in a new patch is both lol worthy and rage inducing, but it's also something that a reasonable person could understand to be entirely unintentional. Give them some time to work it out sure. But the problems that we've been seeing recently aren't of that type, they're changes in business strategy, or the result of CCP asking for and then actively ignoring user input. I agree with you about MTs, I'm not interested myself, even if they were only a dollar each. But the whole "vanity items only" thing was never a part of CCPs original song and dance. That only came about after a large to-do about MTs in the first place, and I fully expect that if they had been left to their own devices that we would now be seeing the same type of MT store that we have now, but with all types of other non-vanity "convenience" itmes in it. CCP desperately wants all kinds of MT, and it's only pressure back from the community that keeps them from slowly invading every single aspect of gameplay. If the community stops pushing and just waits to see then you can expect to see them creeping back over the "vanity only" line as soon as they think they can get away with it, and they will be at the same insane prices we see now because that's what they feel is appropriate. It's a similar thing with CQ, of course it will get patched and tweaked, and in the next year we most likely will see the other 3 racial CQs. But what we have now was deemed a strong enough user experience for a release. From a technical standpoint it's not terrible, there are some minor issues that are to be expected with such a new release. If we sit back and just watch and see they can look at their metrics and say "Great success! We'll do more of this." Much in the same way that they look back on Apocrypha and all of the technical debt that accumulated during that release and say it was one of the buggiest worst expansions ever, even tho for most of the player base Apocrypha has been one of the best expansions in recent history.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:34:00 - [1272] Originally by: Rex Liberium Originally by: riverini 43 pages and still no CCP response of this? No only trolling CCP alts. Funny they think a few shills can change complete and total loss of goodwill. His name was John Turbefield!
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:35:00 - [1273] Originally by: Morgan Polaris So, a couple of threadnaughts have been spawned, most of what should've been said has been said, repeated, memefied, etc. Let's quiet down a bit, let things sink in, look back at what's been said both here and pretty much all the outlets we (don't) care about. We know CCP is in dismay, most of them are or at least used to be players, so more funky stuff, like this leak, is bound to happen. Personally, the entertainment over the last few days following those first few moments after TQ went back online, are just priceless. Dominion, Tyrannis and what the hell Incursion was be damned, this little CCP breakdown is priceless. Like I said, cool down the presses a bit, let them have their say. It's going to be worth it. thats the thing they aint got the balls to say **** all lol or just dont know what to say to try and pick the pieces up. They have been people reading this thread for a while now and they havent even mumbled a word
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:36:00 - [1274] Looks pretty certain that Seleene leaked it. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Apple iPwn Superscript	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:37:00 - [1275] In on dis CCP dun goofed
Ni'ark	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:38:00 - [1276] Originally by: Morgan Polaris So, a couple of threadnaughts have been spawned, most of what should've been said has been said, repeated, memefied, etc. Let's quiet down a bit, let things sink in, look back at what's been said both here and pretty much all the outlets we (don't) care about. We know CCP is in dismay, most of them are or at least used to be players, so more funky stuff, like this leak, is bound to happen. Personally, the entertainment over the last few days following those first few moments after TQ went back online, are just priceless. Dominion, Tyrannis and what the hell Incursion was be damned, this little CCP breakdown is priceless. Like I said, cool down the presses a bit, let them have their say. It's going to be worth it. No, because if we stop now the fire will extinguish and CCP will not give us any answers. We keep posting, whining, trolling because we care about this stupid game.
Garheade Amarr Aideron Robotics	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:38:00 - [1277] Originally by: General Windypops Looks pretty certain that Seleene leaked it. Or Seleene made it up... either way I lol'd.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:40:00 - [1278] Originally by: General Windypops Looks pretty certain that Seleene leaked it. Possibly. Although frankly if it is CCP's internal jazzmag then anyone visiting an office could of picked up a copy and walked off with it. Companies tend to leave such things in the reception areas so visitors can flick through it and read how awesome the company they're visiting are.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:40:00 - [1279] Originally by: Morgan Polaris So, a couple of threadnaughts have been spawned, most of what should've been said has been said, repeated, memefied, etc. Let's quiet down a bit, let things sink in, look back at what's been said both here and pretty much all the outlets we (don't) care about. We know CCP is in dismay, most of them are or at least used to be players, so more funky stuff, like this leak, is bound to happen. Personally, the entertainment over the last few days following those first few moments after TQ went back online, are just priceless. Dominion, Tyrannis and what the hell Incursion was be damned, this little CCP breakdown is priceless. Like I said, cool down the presses a bit, let them have their say. It's going to be worth it. Yeah well if they dont speak soon they are going to miss their own funeral, so to speak. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:40:00 - [1280] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra No one is forcing you to get a monocle, if you are rich then get one and if you are a poor scrub who shouldnt be wearing a monocle then dont because you cant and are poor. it will be people like you that stay and get milked for your $$ as ccp carry out there plans for the future Sounds good. Would be nice to get rid of all the whining cheapskate bleaters. Lol this is rich, would have taken you for a troll, if I knew you were not serious. Clearly, a fair access too all of the games content for our subscriptions without paying extra RL money is begin "cheapskate". It has nothing to do about beign "cheap". Get your head out of you ass :) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:40:00 - [1281] Originally by: leth ghost thats the thing they aint got the balls to say **** all lol or just dont know what to say to try and pick the pieces up. They have been people reading this thread for a while now and they havent even mumbled a word Like I said, what would they say? The easiest thing would just be to deny it... except then they don't get to 'coincidentally' implement anything on that list any more. So, damage control, in that regard, would halt their money-grubbing plans. And if it's real, we fry 'em regardless. So, I'd say that leaves CCP up that proverbial body of water made of excriment without a means of propulsion. --
Sragir Kshatriyas	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:42:00 - [1282] Originally by: Nikki West Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. +1 Well said. +1 (1 week old PS3 going to my daughter. Because my merc in Dust514 will be basic . If a monocle cost this much, I wonder what the prices will be for advanced weapons, ammo, and equipment.)
Kronir	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:42:00 - [1283] Originally by: Tammarr Then I read it once more when told by the most logical man I know to read it as two debate articles in one. My stance changes, my pov adapts, I see a document quite plausible meant for creating inhouse debate, the document says nothing. It argues for various points in order for the intended readers(CCP employees) to form a opinion of their own. Noone calls a document gordon gekko edition if its not highly satirical. Gordon gekko being a name most will link directly to overwhelming greed: Its either faked/satir or its light heartedly meant to get you thinking with such a shocker for a name =) Read the document. Read it as a doc meant for creating debate. Don't take qoutes out of context. Any rage you feel atm will quite quickly give way as your rational mind and logic takes control and tells you the actual truth. Have some valium before reading if fellings are running high. The bottom-line is that change is in the wind. And the current iteration of Incarna along with the public comments of CCP show which way the wind is going to be blowing. The document may well be a 'debate'...but the decission has already been made. If it hadn't already been made - we wouldn't be where we are today.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:43:00 - [1284] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra No one is forcing you to get a monocle, if you are rich then get one and if you are a poor scrub who shouldnt be wearing a monocle then dont because you cant and are poor. it will be people like you that stay and get milked for your $$ as ccp carry out there plans for the future Sounds good. Would be nice to get rid of all the whining cheapskate bleaters. Lol this is rich, would have taken you for a troll, if I knew you were not serious. Clearly, a fair access too all of the games content for our subscriptions without paying extra RL money is begin "cheapskate". It has nothing to do about beign "cheap". Get your head out of you ass :) It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:43:00 - [1285] Originally by: Tammarr The document contains in essence two extremely opposing views talking about MT, pulling qoutes of out the blue always looks bad. It is quite possible the document is legit, and is an attempt to create inhouse debate over MT and try to get new ideas coming in. Intro: Vanity MT = monocles and other harmless stuff. Power MT = game outcome changing items like super ships, faction boosters, super ammo etc. Imho since mods are not locking this thread there are two possible scenarios: 1) There is a CCP internal struggle raging. The CCP "anti-power-MT" faction slipped this document so that we could help them against the otherwise unstoppable power of the very lead game designer. In this case we should support the guys like that the economist, who are pro-vanity but against power-aurum items. 2) Inside CCP there are equal pro and against factions and they let out this document to see our reaction. What we do and say here will be used at the next guidelines, corporate currents will become more powerful, others will go under. In any case, this document slipped just too well timed, it's not a coincidence. They even say they are watching. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Bendy Profane The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:45:00 - [1286] Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:46:00 - [1287] Originally by: Cipher Jones Yeah well if they dont speak soon they are going to miss their own funeral, so to speak. It's all too late. Just in the threads of people who have confirmed they have unsubscribed you can see many key hub people who believe it or not hold this whole thing together. When CCP wants to findout "Will this hurt too many people?" they head over to the database guys... "Can you design me a query to show me how many people are connecting with XX hardware?" or whatever... The answer always comes back "ahh like 1-3%". CCP started making the mistake of assuming small percentages didn't matter. 1% + 1% + 1% + 1% + 1% + 9% + 2% + 13% + 100% His name was John Turbefield!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:46:00 - [1288] So if PLEX hording is causing this, what if we simply stop our CC payments and consume PLEX as 30 days game time? I have 4 years worth of gametime. Would that stop the MT plans? NO, because the document states clearly the reason is to GENERATE MORE REVENUE for OTHER PRODUCTS. The plex hording is NOT the reason for this. READ THE DOCUMENT.
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:47:00 - [1289] Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 23/06/2011 13:46:56 Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Intro: Vanity MT = monocles and other harmless stuff. Power MT = game outcome changing items like super ships, faction boosters, super ammo etc. Imho since mods are not locking this thread there are two possible scenarios: 1) There is a CCP internal struggle raging. The CCP "anti-power-MT" faction slipped this document so that we could help them against the otherwise unstoppable power of the very lead game designer. In this case we should support the guys like that the economist, who are pro-vanity but against power-aurum items. 2) Inside CCP there are equal pro and against factions and they let out this document to see our reaction. What we do and say here will be used at the next guidelines, corporate currents will become more powerful, others will go under. In any case, this document slipped just too well timed, it's not a coincidence. They even say they are watching. In any case this framing of the problem eliminates the "No MT" option
Kronir	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:47:00 - [1290] Originally by: Kronir The bottom-line is that change is in the wind. And the current iteration of Incarna along with the public comments of CCP show which way the wind is going to be blowing. The document may well be a 'debate'...but the decission has already been made. If it hadn't already been made - we wouldn't be where we are today. And this is the way the wind is blowing... Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career?
gektor fox Ozuwara	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:47:00 - [1291] a
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:48:00 - [1292] People have accepted PLEX for ISK/AUR, they have accepted reluctently VANITY items. What they will NOT accept is game changing PAID items. There is a line that not even VALVE is crossing.
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:48:00 - [1293] Originally by: Siiee Originally by: Verone I'll wait to see what gets fixed, rolled out, polished and repaired in the coming patches before I resort to throwing my toys around. The problem with that as I see it is these sort of problems are not technical mishaps or silly programming blunders. Breaking gatejumps in a new patch is both lol worthy and rage inducing, but it's also something that a reasonable person could understand to be entirely unintentional. Give them some time to work it out sure. But the problems that we've been seeing recently aren't of that type, they're changes in business strategy, or the result of CCP asking for and then actively ignoring user input. I agree with you about MTs, I'm not interested myself, even if they were only a dollar each. But the whole "vanity items only" thing was never a part of CCPs original song and dance. That only came about after a large to-do about MTs in the first place, and I fully expect that if they had been left to their own devices that we would now be seeing the same type of MT store that we have now, but with all types of other non-vanity "convenience" itmes in it. CCP desperately wants all kinds of MT, and it's only pressure back from the community that keeps them from slowly invading every single aspect of gameplay. If the community stops pushing and just waits to see then you can expect to see them creeping back over the "vanity only" line as soon as they think they can get away with it, and they will be at the same insane prices we see now because that's what they feel is appropriate. It's a similar thing with CQ, of course it will get patched and tweaked, and in the next year we most likely will see the other 3 racial CQs. But what we have now was deemed a strong enough user experience for a release. From a technical standpoint it's not terrible, there are some minor issues that are to be expected with such a new release. If we sit back and just watch and see they can look at their metrics and say "Great success! We'll do more of this." Much in the same way that they look back on Apocrypha and all of the technical debt that accumulated during that release and say it was one of the buggiest worst expansions ever, even tho for most of the player base Apocrypha has been one of the best expansions in recent history. Spot on and well said.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:49:00 - [1294] Edited by: leth ghost on 23/06/2011 13:49:04 Originally by: Kronir Originally by: Kronir The bottom-line is that change is in the wind. And the current iteration of Incarna along with the public comments of CCP show which way the wind is going to be blowing. The document may well be a 'debate'...but the decission has already been made. If it hadn't already been made - we wouldn't be where we are today. And this is the way the wind is blowing... Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? QFT
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:51:00 - [1295] Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08)
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:51:00 - [1296] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein In any case this framing of the problem eliminates the "No MT" option In the doc there's no one arguing against MT completely, no "against" internal current that we are let to see. In line of principle I am not against MT either, if people want to waste money on a monocle why not. It's less pressure at converting PLEXes into staying ISK that pollutes the economy from inside. It's a PLEX sink, it's good. Therefore as wannabe economist myself I support the pamphlet economist in a moderate support for purely vanity items. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:52:00 - [1297] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 13:52:21 MAKE NO MISTAKE When a new player joins, they find EVE HARD. If they have a Cash door to make it easier, NEW PLAYERS WILL OPEN THAT DOOR. MAKE NO MISTAKE. It WILL change the game. If they do this, the only way to end it is to COME DOWN HARD (and I mean the entire UNIVERSE) on that PLAYER who uses CASH BONUSES. Make them PAY MORE AND MORE AND MORE, until they have NO MONEY LEFT.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:52:00 - [1298] Originally by: Ranita Drell CCP Molock: But that's still crazy -- you could buy a capital ship for that much -- or a monocle in real life. It needs to be way lower. CCP Soundwave: Let's just make it an even 12000. CCP Molock: But our players are going to think we've gone insane with greed ... only a handful of people will buy it and we won't even profit on it. CCP Soundwave: If that's the case we can just cut the prices by a third and we'll look reasonable and magnanimous. It's win/win. Locator Agent: "The scumbags can be found at CCP Headquarters, Iceland." --
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:53:00 - [1299] Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. To maximize profit CCP would have to retain old customers while gaining new ones. While it might not be shocking it is a violation of what was promised to the fanbase. I can tell by your avatar and writing style that you are much more intelligent and suave than the rest of us. So for example when your girl cheats on you you can just get a new one because you are so all that. for normal sewer dwellers like us tho it still hurts :( . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Lady Spanky Perkone	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:54:00 - [1300] Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08) I have characters in a range of the biggest 0.0 alliances, and I can honestly say that this isn't being discussed AT ALL in our comms channels. There have been a couple of chuckles at how OTT these forums are getting, and not one single person actually being bothered in the slighted. Looks like it's only a small minority who are getting so uppity. Your signature was inappropriate, email [email protected] to find out why (don't forget to include a link to it) -Sahwoolo
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:54:00 - [1301] Originally by: Ranka Mei So, I'd say that leaves CCP up that proverbial body of water made of excriment without a means of propulsion. Drag out the EVE:TV gear. Wheel in Hilmar. $60 monacle and the rest of this carp demands the CEO do this. He appologises. He promises, to the camera, this will not happen again, even if EVE has to go to one expansion a year it will not happen again. No more Dominions, Tyranis's, Incursions (which wasn't that bad, no Apoth but hey) or Incarna's. Good stuff from here on in. That is uploaded to YouTube, twitter messages & forum posts ensue. A mail is sent out giving a 5 day grace period login to all accounts so that those who quit can come back and see if it really is fixed. Dev's pull the mother of all nighters and Monday (or Tuesday) Incarna 1.0.1 is released that fixes this mess.
Redblade Reikoku Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:54:00 - [1302] Originally by: Jade Constantine Constructive post While I agree with you I'm with Verone a bit on this, at least let the patch sink in and get a few fixes, give CCP some time to perhaps shed some light on this and then make a stand if needed. Sadly the more constructive input like yours is just drowned in nonsense and over sized lettering these days.
Arya Greywolf	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:54:00 - [1303] As much as we all want to see a response by CCP to this... I have a feeling that most of us won't like it in the end anyway. At first I really was p'OD and wanted to see what CCP was going to say. After thinking about it, I came to the conclusion that what is in that document is going to happen - no matter what. Yeah, CCP might come out and say stuff like "we are sorry for not letting you in on development; this is only a speculative document; we promise not to sell game changing items for $$$; etc." Yet, I can just see 3 months from now, CCP will forget all their apologies and implement their plan anyway, in hopes that we will come around. As much as I don't want this to happen, it probably will.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:55:00 - [1304] What I find Ironic is that this feature is TARGETED at those WITH LOTS OF CASH (be it ISK or real money), and that means BIG CORPS and LOYAL YEARLY CUSTOMERS. Ironic is, the very people they are hoping to FLEECE, are going to LEAVE over this exact feature. Makes NO SENSE their TARGET AUDIENCE. The only target customer it makes sense to is the NEW CUSTOMER, which will NOT STAY anyway (especially if we have our way with them)
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:57:00 - [1305] Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 23/06/2011 13:56:52 Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? Dumbest thing I heard. First a baseless assumption about me. Then an assumptions that you should get treated differently then me becuase "you are richer and got a more powerful job in RL and not the same time for games that I have". As I said, get your head out of you ass :) you are clearly disconnected to what the issue is about, and you somehow think you are better then others becuse you "got a fansy job" as is entitld to different treatment. :P Sad. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:57:00 - [1306] I TOO CAN SPEAK IN CAPS. WHEN WILL WE GET TOPHATS CCP????
Fractal Muse	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:58:00 - [1307] Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? If you are going to make statements like this at least back them up with how much 'more money' you have. Many players in EVE online make well over $100,000 USD / Year. The way the skill system works means that regardless of how much in-game playing time one has you remain competitive so long as you remain subscribed. I've always liked that about EVE since I didn't have a lot of time to play (I often spent weeks without logging in other than to change a skill). With PLEX for ISK one could buy up any ship wanted quickly. So, the way the game was designed prior to this patch have kept things balanced from the perspective of someone who "plays real life harder" than the game. My issue with EVE Online now is twofold: First, I no longer want to be associated with the game. CCP's idea of what "micro-transactions" is nowhere near what mine would be. I actually have no issues with RMT as long as they remain in the realm of "micro-transactions" as such. I would rather see rare and hard to get items going to people who worked in the game to get those rare and hard to get items. But, in an environment like EVE, the occasional thing like a monocle is 'alright' by me. The problem is the pricing of such items. The pricing has made the items a joke. This, in turn, makes the game itself a joke. This in turn makes anyone who plays a joke of a game... The other major issue I have with the patch is the non-standard implementation of movement inside of stations. I hate that I cannot run. And I hate that WASD does not do what I expect it to do based on the de-facto standard of movement in FPS and other MMOs. I could learn and adapt... yes.. but, frankly, I don't want to. If they do not understand basic gameplay like this then I want nothing to do with the game. When they remove the option of not loading CQ then everyone will have to waste extra time WALKING back and forth. It's silly. But, if they keep the option to not load CQ and default to the hangar where one has the option to disembark then that would be better in my view. Too many straws broke the camel's back.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:58:00 - [1308] "Not stay anyway" is part of the virus that invaded CCPs mind. Remember they were kinda shocked to discover their retention/churn rate of 7 months. There were elements of them focusing in on this time period rather then trying to extend it. His name was John Turbefield!
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:59:00 - [1309] Originally by: Redblade While I agree with you I'm with Verone a bit on this, at least let the patch sink in and get a few fixes, give CCP some time to perhaps shed some light on this and then make a stand if needed. there is no time for complacency!
QT McWhiskers EdgeGamers Situation Normal.	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:59:00 - [1310] Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT spending as much time with my kids as you do just because you have a less successful career? Bolded part changed to show just how much of an idiot you are. By those exact same claims. You should gripe about every single online video game you play. You should make that argument for halo or call of doody, or whatever else you play because if that is your argument, then every single video game should fit that bill. "Is it fair that you beat ff13 before I did becuase you only work 5 ours a day and I work 9?" That is life suck it up and deal with it. I have a 9-6 job and I still find time for friends/games. I don't have near as much isk as my corp mates, but I dont care. I really don't. It doesn't mean I will buy a bunch of plex to get some ships and a few monocles to resell. (Lol at people reselling monocles because it would make more sense to just sell the plex. Better established market = better turnover.)
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 13:59:00 - [1311] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus "Not stay anyway" is part of the virus that invaded CCPs mind. Remember they were kinda shocked to discover their retention/churn rate of 7 months. There were elements of them focusing in on this time period rather then trying to extend it. Anybody know the CHURN rate of ENTROPIA?
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:00:00 - [1312] Originally by: Lady Spanky Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08) I have characters in a range of the biggest 0.0 alliances, and I can honestly say that this isn't being discussed AT ALL in our comms channels. There have been a couple of chuckles at how OTT these forums are getting, and not one single person actually being bothered in the slighted. Looks like it's only a small minority who are getting so uppity. No they are all discussing it here on the forums. Go away, your just waiting untill you can buy sov for aur.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:00:00 - [1313] Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 23/06/2011 13:56:52 Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? Dumbest thing I heard. First a baseless assumption about me. Then an assumptions that you should get treated differently then me becuase "you are richer and got a more powerful job in RL and not the same time for games that I have". As I said, get your head out of you ass :) you are clearly disconnected to what the issue is about, and you somehow think you are better then others becuse you "got a fansy job" as is entitld to different treatment. :P Sad. Not baseless at all. I looked at your poor spelling, combined that with the fact that you clearly don't understand corporate marketing and sales planning and made a perfectly reasonable conjecture. It is entirely right and reasonable that people with more money can buy themselves better stuff. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Sragir Kshatriyas	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:01:00 - [1314] Anyway.... This 2004 old vet, has unsubbed. [I used to play EVE ONLINE, not going to play Eve-Scape]
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:01:00 - [1315] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 14:04:21 I say we all let CCP do this and turn Eve into Entropia. Then we can point and laugh at them and say we told you so, while they look for new jobs. CCP. I WANT MicroTransactions everywhere. Please? I say we play CCP's game their way. Batter up! At this stage; I am past caring and just having FUN at CCP's expense now. Its the NEW GAME!
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:02:00 - [1316] On the one hand: What we all signed up for EVE for - a player-driven game with deep, complex gameplay and emergent player-driven narrative. On the other hand, this bozo's conception of EVE: Originally by: General Windypops It is entirely right and reasonable that people with more money can buy themselves better stuff.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:02:00 - [1317] Originally by: Lady Spanky Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08) I have characters in a range of the biggest 0.0 alliances, and I can honestly say that this isn't being discussed AT ALL in our comms channels. There have been a couple of chuckles at how OTT these forums are getting, and not one single person actually being bothered in the slighted. Looks like it's only a small minority who are getting so uppity. I dont know how many big alliances there are but recently at least 2 have been caught RMT'ing. Would be no wonder THEY aren't worried. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:02:00 - [1318] Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? rich **** much?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:02:00 - [1319] Originally by: Miilla Anybody know the CHURN rate of ENTROPIA? lol 200%, everytime someone joins 2 people leave! Know that can trap animals in bad collision boxes and milk them for sweat :-D His name was John Turbefield!
Ni'arks Slave	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:03:00 - [1320] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 23/06/2011 13:56:52 Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? Dumbest thing I heard. First a baseless assumption about me. Then an assumptions that you should get treated differently then me becuase "you are richer and got a more powerful job in RL and not the same time for games that I have". As I said, get your head out of you ass :) you are clearly disconnected to what the issue is about, and you somehow think you are better then others becuse you "got a fansy job" as is entitld to different treatment. :P Sad. Not baseless at all. I looked at your poor spelling, combined that with the fact that you clearly don't understand corporate marketing and sales planning and made a perfectly reasonable conjecture. It is entirely right and reasonable that people with more money can buy themselves better stuff. 6/10
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:03:00 - [1321] Edited by: Ranka Mei on 23/06/2011 14:03:10 Originally by: Lady Spanky I have characters in a range of the biggest 0.0 alliances, and I can honestly say that this isn't being discussed AT ALL in our comms channels. There have been a couple of chuckles at how OTT these forums are getting, and not one single person actually being bothered in the slighted. Looks like it's only a small minority who are getting so uppity. So, that is why you are posting with an alt from an NPC corp, big shot? Obvious troll being obvious. --
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:03:00 - [1322] Originally by: Miilla So if PLEX hording is causing this, what if we simply stop our CC payments and consume PLEX as 30 days game time? I have 4 years worth of gametime. Would that stop the MT plans? NO, because the document states clearly the reason is to GENERATE MORE REVENUE for OTHER PRODUCTS. The plex hording is NOT the reason for this. READ THE DOCUMENT. I have. I can also see what's driving Aurum only being derived from PLEX. If you aren't bright enough to spot it then that's your problem.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:04:00 - [1323] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. To maximize profit CCP would have to retain old customers while gaining new ones. While it might not be shocking it is a violation of what was promised to the fanbase. By making move like this CCP will NEITHER retain existing customers NOR attract any new ones. They've cost themselves 100,000 accounts AT LEAST, maybe even more. This is similar to what happened when SOE dumped the NGE turd on Star Wars Galaxies. The reason why they won't be able to replace those who leave is because they won't leave quietly. People who get backstabbed by a business tend to go away LOUDLY. The NGE ended up being reported in places where not even WoW got reported on: CBS, The New York Times, etc, not to mention the entire gaming news press. Take a look at the top story on all the gaming sites right now: Yep, this little backstab. People aren't going to go subscribe to the game that everyone says has management with the morality of Anthony Weiner. Also, another hindrance to attracting new players for a game like this IS the skill train time sink. The only way this game brings in new players is because of OLD players, like us (I have three 50+ million SP characters myself). EVE is more dependent on veteran players for long term survival than SWG was. Which means, to me anyway, I think this fiasco is going to hurt them faster and harder than the NGE harmed SOE. Worst of all, from CCP's point of view, it's harmed their reputation. Who is going to buy their other games? Take a look at how (un) successful everything SOE has launched since the NGE has been? DCUO, for example, which they spent over $50 million developing cratered within 5 months of launch, it's already being consolidated down into the bare minimum number of servers needed to keep it open with both PVP and PVE rulesets... So not only is this going to cost CCP EVE's success, it's going to make the failure of DUST and World of Twilight foregone conclusions. To CCP management: Is the extra nose candy money from selling $70 monocles and future planned items worth that?
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:05:00 - [1324] Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? why dont you just say it clearly I AM IMPORTANT I HAVE LOTS OF MONEY YOU MUST LET ME BUY MY WAY TO THE TOP OF A GAME WITH RL MONEY o its because you will sound like a complete idiot lol
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:05:00 - [1325] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 14:02:36 I say we all let CCP do this and turn Eve into Entropia. Then we can point and laugh at them and say we told you so, while they look for new jobs. EVE is the smallest project and the least important of their gaming projects since.. 2009 or so. Twilight Online will outsell EVE by a giant margin when it comes. ...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala.
Nirnaeth Ornoediad Caldari Shadowed Command Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:05:00 - [1326] A major problem with purchasing in-game items with real money is that it breaks a fundamental value proposition of EVE: the sandbox. One of the points of EVE is to have a player-driven economy. That means we get the raw materials, refine them, make stuff, and sell it. If players can purchase ships, modules, ammo, whatever, it effectively makes the industrial side of EVE far less valuable. Instead of industrialists competing amongst themselves, they will--quite literally--be competing against the real-world economic power of the playerbase. This is different than PLEX, which only affects the cashflow within EVE (it doesn't actually add to the cash supply, and thus doesn't even affect the value of money aside from the miniscule number of PLEX destroyed). I understand that CCP needs to seek additional revenue streams to grow as a business, and micro-transactions are a reasonable one. Paying for convenience--more than 50 fittings, more than 3 toons on the same account, more than 500 bookmarks, etc.--makes sense, in that they affect player-game interaction, and not player-player interaction. Theoretically, if the number of items sold for real-life money were limited, supply/demand would kick in and in-game industrialists wouldn't be impacted that badly. The problem is that once the real-world revenue stream is turned on, it's very hard not to turn it on full blast. CCP will be unwilling, I think, to impose quotas on such sales (sorry, only 100 faction battleships this month). CCP has managed to make a game with several hundred thousand loyal accounts: a nice, consistent ~$50M USD/year revenue stream. Short of trivial games--such as Farmville--I can't think of any serious game that has survived on micro-transactions. Just as Salesforce.com, SuccessFactors, and other software companies have figured out, you need a recurring revenue stream in software (even Larry Ellison points out that Oracle gets 18-22% of its revenue from maintenance). Micro-transactions have the possibility of significantly reducing this revenue stream, especially in the mid- to long-term. CCP risks seeing a short-term spike in revenue, getting excited, moving to even more drastic effects, and then seeing the proverbial floor drop. Just my 2 ISK. Or Aurum, or whatever. --------------------------------------------- "Gate is green. Jump and meet your maker." --Mr Vee
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:06:00 - [1327] Originally by: Othran Originally by: Miilla So if PLEX hording is causing this, what if we simply stop our CC payments and consume PLEX as 30 days game time? I have 4 years worth of gametime. Would that stop the MT plans? NO, because the document states clearly the reason is to GENERATE MORE REVENUE for OTHER PRODUCTS. The plex hording is NOT the reason for this. READ THE DOCUMENT. I have. I can also see what's driving Aurum only being derived from PLEX. If you aren't bright enough to spot it then that's your problem. Yes I know, PLEX is just a VEHICLE to generate more REVENUE for the other products. It solves 2 problems in one go. Anyway, I am just going to have fun that hopefully is at CCP's expense with my remaining game time. I am past caring about it. Its my new mini game. **** over as many noobs as I can, and the game in the process.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:06:00 - [1328] Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? why dont you just say it clearly I AM IMPORTANT I HAVE LOTS OF MONEY YOU MUST LET ME BUY MY WAY TO THE TOP OF A GAME WITH RL MONEY o its because you will sound like a complete idiot lol hes just a rich **ing ** with a kid in his brain
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:07:00 - [1329] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 23/06/2011 13:56:52 Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? Dumbest thing I heard. First a baseless assumption about me. Then an assumptions that you should get treated differently then me becuase "you are richer and got a more powerful job in RL and not the same time for games that I have". As I said, get your head out of you ass :) you are clearly disconnected to what the issue is about, and you somehow think you are better then others becuse you "got a fansy job" as is entitld to different treatment. :P Sad. Not baseless at all. I looked at your poor spelling, combined that with the fact that you clearly don't understand corporate marketing and sales planning and made a perfectly reasonable conjecture. It is entirely right and reasonable that people with more money can buy themselves better stuff. Quote: game1 [geym] noun, adjective, gam+er, gam+est, verb, gamed, gam+ing. ûnoun 1. an amusement or pastime: children's games. 2. the material or equipment used in playing certain games: a store selling toys and games. 3. a competitive activity involving skill, chance, or endurance on the part of two or more persons who play according to a set of rules, usually for their own amusement or for that of spectators. Winning by taking the game out of eve. For you its statussymbols in space or epeen in space.
Cyaxares II	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:08:00 - [1330] Edited by: Cyaxares II on 23/06/2011 14:10:10 Originally by: Lady Spanky I have characters in a range of the biggest 0.0 alliances, and I can honestly say that this isn't being discussed AT ALL in our comms channels. There have been a couple of chuckles at how OTT these forums are getting, and not one single person actually being bothered in the slighted. wouldn't say "not a single person" but here it's like 5 guys talking about it in a forum thread and practically no mention in chat or comms
Agricola Plagiarius	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:09:00 - [1331] I find it ironic when you calculate the RM cost a shirt in eve costs more then what I'm willing to pay for a shirt in RL
Ms Freak Amarr Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:09:00 - [1332] Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08) I've paid/played since 03 on two accounts. Vanity items i'm not bothered about. Power items? Not whilst i'm still paying my subs. I can live with the display case that CQ is (i have disabled it mind you) and i can well believe the document which i've had ~20 hours to read and digest is indeed real, and, most probably, designed to cause this very debate, however: I still don't like where EvE is going and CCP need to interact with thier customers to make thier product(s) better. If they intereact and make thier product(s) better then more people will want to know what we are all raving about and they will make more money.
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:09:00 - [1333] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: Sidus Isaacs Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 23/06/2011 13:56:52 Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? Dumbest thing I heard. First a baseless assumption about me. Then an assumptions that you should get treated differently then me becuase "you are richer and got a more powerful job in RL and not the same time for games that I have". As I said, get your head out of you ass :) you are clearly disconnected to what the issue is about, and you somehow think you are better then others becuse you "got a fansy job" as is entitld to different treatment. :P Sad. Not baseless at all. I looked at your poor spelling, combined that with the fact that you clearly don't understand corporate marketing and sales planning and made a perfectly reasonable conjecture. It is entirely right and reasonable that people with more money can buy themselves better stuff. I also have more irl money and less irl time and would like to display my awesomeness by buying useless monocles and in the future much more badass ships devoted to someone of my financial stature.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:09:00 - [1334] Originally by: Nirnaeth Ornoediad A major problem with purchasing in-game items with real money is that it breaks a fundamental value proposition of EVE: the sandbox. You needed go no further than that. RMT item shops and sandbox games DO NOT MIX. They are oil and water. You can't have a sandbox with a cash shop, soon as you add one the game isn't a sandbox anymore.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:10:00 - [1335] Think of it succeeding. People buy PLEX for ISK, get AURUM got game change items WIN WIN FUN FUN.. PLEX dries up, people get tired of paying, or the plex input rate matches the REAL PEOPLES ECONOMY. Or they start to use a tighter budget and spend less. Nullsecers (always the first to whine), or hardcore players with lots of isk, COMPLAIN they cannot buy PLEX with ISK, PLEX prices RISE. No stockpiles, just the new input flow mostly. They have to buy new PLEX to WIN!.. That is when the REALITY BREAKS INTO THEIR MIND. OMG ITS A PAY TO WIN GAME. That is when it affects them.. GAME OVER:
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:12:00 - [1336] Originally by: Republica Winder By making move like this CCP will NEITHER retain existing customers NOR attract any new ones. They've cost themselves 100,000 accounts AT LEAST, maybe even more. ... People aren't going to go subscribe to the game that everyone says has management with the morality of Anthony Weiner. ... EVE is more dependent on veteran players for long term survival than SWG was. Which means, to me anyway, I think this fiasco is going to hurt them faster and harder than the NGE harmed SOE. Worst of all, from CCP's point of view, it's harmed their reputation. Who is going to buy their other games? ... QFT! His name was John Turbefield!
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:12:00 - [1337] Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 23/06/2011 14:12:34 Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Nirnaeth Ornoediad A major problem with purchasing in-game items with real money is that it breaks a fundamental value proposition of EVE: the sandbox. You needed go no further than that. RMT item shops and sandbox games DO NOT MIX. They are oil and water. You can't have a sandbox with a cash shop, soon as you add one the game isn't a sandbox anymore. EVE's economy was heavily influenced by NPC buy/sell orders and the price floors/ceilings defined through these for years.
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:13:00 - [1338] CCP... Are you Seriuous ? When i read this Bulletin i thought its only a Joke.. but it seems its true. Well.. Money for items. In a small way its ok. Buying Clothes, remapps, Maybe also Ships that are also found ingame would be ok.. but all this would be possible right now. Also buying Faction standing isnt such a big deal.... But when i read about that thos Ships and Moduls in the shop will have better Bonus than ingame items.. when i read that those things will not get lost when get killed... Theres only one choice: If this comes online.. I cancle all my Accounts as it is FAKT that if it comes CCP dont want the Old Playerbase anymore. They want the 3 Month subscripers who bring fast Money and then leave again. Good luck with them CCP... and i hope you didnt make a Mistake and have to Close Eve after another Year ( Like 95% of all Games who tried to make the fast money.. and now are only F2P Games... Well i wait. What comes... Dont touch the Line Guys cause if you do you will loose a lot of Players that are payed for a long long time and they never will come back. :) This whole thoughts are Rediciuoules. Well if some think im whining.. so think it. Yess its true i am scared of this changes. Not cause i dont want to pay cause off it will change Eve into something new i dont want to play. Lets see where it ends. I will take my fun as long as its possible but these changes are no Patches or improvements. CCP think about it.. what you try to do is something like Sony Online Entertainment tried with SWG... They failed.. they lost 80% of theire Population on some servers in one week after NGE.. you wont see that, i am shure. Everyone i know in eve.. every contact, every friend and in every Chatroom.. all i hear is.. we dont want it and we will quit. Most wont do it thats true.. but i believe enough player will do it. lets all stand together and kick theire Asses so they can see WE DONT WANT THIS ... ( And to all people who think this would be cool as they dont have the time.. you STILL have a big advantage over people you try to make isk in the game, as you can buy everything in eve with money ( plex ) right now. This changes will also kill the whole economy ) Just my 2 or some more cents :) I never posted here before as CCP done a great Job in the Past.. dont break the Dreams of Thousneds of people who play eve CAUSE it is different to all other MMOs..
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:14:00 - [1339] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: General Windypops I actually don't know what the hell all the fuss is about. Do you honestly NOT expect CCP to look at how best to maximise profit? You're all insanely naive if so. Not one thing in that document was shocking or surprising. Except for some of the page design. To maximize profit CCP would have to retain old customers while gaining new ones. While it might not be shocking it is a violation of what was promised to the fanbase. By making move like this CCP will NEITHER retain existing customers NOR attract any new ones. They've cost themselves 100,000 accounts AT LEAST, maybe even more. This is similar to what happened when SOE dumped the NGE turd on Star Wars Galaxies. The reason why they won't be able to replace those who leave is because they won't leave quietly. People who get backstabbed by a business tend to go away LOUDLY. The NGE ended up being reported in places where not even WoW got reported on: CBS, The New York Times, etc, not to mention the entire gaming news press. Take a look at the top story on all the gaming sites right now: Yep, this little backstab. People aren't going to go subscribe to the game that everyone says has management with the morality of Anthony Weiner. Also, another hindrance to attracting new players for a game like this IS the skill train time sink. The only way this game brings in new players is because of OLD players, like us (I have three 50+ million SP characters myself). EVE is more dependent on veteran players for long term survival than SWG was. Which means, to me anyway, I think this fiasco is going to hurt them faster and harder than the NGE harmed SOE. Worst of all, from CCP's point of view, it's harmed their reputation. Who is going to buy their other games? Take a look at how (un) successful everything SOE has launched since the NGE has been? DCUO, for example, which they spent over $50 million developing cratered within 5 months of launch, it's already being consolidated down into the bare minimum number of servers needed to keep it open with both PVP and PVE rulesets... So not only is this going to cost CCP EVE's success, it's going to make the failure of DUST and World of Twilight foregone conclusions. To CCP management: Is the extra nose candy money from selling $70 monocles and future planned items worth that? +1
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:14:00 - [1340] Originally by: Republica Winder By making move like this CCP will NEITHER retain existing customers NOR attract any new ones. They've cost themselves 100,000 accounts AT LEAST, maybe even more. This is similar to what happened when SOE dumped the NGE turd on Star Wars Galaxies. The reason why they won't be able to replace those who leave is because they won't leave quietly. People who get backstabbed by a business tend to go away LOUDLY. The NGE ended up being reported in places where not even WoW got reported on: CBS, The New York Times, etc, not to mention the entire gaming news press. Take a look at the top story on all the gaming sites right now: Yep, this little backstab. People aren't going to go subscribe to the game that everyone says has management with the morality of Anthony Weiner. Also, another hindrance to attracting new players for a game like this IS the skill train time sink. The only way this game brings in new players is because of OLD players, like us (I have three 50+ million SP characters myself). EVE is more dependent on veteran players for long term survival than SWG was. Which means, to me anyway, I think this fiasco is going to hurt them faster and harder than the NGE harmed SOE. Worst of all, from CCP's point of view, it's harmed their reputation. Who is going to buy their other games? Take a look at how (un) successful everything SOE has launched since the NGE has been? DCUO, for example, which they spent over $50 million developing cratered within 5 months of launch, it's already being consolidated down into the bare minimum number of servers needed to keep it open with both PVP and PVE rulesets... So not only is this going to cost CCP EVE's success, it's going to make the failure of DUST and World of Twilight foregone conclusions. Good post! +1 --
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:14:00 - [1341] Originally by: Miilla I am past caring about it. We noticed the distinct, careless lack of posting, lately. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Cham Palaung	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:14:00 - [1342] A very important reason why i play mmorpgs since now 12 years is : EQUALITY. Once we have paid our monthly bill, we all are equal. Be you rich or poor in real doesn't count anymore in game. If you work hard in the game, you get rewarded in the game, and it's a very good way to heal our wounds from the real life and make new friends, whatever our social origins and horizons. Now, with micro transactions, the game becomes like real life : you can't escape anymore your real social condition. I was playing lord of the rings online since the start, and saw recently arriving the "free to play" changes, and the shop. At start, they promised us that they were selling only customisation items, like clothes, horses, etc... but very fast the shop became full of SP bonus, potions, buffs, etc, be it for fighting or crafting or travelling, now every aspects of the game can be corrupted with your real life money... I left. I will leave EVE as soon as the first unfair product will appear in the shop.
Levaria Gallente Incertae Sedis Atlas.	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:14:00 - [1343] Im gonna need a **ing umbrella, CCP keeps ing all over the player base. Today's forecast, partly to mostly ty with a chance of Microtransactions.... ~Pirates May Cry but Care Bears will die!~**
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:14:00 - [1344] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Republica Winder RMT item shops and sandbox games DO NOT MIX. They are oil and water. You can't have a sandbox with a cash shop, soon as you add one the game isn't a sandbox anymore. EVE's economy was heavily influenced by NPC buy/sell orders and the price floors/ceilings defined through these for years. While they were removed in a way which ruined eves economy for years to come. His name was John Turbefield!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:15:00 - [1345] Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha Originally by: Miilla I am past caring about it. We noticed the distinct, careless lack of posting, lately. Im here just for my personal pleasure now. I want micro transactions in Eve. Everywhere. I really do now. I have changed sides. At least on this side, I cannot resist, and have fun at the same time, while Eve falls around CCP's ankles (and thus the funding for WoD and Dust).
Maul555 Amarr Reliables Inc BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:16:00 - [1346] Originally by: Lady Spanky Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08) I have characters in a range of the biggest 0.0 alliances, and I can honestly say that this isn't being discussed AT ALL in our comms channels. There have been a couple of chuckles at how OTT these forums are getting, and not one single person actually being bothered in the slighted. Looks like it's only a small minority who are getting so uppity. Our corp chat has been pretty quiet too with a few exceptions, until I came on here and found other corp/alliance members that are voicing their concerns that said absolutely nothing in game. Just because people are using in game channels for doing normal in game stuff, doesn't mean they aren't ****ed... The EVE Personality Test
Landlady	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:19:00 - [1347] No wonder CCP cracked down on bots, people who are botting wouldn't need to pay big piles of cash to get spacepants and pwnage ammo, they could just use their botting proceeds to buy plex instead. Now that bots are getting stopped everyone will have to buy their power equally :P Linky instea,d forgot i cant use images
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:19:00 - [1348] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 14:20:36 Come on people! Support CCP! We want MT everywhere. Just agree and nod to CCP, Let them have their way. Then we get to laugh at them later, while they find new jobs. JOIN THE "I SWITCH SIDES FOR LOLS" club! If you get a survey from them asking if you want MT's etc, just checkboxx YES. May aswell have some fun during the self destruct phase :)
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:20:00 - [1349] Originally by: Ms Freak Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Bendy Profane Take this very seriously, management of CCP. Yes, there are those who will always flame you on the forums. But the recent events also turned a lot of moderates into angry and bitter customers. Without the core community this game is nothing. Do not put it off for good. they can not ignore this i mean, they cannot ignore the fact that alot of old players are angry. unless of course they have really forgotten the older players (ive played scince 08) I've paid/played since 03 on two accounts. Vanity items i'm not bothered about. Power items? Not whilst i'm still paying my subs. I can live with the display case that CQ is (i have disabled it mind you) and i can well believe the document which i've had ~20 hours to read and digest is indeed real, and, most probably, designed to cause this very debate, however: I still don't like where EvE is going and CCP need to interact with thier customers to make thier product(s) better. If they intereact and make thier product(s) better then more people will want to know what we are all raving about and they will make more money. I realise 08 isn't that old but I do remember a better CCP/eve even before I signed up I was watching from the outside (at the time like in 07 i didn't have the awesome gaming rig I do now((its not all that awesome and near exploded with incarna)))
Goatse Girl	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:20:00 - [1350] Bump, need more emo tears
Nirnaeth Ornoediad Caldari Shadowed Command Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:22:00 - [1351] Best quotation from the PDF: "After a certain point of power, though, the enjoyment goes down (after all, how fun is it to have a "win button" that allows you to kill everything in sight with just one click?)" You mean, like supercaps? --------------------------------------------- "Gate is green. Jump and meet your maker." --Mr Vee
J Kunjeh Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:23:00 - [1352] I honestly don't see what everyone is so upset about with regards to this document. I read the entire thing and while I might disagree with some of the opinions within, I realize they're just that, opinions. I actually rather enjoyed reading it and getting some inside info (if it's real) on some CCP employees thoughts about MT. ~Gnosis~
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:23:00 - [1353] If you don't see me... all my accounts with remaining subscription time are likely banned for challenging CCP to maintain the game I pay them for... His name was John Turbefield!
Razin The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:24:00 - [1354] Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? Here's how it is: you are not allowed to break my EVE just because you suck at it. Hopefully this was clear enough. ... If you like choice please support this topic in the Assembly Hall. Thanks.
Landlady	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:24:00 - [1355] Originally by: Miilla Come on people! Support CCP! We want MT everywhere. Just agree and nod to CCP, Let them have their way. Then we get to laugh at them later, while they find new jobs. The problem with that statement is that this sort of MT sale is probably good for the game overall. Every game that goes MT ends up doing much better than subscription, look at what it did for LOTRO and DDO; those games are steaming piles and people dump embarising amounts of cash out at their stores. If you want to object to MT, don't do it by trying to convince people that MT is bad from a business sense, because it inst. Convince them that it is bad from some sort of moral/ethical sense. CCP devs wont be looking for new jobs, they will be trying to avoid paper cuts while they roll around in their giant piles of money because neckbeards think that a $70 monocle is the space-equivalent of louis vuitton.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:24:00 - [1356] Originally by: J Kunjeh I honestly don't see what everyone is so upset about with regards to this document. I read the entire thing and while I might disagree with some of the opinions within, I realize they're just that, opinions. I actually rather enjoyed reading it and getting some inside info (if it's real) on some CCP employees thoughts about MT. become a bit more human
Zedah Zoid Adhocracy Incorporated	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:25:00 - [1357] Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? This is quite possibly one of the dumbest things I have read ever on Eve-O forums so good on you sir! You are not penalized in game because someone else has a less successful career. You are penalized in game because you PLAY THE GAME LESS than someone else. You have a choice just like the other guy. Cut your hours back, tell your customers or your boss that you value your time more than you value their money and play Eve Online if you want to be the big cheese here. Otherwise, quit whining about how you can't extend your income influence further into the game than you already can with PLEX. Sheesh... morons....
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:25:00 - [1358] Originally by: Goatse Girl Bump, need more emo tears Then go cut yourself you little emo *****. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:25:00 - [1359] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 14:27:20 Originally by: J Kunjeh I honestly don't see what everyone is so upset about with regards to this document. I read the entire thing and while I might disagree with some of the opinions within, I realize they're just that, opinions. I actually rather enjoyed reading it and getting some inside info (if it's real) on some CCP employees thoughts about MT. Given the recent AUR prices, it is MORE than "opinion". For all those Comparing Goblins/Dwarfs/Orcs/Mage games with Eve/scifi/spaceships/rayguns. Two VERY DIFFERENT GENRES of game and audience. SCIFI is niche, always has been, always will be. Vampires/Orcs/Dwarfs Always POPULAR. SCI FI = LOW AUDIENCE FANTASY = HUGE MASS APPEAL Do not compare the two.
Darveses Fantastulousification Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:26:00 - [1360] Did someone just take Windypops seriously Candidates List
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:27:00 - [1361] Originally by: Darveses Did someone just take Windypops seriously If I'd known it was so much fun over here I'd have moved out from CAOD years ago... CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:27:00 - [1362] Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? This is quite possibly one of the dumbest things I have read ever on Eve-O forums so good on you sir! Otherwise, quit whining about how you can't extend your income influence further into the game than you already can with PLEX. Sheesh... morons.... How can I put this? Windypops (And all of his corp) are inveterate trolls. That's what they do. That's ALL they do. Stop replying to the muppet.
Goatse Girl	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:28:00 - [1363] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Goatse Girl Bump, need more emo tears Then go cut yourself you little emo *****. ujelly?
Zedah Zoid Adhocracy Incorporated	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:30:00 - [1364] Originally by: Othran Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: General Windypops It's not a troll in the slightest. I have more money than you in real life, but less time than most of you because I have a higher powered job. Is it fair that I should be penalised by NOT having things in game just because you have a less successful career? This is quite possibly one of the dumbest things I have read ever on Eve-O forums so good on you sir! Otherwise, quit whining about how you can't extend your income influence further into the game than you already can with PLEX. Sheesh... morons.... How can I put this? Windypops (And all of his corp) are inveterate trolls. That's what they do. That's ALL they do. Stop replying to the muppet. In that case, I stand trolled. So again, good on you! This is probably why I don't post over here very often.
Azahni Vah'nos Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:30:00 - [1365] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra I TOO CAN SPEAK IN CAPS. WHEN WILL WE GET TOPHATS CCP???? lol ... obviously you missed this Post from Pandemic Legion Recruiter
Kali Doom	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:30:00 - [1366] All Internet Posts from the Past 24hrs on the search term "Eve Online" Monocle. Some funny stuff.
Cedar Locus	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:31:00 - [1367] icelandic morans, eve is already a **** game if you compare it to what it could of been
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:31:00 - [1368] Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 23/06/2011 14:32:59 Originally by: Landlady CCP devs [...] roll[ing] around in their giant piles of money you haven't read the bulletin, have you? take a look at page 10 of the PDF before coming back shamelessly quoting myself: Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 23/06/2011 12:46:12 The average CCP employee has moved to a small, rocky island to work for below-average wages. What does he think about these changes and why does CCP have to convince him with this bulletin? some selected metrics from the employee satisfaction survey: topic: 2009, 2010, 2011 (perfect score is 5) Employee Satisfaction: 4.2, 4.2, 4.1 Employee Loyalty: 4.7, 4.5, 4.4 Morale and Cooperation: 4.1, 4.1, 3.9 Management - CEO: 4.6, 4.4, 4.4 Management - Executive Board: 4.0, 3.7, 3.7 Company Vision and Business Goals: 4.1, 4.1, 3.9 question: 2010, 2011 "Professional development is well organized within CCP.": 3.1, 2.9 "I feel that my pay is in line with the position that I occupy.": 3.2, 3.1 "Communication with other offices is good.": 3.3, 3.1 "CCP's salary policy is fair.": 3.3, 3.2 I call bull**** on everyone claiming that CCP's employees in general are "out of touch" - they see very clearly what's going on and could be our best allies. If you don't care what game you are working on you would be stupid to hire with CCP. The problem is that it is very easy for management to say "we just cannot pay you a competitive wage unless we increase revenue with MTs". this picture matches very well with the information on glassdoor. People like Soundwave are no "devs" - they're management.
Ni'ark	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:32:00 - [1369] Originally by: Nirnaeth Ornoediad A major problem with purchasing in-game items with real money is that it breaks a fundamental value proposition of EVE: the sandbox. One of the points of EVE is to have a player-driven economy. That means we get the raw materials, refine them, make stuff, and sell it. If players can purchase ships, modules, ammo, whatever, it effectively makes the industrial side of EVE far less valuable. Instead of industrialists competing amongst themselves, they will--quite literally--be competing against the real-world economic power of the playerbase. This is different than PLEX, which only affects the cashflow within EVE (it doesn't actually add to the cash supply, and thus doesn't even affect the value of money aside from the miniscule number of PLEX destroyed). I understand that CCP needs to seek additional revenue streams to grow as a business, and micro-transactions are a reasonable one. Paying for convenience--more than 50 fittings, more than 3 toons on the same account, more than 500 bookmarks, etc.--makes sense, in that they affect player-game interaction, and not player-player interaction. Theoretically, if the number of items sold for real-life money were limited, supply/demand would kick in and in-game industrialists wouldn't be impacted that badly. The problem is that once the real-world revenue stream is turned on, it's very hard not to turn it on full blast. CCP will be unwilling, I think, to impose quotas on such sales (sorry, only 100 faction battleships this month). CCP has managed to make a game with several hundred thousand loyal accounts: a nice, consistent ~$50M USD/year revenue stream. Short of trivial games--such as Farmville--I can't think of any serious game that has survived on micro-transactions. Just as Salesforce.com, SuccessFactors, and other software companies have figured out, you need a recurring revenue stream in software (even Larry Ellison points out that Oracle gets 18-22% of its revenue from maintenance). Micro-transactions have the possibility of significantly reducing this revenue stream, especially in the mid- to long-term. CCP risks seeing a short-term spike in revenue, getting excited, moving to even more drastic effects, and then seeing the proverbial floor drop. Just my 2 ISK. Or Aurum, or whatever. You forgot that we are ALREADY paying CCP to PLAY this game, wich makes us all equal regarding stuff we can get.
Verone Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:32:00 - [1370] >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<<
Monstress	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:33:00 - [1371] Originally by: Azahni Vah'nos Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra I TOO CAN SPEAK IN CAPS. WHEN WILL WE GET TOPHATS CCP???? lol ... obviously you missed this Post from Pandemic Legion Recruiter Lol'd. So I take it Iloni Atoriandra will shortly be kicked from PL? :p
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:33:00 - [1372] This is actually a buff to all old players who have tons of ISK laying around after years and years of accumulating wealth since now theres new stuff to waste it on so I celebrate it and await my tophat.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:35:00 - [1373] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra This is actually a buff to all old players who have tons of ISK laying around after years and years of accumulating wealth since now theres new stuff to waste it on so I celebrate it and await my tophat. Yes for a while, UNTIL PLEX dry up. then their ISK BUYS NOTHING. Think of it succeeding. People buy PLEX for ISK, get AURUM got game change items WIN WIN FUN FUN.. PLEX dries up, people get tired of paying, or the plex input rate matches the REAL PEOPLES ECONOMY. Or they start to use a tighter budget and spend less. Nullsecers (always the first to whine), or hardcore players with lots of isk, COMPLAIN they cannot buy PLEX with ISK, PLEX prices RISE. No stockpiles, just the new input flow mostly. They have to buy new PLEX to WIN!.. That is when the REALITY BREAKS INTO THEIR MIND. OMG ITS A PAY TO WIN GAME. That is when it affects them.. GAME OVER:
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:35:00 - [1374] I WONDER IF LULZSEC COULD HELP???
Pure Tabasco	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:36:00 - [1375] Here got a little laugh for you Survival Rule 514: When a angry mob its outside your house, come with your hands up, cleary and slowly; before someone with little fire burns down your house.
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:36:00 - [1376] PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out.
Landlady	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:37:00 - [1377] All kidding aside, I'd pay $30 for enough faction standing with Cathum Conglomerate to access level 4's, I hate grinding 2's and 3's.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:37:00 - [1378] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. Then you are their prize ~~idiot~~customer with money to burn. Fool and their money is easy parted. Have fun funding my game, until the GAME OVER signs appear on the walls.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:38:00 - [1379] Originally by: Verone TB is tht you? squint :D
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:39:00 - [1380] Edited by: leth ghost on 23/06/2011 14:39:59 not far off hitting the 24 hour mark now and still no response, nice way to show you care about your player base !!!!! o hang on they dont, they make us try and think they do, to milk us lol
Eliniale	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:40:00 - [1381] last i heard they were working on a reply they'd run trough the csm first.
Landlady	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:40:00 - [1382] Originally by: leth ghost not far off hitting the 24 hour mark now and still no response, nice way to show you care about your player base !!!!! a hang on they dont they make us try and think they do to milk us lol That's because they are in meetings trying to figure out how to make a buck off of the outrage surrounding this leak :P
Zephy Russ	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:41:00 - [1383] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. Me too. I can't wait for the Top Hat and the cane. I really want a cane. It should come with a "Whack the poor plebians around the head" emote, which can only be used on people without money.
Katahe	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:41:00 - [1384] Si CCP se met a vendre des items qui ont une influence en jeux, je change de jeux. Je lÆai dTja fait par le passT et mÆen porte pas plus mal.
rosinERsundt	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:42:00 - [1385] is it hard to post fake or true ccp? Tbh i always found it funny the way CCP was run, and espcially the members of their dev teams is kinda noob and sad. But this surely breaks the scale of stupidity in business hehe
Cyaxares II	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:43:00 - [1386] Originally by: Landlady Originally by: leth ghost not far off hitting the 24 hour mark now and still no response, nice way to show you care about your player base !!!!! a hang on they dont they make us try and think they do to milk us lol That's because they are in meetings trying to figure out how to make a buck off of the outrage surrounding this leak :P increase the "you are going too fast" delay to 90 minutes, pay 800 AUR to reset the timer.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:43:00 - [1387] Originally by: Katahe Si CCP se met a vendre des items qui ont une influence en jeux, je change de jeux. Je lÆai dTja fait par le passT et mÆen porte pas plus mal. If CCP began to sell items that have an impact in games, I change games. I have done in the past and am none the worse.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:43:00 - [1388] Originally by: leth ghost Edited by: leth ghost on 23/06/2011 14:39:59 not far off hitting the 24 hour mark now and still no response, nice way to show you care about your player base !!!!! o hang on they dont, they make us try and think they do, to milk us lol One thing I've always been amazed about with respect to the attitudes of MMO publishers. They completely lack any sense of urgency. They never see the urgency in the need to fix something that is horribly broken. They never see the urgency in the need to respond quickly to the whole customer base giving them a collective F-U!!!!!!!! to a terrible decision. They seem to think they have all the time in the world or that if they hide it will all go away. In this sense they are really no more mature than the average 4 year old.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:44:00 - [1389] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra This is actually a buff to all old players who have tons of ISK laying around after years and years of accumulating wealth since now theres new stuff to waste it on so I celebrate it and await my tophat. Yes for a while, UNTIL PLEX dry up. then their ISK BUYS NOTHING. I see you changed your mind then The way to imagine the stockpiled PLEX is as a huge loan that can be called in at any time - ie CCP has to provide gametime on PLEX that potentially were bought years ago and the revenue has been spent. Statistically its very unlikely that would happen in a short enough timescale to trouble CCP but remember that there are only 3 ways to remove a PLEX from game : 1) Redeem it for gametime; 2) Redeem it for Aurum; 3) Get it blown up/biomassed. Got it now? Lots of older players hold what is effectively a loan on CCP - certainly a debit entry on the books if you see what I mean? CCP wants to remove some of that potential liability. Hence making PLEX destroyable and now Aurum. Whether this is to attract further investors is open to speculation.
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:45:00 - [1390] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:45:00 - [1391] Originally by: Levaria Im gonna need a **ing umbrella, CCP keeps ing all over the player base. Today's forecast, partly to mostly **ty with a chance of Microtransactions.... rofl
Zephy Russ	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:46:00 - [1392] Edited by: Zephy Russ on 23/06/2011 14:46:49 Now be reasonable. All of you are being like this because you are mere peasants with not enough money to buy a monocle, which, by the way, I am currently choosing not to wear because I am so rich I can afford not to. I'm currently keeping it in my cargo bay, because I can. I also have the dress uniform, even though I can't wear it.
Mika Foxxs	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:46:00 - [1393] After lurking on all these posts since Incarna came out I think I figured out CCP's logic, if true it will make me very . . . upset. CCP may not be able to charge Dustbunnies subscription charges due to legal agreements with the PSN. If they are expecting comparable size in player base then the cost of maintaining the servers for them is too high to be free. So to pay for the Dust 514 subscription fee we are given the NEX store so the dust players don't have to pay themselves. I know this sounds conspiracy theroyish but I already have my tin foil hat on and am praying it not to be true.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:46:00 - [1394] Originally by: Republica Winder They never see the urgency in the need to respond quickly to the whole customer base giving them a collective F-U!!!!!!!! to a terrible decision. Um, no. Don't you get it? CCP's silence is their collective F-U!!!!!!!! to us. --
Iloni Atoriandra Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:47:00 - [1395] Originally by: Atreus Venom Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP You sound like a bitter little poor scrub. Please go outside and down the road as your prescence is devaluing the local property market.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:47:00 - [1396] Originally by: Zephy Russ Now be reasonable. All of you are being like this because you are mere peasants with not enough money to buy a monocle, which, by the way, I am currently choosing not to wear because I am so rich I can afford not to. another rich ** kid ** face
SM100	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:48:00 - [1397] Yes!!!! Let will enter at least a part!!!! And then EVE will roll down to level of browser ****-game and I will forget about it. EVE, don't hold me...
Joao Duarte Selflessness	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:51:00 - [1398] Originally by: Zephy Russ Edited by: Zephy Russ on 23/06/2011 14:46:49 Now be reasonable. All of you are being like this because you are mere peasants with not enough money to buy a monocle, which, by the way, I am currently choosing not to wear because I am so rich I can afford not to. I'm currently keeping it in my cargo bay, because I can. I also have the dress uniform, even though I can't wear it. For discussion about value of vanity items, find the apropriate thread.
Illadelph Justice SniggWaffe FREE KARTTOON NOW	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:51:00 - [1399] Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Zephy Russ Now be reasonable. All of you are being like this because you are mere peasants with not enough money to buy a monocle, which, by the way, I am currently choosing not to wear because I am so rich I can afford not to. another rich ** kid ** face Lol trolled ---
Zephy Russ	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:51:00 - [1400] Edited by: Zephy Russ on 23/06/2011 14:52:57 Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra You sound like a bitter little poor scrub. Please go outside and down the road as your prescence is devaluing the local property market. I absolutely agree. What is with these peasants? It's almost as if they think they are equal to us. What a ludicrous concept. Quote: For discussion about value of vanity items, find the apropriate thread. Your lack of money is offensive. Please avert your eyes.
Goatse Girl	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:52:00 - [1401] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra Originally by: Atreus Venom Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP You sound like a bitter little poor scrub. Please go outside and down the road as your prescence is devaluing the local property market. lol, look at all these peasants moaning, CCP should say "let them eat cake"
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:52:00 - [1402] Originally by: Mika Foxxs After lurking on all these posts since Incarna came out I think I figured out CCP's logic, if true it will make me very . . . upset. CCP may not be able to charge Dustbunnies subscription charges due to legal agreements with the PSN. If they are expecting comparable size in player base then the cost of maintaining the servers for them is too high to be free. So to pay for the Dust 514 subscription fee we are given the NEX store so the dust players don't have to pay themselves. I know this sounds conspiracy theroyish but I already have my tin foil hat on and am praying it not to be true. not thats something that had to be discussed between psn and ccp and all cost should have been covered partly by psn anyway and the main reason dust is even possible is because psn likes to do new and crazy stuff with games and dust being tied to an mmorpg i think the cost is on psn and now the but i want their for the meetings but i can only assume thats what happened
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:54:00 - [1403] Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Republica Winder They never see the urgency in the need to respond quickly to the whole customer base giving them a collective F-U!!!!!!!! to a terrible decision. Um, no. Don't you get it? CCP's silence is their collective F-U!!!!!!!! to us. And my canceled accounts (this one was only still active by accident) is my F-U right back to them. Hell, they are lucky I didn't call my bank and file a chargeback. Easy to do, especially when dealing with a charge from a foreign company.
VaMei	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:55:00 - [1404] Originally by: Othran Got it now? Lots of older players hold what is effectively a loan on CCP - certainly a debit entry on the books if you see what I mean? CCP wants to remove some of that potential liability. Hence making PLEX destroyable and now Aurum. I'd go a step farther than to say Aurum is a way to burn plex, and say that Aurum is a way to legally divorce Plex from any real world value. I'm not suggesting that there are any plans, but if CCP planned to close EvE, players who own Plex could potentially be a legal roadblock since they own something that entitles them to service. Now that Plex can translate to virtual goods rather than service, that end of life concern is closed.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:57:00 - [1405] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Republica Winder They never see the urgency in the need to respond quickly to the whole customer base giving them a collective F-U!!!!!!!! to a terrible decision. Um, no. Don't you get it? CCP's silence is their collective F-U!!!!!!!! to us. And my canceled accounts (this one was only still active by accident) is my F-U right back to them. Hell, they are lucky I didn't call my bank and file a chargeback. Easy to do, especially when dealing with a charge from a foreign company. More power to ya, mate! I'm very close to it myself. Only thing holding me back so far is that I'm still holding out for an official CCP response (yes, I know, deluded). --
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 14:59:00 - [1406] Edited by: Othran on 23/06/2011 15:03:21 Edited by: Othran on 23/06/2011 15:02:36 Originally by: VaMei I'd go a step farther than to say Aurum is a way to burn plex, and say that Aurum is a way to legally divorce Plex from any real world value. I'm not suggesting that there are any plans, but if CCP planned to close EvE, players who own Plex could potentially be a legal roadblock since they own something that entitles them to service. Now that Plex can translate to virtual goods rather than service, that end of life concern is closed. PLEX was made a fully in-game item last year VaMei. There is no financial liability associated with PLEX other than that of players continuing to use stockpiled PLEX in place of RL money to pay for subs. Edit - to make it simple the worst case scenario for CCP is that stockpiled PLEX are used for game subscriptions. That has a recurring cost. Vanity or whatever items have a one-time cost of development (in theory) so it makes the "PLEX debt" disappear if people spend on that.
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:01:00 - [1407] Originally by: Goatse Girl Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra Originally by: Atreus Venom Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP You sound like a bitter little poor scrub. Please go outside and down the road as your prescence is devaluing the local property market. lol, look at all these peasants moaning, CCP should say "let them eat cake" you both are so **ing stupid and the troll thing is so tired... i can afford a digital " you" t-shirt and whatever bull they have but it isnt even important to the game... im never going to see your gay ass monocle (who weres those anyway) and once they do open up the rest of the station and we get to shake hands ill still not care what the hell your wearing... but all this just leads to other things to buy like a drug that makes you fly in human form in the station and then weapons ships and and then sectors of space will be for sell and then you can buy your own expansion with your name on it that all US poor ppl have to install and in this patch your given a concord ship and can blow up whoever you want... yeah im mad cuz im poor NOT im mad cuz you are ****
Aarri Vishnorzen Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:03:00 - [1408] Edited by: Aarri Vishnorzen on 23/06/2011 15:06:23 I hear that only the very rich can buy beer that comes in gold plated and diamond encrusted cans. "damn that beer was delicious! the gold plating and diamonds really enhances the flavor." I'm gonna have to give myself a 3 out of 10 on this, kinda sux. I'm old
Joao Duarte Selflessness	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:03:00 - [1409] Originally by: Zephy Russ Edited by: Zephy Russ on 23/06/2011 14:52:57 Quote: For discussion about value of vanity items, find the apropriate thread. Your lack of money is offensive. Please avert your eyes. Comforting to see that money != brains.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:04:00 - [1410] Originally by: Goatse Girl lol, look at all these peasants moaning, CCP should say "let them eat cake" Execpt... the cake is a lie! --
Harelip Jenkins	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:05:00 - [1411] ugh... Destroying the 3rd party app community that built Eve with the $99 fee then introducing pay to win... It's like a one/two nut punch to anybody that gives a **** about this game. Sounds like CCP has already given up on Eve and is just looking to cash out. I'll let my accounts run for a couple more months to see if this crap is walked back for no other reason than atm I don't know of a decent MMO to switch to. Maybe the CCP failcascade will open the door for a new developer to step in and fill the niche.
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:05:00 - [1412] Originally by: Joao Duarte Originally by: Zephy Russ Edited by: Zephy Russ on 23/06/2011 14:52:57 Quote: For discussion about value of vanity items, find the apropriate thread. Your lack of money is offensive. Please avert your eyes. Comforting to see that money != brains. ha ha i caught what you did there... nice.... coding helped for once
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:05:00 - [1413] Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Republica Winder They never see the urgency in the need to respond quickly to the whole customer base giving them a collective F-U!!!!!!!! to a terrible decision. Um, no. Don't you get it? CCP's silence is their collective F-U!!!!!!!! to us. And my canceled accounts (this one was only still active by accident) is my F-U right back to them. Hell, they are lucky I didn't call my bank and file a chargeback. Easy to do, especially when dealing with a charge from a foreign company. More power to ya, mate! I'm very close to it myself. Only thing holding me back so far is that I'm still holding out for an official CCP response (yes, I know, deluded). Right now all options are on the table IMHO. What CCP has done is "broken the social contract". So all bets are off. Since I really don't care if I ever play EVE again, why not cash all the way out? 50+ million SP capital pilots are still worth money, right?
Zephy Russ	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:05:00 - [1414] Originally by: Atreus Venom you both are so **ing stupid and the troll thing is so tired... i can afford a digital " you" t-shirt and whatever bull they have but it isnt even important to the game... im never going to see your gay ass monocle (who weres those anyway) and once they do open up the rest of the station and we get to shake hands ill still not care what the hell your wearing... but all this just leads to other things to buy like a drug that makes you fly in human form in the station and then weapons ships and and then sectors of space will be for sell and then you can buy your own expansion with your name on it that all US poor ppl have to install and in this patch your given a concord ship and can blow up whoever you want... yeah im mad cuz im poor NOT im mad cuz you are **** How cute, the peasant appears to be vexed for some reason. My dear fellow, what is the matter?
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:07:00 - [1415] Originally by: Zephy Russ Originally by: Atreus Venom you both are so **ing stupid and the troll thing is so tired... i can afford a digital " you" t-shirt and whatever bull they have but it isnt even important to the game... im never going to see your gay ass monocle (who weres those anyway) and once they do open up the rest of the station and we get to shake hands ill still not care what the hell your wearing... but all this just leads to other things to buy like a drug that makes you fly in human form in the station and then weapons ships and and then sectors of space will be for sell and then you can buy your own expansion with your name on it that all US poor ppl have to install and in this patch your given a concord ship and can blow up whoever you want... yeah im mad cuz im poor NOT im mad cuz you are **** How cute, the peasant appears to be vexed for some reason. My dear fellow, what is the matter? why are you talking like you're gay?
Abelard Nightbringer New Foundation	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:10:00 - [1416] Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). ^^ This.
Zephy Russ	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:11:00 - [1417] Originally by: Atreus Venom why are you talking like you're gay? I cannot understand you because you are talking like a lowly peasant. I understand that it is not your fault, however.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:12:00 - [1418] Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). ^^ This. Keep exposing your ignorance of the production side of the economy, aka THE THING THAT MAKES THE ECONOMY RUN. But nah, I guess if CCP poofs in some faction POS for you, that's exactly the same. Can't be bad for the market at all, nope.
Irascor Luclin	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:12:00 - [1419] I can't help but feel like we all did when Napster was called out by Lars Ulrich. I know that stealing music isn't right, they deserve money for their hard work, but after that I'm pretty sure Metallica fell off the face of the planet. Where is EVE going?
Joao Duarte Selflessness	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:15:00 - [1420] Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). ^^ This. I think at least one of the problems there is that the POS you buy in the store wasn't manufactured, like the clothes and monocles aren't manufactured by any player. At the moment if you buy a POS with ISK someone manufactured it using in game minerals or comodities that someone harvested somewhere in New Eden and got their ISK for it. Most people are against shortcuts provided by real world money.
Blaze Stark	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:15:00 - [1421] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku This are customer-unfriendly practices, yes, sanctioned and often used int he industry (not just IT, everywhere), and still SO WRONG if you have any kind of morale. "In a closed society where everybody's guilty, the only crime is getting caught. In a world of thieves, the only final sin is stupidity." (Hunter S. Thompson)
Lev Aeris United Amarr Templar Legion Fidelas Constans	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:15:00 - [1422] This game has been in a nose dive since dominion. It had to hit the ground eventually.
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:17:00 - [1423] Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra PLEX wont dry up as people will still buy GTCs to convert and sell. Ive done 8 already since this came out. As we can see by your ******ed monocle lol...be gone before you get jumped in here. We don't like your kind around here!!
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:18:00 - [1424] Buddy of mine just suggested the Plex for CCP stock campaign! Let the playerbase buy the company using plex. Think of the metagaming possibilities!
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:18:00 - [1425] Originally by: Lev Aeris This game has been in a nose dive since dominion. It had to hit the ground eventually. not even any sign of an emergency landing
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:18:00 - [1426] Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). Well i have nothing against it if you can buy Faction stuff or any ingame Item with Aurum.. .its no different to pay it via plex/isk. But you dont see where it leads. It would have no sence only implementing this way. it leads to buy SP, it leads to buy undestructable Ships that are better than ingame ones and you cannot loose it.. This kind of Items will break eve.. and they think about to bring em in. If the first Item is in eve you cannot loose due a kill.. eve is dead as it is wow online then. But i cannot believe they do it.. they talked over and over about how proud they are about the long therm Subscriptions. How proud they are about the Fakt that eve is different. So why they should change it. I HOPE this all is a Bubble that breaks soon.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:20:00 - [1427] Originally by: Irascor Luclin I can't help but feel like we all did when Napster was called out by Lars Ulrich. I know that stealing music isn't right, they deserve money for their hard work, but after that I'm pretty sure Metallica fell off the face of the planet. Where is EVE going? I never realized that paying CCP $15 per account each month was stealing from them!
Terrestes The Inevitable Corp Black Legion.	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:20:00 - [1428] I posted on this thread.
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:20:00 - [1429] Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). ^^ This. Problem is, if it's a POS with special bonuses it will have a rather large price tag in the NeX (ffs a monocle is $70.) So you'll win the game because you're willing to pour $$$ in it, while others may not be. I will hazard a guess that most people play video games to get away from that aspect of RL. You should not be able to gain gameplay advantages (ie bonused POSes/ships/turrets/ammo) because you're rich IRL. It goes against eve's long touted sandbox aspect. It would take away the fun for the casual (or poor) player.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:24:00 - [1430] Originally by: Saris Jacinta Well i have nothing against it if you can buy Faction stuff or any ingame Item with Aurum.. .its no different to pay it via plex/isk. Even buying regular ships with Aurum will break the Industry trade, as these ships aren't produced with blueprints and minerals, but spawn ex nihilo, as it were, from the 'Cash-for-SQL-query' item-making machinery that is Noble. So, be afraid. Be very afraid. --
A Lunchbox	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:24:00 - [1431] You're doing it wrong.
Gurgeh Murat Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:26:00 - [1432] 76000 view, 1425 replies. Not a DAMN WORD from CCP. Theyve said theyre monitoring it. Original PDF is fake? No need to debate the response CCP. Call it as a fake. Lock thread. Original PDF is real? Massive need for huge OMGOMGWTFAREWEGOINGTODO conference to initiate damage control. Cant call it fake just in case someone produces incontrovertible proof. Threadnaught starts to morph into threadtitan. Outside media starts to post articles. Fire rains from skies, angry mob with pitchforks start buying up all the gasoline. Bad things. to reiterate Not a DAMN WORD from CCP Oh dear.
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:27:00 - [1433] Originally by: Ranka Mei Originally by: Saris Jacinta Well i have nothing against it if you can buy Faction stuff or any ingame Item with Aurum.. .its no different to pay it via plex/isk. Even buying regular ships with Aurum will break the Industry trade, as these ships aren't produced with blueprints and minerals, but spawn ex nihilo, as it were, from the 'Cash-for-SQL-query' item-making machinery that is Noble. So, be afraid. Be very afraid. Well yes ok.. i forgot the Economy.. But if it comes we did not have to talk about it anymore cause there isnt any then left :) They could bring in new skills to build Clothes with Incarna Tailors, Image Designers etc.. some social Stuff.. that would had the abbility to bring in a lot of new players.. but they seem to choose the way that leads into F2P and a Dead Game.. :)
i hatechosingnames Gallente Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:28:00 - [1434] Originally by: Gurgeh Murat 76000 view, 1425 replies. Not a DAMN WORD from CCP. Theyve said theyre monitoring it. Original PDF is fake? No need to debate the response CCP. Call it as a fake. Lock thread. Original PDF is real? Massive need for huge OMGOMGWTFAREWEGOINGTODO conference to initiate damage control. Cant call it fake just in case someone produces incontrovertible proof. Threadnaught starts to morph into threadtitan. Outside media starts to post articles. Fire rains from skies, angry mob with pitchforks start buying up all the gasoline. Bad things. to reiterate Not a DAMN WORD from CCP Oh dear. they are happy to post other crap on their facebook page and twitter no doubt... https://www.facebook.com/eveonline
Joao Duarte Selflessness	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:29:00 - [1435] Maybe it's time to start building a whole new sandbox: http://www.perpetuum-online.com/ Ç9/$10 a month. Shame that I prefer spaceships to mechs and perpetuum is still very rough around the edges, and there's nothing out there like EVE lore. But it beats real money-driven games any day. CCP, please prove us wrong, there's still time. But once people start comiting to something else...
Karthwritte	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:29:00 - [1436] So here a thought: Logically how can a MT that affects gameplay be on the same game thats considered a sandbox? I mean, dosent it make it a roller-coaster experience? You pay for something inside a amusment park. Or like: Hey! drive a supercapital ship! For 60$ (My driving licence cost less) And the worst thing its the griefing. How can a a game wich they say its a sandbox and it allow griefing gonna let other "paying" costumers get your stuff when you payed like 20$ to it. They really thought about it?
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:29:00 - [1437] Originally by: Saris Jacinta Well i have nothing against it if you can buy Faction stuff or any ingame Item with Aurum.. .its no different to pay it via plex/isk. Really? Wowà The difference is huge. Buying an item with Aurum bypasses EVE. That is the difference. It skips the miners, the researchers, the traders, the builders, the traders (again), the mission grinders, the traders (a third time) ù it bypasses every last thing in the game. PLEX and ISK do not. They follow the rules of the game. They have balancing mechanics built into them that make them adhere to supply and demand; MT items do not ù in fact, that's the whole point of MT. ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:30:00 - [1438] Originally by: Gurgeh Murat 76000 view, 1425 replies. Not a DAMN WORD from CCP. Theyve said theyre monitoring it. Original PDF is fake? No need to debate the response CCP. Call it as a fake. Lock thread. Original PDF is real? Massive need for huge OMGOMGWTFAREWEGOINGTODO conference to initiate damage control. Cant call it fake just in case someone produces incontrovertible proof. Threadnaught starts to morph into threadtitan. Outside media starts to post articles. Fire rains from skies, angry mob with pitchforks start buying up all the gasoline. Bad things. to reiterate Not a DAMN WORD from CCP Oh dear. Haha maybe theyer shocked about the reaction but then theire stupid as it was clear to see that a very Big Part of the Community dont want things like that.. its been discussed very often since the last years. Ir it is a Fake but i dont understand WHY they are wait to dement it... All curious about what statement we will see :)
okcerg	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:31:00 - [1439] Originally by: Jade Constantine Edited by: Jade Constantine on 23/06/2011 12:47:10 Originally by: Verone I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business.
Mozillaa Firefox	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:31:00 - [1440] Confirming that this thread is getting long.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:32:00 - [1441] Originally by: Landlady Originally by: leth ghost not far off hitting the 24 hour mark now and still no response, nice way to show you care about your player base !!!!! a hang on they dont they make us try and think they do to milk us lol That's because they are in meetings trying to figure out how to make a buck off of the outrage surrounding this leak :P WTB DEV RESPONSE 100,000 AURUM. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:32:00 - [1442] Originally by: Othran Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Iloni Atoriandra This is actually a buff to all old players who have tons of ISK laying around after years and years of accumulating wealth since now theres new stuff to waste it on so I celebrate it and await my tophat. Yes for a while, UNTIL PLEX dry up. then their ISK BUYS NOTHING. I see you changed your mind then The way to imagine the stockpiled PLEX is as a huge loan that can be called in at any time - ie CCP has to provide gametime on PLEX that potentially were bought years ago and the revenue has been spent. Statistically its very unlikely that would happen in a short enough timescale to trouble CCP but remember that there are only 3 ways to remove a PLEX from game : 1) Redeem it for gametime; 2) Redeem it for Aurum; 3) Get it blown up/biomassed. Got it now? Lots of older players hold what is effectively a loan on CCP - certainly a debit entry on the books if you see what I mean? CCP wants to remove some of that potential liability. Hence making PLEX destroyable and now Aurum. Whether this is to attract further investors is open to speculation. Has there been a case involving this e-scenario? Also, notice their EULA has a clause for LIMITED LIABILITY. That is effectively signing away your right's, which in contractual law is a worthless clause. The law states what liability they have, not their EULA :) Would be nice to see a test case on this, I actually raised this "loan" issue in a previous thread a week or 2 ago where that "limited liability" clause was brought up, it really is a worthless clause, the law states the limits. Not the company.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:33:00 - [1443] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Our anthem.
Nak hak	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:34:00 - [1444] I am passing this link on to friends. They need to have this information.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:35:00 - [1445] I actually have NOT logged in since this news broke, yesterday I was exploring CQ. Since this news broke, havn't really been interested in logging on, still havn'. I also have lost interested in developing tools / libraries / apps on top of the Eve API. Screw it.
Brokers Clone Amarr Northgate	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:36:00 - [1446] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. hmmmm.... 1652?
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:37:00 - [1447] Originally by: Miilla I actually have NOT logged in since this news broke, yesterday I was exploring CQ. Since this news broke, havn't really been interested in logging on, still havn'. I also have lost interested in developing tools / libraries / apps on top of the Eve API. Screw it. i have not logged in world of tanks has nearly down loaded going to go blow stuff up on that to release anger lol
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:38:00 - [1448] C C P = Company Conning Players
Dividius Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:38:00 - [1449] I don't really have a problem with EVE getting a cash shop, but I do think their prices are complete bull. When LotRO went F2P and added their store, they did it right. Cosmetics go for about $2-3. Most convenience items are usually around $5. CCP's prices are simply unacceptable to me, and I won't pay them. For the real-world-value of a monocle (which I think looks rather ugly anyway), I could get a six-month subscription. For the real-world-value of a pair of pants or shirt, I can easily feed my family of 4 one or two meals, or take my sons to a movie. If you look at the CCP merchandise store, you can get a ship model for $75 now. That's just slightly more than a monocle and will last a lifetime if you take care of it. I've been with EVE about 6 months now and I've barely scratched the surface. I'm about 2/3 miner, 1/3 missioner, so I don't make a lot of ISK (still 70m from my first Hulk). My PVP encounters consisted of someone getting Concorded trying to gank my Retriever, and my Hurricane/Pod falling victim to campers at the Bei gate (thankfully I was wise enough to insure it when I saw the mission was in 0.4 space--one of those 'I have a bad feeling about this' moments). Anyway, I would consider myself a casual player, but I feel I fit in with a good portion of the EVE player base when I say CCP's implementation of their cash shop is a freighter load of crap. My hope right now is that when I do eventually get my Hulk there will still be people around to buy the materials.
Delta Jax NixCraft IMPERIAL LEGI0N	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:38:00 - [1450] Originally by: Erichan Buddy of mine just suggested the Plex for CCP stock campaign! Let the playerbase buy the company using plex. Think of the metagaming possibilities! I second this, but be advised, stockholders like to see bigger returns, MT would technically be a win for them, but losing repeat customers due to fail business plans and ceo vision would result in a lot of forced "Executive" resignations... Serious internet spaceships business just got real ccp, there is no win/win here for your customers here, just you killing the golden goose. You need to do some major staff "restructuring" as there is a serious disconnect between you and your customers.. if i worked there I would be worried of long term job stability
Abelard Nightbringer New Foundation	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:38:00 - [1451] Originally by: Joao Duarte Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). ^^ This. I think at least one of the problems there is that the POS you buy in the store wasn't manufactured, like the clothes and monocles aren't manufactured by any player. At the moment if you buy a POS with ISK someone manufactured it using in game minerals or comodities that someone harvested somewhere in New Eden and got their ISK for it. Most people are against shortcuts provided by real world money. oh, like faction drops, officer modules, and such, right? Noone seems to complain when they get stuff for free, which gets farmed, and overly saturated, and *****edly common soon enough, but when the opposite is even suggested* everyone gets all up in arms about it. Sounds like a balancing act to me. How buying a pre-built POS with ISK (YES, u can buy plex with ISK) is any different than buying minerals and building it yourself is beyond me. You're still putting in something to receive something back.
Chagaline	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:39:00 - [1452] Effective crisis communication strategies will typically consider achieving most, if not all, of the following objectives: Maintain connectivity FAIL Be readily accessible to the news media FAIL Show empathy for the people involved FAIL Allow distributed access FAIL Streamline communication processes FAIL Maintain information security FAIL Ensure uninterrupted audit trails FAIL Support multi-channel communications FAIL Remove dependencies on paper based processes FAIL hey CCP, WTB communication staff?
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:39:00 - [1453] I feel bad to say it, given how angry you lot clearly are, but I actually would really quite like a monocle. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:40:00 - [1454] Originally by: Miilla I actually have NOT logged in since this news broke, yesterday I was exploring CQ. Since this news broke, havn't really been interested in logging on, still havn'. I also have lost interested in developing tools / libraries / apps on top of the Eve API. Screw it. I'd assume most third party folks are in the same boat. The prospect of getting fleeced by CCP for what ammounts to doing them a favor is too much risk, espcially when they're clearly not interested in developing anything but MT for the future.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:42:00 - [1455] Edited by: General Windypops on 23/06/2011 15:42:30 Originally by: Chagaline Effective crisis communication strategies will typically consider achieving most, if not all, of the following objectives: Maintain connectivity FAIL Be readily accessible to the news media FAIL Show empathy for the people involved FAIL Allow distributed access FAIL Streamline communication processes FAIL Maintain information security FAIL Ensure uninterrupted audit trails FAIL Support multi-channel communications FAIL Remove dependencies on paper based processes FAIL hey CCP, WTB communication staff? Trying to sound wise and informed on an internet forum will typically involve most, if not all, of the following activities: - Copying and pasting something you googled [SUCCESS] - Clicking submit with a sense of smug fulfillment. [SUCCESS} CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:43:00 - [1456] Originally by: General Windypops I feel bad to say it, given how angry you lot clearly are, but I actually would really quite like a monocle. Go buy one. Although it doesn't actually look all that good from what I can see. Nothing awesome like you'd expect from having your eye socket removed and a hunk of machinery shoved in the hole... like scaring n' stuff. Which is a pity.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:44:00 - [1457] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really don't have much of a clue in business. I agree with Jade. Yes ladies and gentlemen, you heard that right. I AGREE WITH JADE. DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE CCP? WELL DO YOU? Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Chagaline	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:45:00 - [1458] Googling stuff doesnt make it wrong...and yes i didnt care to post a thesis on crisis communication or refering to valid sources, but again, its still not wrong.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:45:00 - [1459] Originally by: Rodj Blake I AGREE WITH JADE. DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE CCP? WELL DO YOU? That's it, thread done. PIE agreeing with Star Fraction. Next Red v Blue will be singing Kumhyah together and we'll have dogs & cats living together.
Joao Duarte Selflessness	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:47:00 - [1460] Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Originally by: Joao Duarte Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Originally by: Quetazoid Edited by: Quetazoid on 22/06/2011 21:07:52 nice leak. and I agree with the statement Greed is Good: lets explore the possibility of having to buy a item, for Example a faction POS with micro-plex. Use ISK, convert to plex, convert to arum, buy POS. How different is that to: Use ISK, buy POS? Infact, the richer get poorer (PLEX prices go up), that faction POS (or sub) will cost more. The Poorer become richer (many sell PLEX for ISK) more expensive PLEX means more money for people who do MT. So given the above paragraph, can someone point out the evil here? All I see is more of a equalizer between the rich and the poor (both in and out of game). ^^ This. I think at least one of the problems there is that the POS you buy in the store wasn't manufactured, like the clothes and monocles aren't manufactured by any player. At the moment if you buy a POS with ISK someone manufactured it using in game minerals or comodities that someone harvested somewhere in New Eden and got their ISK for it. Most people are against shortcuts provided by real world money. oh, like faction drops, officer modules, and such, right? Noone seems to complain when they get stuff for free, which gets farmed, and overly saturated, and *****edly common soon enough, but when the opposite is even suggested* everyone gets all up in arms about it. Sounds like a balancing act to me. How buying a pre-built POS with ISK (YES, u can buy plex with ISK) is any different than buying minerals and building it yourself is beyond me. You're still putting in something to receive something back. I agree that the system is in already, but to expand it even more... I know what you mean, I guess it depends on the amount of stuff they put in the store and how necessary those are to play the game efficiently.
Land0 CaIrissian Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:49:00 - [1461] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really don't have much of a clue in business. +10 My 3 accounts hang in the balance of CCP's response.
i hatechosingnames Gallente Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:50:00 - [1462]
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:51:00 - [1463] CSM should quit. You are just dancing clown dressed monkeys in this. They are worthless anyway, 14% csm vote turnout, and also no bite. CSM are lied to, CSM just dance about like monkeys to CCP's tune.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:52:00 - [1464] Originally by: Delta Jax Originally by: Erichan Buddy of mine just suggested the Plex for CCP stock campaign! Let the playerbase buy the company using plex. Think of the metagaming possibilities! I second this, but be advised, stockholders like to see bigger returns, MT would technically be a win for them, but losing repeat customers due to fail business plans and ceo vision would result in a lot of forced "Executive" resignations... Serious internet spaceships business just got real ccp, there is no win/win here for your customers here, just you killing the golden goose. You need to do some major staff "restructuring" as there is a serious disconnect between you and your customers.. if i worked there I would be worried of long term job stability The point would be they could raise money for WOD and we'd get more of a say in how ccp operates. Though based on what I am seeing it may be too late...
FunzzeR The Wyld Hunt Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:53:00 - [1465] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... PRAISE THE SCOTTISH FOLD!! THEIR WILL SHALL BE DONE!!
Kalissa Sacred Templars RED.OverLord	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:53:00 - [1466] To be honest, I never really had any problem with the sale of so called "vanity items" the fact that they're insanely priced is CCP's fault, if anyone is dumb enough to pay more for a virtual set of pants then they'd pay for a real pair then obviously they have more money than sense. CCP made this big speech about the arrival of the new currency Aurum about it just being for vanity items, things which aside from maybe being traded on the market would have no effect on Eve itself, the very fact they have started to think about selling faction standings and weapons for real life cash somehow feels like they're betraying an understanding between the company and us the comsumer that RL cash that you did or didn't have would not be a factor in how good or powerful you would be at Eve, and believe me bringing in weapons that can only be bought for cash sure as hell breaks that understanding. CCP sure do love Eve of that I have no doubt, but now I'm starting to realise it's only because it's a golden goose by which they wanna get every penny they can out of us. The fact no CCP person has spoken pretty much tells us it's the truth and they've been told to stay off the subject. No doubt at some point they'll make an announcement about how they were only floating ideas about, maybe these changes will happen, maybe they won't. I for one am very glad some CCP employee had the integrity to leak this, because if they hadn't CCP would surely have implemented it down the road, smiled at us while they did and pocketed our cash while thinking "SUCKER!!" Shame on you CCP.
Pesadel0 the muppets RED.OverLord	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:53:00 - [1467] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really don't have much of a clue in business. I agree with Jade. Yes ladies and gentlemen, you heard that right. I AGREE WITH JADE. DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE CCP? WELL DO YOU? Agreed 100% .
SketS47 Minmatar Alpha Intellectual Military Solutions Alpha Intergalactic Mythogenesis	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:54:00 - [1468] Dropping all subs but one and i'll start looking for a new game.. wont be long now Only idiots quote themselves -SketS47-
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:56:00 - [1469] A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:57:00 - [1470] I cannot wait for Microtransactions everywhere. Hurry up CCP! Roll em out! Then I have an excuse to find a new game.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:58:00 - [1471] HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever...
Jehvan Sunburnadire The Forgotten Legion Redrum Fleet	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:58:00 - [1472] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. I'd be happy to pay up to $5 more/mo on my subscriptions than have the game completely obliterated by this bull****.
Pesadel0 the muppets RED.OverLord	Posted - 2011.06.23 15:59:00 - [1473] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. They arent , even if they are i'am paying them to play eve so i recon they should try to improve the game not invest in other projects loosing money.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:01:00 - [1474] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. I would have taken a 50% hike in sub fees to put development of spaceship content back on track. The fact they didn't see this as a viable alternative tells me just how little they know of their customer base.
Antihrist Pripravnik Scorpion Road Industry	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:01:00 - [1475] Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... Quoting this just in case Devs miss it. [Petition] Make entry into CQ and Incarna optional.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:01:00 - [1476] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 16:05:31 http://slashdot.org/submission/1669048/Eve-Online-and-60-microtransactions Expect the forums to get Slashdotted SOONÖ CCP will probably think it is a LULZSEC DDOS and pull the server lol.
Lucrezia Romanova	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:03:00 - [1477] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. I agree with Jade. Yes ladies and gentlemen, you heard that right. I AGREE WITH JADE. DO YOU SEE WHAT YOU'VE DONE CCP? WELL DO YOU? This.. is .. so beautifull.. finally.. star crossed lovers.. grabsPaperTowel Amor victor ! ;)
Abelard Nightbringer New Foundation	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:03:00 - [1478] Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine snipsnipsnip 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. snipsnipsnip Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... this is his best? Ill reword it for him 1. Im too stupid to have cargo open when i dock, or double click the ship to open cargo from ships window. oh, and right clicking - activate ship is too hard on my brain 2. Speculation of Doom, wow, the world is ending, just not right now, maybe later 3. Speculation of Doom, 6+ months from now, based on actions that have not happened yet. I am too stupid to comprehend how to use isk to buy things from the noble store even if they existed (WHICH THEY DONT YET), like in the LP store that for some reason i cant complain about right now. I am just too hard headed to understand that new things in the noble store are just as attainable to anyone else thru isk, therefore i think i am being held back.
TK420 Caldari Navy of Xoc Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:03:00 - [1479] Edited by: TK420 on 23/06/2011 16:06:22 Honestly CCP, go ahead and take the path that SOE did. Do to Everquest 2 what SOE did. You'll receive the same reaction from me, un-subbing. I keep hearing the EVE is a dinosaur, while CCP may be the skeleton, EVE community is the meat on the bones. We're what make you move, we're what provide the most interest content. You really want to screw us over? Be careful about Evolution, sometimes it will kill the dinosaur. How do you think survival of the fittest works? How do you think you've lasted this long? Think of what has made you successful so far.
Arele Minmatar Samurai Salvaging	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:04:00 - [1480] Originally by: Antihrist Pripravnik Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... Quoting this just in case Devs miss it. Jade has the best post on this whole mess.
Della Monk Broski Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:07:00 - [1481] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. I would prefer they cut costs and operate within their means. Either that or get some outside investment. Not pass the buck of crappy management to us.
Pandadora	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:07:00 - [1482] Originally by: Rixiu Because there is no such thing as non-adobe pdf readers? Huh? Apple Preview for starters. There are more, of course.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:10:00 - [1483] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. I'd much rather pay an extra dollar a month if it meant an end to the PLEX trade and all this talk of MTs. That way we could have a return to the days when success in Eve was related to skill and not RL cash. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Saskie Castillo	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:10:00 - [1484] Was first expecting a quick response from CCP telling us its fake. As it looks a lot more shabby than what you'd expect from an internal monthly newsletter. However the lack a quick reply has actually made me think it might be real. The patch itself wasn't that bad, not much content but still far from horrible as it serves a foundation for something that could be on pair with blowing up spaceships, in time. However, it could easily also be turned into a foundation for micro transactions and ****ty fluffy gameplay. That I fear.
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:11:00 - [1485] Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer this is his best? Ill reword it for him 1. Im too stupid to have cargo open when i dock, or double click the ship to open cargo from ships window. oh, and right clicking - activate ship is too hard on my brain 2. Speculation of Doom, wow, the world is ending, just not right now, maybe later 3. Speculation of Doom, 6+ months from now, based on actions that have not happened yet. I am too stupid to comprehend how to use isk to buy things from the noble store even if they existed (WHICH THEY DONT YET), like in the LP store that for some reason i cant complain about right now. I am just too hard headed to understand that new things in the noble store are just as attainable to anyone else thru isk, therefore i think i am being held back. Well your right it isnt yet.. but as we seen they think about it... And we know from real life.. crying when the child has fallen into a Hole is to late.. So we shout out now.. let'em know what we think. Its never bad to Discuess options and its always right to say what you think. CCP wanna make money and they will do anything to get it... show em we are not willing to pay theire loans if they break a Game we all love so much cannot be wrong. Well.. i played SWG.. as there was an idear from SOE to implement the NGE stuff.. and we all said.. hey lets see if they realy do it.. they done it.. and they killed swg. So cause of i dont want to loose a good Game to Moneymaking i start to shout :) you may think its whining.. right it can be but i dont care as i was told my whole life.. if you dont like something then NAME it cause nobody knows what you think :)
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:11:00 - [1486] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. A subscription price increase. But the alternative would not be $60 monocles, but rather $0.99 monocles because that's the whole thing about microtransactions that they've missed: at $60/monocle, they'll sell enough to give everyone a Cadbury egg at the next company picnic. If they sold them at $0.99, they'd be able to buy Iceland. As numerous people have already mentioned in this thread and others, people will gladly fork over the money for 80+ $0.99 items, but will baulk at the idea of paying 1+ $60. That $60 monocle isn't the second option, it's the third, and by far the worst option of the three, because it will not generate any significant amount of money. ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Lelob	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:11:00 - [1487] Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... The more people that see this post, the better.
Mac Aoidh	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:12:00 - [1488] Originally by: Jade Constantine Edited by: Jade Constantine on 23/06/2011 12:47:10 Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. QFT "With A Strong Hand"
Rex Liberium	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:12:00 - [1489] Originally by: Lelob Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... The more people that see this post, the better. We should get it stickied under the thread title: The gospel of Jade.
Brainless Bimbo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:15:00 - [1490] CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) ...... continues overleaf.
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:16:00 - [1491] Originally by: Jade Constantine .... Originally by: Verone I look at the parts of Eve that I enjoy, and those that have an effect on what I enjoy. The rest is for other people to be concerned over. Here is the problem Verone. ... The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Excellent post, Jade, and it nails the problem, and the solution, very accurately. It's why I unsubbed. The only thing I can think of that makes CCP take notice.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:16:00 - [1492] Originally by: Lelob Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... The more people that see this post, the better. Indeed.
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:18:00 - [1493] Originally by: Flex Carter Ok,ok... Where the hell are the Moderators? What are you expecting them to moderate? Sure, there's some extreme stuff, but the core of the discussion: 1. The leaked PDF is clearly real. 2. CCP want to sell I-Win buttons for cash. can't easily be argued with. Are you expecting them to say "Oh, wait, that's not really what we're planning to do!"? You'll be waiting a long, long time. This is what they're doing. They're just trying to figure out a way to spin it.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:20:00 - [1494] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 16:23:47 Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) 2008 huh? I feel like something important happened in 2008... OHHHH the great banking bail out because all the loan companies in America realized their "adjustable mortgage" rates and the like were unsustainable. These loans were a way to sneak in "money grabs" (as many people in the forum would refer to it), and then they were surprised when the majority of those loans defaulted because they were trying to squeeze money out of people that had none! So, I'm guessing that guy really knows how to keep a sustainable business model... Edit: actually, a slight correction, he knew how to keep a sustainable business model until he jumped on the bandwagon of "squeeze out every last cent you can from these people so we can continue to fly our private jets everywhere."
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:20:00 - [1495] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Originally by: Jefferson H Clay A hypothesis and a question, for anyone left reading this thread. Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. I would have taken a 50% hike in sub fees to put development of spaceship content back on track. The fact they didn't see this as a viable alternative tells me just how little they know of their customer base. How much more would you pay per month for Eve in order to fund development of Dust and WoD?
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:21:00 - [1496] Originally by: Miilla Has there been a case involving this e-scenario? Also, notice their EULA has a clause for LIMITED LIABILITY. That is effectively signing away your right's, which in contractual law is a worthless clause. The law states what liability they have, not their EULA :) Would be nice to see a test case on this, I actually raised this "loan" issue in a previous thread a week or 2 ago where that "limited liability" clause was brought up, it really is a worthless clause, the law states the limits. Not the company. You still don't "get it" do you? If all the stockpiled PLEXs were utilised in an organised way CCP would lose lots of revenue for a sustained period. This would require people to give away PLEX for others to sub (the idea of you trying to give away PLEX in Rens is stunningly funny) so the effect was widened as the stockpiles of PLEX won't deplete otherwise and nor would CCPs monthly revenue. Its very very unlikely that would happen under normal circumstances. However were you (for example) trying to attract new investment then that is an area that due diligence may turn up. Especially now. tl;dr were the major holders of stockpiled PLEX to organise in a certain way then CCPs cashflow would be impacted in a non-trivial way (IMHO and I have no knowledge of CCPs current finances).
T0KER	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:22:00 - [1497] Pathetic. I played eve for almost 2 years but ended up getting bored because of the PLEX system. I don't care about loosing a 2$ battleship when I make 25$/hr in my job irl. If dieing meant that I had to grind for an hour or two, that would matter to me. WE LET THEM GET AWAY WITH PLEX, WHAT DID YOU THINK WOULD HAPPEN PLAYERS NEED TO STAND UP AGAINST MICROTRANSACTIONS AND NOT ACCEPT THEM LIKE WE ALL DID PLEX
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:22:00 - [1498] Originally by: Jade Constantine ... The newsletter was more of a shock to my system than the CQ/noble store fiasco has been in truth. And that was out there in ccp land for a while (allegedly) I desperately hoped it was faked but it is looking increasinly likely it was not and it sells a brand of clueless that I find frankly staggering. How somebody can rise to such a senior position in an online game without possessing any apparent understanding of the community the game was based on boggles my mind. HereÆs the reality Verone û CCP stand to lose more revenue in lost multi-account users via the mandatory/ un-optimized CQ than they gain from forcing people to view the 3d environment vanity display case. If there was a quick fix in the works shouldn't we have heard about it ? Or does the fact that this issue was raised often and loudly during SISI testing but entirely ignored tell you that this aspect is not going to be fixed. We need to raise a storm to get CCP to backtrack on the removal of the mandatory CQ view and get a disembark from hanger view option to restore the eve client to former multi client/medium performance rig capabiliy. This is not a argument for mutely saying "lets wait and see." The irony is its for their good AND ours. Forcibly dumping (showing the door) to large sections of multi client using player base is commercial nonsense. And on the Noble Store. If they had set the Aurum store at a sensible level they would have made considerably more money from day one. I myself had prepped a billion isk worth of plexes to buy my character clothes and chances are would have spent the money happily were it possible to buy a whole outfit for that price. But the outrageous greed ôthe gorden gecko effectö meant that I took one look at the monocle and skirts and said screw that û let it rot. And IÆm pretty damned sure IÆm not the only one feeling this way. This is indicative of bad business decision-making on the part of developers who have now shown they have no real idea what they are doing. What the hell is the CSM for if not to run some proposed numbers for aurum prices past them to sanity check the concept before going live with it? Even mittani is shaking his head and saying he had no clue this was the pricing level they were aiming at. It tells me that the "biz-devs" knew this was going to annoy the community immensely and no way the CSM would have told them it was a good idea. Firing the consultants and advisers is always a good way to get a well-crafted policy right? Unless we as a community make a noise and protest this then these bad decision-makers will drag the Eve we know and love to an early grave and it will be a great shame and tragedy for us all. That leaked internal newsletter gives us insight into the rot that has taken hold in the minds here. Question to us is whether we sit down and take it or get up and do something about it. I'm not a player to talk idly about quitting this game and truthfully I don't intend to - but I'm damned if I'm going to sit down and let my hobby go quietly into the night because some marketing numpty got his back of a beermat sums wrong to such disastrous impact. We need to put you on the barricades more often, Jade. It's fairly rare that one sees forum posts of this quality. +1
Inspiration	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:22:00 - [1499] Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... QFT
Alexingeras	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:23:00 - [1500] Originally by: Antihrist Pripravnik Originally by: Reed Tiburon HEY BLUE BARS: Originally by: FunzzeR Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... Quoting this just in case Devs miss it. QFT
Zedah Zoid Adhocracy Incorporated	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:23:00 - [1501] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) This should not be overlooked.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:25:00 - [1502] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 16:26:50 Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) This should not be overlooked. BANK BAILOUT Circa 2008. Yep, he failed then too. Edit: Just to iterate on this OOPS We done ****ed up
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:27:00 - [1503] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. making sure this is on every page from now
Karthwritte	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:29:00 - [1504] Edited by: Karthwritte on 23/06/2011 16:29:21 Lol I got a analogy: eveonline it's like a restaurant, they sell lot of beer and the food its good. Like a good sports bar. Perfect for seeing sports and adults like it to eat meat and chat and laugh. CCP wanted to expand so they served less food for = price to have more $$, and then they used decided they wanted to have more clients JUST LIKE McDonalds so they are making a full playground for kids which take space usually used for tables which means less clients when full and now they though that they should put a ps3 for every screen so when people come they gonna pay for playing the games. Endline? They failed because their regular clients just wanted a good place to eat, chat and drink beer but they saw the restaurant still called eveonline now was for teens than for adults. And teens doesn't go there because it's not McDonalds and they charge a lot for using the ps3. And then EVE closes and CCP opens another restaurant that ended more crappy that they wanted because their $$ income came short. It's sad but again, I got My vision eyes...
ISquishWorms	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:29:00 - [1505] Just confirming I have seen this post and I won't be resubbing either whilst EvE is a great game their greedy future vision with pay to win buttons does little to inspire me to play . Not logged in either since this news broke I have 30ish days left on my account of which I will use to train just in case CCP wake up and do away with this MT cr4p. A friend (not alt) who has just 2 days left on their account who started to play about two months ago after I used the buddy invite also will not be renewing their subscription. There are other games just as fun that you don't even need to pay for sure they have not been updated in a long time or have flashy graphics neither of which are essential for good game play, they also have significantly less bugs and issues. The only way I will be return is if this MT rubbish is scrapped.
Bologna Brains	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:32:00 - [1506] Edited by: Bologna Brains on 23/06/2011 16:32:55 Dust: "...to offset the cost of freeloading spectators Dust will have a nominal cover charge..." (i love it when you speak dirty)" My favorite one thus far; wonder what us capsuleers are called?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:33:00 - [1507] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) Bad sign. A banker at the helm.
Brainless Bimbo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:33:00 - [1508] Originally by: Othran tl;dr were the major holders of stockpiled PLEX to organise in a certain way then CCPs cashflow would be impacted in a non-trivial way (IMHO and I have no knowledge of CCPs current finances). Surely the company could (in fact should) set aside the revenue gained by converting GTC¦s to Plex into an escrow account and earn interest on it until they are utilised, that what they should be doing instead of being short sighted imbecilic greedy ****s. ...... continues overleaf.
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:33:00 - [1509] Originally by: Bologna Brains Dust: "...to offset the cost of freeloading spectators Dust will have a nominal cover charge..." (i love it when you speak dirty)" My favorite one thus far; wonder what us capsuleers are claled? Whiny *****es, or something to that effect, I suppose...
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:34:00 - [1510] Originally by: Bologna Brains Edited by: Bologna Brains on 23/06/2011 16:32:55 Dust: "...to offset the cost of freeloading spectators Dust will have a nominal cover charge..." (i love it when you speak dirty)" My favorite one thus far; wonder what us capsuleers are called? Nice to know that we have been dealing with a company that has nothing but contempt for those who give them money, isn't it? Merge them with SOE and Craptic to form Sony Craptic Control Productions. SCCP
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:35:00 - [1511] Meh, I still don't want to log in.
Shani Mukantagara Amarr Fairlight Corp Rooks and Kings	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:36:00 - [1512] Sucks subbed all of my accounts for a year ;/
Tjarf	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:36:00 - [1513] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Signed
S'qarpium D'igil	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:36:00 - [1514] Posting in the epic thread.
Deimos Wolf Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:37:00 - [1515] I went through different stages of disbelief after the expansion came out. First I thought :" Greedy sobs. How dare you ask 20 Bucks for a virtual piece of cloth?" Then I tried to come up with some explanation. Main difference to most other item stores in other games is, that the wares in it can be purchased via the ingame market and currency. So actually nothing changes. You purchase your plex, exchange it for aurum and then for isk. Nothing changes for the isk for plex buyer. Now the items in the noble store can be purchased. Since you have a currency transition inbetween, there is no need for a single player to invest 4 Plexes into one monocle. Actually few will. You can buy the Noble items on aurum based of plexes of ten or more players, thus creating necessary rarity as the number of incoming plexes and with it aurum is limited. Having said that I still think prices are too steep and ccp ought have put out an explanation beforehand. The above is all fine for me. Where it stops is the notion of game changing items in the store. Wben these come and price relation stays high, then a normal grunt would have to grind too long to get the items. So here one would expect lower rates as the items should not be kept in artificial rarity. Just one more thing to address, the miner and producers. Well this is fairly easy. Just put bpc in the noble store. Everybody gets their share. Just think of it as one more Intermediate step for your plex to take. Nothing really changes. my two cents Deimos
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:38:00 - [1516] 1510 post and climbing. 16:35 UTC. Guestimating blue bars sometime after 18:00 UTC to announce clarifications to be published tomorrow morning. I'll wager #1999 for the blue bars.
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:38:00 - [1517] CCP right about now! -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:38:00 - [1518] Originally by: Deimos Wolf I went through different stages of disbelief after the expansion came out. First I thought :" Greedy sobs. How dare you ask 20 Bucks for a virtual piece of cloth?" Then I tried to come up with some explanation. Main difference to most other item stores in other games is, that the wares in it can be purchased via the ingame market and currency. So actually nothing changes. You purchase your plex, exchange it for aurum and then for isk. Nothing changes for the isk for plex buyer. Now the items in the noble store can be purchased. Since you have a currency transition inbetween, there is no need for a single player to invest 4 Plexes into one monocle. Actually few will. You can buy the Noble items on aurum based of plexes of ten or more players, thus creating necessary rarity as the number of incoming plexes and with it aurum is limited. Having said that I still think prices are too steep and ccp ought have put out an explanation beforehand. The above is all fine for me. Where it stops is the notion of game changing items in the store. Wben these come and price relation stays high, then a normal grunt would have to grind too long to get the items. So here one would expect lower rates as the items should not be kept in artificial rarity. Just one more thing to address, the miner and producers. Well this is fairly easy. Just put bpc in the noble store. Everybody gets their share. Just think of it as one more Intermediate step for your plex to take. Nothing really changes. my two cents Deimos And the Blueprints in the NEX store will be 1 RUN REMAINING COPIES, like the LP store and cost you 200 bucks.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:41:00 - [1519] Originally by: Myra2007 CCP right about now! They're reading threads but they don't give enough of a **** to respond. All they do is lock threads. Thanks for the customer service, CCP.
Zenethalos Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:41:00 - [1520] At first I had no issue with a bit of MT. I even thought I may invest in a plex to pimp out my avatar. I then saw the prices and was p/o'd but realized it is not something that I have to have in order to enjoy the game. I do not like the idea of footing the bill to produce other releases. I also despise the idea of being able to buy power in the form of faction standings/special ammo/mods/ships. Let people play space barbie if they want to sink the extra money into it. Let people pay for stock ships/ammo/mods via plex. I only play about 2 hours a day at best and sometimes after a hefty loss will purchase GTC to recover. It is too early too unsub my two accounts. It is also too early to rage at CCP for now blue bar. This is a large issue that warrants a real response from CCP in the form of a news release/blog release to address our concerns.
Captain Alcatraz Invicta. Rooks and Kings	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:42:00 - [1521] Edited by: Captain Alcatraz on 23/06/2011 16:45:50 Quote: Those same players will buy PLEX without any qualms to get instant access to that ship they just ôneed to have right nowö and they might even go as far as buying a $500 leather jacket that matches the one their avatar is wearing. And all of these expenditures will actually improve their experience of the game and make them feel better about it and about themselves. So wrong, it simply breaks the immersion u tw@ts. Leave psychology 101 in high school, you're disconnected from the playerbase Waiting for official reply before unsubbing
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:42:00 - [1522] Originally by: Miilla Meh, I still don't want to log in. I have had that feeling for like 2 years lol. I've been paying to skill. This patch changes nothing.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:44:00 - [1523] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Miilla Meh, I still don't want to log in. I have had that feeling for like 2 years lol. I've been paying to skill. This patch changes nothing. Such masochism. vOv
Dirk Magnum Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:45:00 - [1524] Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) This should not be overlooked. It is, however, something I'd rather not have known if true. Thanks a lot CCP you've shown me that ignorance really can be bliss
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:45:00 - [1525] Originally by: Bologna Brains Edited by: Bologna Brains on 23/06/2011 16:32:55 Dust: "...to offset the cost of freeloading spectators Dust will have a nominal cover charge..." (i love it when you speak dirty)" My favorite one thus far; wonder what us capsuleers are called? Suckers.
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:45:00 - [1526] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo Originally by: Othran tl;dr were the major holders of stockpiled PLEX to organise in a certain way then CCPs cashflow would be impacted in a non-trivial way (IMHO and I have no knowledge of CCPs current finances). Surely the company could (in fact should) set aside the revenue gained by converting GTC¦s to Plex into an escrow account and earn interest on it until they are utilised, that what they should be doing instead of being short sighted imbecilic greedy ****s. if earning interest on the money gives you higher returns than investing it into your own company then you're doing it wrong. If it doesn't why would you want to do this?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:45:00 - [1527] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Miilla Meh, I still don't want to log in. I have had that feeling for like 2 years lol. I've been paying to skill. This patch changes nothing. Meh, Until all this is sorted out one way or another, I am doing what a company should never want. Browsing COMPETITOR products.
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:47:00 - [1528] Originally by: Tjarf Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Signed nicely worded... +1 _________________________________________________
Pure Tabasco	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:47:00 - [1529] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Miilla Meh, I still don't want to log in. I have had that feeling for like 2 years lol. I've been paying to skill. This patch changes nothing. Meh, Until all this is sorted out one way or another, I am doing what a company should never want. Browsing COMPETITOR products. I am thinking about X-Rebirth you know. I¦m feeling over with MMOs.
Deep Violet	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:47:00 - [1530] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Miilla Meh, I still don't want to log in. I have had that feeling for like 2 years lol. I've been paying to skill. This patch changes nothing. Meh, Until all this is sorted out one way or another, I am doing what a company should never want. Browsing COMPETITOR products. doing that now as well ...sad part is it seems all other spacelike MMOs have MTs already :/
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:48:00 - [1531] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Miilla Meh, I still don't want to log in. I have had that feeling for like 2 years lol. I've been paying to skill. This patch changes nothing. Meh, Until all this is sorted out one way or another, I am doing what a company should never want. Browsing COMPETITOR products. We should fire up a freelancer server. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Janus Talmash Talmash Imports and Exports Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:48:00 - [1532] Originally by: Dirk Magnum Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) This should not be overlooked. It is, however, something I'd rather not have known if true. Thanks a lot CCP you've shown me that ignorance really can be bliss It's true. Hiring a City Group moron, that's a great way of losing your business. ________ Amat victoria curam.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:49:00 - [1533] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 16:51:29 Originally by: Janus Talmash Originally by: Dirk Magnum Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) This should not be overlooked. It is, however, something I'd rather not have known if true. Thanks a lot CCP you've shown me that ignorance really can be bliss It's true. Hiring a City Group moron, that's a great way of losing your business. I have one saying that has ringed true and never failed... BEWARE THE BANKERS! If only we all had enough stock to NOT vote him on the board. EMPLOYEE's of CCP, you have this power in your yearly vote, USE IT, don't be ignorant of the proxy vote. I always loved NOT voting Steve Balmer onto the MSFT board :) But every employee at MSFT has that power, I kept shouting that them why they wernt voting, they didn't give a rats, but went on complaining. If any CCP employee wants to sell their shares privately, I am sure some people on here would buy them just for this reason :)
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:50:00 - [1534] Originally by: Landlady Originally by: leth ghost not far off hitting the 24 hour mark now and still no response, nice way to show you care about your player base !!!!! a hang on they dont they make us try and think they do to milk us lol That's because they are in meetings trying to figure out how to make a buck off of the outrage surrounding this leak :P Yup. Someone (or a bunch of someones) in there is saying "No publicity is bad publicity."
Deimos Wolf Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:53:00 - [1535] Originally by: Miilla And the Blueprints in the NEX store will be 1 RUN REMAINING COPIES, like the LP store and cost you 200 bucks. You just want to rage don't you. You did not even try to comprehend what I wrote. This might be why ccp does not respond. Anything they say will beturned against them. Anyhow. There will be way lower rates on consumables. There is no need for artificial rarity here. I could imagine 1000 run per 10 aur. It is just a way to decrease plexes that's all. They are now stockpiled and need to go. And you won't feel a thing. Because they will be traded for isk as ever before. Just consumed more regularly
akitespero	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:54:00 - [1536] Game advantages should be an integral part of EvE, of gameplay, not something that magically appears whenever you plonk real life euros or dollars. Until now EvE was a game where game advantages were obtained through gameplay. Faction increases required time and commitment, ships had to be built through a long and complex operation requiring many steps and time, ammo had to be savaged or built. CCP had a vision, their aim was to craft a unique space sandbox, a gem of a game, something special, something I was proud to play. Now it seems that EvE is becoming a means to generate more profits, the uniqueness of Eve be damned. CCP's biz dep is betting that the lost subscriptions from disgruntled veterans will be offset by the arrival of masses of new players lured to the new eve. Unless CCP can dispel my fears I'll be joining the ranks of disgruntled veterans. I'll be selling my characters and stuff as my subscription ends, then will donate the resulting isk to whatever relief action CCP promotes next, and then I'll look for something different, unique, to invest my time and cash. I still hope the leaked doc is a fake ...
Marielle Ley	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:54:00 - [1537] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Not something I'm going to make a habit as far as agreeing with Jade Constantine goes, but signed.
Jehvan Sunburnadire The Forgotten Legion Redrum Fleet	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:56:00 - [1538] Edited by: Jehvan Sunburnadire on 23/06/2011 16:56:41 Originally by: Dirk Magnum Originally by: Zedah Zoid Originally by: Brainless Bimbo CCP corporate culture is no longer griefer icelander, its big corporate america, accept it, you have become a revenue input to maximise at every opportunity. Who is the financial man, Joe Gallo, where did he come from: MD at Citigroup 1994 û 2008 (14 years) This should not be overlooked. It is, however, something I'd rather not have known if true. Thanks a lot CCP you've shown me that ignorance really can be bliss Here's his LinkedIn Profile. God knows why anyone at CCP thought it would be a good idea to let someone like this be their CFO. To me... knowing this now just sort of explains everything. I doubt i'll be renewing given the direction they're taking. Lol. Late to the party there... many many responses in the time it took me to verify you could actually click that link >_>
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:56:00 - [1539] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 16:57:00 Originally by: Deimos Wolf Originally by: Miilla And the Blueprints in the NEX store will be 1 RUN REMAINING COPIES, like the LP store and cost you 200 bucks. You just want to rage don't you. You did not even try to comprehend what I wrote. This might be why ccp does not respond. Anything they say will beturned against them. Anyhow. There will be way lower rates on consumables. There is no need for artificial rarity here. I could imagine 1000 run per 10 aur. It is just a way to decrease plexes that's all. They are now stockpiled and need to go. And you won't feel a thing. Because they will be traded for isk as ever before. Just consumed more regularly Until the PLEX start to run dry as people keep breaking them up and use their PLEX for 30 days game time (their true purpose), what if that happens? Your ISK wouldnt buy any AUR, as PLEX is the source. It may not happen for a while until everybody mass dump's their PLEXs and either it is wasted on AUR OR used as game time OR some EXTERNAL item / event. Once the SINK for PLEX starts to drain them, and the FAUCET starts to fill SLOWER than the SINK drains, there is a problem, and Eve will start to BLEED dry. Let's use an a ss anology here, if your a sshole is larger than your food hole, then you got a problem.
Ni'arks Slave	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:57:00 - [1540] Originally by: Marielle Ley Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. /signed
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:57:00 - [1541] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. Drop DUST and tell WoD to get ****ed. Refocus on Eve and get back the churned subscribers who return whenever they fix things via word-of-mouth. Fixed. Too late now. His name was John Turbefield!
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:59:00 - [1542] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 16:51:29 Originally by: Janus Talmash It's true. Hiring a City Group moron, that's a great way of losing your business. I have one saying that has ringed true and never failed... BEWARE THE BANKERS! If only we all had enough stock to NOT vote him on the board. EMPLOYEE's of CCP, you have this power in your yearly vote, USE IT, don't be ignorant of the proxy vote. I always loved NOT voting Steve Balmer onto the MSFT board :) But every employee at MSFT has that power, I kept shouting that them why they wernt voting, they didn't give a rats, but went on complaining. If any CCP employee wants to sell their shares privately, I am sure some people on here would buy them just for this reason :) Thank you, Mojo Nixon <3.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 16:59:00 - [1543] Perhaps this is an omen Thanks to CCP now we can get lives.. :) chokes on the fresh air
Miagi Sans Amarr PURgE-Corp PURgE Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:00:00 - [1544] I may think EVE24 is ****e, but CCP really NEEDS to explain this, if real or not..and if so... God help their souls....
Guttripper Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:00:00 - [1545] Perhaps a "dumb" question - If CCP shut down the Eve server and you had a plex to cash in for a thirty day subscription time, since there would be no game, would CCP be obligated to refund your real life money? I ask because I remember long ago before this current crop of marketing devs took over the game the (original?) devs saw Eve with a ten year life cycle. With the game eight plus years old now, voiding out all the potential ideas for 2012, 2013, 2014 that occasionally get dropped onto the players in blogs and that ilk, could CCP be worried about the sheer number of plexes sold and held in private hands? If CCP has intentions of phasing Eve out in a few years in hopes of replacing that game with that past fad of vampires of Twilight movie fame game in the works, what better way to scuttle the plex market that to offer trinkets for ridiculously expensive prices? The bean counters may be in panic mode and pray to whatever god they pray to that the player base is dumb enough to cash in plex so if push came to shove, CCP would not be stuck having to refund a mountain of plexes. Just a thought on why the game is going as it has gone now.
Deimos Wolf Amarr Hedion University	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:00:00 - [1546] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 16:57:00 Originally by: Deimos Wolf Originally by: Miilla And the Blueprints in the NEX store will be 1 RUN REMAINING COPIES, like the LP store and cost you 200 bucks. You just want to rage don't you. You did not even try to comprehend what I wrote. This might be why ccp does not respond. Anything they say will beturned against them. Anyhow. There will be way lower rates on consumables. There is no need for artificial rarity here. I could imagine 1000 run per 10 aur. It is just a way to decrease plexes that's all. They are now stockpiled and need to go. And you won't feel a thing. Because they will be traded for isk as ever before. Just consumed more regularly Until the PLEX start to run dry as people keep breaking them up and use their PLEX for 30 days game time (their true purpose), what if that happens? Your ISK wouldnt buy any AUR, as PLEX is the source. It may not happen for a while until everybody mass dump's their PLEXs and either it is wasted on AUR OR used as game time OR some EXTERNAL item / event. Once the SINK for PLEX starts to drain them, and the FAUCET starts to fill SLOWER than the SINK drains, there is a problem, and Eve will start to BLEED dry. Let's use an a ss anology here, if your a sshole is larger than your food hole, then you got a problem. And thar is the point where ccp can stabilize on their whim by adjustment of the plex to aur exchange rate. So steady cash flow and plex drain. plus new items. this could be the most painless implementation of an ingane store
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:01:00 - [1547] Originally by: Guttripper If CCP shut down the Eve server and you had a plex to cash in for a thirty day subscription time, since there would be no game, would CCP be obligated to refund your real life money? No. PLEX are ingame items that are owned by CCP, as all other ingame items.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:03:00 - [1548] Originally by: Guttripper Perhaps a "dumb" question - If CCP shut down the Eve server and you had a plex to cash in for a thirty day subscription time, since there would be no game, would CCP be obligated to refund your real life money? I ask because I remember long ago before this current crop of marketing devs took over the game the (original?) devs saw Eve with a ten year life cycle. With the game eight plus years old now, voiding out all the potential ideas for 2012, 2013, 2014 that occasionally get dropped onto the players in blogs and that ilk, could CCP be worried about the sheer number of plexes sold and held in private hands? If CCP has intentions of phasing Eve out in a few years in hopes of replacing that game with that past fad of vampires of Twilight movie fame game in the works, what better way to scuttle the plex market that to offer trinkets for ridiculously expensive prices? The bean counters may be in panic mode and pray to whatever god they pray to that the player base is dumb enough to cash in plex so if push came to shove, CCP would not be stuck having to refund a mountain of plexes. Just a thought on why the game is going as it has gone now. Get somebody versed in Icelandic law.. Perhaps somebody can know somebody and tell us... CCP have an EULA limitation on liability clause in thre but that is WORTHLESS because it is effectively signing away your rights. Thus that clause is unenforceable. The law states what liability they have. Is CCP registered as a "limited liability" company? If so, then you cannot go after the director's assets, if not, go for it :) PS: I want their Lambo's.
Jiseinoku	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:04:00 - [1549] Nice. A banker from Citigroup. Just what we need in addition to game devs that spout microtransactions for in-game advantages as the AwesomeÖ future. Hooray.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:04:00 - [1550] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. Drop DUST and tell WoD to get ****ed. Refocus on Eve and get back the churned subscribers who return whenever they fix things via word-of-mouth. Fixed. Too late now. Would you be so kind as to link me your gaming suggestions Dr. B? vOv
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:04:00 - [1551] Originally by: Miagi Sans I may think EVE24 is ****e, but CCP really NEEDS to explain this, if real or not..and if so... God help their souls.... It's not fake. This would have been the fist thread closed had it not been true. Although the moderators are busy closing down about every other thread on the forums. Traitors. You know, that's the best word I have for CCP after reading that newsletter.
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:05:00 - [1552] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Let us say, just hypothetically, that CCP are in a bit of financial trouble. EVE is the current cash producing product, Dust's dev costs went mental & WoD is taking longer than anticipated. Hypothetically you understand would you of prefered them to up the subs cost for a dollar or so a month or a $60 monacle? Curious is all. Drop DUST and tell WoD to get ****ed. Refocus on Eve and get back the churned subscribers who return whenever they fix things via word-of-mouth. Fixed. Too late now. They bought White Wolf in order to develop WoD. It's them now. DUST is part of the company as well. It's not "they" to them. Eve's not a focus, it's a source of revenue while they develop their core products.
Jehvan Sunburnadire The Forgotten Legion Redrum Fleet	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:05:00 - [1553] Originally by: Saving Face No. PLEX are ingame items that are owned by CCP, as all other ingame items. No. Plex are best thought of as equivalent to promisorry notes or bearer-bonds. They are a loan to CCP in return for something that entitles the bearer to 30 days of game time. As has already been stated in this thread, it would be interesting to see a test case regarding the 'limited liabilities' that companies like to put in their EULAs though.
Terianna Eri Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:06:00 - [1554] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. PLUS FCKING ONE +1 ________________ Originally by: CCP Incognito PS the "time to P*nis" is the shortest time recorded in human history. :)
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:06:00 - [1555] Originally by: Deimos Wolf Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 16:57:00 Originally by: Deimos Wolf Originally by: Miilla And the Blueprints in the NEX store will be 1 RUN REMAINING COPIES, like the LP store and cost you 200 bucks. You just want to rage don't you. You did not even try to comprehend what I wrote. This might be why ccp does not respond. Anything they say will beturned against them. Anyhow. There will be way lower rates on consumables. There is no need for artificial rarity here. I could imagine 1000 run per 10 aur. It is just a way to decrease plexes that's all. They are now stockpiled and need to go. And you won't feel a thing. Because they will be traded for isk as ever before. Just consumed more regularly Until the PLEX start to run dry as people keep breaking them up and use their PLEX for 30 days game time (their true purpose), what if that happens? Your ISK wouldnt buy any AUR, as PLEX is the source. It may not happen for a while until everybody mass dump's their PLEXs and either it is wasted on AUR OR used as game time OR some EXTERNAL item / event. Once the SINK for PLEX starts to drain them, and the FAUCET starts to fill SLOWER than the SINK drains, there is a problem, and Eve will start to BLEED dry. Let's use an a ss anology here, if your a sshole is larger than your food hole, then you got a problem. And thar is the point where ccp can stabilize on their whim by adjustment of the plex to aur exchange rate. So steady cash flow and plex drain. plus new items. this could be the most painless implementation of an ingane store Yes but not with the item's and NEX features suggest in that document, sure put panties and bra's on there, I dont care, I find it funny. But put that other stuff on there, its too big a poision a pill to take. Also, their current prices and exchange rate, is a joke. It is obviously not working.
Jonathan Malcom Gallente Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:06:00 - [1556] Edited by: Jonathan Malcom on 23/06/2011 17:06:13 Sig test. Please ignore. Edit: Failure. :-( http://hosted.corelicorp.net/ceo.png
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:08:00 - [1557] Originally by: Jonathan Malcom Edited by: Jonathan Malcom on 23/06/2011 17:06:13 Sig test. Please ignore. Edit: Failure. :-( Learn to use the PREVIEW checkbox? I know CCP removed LEARNING SKILLS, but comon?
Ronaldo Carrare RR Financial Services	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:09:00 - [1558] Posting because this thread has to stay up, I am mad and angry and butthurt and I think CCP are morans.
The Blind One	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:09:00 - [1559] Edited by: The Blind One on 23/06/2011 17:09:06
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:09:00 - [1560] Edited by: Othran on 23/06/2011 17:10:27 Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire No. Plex are best thought of as equivalent to promisorry notes or bearer-bonds. They are a loan to CCP in return for something that entitles the bearer to 30 days of game time. As has already been stated in this thread, it would be interesting to see a test case regarding the 'limited liabilities' that companies like to put in their EULAs though. I'm afraid you are seriously out of date. While PLEX started with the status you seem to think it still has, CCP changed it to a full in-game item last summer. As an in-game item CCP own it, not you. Edit - if you have it reverse redeemed then that might be a legal argument that would work, but PLEX is nailed down, CCP just want to get rid of the stockpile.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:09:00 - [1561] CCP HAS RESPONDED! http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535591 Now WTF are you supposed to say to that...
Jeffor Selectus Pravus Lupus	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:10:00 - [1562] Any person who has a tiny clue about marketing knows that it is easier to retain old customers than gaining new ones. I am not sure how this applies to this situation but I am fairly sure it does somehow.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:10:00 - [1563] Is any of this affecting the PLEX prices? If that gets ehm DOUBLED, that would be a problem for CCP right? :)
Jehvan Sunburnadire The Forgotten Legion Redrum Fleet	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:10:00 - [1564] Originally by: Othran Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire No. Plex are best thought of as equivalent to promisorry notes or bearer-bonds. They are a loan to CCP in return for something that entitles the bearer to 30 days of game time. As has already been stated in this thread, it would be interesting to see a test case regarding the 'limited liabilities' that companies like to put in their EULAs though. I'm afraid you are seriously out of date. While PLEX started with the status you seem to think it still has, CCP changed it to a full in-game item last summer. As an in-game item CCP own it, not you. Thanks for the info, I stand corrected!
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:11:00 - [1565] Originally by: Reed Tiburon CCP HAS RESPONDED! http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535591 Now WTF are you supposed to say to that... Not a real response. We need to wait for their PR department to ok an official statement. Im sure forum mods arent allowed to say a word without their concent.
Nikita Alterana Risen Angels	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:11:00 - [1566] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. /signed Nikita's Graphic Arts Studio
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:11:00 - [1567] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Miagi Sans I may think EVE24 is **e, but CCP really NEEDS to explain this, if real or not..and if so... God help their souls.... It's not fake. This would have been the fist thread closed had it not been true. Although the moderators are busy closing down about every other thread on the forums. Traitors. You know, that's the best word I have for CCP after reading that newsletter. True or not they have to act. They will take a large loss from this. 1.All the people who really just can't run cq. 2.All the people quitting because of that doc. 3.All the people who wont join eve for the simple reason that it is being bashed on quite a few gaming sites. All in all this was a head shot to them. Normally I would feel bad but they ignored us long enough and I asked myself.."do I really need this game?"..."is it even fun anymore?". Answer is no. For me it's little stuff like hybrids for example along with hundreds of other fixes people have been begging for while they plot how to bull** us. Maybe now they will wake up and see we are fed up.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:11:00 - [1568] Originally by: Reed Tiburon CCP HAS RESPONDED! http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535591 Now WTF are you supposed to say to that... "Thanks for the kind words." I bet they're loving those, and totally ignoring the rest of us, as usual. Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
T0KER	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:12:00 - [1569] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Miagi Sans I may think EVE24 is ****e, but CCP really NEEDS to explain this, if real or not..and if so... God help their souls.... It's not fake. This would have been the fist thread closed had it not been true. Although the moderators are busy closing down about every other thread on the forums. Traitors. You know, that's the best word I have for CCP after reading that newsletter. this
Sig Sour	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:12:00 - [1570] Originally by: Jade Constantine The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. well, what have we then?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:12:00 - [1571] Originally by: Jeffor Any person who has a tiny clue about marketing knows that it is easier to retain old customers than gaining new ones. I am not sure how this applies to this situation but I am fairly sure it does somehow. CCP spitfire always answers questions that I give so I have no beef with him :P (yet)
Jehvan Sunburnadire The Forgotten Legion Redrum Fleet	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:13:00 - [1572] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Originally by: Reed Tiburon CCP HAS RESPONDED! http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535591 Now WTF are you supposed to say to that... "Thanks for the kind words." I bet they're loving those, and totally ignoring the rest of us, as usual. More likely there's been a decree from upon high to not comment on this thread. BTDT when the last.fm site relaunched in 2008. Lots of **ed users, and ed staff, and none of us could say a damn thing due to management. It's a **ty situation for any CCPer who actually cares to be in.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:13:00 - [1573] We should make a new thread with our demands. I know one person had listed them very nicely, but I can't find the posts in this threadnaught... Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:14:00 - [1574] Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire Thanks for the info, I stand corrected! No worries. FWIW I said "money problems" instantly on vent when they did the change. I suspect "investment problems" would have been nearer the mark.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:15:00 - [1575] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor We should make a new thread with our demands. I know one person had listed them very nicely, but I can't find the posts in this threadnaught... I think that much is obvious without creating a new thread: Death to the MT push. vOv
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:15:00 - [1576] Originally by: Judicator Saturnius Originally by: Constantinus Maximus .... Too late now. Would you be so kind as to link me your gaming suggestions Dr. B? If you haven't dived into Dwarf Fortress, it's definately worth at least a short swim. Very tough/complex game, can take awhile before you get all the pieces of the mechanics that you need to survive. Get the Lazy Newb Pack which includes tilesets and things to make it easier to use. His name was John Turbefield!
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:16:00 - [1577] Originally by: Jeffor Any person who has a tiny clue about marketing knows that it is easier to retain old customers than gaining new ones. I am not sure how this applies to this situation but I am fairly sure it does somehow. Not to mention that dissatisfied customers are something like 10 times more likely to tell others about their experience than satisfied ones. That's what brought down SOE, despite their media and marketing blitz promoting the NGE, in which they called us the "vocal minority", word of mouth overcame more than $1 million of advertising.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:16:00 - [1578] "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:16:00 - [1579] Originally by: Judicator Saturnius Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor We should make a new thread with our demands. I know one person had listed them very nicely, but I can't find the posts in this threadnaught... I think that much is obvious without creating a new thread: Death to the MT push. ^^ This. Kill MT and I will happily go about my normal EVE business, blowing up other internet spaceships.
Scortched Merc	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:17:00 - [1580] I already have enough issues fitting internet spaceships... I made my toon... took my pic... I'll be damned if I'm going to try to fit clothing or whatever to me again... thats just the way I am. Posted to a threadnaut! One less thing on the list before I die.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:21:00 - [1581] Meh, I want to log in, but I just can't.
Janus Konor Amarr Supercarrier Aggression Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:21:00 - [1582] Im not reading 52 pages of posts. So I will just say this for me. Dear CCP.. if you are thinking of MT in the future.. to bolster income, I ask this. Please do not do anything that will effect game mechanics. Skins, yes.. Clothes.. Yes.. Tattoos.. Yes.. Anything that effects the game mechanics.. NO. Selling faster or pre-determined SP.. NO!! Special ships? NO!! As for the prices.. Lets be realistic.. Nothing you can buy should exceed your monthly game playing cost, since none of it should effect game play. How can you justify a single item in game that you can buy in MT that is non functional flashy item, to cost more then the right to use your copywrighted and 8+ years in making Game code that we all love? Im not a business guy, so Im sorry if I dont see the advantage of this in short term, however, I think in the long term you will lose more customer base income then CCP can afford, and risk your Company. I know I will not be playing Eve 5 minutes after you make MT effect game mechanics. Which saddens me.. at 74 mil SP, and 5 years in game I feel I have a vested interest in EVE, and hate to give it up for your GREED! Which also means you will also lose a Dust Player, in me.. and my FPS shooter friends who have already said they would play DUST to help my EVE corporation/alliance.
Tamahra Gallente Apina. United Pod Service	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:21:00 - [1583] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Jeffor Any person who has a tiny clue about marketing knows that it is easier to retain old customers than gaining new ones. I am not sure how this applies to this situation but I am fairly sure it does somehow. Not to mention that dissatisfied customers are something like 10 times more likely to tell others about their experience than satisfied ones. That's what brought down SOE, despite their media and marketing blitz promoting the NGE, in which they called us the "vocal minority", word of mouth overcame more than $1 million of advertising. NGE was only one out of several SOE failcascades. Another big failcascade was EQ2. And i see similarities to CCP: CCP think of Eve as their golden goose now, to fund their newer projects, where they put their true development power into. I have seen this at Everquest 1 - Everquest 2, and Sony failed so hard with it and screw their playerbase so badly, i have no interest in going through that a 2nd time.
Republica Winder	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:21:00 - [1584] Originally by: Miilla Meh, I want to log in, but I just can't. Since I'm canceled anyway, no need to keep the client on my PC. Time to free up some space for a new game.
Cpt Wrongway	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:22:00 - [1585] After thinking about it for a long while I've decided that maybe it's best for this to happen. Think of it a couple of ways; CCP is a growing company and they're doing all this to make profit, that's all corporations exist for. Now how do you make more proft and gain new customers when the old guard players have such a heads up on PvP and dominate the SP difference. You keep the core game but offer the weaker willed or more impatient new players the ability to have more of an edge in the existing world. Of course there have to be limits, maybe if you pay for boosts it's only good upto a certain level of SP and or only works on NPCs if we're talking about fancy ammo or something, and the NeX isn't a market killer, people will still buy your PLEXs and there will still be demand for more and CCP will still make proft. But CCP has to listen to us still and make a few accomodations. Hanger view option, etc.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:23:00 - [1586] Originally by: MrSteack Originally by: Reed Tiburon CCP HAS RESPONDED! http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535591 Now WTF are you supposed to say to that... Not a real response. We need to wait for their PR department to ok an official statement. Im sure forum mods arent allowed to say a word without their concent. CCP Spitfire says "Thanks for the kind words," and that is supposed to be a response to what exactly!? Certainly nothing pertaining to this mess. --
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:23:00 - [1587] Originally by: Janus Konor Im not reading 52 pages of posts. So I will just say this for me. Dear CCP.. if you are thinking of MT in the future.. to bolster income, I ask this. Please do not do anything that will effect game mechanics. Skins, yes.. Clothes.. Yes.. Tattoos.. Yes.. Anything that effects the game mechanics.. NO. Selling faster or pre-determined SP.. NO!! Special ships? NO!! As for the prices.. Lets be realistic.. Nothing you can buy should exceed your monthly game playing cost, since none of it should effect game play. How can you justify a single item in game that you can buy in MT that is non functional flashy item, to cost more then the right to use your copywrighted and 8+ years in making Game code that we all love? Im not a business guy, so Im sorry if I dont see the advantage of this in short term, however, I think in the long term you will lose more customer base income then CCP can afford, and risk your Company. I know I will not be playing Eve 5 minutes after you make MT effect game mechanics. Which saddens me.. at 74 mil SP, and 5 years in game I feel I have a vested interest in EVE, and hate to give it up for your GREED! Which also means you will also lose a Dust Player, in me.. and my FPS shooter friends who have already said they would play DUST to help my EVE corporation/alliance. The prices show one clear thing, they are DESPERATE to DRAIN the SINK of PLEX's BADLY URGENTY.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:24:00 - [1588] Originally by: Nikita Alterana Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. /signed
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:25:00 - [1589] Quick question.... With CCP gone, how will the Russian mafia launder their money? More dating sites and mules forwarding WesternUnion? His name was John Turbefield!
Ana Vyr Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1590] CCP, you guys made a real mess here. The naked greed in that article is pretty disgusting. Most EvE players don't give a rats arse about Dust or WoD, yet now we find out we are being milked so you can proceed with those two projects. Nice. Well, you reap what you sow.
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1591] This is the future of this game: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." And this is what you mean to CCP. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1592] If CCP now this quickly change the PLEX AURUM exchange rate or change the NEX prices, those that bought into this MicroTransaction on Day 0, GET A BIG HARD KICK IN THE TEETH. Now, would they buy more if that happens? I would think / hope they would think twice about it.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:27:00 - [1593] Originally by: Cpt Wrongway After thinking about it for a long while I've decided that maybe it's best for this to happen. Think of it a couple of ways; CCP is a growing company and they're doing all this to make profit, that's all corporations exist for. Now how do you make more proft and gain new customers when the old guard players have such a heads up on PvP and dominate the SP difference. You keep the core game but offer the weaker willed or more impatient new players the ability to have more of an edge in the existing world. Of course there have to be limits, maybe if you pay for boosts it's only good upto a certain level of SP and or only works on NPCs if we're talking about fancy ammo or something, and the NeX isn't a market killer, people will still buy your PLEXs and there will still be demand for more and CCP will still make proft. You poor deluded man! You think this is good for the noobs? Perhaps this is a good time to quote Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players. --
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1594] Edited by: MrSteack on 23/06/2011 17:28:46 Fivteen hundred posts and not a single rick roll. This is serious Edit: Devblog posted on the issue
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1595] Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire Originally by: Othran Originally by: Jehvan Sunburnadire No. Plex are best thought of as equivalent to promisorry notes or bearer-bonds. They are a loan to CCP in return for something that entitles the bearer to 30 days of game time. As has already been stated in this thread, it would be interesting to see a test case regarding the 'limited liabilities' that companies like to put in their EULAs though. I'm afraid you are seriously out of date. While PLEX started with the status you seem to think it still has, CCP changed it to a full in-game item last summer. As an in-game item CCP own it, not you. Thanks for the info, I stand corrected! You perhaps missed the edit : Edit - if you have it reverse redeemed then that might be a legal argument that would work, but PLEX is nailed down, CCP just want to get rid of the stockpile.
Planetary Genocide Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1596] I'm logged in but autopiloting at the moment. I might even turn to afk mining, and anyone who has ever brought up the subject of mining in front of me knows that I **ing hate it. As much as I'd like to think that this will never happen, I am preparing a plan to carry out if (when) it does... I think I'll follow the example of people like Paul Clavet and trade all my assets in for PLEX to donate to a plex for good drive. Also, this kinda reminds me of the backstory where all the empires recognize that Sansha's a threat and they kinda get together and ** them up... if anything can bring all the nullsec alliances together, it's saving the game that we used to love.
Amy Darkfire	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1597] Edited by: Amy Darkfire on 23/06/2011 17:28:40 CCP is pulling a John Smedley.. this is their version of a "New Game Experience". ah well The Old Republic is due later in the year :D .l..
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1598] Edited by: Jade Constantine on 23/06/2011 17:28:44 Originally by: Abelard Nightbringer Quote: Quoting Jade Constantine's best post ever... this is his best? Ill reword it for him Please don't play silly games with reinterpreting the very simple argument I am making. Quote: 1. Im too stupid to have cargo open when i dock, or double click the ship to open cargo from ships window. oh, and right clicking - activate ship is too hard on my brain The argument is that this expansion has in effect taken away functionality that we've played with for years now. Needing to run multiple clients with CQ turned off means we get a dead wallpaper that cannot be interracted with and does not show the ship we are piloting. It is not a complicated argument. Quote: 2. Speculation of Doom, wow, the world is ending, just not right now, maybe later I am making reference to what purports to be a CCP newsletter that has not yet been disavowed by CCP. In that newsletter a lead producer of the game is speaking about introducing micropayments for gameplay boosts and advantages and strongly advocating FTP (free to play) style micropay conventions into a (pay to play) PTP subscription based game and that means he is looking for a way to charge us TWICE for content we have already paid for. You can mischaracterize my comments as doom-mongering by all means but do not claim I am not referencing a document in the public domain that has not yet been disavowed by CCP. Quote: 3. Speculation of Doom, 6+ months from now, based on actions that have not happened yet. I am too stupid to comprehend how to use isk to buy things from the noble store even if they existed (WHICH THEY DONT YET), like in the LP store that for some reason i cant complain about right now. I am just too hard headed to understand that new things in the noble store are just as attainable to anyone else thru isk, therefore i think i am being held back. I own a Titan in this game. I am not short of isk. But I do not like the way the Noble store messes with the sandbox in denying the player base of eve the chance to manufacture the things that will be for sale in the market. I think this is short-circuiting the industrial side of Eve even as "vanity items" but does represent a terrible slide into greedy money-grubbing microsanctioning that has no place whatsoever in a pay to play game. If ccp want more money they should just put the subscription up and stop messing with the essential balance of the sandbox that keeps this game healthy and viable. Join the Revolution!
Io Koval Gallente T.R.I.A.D	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:28:00 - [1599] Edited by: Io Koval on 23/06/2011 17:28:55 whoops. Ignore.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:29:00 - [1600] Originally by: Miilla I always loved NOT voting Steve Balmer blue badge ftw My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Shivalla Gallente Financial Removal THE SPACE P0LICE	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:30:00 - [1601] CCP just became the biggest griefer in EVE. Forget about Orphanage, or any other silly pirates etc. This amount tears produced in such a short timespan must be somewhat of a record. But truth to be told, these tears might be too salty and too numerous. For even CCP.
Misanth RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:30:00 - [1602] Originally by: Marielle Ley Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Not something I'm going to make a habit as far as agreeing with Jade Constantine goes, but signed. I feel dirty for agreeing with Jade, but for once, it was quite well written too. +1 -
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:30:00 - [1603] Edited by: Cyber Duck on 23/06/2011 17:33:51 Originally by: Cyber Duck CCP 1st Post Number guess = 1549 :p Well... I lost this bet... Edit: That post was all the way back in the mid 500's.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:31:00 - [1604] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 17:32:02 Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Miilla I always loved NOT voting Steve Balmer blue badge ftw A lower numbered blue to be exact :P which is before the CSP bull****. :)
Po3tank Amarr Basgerin Pirate	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:33:00 - [1605] So...ya... good going ccp way to **** up EvE also the door is very nice, thank you. [orange]Your signature is too large. Please resize it to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:33:00 - [1606] Originally by: Miilla A lower numbered blue to be exact :P which is before the CSP bull****. :) Turned mine in years ago, not had a real job since My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:35:00 - [1607] this thread may get too 100,000 views in 24 hours
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:36:00 - [1608] I think the appropriate question now is: How long will they keep asking for a sub fee when they have so many far-reaching MT schemes in place? The games they seem to want to emulate are in large part F2P with an emphasis on MT. Had they stated EVE would be F2P before this storm they might have won over at least a few players who are ok with being second-class so long as the game is free. In this model, paying once just to have the luxury of logging in and twice to stay competitive, you really have nobody that's happy. Subscriber/anti-mt players are unhappy about the gameplay MT advantages, the F2P/pro-mt potential-players are not going to sign on for something that isn't F2P. They literally took the worst of both worlds and combined the two. vOv
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:37:00 - [1609] CCP & CCP Soundwave: I fart in your general direction! Good day, sirs.
Vasiliy Jopodirkin	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:37:00 - [1610] His name was John Turbefield!
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:38:00 - [1611] So... it's just turned 5:30pm in iceland, end of their working day, the day after their internal newsletter was leaked... and still no word... guess we'll be here another 24 hours
Terianna Eri Senex Legio Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:38:00 - [1612] Oh, and: ________________ Originally by: CCP Incognito PS the "time to P*nis" is the shortest time recorded in human history. :)
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:39:00 - [1613] Originally by: leth ghost this thread may get too 100,000 views in 24 hours We even beat this thread :) http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532949
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:40:00 - [1614] Originally by: Cyber Duck So... it's just turned 5:30pm in iceland, end of their working day, the day after their internal newsletter was leaked... and still no word... guess we'll be here another 24 hours The burnings will now recommence: Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:41:00 - [1615] fifty four page threadnought and not a single blue bar? I can't believe that even CCP couldn't figure out how absolutely **ing **ed the entire EVE community would be over this...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:42:00 - [1616] The people who bought monacles are crying they dont want the price to be LOWERED lol http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535648 BURN BURN
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:42:00 - [1617] That "Your characters will be stored safely" is bull****. They have no policy on it apart from saying they may one day delete them. His name was John Turbefield!
Audelyn Xiao	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:43:00 - [1618] Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. While it will have an effect on the supplier side of the market--depending on what CCP sells--six months ago I could spend my local currency and buy both an Thanatos and a pilot to sit in it, if I had so chosen. Clearly, money for non-vanity items has not killed every game that has ever tried it: this one.
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:43:00 - [1619] Originally by: Cyber Duck So... it's just turned 5:30pm in iceland, end of their working day, the day after their internal newsletter was leaked... and still no word... guess we'll be here another 24 hours If this is as big of a cluster**** as it seems to be, I wouldn't be surprised they're still in the same all day long emergency-all-hands-on-deck management meeting trying to find a way to spin, mitigate, damage control, sweep under the rug, backpedal, fix or somehow get a grip...
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:43:00 - [1620] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus That "Your characters will be stored safely" is bull****. They have no policy on it apart from saying they may one day delete them. More likely to hold them for future sale. I wonder how much ARUM cash they'll get for my 9 characters, most of which are in excess of 90m sp.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:44:00 - [1621] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus That "Your characters will be stored safely" is bull****. They have no policy on it apart from saying they may one day delete them. Good, so if we cancel they get insta deleted? Then that's another reason not to return, NAIL HAMMER COFFIN.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:45:00 - [1622] Edited by: Carmine Lady on 23/06/2011 17:45:48 http://vimeo.com/21362582 sums up my feelings
Pandadora	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:45:00 - [1623] Originally by: Eliniale (ow snap, i'm female as well. (is it possible for two females in eve to have children) Sure, 3,99$
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:46:00 - [1624] Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No they don't.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:48:00 - [1625] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No they don't. Oh wow, someone is still clinging to the white-knight "fake," story. I'll never know how some people can be that gullable.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:49:00 - [1626] Originally by: Sakura Zendragon If this is as big of a cluster** as it seems to be, I wouldn't be surprised they're still in the same all day long emergency-all-hands-on-deck management meeting trying to find a way to spin, mitigate, damage control, sweep under the rug, backpedal, fix or somehow get a grip... It's worse then that. They haven't got past denial phase in their own heads. Probably a phone call or two with "just ***in again, whatever" His name was John Turbefield!
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:50:00 - [1627] Respect guys, page 55 already, and no answer yet, must be quite a fun ride at CCP offices atm.
Iulia Badr Marinela	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:50:00 - [1628] Originally by: Audelyn Xiao Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. While it will have an effect on the supplier side of the market--depending on what CCP sells--six months ago I could spend my local currency and buy both an Thanatos and a pilot to sit in it, if I had so chosen. Clearly, money for non-vanity items has not killed every game that has ever tried it: this one. You forgot that you can buy Aurum ships Soon (TM)!! Enjoy it!
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:51:00 - [1629] I dont mind pay for extras or pay per month, EVE has a server and they need money for maintaince/development however I wont pay both and please bear in mind CCP that SWTOR is out in a few months. EVE is a amazing game and is built not around pvp like many think but around it's market, pvp is the main mechanic for removing items from the game aka removing isk and at the same time increasing demand as the dead guys needs new ship etc. The market is a huge part of EVE and having MT to buy in-game items would have a disastrous effect on the market, it would reduce demand for market goods which means ships/mods will be worth less and right down the line everyone makes less credits, as the minerals/ores they are made from will be worth less. If they plan on selling elite items that cant be made in game T4 that would be terrible as it would make 2 tiers of players those with more cash and those with less, which is ok in something in Dark orbit but in that game you aren't paying subs, expecting us to pay both subs and MT to remain competitive is a step too far. Is this report fake or real? If its real was it released to test the waters with the playerbase? Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:52:00 - [1630] Originally by: Iulia Badr Marinela Originally by: Audelyn Xiao Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. While it will have an effect on the supplier side of the market--depending on what CCP sells--six months ago I could spend my local currency and buy both an Thanatos and a pilot to sit in it, if I had so chosen. Clearly, money for non-vanity items has not killed every game that has ever tried it: this one. You forgot that you can buy Aurum ships Soon (TM)!! Enjoy it! Acutally you just submit your current ship and BUY THE PAINTWORK. TrueCoatÖ (google it :) )
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:52:00 - [1631] Originally by: Miilla Good, so if we cancel they get insta deleted? Not insta-delete but they have vocalised that they may one day have to delete old ones. Can't remember where, fanfest video or something about databases. Either way there is zero "digital legacy" policy or any kind of commitment to maintain the character data. His name was John Turbefield!
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:52:00 - [1632] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No they don't. Oh wow, someone is still clinging to the white-knight "fake," story. I'll never know how some people can be that gullable. No, he's saying they don't (know money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it.). In other words, he's essentially saying greed has blinded them. Heck, I even upgraded my sig to the effect. :) -- "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:53:00 - [1633] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. +1
Jennifer Nardieu	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:53:00 - [1634] Edited by: Jennifer Nardieu on 23/06/2011 17:53:43 I would love for this to be the meta-game to end all metagaming. Goons / Test releasing realistic propaganda and information to the press, causing the max exodus of subscribed accounts. It'd be a beautiful thing and they really will have "won" EVE. However what I fear is that it's all too true. Do not go gently into that good night... for CCP will bend you over and have their way with you.
HoboWithAShip	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:53:00 - [1635] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Respect guys, page 55 already, and no answer yet, must be quite a fun ride at CCP offices atm. You've gotta be shting me, right? I went to sleep, knowing that CCP would have at least released something by the time I got up. You're telling me that they haven't said ANYTHING?! What the **.
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:54:00 - [1636] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Sakura Zendragon If this is as big of a cluster** as it seems to be, I wouldn't be surprised they're still in the same all day long emergency-all-hands-on-deck management meeting trying to find a way to spin, mitigate, damage control, sweep under the rug, backpedal, fix or somehow get a grip... It's worse then that. They haven't got past denial phase in their own heads. Probably a phone call or two with "just *in again, whatever" IMHO, if they were in denial, we'd probably have gotten some lame devblog already about how they are just "throwing ideas around", "having a rich internal exchange of ideas", "nothing is set in stone" or something to that effect, thinking that would pacify things. But then again, maybe I'm just hoping they actually have ** themselves over this and might actually come to their senses...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:54:00 - [1637] Originally by: Junkie Babe I dont mind pay for extras or pay per month, EVE has a server and they need money for maintaince/development however I wont pay both and please bear in mind CCP that SWTOR is out in a few months. EVE is a amazing game and is built not around pvp like many think but around it's market, pvp is the main mechanic for removing items from the game aka removing isk and at the same time increasing demand as the dead guys needs new ship etc. The market is a huge part of EVE and having MT to buy in-game items would have a disastrous effect on the market, it would reduce demand for market goods which means ships/mods will be worth less and right down the line everyone makes less credits, as the minerals/ores they are made from will be worth less. If they plan on selling elite items that cant be made in game T4 that would be terrible as it would make 2 tiers of players those with more cash and those with less, which is ok in something in Dark orbit but in that game you aren't paying subs, expecting us to pay both subs and MT to remain competitive is a step too far. Is this report fake or real? If its real was it released to test the waters with the playerbase? You don't understand, the MT stuff is NOT to fund the EVE CLUSTER. It is to FUND their WoD and DUST products and every other product , THAT IS NOT EVE. Face it, we have all just been MonacledÖ by CCP.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:56:00 - [1638] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 17:57:41 meh I still don't want to log on
Sanya Lyss	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:56:00 - [1639] Still no answer from CCP ? Oh they wont bother probably, we customers are cattle for them that should be milked after all
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:57:00 - [1640] it would be great if ccp just came out with U MAD
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:57:00 - [1641] Originally by: Miilla Face it, we have all just been MonacledÖ by CCP. Always fun to witness the day a new meme is born.
Captain Alcatraz Invicta. Rooks and Kings	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:57:00 - [1642] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No they don't.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:58:00 - [1643] Originally by: Sanya Lyss Oh they wont bother probably, we customers are cattle for them that should be milked after all Mooooooooooooo My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:58:00 - [1644] Originally by: Sanya Lyss Still no answer from CCP ? Oh they wont bother probably, we customers are cattle for them that should be milked after all Even a cow has to be fed every once in a while. Best not forget that, CCP. -- "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:58:00 - [1645] Most likely they're still hoping that this fire will die out, and if they respond it'll be like trying to put out a fire with gasoline. What has me wondering is, why haven't they responded to any of the articles written on the what? 10 different gaming websites? On a side note I think this is the single largest threadnaught on the EVE forums.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:59:00 - [1646] Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose!
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:59:00 - [1647] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 18:01:12 Originally by: Sakura Zendragon IMHO, if they were in denial, we'd probably have gotten some lame devblog already about how they are just "throwing ideas around" No no.... I mean in denial like a mother who just lost her child. Silent. Shocked. Unable to process thoughts. Complete and total breakdown. edit: JADE! give me a word for it :-) His name was John Turbefield!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 17:59:00 - [1648] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Most likely they're still hoping that this fire will die out, and if they respond it'll be like trying to put out a fire with gasoline. What has me wondering is, why haven't they responded to any of the articles written on the what? 10 different gaming websites? On a side note I think this is the single largest threadnaught on the EVE forums. Wait until the article on the Slashdot firehose goes front page :) CCP will be begging for Lulzsec to comeback.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:00:00 - [1649] Edited by: MrSteack on 23/06/2011 18:00:34 Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose! Bwahahahaha, you are my hero!
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:02:00 - [1650] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose! well... the mods are watching... that link was an image two seconds ago
Jamie Banks Quantum Horizons	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:02:00 - [1651] It was good while it lasted. Unsubscribed x3. _______________________________ Join in-game Channel 'Aussies' AU/NZ Corp Register
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:03:00 - [1652] Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 18:03:25 Originally by: Cyber Duck Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose! well... the mods are watching... that link was an image two seconds ago I edited it myself, was too wide and I hate distastefully warping forums. Feel free to link it in image format yourself to see how long it takes them to nerf it.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:03:00 - [1653] Whats the deal with this slashdot?
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:03:00 - [1654] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 18:01:12 Originally by: Sakura Zendragon IMHO, if they were in denial, we'd probably have gotten some lame devblog already about how they are just "throwing ideas around" No no.... I mean in denial like a mother who just lost her child. Silent. Shocked. Unable to process thoughts. Complete and total breakdown. edit: JADE! give me a word for it :-) Traumatised. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:04:00 - [1655] Originally by: Cyber Duck well... the mods are watching... that link was an image two seconds ago I don't think they mind so long as the dimensions are reasonable. Not all of us keep the "resize image" option turned on. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Sakura Zendragon	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:05:00 - [1656] Originally by: Rodj Blake Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 18:01:12 Originally by: Sakura Zendragon IMHO, if they were in denial, we'd probably have gotten some lame devblog already about how they are just "throwing ideas around" No no.... I mean in denial like a mother who just lost her child. Silent. Shocked. Unable to process thoughts. Complete and total breakdown. edit: JADE! give me a word for it :-) Traumatised. Catatonic is the word you're looking for, I think.
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:05:00 - [1657] Sigh. I'm adhering to not discussing moderation, but this just further rationalizes a potentially rash decision I'm about to take. For the lols: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535011 Donations accepted: 1BpQEYT7aSUNM863BV67FPxyv1cpxr74uu \| [url=http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535011]Possibly the best thread ever
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:06:00 - [1658] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose! o_O give me the system and the planet, we'll have dreads in orbit in 2 hours
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:06:00 - [1659] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Junkie Babe I dont mind pay for extras or pay per month, EVE has a server and they need money for maintaince/development however I wont pay both and please bear in mind CCP that SWTOR is out in a few months. EVE is a amazing game and is built not around pvp like many think but around it's market, pvp is the main mechanic for removing items from the game aka removing isk and at the same time increasing demand as the dead guys needs new ship etc. The market is a huge part of EVE and having MT to buy in-game items would have a disastrous effect on the market, it would reduce demand for market goods which means ships/mods will be worth less and right down the line everyone makes less credits, as the minerals/ores they are made from will be worth less. If they plan on selling elite items that cant be made in game T4 that would be terrible as it would make 2 tiers of players those with more cash and those with less, which is ok in something in Dark orbit but in that game you aren't paying subs, expecting us to pay both subs and MT to remain competitive is a step too far. Is this report fake or real? If its real was it released to test the waters with the playerbase? You don't understand, the MT stuff is NOT to fund the EVE CLUSTER. It is to FUND their WoD and DUST products and every other product , THAT IS NOT EVE. Face it, we have all just been MonacledÖ by CCP. Likely, if they bring out MT for items that effect game performance I'l be going elsewhere prob SWTOR later in the year or maybe try wow. Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:07:00 - [1660] Cut down to size: Ze door!
Ren Nekk Dead Eye Dogs	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:07:00 - [1661] Haven't followed this since page 26 about 8 hours ago... but I just want to post again because I care. A few days ago I was mildly interested in Incarna and mostly indifferent to the vanity items to come, and I honestly wouldn't have thought at all that now I'd be one CCP post away from cancelling my 4 accounts. Seriously, if that document is legit, it is going to take one hell of a full disclosure, and one hell of an apology, and some serious backpedaling for me to stay. And honestly, if that document reflects the general direction of things in the modern MMO market, I can go spend my time with other games just fine thank-you-very-much. I mean honestly, who are the people fueling this crap? What kind of spiritual depravity does it take, e.g., to play Zynga games, to get invested in a game where the "game" is "confirm purchase"? Rest in peace the glory days of Ultima Online, Everquest, and Asheron's Call. If $-for-faction-standing is in EVE's future, I can only hope EVE will be resting in damnation before too long, and that the people who played it will have moved on to better things.
Jade Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:08:00 - [1662] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 18:01:12 Originally by: Sakura Zendragon IMHO, if they were in denial, we'd probably have gotten some lame devblog already about how they are just "throwing ideas around" No no.... I mean in denial like a mother who just lost her child. Silent. Shocked. Unable to process thoughts. Complete and total breakdown. edit: JADE! give me a word for it :-) You probably need three for a time like this. wretched calamitous despair comes close :) Join the Revolution!
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:08:00 - [1663] @ktouborg and other CCPers are active on their Twitter accounts. Its been a full business day in Iceland. I would love to see some response from CCP. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:10:00 - [1664] Originally by: Liang Nuren @ktouborg and other CCPers are active on their Twitter accounts. Its been a full business day in Iceland. I would love to see some response from CCP. yep iv seen quite a bit of tw4tering going on lol
Ein Spiegel	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:10:00 - [1665] Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. Dust will be free to download. Free to play. The only income stream from Dust is going to be MT. This was repeated again during the AT9 coverage. I just don't see this being real. (sarcasm) It's almost "fair and balanced", if you will. (end sarcasm) It is about on par with all of the other "quality" coverage you get at EN24. I'm not saying that I don't think CCP may be looking a lot closer at MT, and there may be parts of it that actually have some truthiness. However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, the author of the article and the entire EN24 website has just opened themselves up to a major liability in the "slander/libel" arena, and if it's real, it's a major liability in the "confidential"/"privacy"/"corporate espionage" area. Either way, lawyers may become involved, and they do not react quickly to forum posters. In fact, silence is a pretty good indication that some kind of legal action may be underway.
Stahlregen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:12:00 - [1666] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Most likely they're still hoping that this fire will die out, and if they respond it'll be like trying to put out a fire with gasoline. What has me wondering is, why haven't they responded to any of the articles written on the what? 10 different gaming websites? On a side note I think this is the single largest threadnaught on the EVE forums. Wait until the article on the Slashdot firehose goes front page :) CCP will be begging for Lulzsec to comeback. Hah what? Slashdot hasn't been in vogue for years.
Pandadora	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:13:00 - [1667] Originally by: Satallius Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Isil Rahsen Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun Its funny to watch people trying to sabotage eve with posts like this, i wonder how much they are paid by other companies for doing so. Ahahahahaha cough cough ... Oh, you're serious? Get a grip, EVE has no competition in this niche. And that is all Eve is, NICHE, TINY, WoD is their BIG REVENUE generator once it is live. Eve is just to get it started. Once WoD goes live, it is going to bring in much more revenue than Eve ever did, as WoD has a larger potential audience than "niche scifi". IMO Vampire is pretty popular as LARP game here. Doubt that the same persons would play a MMO though. Really? How big can WoD's base be? If I am correct, WoD is supposed to be based on the world of Vampire: The Masquerade? How big of a niche is that? The two single player Vampire games made by troika games didn't even sell that well. So how will an MMO based on the same table top RPG do well?
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:13:00 - [1668] Originally by: Ein Spiegel legal action may be underway. Hope they win a lot of money in the lawsuit because they're loosing customers like wild-fire here.
Rarkal Vzdelops	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:13:00 - [1669] Dust is free is download? -------------------
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:14:00 - [1670] There is obviously a ban on them replying to this matter until they brainstorm what is their stance on this. In true corporate manner until they decide many unsubbs will happen. At least I pray they are not that incompetent to think that the "this is just a way to encourage debate on the matters inhouse" will work. MANY accounts are awaiting their stance on the matter. Your move CCP Creation is so precious And Greed is so destructive. Rings a bell ÇÇP ?
Stahlregen GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:14:00 - [1671] Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. Dust will be free to download. Free to play. The only income stream from Dust is going to be MT. This was repeated again during the AT9 coverage. I just don't see this being real. (sarcasm) It's almost "fair and balanced", if you will. (end sarcasm) It is about on par with all of the other "quality" coverage you get at EN24. I'm not saying that I don't think CCP may be looking a lot closer at MT, and there may be parts of it that actually have some truthiness. However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, the author of the article and the entire EN24 website has just opened themselves up to a major liability in the "slander/libel" arena, and if it's real, it's a major liability in the "confidential"/"privacy"/"corporate espionage" area. Either way, lawyers may become involved, and they do not react quickly to forum posters. In fact, silence is a pretty good indication that some kind of legal action may be underway. That sure is a lot of words just to tell us you're dumb.
Hantaria Clivan ThErEaLdEaL...	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:15:00 - [1672] nice dmg control, ccp. no response is indeed a nice tactic. not? i don¦t care ¦bout cq. the possibility to switch it of seems ok to me. i don¦t care ¦bout NEX. useless things, k. if someone wants to buy it, fine. but if it¦s planned to put in gamechanging items, i do care. been to that in two games and both failed. will not see a third one failing!
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:17:00 - [1673] Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. Dust will be free to download. Free to play. The only income stream from Dust is going to be MT. This was repeated again during the AT9 coverage. I just don't see this being real. (sarcasm) It's almost "fair and balanced", if you will. (end sarcasm) It is about on par with all of the other "quality" coverage you get at EN24. I'm not saying that I don't think CCP may be looking a lot closer at MT, and there may be parts of it that actually have some truthiness. However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, the author of the article and the entire EN24 website has just opened themselves up to a major liability in the "slander/libel" arena, and if it's real, it's a major liability in the "confidential"/"privacy"/"corporate espionage" area. Either way, lawyers may become involved, and they do not react quickly to forum posters. In fact, silence is a pretty good indication that some kind of legal action may be underway. Only problem to your logic is that credible people have stated it is true. IF it was fake there would be a statement already and closing of thread. What colour is the sky in your world?
El Lion	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:17:00 - [1674] Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. signed
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:17:00 - [1675] Originally by: Judicator Saturnius I think the appropriate question now is: How long will they keep asking for a sub fee when they have so many far-reaching MT schemes in place? The games they seem to want to emulate are in large part F2P with an emphasis on MT. Had they stated EVE would be F2P before this storm they might have won over at least a few players who are ok with being second-class so long as the game is free. In this model, paying once just to have the luxury of logging in and twice to stay competitive, you really have nobody that's happy. Subscriber/anti-mt players are unhappy about the gameplay MT advantages, the F2P/pro-mt potential-players are not going to sign on for something that isn't F2P. They literally took the worst of both worlds and combined the two. They can't go F2P as long as skill training proceeds on logged-off accounts. Think about the implications of this.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:17:00 - [1676] Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. Dust will be free to download. Free to play. The only income stream from Dust is going to be MT. This was repeated again during the AT9 coverage. I just don't see this being real. (sarcasm) It's almost "fair and balanced", if you will. (end sarcasm) It is about on par with all of the other "quality" coverage you get at EN24. I'm not saying that I don't think CCP may be looking a lot closer at MT, and there may be parts of it that actually have some truthiness. However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, the author of the article and the entire EN24 website has just opened themselves up to a major liability in the "slander/libel" arena, and if it's real, it's a major liability in the "confidential"/"privacy"/"corporate espionage" area. Either way, lawyers may become involved, and they do not react quickly to forum posters. In fact, silence is a pretty good indication that some kind of legal action may be underway. oh hai ccpfanboy. I see no mention of a CCP Stephanie anything.
Judicator Saturnius Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:19:00 - [1677] Edited by: Judicator Saturnius on 23/06/2011 18:22:56 Originally by: Technovar Originally by: Judicator Saturnius I think the appropriate question now is: How long will they keep asking for a sub fee when they have so many far-reaching MT schemes in place? The games they seem to want to emulate are in large part F2P with an emphasis on MT. Had they stated EVE would be F2P before this storm they might have won over at least a few players who are ok with being second-class so long as the game is free. In this model, paying once just to have the luxury of logging in and twice to stay competitive, you really have nobody that's happy. Subscriber/anti-mt players are unhappy about the gameplay MT advantages, the F2P/pro-mt potential-players are not going to sign on for something that isn't F2P. They literally took the worst of both worlds and combined the two. They can't go F2P as long as skill training proceeds on logged-off accounts. Think about the implications of this. Exactly, they have no way to reconcile the two. Thus they should be explaining the obvious necessary transition ahead or going FULL stop on this nonsense immidiately. vOv
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:20:00 - [1678] Originally by: Cyber Duck Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose! well... the mods are watching... that link was an image two seconds ago Yes they are and I believe they silently picked a few posts out of here as well.
Pandadora	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:21:00 - [1679] Originally by: Olleybear No Faction pos for real money, no special ammo for real money, no 1 day old superheros that can go around ganking 7 year vets because they spent $1000 to do so. i dont like the Aurum shop either and think CCP is heading in the wrong direction here. That said, you can do just what you mentioned with Plex and Chartransfer.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:21:00 - [1680] They continue to ignore the problem
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:22:00 - [1681] Originally by: Velicitia fifty four page threadnought and not a single blue bar? I can't believe that even CCP couldn't figure out how absolutely **ing **ed the entire EVE community would be over this... Oh, they figured it out. Even Soundwave knew that - thus his comments in the internal document. They just aren't that concerned about it.
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:23:00 - [1682] Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us Linkage
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:23:00 - [1683] Originally by: Tehlana Riolis They continue to ignore the problem excellent they think this will distract us.. whitewash productions. WWP
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:23:00 - [1684] Edited by: Bloodpetal on 23/06/2011 18:26:33 Hahhaha, I like how they don't dare put their name on the blog. :) It's CCP Soundwave for sure reporting from BFF. ---------------------------------------------------- Looks like war has been declared. Quote: voices from the war: content updates in incarna Teen rated forums. Quote: Also, your ******* agent refuses to pay you? ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:25:00 - [1685] Originally by: Tehlana Riolis There is obviously a ban on them replying to this matter until they brainstorm what is their stance on this. In true corporate manner until they decide many unsubbs will happen. At least I pray they are not that incompetent to think that the "this is just a way to encourage debate on the matters inhouse" will work. MANY accounts are awaiting their stance on the matter. Your move CCP Creation is so precious And Greed is so destructive. Rings a bell ÇÇP ? They are preparing responses for all the PRESS enquires on the matter first. Then we will get to see that. FRIDAY anybody? THen we can have a weekend emorage thread. again. Then they come back Monday, hungover and we are easier to deal with, all the energy will have been vented.
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:25:00 - [1686] Originally by: Bloodpetal Hahhaha, I like how they don't dare put their name on the blog. :) It's CCP Soudnwave for sure reporting from BFF. it's CCP Big Dumb Object's devblog.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:26:00 - [1687] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Originally by: Cyber Duck Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 17:59:37 The door, it has a purpose! well... the mods are watching... that link was an image two seconds ago Yes they are and I believe they silently picked a few posts out of here as well. They're cherry picking out the choice bits of info from the noise before eve-search spiders. His name was John Turbefield!
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:26:00 - [1688] He mentioned a NEWSLETTER so it is true. Unsub by monday if you don't adress this properly.
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:27:00 - [1689] Edited by: Bloodpetal on 23/06/2011 18:28:27 Edited by: Bloodpetal on 23/06/2011 18:27:13 Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Bloodpetal Hahhaha, I like how they don't dare put their name on the blog. :) It's CCP Soudnwave for sure reporting from BFF. it's CCP Big Dumb Object's devblog. No profile, division, etc set. http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=author&p=CCP%20Big%20Dumb%20Object P.S. Looks like war has been declared. Quote: voices from the war: content updates in incarna Teen rated forums. Quote: Also, your ******* agent refuses to pay you? ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
Altornator Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:27:00 - [1690] 90k views
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:28:00 - [1691] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us Linkage Ultimate confirmation that the newsletter is true. Naysayers who believed ÇÇP isnt that idiotic panic !
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:29:00 - [1692] Originally by: Terianna Eri Image changed to link. Navigator So you are reading this thread, are you? Tell your higher-ups to pull their heads out of their asses and organize some kind of response. Please and thank you. http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/12238558/a-fictionalized-account-of-the-events-that-led-to-june-21st Cannot Communicate Properly. --- Which is the best DOOR picture???
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:30:00 - [1693] Originally by: Bloodpetal No profile, division, etc set. http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=author&p=CCP%20Big%20Dumb%20Object I see... but it looks like he was at PAX East 2011 so it is unlikely he is just a meatshield persona.
Bologna Brains	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:31:00 - [1694] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us Linkage guess this confirms the "newsletter" is real. CCP= Idiots
LC Sulla Caldari House Mekarae	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:31:00 - [1695] A possible future. Makes you think Me - "...so I'd like to join your alliance..." Alliance guy - "cool. We're fighting a major war here for this bit of space and our enemies have more money than we do. How much money can you put in to the war effort?" Me - "oh... ISK you mean??" Alliance guy - "...nah mate. I was thinking more along the lines of EURO!" ------------------
Parador	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:31:00 - [1696] My 200Euros just got to my paypall account... Thank god I didn't spend them yet. I'm angry as hell about this fiasco and the way CCP is treating us. No good answer before this weekend means I spend my money elswhere!
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:31:00 - [1697] Any response from ccp yet and anybody have a list of CCP alts that they know for sure \|-----ººº╚╚████████████████╚╚ººº-----\| [url="http://www.eveonline.com/ingameb
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:32:00 - [1698] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us Linkage it... is real, the newsletter was real
Scott Ryder Amarr Ministry of War	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:33:00 - [1699] Nice little ****storm, isnt it time for CCP to pull heads out ass and answer some of the concerns raised here?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:33:00 - [1700] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 18:35:19 Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us ROFL! "Highlight the 4 last-minute bug fixes (the stuff that's been broken for years) which we included when we realised people were already ****ed, that will do the trick!" edit: oops I fell into the heading trap, only 2 fixes and some random rambling by a drunk person. His name was John Turbefield!
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:33:00 - [1701] Originally by: Atreus Venom Any response from ccp yet and anybody have a list of CCP alts that they know for sure Nothing related to the relevent bits in this thread.
Nedak Pather	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:33:00 - [1702] I've never posted on these forums before and I've never really complained about anything CCP has ever done. But, if that newsletter is real and if the new business plan is micro-transactions I will most certainly be unsubscribing from EvE Online. It's your move CCP. I'm just waiting for the official announcement. Also, I find it interesting how CCP really doesn't take our complaints seriously anymore. They EXPECT opposition. Why? Because you guys (the community) have complained for so long about the most useless **. that you guys ended up liking! So now, something game breaking is about to be released and all opposition will fall on deaf ears because the EvE community loves to *** about everything. Nice job guys. So this is what I ask of you: If this bulletin is confirmed by CCP and if they really do plan on going down the micro-transaction route, unsubscribe. And REALLY send a message to CCP.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:34:00 - [1703] If everyone who said it wasn't real can just go ahead and take a picture with your foot in your mouth now that would be just great. Please post the pics in this thread only as we want a consolidated thread. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:34:00 - [1704] Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. So you didn't read the document I take it? Quote: And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. So how does that indicate that the document is fake? It's not mentioned anywhere in the actual text, but is rather something the EN24 author invented. Which means thatà Quote: To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) àall of this is completely irrelevant. It is the EN24 author that is not familiar with WoD, not CCP. (And why would he be? He's writing about EVE, not WoD.) So again, why does this in any way indicate that the document is fake? Quote: Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. So what? Again, that's EN24's comment, not CCP's. Oh, and you're wrong: they only said that Dust would be free to play, not that it would be free to purchase. Quote: However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, How is the article fake? Is it not written by EN24? Because that would be the only way the article was fake. If they make mistakes in the commentary about the document, that doesn't make the article fake ù it just makes the writers somewhat misinformed. And if it's the document you're talking about (without having read it), how is it fake? ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Knara Semosin	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:35:00 - [1705] guys, dont forget about the Door in the newspaper. EON magazine should hope a competition for real =P
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:35:00 - [1706] The damage has been done really now. Even if they do not go with this, it will still be on everybodie's minds, not if, but WHEN. People will always be eyeing up that OTHER COMPETITOR's PRODUCTS, just in case. People will detach themselves from Eve emotionally and their involvement to just Ill go in and shoot a little, nothing more just to protect themselves.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:36:00 - [1707] Originally by: CCP Fallout Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. ok now for sure its not a hoax
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:37:00 - [1708] Originally by: Pat Morrison Originally by: Velicitia fifty four page threadnought and not a single blue bar? I can't believe that even CCP couldn't figure out how absolutely **ing **ed the entire EVE community would be over this... Oh, they figured it out. Even Soundwave knew that - thus his comments in the internal document. They just aren't that concerned about it. I think I just died a little inside guess this is as good a time as any to bid farewell to New Eden as we know it...
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:38:00 - [1709] how about the indication that it is real that completely screws thinking its fake.... THEY HAVEN'T DEBUNKED THE LETTER YET \|-----ººº╚╚████████████████╚╚ººº-----\| [url="http://www.eveonline.com/ingameb
Enuen Ravenseye Malevolence. Imperial 0rder	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:39:00 - [1710] Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. Dust will be free to download. Free to play. The only income stream from Dust is going to be MT. This was repeated again during the AT9 coverage. I just don't see this being real. (sarcasm) It's almost "fair and balanced", if you will. (end sarcasm) It is about on par with all of the other "quality" coverage you get at EN24. I'm not saying that I don't think CCP may be looking a lot closer at MT, and there may be parts of it that actually have some truthiness. However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, the author of the article and the entire EN24 website has just opened themselves up to a major liability in the "slander/libel" arena, and if it's real, it's a major liability in the "confidential"/"privacy"/"corporate espionage" area. Either way, lawyers may become involved, and they do not react quickly to forum posters. In fact, silence is a pretty good indication that some kind of legal action may be underway. LOL Isn't it a little late in the day in Iceland for CCP employees to be posting? And if you had read even a page or two you would know this was already confirmed by folks who have physically seen it. So nice try on the spin, CCP Whateveryournameis
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:40:00 - [1711] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 18:42:04 Meh, I still don't feel like logging in to the game. I even want to go blow up a hulk, but meh nah.
Dougal Regyri	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:40:00 - [1712] Man :( I'm so gutted , I thought id finally found a new game I could get into and ive spent the last 3 weeks playing it not stop. Now i find out this, I didnt like the RMT introduced with the nex but it didnt bother me because it was all stuff that didnt impact gameplay..... but apprently thats whats round the corner:< truly gutted
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:42:00 - [1713] Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us His tank is failing. Burn your MWD's and swap to close range ammo!
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:42:00 - [1714] The second best post (after Jade's). Enough said. I'm done, I'm out. Cashing in my PLEXes, training my characters, aaaand I'm done. I thought you cared, CCP. --- Which is the best DOOR picture???
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:42:00 - [1715] Oh well, Newsletter confirmed. I'm out.
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:42:00 - [1716] Annnnnnddddd....watch the numbers fall! http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility whats really f'in sad is i get to watch the world i've put so much time into go failcascade on me. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:43:00 - [1717] Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Enough said. I'm done, I'm out. Cashing in my PLEXes, training my characters, aaaand I'm done. I thought you cared, CCP. holy **** bye bye lots of subs
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:43:00 - [1718] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 18:44:15 Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Enough said. I'm done, I'm out. Cashing in my PLEXes, training my characters, aaaand I'm done. I thought you cared, CCP. Cashing them into what? LOL. I have 20 billion isk worth of plex in my hanger. Forbidden You don't have permission to access /viewtopic.php on this server. Additionally, a 403 Forbidden error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. That link is dead.
Dr Sodius	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:44:00 - [1719] hey ccp, i have a great idea how about adding an option for "lag-free-system"?? going to cost only 70000 aurums! you're going to loose a lot ccp!! a lot
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:44:00 - [1720] An update on the door. It appears soundwave has closed the portal into WoW.
Othran Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:45:00 - [1721] Had a reasonable think about this and it basically comes down to "I can't trust CCP ever again". So from now on if you see Othran in space he may be trying to kill you or give you stuff. Oh and **** you CCP, MT games are ones you spend 6 months max on. Enjoy your buyout - if you can convince them to do it.
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:45:00 - [1722] Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Failheap is offline?! ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
Cherche LaFemme	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:45:00 - [1723] kan i haz yo zikrit dokuments? ... i don't want to be a black sheep or whatnot, but i for myself i don¦t give a **** what Soundwave or whoever else unofficially said somewhere ... currently it's not happening, neither it looks like it will be in any near future, until then, good job on PR you managed to push majority of your customers into a /allofsuddencarealot mode, bravo. btw this is my very subjective opinion i find it very lulz to read all this speculations, hypotheses and assumptions
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:45:00 - [1724] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 18:46:23 Where can we see an accurate and fast number of subs in Eve? I guess server loading will drop, that's one indicator of less alt usage. Any others? I really want to watch this Train wreck in slow motion :) Then play it back after CCP goes bye bye as examples for other MMO's in future :)
Illwill Bill For a fistful of Veldspar	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:46:00 - [1725] Originally by: Bloodpetal Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Failheap is offline?! Let the :tinfoil: begin!
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:47:00 - [1726] Originally by: Cherche LaFemme kan i haz yo zikrit dokuments? ... i don't want to be a black sheep or whatnot, but i for myself i don¦t give a **** what Soundwave or whoever else unofficially said somewhere ... currently it's not happening, neither it looks like it will be in any near future, until then, good job on PR you managed to push majority of your customers into a /allofsuddencarealot mode, bravo. btw this is my very subjective opinion i find it very lulz to read all this speculations, hypotheses and assumptions oh, to be so niave again. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:47:00 - [1727] Originally by: Bloodpetal Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Failheap is offline?! i got it dl'd
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:48:00 - [1728] Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Bloodpetal Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Failheap is offline?! i got it dl'd needs linkage
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:48:00 - [1729] Originally by: Bloodpetal Failheap is offline?! Let the :tinfoil: begin! It is. Straight out forbidden access, look like someone turned off the switch. Failheap Main Page ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:49:00 - [1730] Originally by: Jennifer Nardieu Edited by: Jennifer Nardieu on 23/06/2011 17:53:43 I would love for this to be the meta-game to end all metagaming. Goons / Test releasing realistic propaganda and information to the press, causing the max exodus of subscribed accounts. It'd be a beautiful thing and they really will have "won" EVE. However what I fear is that it's all too true. Do not go gently into that good night... for CCP will bend you over and have their way with you. Not Goons, not TEST, but Citibank: Joseph Gallo's Experience (from LinkedIn MD Citigroup Public Company; 10,001+ employees; C; Financial Services industry 1994 û 2008 (14 years) Chief Financial Officer CCP Games Privately Held; Computer Games industry June 2009 û Present (2 years 1 month) As CFO of CCP Games, Joe oversees the financial positioning and reporting of CCP. He is also responsible for the strategic initiatives of the Company and relations with its investors. Global financial crisis and Incarna/MT fiasco - brought to you by the same people.
Enuen Ravenseye Malevolence. Imperial 0rder	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:49:00 - [1731] Originally by: Cipher Jones If everyone who said it wasn't real can just go ahead and take a picture with your foot in your mouth now that would be just great. Please post the pics in this thread only as we want a consolidated thread. Is it possible to sticky a single post? I almost feel bad for the CCP alts who posted with their claims of the newsletter being fake, only to find out their boss has now confirmed it's true. I would laugh but I'm afraid I'm too busy trying to hold down the bile.
Nedak Pather	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:49:00 - [1732] Just unsubbed.
Cherche LaFemme	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:50:00 - [1733] Originally by: Token Afrodude Originally by: Cherche LaFemme kan i haz yo zikrit dokuments? ... i don't want to be a black sheep or whatnot, but i for myself i don¦t give a **** what Soundwave or whoever else unofficially said somewhere ... currently it's not happening, neither it looks like it will be in any near future, until then, good job on PR you managed to push majority of your customers into a /allofsuddencarealot mode, bravo. btw this is my very subjective opinion i find it very lulz to read all this speculations, hypotheses and assumptions oh, to be so niave again. its not about being naive or not ... its not happening now, thats all of i care if it happens then i leave, as simple as that
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:50:00 - [1734] We killed failheap.
Jennifer Nardieu	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1735] Originally by: Token Afrodude Annnnnnddddd....watch the numbers fall! http://eve-offline.net/?server=tranquility whats really f'in sad is i get to watch the world i've put so much time into go failcascade on me. I hate CCP's plans as much as the next person in this thread. But you do realise those graphs show an increase in users yes? The date starts with "Today" on the left side of every graph.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1736] Microtransactions... In pictures..
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1737] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Bloodpetal Originally by: Reed Tiburon The second best post (after Jade's). Failheap is offline?! i got it dl'd needs linkage Linkage
Shaks 12th Squad	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1738] posting in epic thread this has been very entertaining so far. and sad
Ren Nekk Dead Eye Dogs	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1739] Edited by: Ren Nekk on 23/06/2011 18:54:29 Wow all our posts are rapidly being disappeared from the dev blog thread... Originally by: Ren Nekk Originally by: CCP Fallout Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. It really does not seem fair to ask this when the concerns we have are so wide-ranging and potentially affect whether or not we even continue to play the game. This dev blog simply means something other than you would like it to, in the current context of EVE Online. Is the content described in this dev blog "enough" to matter, given all the other concerns? Absolutely not. It is even insulting. I mean yes, agent changes, blah blah - who cares when many of us are awaiting a real response from CCP in order to decide whether to cancel subs and leave or not? If that newsletter is legit, maybe you should have saved this dev blog for all your future subscribers, once you have successfully purged all the "freeloading spectators" who don't care to stick around while EVE gets her soul sucked dry.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1740] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 18:53:06 Originally by: LC Sulla A possible future. Makes you think Me - "...so I'd like to join your alliance..." Alliance guy - "cool. We're fighting a major war here for this bit of space and our enemies have more money than we do. How much money can you put in to the war effort?" Me - "oh... ISK you mean??" Alliance guy - "...nah mate. I was thinking more along the lines of EURO!" Long as they get a license for the corp website that should be fine by CCP. edit: duh... what am I saying.... It's over. Done. Gone. Kaput. His name was John Turbefield!
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:51:00 - [1741] Originally by: Cherche LaFemme Originally by: Token Afrodude Originally by: Cherche LaFemme kan i haz yo zikrit dokuments? ... i don't want to be a black sheep or whatnot, but i for myself i don¦t give a ** what Soundwave or whoever else unofficially said somewhere ... currently it's not happening, neither it looks like it will be in any near future, until then, good job on PR you managed to push majority of your customers into a /allofsuddencarealot mode, bravo. btw this is my very subjective opinion i find it very lulz to read all this speculations, hypotheses and assumptions oh, to be so niave again. its not about being naive or not ... its not happening now, thats all of i care if it happens then i leave, as simple as that Comes a point where you have to decide whether or not to keep spending time in something you know you'll leave pretty soon... Originally by:** Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:52:00 - [1742] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us His tank is failing. Burn your MWD's and swap to close range ammo! Failing? his ship is gone. GET THE POD! GET THE POD!! GEEEET THEEEEEEEE POOOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDD!!!!!!111! It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:52:00 - [1743] They have started to delete posts in the blog comments. In before failcascade.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:52:00 - [1744] Edited by: Tehlana Riolis on 23/06/2011 18:54:50 Çommunity i$ held together bÑ trust.Ñou break that tru$t , Ñou break the Çommunity. Creation is such a beautiful thing And greed is so destructive. You should have learned from your own trailer. You have forever lost the faith of the community. From now on we will all be on the lookout for a better game... for those who have not already left...
delonewolf	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:53:00 - [1745] Edited by: delonewolf on 23/06/2011 18:53:00 i'm not one to complain, i have nothing against vanity items in a shop, but if you put one game altering item in that thing i am done. i just bought a plex for isk for the first time to make sure you won't get paid with my money for the next month, you will have to come out with an ironclad guarantie that only vanity items will ever be in that shop to re-earn my trust and paying sub.
Camalll	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:53:00 - [1746]
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:54:00 - [1747] Failheap is Forbidden. Tinfoil hat is fully on. --- Which is the best DOOR picture???
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:55:00 - [1748] Originally by: Jennifer Nardieu I hate CCP's plans as much as the next person in this thread. But you do realise those graphs show an increase in users yes? The date starts with "Today" on the left side of every graph. I realise this. and i know i for one have been logging into accounts getting things "in order" if you will, and handing **** out to people who decide to actualy stay through all this. the real telling numbers will be over the coming days/weeks. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:56:00 - [1749] if CCP Soundwave joined Greenpeace they would start harpooning whales and charge $9.99 for each donation
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:56:00 - [1750] From Failheap pt1: So I see you are now all also on the same page. Yes, I read the Fearless magazine some time ago, and you may have noticed I used it a couple of time for some price quotes and comparisons. Ofcourse, as this is FHC, you all called me nuts and bitter back then, but I certainly enjoyed hearing that those price quotes and comparisons caused a bit of a stir up there in Iceland. I thought that was pretty funny. My reaction, BTW, after sleeping on it for a night, was quite the same as a couple of people have posted in this thread: I cancelled my remaining account. I had that account for several years, and before the tripe in this magazine still had hopes that possibly, maybe, cooler, smarter heads at CCP would prevail over this madness. Hope that were obviously dashed then, as they are for some of you now. Likewise, I wasn't even angry about it then, just disappointed. As for those who are clamouring for a response from CCP. Don't bother. Rumour has it that from high on up at CCP the word has come down not to respond but look at :metrics: first. Those :metrics: being: the amount of swag sold from the MT shop. Yes, that means that if you think your cancellation will amount to anything, then I suspect that it won't amount to a hill of beans. All those nicely worded cancellation letters you might have drafted will end up in the nice round archive, or more appropriately: /dev/null. Eventually, obviously, CCP will, in some way, give a response, kind of in the form of a non-apology apology. You've seen them before, so you'll know what to expect. At any rate, CCP's response to threadnaughts should be well known by now: they circle the wagons. I.e., they let the customers (they still have) blow off steam for a couple of days, then throw in the locking and 'cleaning-up' of the threads, and the throw in the non-apology apology dev-blog and that will be it. CCP is basically done with listening to their customers by now, every sign points to that, and it is even more clear from a bit of distance (i.e., no longer being subbed). But don't think CCP is an entity as a whole on this issue, or on many other issues in fact. From what I can gather, and as you know by now some people tell me things about stuff, CCP is basically split right down the middle from high to low on this MT issue. Well, perhaps less so from on high and more so from on low really. Dear John Turbefield may have been the 'also has something to say'-guy in the internal magazine, but he's one of many, obviously on the non-decision-making level who fundamentally disagree just as much as, well, most of you and I about this whole MT nonsense. But they not only don't have any decision making influence, they have no real influence at all.
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:57:00 - [1751] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Terianna Eri Image changed to link. Navigator So you are reading this thread, are you? Tell your higher-ups to pull their heads out of their asses and organize some kind of response. Please and thank you. http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/12238558/a-fictionalized-account-of-the-events-that-led-to-june-21st Cannot Communicate Properly. LOL Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:58:00 - [1752] Well I finally cancelled my subscription after that response from Fallout. So, anybody up for making a displaced EVE player guild/clan/whatever on SWTOR? Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Lakut Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:58:00 - [1753] Originally by: Miilla Forbidden You don't have permission to access /viewtopic.php on this server. Additionally, a 403 Forbidden error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. That link is dead. Still got the page open, posting it as a screencap because of :charlimit: (in true Bartholomeus Crane walloftext fashion) http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png Most importantly, the issue is that this is already my signature. ---------- You get a wonderful view from the point of no return.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:58:00 - [1754] Failheap pt2: There is no real discussion at CCP, and there hasn't been for quite a while. Like Seleene said, the majority of employees get told squad, don't know what's going on, quite a few have become complete apathetic to what's being decided even. In the end, it's just a job, and they are actively encouraged in that direction. They aren't asked for their opinion and even if they'd have one, or wanted to ventilate one, there's nowhere to go with it. They are just there to concentrate on their thing, and applaud there rest, and basically drink the coolaid. Most stopped caring quite some time ago. And that is mostly because the 'leadership' (hard to talk about leadership when it's become so incompetent but what other word is there?) is by now entirely 'personified'. Call it little kingdoms, call it cliques, call it whatever you like, there are just a couple of people who really have an influence, and although that's not bad in and off itself, they stopped listening to everyone else but to those who tell them what they like to hear (read Stoffer) or who tell them funny things. This was the case when :18months: happened, and just like now, CCP circled the wagons, and it just got worse. Moreover, what came out here now, was already common knowledge for quite some time at CCP internally, so quite a lot of the good guys, the guys with options to go somewhere else, well, they have packed their bags, or they are quite busy packing their bags. Why am I telling you this? Well, because I think it is important that you understand that it is basically over. This may be EVE's NGE moment, it may not be, we don't know yet, but one thing should be clear. This magazine is a clear reflection of how CCP think internally. And once you realise that, it is clear that for EVE it is over. Perhaps just for me, I can accept that not everyone will agree with me on this, but this way of thinking 'breaks' EVE. It is fundamentally flawed, and it will only get worse over time. CCP the company is, in my view falling apart, and so is EVE with it. And frankly, I don't see how it can be stopped, not any more. And no amount of circling the wagons can stop this from happening. Not if half of your cowboys are basically joining the Indians while you do it. Lot's of slippery slope analogies can be made but really, it's all downhill from here. I'm enjoying the sight, but only because I'm well away from the boulders really.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:59:00 - [1755] Edited by: BeanBagKing on 23/06/2011 18:59:24 edit, fail posting
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:59:00 - [1756] Originally by: MrSteack From Failheap pt1: So I see you are now all also on the same page. Yes, I read the Fearless magazine some time ago, and you may have noticed I used it a couple of time for some price quotes and comparisons. Ofcourse, as this is FHC, you all called me nuts and bitter back then, but I certainly enjoyed hearing that those price quotes and comparisons caused a bit of a stir up there in Iceland. I thought that was pretty funny. My reaction, BTW, after sleeping on it for a night, was quite the same as a couple of people have posted in this thread: I cancelled my remaining account. I had that account for several years, and before the tripe in this magazine still had hopes that possibly, maybe, cooler, smarter heads at CCP would prevail over this madness. Hope that were obviously dashed then, as they are for some of you now. Likewise, I wasn't even angry about it then, just disappointed. As for those who are clamouring for a response from CCP. Don't bother. Rumour has it that from high on up at CCP the word has come down not to respond but look at :metrics: first. Those :metrics: being: the amount of swag sold from the MT shop. Yes, that means that if you think your cancellation will amount to anything, then I suspect that it won't amount to a hill of beans. All those nicely worded cancellation letters you might have drafted will end up in the nice round archive, or more appropriately: /dev/null. Eventually, obviously, CCP will, in some way, give a response, kind of in the form of a non-apology apology. You've seen them before, so you'll know what to expect. At any rate, CCP's response to threadnaughts should be well known by now: they circle the wagons. I.e., they let the customers (they still have) blow off steam for a couple of days, then throw in the locking and 'cleaning-up' of the threads, and the throw in the non-apology apology dev-blog and that will be it. CCP is basically done with listening to their customers by now, every sign points to that, and it is even more clear from a bit of distance (i.e., no longer being subbed). But don't think CCP is an entity as a whole on this issue, or on many other issues in fact. From what I can gather, and as you know by now some people tell me things about stuff, CCP is basically split right down the middle from high to low on this MT issue. Well, perhaps less so from on high and more so from on low really. Dear John Turbefield may have been the 'also has something to say'-guy in the internal magazine, but he's one of many, obviously on the non-decision-making level who fundamentally disagree just as much as, well, most of you and I about this whole MT nonsense. But they not only don't have any decision making influence, they have no real influence at all. Good stuff
Kith'rahl Miromme	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:59:00 - [1757] Logged in to see if CCP had an answer. Screw you guys, here in eve, and whatever you develop next. I think you will see the effects of this for some time. To the players here, I've always admired you guys. I resubbed a month ago, and have been looking forward to getting out of empire space and see the real eve online. Screw CCP. Ban my accounts if you wish, I won't be coming back. Unbelievable, that a corp could shyt on its playerbase in so thorough a manner. Had to be bought by a competitor, and intentionally ran into the ground.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 18:59:00 - [1758] Originally by: Cherche LaFemme kan i haz yo zikrit dokuments? ... i don't want to be a black sheep or whatnot, but i for myself i don¦t give a ** what Soundwave or whoever else unofficially said somewhere ... currently it's not happening, neither it looks like it will be in any near future, until then, good job on PR you managed to push majority of your customers into a /allofsuddencarealot mode, bravo. btw this is my very subjective opinion i find it very lulz to read all this speculations, hypotheses and assumptions http://www.mediafire.com/?ccl135embyb6c2v -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Abrazzar	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:00:00 - [1759] It's sad that CCP turned from a company I would have loved to be working for into a company I loath to even consider working for. The good things about CCP have all gone rotten. Greed is one of the most destructive motivators, right after hate and just before fear. --------
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:00:00 - [1760] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Failheap is Forbidden. Tinfoil hat is fully on. wow... had a feeling it was them last time too, the timing.... Tinfoil is on, it's the only way to be safe. His name was John Turbefield!
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:00:00 - [1761] Unsubbed. I want to see other people do this. -15$/month here.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:00:00 - [1762] Edited by: BeanBagKing on 23/06/2011 19:01:58 I'm going to self quote here (because it's the best phrasing I've come up with) and then go on to explain in a wall of text now that I know CCP is watching this thread. Originally by: "BeanBagKing" Lets take the golf analogy. I pay for my own clubs (keyboard), balls (snicker... mouse), bag (screen), etc. At the end of the day those are mine and I take them home. I go to a course and I pay to have access to that course (CCP's servers). They use my money to upkeep the greens (expansions) and fix divots (bugs, that one was easy). What CCP is, in effect, talking about is letting me walk onto their course and pay for a hole in one.... This is why players grudgingly put up with vanity items. I don't like them, but hey, I'm not going to use them so whatever. If someone wants to see their fairway as bright pink, then whatever, it's not my cup of tea, but it doesn't change the game. When someone pays an extra $30 to have a stroke removed, that's a different story. It ruins the enjoyment of the game, immediately for me. They may win a few rounds, but once all the legitimate players stop going to that golf course, there isn't anything left for them either. Yes I know there's a lot of gray area, people have been talking about PLEX -> ISK -> Ships for a while now. Vanity items are another gray area. At some point a dark enough shade of grey turns to black for me, that's where this is headed. Really sports is the most horrible example you could use, from CCP's perspective. Sure, twisted by a marketing guy it sounds great, but look at the core idea. I'm paying for an advantage and/or a shortcut... That is EXACTLY what sports are all about NOT doing. They are about the individuals skill, not about buying 10 more touchdowns that the next guy. I don't like the vanity items, I think it introduces a completely unnecessary element to the game. I actually like CQ, more specifically, it's meh in it's current form, but I like where it's headed, I want to walk in stations. Not because I'll be doing a lot of it, I'm a pvp nullsec player, but I love scifi games, and I love the idea of a completely scifi world where I could walk around my ship, etc. The new NeX market (I think that's the name of it) doesn't add anything though except money to CCP's wallet. You really want a market for stuff like that make it player run, and items are destroyed if your capsule is. That would add something to the walking in stations experience IMO. However, even in it's current form I say whatever. It's like I say above, I may not want to pay for a bright pink fairway, but if others do, then so be it. It's a completely different story if you start talking about paying, or being paid, to hold sov, get faction standings, or store more ship fittings (something that we were originally able to do). I think the community has a right to be outraged by it, especially when you previously told us this wouldn't happen and the players expressly said they didn't want it. Now you are getting some really bad press coverage over it and a lot of players say they are leaving, I guess only you know if they really are with your metrics. Basically, we told you so when we voted against all of that MT business. You had a great vision for this game, total scifi and player run economy. I'm not marketing expert, so I don't know how this MT business will turn out, I'll say it like I've said before though, I don't want to go in this direction with you, and it seems other players don't either. With the bad press, I don't think new players will want to follow either. Continued here http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534552&page=59#1762
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:00:00 - [1763] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:05:37 They don't care if you QUIT. They have their plan, they are executing on it, get out of their way. The numbers they are watching is the NEX sales. So go ahead, quit. It means jack. You can thank the people that buy monacles etc.. Gank on sight. Gank them until their ISK runs out, then gank them until their PLEX runs out, then GANK them until their bank runs out. Plain and simple way to make them hurt.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:01:00 - [1764] Edited by: BeanBagKing on 23/06/2011 19:03:56 This isn't something I want to see a backpedaling, damage control, we're sorry blog about. This is something that CCP needs to sit down and say "our current vision is wrong", revisit what they originally intended for Eve, and present that to us. Even then I'm not sure the players will trust or believe you, but if you show your serious then I think level heads will prevail. I know your a buisness and want to make profits, I recognize you probably value my wallet more than me as an individual. I wish it wasn't like that, but you wouldn't be around if this game didn't make money. Right now you have to ask yourself though, is the bad press and loss of subscriptions from this worth the amount that may be made from MT? I also recognize nobody will probably lose their job over this (Kristoffer Touborg), but if you really want us to trust you again, then don't have him involved in this in any way, the players DON'T trust him right now, and probably won't ever again... CCP Soundwave, I liked you, you were the face of CCP and about the only one who's real face I could pick out and put a name with, you seemed to like the vision of Eve and the player base so much. To think that you KNEW you were adding a game mechanic that the players didn't like and didn't want, but you planned on shoving it at us anyway... I'm dissapointed, I feel a bit betrayed. Not because you aren't allowed to hold your own opinion or anything like that, but because you would rather see your own opinion win out against the wishes of the majority of the players, because you didn't listen to us and it seems you didn't care except about yourself, you didn't want to get "burned at the stake". For me this isn't about CQ (which is a good direction), turrets (icons are kinda hard to distinquish, but I like them), mission rebalancing blogs, etc. I know work on other stuff goes on. I don't want this to be confused with anything else. This is about MT. Several months ago tinfoil hatters were saying THIS IS A SLIPPERY SLOPE! CCP went along with vanity items anyway. Now we see what appears to be CCP wanting to sell us faction standings... I don't recall my position at the time, but I think I was in the group that didn't want this but trusted CCP when they said vanity only. I guess I see the position of the company now, I guess it's not paranoia when they're really after you right? I've invested a lot of time and effert into this game, but I've invested more time and effort into other games in the past and left them. I don't want to leave Eve, I like it, it's not something I would drop overnight. However, if you ruin this game, I will move on, we joke a lot on here about Eve being a drug, about not knowing what to do and getting the shakes when the server goes down. The truth of this is that it is a joke though, this is a game, this is my free time, it's not something I "need" and if I no longer enjoy it, I will move on. I liked (past tense) CCP's vision, now I'm not so sure.
Two Chains	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:01:00 - [1765] Cannot believe that CCP consider silence a suitable response to this mess. I rejoined EVE around 8 months ago when Incarna looked to be on the horizon as I had been looking forward to what promised to be a great leap forward for EVE - so far I am totally underwhelmed by what they have produced after so many years of waiting - then comes the move to MT which is the one thing that has already driven me away from other MMOs Unless CCP show definitively that they are listening to the players concerns I won't be sticking around and that will be another two cash paid accounts lost to this debacle. I have already been online to purchase other games to keep me occupied until Deus Ex and Skyrim are released. How depressing...
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:03:00 - [1766] Is it me, or did the new patch today add a whole lot more of this NEX clothing in the regular market? Untick "Show only available" and browse through what theyll add to the NEX soon. They are really on top of that DCII
Cedric deBouilard Gallente EVE University Ivy League	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:04:00 - [1767] CCP never learns from PR mistakes, how is this any different than when you wanted us to vote for game of the year or whatever right after ****ing off your playerbase? I can buy real clothes with that much RL $. Bottom line, greed is not good and I'm not "The Goose That Laid the Golden Eggs" I genuinely feel insulted. His name was John Turbefield!
Enuen Ravenseye Malevolence. Imperial 0rder	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:05:00 - [1768] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Unsubbed. I want to see other people do this. -15$/month here. As a protest, it's not even worth unsubbing. You saw this part, I hope: "As for those who are clamouring for a response from CCP. Don't bother. Rumour has it that from high on up at CCP the word has come down not to respond but look at :metrics: first. Those :metrics: being: the amount of swag sold from the MT shop." As long as the zombies continue to buy monacles, CCP could care less how many people ragequit.
Ein Spiegel	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:05:00 - [1769] Originally by: Enuen Ravenseye Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. LOL Isn't it a little late in the day in Iceland for CCP employees to be posting? And if you had read even a page or two you would know this was already confirmed by folks who have physically seen it. So nice try on the spin, CCP Whateveryournameis Snipped parts that were dated, and possibly had errors. Any kind of mention of Stephanie Meyers causes me to have an aneurysm. However, I don't work for CCP. Never will. Nor am I an alt of any employee, family member, friend of a friend, etc. I imagine I should have said "Dust is Free* to download, free to play" - looking at the manner in which CCP portraying it.
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:06:00 - [1770] Edited by: Tammarr on 23/06/2011 19:06:05 Ohmy, I see the butthurt forum warrior and alts brigade are still upset about a buddy of theirs getting a kickban in the crackers. As well as poor poor plex speculants with 20b tied up in plexes not getting the sudden sell in plex at high isk value they hoped for. Still being little emo girls '...nah still dont feel like loging in' working on the destruction of ccps rep with all their e-might because things didnt go as they want. HTFU.
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:06:00 - [1771] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot An update on the door. It appears soundwave has closed the portal into WoW. LOL Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:07:00 - [1772] After reading the newest dev blog, had overwhelming need to tell 'em go f-word emselves. Then I realized that why would I care. For my eve career to be complete, all I wanna see is a picture where some1 is showeling monocles up to CCP CEO's butt and preferably without any lube. Some1 please deliver and you will be my hero. Thank you. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:07:00 - [1773] Originally by: Enuen Ravenseye Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Unsubbed. I want to see other people do this. -15$/month here. As a protest, it's not even worth unsubbing. You saw this part, I hope: "As for those who are clamouring for a response from CCP. Don't bother. Rumour has it that from high on up at CCP the word has come down not to respond but look at :metrics: first. Those :metrics: being: the amount of swag sold from the MT shop." As long as the zombies continue to buy monacles, CCP could care less how many people ragequit. And the joke is on the ***gots who buy them. Hope they enjoy a tranq server with 1k players @ max capacity all sipping single-malt and buying another system in nullsec with euros.
Tejal Charu	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:08:00 - [1774] Originally by: Tammarr Edited by: Tammarr on 23/06/2011 19:06:05 Ohmy, I see the butthurt forum warrior and alts brigade are still upset about a buddy of theirs getting a kickban in the crackers. As well as poor poor plex speculants with 20b tied up in plexes not getting the sudden sell in plex at high isk value they hoped for. Still being little emo girls '...nah still dont feel like loging in' working on the destruction of ccps rep with all their e-might because things didnt go as they want. HTFU. Someone has no idea what is going on! Good work!
Luer Lok Gallente The Feynman Syndicate	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:08:00 - [1775] Sadly unsubbing. -$45/month to CCP. At least X-Rebirth is right around the corner. Been a good run, 175m SP down the drain tho...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:08:00 - [1776] We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:09:00 - [1777] Originally by: Failheap pt2 This magazine is a clear reflection of how CCP think internally. And once you realise that, it is clear that for EVE it is over. Perhaps just for me, I can accept that not everyone will agree with me on this, but this way of thinking 'breaks' EVE. It is fundamentally flawed, and it will only get worse over time. CCP the company is, in my view falling apart, and so is EVE with it. Unadulterated Truth. I like the bit about metrics.... All the "metrics" would show is a bunch of people bought monocles with their now worthless isk. I hope they read those stats and think it was a success, just so we can watch them dig deeper for a few weeks. :-D His name was John Turbefield!
Ni'ark Parnassius Corporation Revival Of The Talocan Empire	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:09:00 - [1778] 60 page and still no response
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:09:00 - [1779] Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. What are you going to do? Steal their credit cards and empty them?
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:10:00 - [1780] Originally by: Ni'ark 60 page and still no response have you not been what has been said, they dont look like they intend to that much balls they cant even show face lmfao ccp grow some balls or dont men have them in iceland
Duran Sarn	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:11:00 - [1781] Edited by: Duran Sarn on 23/06/2011 19:11:02 -3 Accounts -45Ç for CCP per month Too bad one of my Accs automatically resubbed for another month during the Incarna deployment. Welp
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:11:00 - [1782] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:12:05 Originally by: Tla Atij Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. What are you going to do? Steal their credit cards and empty them? Get a huge battle vs 1 (THEM) non stop until they run out of isk to replace ships Pitch tents at their stations. If they are in your corp, GANK THEM concord free. NON STOP. Setup bait corps to fish for people with nex items, then gank gank gank. Keep ganking until they need to BUY PLEX to get more ISK to get new ships. Eventually they will stop BUYING as the cost of THEIR eve rises , until it becomes, too expensive for them.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:11:00 - [1783] I'm not ragequitting. I'm showing my back to CCP, as they clearly decided to give us the middle finger. I've nothing to do with people like that. Bring on Football Manager
Lora Ipsum	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:11:00 - [1784] Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. And what is this good for? (nothing) /me not sure if i unsub my 2 accounts, but this affair opened my eyes. I almost forgot CCP is a company with money in its focus. Stupid little girl
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:11:00 - [1785] Originally by: Ni'ark 60 page and still no response No there is a response. "Here is a devblog about 2 really old bugs we fixed. See we care!" His name was John Turbefield!
Camalll	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:12:00 - [1786] Posting in the most epic eve thread.
Jherdan Berral	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:13:00 - [1787] Originally by: delonewolf Edited by: delonewolf on 23/06/2011 18:53:00 i'm not one to complain, i have nothing against vanity items in a shop, but if you put one game altering item in that thing i am done. i just bought a plex for isk for the first time to make sure you won't get paid with my money for the next month, you will have to come out with an ironclad guarantie that only vanity items will ever be in that shop to re-earn my trust and paying sub. Err... if you sub, you pay CCP fifteen bucks. If you buy plex with isk, someone else is paying CCP 20 bucks -for- you (A bit less if they buy in bulk). In effect, you are giving them just as much if not more money.
Isidore Tailleur Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:13:00 - [1788] Edited by: Isidore Tailleur on 23/06/2011 19:14:19 Edited by: Isidore Tailleur on 23/06/2011 19:13:49 Thank you CCP for throwing your unique and successful business model down the toilet. Also every MMO is crap. It is the player driving economy and that everything in the game as well as expansions is included in subscription fee that makes EVE stand out from other MMOs and not be crap. EVE won't have a chance if you adopt the business model of every other MMO because EVE as such is actually a pretty repetitive and really boring game. It is the sandbox and community dynamic that makes EVE great.
Duran Sarn	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:14:00 - [1789] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:11:24 Originally by: Tla Atij Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. What are you going to do? Steal their credit cards and empty them? Get a huge battle vs 1 (THEM) non stop until they run out of isk to replace ships Pitch tents at their stations. If they are in your corp, GANK THEM concord free. NON STOP. Keep ganking until they need to BUY PLEX to get more ISK to get new ships. Eventually they will stop BUYING as the cost of THEIR eve rises , until it becomes, too expensive for them. Very bad idea, this would just shove even more money down CCP's throat and that's exactly what they want.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:14:00 - [1790] my eve... my beautiful, beautiful eve... eve online is now just another one of their few games... this will end not just eve... but ccp as a company... unless they absolve themselves by removing any reference or pursuit of RMT...
enderhexfyre Gallente D00M. Northern Coalition.	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:14:00 - [1791] Dear CCP from an active podcaster Blogger and player u just lost 2 subs 3rd pending fix this plz Killboard Link
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:14:00 - [1792] Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. Sorry Milla... been nice reading your spamposts but it is really game over now. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:15:00 - [1793] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:17:44 Originally by: Duran Sarn Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:11:24 Originally by: Tla Atij Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. What are you going to do? Steal their credit cards and empty them? Get a huge battle vs 1 (THEM) non stop until they run out of isk to replace ships Pitch tents at their stations. If they are in your corp, GANK THEM concord free. NON STOP. Keep ganking until they need to BUY PLEX to get more ISK to get new ships. Eventually they will stop BUYING as the cost of THEIR eve rises , until it becomes, too expensive for them. Very bad idea, this would just shove even more money down CCP's throat and that's exactly what they want. Im pretty sure they will stop buying PLEX fast :) Unless they are total morons. So what else is there? I paid yearly, i have 111 days left, may aswell do something. Go an idea? I got 20 billion worth of PLEXs in my hanger, got an idea? Spedn on game time? Thats 4 years worth. I doubt CCP will be here in 4 years with EVE at this rate. Shame to let all that GANK Money go to waste g
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:16:00 - [1794] No - punishing the players who support this stupid scheme is the real EVE way to solve it - yes, those players might give CCP more money to replace losses - but it will also discourage others from following that example. Drown them in the sandbox. -
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:16:00 - [1795] Originally by: Duran Sarn Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:11:24 Originally by: Tla Atij Originally by: Miilla We need a list of NEX customers to GANK GANK GANK, until their bank runs dry. What are you going to do? Steal their credit cards and empty them? Get a huge battle vs 1 (THEM) non stop until they run out of isk to replace ships Pitch tents at their stations. If they are in your corp, GANK THEM concord free. NON STOP. Keep ganking until they need to BUY PLEX to get more ISK to get new ships. Eventually they will stop BUYING as the cost of THEIR eve rises , until it becomes, too expensive for them. Very bad idea, this would just shove even more money down CCP's throat and that's exactly what they want. This. Simply unsub and let your rage fuel the forum fire as long as you care to expend the /effort.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:16:00 - [1796] Originally by: BeanBagKing Edited by: BeanBagKing on 23/06/2011 02:08:16 Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Welp, time to begin the F5 threadnaught vigil. /coffee I've got money to burn so, anyone who guesses the post # of the first CCP reply gets 2billion isk. I'll be doling out more of my old-money-isk as the night progresses. I have in excess of 140bilion liquid at the moment, so stay tuned. I'm going to go with 932 Edit: what happens if CCP locks it without a post? Welp... guess I was way off....
MrGook	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:17:00 - [1797] Maybe this is the new strategy to fight RMT - sell everything they offer via macropayments now?
Mr LaForge	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:18:00 - [1798] Coming soon. 20,000 Aur for a vest!
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:18:00 - [1799] Originally by: Miilla Im pretty sure they will stop buying PLEX fast :) Unless they are total morons. um.... they're playing Eve.... His name was John Turbefield!
Mechero Gallente Razorback Industrial Wayfarer Stellar Initiative	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:18:00 - [1800] Lame, really, just lame. Some games work well with MT's i.e. DDO, but now, MT's for faction, ships, etc... this is so going to ruin the game for so many people. Lame, just lame. Pew Pew!
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:18:00 - [1801] Edited by: Atreus Venom on 23/06/2011 19:18:47 THE NEW DIRECTION OF CCP AND NOW MY CQ LOOKS LIKE THIS!!!!! º--Atreus--º
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:18:00 - [1802]
Kallehd Norse'Storm Battle Group Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:19:00 - [1803] So, anyone has any ideias on when SW: TOR goes live? Now is looking like "the" timming!
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:19:00 - [1804] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 19:20:21 Eve just became a SHARDED game, FINANCIALLY SHARDED. Those with disposable money to burn, those without. Kind of like in a prison, you don't want to be the person "with" surrounded by all those "without".
Red Maiden Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:20:00 - [1805] Originally by: Cyber Duck my eve... my beautiful, beautiful eve... ...wherefore art thou? CCP might have a good strategy here, as was pointed out earlier: let the players vent themselves out of gas on these forums, then swoop in and give a non-apology apology and move forward with their plan.
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:21:00 - [1806] Originally by: Kallehd So, anyone has any ideias on when SW: TOR goes live? Now is looking like "the" timming! I was snorting when hearing about SWTOR each time... now I am looking to see when it shows up to play it. And only it.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:21:00 - [1807] Originally by: Kallehd So, anyone has any ideias on when SW: TOR goes live? Now is looking like "the" timming! Heh, yeah, if they did it now or within a month, they would devour a pretty big chunk of the disgruntled playerbase... Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:21:00 - [1808] Originally by: Red Maiden Originally by: Cyber Duck my eve... my beautiful, beautiful eve... ...wherefore art thou? CCP might have a good strategy here, as was pointed out earlier: let the players vent themselves out of gas on these forums, then swoop in and give a non-apology apology and move forward with their plan. exactly why I unsubbed now. IF they fix this, I'm back in. If not then they still don't get my money. Cheerio
Obviously Confidential	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:21:00 - [1809] CCP went Gordon Gekko on us because they thought we were golden goose. Turns out we are black swans with afterburners and rocket launchers It's easier to be Gordon Gekko on people that love you but it only lasts until they catch up. And they always do, sooner or later.
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:22:00 - [1810] Originally by: Atreus Venom Edited by: Atreus Venom on 23/06/2011 19:18:47 THE NEW DIRECTION OF CCP AND NOW MY CQ LOOKS LIKE THIS!!!!! and i only used 137 PLEX for the girl and the coat was 80 PLEX º--Atreus--º
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:22:00 - [1811] Originally by: Lakut Originally by: Miilla Forbidden You don't have permission to access /viewtopic.php on this server. Additionally, a 403 Forbidden error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. That link is dead. Still got the page open, posting it as a screencap because of :charlimit: (in true Bartholomeus Crane walloftext fashion) http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png Everybody should read that post. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:23:00 - [1812] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Originally by: Red Maiden Originally by: Cyber Duck my eve... my beautiful, beautiful eve... ...wherefore art thou? CCP might have a good strategy here, as was pointed out earlier: let the players vent themselves out of gas on these forums, then swoop in and give a non-apology apology and move forward with their plan. exactly why I unsubbed now. IF they fix this, I'm back in. If not then they still don't get my money. Cheerio qft
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:23:00 - [1813] Since it was obliterated from the blog comments: Originally by: Me, before being silenced HEY. ASS HOLES. When your community is screaming at you, you don't post cheery devblogs on unrelated crap. You either say what's pertinent, or you say NOTHING AT ALL. If you have a devblog that's been written before the hellstorm and waiting to be released, YOU KEEP IT SUPPRESSED UNTIL YOU TEND TO THE MAIN CONCERNS OF THE SCREAMING COMMUNITY. Most devs posting in this thread probably don't have direct control over that, of course. But I'm sure somebody reading this does have control of that.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:23:00 - [1814] Originally by: Red Maiden Originally by: Cyber Duck my eve... my beautiful, beautiful eve... ...wherefore art thou? CCP might have a good strategy here, as was pointed out earlier: let the players vent themselves out of gas on these forums, then swoop in and give a non-apology apology and move forward with their plan. Bitter post until the sub runs out.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:23:00 - [1815] I hope that those who support micro transactions for game change items, are prepared to pay more to cover all the unsubbed accounts. Because that is what you will have to do, PAY MORE to cover the lower subs.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:23:00 - [1816] Originally by: MrSteack Failheap pt2: There is no real discussion at CCP, and there hasn't been for quite a while. Like Seleene said, the majority of employees get told squad, don't know what's going on, quite a few have become complete apathetic to what's being decided even. In the end, it's just a job, and they are actively encouraged in that direction. They aren't asked for their opinion and even if they'd have one, or wanted to ventilate one, there's nowhere to go with it. They are just there to concentrate on their thing, and applaud there rest, and basically drink the coolaid. Most stopped caring quite some time ago. And that is mostly because the 'leadership' (hard to talk about leadership when it's become so incompetent but what other word is there?) is by now entirely 'personified'. Call it little kingdoms, call it cliques, call it whatever you like, there are just a couple of people who really have an influence, and although that's not bad in and off itself, they stopped listening to everyone else but to those who tell them what they like to hear (read Stoffer) or who tell them funny things. This was the case when :18months: happened, and just like now, CCP circled the wagons, and it just got worse. Moreover, what came out here now, was already common knowledge for quite some time at CCP internally, so quite a lot of the good guys, the guys with options to go somewhere else, well, they have packed their bags, or they are quite busy packing their bags. Why am I telling you this? Well, because I think it is important that you understand that it is basically over. This may be EVE's NGE moment, it may not be, we don't know yet, but one thing should be clear. This magazine is a clear reflection of how CCP think internally. And once you realise that, it is clear that for EVE it is over. Perhaps just for me, I can accept that not everyone will agree with me on this, but this way of thinking 'breaks' EVE. It is fundamentally flawed, and it will only get worse over time. CCP the company is, in my view falling apart, and so is EVE with it. And frankly, I don't see how it can be stopped, not any more. And no amount of circling the wagons can stop this from happening. Not if half of your cowboys are basically joining the Indians while you do it. Lot's of slippery slope analogies can be made but really, it's all downhill from here. I'm enjoying the sight, but only because I'm well away from the boulders really. Hahah if you believe that's genuine then you probably believe horoscopes too. Fan fiction forum is thattaway sonny. Some people really are utterly stupid and gullible. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:23:00 - [1817] Milly being internet raging because her buddy got banned. Milly being inflammatory because 'she got 20b in plexes', opps, no extra plex demand, oops no spike in plex price thx to (admittedly) high priced items, oops failed market speculation, got to hurt. People reading a supposedly internal document aimed to be read by none other. 'Gordon Gekko' edition, roflmao. they got humour. a document most likely if true intended to discuss from two opposing viewpoints MT usage and to form/weather internal opinions. Stop listening to the forum warriors, realize ccp did everyone paying subs with plex a favour with this initial high pricing since the spike in demand was left out. realize that failed spike in demand got some market mongols butthurt. i realize that hellicity getting kicked might not have been the best way since yeah; buddies have mobilized a flamewar, if the ban is actually for the reason they so present. (Did we ever get to know if miss hulkageddon did have a hulk bpo or no btw? ) This flamenaught is over nothing when you apply logic, except a fair few hurt individuals marshalling all their might to poke ccp, the big evil master corporation in the face because they were left out.
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:24:00 - [1818] Originally by: Token Afrodude Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Quote: Hello all, We understand that right now, many of you have a number of concerns and issues with the current state of EVE Online, we ask that you not derail threads with these posts. We are asking all of you who have comments and issues regarding the newsletter to post in this thread, and those of you with comments and issues regarding the Noble Exchange store prices to post here. This will help us keep track of what is being said by the community much more easily, while allowing other players to discuss other aspects of EVE Online in an on-topic environment. Fallout Associate Community Manager CCP Hf, EVE Online Contact us His tank is failing. Burn your MWD's and swap to close range ammo! Failing? his ship is gone. GET THE POD! GET THE POD!! GEEEET THEEEEEEEE POOOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDD!!!!!!111! If they had fixed the lag he may have survived Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Well I finally cancelled my subscription after that response from Fallout. So, anybody up for making a displaced EVE player guild/clan/whatever on SWTOR? I'l def be playing SWTOR wether il still be playing EVE I dunno it depends on CCP makes MT gameplay altering. Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:25:00 - [1819] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 19:25:29 Originally by: Lakut Originally by: Miilla Forbidden You don't have permission to access /viewtopic.php on this server. Additionally, a 403 Forbidden error was encountered while trying to use an ErrorDocument to handle the request. That link is dead. Still got the page open, posting it as a screencap because of :charlimit: (in true Bartholomeus Crane walloftext fashion) http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png Info Hero! You see how he did that, like a ninja or a Marine in the south pacific. His name was John Turbefield!
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:25:00 - [1820] Originally by: Miilla Im pretty sure they will stop buying PLEX fast :) Unless they are total morons. So what else is there? I paid yearly, i have 111 days left, may aswell do something. Go an idea? I got 20 billion worth of PLEXs in my hanger, got an idea? Spedn on game time? Thats 4 years worth. I doubt CCP will be here in 4 years with EVE at this rate. Shame to let all that GANK Money go to waste g I hear rifters are the "in" thing for PvP... How many will you be needing?
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:25:00 - [1821] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: MrSteack Failheap pt2: There is no real discussion at CCP, and there hasn't been for quite a while. Like Seleene said, the majority of employees get told squad, don't know what's going on, quite a few have become complete apathetic to what's being decided even. In the end, it's just a job, and they are actively encouraged in that direction. They aren't asked for their opinion and even if they'd have one, or wanted to ventilate one, there's nowhere to go with it. They are just there to concentrate on their thing, and applaud there rest, and basically drink the coolaid. Most stopped caring quite some time ago. And that is mostly because the 'leadership' (hard to talk about leadership when it's become so incompetent but what other word is there?) is by now entirely 'personified'. Call it little kingdoms, call it cliques, call it whatever you like, there are just a couple of people who really have an influence, and although that's not bad in and off itself, they stopped listening to everyone else but to those who tell them what they like to hear (read Stoffer) or who tell them funny things. This was the case when :18months: happened, and just like now, CCP circled the wagons, and it just got worse. Moreover, what came out here now, was already common knowledge for quite some time at CCP internally, so quite a lot of the good guys, the guys with options to go somewhere else, well, they have packed their bags, or they are quite busy packing their bags. Why am I telling you this? Well, because I think it is important that you understand that it is basically over. This may be EVE's NGE moment, it may not be, we don't know yet, but one thing should be clear. This magazine is a clear reflection of how CCP think internally. And once you realise that, it is clear that for EVE it is over. Perhaps just for me, I can accept that not everyone will agree with me on this, but this way of thinking 'breaks' EVE. It is fundamentally flawed, and it will only get worse over time. CCP the company is, in my view falling apart, and so is EVE with it. And frankly, I don't see how it can be stopped, not any more. And no amount of circling the wagons can stop this from happening. Not if half of your cowboys are basically joining the Indians while you do it. Lot's of slippery slope analogies can be made but really, it's all downhill from here. I'm enjoying the sight, but only because I'm well away from the boulders really. Hahah if you believe that's genuine then you probably believe horoscopes too. Fan fiction forum is thattaway sonny. Some people really are utterly stupid and gullible. ccp alt gtfo only show up when ur trying to smooth sh it over dont matter it still stinks
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:25:00 - [1822] well here is CCP to back you and tell us its fake... i dotn see them responding to that i see them responding to the overheated computers though... so they are here just not gonna touch this subject until we cool off or leave º--Atreus--º
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:26:00 - [1823] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And the joke is on the ***gots who buy them. Hope they enjoy a tranq server with 1k players @ max capacity all sipping single-malt and buying another system in nullsec with euros. The only person who I have encountered who played into this micro transaction stuff, spent $1200 on in game gold on some F2P Korean game. He was a 38 year old virgin with a learning disability who was on welfare living with his mother and decided to use that money on game currency instead of getting dental work done. I met this person through Eve, and I now wonder if he has returned to Eve to give CCP some more of his welfare checks.
Republica Winder Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:26:00 - [1824] Originally by: Miilla I hope that those who support micro transactions for game change items, are prepared to pay more to cover all the unsubbed accounts. Because that is what you will have to do, PAY MORE to cover the lower subs. Monocles will have to cost $200 a pop to make up for all the subs they are going to lose in the next week alone. In fact, I just had a brainstorm. Why not charge subscriptions FOR the monocles! Why should you only have to pay ONCE to enjoy the great monocle forever? What are you, freeloading spectators? Everyone who wishes to continue to enjoy the look of a futuristic Col. Klink should have to renew their monocle license at least every 2 months. There you go, REVENUE TO TEH MOON!
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:26:00 - [1825] Originally by: Tammarr White knights are back guys!
Alaura Aquila Minmatar Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:26:00 - [1826] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And the joke is on the ***gots who buy them. Hope they enjoy a tranq server with 1k players @ max capacity all sipping single-malt and buying another system in nullsec with euros. Maybe this will solve the lag issue? --
Chingyz Caldari Mind Games. 0ccupational Hazzard	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:27:00 - [1827] In the last couple of years I've watched how EVE moved more and more towards player driven economy. The player driven economy was the main reason why I chose to play EVE. With the Incarna expansion I hoped new professions would have been introduced and clothes made by the players. I fear very much that CCP is starting to move away from the player driven economy in order to cash in on the microtransaction market. Last time a gaming company made a major change to what was my reason to play it, I simply left... sems I'll have to spend another 2 years searching for a game that is at least close to a sandbox with a player driven economy.
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:27:00 - [1828] Their metrics is John Turbenfield. Their reputation is violated. They really have no choice. Originally by: MrSteack Edited by: MrSteack on 23/06/2011 18:59:16 As for those who are clamouring for a response from CCP. Don't bother. Rumour has it that from high on up at CCP the word has come down not to respond but look at :metrics: first. Those :metrics: being: the amount of swag sold from the MT shop. Yes, that means that if you think your cancellation will amount to anything, then I suspect that it won't amount to a hill of beans. All those nicely worded cancellation letters you might ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:27:00 - [1829] Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: MrSteack Failheap pt2: There is no real discussion at CCP, and there hasn't been for quite a while. Like Seleene said, the majority of employees get told squad, don't know what's going on, quite a few have become complete apathetic to what's being decided even. In the end, it's just a job, and they are actively encouraged in that direction. They aren't asked for their opinion and even if they'd have one, or wanted to ventilate one, there's nowhere to go with it. They are just there to concentrate on their thing, and applaud there rest, and basically drink the coolaid. Most stopped caring quite some time ago. And that is mostly because the 'leadership' (hard to talk about leadership when it's become so incompetent but what other word is there?) is by now entirely 'personified'. Call it little kingdoms, call it cliques, call it whatever you like, there are just a couple of people who really have an influence, and although that's not bad in and off itself, they stopped listening to everyone else but to those who tell them what they like to hear (read Stoffer) or who tell them funny things. This was the case when :18months: happened, and just like now, CCP circled the wagons, and it just got worse. Moreover, what came out here now, was already common knowledge for quite some time at CCP internally, so quite a lot of the good guys, the guys with options to go somewhere else, well, they have packed their bags, or they are quite busy packing their bags. Why am I telling you this? Well, because I think it is important that you understand that it is basically over. This may be EVE's NGE moment, it may not be, we don't know yet, but one thing should be clear. This magazine is a clear reflection of how CCP think internally. And once you realise that, it is clear that for EVE it is over. Perhaps just for me, I can accept that not everyone will agree with me on this, but this way of thinking 'breaks' EVE. It is fundamentally flawed, and it will only get worse over time. CCP the company is, in my view falling apart, and so is EVE with it. And frankly, I don't see how it can be stopped, not any more. And no amount of circling the wagons can stop this from happening. Not if half of your cowboys are basically joining the Indians while you do it. Lot's of slippery slope analogies can be made but really, it's all downhill from here. I'm enjoying the sight, but only because I'm well away from the boulders really. Hahah if you believe that's genuine then you probably believe horoscopes too. Fan fiction forum is thattaway sonny. Some people really are utterly stupid and gullible. Considering it matches the opinions of 9 different employees on that employment survey site posted early there is not much question. oh the troll ccp alt guy, shouldn't have even bothered to reply. His name was John Turbefield!
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:28:00 - [1830] Originally by: Atreus Venom well here is CCP to back you and tell us its fake... i dotn see them responding to that i see them responding to the overheated computers though... so they are here just not gonna touch this subject until we cool off or leave I WANT TO SEE CCP [insert name] TELL US SOMETHING... **** THE ALTS.. btw CCP FALLOUT that name sounds so appropriate right now º--Atreus--º
Elison Muerte Caldari Moustache Twirling Space Cads Auctorita Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:28:00 - [1831] I've got my monocle right here peasants!
Atreus Venom Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:30:00 - [1832] Originally by: Atreus Venom Edited by: Atreus Venom on 23/06/2011 19:29:29 Originally by: Atreus Venom Edited by: Atreus Venom on 23/06/2011 19:18:47 THE NEW DIRECTION OF CCP AND NOW MY CQ LOOKS LIKE THIS!!!!! i removed image cuz it was too wide but it is on the previous page if you want to see how CCP IS **ING US!!!! and i only used 137 PLEX for the girl and the coat was 80 PLEX CCP **ERS!!! º--Atreus--º
Tyree Jinx Minmatar Sebiestor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:30:00 - [1833] looks real.
Republica Winder Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:30:00 - [1834] Originally by: Alaura Aquila Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And the joke is on the *gots who buy them. Hope they enjoy a tranq server with 1k players @ max capacity all sipping single-malt and buying another system in nullsec with euros. Maybe this will solve the lag issue? I guess that's one way to do it. If you ** off all your players and they leave there will be a lot less server lag. I guess they can go ahead and pink slip all the Devs working on lag now, the cash shop and plans to monetize EVERYTHING ELSE In this game has rendered their jobs irrelevant. While they are at it they could probably remove half the 0.0 regions to save on database size too, there will still be way more room than is actually needed.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:30:00 - [1835] Originally by: Hesperius Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And the joke is on the *gots who buy them. Hope they enjoy a tranq server with 1k players @ max capacity all sipping single-malt and buying another system in nullsec with euros. The only person who I have encountered who played into this micro transaction stuff, spent $1200 on in game gold on some F2P Korean game. He was a 38 year old virgin with a learning disability who was on welfare living with his mother and decided to use that money on game currency instead of getting dental work done. I met this person through Eve, and I now wonder if he has returned to Eve to give CCP some more of his welfare checks. I remember him. ing sad story that one. -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
delonewolf	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:31:00 - [1836] Originally by: Jherdan Berral Originally by: delonewolf Edited by: delonewolf on 23/06/2011 18:53:00 i'm not one to complain, i have nothing against vanity items in a shop, but if you put one game altering item in that thing i am done. i just bought a plex for isk for the first time to make sure you won't get paid with my money for the next month, you will have to come out with an ironclad guarantie that only vanity items will ever be in that shop to re-earn my trust and paying sub. Err... if you sub, you pay CCP fifteen bucks. If you buy plex with isk, someone else is paying CCP 20 bucks -for- you (A bit less if they buy in bulk). In effect, you are giving them just as much if not more money. err i said my money, i know ccp has been paid for the plex, it just won't be from my wallet anymore. plexes are paid for so make no difference to me or ccp, wether i go back to paying after the plex is the difference and the only one we can make. buying and using a plex is a step i did not see myself take yesterday.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:31:00 - [1837] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: General Windypops Originally by: MrSteack Failheap pt2: There is no real discussion at CCP, and there hasn't been for quite a while. Like Seleene said, the majority of employees get told squad, don't know what's going on, quite a few have become complete apathetic to what's being decided even. In the end, it's just a job, and they are actively encouraged in that direction. They aren't asked for their opinion and even if they'd have one, or wanted to ventilate one, there's nowhere to go with it. They are just there to concentrate on their thing, and applaud there rest, and basically drink the coolaid. Most stopped caring quite some time ago. And that is mostly because the 'leadership' (hard to talk about leadership when it's become so incompetent but what other word is there?) is by now entirely 'personified'. Call it little kingdoms, call it cliques, call it whatever you like, there are just a couple of people who really have an influence, and although that's not bad in and off itself, they stopped listening to everyone else but to those who tell them what they like to hear (read Stoffer) or who tell them funny things. This was the case when :18months: happened, and just like now, CCP circled the wagons, and it just got worse. Moreover, what came out here now, was already common knowledge for quite some time at CCP internally, so quite a lot of the good guys, the guys with options to go somewhere else, well, they have packed their bags, or they are quite busy packing their bags. Why am I telling you this? Well, because I think it is important that you understand that it is basically over. This may be EVE's NGE moment, it may not be, we don't know yet, but one thing should be clear. This magazine is a clear reflection of how CCP think internally. And once you realise that, it is clear that for EVE it is over. Perhaps just for me, I can accept that not everyone will agree with me on this, but this way of thinking 'breaks' EVE. It is fundamentally flawed, and it will only get worse over time. CCP the company is, in my view falling apart, and so is EVE with it. And frankly, I don't see how it can be stopped, not any more. And no amount of circling the wagons can stop this from happening. Not if half of your cowboys are basically joining the Indians while you do it. Lot's of slippery slope analogies can be made but really, it's all downhill from here. I'm enjoying the sight, but only because I'm well away from the boulders really. Hahah if you believe that's genuine then you probably believe horoscopes too. Fan fiction forum is thattaway sonny. Some people really are utterly stupid and gullible. Considering it matches the opinions of 9 different employees on that employment survey site posted early there is not much question. oh the troll ccp alt guy, shouldn't have even bothered to reply. What do you mean 'matches'. All the guys done is post a very vague made up description with no actual factual details and using only info that's already in the public domain. If you're so desperately gullible that you'll believe it then fair play to you. Tell your fortune for one monocle, sir. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
The Offerer Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:31:00 - [1838] Originally by: Tammarr Milly being internet raging because her buddy got banned. Milly being inflammatory because 'she got 20b in plexes', opps, no extra plex demand, oops no spike in plex price thx to (admittedly) high priced items, oops failed market speculation, got to hurt. People reading a supposedly internal document aimed to be read by none other. 'Gordon Gekko' edition, roflmao. they got humour. a document most likely if true intended to discuss from two opposing viewpoints MT usage and to form/weather internal opinions. Stop listening to the forum warriors, realize ccp did everyone paying subs with plex a favour with this initial high pricing since the spike in demand was left out. realize that failed spike in demand got some market mongols butthurt. i realize that hellicity getting kicked might not have been the best way since yeah; buddies have mobilized a flamewar, if the ban is actually for the reason they so present. (Did we ever get to know if miss hulkageddon did have a hulk bpo or no btw? ) This flamenaught is over nothing when you apply logic, except a fair few hurt individuals marshalling all their might to poke ccp, the big evil master corporation in the face because they were left out. Obvious CCP alt is obvious.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:31:00 - [1839] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling
Kary Tamona Crom Demons	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:32:00 - [1840] So it is true then... I'm out of here.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:32:00 - [1841] So... 23 hours gone... nearly at the 2000 post mark...
Lady Aphra Ladies of Negotiable Affection	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:33:00 - [1842] With a very heavy heart, I have unsubbed. I have until August. I shall re-sub if CCP care to consider the way they are directing the game's development, if not, my main will unsub too. CCP, I have played and loved this game for nearly 5 years now, this was a very difficult decision, but your silence on this issue speaks volumes to me. Saddened and dispirited 2006 player.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:33:00 - [1843] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png this was posted on there, then it went down ????????????
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:33:00 - [1844] CCP: If it's unflattering, it's untrue.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:34:00 - [1845] Originally by: Cyber Duck So... 23 hours gone... nearly at the 2000 post mark... only a pathetic paragraph IN DIFFERENT THREAD, on this matter
Landlady	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:34:00 - [1846] Cancelled my account, and my second one too, unfortunately that is barely 1/2 a monocle's worth of $ : /
E man Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:35:00 - [1847] Unsubing may not even show. Incarna will bring back some poeple just to see it. So sub numbers won't go down. Also despite the forum whinning people just don't care enough. They may think "wow thats dumb" and then undock as normal. Problem is if the "metrics" show this works it will affect the people who don't care. Rather than post they will just unsub, no rage, no threads they will just leave. ______ Hello WoW players. Look at your toon, now back to me. Sadly it isn't me, but if it wasn't simplistic pre scripted linear mono dimensional game you could look like me. I'm in a Paladin
Tarmuk	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:36:00 - [1848] -2 subs. Was fun while it lasted. See you on some other game.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:37:00 - [1849] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:37:04 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png this was posted on there, then it went down ???????????? Yeah I was keeping this thread and that one going at the same time. I read it over there. If I'm not mistaken, I had trouble accessing it at least one other time as well for about 10 minutes.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:37:00 - [1850] Edited by: MrSteack on 23/06/2011 19:38:07 Originally by: Black Dranzer :images of removed thread: CCP: If it's unflattering, it's untrue. That thread is showing up on my PC, check your connection http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535654 Post #14 is the one we are all talking about
Miagi Sans Amarr PURgE-Corp PURgE Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:37:00 - [1851] if i wasn't so addicted to eve i would have rage quit just now too :(
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:38:00 - [1852] Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png this was posted on there, then it went down ???????????? mmmmmm hmmmmmm remember the timing when that last happened.......... I wonder if they took it down themselves to reduce liability. Forums are somewhat protected from their users posts in US right? Was it US that made them liable? His name was John Turbefield!
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:38:00 - [1853] Originally by: Black Dranzer CCP: If it's unflattering, it's untrue. /facepalm --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! ht
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:39:00 - [1854] Originally by: MrSteack That thread is showing up on my PC, check your connection The thread is there. The post isn't. Their moderation is on overdrive.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:39:00 - [1855] I have a hard time believing there is no "metric," for people mass unsub'ing in less than 24 hours. There is SOMEONE at CCP who's going to see that spam in his inbox.
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:39:00 - [1856] Originally by: Black Dranzer CCP: If it's unflattering, it's untrue. Why am i not surprised? It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:40:00 - [1857] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: MrSteack That thread is showing up on my PC, check your connection The thread is there. The post isn't. Their moderation is on overdrive. ... /facepalm
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:40:00 - [1858] Well then. Sent my E-Mails to the Argentine press. Hopefully one will give it a look. Bad press is done in Argentina. Spread it to your countries.
Sylphs	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:40:00 - [1859] -2 Subs here too. Will re sub only if item shop goes poof.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:40:00 - [1860] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png this was posted on there, then it went down ???????????? mmmmmm hmmmmmm remember the timing when that last happened.......... I wonder if they took it down themselves to reduce liability. Forums are somewhat protected from their users posts in US right? Was it US that made them liable? back up with post gone lol good job it was screen shotted and dl,d
Dograzor The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:40:00 - [1861] Confirming that they are deleting posts without notifying. On another note, this thread is reaching 100.000 views in less then 24h. Shouldn't this tell CCP something? - "We don't gank, we just apply force in a disproportionate manner during an uneven tactical combat situation to maximize revenue and increase shareholder value"
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:41:00 - [1862] The danger for CCP is that it will be all to easy to dismiss un-subbing because in reality noone quit anything. After unsubbing on my accounts, I realize i have 75 days till it runs out. Are they counting on this dying down in a few weeks and my weak will to not come back to eve-crack? I fear it wont really mean anything till its a hit on active accounts.. not subs.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:41:00 - [1863] When Chribba, Akita T, and Milia, all start getting concerned... You know ****'s gettin real
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:42:00 - [1864] Edited by: Carmine Lady on 23/06/2011 19:43:21 Originally by: Dograzor Confirming that they are deleting posts without notifying. On another note, this thread is reaching 100.000 views in less then 24h. Shouldn't this tell CCP something? it probably is but they dont like us anymore, Im convinced ccp dont care. Originally by: Cyber Duck When Chribba, Akita T, and Milia, all start getting concerned... You know **'s gettin real When people like Helicity get banned from forum thats also when ** gets real
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:42:00 - [1865] Originally by: Dograzor Confirming that they are deleting posts without notifying. On another note, this thread is reaching 100.000 views in less then 24h. Shouldn't this tell CCP something? That the need to put their head deeper in the sand? or That they need to basically sack everyone and restructure this week? His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
Mac Aoidh Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:42:00 - [1866] I'm not just unsubbing but recycling my character. 9 hours till biomass. **** you CCP!
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:43:00 - [1867] Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png this was posted on there, then it went down ???????????? mmmmmm hmmmmmm remember the timing when that last happened.......... I wonder if they took it down themselves to reduce liability. Forums are somewhat protected from their users posts in US right? Was it US that made them liable? back up with post gone lol good job it was screen shotted and dl,d Again if anyone didn't read it: http://forum.eveuniversity.org/viewtopic.php?p=392578#p392578 --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Doc Fury Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:43:00 - [1868] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 19:31:41 Does anyone know why Failheap is still down? EDIT : spelling His host cut him off. Originally by: trox Hosting company basically told me lol, **** your forum. I am getting a dedicated box, clearly the forums will be down for a bit, but it should be fine by tonight. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.'
Scorpii Zenith Minmatar Ancient Heat	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:43:00 - [1869] Originally by: Masjheira What an idiot I was to actually think CCP was still concerned by the quality of their gaming experience... They care about money, nothing else. Time for me to look for another game. You know it's not FREE to make MMORPG game and constantly upgrade it. And if your business isn't making PROFIT, your doing it wrong. ****ing poor ass whining bitter vet losers
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:43:00 - [1870] Originally by: Cyber Duck When Chribba, Akita T, and Milia, all start getting concerned... You know **'s gettin real I missed Chribba and Akita T posting. They probably snuck it in while I was sleeping.... -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
McSkeezy	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:44:00 - [1871] The sad thing is that for every person that unsubs, only two monocles need be purchased per year to recoup the costs. As soon as I see any confirmed non-cosmetic items in the cash-shop, I'm out. Frankly don't care about how much Monocles cost, because I never planned on purchasing any cosmetic items anyways.
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:44:00 - [1872] What i do not understand, and cannot believe is that CCP is so Blind not to see what they do. Sony hat its Waterloo with SWG when they brought in NGE... against massive Community resistance. They believed that the Community will stay.. never ment what they do.. and that WE Players are none to take Seriuous. CCP look at Sony.. look what happend with SWG after they completely ignored the Player Base... You may think we will stay.. Most will stay.. but we have an eye on what comes, and one item can break the complete Game. Some may call us whiners.. who cares. I like this Game but i am not addicted and im not Married with Eve. If it turns ****.. i turn my back. Easy enough. One of the best parts is.. they want us to pay money for fitting slots.. as long as i can import my fittings from 3rt party.. Its useless.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:44:00 - [1873] delete and moderate it as much as you want Linkage
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:44:00 - [1874] Do people think we should seperate the EVE Dev team from ccp itself? if CCP are telling the eve dev team to implement this as their business model... then it's ccp's problem... not the eve dev team... who maybe split over the direction the game is heading. Apart from soundwave... he's a weekend warrior... plex for standings? hah... go grind like the rest of us you fool -------
Malachi256	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:44:00 - [1875] It would be interesting to hear comments from representatives of some of the big corporations. Does this change anything, will there be a disruption of corp leadership, etc.
Landlady	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:45:00 - [1876] Originally by: E man Industries Unsubing may not even show. Incarna will bring back some poeple just to see it. So sub numbers won't go down. Also despite the forum whinning people just don't care enough. They may think "wow thats dumb" and then undock as normal. Problem is if the "metrics" show this works it will affect the people who don't care. Rather than post they will just unsub, no rage, no threads they will just leave. Sadly, if the metrics show +cash for them, then it is what is 'good' for the game, and thus the community, and thus the players. Sadly, this is the truth, no matter how crappy it may sound.
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:45:00 - [1877] Originally by: Kallehd So, anyone has any ideias on when SW: TOR goes live? Now is looking like "the" timming! Supposdly october but it's Bioware, like blizzard they wont release till their happy could be next year. Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Gurgeh Murat Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:46:00 - [1878] This is NOT a whine post. Its a HOPE post. Dear "retch" CCP My three accounts will no longer be playing your game. Im sure the temporary influx of people who have no idea of what EvE was really about will temporarily fill the gap of me, and others like me, but you...YOU...have killed this game. Youve destroyed the player created/maintained sandbox. How so? More than 24hrs and youve not rebutted the leaked newsletter. False is easy to denounce. Youve done ** ALL. So pay to win is a "good news feature" on its way sometime soon. In game items out of thin air. Youve tried to gouge the people who fixed the holes in your otherwise unplayable game. to quote Professor Farnsworth "good news everyone, were ing you over" People paying out of their pocket to make YOUR game better. Youve lied to us. Trust is like a mirror. You can fix it, but you always see the cracks. Oh wait, youve not even tried to fix it. You recognize this is a niche game. That is, not full of **ed ups with no sense who can put some thought into a game. Thats not a bad niche. Yet you think we will not realize when you serve cow as fillet steak? You release a contentless "expansion" that provides NOTHING but a place to show off ridiculously overpriced vanity items. Ok, a few bug fixes, and I applaud that. But the basic message. MOAR MONEY!! You move the game to micro transactions without considering that microtransactions in a PAY TO PLAY game means were being charged twice. Once just to log on, and again to have any hope of being competitive. "oh but weve never said we're gonna move the game to microtransactions". Oryly? When one of your senior devs is massively in favour of it , I take that as a its gonna happen. EvE has moved into its end days. Your ing off all the people who read the forums e.g the folk who give a damn about your game. The majority of "noobs" dont read the forums. They dont stick around either. The people who have given you money over the past 8 years ARE the people who read the forums. And they have a voice. And an option. Lots of them really. I have many billions in assets. It doesent mean if im not enjoying what YOU are doing to the game. I can happily flit from World of Tanks to Champions online. FREE TO PLAY GAMES. If I like them, I can pay money to get better gear. Fine, outlined from the outset, and i know ill face people who have traded beer tokens (i.e. rl money) for an in game advantage. But this...THIS......... Yes brethren, I am more than mildly irate. But there can be hope. CCP, stop trying to milk a golden goose. Were not that demanding. fix the many bugs, keep a STABLE player base, enjoy the revenue and use it for whatever. Dont try to nickel and dime us. Dont try to milk us. Remember the people posting on here are the REAL (no disrespect) players of eve. You trade us in for transigent income at your peril. I paid for a friend to come back to eve a month ago. Because I had faith. Your destroying it. Bear in mind. IM not talking about changing my mortgage provider, or moving job. "meh, EvE has become **, ill play something else." Its not a big deal really. Or is it....Well I guess it is if you need my subs to keep your reconfigured herring factory running. GG CCP, gg.... Yours Gurgeh Murat Closed System Dr Fynemann
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:46:00 - [1879] Originally by: The Offerer Originally by: Tammarr Obvious CCP alt is obvious. That the best you got for a response not fitting with the general scheme? sure I'am CCP Soundwave glad to meet you. Saying I'am someone I'am not does not make the meaning in my post less true.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:46:00 - [1880] Originally by: Scorpii Zenith Originally by: Masjheira What an idiot I was to actually think CCP was still concerned by the quality of their gaming experience... They care about money, nothing else. Time for me to look for another game. You know it's not FREE to make MMORPG game and constantly upgrade it. And if your business isn't making PROFIT, your doing it wrong. ****ing poor ass whining bitter vet losers And yet so many mmo's of the past made money on just a sub fee. Others did the same thing with a free game charging for in-game items. Explain again why CCP now needs both (not to mention the most expensive in-game garb in history)?
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:46:00 - [1881] Originally by: Ein Spiegel Surprised not locked yet. But I didn't sift through the 55 pages. I'm assuming there's not a CCP dev response here. However. When I initially read the EN24 article, I concluded it was fake within 5 minutes. And this is why. It has nothing, absolutely nothing, to do with Eve. It has to do with references to WoD content. The most damning is the reference to CCP Stephanie Myers. To start, they wouldn't allow a Dev name to match a real name. There are legal complications. But that's not the big reason this screams FAKE. The big reason, as any developer on the WoD team would know, is that the mere mention of that name will cause violence, pain, and suffering to the person that uses it from anyone that is hardcore WoD enough to attend Masquerade (which is the Camarilla gathering and somewhat like "FanFest" for Eve in the WoD world) and actually see the few tidbits CCP has shown about WoD MMO there. This is written by someone that thinks "Oh, a Vampire MMO would of course be just like Twilight." Which, if repeated in my presence, would lead to an immediate disemboweling. There is that much difference in mood, setting, and theme, as to cause physical pain if the two are in the same sentence. CCP devs know this. Why? Because White Wolf employees are on the team - they didn't all cut and run when CCP bought White Wolf publishing. The hardcore fans of WoD are such that they sued (granted, they lost... c'mon) over the image of the game when story elements and business requirements caused them to be upset. (This is why the Camarilla, which was independent, is now owned wholly by White Wolf - it's like me suing my favorite author because I don't like how their latest book upsets my fanfic. WoD players are in fact that passionate. Not too bright, sometimes, but passionate.) Of course, the DUST related comment also points to someone that has no clue what is going on... it blatantly contradicts what the CEO has already said about DUST. Dust will be free to download. Free to play. The only income stream from Dust is going to be MT. This was repeated again during the AT9 coverage. I just don't see this being real. (sarcasm) It's almost "fair and balanced", if you will. (end sarcasm) It is about on par with all of the other "quality" coverage you get at EN24. I'm not saying that I don't think CCP may be looking a lot closer at MT, and there may be parts of it that actually have some truthiness. However, I imagine part of the reason we don't see a CCP response to this yet is because, if it's fake, the author of the article and the entire EN24 website has just opened themselves up to a major liability in the "slander/libel" arena, and if it's real, it's a major liability in the "confidential"/"privacy"/"corporate espionage" area. Either way, lawyers may become involved, and they do not react quickly to forum posters. In fact, silence is a pretty good indication that some kind of legal action may be underway. After all that typing, I'd have thought you'd have gone to the pretty slight effort to look for the original, unedited version. Hint: The real names were mostly removed in the EN24 version, and sometimes not so well. The real name of that person is in the original, and it's not Stephenie Meyer or the misspelled one in the EN24 edit. I'm not linking to it, but it's available.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:47:00 - [1882] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Cyber Duck When Chribba, Akita T, and Milia, all start getting concerned... You know ****'s gettin real I missed Chribba and Akita T posting. They probably snuck it in while I was sleeping.... Chribba Posted in another thread a week or so back about the 99$ "token" payment... akita t's in here somewhere though
Olaf Rasmussen Utopian Research I.E.L. Hedonistic Imperative	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:49:00 - [1883] Edited by: Olaf Rasmussen on 23/06/2011 19:50:01 -2 accounts. This is beyond salvaging
Dierdra Vaal Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:49:00 - [1884] Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 23/06/2011 19:49:58 Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 23/06/2011 19:49:46 lets not forget that CCP's Chief Financial Officer, Joseph Gallo, used to be Managing Director, Investment Banking at CITIGROUP. Yes, from the bank that nearly went under and needed a massive bailout from the US government. This was the same year that Gallo left (was fired from?) citigroup after working there 14 years. Just, you know, making sure it's not forgotten. Sources: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/joseph-gallo/20/726/64b http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122747680752551447.html Veto #205 * * * Director Emeritus at EVE University * * * CSM1 delegate, CSM3 chairman and CSM5 vice-chairman
Eladaris Frost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:50:00 - [1885] Originally by: Tammarr That the best you got for a response not fitting with the general scheme? sure I'am CCP Soundwave glad to meet you. Saying I'am someone I'am not does not make the meaning in my post less true. You can't even be arsed to log into the game, does your opinion on a faceless alt really matter?
War Kitten Panda McLegion	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:50:00 - [1886] Posting to confirm I am shocked. I am shocked that CCP has a marketing/sales department and that they produce newsletters, and that their goal is to make money. Shocked I tell you. Anybody want one of our internal newsletters at work? We try to make money too. This has to be stopped. "Here's your sign..."
Erichk Knaar Caldari Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:51:00 - [1887] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And yet so many mmo's of the past made money on just a sub fee. Others did the same thing with a free game charging for in-game items. Explain again why CCP now needs both (not to mention the most expensive in-game garb in history)? Ignoring the lolprice for the monocle for second, care to name one sub-only supported game that's still running?
Jim Luc Caldari Rule of Five Split Infinity.	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:51:00 - [1888] One of the reasons that micro-transactions work is because they are MICRO. Usually for about $5 - $10 you could get a batch of things. These are vanity items. $80 for a stupid eye-patch?? Did someone really think it would be cool enough to warrant this?? No offense to the art people, it really doesn't look all that awesome. I think we are all a bit miffed because when someone thinks MT they think small amounts of money that is optional, ie vanity items. But that you could quickly purchase on a whim, along with a pack of gum at the end of checkout. Also - I fully expected the store to be completely stocked with lots of great things, each for $1 or $2, ie a single PLEX can purchase 15 - 20 items. This store should be stocked with at least 40 pieces of clothing available for purchase. Horse Armor was only $2.50... http://www.joystiq.com/2006/04/03/download-oblivions-horse-armor-for-a-price/
Ganthrithor Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:51:00 - [1889] My favorite was the bit about how "microtransactions will motivate us to produce better content-- if people don't like our offerings they'll keep using what they have rather than forking over more money for new features." I suppose I can choose not to use all the stupid Incarna stuff you've spent the last year(s) working on in exchange for a partial refund of my subscription money then, right?
Tammarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:51:00 - [1890] Originally by: Eladaris Frost Originally by: Tammarr That the best you got for a response not fitting with the general scheme? sure I'am CCP Soundwave glad to meet you. Saying I'am someone I'am not does not make the meaning in my post less true. You can't even be arsed to log into the game, does your opinion on a faceless alt really matter? It does. Does your attack on my faceless self mean you have no argument for what I'am saying?
Bllizzard	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:52:00 - [1891] And I was thinking the boot.ini screw up was bad, this brings a whole new dimension to the word FAIL.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:52:00 - [1892] Originally by: War Kitten Posting to confirm I am shocked. I am shocked that CCP has a marketing/sales department and that they produce newsletters, and that their goal is to make money. Shocked I tell you. Anybody want one of our internal newsletters at work? We try to make money too. This has to be stopped. White knights, please elaborate. Have we been playing this game for free since 2003 and I never knew it? Otherwise your argument holds no water.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:53:00 - [1893] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: MrSteack That thread is showing up on my PC, check your connection The thread is there. The post isn't. Their moderation is on overdrive. Yea they deleted mine too where I "joke" and "devblog" were in same sentence. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
i hatechosingnames Gallente Dreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:53:00 - [1894]
William Walker Amarr House Aratus Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:54:00 - [1895] -1 sub. 29th of July I'm out. I hope I can see CCP back-pedaling on this, but I doubt it. ________________________________________________
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:55:00 - [1896] Originally by: Malachi256 It would be interesting to hear comments from representatives of some of the big corporations. Does this change anything, will there be a disruption of corp leadership, etc. Errr... why? As previously mentioned many time there's almost no discussion of this at all in the main alliances, and they really couldn't care less. CCP is a company. With shareholders. Of course they're here to make money. Not seen a single person in game saying they were even bothered, let alone quitting. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Malachi256	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:55:00 - [1897] Edited by: Malachi256 on 23/06/2011 19:55:21 Originally by: War Kitten Posting to confirm I am shocked. I am shocked that CCP has a marketing/sales department and that they produce newsletters, and that their goal is to make money. Shocked I tell you. Anybody want one of our internal newsletters at work? We try to make money too. This has to be stopped. Way to misrepresent the argument. Not a single person here has stated that they don't want CCP to make money. Robust game development is the pathway that everyone here wants CCP to take to making more money. Short-cut microtransactions that not only don't add to the game, but are fundamentally destructive to it, are where people have a problem. CCP going from a company of gamers doing something they love for a profit, to a company of profiteers fleecing gamers, is the fundamental issue. Two days ago (for those of us who were largely ignorant of the internal workings at CCP), this game had a future. Now, it does not.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:55:00 - [1898] over 100k+
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:56:00 - [1899] Edited by: Reed Tiburon on 23/06/2011 19:56:28 Originally by: Dierdra Vaal Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 23/06/2011 19:49:58 Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 23/06/2011 19:49:46 lets not forget that CCP's Chief Financial Officer, Joseph Gallo, used to be Managing Director, Investment Banking at CITIGROUP. Yes, from the bank that nearly went under and needed a massive bailout from the US government. This was the same year that Gallo left (was fired from?) citigroup after working there 14 years. Just, you know, making sure it's not forgotten. Sources: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/joseph-gallo/20/726/64b http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122747680752551447.html When a former CSM loves you so much that he brings this up, well... Stay fighting, DV. I can't imagine what it must have been like to face this boneheaded, head-in-the-sand, island-fever attitude every time you went up to that frigid rock to talk to these chuckleheads. http://www.galleryhosted.com/FVJEYPHPYDF2GD3/001_FVJEYPHPYDF2GD3.png --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Hans Jagerblitzen Autocannons Anonymous	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:56:00 - [1900] I've posted this thread, where you all can share your thoughts on an alternative solution to the microtransaction model proposed by CCP. They want our money, what a surprise. Lets take this opportunity to show them that we are open to ways that accomplish this without destroying the integrity of New Eden as seen by its core player base. ....resume trolling.
dhunpael Caldari Narwhals Ate My Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:56:00 - [1901] i am to shocked that ccp does this. making money is okay, but not at the cost of your player base. Give us less content and more real fixes. don't implement MACRO transactions if you are allready making money every month from every player. i am to thinking to stop playing eve if this keeps on going
Nikki West	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:56:00 - [1902] Over 100k views and still no blue feedback ... ---
glepp	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:56:00 - [1903] Unsubbed 2/3 accounts. Last one will get unsubbed soon. They run out in october, and unless CCP changes out bigtime, I'm not investing any more time, money or effort into a company i have lost faith in. Goodbye CCP, it was fun while you still seemed to care.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:57:00 - [1904] Can we say Threadtitan now?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:58:00 - [1905] Originally by: Gurgeh Murat This is NOT a whine post. Its a HOPE post. Dear "retch" CCP My three accounts will no longer be playing your game. Im sure the temporary influx of people who have no idea of what EvE was really about will temporarily fill the gap of me, and others like me, but you...YOU...have killed this game. Youve destroyed the player created/maintained sandbox. How so? More than 24hrs and youve not rebutted the leaked newsletter. False is easy to denounce. Youve done ** ALL. So pay to win is a "good news feature" on its way sometime soon. In game items out of thin air. Youve tried to gouge the people who fixed the holes in your otherwise unplayable game. to quote Professor Farnsworth "good news everyone, were ing you over" People paying out of their pocket to make YOUR game better. Youve lied to us. Trust is like a mirror. You can fix it, but you always see the cracks. Oh wait, youve not even tried to fix it. You recognize this is a niche game. That is, not full of **ed ups with no sense who can put some thought into a game. Thats not a bad niche. Yet you think we will not realize when you serve cow as fillet steak? You release a contentless "expansion" that provides NOTHING but a place to show off ridiculously overpriced vanity items. Ok, a few bug fixes, and I applaud that. But the basic message. MOAR MONEY!! You move the game to micro transactions without considering that microtransactions in a PAY TO PLAY game means were being charged twice. Once just to log on, and again to have any hope of being competitive. "oh but weve never said we're gonna move the game to microtransactions". Oryly? When one of your senior devs is massively in favour of it , I take that as a its gonna happen. EvE has moved into its end days. Your ing off all the people who read the forums e.g the folk who give a damn about your game. The majority of "noobs" dont read the forums. They dont stick around either. The people who have given you money over the past 8 years ARE the people who read the forums. And they have a voice. And an option. Lots of them really. I have many billions in assets. It doesent mean if im not enjoying what YOU are doing to the game. I can happily flit from World of Tanks to Champions online. FREE TO PLAY GAMES. If I like them, I can pay money to get better gear. Fine, outlined from the outset, and i know ill face people who have traded beer tokens (i.e. rl money) for an in game advantage. But this...THIS......... Yes brethren, I am more than mildly irate. But there can be hope. CCP, stop trying to milk a golden goose. Were not that demanding. fix the many bugs, keep a STABLE player base, enjoy the revenue and use it for whatever. Dont try to nickel and dime us. Dont try to milk us. Remember the people posting on here are the REAL (no disrespect) players of eve. You trade us in for transigent income at your peril. I paid for a friend to come back to eve a month ago. Because I had faith. Your destroying it. Bear in mind. IM not talking about changing my mortgage provider, or moving job. "meh, EvE has become **, ill play something else." Its not a big deal really. Or is it....Well I guess it is if you need my subs to keep your reconfigured herring factory running. GG CCP, gg.... Yours Gurgeh Murat Closed System Dr Fynemann Bold the bit CCP will hear. "Oh cool he agrees, F2P ftw" His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:58:00 - [1906] The contempt for the player opinion was pretty shocking too. It was clear that the only thing holding back their plans to enact full-scale MT is working out how to sneak it past us. And that they believe our (Was is 90%) refusal of MT was stupid. If CCP doesn`t want us as players, and that`s what that newsletter says - then they can live without us. -
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:58:00 - [1907] and another one bites the dust
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:58:00 - [1908] Originally by: Erichk Knaar Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And yet so many mmo's of the past made money on just a sub fee. Others did the same thing with a free game charging for in-game items. Explain again why CCP now needs both (not to mention the most expensive in-game garb in history)? Ignoring the lolprice for the monocle for second, care to name one sub-only supported game that's still running? pretty sure Darkfall Online is still sub-only (imo harsher pvp than EVE but also much smaller playerbase).
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 19:59:00 - [1909] Originally by: glepp Unsubbed 2/3 accounts. Last one will get unsubbed soon. They run out in october, and unless CCP changes out bigtime, I'm not investing any more time, money or effort into a company i have lost faith in. Goodbye CCP, it was fun while you still seemed to care. See this, CCP? You don't know him, but this is glepp. He is one of the many players who make up the vital social fabric between CCP and game. He is a regular poster on the E-UNI forums, helping the newest of the newbies get their heads around this complex and often unintuitive game. He, in short, is good people. He doesn't give a **** about you anymore. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Galandole Tsuramananda	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:00:00 - [1910] Originally by: i hatechosingnames What a badass you are. Make sure you contract your crap to this character, so I can continue to enjoy the game with it.
Iulia Badr Marinela	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:00:00 - [1911] http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533269
Chip Flux Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:00:00 - [1912] What happened to the ` there are good people in ccp, who can turn this around like they always have`, attitude. I do not believe for one moment, that it is not just the wrong people in charge atm, causing this. And.. when it is sorted out, I expect to see all that clothing that you have sitting there, being denied to all your loyal players, put into the wardrobe of our rather bland quarters, every one of them Chip Flux
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:02:00 - [1913] Originally by: Enuen Ravenseye Originally by: Cipher Jones If everyone who said it wasn't real can just go ahead and take a picture with your foot in your mouth now that would be just great. Please post the pics in this thread only as we want a consolidated thread. Is it possible to sticky a single post? I almost feel bad for the CCP alts who posted with their claims of the newsletter being fake, only to find out their boss has now confirmed it's true. I would laugh but I'm afraid I'm too busy trying to hold down the bile. CCP alts? No, they'd have seen the original.
Cedric deBouilard Gallente EVE University Ivy League	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:02:00 - [1914] Originally by: glepp Unsubbed 2/3 accounts. Last one will get unsubbed soon. They run out in october, and unless CCP changes out bigtime, I'm not investing any more time, money or effort into a company i have lost faith in. Goodbye CCP, it was fun while you still seemed to care. It's sad to hear that from you glepp, but I can't argue with your reasons for I feel the same way
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:02:00 - [1915] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Edited by: Reed Tiburon on 23/06/2011 19:59:11 Originally by: glepp Unsubbed 2/3 accounts. Last one will get unsubbed soon. They run out in october, and unless CCP changes out bigtime, I'm not investing any more time, money or effort into a company i have lost faith in. Goodbye CCP, it was fun while you still seemed to care. See this, CCP? You don't know him, but this is glepp. He is one of the many players who make up the vital social fabric between CCP and game. He is a regular poster on the E-UNI forums, helping the newest of the newbies get their heads around this complex and often unintuitive game. He, in short, is good people. He doesn't give a **** about you anymore. If I worked at CCP, I'd be worried about stuff like this. They don't get that. He's 1% in an SQL query done 5mins before a meeting. His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:02:00 - [1916] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Erichk Knaar Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot And yet so many mmo's of the past made money on just a sub fee. Others did the same thing with a free game charging for in-game items. Explain again why CCP now needs both (not to mention the most expensive in-game garb in history)? Ignoring the lolprice for the monocle for second, care to name one sub-only supported game that's still running? pretty sure Darkfall Online is still sub-only (imo harsher pvp than EVE but also much smaller playerbase). Vanity MTs are prevalent in the sub-driven mmo market. Buying game advantages, that's not. Even blizzard has not crossed that threshold, although you might claim the race and server transfer accomplishes similar feats. The bottom line is, there are more successful titles who've pioneered more effective ways to "milk," their subscribers without taking a steaming crap on the ones who just want to sub and play without MT.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:02:00 - [1917] Originally by: Cyber Duck When Chribba, Akita T, and Milia, all start getting concerned... You know ****'s gettin real 2 i's and 2 'ls :) I think this picture sums what is happening now... I am sitting planning my exit strategy .. depending on CCP's next move.. basically my next move. So far I have cancelled all Eve App SDK development work and 2 Apps and further app brainstorming.
Terdarius	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:04:00 - [1918] wow... just wow... If this is really the direction CCP is heading I will surely miss a once great game company.... it's sad that every good game company seems to succumb to incredible greed over keeping their players happy at some point or another...
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:04:00 - [1919] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade Can we say Threadtitan now? Well, i think if we reach at least 360.000 clicks, it would qualify.
Wen Jaibao Aperture Harmonics K162	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:04:00 - [1920] Originally by: Dierdra Vaal Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 23/06/2011 19:49:58 Edited by: Dierdra Vaal on 23/06/2011 19:49:46 lets not forget that CCP's Chief Financial Officer, Joseph Gallo, used to be Managing Director, Investment Banking at CITIGROUP. Yes, from the bank that nearly went under and needed a massive bailout from the US government. This was the same year that Gallo left (was fired from?) citigroup after working there 14 years. Just, you know, making sure it's not forgotten. Sources: http://www.linkedin.com/pub/joseph-gallo/20/726/64b http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122747680752551447.html Christ, I can see it now. CCP: HEY LETS HIRE THIS GUY HE HAS EXPERIENCE No CCP, he only knows how to ruin everything and bail out with a golden parachute. I hope to god you aren't listening to anything he has to say. But you probably are. Perhaps we just found the smelly capitalist rat responsible for all of this?
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:05:00 - [1921] I detect smug from the OP.
War Kitten Panda McLegion	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:06:00 - [1922] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot White knights, please elaborate. Have we been playing this game for free since 2003 and I never knew it? Otherwise your argument holds no water. There was no argument, just a step back from the whole outrage that CCP is trying to make money. Companies do that. Companies that don't do that fail and go under. I make no judgement on the soundness of their decisions - I don't think MT are evil, nor do I think there is anything "Micro" about CCP's aurum.
Niobic Minmatar Infinite Monkey Cage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:06:00 - [1923] Greed is good? k i'll keep my 2 x ú15 a month kthnxcyabye
Strazdas Unstoppable	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:06:00 - [1924] Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. 3 words for you: team fortress 2
Dalmont Delantee Gallente Shiloh Technologies	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:06:00 - [1925] Msg to CCP: Greed is not good, Greed is ****ed. Personally I only buy micro transactions in LOTRO because I have a lifetime sub and sometimes I buy crap with my thousands of credits. I rare ever play the game since it went free to play. I also play NO FTP games, as the community is usually full of kids, tossers and **s. I also know a lot of the people whowere thinking about playing WoD are now very concerned, so not old are CCP ign up EVE with this they are ing up their up coming games too. I usually get ed off with all the rage quitters over nothing such as bugs, walking in closets or whatever stuff they add because it doesn't change the main game...THIS will and probably already has. Thanks CCP for ing up big time and please can we have some heads rolling and some decent people making this game not some ** who buys dresses for some *ty game other than EVE. Take comfort in knowing that its probably some pimply faced twit, or 40 year old virgin, who gleens everytime mommy offfers to take them to needle point lessons*
Kali Doom	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:07:00 - [1926] Edited by: Kali Doom on 23/06/2011 20:07:17 So, who is Bartholomeus Crane???
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:08:00 - [1927] You know what people? Bottom line is this...I know many of you still hoped this would work out and that ccp would come and fix this. Truth is they wont. I also know many are thinking.."oh **,no more eve what do I do?". It's a game. A game in which we have developed a close relationship with it's devs. And now we feel back stabbed. Forget hurting ccp which many of you would love to do. They don't care nor should you. Forget eve and break the addiction..or deal with where the game is headed. If you're really **ed..biomass the char and then there is no way back. I know my quitting wont hurt them..but I'll be damned if I let then have another cent of my money. I will not support them any longer. They will doom themselves sooner or later with the way they treat their players. Choose one of the two options. Deal with it or biomass if you can't quit. It has been fun playing/trolling with you guys and I hope to see some of you in swtor when it comes out.
Gurgeh Murat Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:08:00 - [1928] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Gurgeh Murat I can happily flit from World of Tanks to Champions online. FREE TO PLAY GAMES. Bold the bit CCP will hear. "Oh cool he agrees, F2P ftw" Absolutely correct good sir. EvE is turning into P2P MT game. Pay to play, or Micro transactions. Choose one. CCP want to have their cake and eat it. It will choke them. Good day to you sir.
Hirana Yoshida Behavioral Affront	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:08:00 - [1929] Eve24 is the biggest pile of ** this side of the milkyway .. they (he/she/it) literally makes FoxNews tagline kosher by comparison. Yes, vanity items can be bought .. big whoop/whaaa. As long as they are kept to their promise of keeping actual gameplay items out then who gives a ? Dust is a completely unrelated game with about as much in common with Eve as an asphalt factory has with a car manufacturer (ie. they function together but that is as far as it goes). WoD is still vaporware as far as I am concerned. We have heard diddly about it and there is no reason to think that it will ever launch as anything but a flashgame on FailBook. In short: Piece of ** nonsensical whinage.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:10:00 - [1930] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 23/06/2011 20:11:27 Originally by: Kali Doom So, who is Bartholomeus Crane??? Guy with Russian mafia looking for his door? edit: What are they called even? Still fly under KGB flags and stuff? His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:10:00 - [1931] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Eve24 is the biggest pile of ** this side of the milkyway .. they (he/she/it) literally makes FoxNews tagline kosher by comparison. Yes, vanity items can be bought .. big whoop/whaaa. As long as they are kept to their promise of keeping actual gameplay items out then who gives a ? Dust is a completely unrelated game with about as much in common with Eve as an asphalt factory has with a car manufacturer (ie. they function together but that is as far as it goes). WoD is still vaporware as far as I am concerned. We have heard diddly about it and there is no reason to think that it will ever launch as anything but a flashgame on FailBook. In short: Piece of ** nonsensical whinage. lol go read through this thread and then come back and say that i cba to link you the stuff go find it yourself
Erichk Knaar Caldari Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:10:00 - [1932] Originally by: Kali Doom Edited by: Kali Doom on 23/06/2011 20:07:17 So, who is Bartholomeus Crane??? A bittervet who claimed to be an AI expert, who still spergs walls of text hating on CCP [months/years] after he quit Eve. Unhealthy obsession is unhealthy.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:11:00 - [1933] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Eve24 is the biggest pile of ** this side of the milkyway .. they (he/she/it) literally makes FoxNews tagline kosher by comparison. Yes, vanity items can be bought .. big whoop/whaaa. As long as they are kept to their promise of keeping actual gameplay items out then who gives a ? Dust is a completely unrelated game with about as much in common with Eve as an asphalt factory has with a car manufacturer (ie. they function together but that is as far as it goes). WoD is still vaporware as far as I am concerned. We have heard diddly about it and there is no reason to think that it will ever launch as anything but a flashgame on FailBook. In short: Piece of ** nonsensical whinage. Filed under "we told you so" for later use against you. Thanks.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:11:00 - [1934] Originally by: Kali Doom Edited by: Kali Doom on 23/06/2011 20:07:17 So, who is Bartholomeus Crane??? Yeah, who is this guy? Right after he posts, Failheap goes offline. Odd.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:11:00 - [1935] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida Eve24 is the biggest pile of ** this side of the milkyway .. they (he/she/it) literally makes FoxNews tagline kosher by comparison. Yes, vanity items can be bought .. big whoop/whaaa. As long as they are kept to their promise of keeping actual gameplay items out then who gives a ? Dust is a completely unrelated game with about as much in common with Eve as an asphalt factory has with a car manufacturer (ie. they function together but that is as far as it goes). WoD is still vaporware as far as I am concerned. We have heard diddly about it and there is no reason to think that it will ever launch as anything but a flashgame on FailBook. In short: Piece of nonsensical whinage. So you're discounting something an obviously disgruntled CCP employee leaked to multiple sources because Eve News 24 broke the news first? REALLY? -Liang -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Magmemnon	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:12:00 - [1936] Found over at BC. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:12:00 - [1937] Question - is the monocle now a new unit of currency? "Id like to buy that titan from you good sir" "That will be 15 monocles please" "There you go, pleasure doing business with you." C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 (ಠ_O)
Soden Rah Gallente EVE University Ivy League	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:12:00 - [1938] I have held off posting for a while since it looked initially like this could well be a prank... Now it doesn't... My response to the gist of the document is this: A) you hold a position and stand by it, arguing in its defence with reasoned argument... If those arguments stand up, you get to keep that position... If the arguments don't stand up... you modify your position to take into account the counter arguments that defeated you... If you don't admit defeat to better arguments you are guilty of rigid dogmatism, and that leads to bad places... What you don't do is hold a position, you don't think you can justify to others, and simply keep quiet about it and implement its consequences without telling anyone... This is being what is known as a conniving, cowardly, yellow bellied chicken... If CCP really believe that MT is the way forward, then they should say so, and why... Then those of us that still disagree can know where we stand... And quit if necessary. lying about MT because you don't think we will like it is utter cowardice. B) I think introducing MT for vanity items is really bad, and totally oppose it (long argument not for right now in this heated atmosphere). Introducing MT for non-vanity items is unforgivable and I will quit if you ever do this. C) As far as I was concerned the NEX appeared on SiSi out of thin air, with the follow-up dev blog announcing a fait acompli that from now on clothing (and other items) would only be available for MT, and even the selection we had (which is not very good) would be reduced to the clothes on our backs... I read the forums quite a bit, and read all the dev blogs, and this came as a total shock to me... I basically found out that immersion was going to cost extra on the test server. This ****ed me off a lot. I pay a subscription for EVE... this gives (or should give) full access to the player economy, and with nothing other than my subscription and time, I can build, win, or buy with isk I make, anything in game (barring things like tourney prises) without paying another dime... In fact one of EVE's greatest strengths and one of the things that keeps me in it is the player driven economy... MT, even for vanity items destroys this... and destroys the player economy's immersive value as well. If you had posted a dev blog, 6 months ago, saying we are looking in to doing this, this, and this, what are your thoughts, would you accept this.... and we had had the ability to discuss the issue before a single line of code had been written... we could have had a civilised discussion on it... However you have tried to ram this down our throats with little to no warning, despite huge response to the one thread I was aware of in the assembly hall where almost everyone voted against MT... Because of this we can't have a civilised debate on the subject... Either MT goes... or I do... take your pick either way... From a PR perspective... You really need to get some kind of initial response, or at least explanation out NOW... it has already taken you to long to respond. And no, you can't have my stuff. -------- By Grfmsv÷tn, Eyjafjallaj÷kull, Vatnaj÷kull, and Hekla itself... THIS is my sig. Support Optional CQ
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:12:00 - [1939] Originally by: Hirana Yoshida In short: Piece of **** nonsensical post. So you missed the links in this thread and decided to stop in and white knight? Good for you, now get busy reading the truth.
Cunane Jeran Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:13:00 - [1940] If this turns out to not be a work of fiction, its a deal breaker. I wouldn't touch this game again and I'd also make sure other people I know don't make the mistake of starting it up tbh.
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:13:00 - [1941] Originally by: Tammarr Edited by: Tammarr on 23/06/2011 19:06:05 Ohmy, I see the butthurt forum warrior and alts brigade are still upset about a buddy of theirs getting a kickban in the crackers. As well as poor poor plex speculants with 20b tied up in plexes not getting the sudden sell in plex at high isk value they hoped for. Still being little emo girls '...nah still dont feel like loging in' working on the destruction of ccps rep with all their e-might because things didnt go as they want. HTFU. Ein Spiegel's not a CCP alt. However, this might be.
De'Veldrin Minmatar Norse'Storm Battle Group Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:15:00 - [1942] My only regret is not getting out into nullsec sooner. It's a blast. I haven't clicked unsub yet, but if CCP doesn't get their ** together, and quick, I'll be out the door, down the hall, and gone. --Vel Originally by:** Blacksquirrel This is EVE. PVE can happen anywhere at anytime. Be prepared.
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:16:00 - [1943] That's a very decent piece of forum banter right there. Spread the word. http://i.imgur.com/5xJhp.png Donations accepted: 1BpQEYT7aSUNM863BV67FPxyv1cpxr74uu \| http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1535011
tr33hugger Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:16:00 - [1944] CCP Why U No Listen? I am disappoint. tr33hugger
Ragnar Wintermute	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:16:00 - [1945] Well, I never post on the forums but just wanted to contribute my - 1 subscriptions purely on the basis of how offended I am by that newsletter and it's cavalier tone. Not to mention, I had a good 10 or so friends who probably would of came back to check it out. I didn't care much for Incarna but I thought it was a great idea if implemented correctly. I'm all for expanding the game and attracting new players but until I hear some good things in the next couple of months, I don't plan on coming back. (Actually very early in development for my own space game at the moment. :P) I already honestly don't enjoy the game because of how tedious it can be when playing alone. (My last corp kicked me out for being inactive during finals week and good luck staying in any corp as a not so active player) But the sole reason why I still played was due to it's economic system and genius sandbox nature. However, the new direction of pushing micro-transactions disrupts the entire foundation of the game and their ability to further expand upon that foundation to offer new gameplay. (This is especially important for tired players, after all Eve is top heavy and the veterans are what keeps food on this company's plate. Not to mention the effects that a fail cascade of Eve can cause to Dust) In short, this should of been an in-game economic expansion for Eve and not CCP and the problem lies in the fact that the higher ups realized that the in-game industrialist are an economic threat to their own virtual goods.
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:16:00 - [1946] I simply don't understand why senior management thought it would be a good idea to circulate a newsletter with sensitive content like this. If the motivation was to align employees to the new business plan and show that they are a progressive company with transparent processes, then this is a p!ss-poor way of implementing it.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:17:00 - [1947] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:17:00 - [1948] Thread is 24 hours old... pretty sure this is a new record of some sort... -------
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:18:00 - [1949] I think this thread deserves its own node on the cluster no? Somebody petition for a large fleet fight, 300k vs 1?
Wa'roun Quantum Cats Syndicate	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:18:00 - [1950] Originally by: Tachibana Kanade He mentioned a NEWSLETTER so it is true. Unsub by monday if you don't adress this properly. Reading comprehension 101: The subject of that thread is keep it on-topic, and not discuss this newsletter thread in the dev blog thread. Funny how people love to jump on the mere mention of "newsletter" and say, AH HAAA! It is real because they said, "newsletter"! I really don't care either way. I play EQ II and the Marketplace doesn't affect my gameplay.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:18:00 - [1951] Originally by: Soden Rah blah blah blah .... I will quit if you ever do this. .... blah blah blah If they heard anything. That is it. That you aren't quiting. Just unsubscribe before it recurs and you're left on the ship alone. Good post otherwise. His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
In System Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:18:00 - [1952] Edited by: In System on 23/06/2011 20:19:24 Wow. I was expecting to wake up and see this account at least forum banned. (because of this) Guess CCP have given up any attempt to slow this trainwreck. Miilla's right, they'll just let us rage over the weekend and come back with a patronising "So, you finished?" on Monday.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:19:00 - [1953] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) lololol so funny and not far from the truth
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:21:00 - [1954] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:22:22 Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:21:39 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) lololol so funny and not far from the truth Wut is it :) synopsis please! I have no video bandwidth lol PS: for those tired of pushing F5, get the "RELOAD EVERY" add-in for firefox g
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:21:00 - [1955] Originally by: Wa'roun Originally by: Tachibana Kanade He mentioned a NEWSLETTER so it is true. Unsub by monday if you don't adress this properly. Reading comprehension 101: The subject of that thread is keep it on-topic, and not discuss this newsletter thread in the dev blog thread. Funny how people love to jump on the mere mention of "newsletter" and say, AH HAAA! It is real because they said, "newsletter"! I really don't care either way. I play EQ II and the Marketplace doesn't affect my gameplay. White knight anybody? They delete comments without warning, And all because we say that there are MORE important things to adress than this. And says that they know about the situation, and the NEWSLETTER has to be discussed here. Believe what you want to believe, I already unsubbed. I've nothing to do with CCP if this is what they see us as. Cheerio.
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:23:00 - [1956] Originally by: Cyber Duck my eve... my beautiful, beautiful eve... eve online is now just another one of their few games... this will end not just eve... but ccp as a company... unless they absolve themselves by removing any reference or pursuit of RMT... No, it won't end CCP - Even SOE's still in existence after their actions. Eve as we knew it? It's done. Can't trust Citibank to run a game.
Antihrist Pripravnik Scorpion Road Industry	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:24:00 - [1957] Edited by: Antihrist Pripravnik on 23/06/2011 20:25:12 Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) That's getting old. The situation with their MT plans looks more like this scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BICNoRV1gw&feature=player_detailpage#t=333s Starring: Yosemite Sam = CCP MT management Bugs Bunny = the community Ship = EVE Online Cannon = MT based game The only question is, will CCP extinguish the fuse in time. [Petition] Make entry into CQ and Incarna optional.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:24:00 - [1958] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:22:22 Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:21:39 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) lololol so funny and not far from the truth Wut is it :) synopsis please! I have no video bandwidth lol PS: for those tired of pushing F5, get the "RELOAD EVERY" add-in for firefox g It is an overused ****** drama scene with lots of yelling and a humour subtext on how Eve is about money and the blues failed to dupe the players.
Brun Swick	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:24:00 - [1959] the lack of official response by ccp is deafening. sigh...
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:24:00 - [1960] Originally by: Soden Rah If you had posted a dev blog, 6 months ago, saying we are looking in to doing this, this, and this, what are your thoughts, would you accept this.... and we had had the ability to discuss the issue before a single line of code had been written... we could have had a civilised discussion on it... There was a civilised discussion, even a vote - and the player base voted against all MT in all forms, with only a few percentage difference between no-MT and only-vanity-MT. It`s still in the assembly hall. CCP read what they wanted to from it and is ignoring it. Even when we`re being reasonable, they are not listening. Their response to recent debacles is showing the same attitude - it is always the players who 'misunderstood', it is never a screw up on CCP's part. For this one, we need a f*ing apology, a promise to stop treating the players like idiots, and a promise to keep this MT st out of our game. And even then - who`s going to believe them after this? -
McSkeezy	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:24:00 - [1961] "Eventually, obviously, CCP will, in some way, give a response, kind of in the form of a non-apology apology. You've seen them before, so you'll know what to expect. At any rate, CCP's response to threadnaughts should be well known by now: they circle the wagons. I.e., they let the customers (they still have) blow off steam for a couple of days, then throw in the locking and 'cleaning-up' of the threads, and the throw in the non-apology apology dev-blog and that will be it. CCP is basically done with listening to their customers by now, every sign points to that, and it is even more clear from a bit of distance (i.e., no longer being subbed)." -Bartholomeus Crane QFT.
Joseph Vacher	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:25:00 - [1962] Edited by: Joseph Vacher on 23/06/2011 20:25:41 Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:22:22 Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:21:39 Originally by: leth ghost Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) lololol so funny and not far from the truth Wut is it :) synopsis please! I have no video bandwidth lol PS: for those tired of pushing F5, get the "RELOAD EVERY" add-in for firefox g Jesus, you posted that in normal text and then edited it to make it massive SO'D WE'D ALL KNOW HOW IMPORTANT IT IS. The video is another one of those sodding ****** things that weren't funny years ago. Hey, maybe I'll be 2000th. edit: apparently the name of the leader of fascist Germany in the 1930s/40s needs to be asterisked out. This forum rules.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:25:00 - [1963] I still havn't logged into the game since this news broke lol CBA now.
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:25:00 - [1964] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) ROFL
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:26:00 - [1965] Oh we were given an official response.. to contain our rage to this thread only instead of spawning multiples.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:26:00 - [1966] Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Grey Stormshadow http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc This made my day :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) ROFL I require another video by post 2k. Make it so forum.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:27:00 - [1967] Originally by: Erichan Oh we were given an official response.. to contain our rage to this thread only instead of spawning multiples. That is to make it easier for the Janitor to mop it up when they move to the new forums.
Kali Doom	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:27:00 - [1968] Edited by: Kali Doom on 23/06/2011 20:27:39 Originally by: Kali Doom Edited by: Kali Doom on 23/06/2011 20:07:17 So, who is Bartholomeus Crane??? So does this guy have any connections with CCP in his past??
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:28:00 - [1969] Originally by: Tammarr Milly being internet raging because her buddy got banned. Milly being inflammatory because 'she got 20b in plexes', opps, no extra plex demand, oops no spike in plex price thx to (admittedly) high priced items, oops failed market speculation, got to hurt. People reading a supposedly internal document aimed to be read by none other. 'Gordon Gekko' edition, roflmao. they got humour. a document most likely if true intended to discuss from two opposing viewpoints MT usage and to form/weather internal opinions. Stop listening to the forum warriors, realize ccp did everyone paying subs with plex a favour with this initial high pricing since the spike in demand was left out. realize that failed spike in demand got some market mongols butthurt. i realize that hellicity getting kicked might not have been the best way since yeah; buddies have mobilized a flamewar, if the ban is actually for the reason they so present. (Did we ever get to know if miss hulkageddon did have a hulk bpo or no btw? ) This flamenaught is over nothing when you apply logic, except a fair few hurt individuals marshalling all their might to poke ccp, the big evil master corporation in the face because they were left out. Oh, just stop. It's not helping your company.
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:28:00 - [1970] Originally by: Miilla I still havn't logged into the game since this news broke lol CBA now. it's another ****** Downfall subtitle replacement thing.
Sig Sour	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:29:00 - [1971] Originally by: Strazdas Unstoppable Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. 3 words for you: team fortress 2 What about it? The MT stuff drove everyone back to CS which is now stronger than ever.
Tass Kevel	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:29:00 - [1972] Edited by: Tass Kevel on 23/06/2011 20:31:54
Chip Flux Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:29:00 - [1973] I would at this juncture say that if eve needs more money to become what everyone here wants, then put up subs, but who wants to pay for other games to be made? Eve is what its all about. But we as a playerbase seem to have been talked into financing other games that most of us will never play. How did this happen? its not eve that is draining the isk
Sral TBear Shipwreck cove	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:30:00 - [1974] What to say...... CCP just changed my naive look at my self...i was a gamer...in a universe where effort matters and now if this is implementet im just and old eve idiot who dont follow the "modern" days of $ talk. Eve is a game where i can evolve by experience, where the isk ·sed are hard earned, but in the future im just a poor guy who cant affort to be the same as i am now. Im a dad to 3 children, i use eve as my little place, dont have more cash to keep up. Im playing eve because everyone starts the same, everyone have to evolve in the game. No short cuts no nothing, just time and effort. I cant compete with RL wallets. I have been chased of other games because i couldnt kjeep up with those buying power items or the like, and now eve will do the same :( This just sux sux sux. I keep playing, but when non createt player content can be bought or you can buy advanteges arive i will not be here any more :(
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:30:00 - [1975] Originally by: Tass Kevel Just use `Hilmar` to replace that word they wont let you say. I'm as upset as anyone, but noone deserves that discourtesy.
Brainless Bimbo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:31:00 - [1976] The thing about why i keep pointing to Joe Gallo is that he is probably the mystery shareholder who injected loads of cash in CCP a few years ago or part of that bargain. I¦ve been saying for a long time eve in not made by gamers any more, its now just a vehicle to provide large amounts of short term return on investment. ...... continues overleaf.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:31:00 - [1977] Originally by: Sig Sour Originally by: Strazdas Unstoppable Originally by: Digital Messiah This is fake, CCP knows as well as we do money for non vanity items has killed every game that has ever tried it. No amount of creeping it in has worked either. 3 words for you: team fortress 2 What about it? The MT stuff drove everyone back to CS which is now stronger than ever. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Tejal Charu	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:31:00 - [1978] Edited by: Tejal Charu on 23/06/2011 20:32:00 Originally by: Sral TBear What to say...... CCP just changed my naive look at my self...i was a gamer...in a universe where effort matters and now if this is implementet im just and old eve idiot who dont follow the "modern" days of $ talk. Eve is a game where i can evolve by experience, where the isk ·sed are hard earned, but in the future im just a poor guy who cant affort to be the same as i am now. Im a dad to 3 children, i use eve as my little place, dont have more cash to keep up. Im playing eve because everyone starts the same, everyone have to evolve in the game. No short cuts no nothing, just time and effort. I cant compete with RL wallets. I have been chased of other games because i couldnt kjeep up with those buying power items or the like, and now eve will do the same :( This just sux sux sux. I keep playing, but when non createt player content can be bought or you can buy advanteges arive i will not be here any more :( I know that feel. http://cdn1.knowyourmeme.com/i/000/107/432/original/i_hug_that_feel.png?1300595876
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:32:00 - [1979] Originally by: Kali Doom Originally by: Kali Doom So, who is Bartholomeus Crane??? So does this guy have any connections with CCP in his past?? http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/CCP-Games-Reviews-E159347.htm Same opinions as others and knows more about stuff I've seen from the outside only in small details here or there. It's reality. Regardless who he is the whole thing is truth. His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:33:00 - [1980] Originally by: Sral TBear This just sux sux sux. I keep playing, but when non createt player content can be bought or you can buy advanteges arive i will not be here any more :( You mean like they tried to slip into Incarna with Ships For Aurum? They're already well down this path, and they see no problems with it. People like you, and me, are expendable in pursuit of people that don't mind their wallets being anally **d. /shrug -Liang -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:34:00 - [1981] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:36:21 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:30 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:09 CCP Soundwave had time to comment on the ccp cardgames but not here... http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1497648&page=2 having trouble with link but copies fine to browser tab
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:36:00 - [1982] To anyone who's waiting for MT to invade game-advancement in order to drop sub: Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? 3. Who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather than engine trials and flashy cyno effect rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. HereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Now is the time to vote with your sub. If you keep going in the face of this information, you're simply funding that which you will unsubscribe for (and dust/WoD). There is no reason to continue paying CCP now unless you in-fact want to buy in-game advantages with ARUM.
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:37:00 - [1983] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:36:21 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:30 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:09 CCP Soundwave had time to comment on the ccp cardgames but not here... http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1497648&page=2 having trouble with link but copies fine to browser tab What a punk. Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Bendy Profane The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:37:00 - [1984] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Edited by: Reed Tiburon on 23/06/2011 19:59:11 Originally by: glepp Unsubbed 2/3 accounts. Last one will get unsubbed soon. They run out in october, and unless CCP changes out bigtime, I'm not investing any more time, money or effort into a company i have lost faith in. Goodbye CCP, it was fun while you still seemed to care. See this, CCP? You don't know him, but this is glepp. He is one of the many players who make up the vital social fabric between CCP and game. He is a regular poster on the E-UNI forums, helping the newest of the newbies get their heads around this complex and often unintuitive game. He, in short, is good people. He doesn't give a **** about you anymore. If I worked at CCP, I'd be worried about stuff like this. Confirming glepp is not the kind of player you want to lose. Many of the slogans in your brochure indicate that you mix up being fearless with being delusional. The scale of empty marketing talk used to justify a possible future sale of non-vanity space goods for real money is concerning. Stop for a moment, breathe in, breathe out. Now take a close look at this particular gaming community you have and ask yourself again: You really think you want to follow this path any further? We chose Eve for reasons, you know. What works for games like LoTR Online will not necessarily work for Eve. It will most probably not.
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:37:00 - [1985] Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 23/06/2011 20:43:07 Originally by: Kali Doom Edited by: Kali Doom on 23/06/2011 20:07:17 So, who is Bartholomeus Crane??? of course we don't know someone who seems to be very good friends with CCP employees - maybe an ex-employee, maybe a current employee who merely wants to hide his identity He posted on scraphead-challenge and seems to have migrated to failheap-challenge like most of the shc community - the recurrent theme of his posts is the divide between "Team Awesome" and the rest of the world, both within CCP and with rgds to the playerbase. His perception seems to be that a relatively small group of CCP employees are running the company management based on nepotism, he calls them "Team Awesome" because they absolutely love the big ideas & concepts that are impossible to implement (think of the disconnect between PI reality and concept, or the new "A Future Vision" trailer) while overlooking all the small grievances that are boring and tedious to fix (think of POS management or corp role management, ...).
Ebisu Kami	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:39:00 - [1986] Edited by: Ebisu Kami on 23/06/2011 20:44:09 Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Sral TBear This just sux sux sux. I keep playing, but when non createt player content can be bought or you can buy advanteges arive i will not be here any more :( You mean like they tried to slip into Incarna with Ships For Aurum? They're already well down this path, and they see no problems with it. People like you, and me, are expendable in pursuit of people that don't mind their wallets being anally ****d. /shrug -Liang Frankly, I was shocked, that they even had the idea of bringing that repaint into the talks with a ship readily delivered, after the outrage about MT a while back and their promise to "no non-vanity for MT". It looked so utterly contradictory to the promises and statements they made... Guess we can take it for granted now, that all the nice words from the past aren't worth a dime, because they obviously didn't do this by accident or :nothtoughfarenough:, but because they didn't care at all. Summer of Rage, CSM5, Team BFF, all for nought.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:40:00 - [1987] I guess when we interview an Ex CCP employee we strike them off the hire list. Untrustable.
Cedric deBouilard Gallente EVE University Ivy League	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:41:00 - [1988] Edited by: Cedric deBouilard on 23/06/2011 20:40:47 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc
BeanBagKing Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:41:00 - [1989] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:36:21 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:30 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:09 CCP Soundwave had time to comment on the ccp cardgames but not here... http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1497648&page=2 having trouble with link but copies fine to browser tab Check the timestamp on that post man, it was like a week ago.
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:41:00 - [1990] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo The thing about why i keep pointing to Joe Gallo is that he is probably the mystery shareholder who injected loads of cash in CCP a few years ago or part of that bargain. I¦ve been saying for a long time eve in not made by gamers any more, its now just a vehicle to provide large amounts of short term return on investment. Joseph Gallo was "just" a managing director in Citi - the head honcho is the Chief Executive Officer Securities and Banking (Institutional Clients Group). There are probably 50 or more MDR's in the Investment Banking division
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:42:00 - [1991] Longest meeting they've ever had i'm betting.
Funkiera	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:42:00 - [1992] Originally by: Miilla miilla is a scam artist do not trust or fall pray to it
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:42:00 - [1993] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:42:36 Originally by: Miilla I guess when we interview an Ex CCP employee we strike them off the hire list. Untrustable. I have to believe based on a variety of comments that there are a lot of good CCP folks. The document itself is disingenious but I think the employees of CCP are largely not responsible for what is happening. It is the leaders that need to respond, not the rank and file. My opinion.
Sorcsha Voren Caldari SVC Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:43:00 - [1994] I have no problems with the NEX, in and of itself. I don't care about your monacles, your t-shirts, your boots. I don't even care to re-customize my character for a small fee (even though I think that's rather stupid). However, when you start talking about things we already have that would have to be maintained over time with real life cash, when you start talking about selling faction rep., when you start talking about possibly selling mods, ammo and ships on the NEX requiring **** all stupid amounts of plex and ISK......that's when I'm going to tell you in which orifice you can jam your game and your subscription fees. They must be serving up a particularly potent batch of stupid on the lunch carts at CCP HQ, because if you KNOW already that the majority of your player base doesn't like your changes, you're a complete and utter moron if you go through with them. Virtual, non game changing, non game affecting items are fabulous. Go for it. People will buy them. But when you start bending your playerbase over and talk about how you're selling your game changing mechanics for a buck, you lose. I'll wait for your move, but I don't need your game. I play because I like to.....not because I have to.
Soden Rah Gallente EVE University Ivy League	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:43:00 - [1995] Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:36:21 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:30 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:09 CCP Soundwave had time to comment on the ccp cardgames but not here... http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1497648&page=2 having trouble with link but copies fine to browser tab Check the timestamp on that post man, it was like a week ago. also learn how to post links properly -------- By Grfmsv÷tn, Eyjafjallaj÷kull, Vatnaj÷kull, and Hekla itself... THIS is my sig. Support Optional CQ
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:43:00 - [1996] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:42:36 Originally by: Miilla I guess when we interview an Ex CCP employee we strike them off the hire list. Untrustable. I have to believe based on a variety of comments that there are a lot of good CCP folks. The document itself is disingenious but I think the employees of CCP are largely not responsible for what is happening. It is the leaders that need to respond, not the rank and file. My opinion. Just doin ma job man, trolling. :) Sure some are fine, some don't take sides (wise ones), they just get on with their job. It's the ones that bare faced lied to us.
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:45:00 - [1997] Edited by: Shandir on 23/06/2011 20:44:52 I used to be able to have more than 50 ship fittings. Why would I pay for it now? -
Mac Aoidh Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:45:00 - [1998] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo The thing about why i keep pointing to Joe Gallo is that he is probably the mystery shareholder who injected loads of cash in CCP a few years ago or part of that bargain. I¦ve been saying for a long time eve in not made by gamers any more, its now just a vehicle to provide large amounts of short term return on investment. ^^There it is! CCP got in way over their heads trying to do to many things at once. This resulted in them having to take on investors to help fund their growth. Investors want a return and MT is how they are going to get that return, playerbase be damned.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:45:00 - [1999] Originally by: Ebisu Kami Frankly, I was shocked, that they even had the idea of bringing that repaint into the game with a ship readily delivered, after the outrage about MT a while back and their promise to "non non-vanity for MT". It looked so utterly contradictory to the promises and statements they made... Guess we can take it for granted now, that all the nice words from the past aren't worth a dime, because they didn't do this by accident or :nothtoughfarenough:, but because they didn't care at all. Once again the real CCP shows up in this detail. If you read their comments to CSM you quickly see they are so isolated they don't even understand there "might" be "some" issue. Then basically say "oh cool so you agree, it's working as intended, oh not a bug, I mean we'll just trial it then see, gotta run!". His name was John Turbefield! Truth.
Beelzebubz	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:46:00 - [2000] Originally by: Miilla Entropia... That is a name you should fear... It's comming. oh god, i have nightmares about sweating those dr seuss looking monsters for countless hours but youll never be able to exchange isk for rl money, ccp would go bankrupt in minutes
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:46:00 - [2001] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:47:07 Originally by: Shandir Edited by: Shandir on 23/06/2011 20:44:52 I used to be able to have more than 50 ship fittings. Why would I pay for it now? Because you can no longer have more than 50 ship fittings. Duh. POST... uhh Space 1999!!!!
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:46:00 - [2002] Post 2000 >GET<
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:47:00 - [2003] Originally by: Soden Rah Originally by: BeanBagKing Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:36:21 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:30 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:09 CCP Soundwave had time to comment on the ccp cardgames but not here... http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1497648&page=2 having trouble with link but copies fine to browser tab Check the timestamp on that post man, it was like a week ago. also learn how to post links properly My apologies to CCP Soundwave for not checking. As to links, I won't be on these forums long enough for that bit of training to matter I suppose. That depends on the sincereity and rapidity of a response from CCP. Stay tuned I suppose.
Warg Matar Minmatar The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:48:00 - [2004] Originally by: Marcus Vorenius Joseph Gallo was "just" a managing director in Citi - the head honcho is the Chief Executive Officer Securities and Banking (Institutional Clients Group). There are probably 50 or more MDR's in the Investment Banking division Why did he not attempt to become John Turbefield though??!?!
Inspiration	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:48:00 - [2005] Originally by: Shandir Edited by: Shandir on 23/06/2011 20:44:52 I used to be able to have more than 50 ship fittings. Why would I pay for it now? The new business model of CCP is to deliver LESS for what you already pay them for and then charge you additional for getting your worth. In short, they are going to extort you instead of delivering the service you pay for. They gone sick in the head!
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:48:00 - [2006] Originally by: Mehrdad Kor-Azor Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:36:21 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:30 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:35:09 CCP Soundwave had time to comment on the ccp cardgames but not here... http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1497648&page=2 having trouble with link but copies fine to browser tab What a punk. Any chance of doing a picture with Mr burns body from the simpsons and that tw@ts face on it Originally by: Gothikia If he shoots CCP Soundwave in the face, I'll tongue his gonads. No joke.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:48:00 - [2007] Originally by: Cyber Duck Post 2000 >GET< We're not going to be getting a CCP response until post 3000, calling it now. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:48:00 - [2008] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 20:47:07 Originally by: Shandir Edited by: Shandir on 23/06/2011 20:44:52 I used to be able to have more than 50 ship fittings. Why would I pay for it now? Because you can no longer have more than 50 ship fittings. Duh. POST... uhh Space 1999!!!! Better not waste money on fits, faction towers will be back and certainly worth a small fortune (in arum).
Cailais Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:49:00 - [2009] Originally by: Cedric deBouilard Edited by: Cedric deBouilard on 23/06/2011 20:40:47 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Quality. C. 'GREED IS GOOD' - CCP 2011 (ಠ_O)
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:49:00 - [2010] Originally by: Landlady Originally by: E man Industries Unsubing may not even show. Incarna will bring back some poeple just to see it. So sub numbers won't go down. Also despite the forum whinning people just don't care enough. They may think "wow thats dumb" and then undock as normal. Problem is if the "metrics" show this works it will affect the people who don't care. Rather than post they will just unsub, no rage, no threads they will just leave. Sadly, if the metrics show +cash for them, then it is what is 'good' for the game, and thus the community, and thus the players. Sadly, this is the truth, no matter how crappy it may sound. Exactly this. If it makes money, it's the direction they'll take. Citibank is running the show now.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:49:00 - [2011] Who likes mournful music? Finally finished reading all that I missed. Still nothing from CCP besides an unrelated dev blog that only has 4 pages because their moderation is in overdrive, and only the sickeningly cheery supportive comments remain. That post from Bart Crane is interesting, and probably accurate. Some of us from yesterday are still here. Ahh well. This is kind of amusing, sort of like the way they used to put bears on hotplates to make them dance.
Heimdallofasgard APEX ARDENT COALITION C0NVICTED	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:50:00 - [2012] Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 20:50:51 Anyone else see this today? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T1SZKab7F8&feature=related just sayin... -------
Republica Winder Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:51:00 - [2013] Originally by: Miilla I guess when we interview an Ex CCP employee we strike them off the hire list. Untrustable. Not exactly. Right now, it's the senior managers who get that tag. However, if they don't 100% retract all this crap, the CCP employees REMAINING 6 months from now should go on any "do not hire" list. If they follow the same pattern SOE did into downfall, what is happening right now is their best people all realize that the light at the end of the tunnel is the onrushing train. They are hard at work right now finding new gigs. What will be left will be a mix of evil and incompetent types who agreed with this move, new hires with no experience, and those who might have WANTED to leave but weren't good enough to land a job anywhere else. The result will be a Dev staff that is completely incapable of making anything. That's what happened with SOE. When the NGE hit, their best talent ran to the exits, STARTING with Raph Koster (who designed Pre-NGE SWG). Fast forward to their next major new MMO release, DC Universe Online. They spent 5 years and $50 million developing it. They put all the resources necessary to produce an AAA title. They put their best people on it. The end product was a piece of crap full of PVP exploits and not enough content to keep people playing past the first 2 weeks. They are merging servers down to 4. The game will likely have all remaining development cut off before it's even 1 year old. The lesson: Pulling a NGE is company destroying. Even IF you manage to survive it and keep going, the end result not only is a horrific reputation with customers, but with INDUSTRY TALENT. SOE can't hire top level talent to work for them in Austin or San Diego, much more appealing places than Iceland. Which tells me that CCP will ultimately end up in even worse shape. Again, assuming they survive this, they don't have other MMOs to live off of like SOE did. They are killing their ONE REVENUE SOURCE.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:51:00 - [2014] Logging into Eve now... first time since MT news broke. Bleh... Anybody got any faction barf bags?
Joseph Vacher	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:51:00 - [2015] With only so much Aurum to burn, do you buy clothes, or pizza?
Atlas Arnst Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:51:00 - [2016] All the tears from this thread are delicious!
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:51:00 - [2017] Remember when people thought we'd get a CCP response by post 1200 or so? -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:51:00 - [2018] Originally by: Ebisu Kami Frankly, I was shocked, that they even had the idea of bringing that repaint into the game with a ship readily delivered, after the outrage about MT a while back and their promise to "non non-vanity for MT". It looked so utterly contradictory to the promises and statements they made... Guess we can take it for granted now, that all the nice words from the past aren't worth a dime, because they didn't do this by accident or :nothtoughfarenough:, but because they didn't care at all. Well if the Hello Kitty Apoc didn't consume an Apoc + AUR to get that'd be bad IMHO. I've no real issue with a Hello Kitty Apoc so long as it remaind an Apoc on the overview and has no weaker (or greater) stats than a stock one. Now the 'Total Hell Death' Apoc... well we've been there done that 40 pages ago.
Antihrist Pripravnik Scorpion Road Industry	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:52:00 - [2019] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 20:42:36 Originally by: Miilla I guess when we interview an Ex CCP employee we strike them off the hire list. Untrustable. I have to believe based on a variety of comments that there are a lot of good CCP folks. The document itself is disingenious but I think the employees of CCP are largely not responsible for what is happening. It is the leaders that need to respond, not the rank and file. My opinion. Time for Hilmar's devblog, I guess. [Petition] Make entry into CQ and Incarna optional.
Silicon Sailor Northgate	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:53:00 - [2020] 2 THOUSAND posts? Good Lord... what's the record?
Cyber Duck	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:53:00 - [2021] Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one!
Tehlana Riolis	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:53:00 - [2022] Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 20:50:51 Anyone else see this today? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T1SZKab7F8&feature=related just sayin... That will never be again T_T I miss the true EVE. This is just a rotting corpse now :(
Manssell	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:53:00 - [2023] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo The thing about why i keep pointing to Joe Gallo is that he is probably the mystery shareholder who injected loads of cash in CCP a few years ago or part of that bargain. I¦ve been saying for a long time eve in not made by gamers any more, its now just a vehicle to provide large amounts of short term return on investment. The concept of "business" would be great... it it wasn't for "business people".
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:54:00 - [2024] The thing is, what's the point of a monocle without a pipe to wiggle while you put the monocle in? CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
E6o5	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:54:00 - [2025] if real then -2 accounts
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:54:00 - [2026] Originally by: Silicon Sailor 2 THOUSAND posts? Good Lord... what's the record? No the record was before they deleted all the ones they don't want to go to eve-search. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details.
Erichk Knaar Caldari Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:55:00 - [2027] Originally by: General Windypops The thing is, what's the point of a monocle without a pipe to wiggle while you put the monocle in? You are forgetting the top hat and the twirly mustache.
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:56:00 - [2028] Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! That`s probably referring to the Learning Skills change. -
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:56:00 - [2029] Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! Good lord tell me its steam trolling CCP. glad i unsubbed already.
Mac Aoidh Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:56:00 - [2030] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Silicon Sailor 2 THOUSAND posts? Good Lord... what's the record? No the record was before they deleted all the ones they don't want to go to eve-search. I have a feeling this thread will meet a similar fate.
Abrazzar	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:56:00 - [2031] Originally by: Antihrist Pripravnik Time for Hilmar's devblog, I guess. He's writing devblogs? And here I thought he just calls a PR agent to draft the blog and simply puts his name at the end of it. --------
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:56:00 - [2032] Edited by: General Windypops on 23/06/2011 20:56:45 Originally by: Silicon Sailor 2 THOUSAND posts? Good lord ... what's the record? To be fair, at least 1,320 of them are Miillla informing us that she's very angry and has cancelled the brainstorming for some crappy app she was going to maybe think about building. CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
ExcalibursTemplar Caldari Citadel Enterprises	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:57:00 - [2033] Originally by: Cedric deBouilard Edited by: Cedric deBouilard on 23/06/2011 20:40:47 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc PMSL is never a proper drama without a downfall parady Originally by: Gothikia If he shoots CCP Soundwave in the face, I'll tongue his gonads. No joke.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:57:00 - [2034] Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the hell is this about, then? --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Decon Ko	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:57:00 - [2035] Originally by: Miilla I still havn't logged into the game since this news broke lol CBA now. -- This: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1248088
Dimitri Fukoyama	Posted - 2011.06.23 20:59:00 - [2036] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the hell is this about, then? Its just how they removed learning skills from the game... im pretty sure
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:00:00 - [2037] Originally by: Dimitri Fukoyama Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the hell is this about, then? Its just how they removed learning skills from the game... im pretty sure Don't nubs get a implant that burns out after their first month as well?
Alaura Aquila Minmatar Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:00:00 - [2038] Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 20:50:51 Anyone else see this today? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T1SZKab7F8&feature=related just sayin... Why is it a Trinity trailer? --
Hoshi The Einherjar Corporation	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:02:00 - [2039] So CCP are watching this thread for reactions? Ok then here are my reaction, the minute you add non vanity items to the NeX I will cancel my accounts. This is not a threat, just a simple statement of fact. 6 years of Eve has been a good run but if you are going to turn this into a pay to win game then it's no longer a game for me. ---------------------------------------- "Memories are meant to fade. They're designed that way for a reason."
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:02:00 - [2040] Originally by: Alaura Aquila Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 20:50:51 Anyone else see this today? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T1SZKab7F8&feature=related just sayin... Why is it a Trinity trailer? He was saying it was the "good old days", gone forever.
Alaura Aquila Minmatar Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:03:00 - [2041] Edited by: Alaura Aquila on 23/06/2011 21:04:28 Edited by: Alaura Aquila on 23/06/2011 21:04:00 Originally by: Erichan Originally by: Alaura Aquila Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 20:50:51 Anyone else see this today? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T1SZKab7F8&feature=related just sayin... Why is it a Trinity trailer? He was saying it was the "good old days", gone forever. Sorry, so much sensory overload on the forums today --
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:03:00 - [2042] Edited by: MrSteack on 23/06/2011 21:03:35 Redundant about learning skills
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:04:00 - [2043] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 21:13:08 http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534988 The NEX store has been exploited???
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:04:00 - [2044] Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the ** is this. -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:05:00 - [2045] Originally by: Shandir Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! That`s probably referring to the Learning Skills change. I think so. It's not really relevant anyway, new characters have been getting a training boost for quite some time now. They haven't started selling training speed yet.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:06:00 - [2046] Originally by: Saving Face Originally by: Shandir Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! That`s probably referring to the Learning Skills change. I think so. It's not really relevant anyway, new characters have been getting a training boost for quite some time now. They haven't started selling training speed yet.
Apollo Gabriel Brotherhood Of Fallen Angels Etherium Cartel	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:06:00 - [2047] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the ** is this. They're talking the learning skills removal and + attribute points. The news of eve is slow to propagate. AG * Signature may appear without warning! *** Please do not feed the trolls, it builds dependency.
Finefine	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:07:00 - [2048] I think CCP is over a barrel here, they management want to provide MT's but true MT's for clothes at sensible prices would not provide a big enough revenue. I've never cared how my char looked, I fly a spaceship (on my main :p ) and pew pew and I guess this is a hard, niche game, if we wanted to play house and dress up we would play another game. There's no incentive for most of the players to buy something with MT's unless it gives them an advantage, forcing WIS on us seems pointless, and it's the force that bothers me, I can look at a wall and door and opt out for now, but it offers me nothing it's just a pretty bloated screensaver. It's like being able to watch TV in GTA:IV. It was cool for a time, but then you get on with the real game, it doesn;t offer anything beyond what you see in the first 10 seconds of looking around.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:09:00 - [2049] Originally by: Apollo Gabriel Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the ** is this. They're talking the learning skills removal and + attribute points. The news of eve is slow to propagate. AG So right after they introduce the MT store, there's a marketing push advertising newly (breaking news) accelerated training..... -- Eve Forum *** Extraordinaire On Twitter
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:09:00 - [2050] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the **** is this. I think it's this newbie implant. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:10:00 - [2051] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the **** is this. Woa, CCP has really gone off their minds, why are they even offering skill points boosts for? so people will buy skill point sets now? wth? Oh the Rage!!! ---Archipelago Theory---
Kary Tamona Crom Demons	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:10:00 - [2052] Just cancelled my subs. That's all I have to say.
Yammel	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:12:00 - [2053] What could they offer us for the price of a plex that 1) Would not unbalance the game 2) Lots of players would want to buy Clothes isn't it.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:13:00 - [2054] I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY"
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:14:00 - [2055] Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:15:00 - [2056] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. What does QFT mean?
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:16:00 - [2057] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. What does QFT mean? Quoted for truth -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Major Connie Chung	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:16:00 - [2058] Now is the time to vote with your sub. If you keep going in the face of this information, you're simply funding that which you will unsubscribe for (and dust/WoD). There is no reason to continue paying CCP now unless you in-fact want to buy in-game advantage Agree. Cancelled both my accounts over this and the wardec abuse and general attitude and arrogance of ccp, and i wont buy a ps3 as i have a wii and xbox360. So no dust either.
William Walker Amarr House Aratus Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:16:00 - [2059] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. What does QFT mean? Quoted for truth. Bye bye EVE ________________________________________________
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:16:00 - [2060] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. What does QFT mean? It means Quoted for Truth. Also I'm fine, altpoastan for teh win. -Heli
InsertxNamexHere	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:17:00 - [2061] Originally by: Cyber Duck Post 2000 >GET< B@$tard!!!!!!11!!
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:17:00 - [2062] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. What does QFT mean? quoted for truth and welcome back.. how was your ingame experience?
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:18:00 - [2063] Edited by: Sidus Isaacs on 23/06/2011 21:19:04 Originally by: General Windypops You really are full of yourself aren't you? :) Comment my spelling all you like, but it is still a baseless claim. Funny thing is, I got no shortage of money atm, but I am not an idiot that spends it on stupid things just to show I got it. You know, something you hinted you would do. I could buy a monocle and flaunt it, but why the **** would I? And why should new content be avalable only to the ones with more RL cash? CCP already had the ples for isk thing going, there simply was no real reason other then to draw more RL money form hte players to implement this. As hard as it is to belive, I am all about fairness. But things like that is hard to understand for you apparently. You got your head so far up that ass of yours you do not see what is actually going on. Oh, and I do understand what CCP is doing. They are going to make more money on us. From a pure profit based viewpoint it makes sense, and they are doing their best to cover it up in gibberish and sweet talk. But the world is more then short term profit, and when you betray long term customers this way... well lets just say you do not understand what you are really doing. So keep living in your marketing fantasy world. I am sure EVE will be just as fun with a bunch of idiots populating New Eden in their "pimped" ships and monocles. Also, Geroge Carlin had a funny show about marketing guys. You should watch it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Mitchello B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:18:00 - [2064] Failheap-challenge is reachable again, via IP only currently. INCARNA. EXPERT HOUSING, QUARTER STYLE, New Eden's Blue Lagoon. Coming Soon.
General Windypops The Littlest Hobos En Garde	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:19:00 - [2065] How can we possibly replace the 20 or so of you that are quitting???????????? CSM 6: Let's get Windypops indypops.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:20:00 - [2066] Heads up as was news at least to me. Sounds like nice thing to look forward to after this clusterf... ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:20:00 - [2067] Originally by: General Windypops How can we possibly replace the 20 or so of you that are quitting???????????? You're trying too hard windypops, you old troll you friendly shoulder punch
Adacia Calla Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:20:00 - [2068] The leaked PDF is tricky to read on an Android PDF reader but I managed to do it. Also managed to navigate the new account management site on my Android phone and cancelled all accounts, which is equally as tricky because it's hard to click on the "Cancel Subscription" button due to the hover/drop down thinger.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:20:00 - [2069] Originally by: Erichan Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. What does QFT mean? quoted for truth and welcome back.. how was your ingame experience? I have an invisible cloaked toon, since i Cleared my cache lol
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:21:00 - [2070] Originally by: General Windypops How can we possibly replace the 20 or so of you that are quitting???????????? Lowering the price of course. Enjoy the new players, and expect more ragequit when they put ships/ammo and all that BS in the NeX
Mia Aires	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:21:00 - [2071] Bye Bye EVE it was a nice time until didn't care about your playerbase
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:22:00 - [2072] Originally by: Adacia Calla The leaked PDF is tricky to read on an Android PDF reader but I managed to do it. Also managed to navigate the new account management site on my Android phone and cancelled all accounts, which is equally as tricky because it's hard to click on the "Cancel Subscription" button due to the hover/drop down thinger. Tried CQ on the Android yet? g
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:26:00 - [2073] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 21:26:10 Im going to gank a hulk, feck it.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:27:00 - [2074] Those new turrets really are nice, aren't they? Damn shame.
Bubanni	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:27:00 - [2075] :( because of this ccp, I seen multiple good players scrap their toons... what have you done ccp!?!?!? Your killing yourself if you continue on this path! I personly don't care, but when your making my friends quit the game... well you should know
Dr Deus	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:27:00 - [2076] (First and last post on 3Y main). The sad thing about this memo is the clear disconnect between CCP and the community. I used to think we were in the same boat, that we were evolving together, sharing a vision and playing/building a fantasy world in a partnership between players and developers. Of course I understand that a game costs money, and I gladly pay. That's my end of the partnership. CCP's end is to run a business to develop and evolve the game. We had different roles, but there was mutual respect and trust. However, this is clearly not the case. In the eyes of this memo, I am merely a consumer to be monetized. That's it. Nothing more. This is hugely disappointing, and both CCP and players are worse off because of it. I wish both players and CCP the best, because the potential is fantastic. For me however, the sensible thing is to move on. Be excellent to each other. Fly hard. O7 Signing off D2
Jo Blot	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:27:00 - [2077] Originally by: Khysanth Onyx lol yeah the inevitable outcome is the death of a million people, this is what I'm talking about If you were, you probably wouldn't want to be drawing attention to it with "lol".
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:29:00 - [2078] Originally by: Dr Deus (First and last post on 3Y main). The sad thing about this memo is the clear disconnect between CCP and the community. I used to think we were in the same boat, that we were evolving together, sharing a vision and playing/building a fantasy world in a partnership between players and developers. Of course I understand that a game costs money, and I gladly pay. That's my end of the partnership. CCP's end is to run a business to develop and evolve the game. We had different roles, but there was mutual respect and trust. However, this is clearly not the case. In the eyes of this memo, I am merely a consumer to be monetized. That's it. Nothing more. This is hugely disappointing, and both CCP and players are worse off because of it. I wish both players and CCP the best, because the potential is fantastic. For me however, the sensible thing is to move on. Be excellent to each other. Fly hard. O7 Signing off D2 The day they invented the CSM was a sign they where out of touch. The CSM represents 14% or less of the player base (last voter turn out).
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:30:00 - [2079] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow Heads up as was news at least to me. Sounds like nice thing to look forward to after this clusterf... sry to disappoint you, but Infinity MMO has been halted for the benefit of making an engine out of it first. There is no content, no game design, its not even started yet. What you see there are tech-demos at best, even if they started fulltime now it would only come in 2 years at best, with a team of 50ppl.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:31:00 - [2080] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 21:32:02 Meh, im standing at the Rens DOCK, staring at my Vargur... Doesn't quite feel the same Awe now :( You know all those people that cry we have MT today via PLEX? well that's not true, sure you can buy items, but that doesnt autmatically mean you can USE them, sure I can buy a TITAN with purchased PLEX, but I still cant use it lol I have to train those skills..
Saskie Castillo	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:31:00 - [2081] Originally by: Miilla The day they invented the CSM was a sign they where out of touch. The CSM represents 14% or less of the player base (last voter turn out). The CSM probably represent more than 14% of the player base' opinions, but 86% don't care, and those 86% probably don't mind or are stupid enough to get monetized. HOPE HERO CEO :: JOHN TURBEFIELD
Darveses Fantastulousification Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:32:00 - [2082] Edited by: Darveses on 23/06/2011 21:33:02 Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:32:00 - [2083] If only Incarna had been bars with Poker.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:32:00 - [2084] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:32:51 The CSM may have been voted on by 14% but that doesn't mean they aren't looking out for the rest of us. I am fairly certain based on the comments here and on Failheap that the CSM was either forbidden to comment via NDA or never exposed to the majority of this nightmare.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:32:00 - [2085] Originally by: Brujo Loco Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Cyber Duck Linkage Quote: Breaking News! - Radical changes to EVE Online character development allow you to train characters faster and get into action from the day one! What the **** is this. Woa, CCP has really gone off their minds, why are they even offering skill points boosts for? so people will buy skill point sets now? wth? Oh the Rage!!! Play for free is one of the bullet points too. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:36:00 - [2086] Originally by: Gurgeh Murat Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Gurgeh Murat I can happily flit from World of Tanks to Champions online. FREE TO PLAY GAMES. Bold the bit CCP will hear. "Oh cool he agrees, F2P ftw" Absolutely correct good sir. EvE is turning into P2P MT game. Pay to play, or Micro transactions. Choose one. CCP want to have their cake and eat it. It will choke them. Good day to you sir. No, more than that. Subscription plus in-game transactions. (They're not micro at these prices, can't call them that anymore.) They can't go F2P - how does skill training work then?
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:36:00 - [2087] Damn, one day at work and we go from 23 to 70 pages already. Good times ... ______________________________
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:37:00 - [2088] Originally by: Adunh Slavy Play for free is one of the bullet points too. LIES; Free to PLAY is not really true. It is NOT FREE, sure its free to LOOK AROUND, but if you want to actually PLAY you have to buy stuff. Free to PLAY is a bad description, perhaps should be flagged to trading standards bodies. FREE TO VIEW more like.
Vladimir Ilych Gradient Electus Matari	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:37:00 - [2089] Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:32:51 The CSM may have been voted on by 14% but that doesn't mean they aren't looking out for the rest of us. I am fairly certain based on the comments here and on Failheap that the CSM was either forbidden to comment via NDA or never exposed to the majority of this nightmare. I think you are correct. I am sure the CSM (if aware) warned CCP this might generate something of a reaction.
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:37:00 - [2090] Originally by: Darveses Edited by: Darveses on 23/06/2011 21:33:02 Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. +1 Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed so destructive.
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:38:00 - [2091] Originally by: Technovar They can't go F2P - how does skill training work then? They could go F2P but only paid accounts would get skill training. Of course that's a bit of a slippery slope as the next step would be different grades of skill training...
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:38:00 - [2092] Originally by: Darveses Edited by: Darveses on 23/06/2011 21:33:02 Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Miilla I think we need a new signiture for everybody. "FREE HELICITY" QFT. Sigged. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! ht
Illuminaty	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:38:00 - [2093] I think it is a problem that the expansion is that to get it finished they had to go into major debt on the spaceship side of the game. I don't think Incarna is a PROBLEM, but I think it was an issue that they ended up spending far more resources on it than they expected, which resulted in limited spaceship content. It seems like CCP understands the debt they have incurred on the spaceship side of the game and the winter expansion seems like it is intended to address this. I think the MT shop has the danger of drawing resources away from core game content. This wouldn't be a massive issue, except that CCP already has a massive spaceship content debt on the core game, and the core game is what their existing cash flow is based on. Relaxing your grip on a bird in the hand to go chasing after two in the bush is just plain dumb. However, if CCP can focus on creating a good spaceship based winter expansion to pay off their spaceship content debt, then they have a chance to use the MT store income to pay for MT store items, they should be able to steer their way though this. This of course assumes they don't lose their minds and start chasing MT store income at the expense of their current income flow. Vanity items (if made with development $ that is paid for by vanity item sales) won't harm spaceship EVE (so long as spaceship EVE $ subs pay for spaceship EVE content). The MT store could even help spaceship EVE since re-building the spaceship models to allow them to sell re-skins could help pay for new and improved base skins for the non-MT spaceship EVE. However, selling power-boosting items in a subscription based MMO is going to be problematic. Power-booster items are a required evil in a F2P game (which EVE is not). Something has to pay the bills. Subscriptions pays the bills, adding power-boosters is simply an unneeded evil. Needlessly degrading your product for the sake of increased profits is the definition of cutting corners. It makes it easier and easier for a competitor to take you out. Businesses are in the business of staying in business, that requires them to make money. Making money doesn't mean you can stay in business though. You can fire all your developers and no be able to maintain or make new product and be highly profitable until it finally falls apart and the company ends up in the dustbin of history. Of course, I'm sure many of the people pushing this greed-is-good line fully expect to kill the company long term. It can be very profitable to run a company into the ground, and making profits is a great means of allowing you to jump ship to another company that can be profitably run into the ground. Just so long as you don't have to do the work to build the company and so long as you are long gone before the effects of the cannibalization really set in. I mean, that is what corporate raiders like Gordon Gekko did, you know, the guy on the cover of the news letter.
cjacey	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:38:00 - [2094] wishes he could do a long running jump over the rail quick enough to get away from the sinking ship of CQ
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:39:00 - [2095] Originally by: Cunane Jeran If this turns out to not be a work of fiction, its a deal breaker. I wouldn't touch this game again and I'd also make sure other people I know don't make the mistake of starting it up tbh. The Fearless issue? Not fiction. The unedited copy's been leaked elsewhere.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:41:00 - [2096] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:43:07 Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:42:21 Originally by: Vladimir Ilych Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:32:51 The CSM may have been voted on by 14% but that doesn't mean they aren't looking out for the rest of us. I am fairly certain based on the comments here and on Failheap that the CSM was either forbidden to comment via NDA or never exposed to the majority of this nightmare. I think you are correct. I am sure the CSM (if aware) warned CCP this might generate something of a reaction. Seleene specifically says she and the rest of the CSM were not shown any of this before hand in her blog. (don't have link but will get and edit it in). http://seleenes-sandbox.blogspot.com// "One thing I want to be crystal clear on though - the CSM was NOT asked or consulted on any of the prices in the Noble Exchange store. We asked and were told that they were not finalized. We floated a few thoughts at the summit, heads nodded a bit and that was the end of it. So wherever this marketing scheme came from, the CSM did not play a part in it (even tho we wanted to). As CSM Chairman Mittani just said on Twitter: "NeX is insane. My Lowe costs less than a monocle and fires ****-bullets in WoT. They didn't ask for price advice. Oops!"
Futile Rhetoric	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:41:00 - [2097] Originally by: Vladimir Ilych Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:32:51 The CSM may have been voted on by 14% but that doesn't mean they aren't looking out for the rest of us. I am fairly certain based on the comments here and on Failheap that the CSM was either forbidden to comment via NDA or never exposed to the majority of this nightmare. I think you are correct. I am sure the CSM (if aware) warned CCP this might generate something of a reaction. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532949&page=5#135
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:41:00 - [2098] Originally by: Illuminaty This of course assumes they don't lose their minds and start chasing MT store income at the expense of their current income flow. Vanity items (if made with development $ that is paid for by vanity item sales) won't harm spaceship EVE (so long as spaceship EVE $ subs pay for spaceship EVE content). The MT store could even help spaceship EVE since re-building the spaceship models to allow them to sell re-skins could help pay for new and improved base skins for the non-MT spaceship EVE. However, selling power-boosting items in a subscription based MMO is going to be problematic. Power-booster items are a required evil in a F2P game (which EVE is not). Something has to pay the bills. Subscriptions pays the bills, adding power-boosters is simply an unneeded evil. Needlessly degrading your product for the sake of increased profits is the definition of cutting corners. It makes it easier and easier for a competitor to take you out. Businesses are in the business of staying in business, that requires them to make money. Making money doesn't mean you can stay in business though. You can fire all your developers and no be able to maintain or make new product and be highly profitable until it finally falls apart and the company ends up in the dustbin of history. Of course, I'm sure many of the people pushing this greed-is-good line fully expect to kill the company long term. It can be very profitable to run a company into the ground, and making profits is a great means of allowing you to jump ship to another company that can be profitably run into the ground. Just so long as you don't have to do the work to build the company and so long as you are long gone before the effects of the cannibalization really set in. I mean, that is what corporate raiders like Gordon Gekko did, you know, the guy on the cover of the news letter. Good post. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:42:00 - [2099] Originally by: Erichan Originally by: Vladimir Ilych Originally by: Erichan Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:32:51 The CSM may have been voted on by 14% but that doesn't mean they aren't looking out for the rest of us. I am fairly certain based on the comments here and on Failheap that the CSM was either forbidden to comment via NDA or never exposed to the majority of this nightmare. I think you are correct. I am sure the CSM (if aware) warned CCP this might generate something of a reaction. Seleene specifically says she and the rest of the CSM were not shown any of this before hand in her blog. (don't have link but will get and edit it in). Bare faced lies by CCP again. Deceptive. They knew what the reaction would be.
Lykouleon Wildly Inappropriate Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:44:00 - [2100] Originally by: Erichan Seleene specifically says she Seleene is a d00d... Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER SO THAT I CAN HIT THEM WITH MY SWORD
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:45:00 - [2101] Last year's motto: Excellence This year's claimed motto: Deliver This year's real motto: F*** it. -
Mia Aires	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:45:00 - [2102] Edited by: Mia Aires on 23/06/2011 21:46:21 Maybe this lady could share her humorous approach to community management prior or after the GDC Europe 2011 Quote: Elsewhere, V. M., senior director of PR and communication from EVE Online developer CCP, will take a humorous approach to discussing community management in, "Everything I Ever Needed to Know About Online Communities I Learned from Jurassic Park," a talk that will illustrate the ins and outs of the job using examples from the classic Stephen Spielberg film and its sequels. Source: www.gamasutra.com She will have to show what she learned from Jurassic Park after today!
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:46:00 - [2103] It feels like everybody's running out of steam. After cancelling a subscription, there's not much to do but stand around screaming outrage, and my throat is getting sore. This thing has been given major publicity already.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:46:00 - [2104] I liked Incarna :( I wanted to build on the API :( Not now I won't, H. G . Wells in his novel "The first men on the moon" "The best vacation is a change of job" Perhaps a change of MMO is what's needed.
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:46:00 - [2105] Originally by: General Windypops How can we possibly replace the 20 or so of you that are quitting???????????? I find it interesting that today's peak player count was 1000 less than yesterday's..... despite being a "top seller" in Steam. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Sevena Black	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:47:00 - [2106] This is bad. I've never played games with Microtransactions for very long. I've played EVE for more than 3 years. I'd hate to give it up. But I must when this goes through. It just isn't right
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:49:00 - [2107] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 21:49:27 Originally by: Lykouleon Originally by: Erichan Seleene specifically says she Seleene is a d00d... Fine. HE. The fact is being a CSM delegate is a delicate balancing act. In exchange for advanced knowledge on some things, you can be bound to silence on a broad range of things. Based on the little I know of the current and previous CSMs, I can't believe a single one of them would sign up for this. waits for numerous responses of historical proofs with a sense of impending doom
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:49:00 - [2108] Companies do not switch to MT and FTP models because they make less money. They switch to them because it will draw more money than a simple subscription. Development costs money and a base subscription x players = fixed money intake. Now you go to RMT and FTP models. Now each item developed will have a projected corresponding expected income. If certain classes of models do not bring in the money, they will no longer be developed. The company can zero focus on what the paying players want the most, specialize in that area, and rake in the money. This reduces overall development cost and you now know where to place development time. Sure the overall framework has to be put in place, but it is only a frame work. If you want the dressing and fun, the player will have to pay for those pieces to hang. Gone will be the days of actual real game play expansion, everything from now on will have an eye towards monetizing the end result. This is especially true here where your lead game designer advocates for such.
Mister Smithington	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:51:00 - [2109] Jesus christ, this thread is growing faster than I can keep up with it at work :O Turns out CCP confirmed the newsletter, so I'm just posting to say: -2 subs from me. Burned my plexes I had sitting in my hangar, and I have no intention of re-upping when that time runs out.
Korerin Mayul Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:51:00 - [2110] this is absolutely **ing disgusting, me hearties. that a company which has built its strong position in the market through peerless developer/player relations could have brought this fest to pass numbs me. That they should have held a unilateral 'no bloody microtransictions' motion by the CSM in such contempt is breathtaking, that they should do all this while attempting to charge for API access and trumpeting the fact that the CSM exists... its the ragnarock of **ups. i wouldn't be worrying about loosing subscribers, at this moment id be more worried about loosing stakeholders. Thank god you didn't IPO before this monster.
Natalie Cerulean Caldari Arekin Piggy Bank Arekin Syndicate	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:51:00 - [2111] Originally by: Mister Smithington Jesus christ, this thread is growing faster than I can keep up with it at work :O Turns out CCP confirmed the newsletter, so I'm just posting to say: -2 subs from me. Burned my plexes I had sitting in my hangar, and I have no intention of re-upping when that time runs out. Where? When? What? Link?!?!
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:52:00 - [2112] Originally by: Caladan Broood ... Except I`ve never seen a F2P game where you had a MT for good gameplay. What if that`s what the players want their money to go to? -
tr33hugger Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:53:00 - [2113] Lets try to keep things in perspective: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1488892 tr33hugger
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:54:00 - [2114] Originally by: Caladan Broood Companies do not switch to MT and FTP models because they make less money. They switch to them because it will draw more money than a simple subscription. Development costs money and a base subscription x players = fixed money intake. Now you go to RMT and FTP models. Now each item developed will have a projected corresponding expected income. If certain classes of models do not bring in the money, they will no longer be developed. The company can zero focus on what the paying players want the most, specialize in that area, and rake in the money. This reduces overall development cost and you now know where to place development time. Sure the overall framework has to be put in place, but it is only a frame work. If you want the dressing and fun, the player will have to pay for those pieces to hang. Gone will be the days of actual real game play expansion, everything from now on will have an eye towards monetizing the end result. This is especially true here where your lead game designer advocates for such. is it seriously that hard though for :CCP: to grasp that it is Internet Spaceships that makes the money ... not internet barbies Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed so destructive.
Sragir Kshatriyas	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:55:00 - [2115] Originally by: Joao Duarte Maybe it's time to start building a whole new sandbox: http://www.perpetuum-online.com/ Ç9/$10 a month. Shame that I prefer spaceships to mechs and perpetuum is still very rough around the edges, and there's nothing out there like EVE lore. But it beats real money-driven games any day. CCP, please prove us wrong, there's still time. But once people start comiting to something else... Thank you.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:55:00 - [2116] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 21:55:30 Originally by: Caladan Broood Companies do not switch to MT and FTP models because they make less money. They switch to them because it will draw more money than a simple subscription. Development costs money and a base subscription x players = fixed money intake. Now you go to RMT and FTP models. Now each item developed will have a projected corresponding expected income. If certain classes of models do not bring in the money, they will no longer be developed. The company can zero focus on what the paying players want the most, specialize in that area, and rake in the money. This reduces overall development cost and you now know where to place development time. Sure the overall framework has to be put in place, but it is only a frame work. If you want the dressing and fun, the player will have to pay for those pieces to hang. Gone will be the days of actual real game play expansion, everything from now on will have an eye towards monetizing the end result. This is especially true here where your lead game designer advocates for such. Subscriptions provide a STEADY REVENUE stream which is what a profitalbe company needs, this is what CCP are depending on for stability, they are using MT to MILK customers for more. MT cannot be budgeted or planned for, sure you can set EXPECTATIONS or TARGETS, but it is unpredictable, not what a company wants in a recession, unpredictable revenue. Hence CCP using BOTH models. Also, FREE 2 PLAY are anything but FREE, if you actually want to PLAY them. I also as a customer find it harder to budget for MT games, and thus do NOT play them. I Subbed to eve because I know what I plan to spend yearly on it, don't forget I also purchase non MMO games. So if CCP think I am blowing a lot of money just for them, forget it. I budgeted in their yearly sub, nothing more, nothing more is disposable for CCP from me. Life costs more than a stupid MMO. SO CCP may aswell stick their heads out a moving train in a train wreck to guage their revenues for this.
Fighter26 Orion's Fist	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:56:00 - [2117] Edited by: Fighter26 on 23/06/2011 21:56:22 I checked out the pdf... it looks legit BUT WHERE ARE PAGES 2 and 3? I don't like evidence being withheld! PDF Goes Front cover >> page 4 and 5 (look at botom right corner.) WHERE ARE THE MISSING PAGES 2 AND 3? -Fighter -
Seleene	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:56:00 - [2118] Originally by: Lykouleon Originally by: Erichan Seleene specifically says she Seleene is a d00d... No, I'm... wait... WHAT?? ---- Seleene's Sandbox - My Blog, where I say stuff.
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:57:00 - [2119] Originally by: Sragir Originally by: Joao Duarte Maybe it's time to start building a whole new sandbox: http://www.perpetuum-online.com/ Ç9/$10 a month. Shame that I prefer spaceships to mechs and perpetuum is still very rough around the edges, and there's nothing out there like EVE lore. But it beats real money-driven games any day. CCP, please prove us wrong, there's still time. But once people start comiting to something else... Thank you. who's starting the eve bittervet corp in that game? Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed so destructive.
Shandir Minmatar Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:57:00 - [2120] There's another copy with employee satisfaction numbers on it. -
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:57:00 - [2121] Reality is that CCP rolls forward with their plans and part of the EvE community bag their packs and move on. I am honestly happy that my accounts don't have more than 1-2 days remaining and that I got only 1 plex in hangar (which I will leave there in case some groundbreaking changes would happen in future). If I had more time left, I would just sit here in forums and troll/rage/whine about everything day after day and that would just make myself sad in the end. It is better that I can just delete Eve folders and forget entire thing for now. Couple weeks of settlers or something will keep me busy np. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:57:00 - [2122] Originally by: Fighter26 WHERE ARE THE MISSING PAGES 2 AND 3? There's an unedited doc somewhere in the thread..
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:57:00 - [2123] Originally by: Fighter26 Edited by: Fighter26 on 23/06/2011 21:56:22 I checked out the pdf... it looks legit BUT WHERE ARE PAGES 2 and 3? I don't like evidence being withheld! PDF Goes Front cover >> page 4 and 5 (look at botom right corner.) WHERE ARE THE MISSING PAGES 2 AND 3? -Fighter [This page is intentionally left blank] [This page is intentionally left blank]
Hesperius	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:59:00 - [2124] Edited by: Hesperius on 23/06/2011 21:59:42 Originally by: Liang Nuren I find it interesting that today's peak player count was 1000 less than yesterday's..... despite being a "top seller" in Steam. Look at you getting all fancy with the images and even drawing on them now... oh wait, posting in haste... i see now.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:59:00 - [2125] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow Reality is that CCP rolls forward with their plans and part of the EvE community bag their packs and move on. I am honestly happy that my accounts don't have more than 1-2 days remaining and that I got only 1 plex in hangar (which I will leave there in case some groundbreaking changes would happen in future). If I had more time left, I would just sit here in forums and troll/rage/whine about everything day after day and that would just make myself sad in the end. It is better that I can just delete Eve folders and forget entire thing for now. Couple weeks of settlers or something will keep me busy np. They've certainly made it abundantly clear that they don't give a **** about the consumer. The rest is up to us: whether to take it, or whether to leave. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Mia Aires	Posted - 2011.06.23 21:59:00 - [2126] Originally by: Fighter26 Edited by: Fighter26 on 23/06/2011 21:56:22 I checked out the pdf... it looks legit BUT WHERE ARE PAGES 2 and 3? I don't like evidence being withheld! PDF Goes Front cover >> page 4 and 5 (look at botom right corner.) WHERE ARE THE MISSING PAGES 2 AND 3? -Fighter Here FEARLESS There is more "fun" inside
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:00:00 - [2127] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 22:00:41 Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Fighter26 WHERE ARE THE MISSING PAGES 2 AND 3? There's an unedited doc somewhere in the thread.. http://www.mediafire.com/?ccl135embyb6c2v
Maraner Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:00:00 - [2128] I dont see myself quiting over MT. BUT it will depend upon whats available. The cosmetic stuff is not an issue for me but if people can start purchasing new ship types or modules / drugs etc I think that will be a disaster. As always the devil is in the detail. Either way we seem to be living in interesting times. I think its about time that CCP comment on this formally. ------------------------------------- yeah , this looks easy I'll just spend an hour or so a week......
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:04:00 - [2129] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 22:04:22 Meh... Im still at the CQ docking area in Rens staring at my Vargur :(
Tallon Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:04:00 - [2130] I truly wish the micro transactions do not go through. It will probably be the end of me in this epic game I have enjoyed from the beginning (Beta tester). Coming from Games such as: Allegiance (original) Galactic Empire or GE as it was known Star Wars Galaxies SWG This was always my favorite. Micro transactions will ruin the spirit of the game I have loved over the years. Standing by for further announcements before I make my final pod self destruct! Tallon!
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:06:00 - [2131] Originally by: Black Dranzer It feels like everybody's running out of steam. After cancelling a subscription, there's not much to do but stand around screaming outrage, and my throat is getting sore. This thing has been given major publicity already. After the magiked scorpion, the $99 for being a fan who supports CCP's game EVE, Aurum GOLD paywall, etc. There isn't much more to say, CCP are who they are and EVE is what it is, turning into what it will.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:06:00 - [2132] You know what would really be the icing on the cake at this point in time? If CCP put a "once only" ad on the log in screen for the NEX store..
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:08:00 - [2133] Originally by: Miilla You know what would really be the icing on the cake at this point in time? If CCP put a "once only" ad on the log in screen for the NEX store.. I thought this was done already. Could have sworn I saw one. I will have to check on next login.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:08:00 - [2134] This is the only MMO I have ever played. I started playing because it was so unlike other MMOs. Player-driven story. Player-driven economy. How many of us subscribed because of Guiding Hand Social Club's infiltration of Ubiqua Seraph? How many of us read about the huge EBANK scam, or the stories of the Great War? Now CCP wants to squeeze the neck of the Golden Goose to see if it'll pop out some more eggs in its dying throes. Then it can be like all the other dead, lame-duck MT MMOs out there. No thanks. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:11:00 - [2135] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Miilla You know what would really be the icing on the cake at this point in time? If CCP put a "once only" ad on the log in screen for the NEX store.. I thought this was done already. Could have sworn I saw one. I will have to check on next login. It will be in your Eve Cache folder if it did.
Sorcsha Voren Caldari SVC Corp	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:11:00 - [2136] Originally by: Reed Tiburon This is the only MMO I have ever played. How many of us subscribed because of Guiding Hand Social Club's infiltration of Ubiqua Seraph? How many of us read about the huge EBANK scam, or the stories of the Great War? I did. I shamelessly admit that the GHSC article is what made me want to play this game. But, I sure don't want to be part of what they have in mind, now.
Warg Matar Minmatar The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:12:00 - [2137] Battlefield3! like some other guy wrote. It's not a mmog, but it's my last hope :( Diablo is too far off the horizon.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:13:00 - [2138] Originally by: Maraner I dont see myself quiting over MT. BUT it will depend upon whats available. The cosmetic stuff is not an issue for me but if people can start purchasing new ship types or modules / drugs etc I think that will be a disaster. As always the devil is in the detail. Either way we seem to be living in interesting times. I think its about time that CCP comment on this formally. Yea... it is everyones own call. I vented over a day before could put anything to words... and then I spent couple calm hours to write this... and felt rather good to be done with it... I don't wait or even want CCP to talk me back to their customer. Only reason why I still "whine" in here is that I've paid for it and I find it amusing as an activity. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:13:00 - [2139] Originally by: Myra2007 This is the future of this game: "However, as a subscription based golden goose, EVE needs to incorporate the virtual goods sales model to allow for further revenue û revenue to fund our other titles, revenue for its developer: you." And this is what you mean to CCP. My very favorite part of this is using the tale of the Golden Goose as an unironic argument in favor of getting more money out of the players for the same services. Fairy Tale FAIL. http://www.familymanagement.com/literacy/grimms/grimms50.html
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:15:00 - [2140] I used to call my gank ships "Miilla for CSM".. So now I need a new gankship name.. "Youve been Monacled?"
Marco Breau	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:16:00 - [2141] CCP is simply out to make as much money as possible. In order to make the most money out of the game, they try to get you hooked, get you addicted. Then they bilk you for everything you are worth in time and money, it's the same game casinos play.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:16:00 - [2142] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Miilla You know what would really be the icing on the cake at this point in time? If CCP put a "once only" ad on the log in screen for the NEX store.. I thought this was done already. Could have sworn I saw one. I will have to check on next login. Don't worry, the ad will be once. Then the colors and text will change and its a new ad! Heck, automate the color background change and you have new one-time only ads! But wait there's more, they will also send out very helpful articles to your email informing you of NEX. These emails will send you to the very helpful site of evepedia where the evepedia article will detail how to get NEX, what is NEX, what can you buy with NEX, etc. (Sorta what they did with PLEX). Speaking of PLEX, I bet the NEX will link to PLEX which will link to profit sites
Nadarius Chrome Celestial Horizon Corp.	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:17:00 - [2143] Originally by: Miilla I used to call my gank ships "Miilla for CSM".. So now I need a new gankship name.. "Youve been Monacled?" "Buy moar tank SPs with AUR"
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:18:00 - [2144] Originally by: Nadarius Chrome Originally by: Miilla I used to call my gank ships "Miilla for CSM".. So now I need a new gankship name.. "Youve been Monacled?" "Buy moar tank SPs with AUR" Won't fit in, 19 or 20 letters only :(
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:19:00 - [2145] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Nadarius Chrome Originally by: Miilla I used to call my gank ships "Miilla for CSM".. So now I need a new gankship name.. "Youve been Monacled?" "Buy moar tank SPs with AUR" Won't fit in, 19 or 20 letters only :( Monocles or death?
Futile Rhetoric	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:19:00 - [2146] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Nadarius Chrome Originally by: Miilla I used to call my gank ships "Miilla for CSM".. So now I need a new gankship name.. "Youve been Monacled?" "Buy moar tank SPs with AUR" Won't fit in, 19 or 20 letters only :( MY LIFE FOR AUR.
MrSteack Caldari Unchained Potential Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:19:00 - [2147] Edited by: MrSteack on 23/06/2011 22:19:48 HAHAhahahaha http://www.eveonline.com/en/incarna They bumped the video about introducing the CQ to the front page today. Something about this seems pathetic. edit:link included
Bendy Profane The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:20:00 - [2148] Originally by: Reed Tiburon This is the only MMO I have ever played. I started playing because it was so unlike other MMOs. Player-driven story. Player-driven economy. How many of us subscribed because of Guiding Hand Social Club's infiltration of Ubiqua Seraph? How many of us read about the huge EBANK scam, or the stories of the Great War? This all applies in my case. Eve's unique culture and member base is also the reason why think CCP will not be successful with the model they are currently flirting with. Cutting your unique selling points and adapting to the pressure they apparently feel from the mainstream - will make you lose your identity and transform you into one of many.
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:20:00 - [2149] Originally by: Marco Breau CCP is simply out to make as much money as possible. In order to make the most money out of the game, they try to get you hooked, get you addicted. Then they bilk you for everything you are worth in time and money, it's the same game casinos play. but at least the original style of this was Internet Spaceships... and the devs had a half a brain... I remember in my early days hearing of the exploits of GHSC, MoO (hey, maybe they were on to something...), BoB, and others... wishing that some day, I could be in a group like that. To bad CCP killed the sandbox. Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed so destructive.
Adrie Atticus Mining and Industrial Services	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:21:00 - [2150] Originally by: Miilla You know what would really be the icing on the cake at this point in time? If CCP put a "once only" ad on the log in screen for the NEX store.. For some reason when you decide not to use the biggest font known to mankind, I actually read your posts. Please, start using big letters again so I know what to skip. Is it only 111 days now?
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:22:00 - [2151] Originally by: Sorcsha Voren Originally by: Reed Tiburon This is the only MMO I have ever played. How many of us subscribed because of Guiding Hand Social Club's infiltration of Ubiqua Seraph? How many of us read about the huge EBANK scam, or the stories of the Great War? I did. I shamelessly admit that the GHSC article is what made me want to play this game. But, I sure don't want to be part of what they have in mind, now. You can look at the GHSC episode as a preview of what CCP wants to do with your RL Dollahz. --------------------- Countdown to sub running out: 9
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:24:00 - [2152] Originally by: E6o5 if real then -2 accounts Get ready, then. It's real.
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:25:00 - [2153] I hope this is just about an excitable guy in marketing sharing their great ideas to create revenue. Every big company has them. Those drawing the big pay cheques then knock the edges of the ideas off and smooth the brighter thinking into potential policy. It makes sense to seek new revenue streams for the game and innovation really isn't a bad thing and should be encouraged. The danger in the thinking that this "memo" espouses and the early signs of it's similarity to the direction of travel evidenced by Incarna is that we are moving away from the sandbox. Once you start allowing people to pay for priviledge and power in the game you have fundamentally changed it's appeal and the risk and reward balance. It's OK to allow meta gaming and its always been there, RMT goes beyond the pale and the thought that RMT could pay for power and space would sound like a death knell across New Eden. Leave vanity purchases in. Anything that does not affect gameplay can be paid for, make that your mantra and let loose the innovative minds of the CCP team. You want an orange ship, well it'll cost you, you can have a monocle too if you'd like and gunless luxury yacht that everyone knows cost you a small fortune. Dust is new, Dust is the place to go beyond the sandbox but don't kill your cash cow. If that memo is true then you have a lot of persuading to do and marketing to bring in the people who will pay for it's ideas, if it isn't then you have a lot of explaining to do to calm people down.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:26:00 - [2154] yeah there is no more doubt that its real, just what to do about it... People seem to fall into a few camps: 1)don't care--carry on 2)unsub but waiting to see what CCP says 3)those unsubbed waiting to microwave their toons 4)the silent many who have already left I'm in camp 2 atm :/
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:27:00 - [2155] Not even VALVE are selling game changing items. They still sit behind that "vanity" line. THEY KNOW THE DANGER. Valve is smart, valve is rich because they are smart.
JitaPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:27:00 - [2156] Cant wait for faction towers for aurum, since they dont drop for 6 months or so now.
Max Kolonko Caldari Worm Nation Ash Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:28:00 - [2157] CCP keeps pushing the boundry. STOP, RETHINK, KEEP ALL YOUR PROMISES. Max Kolonko
XIRUSPHERE Gallente The 8th Order Mean Coalition	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:29:00 - [2158] Edited by: XIRUSPHERE on 23/06/2011 22:32:30 Thread will be ignored till it's past 100 pages if even then. Dev's and mods are in ninja mode till patch tuesday working their asses off to try to push forth some more fluff that will distract your average player. Then we might see some post along the lines of " I work so hard for you bebe, why don't you luff me ".
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:30:00 - [2159] Originally by: Erichan yeah there is no more doubt that its real, just what to do about it... People seem to fall into a few camps: 1)don't care--carry on 2)unsub but waiting to see what CCP says 3)those unsubbed waiting to microwave their toons 4)the silent many who have already left I'm in camp 2 atm :/ There's a 5th. Those that are still subbed and awaiting some action or inaction from CCP before they ragequit.
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:31:00 - [2160] Originally by: Erichan Originally by: Alaura Aquila Originally by: Heimdallofasgard Edited by: Heimdallofasgard on 23/06/2011 20:50:51 Anyone else see this today? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5T1SZKab7F8&feature=related just sayin... Why is it a Trinity trailer? He was saying it was the "good old days", gone forever. "Uploaded by ValveVideos on Jun 23, 2011"
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:31:00 - [2161] Originally by: XIRUSPHERE Thread will be ignored till it's past 100 if even then. 100 what? We are alredy past 1.000 and 100.000
Belid Hagen Resilience. Northern Coalition.	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:35:00 - [2162] This is what happens when you put members of goonswarm in charge of leading CCP's direction.
Ohh Yeah SniggWaffe FREE KARTTOON NOW	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:35:00 - [2163] Edited by: Ohh Yeah on 23/06/2011 22:35:26 Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: XIRUSPHERE Thread will be ignored till it's past 100 if even then. 100 what? We are alredy past 1.000 and 100.000 Pages you blithering idiot snypaaaaah
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:35:00 - [2164] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: XIRUSPHERE Thread will be ignored till it's past 100 if even then. 100 what? We are alredy past 1.000 and 100.000 He's obviously referring to the number of active accounts left. CCP will only realize when 100 accounts are left. Windypops and his CCP alts
Technovar Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:35:00 - [2165] Originally by: Quartex I hope this is just about an excitable guy in marketing sharing their great ideas to create revenue. Every big company has them. Those drawing the big pay cheques then knock the edges of the ideas off and smooth the brighter thinking into potential policy. It makes sense to seek new revenue streams for the game and innovation really isn't a bad thing and should be encouraged. The danger in the thinking that this "memo" espouses and the early signs of it's similarity to the direction of travel evidenced by Incarna is that we are moving away from the sandbox. Once you start allowing people to pay for priviledge and power in the game you have fundamentally changed it's appeal and the risk and reward balance. It's OK to allow meta gaming and its always been there, RMT goes beyond the pale and the thought that RMT could pay for power and space would sound like a death knell across New Eden. Leave vanity purchases in. Anything that does not affect gameplay can be paid for, make that your mantra and let loose the innovative minds of the CCP team. You want an orange ship, well it'll cost you, you can have a monocle too if you'd like and gunless luxury yacht that everyone knows cost you a small fortune. Dust is new, Dust is the place to go beyond the sandbox but don't kill your cash cow. If that memo is true then you have a lot of persuading to do and marketing to bring in the people who will pay for it's ideas, if it isn't then you have a lot of explaining to do to calm people down. "Excitable guy in marketing?" It's CCP Soundwave. Lead Designer. Quote: I would like virtual goods sales in EVE. In fact, IÆd like to sell a lot more than vanity items.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:36:00 - [2166] Feels good to be milked to fund furries dunnit? Furries = warewolves etc
DeadDuck Amarr Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:36:00 - [2167] Sorry CCP for what I've seen you're really screwing the game big time. Haven't you noticed already that you failed miserably already in the (NOT BEATEN) record CPU. Aren't you noticing the players opinion about Incarna?... keep going in this path, keep going. Strength and Honour
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:36:00 - [2168] Originally by: Belid Hagen This is what happens when you put members of goonswarm in charge of leading CCP's direction. To be fair, I doubt the CSM were in on this. They've testified they had no idea of the pricing (and they did ask). Direct hatred where it's warranted.
Illwill Bill For a fistful of Veldspar	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:37:00 - [2169] That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. FREE HELICITY
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:37:00 - [2170] Is anyone else outraged by the hypocracy and blatant abandonment of direct engagement with the players? I honestly could care less about MT. MT will exist(in their own words its about how they implement it). What was obvious though was that they intend to go a LOT farther than they said they would in the same document they espoused a commitment to transparency. "It is easy to make decisions without debate, but CCP espouses transparency and unity û two values integral to the recent Economic and Microtransaction Summit held in Reykjavik, which focused on the viability of the virtual goods sales model in all our games." Where is the transparency and unity in lying to us about the future of MT and the unity of working it out with the player base in a direct and open way? If the issue is money, then lets talk money (several threads already going on this). Isn't CCP "making decisions without debate"? Or at least debate without all the facts on the table?
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:37:00 - [2171] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 23/06/2011 22:40:41 Originally by: XIRUSPHERE Edited by: XIRUSPHERE on 23/06/2011 22:32:30 Thread will be ignored till it's past 100 pages if even then. Dev's and mods are in ninja mode till patch tuesday working their asses off to try to push forth some more fluff that will distract your average player. Then we might see some post along the lines of " I work so hard for you bebe, why don't you luff me ". Do you think 100 pages is really the point of critical mass here? We shall see I suppose. we are well on our way to that 100th page and most of it within the first 24hours. Unfortunately more and more people are giving up. I don't really want to quit EVE, and I like Incarna really, sexy new turrets and even though it's unpolished the Captains Quarters is a really interesting idea, one that I like. But when you can simply buy an advantage for AURUM and don't even have to engage the (currently) player based economy THAT my friends becomes a problem.
Donatella D'Tren Harbingers of Chaos Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:37:00 - [2172] In Russian EVE, CCP farms YOU!
Adacia Calla Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:38:00 - [2173] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 22:29:49 Not even VALVE are selling game changing items. They still sit behind that "vanity" line. THEY KNOW THE DANGER, they have even stated this fact. Valve is smart, valve is rich because they are smart. Agreed, Valve IS smart. The single biggest change they've made in their entire career was the introduction of Steam, and it seemed like a bit of a gamble at the time, but it's been 100% smooth since it's delivery. Who knows, maybe in 2 or 3 years I'll start using CCP products once they've gotten rid of the current idiotic marketing staff.
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:39:00 - [2174] Originally by: Republica Winder Originally by: Miilla I guess when we interview an Ex CCP employee we strike them off the hire list. Untrustable. Not exactly. Right now, it's the senior managers who get that tag. However, if they don't 100% retract all this crap, the CCP employees REMAINING 6 months from now should go on any "do not hire" list. If they follow the same pattern SOE did into downfall, what is happening right now is their best people all realize that the light at the end of the tunnel is the onrushing train. They are hard at work right now finding new gigs. What will be left will be a mix of evil and incompetent types who agreed with this move, new hires with no experience, and those who might have WANTED to leave but weren't good enough to land a job anywhere else. The result will be a Dev staff that is completely incapable of making anything. That's what happened with SOE. When the NGE hit, their best talent ran to the exits, STARTING with Raph Koster (who designed Pre-NGE SWG). Fast forward to their next major new MMO release, DC Universe Online. They spent 5 years and $50 million developing it. They put all the resources necessary to produce an AAA title. They put their best people on it. The end product was a piece of crap full of PVP exploits and not enough content to keep people playing past the first 2 weeks. They are merging servers down to 4. The game will likely have all remaining development cut off before it's even 1 year old. The lesson: Pulling a NGE is company destroying. Even IF you manage to survive it and keep going, the end result not only is a horrific reputation with customers, but with INDUSTRY TALENT. SOE can't hire top level talent to work for them in Austin or San Diego, much more appealing places than Iceland. Which tells me that CCP will ultimately end up in even worse shape. Again, assuming they survive this, they don't have other MMOs to live off of like SOE did. They are killing their ONE REVENUE SOURCE. There's something about business leaders, over and over, in all different industries, prioritizing a short term expected, theoretical revenue bump over continued long term success. It's weird.
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:39:00 - [2175] Originally by: Belid Hagen This is what happens when you put members of goonswarm in charge of leading CCP's direction. keep the CAOD rubbish where it belongs, mate... _________________________________________________
Illuminaty	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:40:00 - [2176] Going to have to check out that Perpetuum game. Not sure it is better, but I'm at least going to LOOK. Turned off the auto-renew on my accounts, and I'm not really in the mood to apply my PLEX. Hopefully the "this is a really bad idea" faction inside CCP gets a push from this, but from looking at the CCP employee reviews, it sounds like the upper management are ivory towered up pretty good.
RC Denton	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:40:00 - [2177] Since this is the thread they say they're monitoring for this stuff I'll post my $.02. If microtransactions are constrained to vanity items that don't have a significant impact on game play, then I really don't care. I'm not being forced to pay real $$$ on top of the subscription fee to stay competitive. If, however, they start selling performance and progression impacting items (+6 implants or whatever) which must be bought with real $$$ and can't be bought with ISK then I will probably stop playing the game, and I've been playing since 2006. Being able to purchase everything with isk levels the playing field. If I want to spend $$$ to get the spiffy new whatchamacallit then I can do so, but I'm not gated from getting it if I don't. It will just take longer to make the isk in game.
Distortus	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:42:00 - [2178] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Erichan yeah there is no more doubt that its real, just what to do about it... People seem to fall into a few camps: 1)don't care--carry on 2)unsub but waiting to see what CCP says 3)those unsubbed waiting to microwave their toons 4)the silent many who have already left I'm in camp 2 atm :/ There's a 5th. Those that are still subbed and awaiting some action or inaction from CCP before they ragequit. Confirming camp 5th.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:42:00 - [2179] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 22:42:50 Originally by: RC Denton Since this is the thread they say they're monitoring for this stuff I'll post my $.02. If microtransactions are constrained to vanity items that don't have a significant impact on game play, then I really don't care. I'm not being forced to pay real $$$ on top of the subscription fee to stay competitive. If, however, they start selling performance and progression impacting items (+6 implants or whatever) which must be bought with real $$$ and can't be bought with ISK then I will probably stop playing the game, and I've been playing since 2006. Being able to purchase everything with isk levels the playing field. If I want to spend $$$ to get the spiffy new whatchamacallit then I can do so, but I'm not gated from getting it if I don't. It will just take longer to make the isk in game. their loopwhole in what you say is that you can use isk to buy plex that you convert to aurum to buy the enhancement and therefore [think monty python wood to duck analogy] you buy stuff with isk means they feel off the hook.
Vandrion Gallente The Collective B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:43:00 - [2180]
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:44:00 - [2181] Originally by: Emperor Cheney There's something about business leaders, over and over, in all different industries, prioritizing a short term expected, theoretical revenue bump over continued long term success. It's weird. Septic tank business models. Largest sh its rise to the top. seen it first hand Also you may want to read this about leaders... http://blogs.forbes.com/jeffbercovici/2011/06/14/why-some-psychopaths-make-great-ceos/
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:44:00 - [2182] Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. for anyone too young to have been there when Trinity came out. WATCH THIS Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed so destructive.
Don Pellegrino Pod Liberation Authority HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:47:00 - [2183] I will be eternally damned for quoting and agreeing with Jade Constantine, but I have to do so. It nails it: Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. ____________________________________________
Nutsy	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:47:00 - [2184] I finally understand it. They blamed the Russians for money laundering in Icelandic banks and now they have corrupted ccp!!!! Were all doomed!! Doesn't capitalism make u all warm and fuzzy.
Helgur Red Federation	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:48:00 - [2185] 4 **ing years with this game. I'll miss it. This is truly the coup de grGce and this is the first time I've uttered these words: eve is dead** GG CCP GG
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:49:00 - [2186] Originally by: Ohh Yeah Edited by: Ohh Yeah on 23/06/2011 22:35:26 Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: XIRUSPHERE Thread will be ignored till it's past 100 if even then. 100 what? We are alredy past 1.000 and 100.000 Pages you blithering idiot snypaaaaah hurt your feelings much? milk?
Katmande	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:50:00 - [2187] I am reducing my subscription plan to 1 month. I usualy sub for 6 months. There is just too much uncertaincly concerning micro tranactions and EVE right now. I have no interest in playing any game were MT is used for none vanity improvments to charecters. NO to faction, implant or any no vanity MT. I also think CCP has an obligation to inform the player base on what they really intend for EVE. If the letters are real - CCP management is being deceptive and lieing to the customer. I am not sure I even want to waste any more time on money on developing my charecters. I have zero interst in game that operate on the MT modle. T
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:50:00 - [2188] Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. for anyone too young to have been there when Trinity came out. WATCH THIS it's really hard to believe that this is the same CCP that is now doing all this horrible crap... _________________________________________________
Nimbat	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:51:00 - [2189] Have anyone translated and sent this to the russian population in eve? I'm sure they'd like to hear what's going on aswell.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:52:00 - [2190] i predict a slow death now. A few will drop out then a few more, a bit more MT injected in, and a few more drop out. Then all of a sudden every one will realise that all these few people not playing no more add up a lot less pcu and when they realise this it will free fall
Deamos Dev Null Development and Holdings	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:52:00 - [2191] This is such a sad revelation. Dear CCP, I am disappointed in you. As a player whom has been with you since 2003, I stood beside you when the times looked very bleak. This is absolutely insane. First of all, fire whomever came up with this idea with MT... Then, give John Turbefield a god damn raise. We, the players of Eve Online, want more devs like him. He understands what we want. I will be waiting to see what you do with this scandal..... Hugs, Kisses, and pew pew.. -Deamos -
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:53:00 - [2192] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 22:54:51 I dont WANT to quit, like most people here. IF I had alts, sure I would cancel them most likely, but I dont have alts, i play for FUN and dont want to "work" at eve as a game as that beats the purpose of a game, fun I wont be touching MT stuff, I basically dont have more money to throw at CCP, nor would I want to, that money goes on other things, life, books, tools, health, equipment, other games, travel and more etc etc. NOT CCP. I pay my yearly sub, I budget for that, that is what you get, nothing else. If eve becomes a paywall, then I can no longer play it. IT is that simple. If it obstructs my game, its no longer a fun game. My friends are all going to SWTOR, I probably will try it, avoiding paywalls in the MMO space will get harder, and thus, them (the MMO companies) getting my money will be harder too, i can play hardball too.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:54:00 - [2193] Originally by: Nimbat Have anyone translated and sent this to the russian population in eve? I'm sure they'd like to hear what's going on aswell. Brilliant idea. Anyone know Russian? Let's get that PDF translated and distributed. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
raker	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:55:00 - [2194] Edited by: raker on 23/06/2011 22:55:55 The silence from ccp is deafening, they havent repled at all Surely its time they came out from under the desk and made a statement, CCP not responding is adding fuel to the fire We all now know that the noble exchange is a cash cow, I mean the prices are way off, and lets face it, no one can see your flash clothes , execpt yourself in a mirror Youve got it wrong CCP, its time to put your hands up, and inform us of your intentions to sort this mess out get back to basics's this is eve online, not the Sims
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:58:00 - [2195] Edited by: Token Afrodude on 23/06/2011 22:57:57 Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. for anyone too young to have been there when Trinity came out. WATCH THIS really makes you wonder wtf happened It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:59:00 - [2196] Originally by: Token Afrodude Edited by: Token Afrodude on 23/06/2011 22:57:57 Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. for anyone too young to have been there when Trinity came out. WATCH THIS really makes you wonder wtf happened I wasn't there but I think the graphics engine got a big upgrade which you can see in some of the videos where they show the old ship transitioned to the new ship. Did I get that right vets?
Illuminaty	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:59:00 - [2197] Originally by: Don Pellegrino Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. 2. If you read the newsletter youÆll see reference to saved fitting slots û and I donÆt know about you Verone but in JF weÆve run out of saved corp ship fittings. We want CCP to up the limit but is that really going to happen while the ôbiz-devsö talk honeyed words about how to squeeze extra income from players for such ôminor upgrades.ö? How long till we pay aurum for extra corp standing slots? For wardec options? For a usable corp management screen? 3. And who develops these vanity items? Yes thats right its Eve artists and developers whose salary we pay with our subscriptions. Given the choice wouldnÆt you rather have engine trials and flashy cyno effect for all players rather than a bunch of overpriced tat in the Aur store for a fleeced few? Because that is precisely the compromise being made here -> CCP using our subs money to pay for vanity item production they want to sell back to us for greedy prices and it is something you SHOULD get mad about. So hereÆs the thing. The time to fight for the game we love is not in six months time when these concepts have bedded down and CCP is feeling bold enough to start selling Noble Faction ammo and +9 implants. The time to fight is now. Because this newsletter embodies everything that many of us feared but didnÆt want to believe CCP were becoming capable of. It is a massive betrayal of the compact we shared as players and developers of this game and indicates that CCP is preparing to leap down a very dark and deep path of self-immolation in the months to come. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. Yea, it is the blatant cannibalization that scares me. If you kill a healthy host there is a lot of meat to feast on until there is nothing but bones left. Blind greed is not good.
Caladan Broood	Posted - 2011.06.23 22:59:00 - [2198] Um the Russians will sure love and support CCP. Their botting revenue will skyrocket selling and buying NEX items and currency. The Russians are never your friends.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:00:00 - [2199] Originally by: Caladan Broood Um the Russians will sure love and support CCP. Their botting revenue will skyrocket selling and buying NEX items and currency. The Russians are never your friends. No time for xenophobia ***got. gtfo
Hra Neuvosto The 8th Order Mean Coalition	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:00:00 - [2200] Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. Incarna didn't even have a trailer :( ------------------
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:01:00 - [2201] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 23:02:21 Originally by: Caladan Broood Um the Russians will sure love and support CCP. Their botting revenue will skyrocket selling and buying NEX items and currency. The Russians are never your friends. There already is a NEX store EXPLOIT http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1534988
Royaldo Gallente Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:01:00 - [2202] is this where i x up now? see the nc died, and im kinda lost..
Hyperforce99 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:02:00 - [2203] I'm honestly still wondering why there has been no proper response from CCP about this. They must be either scrambling to meet up and decide which direction to go from here. Or they are simply ignoring it (which would be the worst thing they could do). I guess i'll see in the morning. --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/
Obicula Oris	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:02:00 - [2204] The day this aurum rubbish starts to impact Gameplay, will be the beginning of the end of EVE. If CCP can't see this happening, they are incredibly short sighted. Sad to see such mental excrement from the makers of the game we love so much.
daddys helper	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:03:00 - [2205] I love how everyone points out the spelling errors and says "fake!" ok I'm off to go do a mission that pays "Fifteen hundred thousand isk"
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:04:00 - [2206] Originally by: Hyperforce99 I'm honestly still wondering why there has been no proper response from CCP about this. They must be either scrambling to meet up and decide which direction to go from here. Or they are simply ignoring it (which would be the worst thing they could do). I guess i'll see in the morning. dont get your hopes up tbh _________________________________________________
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:05:00 - [2207] Originally by: daddys helper I love how everyone points out the spelling errors and says "fake!" ok I'm off to go do a mission that pays "Fifteen hundred thousand isk" QFT It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:05:00 - [2208] **** it, I'm gonna go play Dragon Age. I fully expect there to be no response when I return. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Brainless Bimbo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:06:00 - [2209] Originally by: daddys helper I love how everyone points out the spelling errors and says "fake!" ok I'm off to go do a mission that pays "Fifteen hundred thousand isk" lol ...... continues overleaf.
Futile Rhetoric	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:06:00 - [2210] Originally by: Reed Tiburon I fully expect there to be no response when I return. Why do you do this to yourself.
Daray Greerr Gallente Mort's Navy Mort's Empire	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:06:00 - [2211] Originally by: Jonny Utrigas Originally by: Erichan yeah there is no more doubt that its real, just what to do about it... People seem to fall into a few camps: 1)don't care--carry on 2)unsub but waiting to see what CCP says 3)those unsubbed waiting to microwave their toons 4)the silent many who have already left I'm in camp 2 atm :/ There's a 5th. Those that are still subbed and awaiting some action or inaction from CCP before they ragequit. I'm in that one. Not reacting too rashly. Waiting to see what happens with some hope. If it gets to the point of non-vanity AUR items, I might leave. Even if people can just buy plex, sell them, and buy anything they want anyway. Most upset at the complete unjustifiable NeX prices.
Reilly Duvolle	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:06:00 - [2212] You know, CCP has for the last years grown exponentially, devloping DUST514, World of Darkness and probably also funding projects that are not even public yet. Huge sums of money has been pumped into these endeveaurs. In this whole time - and for at least a whole more year to come - their sole point of revenue has been and is EVE Online. The EVE Online community - US - has allowed them to do these things. We surely are their customers. But in the current state of affairs, the EVE Online playerbase is also CCPs de-facto employers. WE pay their salaries. WE fund their projects. And WE decide wheter we want to stay or take our money elsewhere. So CCP - a word of caution. You are walking on a very narrow path right now. There ARE limits to how much bull**** from you us players will take before moving on. And if you travel down that road that are indicated in your internal magazine, chances are the the EVE Online playerbase will burn your whole damn company to the ground.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:07:00 - [2213] CCP is either in complete breakdown ( LOL? ) or laughing their asses off. THey just hid themselves in the closet waiting for the fire to extinguish ( which it will eventually ) After that, we can expect the new game changing updates to NeX, And another buttload of ragequit. Rinse repeat. ??? Profit
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:07:00 - [2214] Originally by: Reed Tiburon **** it, I'm gonna go play Dragon Age. I fully expect there to be no response when I return. response? we trashed CCP's tank and got the pod quite a few pages back. It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:08:00 - [2215] Originally by: Technovar Originally by: Quartex I hope this is just about an excitable guy in marketing sharing their great ideas to create revenue. Every big company has them. Those drawing the big pay cheques then knock the edges of the ideas off and smooth the brighter thinking into potential policy. It makes sense to seek new revenue streams for the game and innovation really isn't a bad thing and should be encouraged. The danger in the thinking that this "memo" espouses and the early signs of it's similarity to the direction of travel evidenced by Incarna is that we are moving away from the sandbox. Once you start allowing people to pay for priviledge and power in the game you have fundamentally changed it's appeal and the risk and reward balance. It's OK to allow meta gaming and its always been there, RMT goes beyond the pale and the thought that RMT could pay for power and space would sound like a death knell across New Eden. Leave vanity purchases in. Anything that does not affect gameplay can be paid for, make that your mantra and let loose the innovative minds of the CCP team. You want an orange ship, well it'll cost you, you can have a monocle too if you'd like and gunless luxury yacht that everyone knows cost you a small fortune. Dust is new, Dust is the place to go beyond the sandbox but don't kill your cash cow. If that memo is true then you have a lot of persuading to do and marketing to bring in the people who will pay for it's ideas, if it isn't then you have a lot of explaining to do to calm people down. "Excitable guy in marketing?" It's CCP Soundwave. Lead Designer. Quote: I would like virtual goods sales in EVE. In fact, IÆd like to sell a lot more than vanity items. Sorry you are right, I had not read the article but understood the argument, as it's a hallowed one in gaming right now (aka Farmville . check their designers revenue, CCP will have done).
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:08:00 - [2216] Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 23:10:37 Everytime I open my character WALLET in Eve now, I just get confirmation of the stupid decisions CCP makes. FFS what idiot thinks putting the balance on the RIGHT side is a good idea? My market window covers the damn balance now. (PS: you can keep the "highlighted" AUR balance on the right though because it always says ZERO) And yeah No NEW VIDEO for Incarna in the logon. That shows how much they really give a damn about Incarna.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:10:00 - [2217] Originally by: Hra Neuvosto Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. Incarna didn't even have a trailer :( Found it. Here
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:10:00 - [2218] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 23:09:25 Everytime I open my character WALLET in Eve now, I just get confirmation of the stupid decisions CCP makes. FFS what idiot thinks putting the balance on the RIGHT side is a good idea? My market window covers the damn balance now. (PS: you can keep the "highlighted" AUR balance on the right though because it always says ZERO) I think there is a proposal to put Aurum on the opposite of the wallet from isk.
Eladaris Amarr Excessum Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:11:00 - [2219] Originally by: Hyperforce99 I'm honestly still wondering why there has been no proper response from CCP about this. They must be either scrambling to meet up and decide which direction to go from here. Or they are simply ignoring it (which would be the worst thing they could do). I guess i'll see in the morning. What response could there be? It's already been fairly solidly confirmed that it's not a fake. And since the lowest of low CCP peon's could have popped in at page 7 and said "Hey, I've got that issue of Fearless right in front of me, that's a total scam". and stopped this 70+ pages and a thousand cancelled accounts early. This is the future vision CCP hasn't been willing to show the player base. Last I checked companies don't produce insider newspapers that AREN'T 100% in line with the company future vision. Personally having SEEN this issue, I'd really love to know what some of the earlier ones looked like. Wonder how many times the former CSM members had to put the NDA blindfolds on when discussing the 'future' of Eve.
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:13:00 - [2220] Originally by: Hra Neuvosto Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. Incarna didn't even have a trailer :( What about this? These are the things that made me join EvE. That intangible feeling of being one in a million, yet fundamental. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:13:00 - [2221] Originally by: Eladaris Originally by: Hyperforce99 I'm honestly still wondering why there has been no proper response from CCP about this. They must be either scrambling to meet up and decide which direction to go from here. Or they are simply ignoring it (which would be the worst thing they could do). I guess i'll see in the morning. What response could there be? It's already been fairly solidly confirmed that it's not a fake. And since the lowest of low CCP peon's could have popped in at page 7 and said "Hey, I've got that issue of Fearless right in front of me, that's a total scam". and stopped this 70+ pages and a thousand cancelled accounts early. This is the future vision CCP hasn't been willing to show the player base. Last I checked companies don't produce insider newspapers that AREN'T 100% in line with the company future vision. Personally having SEEN this issue, I'd really love to know what some of the earlier ones looked like. Wonder how many times the former CSM members had to put the NDA blindfolds on when discussing the 'future' of Eve. We should get some CSM members that can read braille for all these blindfolds they wear while reading those newsletters in their meetings.
Maximus Trollus Amarr The Village Idiots	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:13:00 - [2222] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 23/06/2011 23:10:37 Everytime I open my character WALLET in Eve now, I just get confirmation of the stupid decisions CCP makes. FFS what idiot thinks putting the balance on the RIGHT side is a good idea? My market window covers the damn balance now. (PS: you can keep the "highlighted" AUR balance on the right though because it always says ZERO) And yeah No NEW VIDEO for Incarna in the logon. That shows how much they really give a damn about Incarna. every time I refresh this thread there are three new posts made by you, in which you say absolutely nothing at all...
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:14:00 - [2223] Something makes me doubt the average Joe at CCP buys into this, much interaction as some have with the community. Hence the leak out of self-interest. I don't think they are oblivious to the fact this agenda essentially puts the gun in EVE's mouth and pulls the trigger.
Deamos Dev Null Development and Holdings	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:15:00 - [2224] This topic needs to stay on top until CCP gives a response! -
Eladaris Amarr Excessum Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:15:00 - [2225] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Eladaris Personally having SEEN this issue, I'd really love to know what some of the earlier ones looked like. Wonder how many times the former CSM members had to put the NDA blindfolds on when discussing the 'future' of Eve. We should get some CSM members that can read braille for all these blindfolds they wear while reading those newsletters in their meetings. It's an NDA... and we already know what happens when 'ahem' now-former members of the CSM break those.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:15:00 - [2226] PONY PROTEST :)
Nadarius Chrome Celestial Horizon Corp.	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:17:00 - [2227] Coming soon, the yearly "free" expansions will cost only 25,000 AUR. It's free, 'cos you can buy PLEX on the market, turn it into AUR, and buy it that way!
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:18:00 - [2228] Originally by: Hra Neuvosto Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. Incarna didn't even have a trailer :( Kinda hard to do a vid of a cash register and make it interesting. My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:18:00 - [2229] Originally by: Don Pellegrino I will be eternally damned for quoting and agreeing with Jade Constantine, but I have to do so. It nails it: Originally by: Jade Constantine Here is the problem Verone. Sure when you have been playing Eve as long as we have you learn to take the rough with the smooth but you do so with the general feeling that CCP developers understand and ôgetö what makes Eve great û and thatÆs the problem now. This internal newsletter (if real) shows that one of the leading developers does not ôget eveö does not care about eve, and simply sees eve as a cash cow to be milked ferociously to fund other projects. This is about keeping the golden goose of eve subscriptions (on a drip feed if necessary) while chasing and grubbing every little loose cent he can from the player base. Let me give you a couple of examples of how this can and does (and has already) impacted our enjoyment of this game: 1. The Captains Quarters û itÆs not gameplay its a display cabinet for vanity items. And the price of this display cabinet for you and I is that multi-client performance in stations is now terrible û if you have a bad graphic card itÆs a jerk fest û if you have a decent graphics card itÆs heat-fest. I can run 3-4 clients with CQÆs turned on û I can run it smoothly û but do I want to? Hell no because my Gtx 580 sounds like its melting my motherboard now! So I need to turn off the CQÆs on multiple accounts and as a result have more limited functionality on those accounts and an ugly wallpaper. No more station environment, no more clicking on my ship to open cargo hold, no more dragging ship to the hanger to board it. The delivery of the CQ vanity item display case has impacted my gameplay. CCP could have made it optional and given us the option of keeping the old hanger view and added a ôdisembark shipö option to the UI but ôoh noö to do that would have meant we werenÆt being forced to look the vanity display case that marketing insisted must be front and centre if weÆre to even think about buying these ridiculously overpriced items from the Noble store. I donÆt want to see Eve Online die Verone. That sounds dramatic I know, but gameworlds die when the dreams and visions are extinguished and that can happen through a succession of bad ideas foisted on a community by people who really donÆt have much of a clue in business. I've edited Jade's points into the one that matters. S/he has articulated the issue better than most. In addition to my own points I am sad that CCP over-looked the impact on poorer graphic cards and as a businessmen that they didn't think through the effect on the multi account players who inevitably are Eve's power players and loudest voices.
Duchess Starbuckington	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:18:00 - [2230] Edited by: Duchess Starbuckington on 23/06/2011 23:18:31 The day people can spend aurum for stuff that isn't purely cosmetic/provides serious practical advantages is the day I unsub. The sentiment in my corp is very much the same. In the highly unlikely event CCP actually read this: you are playing with fire here. There's only so much you can **** your playerbase around before it will come back to bite you, straight in the wallet. _________________________________ ROCKET STATUS: FIX IN PROGRESS...
dumpertt	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:19:00 - [2231] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Nimbat Have anyone translated and sent this to the russian population in eve? I'm sure they'd like to hear what's going on aswell. Brilliant idea. Anyone know Russian? Let's get that PDF translated and distributed. russians do read eve-24 and failheap, man. and yeah - there is thread at eve-ru. pretty same - "unsubbed", "can i have ur stuff", "seleene said it looks real" etc.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:21:00 - [2232] Originally by: dumpertt Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Nimbat Have anyone translated and sent this to the russian population in eve? I'm sure they'd like to hear what's going on aswell. Brilliant idea. Anyone know Russian? Let's get that PDF translated and distributed. russians do read eve-24 and failheap, man. and yeah - there is thread at eve-ru. pretty same - "unsubbed", "can i have ur stuff", "seleene said it looks real" etc. Did they mention Me?
Baaz Vinashak	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:21:00 - [2233] CCP you are getting the micro transaction piece so wrong. You have a platform that allows you to make simple innovations that can add a significant revenue stream to your business, but your game designers and advisors don't seem to have a clue. Get a good consultant, who has advised telecoms and media players on subscriber model innovation and Value Added Services to guide you. Apps Stores and VAS are simple and elegant ways of creating new revenue streams. Get a good consultant. p.s I charge 1200 Euros a day, contact in game if you wanna chat
Eladaris Amarr Excessum Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:21:00 - [2234] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Something makes me doubt the average Joe at CCP buys into this, much interaction as some have with the community. Hence the leak out of self-interest. I don't think they are oblivious to the fact this agenda essentially puts the gun in EVE's mouth and pulls the trigger. I think we've heard more than once or twice or twenty times that the rate of pay in Iceland... well... isn't all that grand. We've heard that if you aren't native, you aren't getting a great deal of fast promotions. If you've moved to that rock, your job options are probably pretty damn small. You likely NEED the game to succeed to be successful, but that's more a matter of profit margins and membership numbers, and less what no more than 10% percent of the player base think (forum-goers). And if you started playing Eve after the T20 fiasco, your sole opportunities for Eve gameplay are likely mining, hi-sec mission running, and doing a bit of exploration. You're pretty much directly forbidden from participating in any of the true eve game play... including scamming, market manipulation, or the rest. We've seen direct proof of that back when the CCP folks chimed into the forums with what they do in-game (IE - not much). Considering all of that... Why would the average Joe at CCP really care? It's a poorly paid job where he's probably ignored most of the time anyway, and, not to white knight CCP... but he's probably looked at the forum's a time or three and seen the foaming masses here, and just totally tuned out of the game entirely.
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:22:00 - [2235] Originally by: Erichan I wasn't there but I think the graphics engine got a big upgrade which you can see in some of the videos where they show the old ship transitioned to the new ship. Did I get that right vets? That would be it... no real "new content" (well not much, from what I remember... I only started at the very tail end of Revelations II) ... but they gave us exactly what we had wanted -- LOTS AND LOTS of pretty for our internet spaceships... Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed, so destructive. Your choice WILL make a difference
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:23:00 - [2236] Originally by: Miilla Did they mention Me? LOL - Down in front! My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:24:00 - [2237] Originally by: Eladaris Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Something makes me doubt the average Joe at CCP buys into this, much interaction as some have with the community. Hence the leak out of self-interest. I don't think they are oblivious to the fact this agenda essentially puts the gun in EVE's mouth and pulls the trigger. I think we've heard more than once or twice or twenty times that the rate of pay in Iceland... well... isn't all that grand. We've heard that if you aren't native, you aren't getting a great deal of fast promotions. If you've moved to that rock, your job options are probably pretty damn small. You likely NEED the game to succeed to be successful, but that's more a matter of profit margins and membership numbers, and less what no more than 10% percent of the player base think (forum-goers). And if you started playing Eve after the T20 fiasco, your sole opportunities for Eve gameplay are likely mining, hi-sec mission running, and doing a bit of exploration. You're pretty much directly forbidden from participating in any of the true eve game play... including scamming, market manipulation, or the rest. We've seen direct proof of that back when the CCP folks chimed into the forums with what they do in-game (IE - not much). Considering all of that... Why would the average Joe at CCP really care? It's a poorly paid job where he's probably ignored most of the time anyway, and, not to white knight CCP... but he's probably looked at the forum's a time or three and seen the foaming masses here, and just totally tuned out of the game entirely. I am not voting for John T to be President of CCP or anything, but it demontstrates that at least some of the staff feel that this isn't the right direction. I just don' think they have any more voice than we do right now :(.
BigBong Theory	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:25:00 - [2238] You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ********** Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:26:00 - [2239] Originally by: Miilla PONY PROTEST :) thought the mods were asleep lol well they are still about but still no reply to the concerns on this thread doubt there will be
Florestan Bronstein draketrain	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:27:00 - [2240] Originally by: Helicity Boson Everything has been said really. The game is over. The cards are on the table, I don't think there is any meaningful response CCP could come up with other than doing a 180¦ turn on their strategical direction (and that won't happen). CCP has tried to fund three games with the revenue of one game - when this proved to be impossible they had to gamble on changing their single cash cow's business model in order to extract more revenue. That's not fearless, it is desperate. I guess there exist funding agreements with VCs and banks concerning DUST and WoD that would make scrapping or significantly delaying either of these projects impossible. And at least in the case of DUST the sunk cost is probably high enough to justify completing this project no matter how successful it can be expected to be on the market. EVE still has a lot of momentum - even if it bleeds a few thousand accounts per month it will stay alive for a very long time. In any case it will live long enough to provide DUST with gameplay content for the 6-18 months you can expect a console title to last and to finance the bridge to WoD. The sad reality is that "nobody wants to buy a monocle for 60$" paves the road for more aggressive MT items/services - there's little choice but to vary the product palette (and pricing) until people start to buy and we all know that there are some MT items that would see huge uptake simply due to the pvp nature of the game (even if they might be unpopular on the forums). A new game without the legacy cruft, a new audience without the bittervets, a new business model without the sense of entitlement brought by subscriptions, ... if you had to choose between slowly sacrificing EVE to get WoD and instantly sacrificing WoD for a stagnating EVE, what would your choice be? And there is still the "hope" scenario - hope that MTs will see some serious uptake before CCP has to switch to gameplay affecting offers, hope that DUST will be a success and live for many expansions, hope that CCP will be able to retain its talent through the critical next 1-1.5 years, hope that the huge gamble pays off and that CCP will emerge with three successful games.
Amitious Turkey Gallente TarNec	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:27:00 - [2241] It's a good thing we, the subscribers, have power over CCP's wallet...I ain't buying a thing from the Noble Exchange until it gets down to pennies. Haunting the forums since '03 Originally by: CCP Navigator We love you all as well <3 Originally by: CCP Navigator We have just updated Dodixie. We care a lot for Gallente. NAVIGATOR <3
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:27:00 - [2242] Aren't we a bit beyond Mods at this point? This is basically so fundamental we're looking for a Hilmer response, aren't we?
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:28:00 - [2243] Originally by: Eladaris Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Something makes me doubt the average Joe at CCP buys into this, much interaction as some have with the community. Hence the leak out of self-interest. I don't think they are oblivious to the fact this agenda essentially puts the gun in EVE's mouth and pulls the trigger. I think we've heard more than once or twice or twenty times that the rate of pay in Iceland... well... isn't all that grand. We've heard that if you aren't native, you aren't getting a great deal of fast promotions. If you've moved to that rock, your job options are probably pretty damn small. You likely NEED the game to succeed to be successful, but that's more a matter of profit margins and membership numbers, and less what no more than 10% percent of the player base think (forum-goers). And if you started playing Eve after the T20 fiasco, your sole opportunities for Eve gameplay are likely mining, hi-sec mission running, and doing a bit of exploration. You're pretty much directly forbidden from participating in any of the true eve game play... including scamming, market manipulation, or the rest. We've seen direct proof of that back when the CCP folks chimed into the forums with what they do in-game (IE - not much). Considering all of that... Why would the average Joe at CCP really care? It's a poorly paid job where he's probably ignored most of the time anyway, and, not to white knight CCP... but he's probably looked at the forum's a time or three and seen the foaming masses here, and just totally tuned out of the game entirely. They are not forbidden to do everything, as you're insinuating, and furthermore the level of disconnect you assume is way beyond "guy who logs in to run missions every now and then." The level of ignorance required to push the agenda seen in that pdf is something along the lines of "yeah I know about EVE, it's this space mmo thingy." Nobody with even a hint of connectivity with the community at large would suggest subversion of the game with arum.
Evolutionairy	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:28:00 - [2244] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on . Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
dumpertt	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:30:00 - [2245] Originally by: Miilla Did they mention Me? **** or gtfo
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:32:00 - [2246] Originally by: Erichan Aren't we a bit beyond Mods at this point? This is basically so fundamental we're looking for a Hilmer response, aren't we? This! Eagerly awaiting another smug tweet any minute now. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
DjLowballer Amarr Firebird Squadron	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:33:00 - [2247] 75 pages and still nothing? Crazy
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:34:00 - [2248] 75 Pages in less than 48 hours, can we reach 200 pages in the next couple days? What's the longest thread in EVE Forum history? ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:34:00 - [2249] Originally by: Myra2007 Originally by: Erichan Aren't we a bit beyond Mods at this point? This is basically so fundamental we're looking for a Hilmer response, aren't we? This! Eagerly awaiting another smug tweet any minute now. Mittani vs. Hilmar smug-tweet war. Go.
IVeige Caldari IVever.	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:34:00 - [2250] Originally by: Helgur 4 **ing years with this game. I'll miss it. This is truly the coup de grGce and this is the first time I've uttered these words: eve is dead** GG CCP GG Agree, bye ccp. Suscription cancelled.
Ranita Drell	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:35:00 - [2251] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein The cards are on the table, I don't think there is any meaningful response CCP could come up with other than doing a 180¦ turn on their strategical direction (and that won't happen). CCP has tried to fund three games with the revenue of one game - when this proved to be impossible they had to gamble on changing their single cash cow's business model in order to extract more revenue. That's not fearless, it is desperate. I guess there exist funding agreements with VCs and banks concerning DUST and WoD that would make scrapping or significantly delaying either of these projects impossible. And at least in the case of DUST the sunk cost is probably high enough to justify completing this project no matter how successful it can be expected to be on the market. EVE still has a lot of momentum - even if it bleeds a few thousand accounts per month it will stay alive for a very long time. In any case it will live long enough to provide DUST with gameplay content for the 6-18 months you can expect a console title to last and to finance the bridge to WoD. The sad reality is that "nobody wants to buy a monocle for 60$" paves the road for more aggressive MT items/services - there's little choice but to vary the product palette (and pricing) until people start to buy and we all know that there are some MT items that would see huge uptake simply due to the pvp nature of the game (even if they might be unpopular on the forums). A new game without the legacy cruft, a new audience without the bittervets, a new business model without the sense of entitlement brought by subscriptions, ... if you had to choose between slowly sacrificing EVE to get WoD and instantly sacrificing WoD for a stagnating EVE, what would your choice be? And there is still the "hope" scenario - hope that MTs will see some serious uptake before CCP has to switch to gameplay affecting offers, hope that DUST will be a success and live for many expansions, hope that CCP will be able to retain its talent through the critical next 1-1.5 years, hope that the huge gamble pays off and that CCP will emerge with three successful games. I suspect that this is the sad reality. I really hope you're off the mark.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:36:00 - [2252] Can someone link the better tweets?
Eladaris Amarr Excessum Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:38:00 - [2253] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot They are not forbidden to do everything, as you're insinuating, and furthermore the level of disconnect you assume is way beyond "guy who logs in to run missions every now and then." The level of ignorance required to push the agenda seen in that pdf is something along the lines of "yeah I know about EVE, it's this space mmo thingy." Nobody with even a hint of connectivity with the community at large would suggest subversion of the game with arum. I'm not insinuating... I remember the CCP replies, and damned few of those posts including exciting Eve moments many people like to tweet / blog / brag about. Besides, how fun can a MMO game be with IA peering over your shoulder? It's possible more of the CCP staff were active null members taking part in OTHER's visions for their corp future... but I'm fairly certain CCP staff are banned from taking any truly active roles inside their own game. Back on topic tho... There's a massive difference between knowing the direction your company is taking is vile, evil, and doomed to fail... and marching straight into your CEO's office and shaking him by the lapels and telling him he's got his head stuffed up his arse and it's going to cost everyone everything. I used to work for a major international company that decided one day to stop producing their core product, because newer products were sexier, more profitable, and really... they couldn't get new customers outta their old core product. Where as they could get new customers from the new product. (Same industry, different product). Except the old customers had to find a new provider for the old core product... and didn't feel very charitable to my company any more. I sat quite glumly at my desk as a manager knowing the writing was on the wall, and several waves of layoffs later when I lost said job I knew when and where the trail started. But that didn't mean I was going to lose my job early to explain why my companies vision was so FUBAR'ed.
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:39:00 - [2254] Originally by: Amitious Turkey It's a good thing we, the subscribers, have power over CCP's wallet...I ain't buying a thing from the Noble Exchange until it gets down to pennies. Exactly..we have to let them know that...
Reban Daras	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:41:00 - [2255] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
Olokus	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:41:00 - [2256] 1st point this is a forum alt. Now onto business If CCP has decided to go down the route detailed in the "legit" article, Then the only way that they will stop is if a significant amount of accounts are cancelled, Those that are just going to ignore/not purchase the micro items/rep etc are still paying a monthly sub for a game that will slowly transform into a SUB/micro transaction service. I personally would rather not play at all than use micro transactions in a subscription based game. 2 accounts cancelled as of today. Best of luck to all those remain and hopefully this is fake
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:42:00 - [2257] Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Erichan I wasn't there but I think the graphics engine got a big upgrade which you can see in some of the videos where they show the old ship transitioned to the new ship. Did I get that right vets? That would be it... no real "new content" (well not much, from what I remember... I only started at the very tail end of Revelations II) ... but they gave us exactly what we had wanted -- LOTS AND LOTS of pretty for our internet spaceships... I remember logging on back in 2004 to 3 to 11k players and getting excited over passing 20k. I have kept playing because the changes have presented new challenges, some of which weren't annoying (!), all of which forced me and those around me to adapt and evolve our gameplay. That's the point you see, microtransactions have the potential to give me a way of adapting and evolving using my real life currency. I can be better than someone who has paid the same sub as me but cannot afford to keep up with my real world wealth. My son used to play "Club Penguin" when it first came out and he could buy things for his igloo and invite friends to visit and admire his stuff. Now he plays Farmville and asks me for cash to have a better farm than his mates. This is normal human behaviour. In the age of apps, istores and licensed access to content I completely sympathise with CCP; this is an idea worth exploring but it has the potential to bring a fundamental change to gameplay. In all the years I have been playing the changes made have been under-pinned by a desire to make the game better but progress has been determined by in game effort. Somehow, microtransactions must be introduced whilst maintaining this gaming style. The eve community are famed for their whining and ragequits but this is because they care about the product they pay for and believe that deep down CCP "get them". This is the first time I fear that a large section of the community are misunderstood, or perhaps it's just me finally failing to adapt and evolve to Eve 2011?
Misanth RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:43:00 - [2258] I've had a few MMO's I've played 5years+. EVE however is closer to ten than to five, and taken a solid lead. I was starting to wonder if it'd actually make the big ten, but as it looks now, I might struggle with even getting nine.. Maybe I'll go back to playing in a band again. Or, even, get a work? Any computer company that has use of a slightly used 32 year old with decent multi-clienting skills? -
Blade Ripley Caldari Hydra Squadron	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:43:00 - [2259] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
Helgur Red Federation	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:45:00 - [2260] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below. (x 3)
Nemo d'Erewhon	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:46:00 - [2261] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
Royaldo Gallente Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:46:00 - [2262] Originally by: Quartex Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Erichan I wasn't there but I think the graphics engine got a big upgrade which you can see in some of the videos where they show the old ship transitioned to the new ship. Did I get that right vets? That would be it... no real "new content" (well not much, from what I remember... I only started at the very tail end of Revelations II) ... but they gave us exactly what we had wanted -- LOTS AND LOTS of pretty for our internet spaceships... I remember logging on back in 2004 to 3 to 11k players and getting excited over passing 20k. I have kept playing because the changes have presented new challenges, some of which weren't annoying (!), all of which forced me and those around me to adapt and evolve our gameplay. That's the point you see, microtransactions have the potential to give me a way of adapting and evolving using my real life currency. I can be better than someone who has paid the same sub as me but cannot afford to keep up with my real world wealth. My son used to play "Club Penguin" when it first came out and he could buy things for his igloo and invite friends to visit and admire his stuff. Now he plays Farmville and asks me for cash to have a better farm than his mates. This is normal human behaviour. In the age of apps, istores and licensed access to content I completely sympathise with CCP; this is an idea worth exploring but it has the potential to bring a fundamental change to gameplay. In all the years I have been playing the changes made have been under-pinned by a desire to make the game better but progress has been determined by in game effort. Somehow, microtransactions must be introduced whilst maintaining this gaming style. The eve community are famed for their whining and ragequits but this is because they care about the product they pay for and believe that deep down CCP "get them". This is the first time I fear that a large section of the community are misunderstood, or perhaps it's just me finally failing to adapt and evolve to Eve 2011? Why do we need MT's again?
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:46:00 - [2263] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below. Not news, but I might as well make it official
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:47:00 - [2264] Originally by: Royaldo Why do we need MT's again? Someone has to tank the big dragons.
Majuan Shuo Gallente Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:48:00 - [2265] Gee, 76 pages and not a single CCP response (or am i wrong?) What do YOU think that means? For me its either A) It's true and they hope to ignore it, praying it goes away Or it could be B) It's true and they are right now, at this very moment: trying to concoct some ridiculous "corporate-y" response saying its not true and that they appreciate our dedication to the game. Appreciate this: CCP can lick my sack.
Illuminaty	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:48:00 - [2266] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein A new game without the legacy cruft, a new audience without the bittervets, a new business model without the sense of entitlement brought by subscriptions, ... if you had to choose between slowly sacrificing EVE to get WoD and instantly sacrificing WoD for a stagnating EVE, what would your choice be? The problem is that WoD can flop. Dropping a bird in the hand to chase two in the bush is dumb, because you can end up with neither. Especially if WoD ends up too close to WoW and gets crushed. The proper call is kill WoD if you have to make a choice and retreat to your fallback position and try again later. Anyone who ever played EVE ought to know that selling your battle cruiser to buy your first uninsured battleship and then running off to get rich running level 4s is going to end in tears. Also, you definitely don't undermine your workhorse sci-fi based MMO during the lead-up to something like SWTOR.
Press TabQuick	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:48:00 - [2267] Edited by: Press TabQuick on 23/06/2011 23:50:27 Account cancelled. This is the first time I've closed Eve HQ or EVEMON without intent to open them again at restart. If their planning on charging them real money to have those programs and want me to pay them even more money I don't need to play this game anymore.
Deamos Dev Null Development and Holdings	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:49:00 - [2268] Just a reminder I saw posted on Twitter. I guess CCP changed their tune? Old Eve-O Forum Post -
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:49:00 - [2269] A year ago today, this was posted by CCP: Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:50:00 - [2270] If CCP didn't anticapte this kind of reaction, they really are out of touch.
Nadarius Chrome Celestial Horizon Corp.	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:50:00 - [2271] Originally by: Amitious Turkey It's a good thing we, the subscribers, have power over CCP's wallet...I ain't buying a thing from the Noble Exchange until it gets down to pennies. Unfortunately it doesn't require you to buy anything to radically alter the game we all play. ANYONE buying from there consumes PLEX that would otherwise be used to fund game time. Fewer PLEX available for people to use for actual game time means increased prices or people having to switch from PLEX to paying for their account directly. Or quitting. Mr douchebag with his monocle just nuked 3 plex from circulation that people would otherwise have used to play the game.
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:51:00 - [2272] Edited by: Tea Ester Elliot on 23/06/2011 23:52:07 @alticity Yeah it does.
Eladaris Amarr Excessum Industries	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:52:00 - [2273] Originally by: Tea Ester Elliot Originally by: Royaldo Why do we need MT's again? Someone has to tank the big dragons. Personally I'm fine with micro transactions, even MACRO transactions like :monoclegate: are more shocking / dismaying that upsetting. But when the companies possible future vision includes MT + monthly subs, and then adds AUR bullets, ships, faction standings gains, etc... Well that's a whole different ballpark. I think CCP would be dealing less with the ÇÇP and more with óóp if they added ship paint skins for a buck, or corp logo's on your soon to be violenced and destroyed PvP boats.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:52:00 - [2274] Originally by: Riflin' Betty Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli gawd YES. Is this Ms. Hulkageddon?
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:53:00 - [2275] Originally by: Miilla If CCP didn't anticapte this kind of reaction, they really are out of touch. We are all collateral damage. CCP is expecting to lose some accounts over this. -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Lord Cath Amarr Gung-Ho	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:53:00 - [2276] Originally by: Deamos Just a reminder I saw posted on Twitter. I guess CCP changed their tune? Old Eve-O Forum Post I remember that indeed... it's odd how it went from an awesome expansion like apocrypha to the "your game will not be fixed in over 18 months" to "GIVE MA ALL YOUR CASH NAO" in such a short amount of time _________________________________________________
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:54:00 - [2277] Originally by: Riflin' Betty Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? He said "we have no plans". He never said "we'll never do it". It's the safe answer, and you should really be smart enough to learn to read between the lines in cases like these.
Jada Maroo	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:54:00 - [2278] Multi-million dollar companies don't make new business plans in a day. It's clear at this point that the leaked internal business plan has been widely rejected by the players and that items in the NEX store are selling like turd sandwiches. But even if CCP decides to completely reverse course, they had planned their future finances based on these new sources of income. That's going to have to change, and however it changes it's going to take CCP time to come up with new ideas to seperate us from our monies. The most CCP could say right now is "Wow we screwed up, we're gonna do something about it." But CCP doesn't know what that something is yet any more than we do.
Riflin' Betty Perfunctory	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:54:00 - [2279] Originally by: Erichan Originally by: Riflin' Betty Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli gawd YES. Is this Ms. Hulkageddon? Yes. Don't know how long I have till they shut down this account for posting though. But I really wanted to share that image from FHC. -Heli
Liang Nuren	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:56:00 - [2280] Originally by: Riflin' Betty Originally by: Erichan Originally by: Riflin' Betty Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli gawd YES. Is this Ms. Hulkageddon? Yes. Don't know how long I have till they shut down this account for posting though. But I really wanted to share that image from FHC. -Heli DM me any links or pictures you want me to post for you. At least, until I'm banned. :) -- Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire On Twitter
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:57:00 - [2281] Sinking ship pics again please.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:57:00 - [2282] Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Miilla If CCP didn't anticapte this kind of reaction, they really are out of touch. We are all collateral damage. CCP is expecting to lose some accounts over this. So, has anybody calculated how many accounts they can lose before they start to feel it? WHat is the incomming rate of new customers, what is the churn rate and so on?
Brainless Bimbo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:58:00 - [2283] Originally by: Quartex ½fluff+ That's the point you see, microtransactions have the potential to give me a way of adapting and evolving using my real life currency. I can be better than someone who has paid the same sub as me but cannot afford to keep up with my real world wealth. ½fluff+ SO your not playing a game with thousands of others, you¦re indulging in a display of real life wealth in a battle of bling, you arrogant fk. ...... continues overleaf.
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.23 23:59:00 - [2284] Edited by: Erichan on 23/06/2011 23:58:58 oh sweet irony... http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=913 "So this thing is vanity items only? Yes. We will start out with a rather limited number of items initially, carefully measuring the demand and how it impacts the economy. As time progresses, we'll gradually introduce new items and revise our strategy. We've also discussed this issue in depth with the Council of Stellar Management and will both consult with them and keep them up to date every step of the way."
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:00:00 - [2285] Originally by: CCP We've also discussed this issue in depth with the Council of Stellar Management and will both consult with them and keep them up to date every step of the way." Gotcha.
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:00:00 - [2286] Originally by: Royaldo Originally by: Quartex Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Erichan I wasn't there but I think the graphics engine got a big upgrade which you can see in some of the videos where they show the old ship transitioned to the new ship. Did I get that right vets? That would be it... no real "new content" (well not much, from what I remember... I only started at the very tail end of Revelations II) ... but they gave us exactly what we had wanted -- LOTS AND LOTS of pretty for our internet spaceships... I remember logging on back in 2004 to 3 to 11k players and getting excited over passing 20k. I have kept playing because the changes have presented new challenges, some of which weren't annoying (!), all of which forced me and those around me to adapt and evolve our gameplay. That's the point you see, microtransactions have the potential to give me a way of adapting and evolving using my real life currency. I can be better than someone who has paid the same sub as me but cannot afford to keep up with my real world wealth. My son used to play "Club Penguin" when it first came out and he could buy things for his igloo and invite friends to visit and admire his stuff. Now he plays Farmville and asks me for cash to have a better farm than his mates. This is normal human behaviour. In the age of apps, istores and licensed access to content I completely sympathise with CCP; this is an idea worth exploring but it has the potential to bring a fundamental change to gameplay. In all the years I have been playing the changes made have been under-pinned by a desire to make the game better but progress has been determined by in game effort. Somehow, microtransactions must be introduced whilst maintaining this gaming style. The eve community are famed for their whining and ragequits but this is because they care about the product they pay for and believe that deep down CCP "get them". This is the first time I fear that a large section of the community are misunderstood, or perhaps it's just me finally failing to adapt and evolve to Eve 2011? Why do we need MT's again? Some of the player base will enjoy being able to use MT's to enhance their gameplay. I am not one of them but understand why some people like the feature. CCP need to use MT to increase their revenue,to continue to grow their business and reduce risk to it by diversifying their portfolio of games. I don't know how much debt they are using to get their other investments off the ground but the interest on this needs to be paid .. they can't stand still. My argument remains that they need to find a way to do this that satisfies both camps and I think that this is possible. I'd urge people to suggest solutions now, rather than raging.
Vandrion Gallente The Collective B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:00:00 - [2287] Looks like the Incarna Trailer was leaked.......... Leaked Original Incarna Trailer
Illwill Bill For a fistful of Veldspar	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:00:00 - [2288] Originally by: Riflin' Betty A year ago today, this was posted by CCP: Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli Dissapointed, actually. FREE HELICITY
The Huffarunier Gallente The Real OC	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:01:00 - [2289] Originally by: Miilla Originally by: Liang Nuren Originally by: Miilla If CCP didn't anticapte this kind of reaction, they really are out of touch. We are all collateral damage. CCP is expecting to lose some accounts over this. So, has anybody calculated how many accounts they can lose before they start to feel it? WHat is the incomming rate of new customers, what is the churn rate and so on? If you use 45,000 people online at any given time and each person is really $15.00 then at any given second there is $675,000 real money online. Doing some magic caluclations I'd wager their income is something around 33,000 real money per second or so. I dont know what their costs are.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:01:00 - [2290] Dejavu moment. Don't forget to check the thread topic. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :)
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:03:00 - [2291] Originally by: Quartex Some of the player base will enjoy being able to use MT's to enhance their gameplay. I am not one of them but understand why some people like the feature. CCP need to use MT to increase their revenue,to continue to grow their business and reduce risk to it by diversifying their portfolio of games. I don't know how much debt they are using to get their other investments off the ground but the interest on this needs to be paid .. they can't stand still. My argument remains that they need to find a way to do this that satisfies both camps and I think that this is possible. I'd urge people to suggest solutions now, rather than raging. Problem with suggesting things, is that CCP doesn't listen. how many threads over in the assembly hall have been outright ignored? (see MT thread) It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:03:00 - [2292] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow Dejavu moment. Don't forget to check the thread topic. Literally just spit out coffee and ****ed a little at the same time. Thanks.
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:04:00 - [2293] Originally by: Brainless Bimbo Originally by: Quartex ½fluff+ That's the point you see, microtransactions have the potential to give me a way of adapting and evolving using my real life currency. I can be better than someone who has paid the same sub as me but cannot afford to keep up with my real world wealth. ½fluff+ SO your not playing a game with thousands of others, you¦re indulging in a display of real life wealth in a battle of bling, you arrogant fk. I didn't mean "me" and perhaps neither do you ;-) My intention was to illustrate a position that one might take. Take a deep breath fella.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:08:00 - [2294] Originally by: Deamos Just a reminder I saw posted on Twitter. I guess CCP changed their tune? Old Eve-O Forum Post Once upon a time not too long ago... I'm past mad, now. Just sad. --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:09:00 - [2295] Originally by: Florestan Bronstein Originally by: Helicity Boson Everything has been said really. The game is over. The cards are on the table, I don't think there is any meaningful response CCP could come up with other than doing a 180¦ turn on their strategical direction (and that won't happen). CCP has tried to fund three games with the revenue of one game - when this proved to be impossible they had to gamble on changing their single cash cow's business model in order to extract more revenue. That's not fearless, it is desperate. I guess there exist funding agreements with VCs and banks concerning DUST and WoD that would make scrapping or significantly delaying either of these projects impossible. And at least in the case of DUST the sunk cost is probably high enough to justify completing this project no matter how successful it can be expected to be on the market. EVE still has a lot of momentum - even if it bleeds a few thousand accounts per month it will stay alive for a very long time. In any case it will live long enough to provide DUST with gameplay content for the 6-18 months you can expect a console title to last and to finance the bridge to WoD. The sad reality is that "nobody wants to buy a monocle for 60$" paves the road for more aggressive MT items/services - there's little choice but to vary the product palette (and pricing) until people start to buy and we all know that there are some MT items that would see huge uptake simply due to the pvp nature of the game (even if they might be unpopular on the forums). A new game without the legacy cruft, a new audience without the bittervets, a new business model without the sense of entitlement brought by subscriptions, ... if you had to choose between slowly sacrificing EVE to get WoD and instantly sacrificing WoD for a stagnating EVE, what would your choice be? And there is still the "hope" scenario - hope that MTs will see some serious uptake before CCP has to switch to gameplay affecting offers, hope that DUST will be a success and live for many expansions, hope that CCP will be able to retain its talent through the critical next 1-1.5 years, hope that the huge gamble pays off and that CCP will emerge with three successful games. I completely agree with your analysis. This thread has me nodding along with Jade Contantine AND draketrain, a previously unimaginable feat. What I wish is that CCP would just sell EVE instead of going down this road. That might stop all real development for EVE, but at least it would stay alive and wouldn't get worse.
Velicitia Open Designs	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:09:00 - [2296] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Deamos Just a reminder I saw posted on Twitter. I guess CCP changed their tune? Old Eve-O Forum Post Once upon a time not too long ago... I'm past mad, now. Just sad. Yeah, that's about where I am too... So much for the good old days eh? Originally by: CCP Games, Tyranis Expansion, Summer 2010 ...and greed, so destructive. Your choice WILL make a difference
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:10:00 - [2297] Originally by: Fighter26 Edited by: Fighter26 on 23/06/2011 21:56:22 I checked out the pdf... it looks legit BUT WHERE ARE PAGES 2 and 3? I don't like evidence being withheld! PDF Goes Front cover >> page 4 and 5 (look at botom right corner.) WHERE ARE THE MISSING PAGES 2 AND 3? -Fighter The unedited one is available - look around a bit. 13 pages in the document view. The front and back cover are single pages, and the rest are two pages in one.
Token Afrodude Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:10:00 - [2298] Originally by: Reed Tiburon Originally by: Deamos Just a reminder I saw posted on Twitter. I guess CCP changed their tune? Old Eve-O Forum Post Once upon a time not too long ago... I'm past mad, now. Just sad. +1 It's a real pity CCP isn't affiliated with Apple, or their manufacturer Foxconn from China. If they released such a fail patch, they'd all be on the roof flinging themselves off in Shame
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:13:00 - [2299] Originally by: Illuminaty Originally by: Florestan Bronstein A new game without the legacy cruft, a new audience without the bittervets, a new business model without the sense of entitlement brought by subscriptions, ... if you had to choose between slowly sacrificing EVE to get WoD and instantly sacrificing WoD for a stagnating EVE, what would your choice be? The problem is that WoD can flop. Dropping a bird in the hand to chase two in the bush is dumb, because you can end up with neither. Especially if WoD ends up too close to WoW and gets crushed. The proper call is kill WoD if you have to make a choice and retreat to your fallback position and try again later. Anyone who ever played EVE ought to know that selling your battle cruiser to buy your first uninsured battleship and then running off to get rich running level 4s is going to end in tears. Also, you definitely don't undermine your workhorse sci-fi based MMO during the lead-up to something like SWTOR. I agree with this as well. However, keep in mind this same (full) release of the magazine reveals that WOD isn't even in the serious game design stage (!!) So, basically, CCP is doomed. And they're going to drag EVE down with them. I really hope I'm wrong about this, but I'm not banking on it.
Sorcsha Voren Caldari SVC Corp	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:13:00 - [2300] Edited by: Sorcsha Voren on 24/06/2011 00:15:15 Here's an interesting look back at previous CCP posts. http://hosted.corelicorp.net/micro.jpg EDIT: Too late for me, already linked. But......yeah.
Quartex Gallente Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:15:00 - [2301] Originally by: Token Afrodude Originally by: Quartex Some of the player base will enjoy being able to use MT's to enhance their gameplay. I am not one of them but understand why some people like the feature. CCP need to use MT to increase their revenue,to continue to grow their business and reduce risk to it by diversifying their portfolio of games. I don't know how much debt they are using to get their other investments off the ground but the interest on this needs to be paid .. they can't stand still. My argument remains that they need to find a way to do this that satisfies both camps and I think that this is possible. I'd urge people to suggest solutions now, rather than raging. Problem with suggesting things, is that CCP doesn't listen. how many threads over in the assembly hall have been outright ignored? (see MT thread) I cannot say that you're wrong and they really should have talked with the CSM, or ex players who have gone to work at CCP. Short of cancelling your subscription your only other outlet is to voice your ideas, or to nag your CSM candidate to get his/her arse in gear. If I was on the CSM I'd be getting a joint statement organised to; 1. Seek clarification from CCP on the leaked document. Is it true or false? 2. Should it be true, please explain to the community in more detail what is intended and what is not and what considerations have been made in taking the current position. 3. Please ask the CSM to devote their next session to discussing ideas about MT and it's place in the game. They will seek the views of the player base, perhaps using an online survey tool and via in game mail. 4. Please publish milestones for these steps, so that player base can keep up with progress. ... that's a starter for 10.
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:15:00 - [2302] Originally by: Sorcsha Voren Here's an interesting look back at previous CCP posts. http://hosted.corelicorp.net/micro.jpg note the dates. alot can change in a year it seems. Happy Microtransaction-denial Anniversary FREE HELICITY
Mr Kidd	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:16:00 - [2303] Originally by: ExcalibursTemplar Originally by: Cedric deBouilard Edited by: Cedric deBouilard on 23/06/2011 20:40:47 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc PMSL is never a proper drama without a downfall parady This is frickin hilarious!
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:18:00 - [2304] Ok, before signing off for today, i just wanted to check where we are on the CHECKLIST: [x] denial -> most are past that, a few hardcore dudes are still hoping [o] anger -> ongoing still, keep it strong guys [o] bargaining -> some are already here, hoping CCP will give in to the demands, canceling subs and waiting [ ] depression -> nope, not yet, just a few gave up commenting already [o] acceptance -> a portion of the playerbase already accepted, but never got through the 5 stages, so don't really count for the checklist Ok, we have to keep the "anger" stage alive guys, go strong.
Illuminaty	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:19:00 - [2305] Originally by: Carmine Lady Originally by: Sorcsha Voren Here's an interesting look back at previous CCP posts. http://hosted.corelicorp.net/micro.jpg note the dates. alot can change in a year it seems. Happy Microtransaction-denial Anniversary Yea, a lot can change. They can go from lying about it and no one being the wiser, and lying about it and being caught red handed.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:20:00 - [2306] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Ok, before signing off for today, i just wanted to check where we are on the CHECKLIST: [x] denial -> most are past that, a few hardcore dudes are still hoping [o] anger -> ongoing still, keep it strong guys [o] bargaining -> some are already here, hoping CCP will give in to the demands, canceling subs and waiting [ ] depression -> nope, not yet, just a few gave up commenting already [o] acceptance -> a portion of the playerbase already accepted, but never got through the 5 stages, so don't really count for the checklist Ok, we have to keep the "anger" stage alive guys, go strong. I'm somewhere between bargaining (Maybe, just maybe they'll pull their heads out of their asses) and depression (no, we're screwed).
Gurgeh Murat Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:21:00 - [2307] EvE is an amazing game aye? amiright? So...a game. lets take chess as a good example of a game. Even playing field. The only real deciding factor is skill. Faceoff. Kasparov is beating me. I decide I dont like it. So I jump into the Challenger MKII I just bought with an out of chess game wallet (as an ex soldier I get a discount, but nonetheless...) I won chess? THIS, CCP, sums up why your game is no longer bucking the trend, why people will desert you till YOUR GAME IS A DESERT OF PLAYERS and why I will laugh from whatever non P2P+MT game is currently occupying me. Minecraft is pretty cool in a basic way. Ill be on here till my subscription runs out but only for the breakdown lulz tbh. Youve sucked the fun out of this game, and is that not the ONLY true goal of a game? fun? You dont even have the decency to respond to the people who, literally, PAY YOUR WAGES. GG ccp, gg
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:22:00 - [2308] Leak from CCPs business process manual
Duchess Starbuckington	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:24:00 - [2309] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Ok, before signing off for today, i just wanted to check where we are on the CHECKLIST: [x] denial -> most are past that, a few hardcore dudes are still hoping [o] anger -> ongoing still, keep it strong guys [o] bargaining -> some are already here, hoping CCP will give in to the demands, canceling subs and waiting [ ] depression -> nope, not yet, just a few gave up commenting already [o] acceptance -> a portion of the playerbase already accepted, but never got through the 5 stages, so don't really count for the checklist Ok, we have to keep the "anger" stage alive guys, go strong. Well I'm seriously considering sub cancellation for the first time, umm, ever actually. Does that make me depression? _________________________________ ROCKET STATUS: FIX IN PROGRESS...
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:27:00 - [2310] There are exactly five monocles on sale in Jita right now. Five. Count them. Go on, you only need one hand.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:27:00 - [2311] Originally by: Duchess Starbuckington Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Ok, before signing off for today, i just wanted to check where we are on the CHECKLIST: [x] denial -> most are past that, a few hardcore dudes are still hoping [o] anger -> ongoing still, keep it strong guys [o] bargaining -> some are already here, hoping CCP will give in to the demands, canceling subs and waiting [ ] depression -> nope, not yet, just a few gave up commenting already [o] acceptance -> a portion of the playerbase already accepted, but never got through the 5 stages, so don't really count for the checklist Ok, we have to keep the "anger" stage alive guys, go strong. Well I'm seriously considering sub cancellation for the first time, umm, ever actually. Does that make me depression? Depends, quitting because you're trying to make a point or quitting because you've lost all hope?
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:28:00 - [2312] Originally by: Black Dranzer There are exactly five monocles on sale in Jita right now. Five. Count them. Go on, you only need one hand. That took how many PLEX out of circulation? :)
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:28:00 - [2313] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 24/06/2011 00:28:54 Originally by: Duchess Starbuckington Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Ok, before signing off for today, i just wanted to check where we are on the CHECKLIST: [x] denial -> most are past that, a few hardcore dudes are still hoping [o] anger -> ongoing still, keep it strong guys [o] bargaining -> some are already here, hoping CCP will give in to the demands, canceling subs and waiting [ ] depression -> nope, not yet, just a few gave up commenting already [o] acceptance -> a portion of the playerbase already accepted, but never got through the 5 stages, so don't really count for the checklist Ok, we have to keep the "anger" stage alive guys, go strong. Well I'm seriously considering sub cancellation for the first time, umm, ever actually. Does that make me depression? Nope, that would be "bargaining" as you hope CCP notices and thus react to it. If you ragequit however and never look back, thats depression If you then come back and resub, while full MT stuff is implemented, thats acceptance.
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:33:00 - [2314] Edited by: Jonny Utrigas on 24/06/2011 00:36:00 3.33333333333... PLEX per monocle so, 16 and 2/3rds edit to add: not game breaking, but hella funny since people are/did fall for this. but the discussion on prices belongs in the other thread. The really issue in this one that CCP might respond to, is the future plans of buying advantages with AURUM, especially buying overpowered items that appear out of nothing.
Ancyker Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:35:00 - [2315] CCPs actions contradict themselves: When CCP was talking about Incarna and adding microtransactions I had told some friends that I figured they'd add a new currency and probably allow PLEX to be converted to it. At the time no plans for such a thing were announced and some people actually told me it would "never happen". I said it'd be the only thing that would make sense, since no one would pay an entire PLEX for a t-shirt. Then AUR was announced, which fit into what I had stated. Naturally myself and many others thought the same thing, the point of AUR was to split a PLEX into (very) small (~0.5 cents/each) representations of real world currency. And pretty much all of us assumed this was because things were going to be significantly cheaper than a PLEX, i.e. $0.50-2.00 each. When I saw the Noble Store my first reaction was in line with everyone else. At this point I knew things were going to get bad, before this even got leaked. When someone starts trying to pay for an entire expansion with just a handful of items you know things are going to get bad. This, to me, shows a desperate attempt at trying to make as much money as possible regardless of the ultimate cost to the quality of the game. I have nothing against MT, however, the way CCP is going about it is wrong. Very wrong. Looking at this from a business perspective, MT are a great way to supplement a games income. If I were in CCP's shoes I would have added them a long time ago, but I wouldn't be doing it the way CCP is. First, while I know many people are against it, ships could very well be added, as long as they are in line with other ships in the game. What I mean is, you could take a popular faction ship, i.e. the Dramiel or Macherial, copy the stats exactly and give it a different, unique, model. It's a ship, but it's just vanity. The idea of mixing in game achievements with MT works in theory, but only in certain situations. Namely Ship+AUR = same ship, different model. The pricing CCP is using won't actually get them that much money compared to what they should be doing. As was stated many times previously, micro transactions work because they are small. They encourage impulse buying -- the same as the impulse items (gum, candy bars, etc) at the checkout in a super market. If an item costs more than a subscription, people are much less likely to buy it. No item should cost more than $5, the average price should be no more than $2. If CCP really has their heart (and wallet) set on needing to add "items of power", they need to aim/balance it so at most a PLEX worth of AUR a month for an account gets it all the "items of power" it needs. If they shoot for any higher that than it's going to fail -- no if, ands or buts about it. Ideally, however, CCP shouldn't go this route at all. Keep items vanity -- but if you must do it, this is the way. Looks are important to most people, and they will pay quite a lot just to look cool. Ships skins and clothing are a good way to go. It needs a lot of variety and it needs to be easy for people to change. CCP seems to have based the prices on people buy 1 outfit and they are done, but I'm sure many of people had planned to buy several outfits for all their (main) characters. tl;dr: CCPs plan won't work, at all, with anyone. You are going to ruin the game and there will be no going back. Avoid items of power but if you must add them keep them in line with other items in game. Lower MT prices, go for a large quantity sold cheaply rather than a small quantity sold for a lot. It will make things seem fair and end up making more money in the long run.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:36:00 - [2316] People are chipping in to help get a response out of CCP.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:37:00 - [2317] Dress up MT all you want... Oh its more Eve revenue... It is a horse and balloon show for funding WoD nothing more. Just like a political campaigning... Horses and Balloons.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:39:00 - [2318] http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065 STOP THE PRESSES
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:39:00 - [2319] So, they did send in a "noname"-Dev (at least for the community)...lets see how this turns out.
Joe Skellington Minmatar Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:40:00 - [2320] --
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:41:00 - [2321] Originally by: CCP Pann Hi, everyone Some of you who have been around for a while may remember me. I was the original community manager for EVE. These days, I oversee the PR and Community teams. While most of what I do happens behind the curtains, I am still aware of whatÆs going on front and center. I would be lying if I said that whatÆs happening now didnÆt make me sad, but IÆm not here to ask for your sympathy. To be perfectly honest, IÆm here to buy time while we try to sort things out. No sense in lying about it so I'll call a spade a spade. ItÆs clear that many of you are <understatement alert> angry </alert>. ThereÆs a lot happening, things are changing quickly and we havenÆt been as forthcoming as you were used to in the past. IÆm willing to step out front and take a lot of heat for that since I was the one who made the decision to hold off on responding for a while to see if things cooled down once the new wore off. I was wrong to do that and I apologize. We should have said something much sooner. We should have done more to address your concerns and be forthcoming, even if we werenÆt going to be able to immediately give you all of the answers you were looking for or the answer your questions in ways that will instantly turn those frowns upside down. To be even more candid, I cannot answer all of your questions, either, but I am working with the people who can to start getting those answers for you. Again, I know weÆre doing this past the expiration date of your patience but I hope youÆll bear with me. I know that, with very few exceptions, most of you donÆt know me from Adam. I havenÆt earned your trust or respect; therefore I have no right to ask anything of you û but I am going to try, anyway. Can I please count on at least some of you to help bring the pitchforks and torches down a few notches? Like I said, I wonÆt be able to answer all of your questions tonight, but I promise weÆll start getting some info out tomorrow. As I see it, the chief complaint is regarding the high cost of goods in the Nobel Market. Second, many people are unhappy about the CaptainÆs Quarters. Third, there are some performance issues with Incarna. I would appreciate it if you would confirm my observations or tell me what IÆm missing, but I do ask that you do it in a productive way. I will remove posts without prejudice if they are counterproductive to the conversation I hope to have with you. If youÆve read this much, thanks for staying with me. If you have something to say, IÆd like very much to hear it. Humbly yours, ~P~ Let's hope we get a good, straightforward, and honest response sometime soon. Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:42:00 - [2322] Edited by: Miilla on 24/06/2011 00:41:54 Originally by: Black Dranzer http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065 STOP THE PRESSES I told ya all, FRIDAY they talk, and we get to vent over the weekend.
Menas Roving Guns Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:42:00 - [2323] If this is real, and it looks like it is, then can someone in Iceland go over and kick that Kristoffer Touborg guy in the arse, please? It seems to be where his brains are located. Billion isk monacles (lol, wtf?) and vanity items I don't give a crap about - they don't give any advantage. But unfortunately it doesn't sound like it'll just be vanity items... "Not all virtual purchases will focus on customization; some will be new items, ammunition, ships, etc. that can be purchased outright." "... but we would have the option to sell premium content and services at a much higher price point." "... we will effect a universal strategy of micro-sales throughout the EVE experience." Oh, and +1 vote for John Turbefield as El Presidente of the CCP banana republic.
Probably Alt	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:46:00 - [2324] I'm sorry but that response from CCP was an utter **** in on the customers and flippant. Someone is trolling for harder flames. Another account gone.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:47:00 - [2325] Oh, and don't fold now guys, damage control has just started, meaning this is diplomatic foreplay. Send in the first to test the waters. Make some statements, see reactions. P.s. i have no interest in bringing CCP down if they are serious about it, but the post just says "ok i hoped it goes away, it didn't...now lets talk".
Carmine Lady Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:48:00 - [2326] Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 24/06/2011 00:47:40 Oh, and don't fold now guys, damage control has just started, meaning this is diplomatic foreplay. Send in the first to test the waters. Make some statements, see reactions. P.s. i have no interest in bringing CCP down if they are serious about it, but the post just says "ok i hoped it would go away, it didn't...now lets talk". QFT +1 FREE HELICITY
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:50:00 - [2327] "Maybe if we pretend we didn't hear about the newsletter rage, they won't be mad at us anymore" --- Which is the best DOOR picture??? Bartholomeus Crane speaks out! [img]ht
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:50:00 - [2328] Originally by: Miilla Edited by: Miilla on 24/06/2011 00:41:54 Originally by: Black Dranzer http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065 STOP THE PRESSES I told ya all, FRIDAY they talk, and we get to vent over the weekend. I like how her list of complaints consisted of the monocle prices and CQ stuff, but ABSOLULTELY DID NOT TOUCH the issue of expanding ARUM.
Probably Alt	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:51:00 - [2329] Edited by: Probably Alt on 24/06/2011 00:52:08 Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. Done Edit: bold is the opps part on CCP's behalf. Those saying it is fake, please post your photos of you eating crow below.
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:53:00 - [2330] http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065&page=5#138 read my contribution :) (with imags)
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:53:00 - [2331] Originally by: Probably Alt Edited by: Probably Alt on 24/06/2011 00:52:08 Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. Done Edit: bold is the opps part on CCP's behalf. Those saying it is fake, please post your photos of you eating crow below. Make sure the shoe fits in your mouth white knighters
Probably Alt	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:54:00 - [2332] Originally by: Miilla http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065&page=5#138 read my contribution :) (with imags) I do love you Miila
Kewso	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:55:00 - [2333] I find it annoying sitting around spamming lfg for dragon raid, while there are plenty of raids going on in volcanus or stygia for master levels, but only people raiding dragon are gold farmers nowdays. we need to get more people together for the dragon! We dont need no measly master levels, we need more phat dragon lewtz! So lets rally in Jita, need tanks/healers and crowd control !@#!@# ----------------------- A Dysfunctional Playground
Maraner Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:58:00 - [2334] Edited by: Maraner on 24/06/2011 01:00:38 I find it amusing that Gewnywell is paraphrasing Kubler Ross' stages of death and dying. If EVE is to live on in its current form then micro transactions need to be strictly limited to cosmetic changes to game. Personally I have no issues with someone that wants the billion isk shirt or whatever (I do think if you get podded it should be destroyed), after all if your monocle survives your immolation why not your implants? If however CCP place ships and items in the game that significantly effect gameplay I am gone. I will cancel my accounts and move on. This is reminding me of Star Wars Galaxies. A game that still causes a shiver in MMO developer circles. It was a sand box MMO that had a respectable fan base with a good income, someone had a vision and it was destroyed. CCP should heed the warning. Make your shirts and your custom paint job kits or whatever, I think many of us could care less. Put ships and items that effect game play availble throught micro transactions and you will likely reap the whirlwind. ------------------------------------- yeah , this looks easy I'll just spend an hour or so a week......
Lithalnas Amarr Privateers Privateer Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:58:00 - [2335] I think something CCP as well as anyone should learn from this is that if you have something you consider "better if document/blog/business model not released to the public" then you should reconsider why and how you are doing that project. BTW, we need a good name to this even, Monocle-Gate? ------------- Mictro-Transactions can bite my shinny metal exhaust port.
Shang Ty Degenerate Corp Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:59:00 - [2336] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return.
Desya Dak'ann Caldari No Ducks Allowed	Posted - 2011.06.24 00:59:00 - [2337] "WeÆre going to face an uphill struggle, and the reason many of us never talk about this publically is that weÆd be burned at the stake by the players." Oh looksie what happened
Lord Caledon Degenerate Corp Get Off My Lawn	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:00:00 - [2338] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return (NOT LIKELY)
Tea Ester Elliot	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:01:00 - [2339] Dear "it's fake," crowd: Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. Ahahahaha, you white-knight mother****ers. Suck on that.
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:02:00 - [2340] A gift for the naysayers:
Mistress Varia	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:02:00 - [2341] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return.
Monaco Franze Jelly Kings BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:05:00 - [2342] Dear CCP Infidel, can u change my name to "Monacled Franze" please? kthxbye!
Dante024781 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:07:00 - [2343] Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I actually stumbled and almost fell over when I read this.
Arya Greywolf	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:07:00 - [2344] CCP Pann's apology and response seems kind at first and it seems she really cares, but if you are reading her responses further, it's BS because she is just deflecting every question/issue. On top of that, she put the PRICE of the Noble store as priority number 1... REALLY? Her first response pretty much says, "I'm not a developer so I can't answer any development [essentially every issue we have] questions so I'm going to ignore those and hope you guys chill out and forget about all of this. Enjoy your door!"
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:08:00 - [2345] Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. Quoting this to help the poor idiots who're still meatshielding CCP see the light. -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:08:00 - [2346] There's not much she can say; She's in PR/CM. Her primary job is not making the game, it's dealing with the players. There's a huge difference. Really, the apology should not have been posted by her. Not because she's not cut out to respond, but because she doesn't deserve to take the flames.
Illuminaty	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:11:00 - [2347] Originally by: Monaco Franze CCP Infidel Pure gold.
Cancel Align NOW	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:13:00 - [2348] Edited by: Cancel Align NOW on 24/06/2011 01:14:00 It is time for the OP to change the title of this thread to: CCP Confirm the Evenews24 bulletin is correct
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:13:00 - [2349] Originally by: Black Dranzer There's not much she can say; She's in PR/CM. Her primary job is not making the game, it's dealing with the players. There's a huge difference. Really, the apology should not have been posted by her. Not because she's not cut out to respond, but because she doesn't deserve to take the flames. I actually feel pretty bad for her. This is a terrible day at work for anyone. ______________________________
Los Quinton	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:13:00 - [2350] Just a game...
Telvani Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:14:00 - [2351] You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on 05 August 2011. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
Arya Greywolf	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:14:00 - [2352] Originally by: Black Dranzer There's not much she can say; She's in PR/CM. Her primary job is not making the game, it's dealing with the players. There's a huge difference. Really, the apology should not have been posted by her. Not because she's not cut out to respond, but because she doesn't deserve to take the flames. Fair enough, so why does CCP put her under the rug? Get a real developer out here to answer our issues! And if they won't, then we know they have Pann out here to F*CK with us!
Black Dranzer Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:16:00 - [2353] Originally by: Arya Greywolf Fair enough, so why does CCP put her under the rug? Because that's her job; She's out there taking the flames because that's what she's paid to do. That doesn't mean she deserves the fire. It's just what she has to do. The best you can do is be polite to her and tell her that you want the blood of the people responsible, not the designated meat shield.
Sojet Gallente The Seal Cub Clubbing Club.	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:18:00 - [2354] You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on XXXXX Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
Myra2007 Millstone Industries	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:19:00 - [2355] Originally by: Token Afrodude Edited by: Token Afrodude on 23/06/2011 22:57:57 Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. for anyone too young to have been there when Trinity came out. WATCH THIS really makes you wonder wtf happened -- Zinfandelgate - A fictionalized account of the events that led to June, 21st
isca Gallente Interstellar eXodus BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:22:00 - [2356] 5 years.... i really am at a loss as to what to say... Don't give a **** about the vanity stuff. If people with a crapton of isk need to burn it on extrashinies then fine by me. Once the faction standing purchases and other gamebreaking crap comes in, i'm off... CCP Turborg, you have a lot to answer for. Make your first post a good one...
HoboWithAShip	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:22:00 - [2357] Well, it looks like CCP's reply has become a threadnaught of its own, so I'm guessing that this thread wont reach 100 pages. Too bad.
Madeiner	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:22:00 - [2358] Edited by: Madeiner on 24/06/2011 01:22:36 Originally by: Sojet If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below. lol ________
Susitna Caldari The Tuskers	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:23:00 - [2359] Edited by: Susitna on 24/06/2011 01:24:56 Opps wrong thread
M Blanc	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:25:00 - [2360] +1 to addressing the leaked issue of 'Fearless' and to stating for once, honestly, the nature of your long-term plans for microtransactions in Eve.
Monaco Franze Jelly Kings BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:26:00 - [2361] Originally by: Arya Greywolf Get a real developer out here to answer our issues! And if they won't, then we know they have Pann out here to F*CK with us! this would probably cost u a lot of aurum
mobius nm Minmatar Imperativa	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:26:00 - [2362] Originally by: Myra2007 Originally by: Token Afrodude Edited by: Token Afrodude on 23/06/2011 22:57:57 Originally by: Velicitia Originally by: Illwill Bill That Trinity trailer sure brought back memories. for anyone too young to have been there when Trinity came out. WATCH THIS really makes you wonder wtf happened Confirming, I too literally shed a tear the first time I saw this trailer. Because all of it was mine, and I could do ANYTHING. CCP, you killed that magic and wonder on 2011.06.21
Joe Skellington Minmatar Caldari Elite Force Apocalypse Now.	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:35:00 - [2363] --
LordElfa Gallente Golden Lyon Warriors	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:36:00 - [2364] Originally by: Lord Caledon EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return (NOT LIKELY) Wow, at this rate it'll be safe to fly through lowsec by morning. YEAH! òòòòòòò CSM6-Hated by fools for who they are; Loved by the knowledgeable for what they will do.
Mitchello B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:39:00 - [2365] "An overdue apology and request for parley" The next diversion. INCARNA. EXPERT HOUSING, QUARTER STYLE, New Eden's Blue Lagoon. Coming Soon.
Probably Alt	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:41:00 - [2366] How many subs did they see in their "metrics" that they decided to rush some people out to talk with customers I wonder?
Doc Fury Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:48:00 - [2367] This is how it's going to probably go down: CCP will placate the rioting masses and say MT will only ever be for vanity items. Much spin and weasel-words will be used. CCP will compartmentalize more things in EVE development so leaks and the like will be less likely to happen. Development of MT for non vanity items will continue, but in near secrecy. To quote CCP manifest: "Arum is here to stay". CCP will go back to working on their other two games and we will get more weaksauce mini patches that don't really address anything relevant to what the players have been asking for, while the MT machine starts to build momentum. Next year when DUST is released and does not draw the numbers CCP gambled on, they are going to turn on the MT for game altering items they have been working on all along, even though they said they would not. This could also happen sooner, they are hemorrhaging cash trying to juggle 3 games where only one is laying golden eggs. We're not upset that you lied to us CCP, we're upset that from now on we can't believe you. /I am not a golden Goose
mobius nm Minmatar Imperativa	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:52:00 - [2368] Originally by: Doc Fury This is how it's going to probably go down: CCP will placate the rioting masses and say MT will only ever be for vanity items. Much spin and weasel-words will be used. CCP will compartmentalize more things in EVE development so leaks and the like will be less likely to happen. Development of MT for non vanity items will continue, but in near secrecy. To quote CCP manifest: "Arum is here to stay". CCP will go back to working on their other two games and we will get more weaksauce mini patches that don't really address anything relevant to what the players have been asking for, while the MT machine starts to build momentum. Next year when DUST is released and does not draw the numbers CCP gambled on, they are going to turn on the MT for game altering items they have been working on all along, even though they said they would not. This could also happen sooner, they are hemorrhaging cash trying to juggle 3 games where only one is laying golden eggs. Pretty much this, except they planned on bilking the **** out of the Dustbunnies right from the get go. In fact, that was going to be one of the key driving points of the IP so say the rumors. They thought they could build TF2 in Space, and while they're at it why not see if they could fund it all by experimenting on Eve first.
I'm Down	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:53:00 - [2369] guys guys, come on, they gave us 70 dollar virtual 1 piece glasswear. How can you be mad. There's no global recession after all right?
Chromoburst	Posted - 2011.06.24 01:58:00 - [2370] Edited by: Chromoburst on 24/06/2011 02:03:10 This is total BS. First time I've seriously considered quitting eve. CCP take note: This thread represents a reasonable sampling of your customer base. If you don't understand the perspective represented here you should seriously consider how your financial goals are impacting your understanding of your client. This idea blows. Skills should determine the appearance and abilities of a player not thier secular job or personal finances. The impact of plex on this is mitigated by a persons skills. There is only so much you can do with billions of isk on a new account. Adding even vanity items for real world cash brings the real world financial means of a person into eve in a very visible way. I dont want people knowing im poor in game. K. And I dont want to know that my enemies have tons of expendable income in RL. This whole Idea is just terrible.
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:02:00 - [2371] Originally by: Probably Alt How many subs did they see in their "metrics" that they decided to rush some people out to talk with customers I wonder? Not the unsubs - they don't care about those. They're trying to forestall the bad press, as each burned player tells other potential revenue sources not to start playing, and news sources start noticing something's going on.
Pat Morrison	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:05:00 - [2372] Originally by: Doc Fury This is how it's going to probably go down: CCP will placate the rioting masses and say MT will only ever be for vanity items. Much spin and weasel-words will be used. CCP will compartmentalize more things in EVE development so leaks and the like will be less likely to happen. Development of MT for non vanity items will continue, but in near secrecy. To quote CCP manifest: "Arum is here to stay". CCP will go back to working on their other two games and we will get more weaksauce mini patches that don't really address anything relevant to what the players have been asking for, while the MT machine starts to build momentum. Next year when DUST is released and does not draw the numbers CCP gambled on, they are going to turn on the MT for game altering items they have been working on all along, even though they said they would not. This could also happen sooner, they are hemorrhaging cash trying to juggle 3 games where only one is laying golden eggs. Yup, that's how I expect it'll go.
Ranka Mei Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:08:00 - [2373] Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. Holy crap on a cracker! It's real... wow, unbelievable! I mean, I've been posting all over this thread, assuming it was real. But stiil, now that it really is... just wow! -- "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Ehronn Caldari Nutz N Boltz	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:08:00 - [2374] heck yea, less lag as people leave resubscribed my alts! ----------------------- A Dysfunctional Playground
Manos Heimenbarger	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:08:00 - [2375] The CCP replies have been less than stellar so far, so you seem to be right on target.
Gurgeh Murat Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:16:00 - [2376] Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. CCP, you suck donkey balls. Your mother cooks socks in hell. Youve destroyed everything I truly loved about EvE for short term gains. As ye sow, so shall ye reap. THE WHIRLWIND MOTHER****ER! Gratz on your declining playerbase GG ccp, gg
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:25:00 - [2377] Lets not get this thread locked up.
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:27:00 - [2378] Bah, more sad news, apparently this is another thread that explains some of the things to come and points out how fragmented CCP is READ THE POST CIRCLED IN RED Bah, some people, why they do this? This is so bad, why CCP is heading in this direction? ---Archipelago Theory---
ShadowLZ Minmatar Red Star Corp The Jagged Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:32:00 - [2379] Edited by: ShadowLZ on 24/06/2011 02:32:29 Originally by: Riflin' Betty A year ago today, this was posted by CCP: Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwF7n8WyOoU ---------------------------------------- -Pulvis et umbra sumus.
Bomberlocks Minmatar CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:39:00 - [2380] And just to make sure this issue is not swept under the table: Bump! --------------------- Countdown to sub running out: 9
Bloody2k Gallente ZERO T0LERANCE RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:41:00 - [2381] Einmal mit Profis!
Super Whopper I can Has Cheeseburger	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:42:00 - [2382] Edited by: Super Whopper on 24/06/2011 02:45:41 Edited by: ShadowLZ on 24/06/2011 02:32:29 Originally by: Riflin' Betty A year ago today, this was posted by CCP: Doesn't it make you sick when you get lied to? -Heli FREE HELICITY!! Replace CCP management before the game totally dies to absolute stupidity. Soon all kill boards, TS and Vent servers, all fan sites and everything else will have to shut down or pay $99 to CCP for the pleasure of being **ed over. Quote:** Greed is good. Gecko went to prison, so will you fools when the shareholders find out the game's bleeding customers.
Foralai Altrus	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:44:00 - [2383] Originally by: Bomberlocks And just to make sure this issue is not swept under the table: Bump! Oh it can't be swept away now... they verified the memo. It's hit the net, they are in full bore firestorm with a spritzer bottle of gas trouble
Chesty McJubblies Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:44:00 - [2384] Jesus Christ, I have 80 pages of this to read through at work tomorrow?! GJ btw CCP, can't wait to read all the replies. o7 ----------------------------------------
Super Whopper I can Has Cheeseburger	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:47:00 - [2385] Originally by: Foralai Altrus Originally by: Bomberlocks And just to make sure this issue is not swept under the table: Bump! Oh it can't be swept away now... they verified the memo. It's hit the net, they are in full bore firestorm with a spritzer bottle of gas trouble CCP are jealous of SOE, they too want to have their NGE and dead games.
Darkstorm708	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:53:00 - [2386] Edited by: Darkstorm708 on 24/06/2011 02:55:34 I haven't been around this game as long as I would have liked to have been, and I have not enjoyed this game at it's peak, and frankly I was looking forward to it so much. This game had so much playability in the future for me and it saddens me that now, I won't be able to enjoy this game as much as I would have hoped. The most annoying thing is, I re-subbed about an hour before finding out about this, luckily only for 1 month. I will play as much as I can during the one month I subscribed for, I will get out as much as I can and have as much fun as possible, and then I will be quitting. R.I.P EvE Online. You were good while it lasted.
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:54:00 - [2387] In 2 hours and 15 minutes the CCP Pann thread has exploded to 38 pages. Half as much as this thread has gotten up to, really incredible. 1150 posts in 2 hours = 600 posts an hour = 10 posts a minute. Staying steady from the last time I checked the posting rate. ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
WCPistolPete Gallente MacroIntel	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:54:00 - [2388] I'm waiting the movie so I can see how this turns out. It's just too damn much to read. {WC}PistolPete "...going to take a lot of fireworks to clean this place up..." Homer Simpson
Jonny Utrigas	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:58:00 - [2389] Originally by: Bloodpetal In 2 hours and 15 minutes the CCP Pann thread has exploded to 38 pages. Half as much as this thread has gotten up to, really incredible. 1150 posts in 2 hours = 600 posts an hour = 10 posts a minute. Staying steady from the last time I checked the posting rate. Probably why the all the blue bars stopped showing up. about 30% - 40% of it is just massive copy pasta, and then another large portion is OMFG WALL-O-TEXT posts, and by the time I read a single wall of text post the thread has grown by 1 - 2 pages, so yeah. pretty sure they're just going to let that fire calm down a bit before posting anything else in there.
Mac Aoidh Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.24 02:58:00 - [2390] I've got about 30 minutes till my character can be sent off to biomass so I thought I'd chime in one last time. There's really nothing anyone from CCP could say to keep me as a customer. The newsletter that was leaked clearly shows CCP's true future vision as a company. I've been playing off and on since 2004 and I've seen lots of changes, some good, some bad. But those changes were always consistent with the company's core vision of creating an epic mmo that was a true sandbox. MT ruins everything! It will keep Dust from ever being anything more than novelty and will prevent WOD from ever being taken seriously. It will ruin EVE. This is a true NGE moment. In a way, you're doing me a favor CCP. I've got some serious health issues that need to be addressed. It's time I start focusing on how my real life avatar looks. It's been fun and thanks for all the pew pew! Mac out!
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:00:00 - [2391] We will see where this is going, in the meantime, THIS tread has the LINK in it...not the other one, so keep it alive at least till tomorrow. PPL need to read this, as its confirmed now.
Tuco Forever	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:07:00 - [2392] You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ***********. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
A Lunchbox	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:09:00 - [2393] Wow CCP. You've managed in 24 hours to **** off, alienate, and insult more of your customers than I could ever dream of. RECRUITING - CCP Devs for low sec piracy. If there's anything left of low sec in a week anyway. Box Basgerin Pirate.
Bloody2k Gallente ZERO T0LERANCE RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:22:00 - [2394] Edited by: Bloody2k on 24/06/2011 03:22:49 How much money is able to safe until Eve fades? Einmal mit Profis!
Thades	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:25:00 - [2395] wtf!?
TedStriker The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:40:00 - [2396] don't slip guys, keep up the LINK for everyone to read.
Billy Ikkala	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:45:00 - [2397] If this ** is real, god it just makes me so ing angry..does ccp even ing play there own game for ** sakes? if i start to see aurum for ships, i will defiantly cancel my accounts and move on to a different game. i'm guessing by the 80 pages of rage, others feel the same way. bad move ccp......very bad.
Doc Fury Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:49:00 - [2398] Originally by: Billy Ikkala If this ** is real, god it just makes me so ing angry..does ccp even ing play there own game for ** sakes? if i start to see aurum for ships, i will defiantly cancel my accounts and move on to a different game. i'm guessing by the 80 pages of rage, others feel the same way. bad move ccp......very bad. No if, CCP confirmed it was real in their damage control thread. You gotta go in a few pages to find it. Linkage We're not upset that you lied to us CCP, we're upset that from now on we can't believe you. /I am not a golden Goose
Azahni Vah'nos Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.24 03:56:00 - [2399] The only solution that I can see is the 'bad apples' at CCP need to be removed as sad as that is to say. How could you go to Fanfest for example and have some of these people greet you with a smile, you'd just want to smack them one, knowing that they just see you as a walking wallet.
Cpt Wrongway	Posted - 2011.06.24 04:01:00 - [2400] Edited by: Cpt Wrongway on 24/06/2011 04:01:41 Edited by: Cpt Wrongway on 24/06/2011 04:01:01 I'm feeling about as angry as Morbo the news monster gets when a pathetic human confuses how windmills work, so I bid the community fare thee well until tomorrow. "LOYAL CUSTOMERS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY! GOOD NIGHT!!"
Devils Errand	Posted - 2011.06.24 04:12:00 - [2401] My family is celebrating CCP's recent strategic move. They know that it's implementation will mean I'll be spending much more time with them, rather than nuturing bro-love on the internet under the pretense of "playing a game". A final thought as CCP self conflagurates into oblivion. I'm sure it's in their minds that we're all just ranting and it'll pass. There was a leading website devoted to Audi enthusiasts that was for years self moderated and kept a fevered pace because it served the user, not the dollar. One day Internet Brands, a buyer of websites for profitability bought it up, since it had such a strong user base and was viewed from all over the world. They came in, changed the forum software, and went to a completely different format. There was ranting and emo, there was posts from The New Management that they had the user's interests in mind. It got worse. Then one day the user base said, enough. A few went off, started a new forum, and in a span of ONE WEEK, 99.9% of the userbase moved over to the new forum. A website that had a 100k userbase and over a million hits/week went to 100 active users and 3-8 posts a day. If CCP thinks that nothing can really break the interia of the established userbase, they really should think again. It only takes one viral event to break an internet phenom. With that I'll wait to see how things fall out. I'll cancel the subscription, as I pay a year at a time. If by the time the renewal is due the crap hasn't been washed away, then I'll be one of the many I expect that will move on to the next best thing in MMO's.
Emperor Cheney Celebrity Sex Tape	Posted - 2011.06.24 04:27:00 - [2402] Originally by: Devils Errand Then one day the user base said, enough. A few went off, started a new forum, and in a span of ONE WEEK, 99.9% of the userbase moved over to the new forum. A website that had a 100k userbase and over a million hits/week went to 100 active users and 3-8 posts a day. I'm waiting on a new EVE, ran by a sane company. I think a lot of us are.
Dante024781 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.24 04:40:00 - [2403] Edited by: Dante024781 on 24/06/2011 04:39:55 CCP, I will be frank with you. "Are you moving beyond VANITY AUR items?" The only way I will be reactivating my subscriptions is if the answer to this question is "NO" I think most of us know that the reason you have not answered, is that the answer is yes. Right now you are trying to figure out a way to tell us that this is happening without losing customers. I will make it easy for you. You can't. I wish you much luck in your future endeavors. No hard feelings, it is just a game and I have truly enjoyed it. I sincerely hope I am wrong.
GavinCapacitor	Posted - 2011.06.24 04:44:00 - [2404] Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. Welp.
TedStriker The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:07:00 - [2405] And Manifest clearly stated that AURUM is here to stay. End of story.
Manos Heimenbarger	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:17:00 - [2406] Originally by: TedStriker And Manifest clearly stated that AURUM is here to stay. End of story. The deal breaker for me will be if they expand it too far. If they act on what was in that newsletter. Aurum for some boots or sunglasses or an incredibly expensive monocle? Sure... For skill points, faction points, ships or ammo? Goodbye CCP.
Super Whopper I can Has Cheeseburger	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:17:00 - [2407] Originally by: Doc Fury This is how it's going to probably go down: CCP will placate the rioting masses and say MT will only ever be for vanity items. Much spin and weasel-words will be used. CCP will compartmentalize more things in EVE development so leaks and the like will be less likely to happen. Development of MT for non vanity items will continue, but in near secrecy. To quote CCP manifest: "Arum is here to stay". CCP will go back to working on their other two games and we will get more weaksauce mini patches that don't really address anything relevant to what the players have been asking for, while the MT machine starts to build momentum. Next year when DUST is released and does not draw the numbers CCP gambled on, they are going to turn on the MT for game altering items they have been working on all along, even though they said they would not. This could also happen sooner, they are hemorrhaging cash trying to juggle 3 games where only one is laying golden eggs. This is exactly how it will go, the only difference is this time CCP will go bankrupt as they can't get any new capital. Apparently their discussions with with investors has gone badly and they are desperate. White Wolf was bought by CCP for next to nothing, due to the WoD franchise being almost dead. CCP are hoping to create a new MMO that will explode to WoW size so they can cash out. That is also what Dust is for, they want to bring in console players and 'integrate' them with EVE. Depending on how many people are left to play EVE depends on whether Dust can succeed or not. Also CCP are extremely short sighted because everyone can see the console fps market is extremely crowded and dominated by COD. To fund these fun projects CCP have bankrupted themselves. In other words CCP are stupid. Anyone still having any hope CCP won't kill the game is a fool who thinks they're going to get something out of standing up for CCP or just plain fanboy and we know they're as stupid as it gets.
Sevano Markeen	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:21:00 - [2408] Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Ultan Rova stuff Multiple solutions have been presented by players to resolve these issues, CCP never listens. Dead horse anyone?
Bloodpetal	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:23:00 - [2409] Originally by: Sevano Markeen Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Ultan Rova stuff Multiple solutions have been presented by players to resolve these issues, CCP never listens. Dead horse anyone? image link below ____________________________________________________ Cost of the week of June 21st
bl3h	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:26:00 - [2410] Edited by: bl3h on 24/06/2011 05:27:14 Give CCP a break, they're just trying to maximize profit, something that a proper business should do. I bet most of the other MMO developers have this exact same discussion, but they just haven't been leaked
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:29:00 - [2411] Originally by: bl3h Edited by: bl3h on 24/06/2011 05:27:14 Give CCP a break, they're just trying to maximize profit, something that a proper business should do. I bet most of the other MMO developers have this exact same discussion, but they just haven't been leaked And, that makes it better ...because?
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:38:00 - [2412] Originally by: Sevano Markeen Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Ultan Rova stuff Multiple solutions have been presented by players to resolve these issues, CCP never listens. Dead horse anyone? We are now dead cows. Mooo My faith in CCP will return SoonÖ
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 05:43:00 - [2413] Maybe we should just ring the investors and say "Hey... CCP management just lost all your money" :-) His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:09:00 - [2414] Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Sevano Markeen Originally by: Adunh Slavy Originally by: Ultan Rova stuff Multiple solutions have been presented by players to resolve these issues, CCP never listens. Dead horse anyone? We are now dead cows. Mooo Lol. Don't think this thread should fall off the front page just yet.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:15:00 - [2415] Originally by: Isis Soryu Lol. Don't think this thread should fall off the front page just yet. I just woke up and this is the most fun eve has been in 3 years. :-) His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Portmanteau CTRL-Q	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:17:00 - [2416] Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. AWWW so we should feel bad for you because YOU GOT CAUGHT IN A MASSIVE BAREFACED LIE ?? cry moar http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:17:00 - [2417] You telling me, i didn't sleep for nearly 2 days (just a few hours).
Warg Matar Minmatar The Red Circle Inc.	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:21:00 - [2418] Make your chief concern formulating a watertight(space vacuume tight?) statement of Aurum bought crap not ever having ingame performance enhancing, or nerfing effects ever. Not not, not in the future. And you might be starting to get somewhere. I don't really think anyone cares about aurum crap being expensive at all. As long as it's just for vanity, as I had thought was intended, it would simply be a matter of "oh cool, this useless crap is cheap, I'll buy it for immersion/boredom/roleplay" against "bah, go away useless crap".
Aiwha Caldari 101st Space Marine Force Nulli Secunda	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:31:00 - [2419] I... I... CCP. No. Just no. If these go live, I'm out. I can't heal stupid
Mehrdad Kor-Azor Amarr Iure Divino	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:32:00 - [2420] Originally by: Klingon Admiral "Creation is so precious, and greed so destructive." EVE Online: Tyrannis Teaser Summer 2010
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:36:00 - [2421] OP needs to update the first post to include Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. please!
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:38:00 - [2422] Youtube comments on DUST videos look too much like past bad information. We may have to fix that and update people. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:39:00 - [2423] Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha on 24/06/2011 06:45:45 Originally by: Emperor Cheney Then one day the user base said, enough. For 30 pieces of aurum Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Marcus Vorenius Instant Annihilation	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:49:00 - [2424] cross-posting before the lock/move to EVE Fiction Quote: Originally by: CCP Pann -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I'm very surprised to hear that the CCP PR & Communications Director was not involved/consulted on a very sensitive and controversial newsletter. It does not matter if these are personal opinions to get a discussion started, the fact that it's on the table and being discussed proves that it's being considered. The part that really got me going was that you recently nerfed ship fittings, with the intention of charging RL $ for it later (in the newsletter). If you were not going down this route, who in his right mind would call a NEWSLETTER for GREED IS GOOD and place Gordon Gekko on the frontpage.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:50:00 - [2425] Originally by: Portmanteau Edited by: Portmanteau on 24/06/2011 06:20:28 Originally by: CCP Pann The newsletter was not fake. I guess this is how it feels when someone reads your diary, something you hadn't intended anyone else to see. Not to deflect the heat but to explain why what I'm about to say, I wasn't involved with writing it. The only reason I mention that is because I am not going to presume to know the minds of the people who did have comments in there. I am not going to throw people I love under the bus or to the lions or whatever. I can't/won't answer questions about what they said or why they said it. Our newsletters are written as a means to bring about discussion (that sometimes can even become heated debate) among our coworkers. That's really all I can say about it. I am not a game designer. I'm a mouthpiece. I'll admit it. By the time I get involved, the decisions have been made. Not making excuses for myself, just explaining. AWWW so we should feel bad for CCP because THEY GOT CAUGHT IN A MASSIVE BAREFACED LIE ?? cry moar Again. You missed that word. I feel it is important. Also bumper cars.
Aesynil Caldari The Unit...	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:56:00 - [2426] I read the pdf thingy. It wasn't really that bad..One guy said he likes MT's, and that's where half the rage came from. It was the devil's advocate position. The rest was pretty mild... Why don't we have posts from the other guy, where he said that MT's are bad if they go too far, and should be strictly limited to vanity items to avoid making the game die?
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 06:56:00 - [2427] tl;dr Can someone just summarise why y'alls are getting your panties in a panic about if all you want are internet spaceships and you don't care what colour they are or what you look like? I'm pretty sure that if RMT ever goes beyond "vanity items" it is unlikely to imbalance the null sec game but rather the "pve WoW brigade" so who cares? The EVE universe is big enough to let you avoid the fully rmt officer fitted faction battleships mining for trit. This happened in EQ2 a year or so ago and I quit on point of principle. Today I'm back there in a very casual capacity and I have to be honest with you guys its impact is minimal at worst. No rmt buff is ever going to imbalance good gameplay. I just want CCP to maintain an open honest approach to future game design as once you lose the trust of the playerbase you will never get it back.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:01:00 - [2428] Originally by: Aesynil I read the pdf thingy. It wasn't really that bad..One guy said he likes MT's, and that's where half the rage came from. It was the devil's advocate position. The rest was pretty mild... Why don't we have posts from the other guy, where he said that MT's are bad if they go too far, and should be strictly limited to vanity items to avoid making the game die? Keep in mind that the person saying in his opinion we should have standings & ammo & such in the MT shop. Is the lead developer/designer of this game. He also states that they're going to have to be sneaky about it because, we the player base, are in effect a bit dim. Hell even Hilmar doesn't escape. We don't like it because we fear change. Erm... no. We don't like it because your busy driving something some of us have spent 8 years enjoy, doing free PR work for and generally being a community about (we're actually pretty good despite first apperances) is being driven in to the ground for no apparent reason other than "we can".
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:03:00 - [2429] Originally by: Aesynil I read the pdf thingy. It wasn't really that bad..One guy said he likes MT's, and that's where half the rage came from. It was the devil's advocate position. The rest was pretty mild... Why don't we have posts from the other guy, where he said that MT's are bad if they go too far, and should be strictly limited to vanity items to avoid making the game die? You read ALL of it and found nothing offensive about it? I like you, want to be my customer too?
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:07:00 - [2430] Originally by: Aesynil I read the pdf thingy. It wasn't really that bad..One guy said he likes MT's, and that's where half the rage came from. It was the devil's advocate position. The rest was pretty mild... Why don't we have posts from the other guy, where he said that MT's are bad if they go too far, and should be strictly limited to vanity items to avoid making the game die? Originally by: Horace Nancyball tl;dr Can someone just summarise why y'alls are getting your panties in a panic about if all you want are internet spaceships and you don't care what colour they are or what you look like? I'm pretty sure that if RMT ever goes beyond "vanity items" it is unlikely to imbalance the null sec game but rather the "pve WoW brigade" so who cares? The EVE universe is big enough to let you avoid the fully rmt officer fitted faction battleships mining for trit. This happened in EQ2 a year or so ago and I quit on point of principle. Today I'm back there in a very casual capacity and I have to be honest with you guys its impact is minimal at worst. No rmt buff is ever going to imbalance good gameplay. I just want CCP to maintain an open honest approach to future game design as once you lose the trust of the playerbase you will never get it back. Both of you need to re-read this thread and read the Apology thread if you can't understand how this will negatively impact the game. Not only does it create a P2W game, it also completely cuts out the player economy. EQ2 is not EVE, this is a PVP game first and foremost, the minute RL cash directly* adds to your chances of winning the game is ***ed. (Just for the record I don't like plex either but it was either introduce them or continue to sell them on the forum like days of yore, but at least it is operates completely within the economy)
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:09:00 - [2431] Originally by: Horace Nancyball tl;dr Lead Dev/Designer wants perks and non-vanity in the MT shop, CCP's track record of lieing to our faces has bitten them in ass. His wishes leads to: Alliance A has not MT'd stuff. Alliance B has MT'd stuff. Alliance B has more firepower, stronger reps, better tanks, faster ships than Alliance A. Alliance A can not get those things through training skills or griding. Winning a fight, in a PvP focused game, becomes a function of who has more RL cash. $ is converted to PLEX (by someone at somepoint even if you brought the PLEX with ingame ISK). MT store currency can only come from a PLEX. Therefore in simple terms more $ = more MT currency. Add a 3 day stew where CCP said nothing but snarky comments on the forums, a few Bronies going wild and... here we are. That TL;DR enough for you?
Super Whopper I can Has Cheeseburger	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:12:00 - [2432] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Originally by: Aesynil I read the pdf thingy. It wasn't really that bad..One guy said he likes MT's, and that's where half the rage came from. It was the devil's advocate position. The rest was pretty mild... Why don't we have posts from the other guy, where he said that MT's are bad if they go too far, and should be strictly limited to vanity items to avoid making the game die? Keep in mind that the person saying in his opinion we should have standings & ammo & such in the MT shop. Is the lead developer/designer of this game. He also states that they're going to have to be sneaky about it because, we the player base, are in effect a bit dim. Hell even Hilmar doesn't escape. We don't like it because we fear change. Erm... no. We don't like it because your busy driving something some of us have spent 8 years enjoy, doing free PR work for and generally being a community about (we're actually pretty good despite first apperances) is being driven in to the ground for no apparent reason other than "we can". You are wrong. CCP have no money left because they've wasted it on Dust and WoD. No investor will go near them because they're useless and they are desperate. If they thought they could sell us not only items but access to regions they would.
Aesynil Caldari The Unit...	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:21:00 - [2433] It was an internal document, discussing revenue streams. They threw ideas around. They said a lot of what-ifs. They're..erm..a business. This is a business for them. We give them money, and they give us a service. You're naive if you don't think that every business you work with isn't on some level considering the financial aspect of things. They've demonstrated a number of times that if the community outcry is loud enough, they'll see reason. If I see a document explicitly saying "We're going to sell power outright in Eve after promising not to, and screw the player-base" I'll be irritated. If I see a document saying "We're looking at these possibilities but understand the player-base is opposed to it", I'll..erm..see a company trying to make money. A lot..a lot...a -lot- of the rage is over things inferred from this document that just aren't explicitly stated. In the original post, they talk about buying sov with Aurum, when he's actually saying he was thinking of REWARDING people with Aurum for doing things like that. Let's quote a bit. Consumerism can, up to a certain level, improve experience and strengthen identity, making us more competitive Too much consumerism will ruin the experience They're not stupid. They're not going to alienate their player-base or else they just lose money anyways. Don't rabble-rabble-rabble-rage senselessly. Complain appropriately and respectfully, make it clear where the line in the sand is, and the fine folks at CCP will listen and react, or they'll fail and we'll all find something else to play. And finally...Everybody is saying cash shouldn't buy power in the game...It already does. I can drop $200 in Plex, buy a new character, outfit it with the best ships in the game, and go to town on day one. We're already there. The time to rage was then. We missed the bill. The day that they actively endorse the intention to offer something more powerful through ONLY Aurum that the rest of us can't reach, then I'll get irked. So let's see where it goes shrug Please forgive me random rambling. I've been at work for some time, sleepy, headache, etc, and don't care to proofread and write this up properly.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:26:00 - [2434] Edited by: Gwenywell Shumuku on 24/06/2011 07:29:15 Now, really. Let me ask you in all seriousness: do you have reading comprehension problems? I know you may even be serious about it, but try harder. And why are you trying to mitigate it with "others do it too". How does that make it better? But hey, ignore everything, just feel the tone when they speak about us (freeloading spectators???). That ok for you? As i said...man i would like you as a customer of mine, i really do.
Algathas The Revenge of Auntie Freeze	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:29:00 - [2435] Joseph Gallo: June 2009 û Present (2 years 1 month) "As CFO of CCP Games, Joe oversees the financial positioning and reporting of CCP. He is also responsible for the strategic initiatives of the Company and relations with its investors." His previous work history: "Managing Director, Investment Banking Citigroup Public Company; C; Financial Services industry 1994 û 2008 (14 years) " Lets see what his performance at his past job resulted in: Citigroup "Citigroup suffered huge losses during the global financial crisis of 2008 and was rescued in November 2008 in a massive stimulus package by the U.S. government." As we can see, things really started sliding around the time this guy came around. Looking at his previous work history, its no wonder that EVE is in the state it's in.
Hantaria Clivan ThErEaLdEaL...	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:29:00 - [2436] @Aesynil the difference is: buying a char which skills, items and so on everybody could reach without $$ or buying e.g. ammo which only players could get if they spend $$. would be the death for smallscale/solopvp imho.
Khamal Jolstien Caldari Sick Tight BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:30:00 - [2437] Originally by: Aesynil It was an internal document, discussing revenue streams. They threw ideas around. They said a lot of what-ifs. They're..erm..a business. This is a business for them. We give them money, and they give us a service. You're naive if you don't think that every business you work with isn't on some level considering the financial aspect of things. They've demonstrated a number of times that if the community outcry is loud enough, they'll see reason. If I see a document explicitly saying "We're going to sell power outright in Eve after promising not to, and screw the player-base" I'll be irritated. If I see a document saying "We're looking at these possibilities but understand the player-base is opposed to it", I'll..erm..see a company trying to make money. A lot..a lot...a -lot- of the rage is over things inferred from this document that just aren't explicitly stated. In the original post, they talk about buying sov with Aurum, when he's actually saying he was thinking of REWARDING people with Aurum for doing things like that. Let's quote a bit. Consumerism can, up to a certain level, improve experience and strengthen identity, making us more competitive Too much consumerism will ruin the experience They're not stupid. They're not going to alienate their player-base or else they just lose money anyways. Don't rabble-rabble-rabble-rage senselessly. Complain appropriately and respectfully, make it clear where the line in the sand is, and the fine folks at CCP will listen and react, or they'll fail and we'll all find something else to play. And finally...Everybody is saying cash shouldn't buy power in the game...It already does. I can drop $200 in Plex, buy a new character, outfit it with the best ships in the game, and go to town on day one. We're already there. The time to rage was then. We missed the bill. The day that they actively endorse the intention to offer something more powerful through ONLY Aurum that the rest of us can't reach, then I'll get irked. So let's see where it goes shrug Please forgive me random rambling. I've been at work for some time, sleepy, headache, etc, and don't care to proofread and write this up properly. Ok, so the time to act was when PLEX was introduced, not now. But now you say we should wait until they charge aurum, and only aurum, for powerful items to get ***ed? It will be too late to save this game that we still love* if we let it get to that point. Originally by: McKinlay When you get on the batphone and the only people left in the phone book are Aeternus and BLAST it might be time to hang up.
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:31:00 - [2438] Originally by: Aesynil The day that they actively endorse the intention to offer something more powerful through ONLY Aurum that the rest of us can't reach, then I'll get irked. So let's see where it goes shrug I get the feeling that is why most people are making their voices heard now (me trying to as well) because we care for the game we as players know what that would do to the game and we want to stop those discussions before its too late. It is an internal document yes now its been leaked CCP can gauge the reaction of such things and hopefully that will put an end to these thoughts. I just don't want CCP and EVE to be ruined by greed. Cancelling my subscription hasn't come in my mind once in 4 years of play. Good friends great game great developers but with all this if MT for game changing items is the way they go then I am out I know that doesn't mean a lot to anyone else and don't expect it too but that is just how I feel. Obviously there is discussion going on within CCP about what direction to take. I just hope the guys who arguing against MT for anything other than vanity items within CCP will now have a louder voice backed by us.
Shivalla Gallente Financial Removal THE SPACE P0LICE	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:31:00 - [2439] Edited by: Shivalla on 24/06/2011 07:31:44 Edited by: Shivalla on 24/06/2011 07:31:31 http://eyeglass.com/mointowle.html I just drop this here. Discuss.
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:32:00 - [2440] Originally by: Aesynil They've demonstrated a number of times that if the community outcry is loud enough, they'll see reason. That's the problem though. Look at the picture a few pages(?) ago with the posts by a CCP person saying there would never be micro-transactions in EVE. There were no plans for it, there was no talk of it, it would not happen even if it were talked about. Those posts were generated from community outcry over possible MT's. The whole mechanic of delivering additional SP appeared and people went "Ohh shiat". Here we are a year or so later from that server move. We have MT's, we have proof that senior people want to sell us (amongst other things) SP for MT (seriously, it's the easiest way to do a headstart/toon booster for $$ in EVE). It is not hard to see why we feel lied too and a bit abused.
Manos Heimenbarger	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:32:00 - [2441] Originally by: Aesynil They've demonstrated a number of times that if the community outcry is loud enough, they'll see reason. All the more reason to get and stay loud over this.
Fighter26 Orion's Fist	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:33:00 - [2442] Originally by: Shivalla Edited by: Shivalla on 24/06/2011 07:31:44 Edited by: Shivalla on 24/06/2011 07:31:31 http://eyeglass.com/mointowle.html I just drop this here. Discuss. Real turtle? How the hell is CCP going to code that they cannot even get the hair right on ATI cards... -
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:35:00 - [2443] Originally by: Khamal Jolstien Ok, so the time to act was when PLEX was introduced, We did. We raged, we discussed, we warned about the slippery slope. When uPLEX (it turns out a place holder for Aru or however its felt) first appeared on SiSi we discussed, we raged, we warned.
Gaal Lefkin	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:36:00 - [2444] Originally by: Aesynil It was an internal document, discussing revenue streams. They threw ideas around. They said a lot of what-ifs. They're..erm..a business. This is a business for them. We give them money, and they give us a service. You're naive if you don't think that every business you work with isn't on some level considering the financial aspect of things. Thanks for the lesson kid Originally by: Aesynil They've demonstrated a number of times that if the community outcry is loud enough, they'll see reason. If I see a document explicitly saying "We're going to sell power outright in Eve after promising not to, and screw the player-base" I'll be irritated. If I see a document saying "We're looking at these possibilities but understand the player-base is opposed to it", I'll..erm..see a company trying to make money. Like the last time right? "Vanity items only, We promise". See where we are now? Originally by: Aesynil They're not stupid. They're not going to alienate their player-base or else they just lose money anyways. Don't rabble-rabble-rabble-rage senselessly. Complain appropriately and respectfully, make it clear where the line in the sand is, and the fine folks at CCP will listen and react, or they'll fail and we'll all find something else to play. They already alienated a good chunk of their player base... CCP will listen like the last time, make half an apology and a promise they won't hold Originally by: Aesynil And finally...Everybody is saying cash shouldn't buy power in the game...It already does. I can drop $200 in Plex, buy a new character, outfit it with the best ships in the game, and go to town on day one. We're already there. The time to rage was then. We missed the bill. The day that they actively endorse the intention to offer something more powerful through ONLY Aurum that the rest of us can't reach, then I'll get irked. So let's see where it goes shrug Yes, you can already buy power with $$. So why going further on that route? Moreover, back in the days CCP used to find RP reasons for new stuff in game. The PLEX as the pilot license f.e. Now what with the Aurum? What with the NEX? What with a monocle costing more than the moros shooting Dust players? Completely immersion breaking, and sadly it proves CCP doesn't care anymore about that. Am I the only one to see the problem when a company selling an immersing service doesnt care about immersion anymore?
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 07:40:00 - [2445] Edited by: Isis Soryu on 24/06/2011 07:40:12 Originally by: Aesynil And finally...Everybody is saying cash shouldn't buy power in the game...It already does. I can drop $200 in Plex, buy a new character, outfit it with the best ships in the game, and go to town on day one. We're already there. The time to rage was then. We missed the bill. The day that they actively endorse the intention to offer something more powerful through ONLY Aurum that the rest of us can't reach, then I'll get irked. So let's see where it goes shrug Please forgive me random rambling. I've been at work for some time, sleepy, headache, etc, and don't care to proofread and write this up properly. Here is where your argument falls apart because like many you do not understand the nature of PLEX. It DOES NOT create items out of thin air, it DOES NOT give you free reign to have more powerful ships/mods than someone else, and most importantly you NEVER have to pay CCP for the privilege of flying a certain ship/mods/ammo. This crap will completely bypass the player economy, CCP WILL be paid by someone for every ship that is introduced into the GAME either by you or someone else, and people who can't grind that isk (1.3bil for a monocle FFS, how much is a ship?!)have no choice but to pay. You honestly think this won't create a imbalance? If that's your vision of EVE, where the economy doesn't matter, player skills (real ones not ingame ones) doesn't matter, just who has the most cash matters, then you can have it cause that's where CCP is going. I'll be leaving here, before the investors that CCP is beholden to ruin the game I've spent 5+ years investing time into so they can get a return on WoD and Dust.
Talsha Talamar Amarr Nebula Rasa Holdings Nebula Rasa	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:03:00 - [2446] Edited by: Talsha Talamar on 24/06/2011 08:03:14 Originally by: Isis Soryu Here is where your argument falls apart because like many you do not understand the nature of PLEX. The most important thing about PLEX is, that they create a win-win situation for all players involved. The PLEX->ISK guy gets the cash he needs for his expensive "Exotic Dancers", the ISK->PLEX>Subscription guy gets the opportunity to play eve without investing real life cash. During the month bought with an PLEX, the player using the PLEX for his subscription, gets the opportunity to destroy a multiple of the value of the PLEX in ships. I never had a problem with PLEX, even though I so far left every game that introduced RMT for good.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:03:00 - [2447] Originally by: Aesynil They're not stupid. They're not going to alienate their player-base or else they just lose money anyways. Too late. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Khamal Jolstien Caldari Sick Tight BricK sQuAD.	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:04:00 - [2448] Originally by: Jefferson H Clay Originally by: Khamal Jolstien Ok, so the time to act was when PLEX was introduced, We did. We raged, we discussed, we warned about the slippery slope. When uPLEX (it turns out a place holder for Aru or however its felt) first appeared on SiSi we discussed, we raged, we warned. Not going to troll you, but read back what I said exactly and who I was quoting. I'm 100% with you on this. I was pointing out a contradiction in someone else's post, where they said the time to act was when PLEX appeared, but then went on to say that they'll wait until someone can buy a powerful item for Aurum only before they get upset. Originally by: McKinlay When you get on the batphone and the only people left in the phone book are Aeternus and BLAST it might be time to hang up.
Cancel Align NOW	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:11:00 - [2449] Originally by: Black Dranzer Originally by: Arya Greywolf Fair enough, so why does CCP put her under the rug? Because that's her job; She's out there taking the flames because that's what she's paid to do. That doesn't mean she deserves the fire. It's just what she has to do. The best you can do is be polite to her and tell her that you want the blood of the people responsible, not the designated meat shield. 5 years of playing eve has taught me that to win you need to humiliate and mock the meat shield until it folds completely under the pressure before you can truly hit the main target.
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:14:00 - [2450] Originally by: Isis Soryu Both of you need to re-read this thread and read the Apology thread if you can't understand how this will negatively impact the game. Not only does it create a P2W game, it also completely cuts out the player economy. EQ2 is not EVE, this is a PVP game first and foremost, the minute RL cash directly* adds to your chances of winning the game is ***ed. (Just for the record I don't like plex either but it was either introduce them or continue to sell them on the forum like days of yore. At least it operates completely within the economy) All this from a player who seems so against change that he has refused to adopt a new style avatar and presumably therefore isn't even playing the current game? Seriously, I was like you a year or so ago. I honestly believed that rmt would kill the game I was playing. A year on, I don't partake of rmt in any shape or form but would have to admit that the effect is minimal (if that). The scenarios your side of the argument are putting forward....fleet fights being decided by rmt modules is laughable hysteria. If you are in an alliance that gets to that stage, finds themselves outgunned due to rmt (oh no, it could never be possible that the other team are just better than us) and don't have the corp funds available to buy them themselves then you're really just small beer I'm afraid. I'm sorry but rmt is the way ALL MMOs are going in the 21st century. It won't be a huge revenue stream for the devlopers but it will ease pressure on increasing subs generally for everyone. If you want to adopt the luddite stance and smash the machine for instigating change then go ahead, you will have no effect. This evolution of MMOs is insidious and unstoppable. Stay with it and attempt to influence further change from within or quit and have no affect whatsoever. Jumping up and down, crying and tossing your toys out the pram just makes you look like pre-adolescents unworthy of any attention whatsoever.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:18:00 - [2451] Originally by: Horace Nancyball Seriously, I was like you a year or so ago. I honestly believed that rmt would kill the game I was playing. Do you think CCP management being a complete bunch asshats might kill it instead? His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Dante024781 Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:24:00 - [2452] Isn't this the expansion that should have been called Exodus?
Jefferson H Clay	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:25:00 - [2453] Originally by: Khamal Jolstien I was pointing out a contradiction in someone else's post, where they said the time to act was when PLEX appeared, but then went on to say that they'll wait until someone can buy a powerful item for Aurum only before they get upset. The coffee... it hasn't kicked in yet. Sorry.
Norian Lonark Gallente Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:26:00 - [2454] Originally by: Horace Nancyball I'm sorry but rmt is the way ALL MMOs are going in the 21st century. It won't be a huge revenue stream for the devlopers but it will ease pressure on increasing subs generally for everyone. If you want to adopt the luddite stance and smash the machine for instigating change then go ahead, you will have no effect. This evolution of MMOs is insidious and unstoppable. Stay with it and attempt to influence further change from within or quit and have no affect whatsoever. Jumping up and down, crying and tossing your toys out the pram just makes you look like pre-adolescents unworthy of any attention whatsoever. This doesn't mean its right. EVE has built its success on being different to all the other MMO's EVE is growing and is still fresh. Incarna and Dust etc. are great opportunities for EVE to continue being different, innovative and increase its subscription base. RMT for P2W goes against the concept of EVE IMO.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:28:00 - [2455] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 24/06/2011 08:28:11 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqZcEwHBAk8 Maybe this will help CCP. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Olivor	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:29:00 - [2456] Originally by: In System T20 "Ghost" training And now this. Ignoring all the minor times you've screwed us around, of course. Fucking. Lovely. How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase? Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread. This post was made hours ago. Good job you're clearly reading the thread beyond page 5!
Mikal Morataya	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:31:00 - [2457] So CCP Penn, when are you addressing this?
Aesynil Caldari The Unit...	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:32:00 - [2458] The thing is...I agree. If they actively decided to sell faction standings, sell more powerful battleships with Aurum, or any of that, without getting rid of subscription costs...I think I'd be done with Eve. I would not pay $15 a month (Or it's equivalent in Plex's) on multiple accounts, then have to pay More just to be competitive. I don't see them directly saying that, though...They're saying they want to open more avenues of revenue up. They need to make money, okay. They use some semi-offensive language (Free-loaders)..whatever. This is the business side of things, not the sugar-coated PR we get. In all of your jobs, can you honestly tell me none of you talk of your customers/clients/whatever in a way they would not particularly like? It's not disrespect. It's nonformal dialogue. I suppose my rambling opinion on this whole thing..is that a lot of the arguments are...umm...Some type of logical fallacy. Straw man, maybe? People are building up a false statement, then attacking it. "CCP said we'd have to pay for sov!" "They called us freeloaders! (They didn't, they said the term for Dust..)" Or, interpreting things out of statements made, then attacking that. Let CCP get past the planning phase and put out what they're honestly going to do. Tell them in no uncertain terms what you think of those things. If they go through with something ridiculous like $100 for an exclusive super titan or $50 for SP speed boost or a +20% turret damage implant or something equally asinine, despite the protest and rage, then you can start with the suggestions that people should be fired, rage, torches and pitch-forks, etc, etc. Rage-quits and so forth. until then...Open a dialogue, talk it out, and make it clear with something respectful, not questioning their sanity and calling them various names. And please don't call me various names either? :( I don't like half of this stuff either, but a few months from now, if all of this turns out to be nothing, the people screaming the loudest are going to feel awfully silly. The people who made it clear to CCP what is and isn't acceptable will be e-heroes. And hopefully, we'll get back to pew-pewing internet spaceships and drama.
Goatse Girl	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:32:00 - [2459] time for soundwave to go and install someone competent who loves the game
Jai Jones	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:34:00 - [2460] Between T20, ghost trainning and all the other unecessary drama/cheating... I miss the "good old days" of just having pew pew fun. Of course I understand a buisness needs to make money but CCP, to be honest, your stink has the same odur as bankers in general. Your ****ing it up for the playerbase and were the ones paying for your mistakes. So like many, am voting with my sub
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:38:00 - [2461] Edited by: Isis Soryu on 24/06/2011 08:42:56 Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Isis Soryu Both of you need to re-read this thread and read the Apology thread if you can't understand how this will negatively impact the game. Not only does it create a P2W game, it also completely cuts out the player economy. EQ2 is not EVE, this is a PVP game first and foremost, the minute RL cash directly* adds to your chances of winning the game is ***ed. (Just for the record I don't like plex either but it was either introduce them or continue to sell them on the forum like days of yore. At least it operates completely within the economy) All this from a player who seems so against change that he has refused to adopt a new style avatar and presumably therefore isn't even playing the current game? Seriously, I was like you a year or so ago. I honestly believed that rmt would kill the game I was playing. A year on, I don't partake of rmt in any shape or form but would have to admit that the effect is minimal (if that). The scenarios your side of the argument are putting forward....fleet fights being decided by rmt modules is laughable hysteria. If you are in an alliance that gets to that stage, finds themselves outgunned due to rmt (oh no, it could never be possible that the other team are just better than us) and don't have the corp funds available to buy them themselves then you're really just small beer I'm afraid. I'm sorry but rmt is the way ALL MMOs are going in the 21st century. It won't be a huge revenue stream for the devlopers but it will ease pressure on increasing subs generally for everyone. If you want to adopt the luddite stance and smash the machine for instigating change then go ahead, you will have no effect. This evolution of MMOs is insidious and unstoppable. Stay with it and attempt to influence further change from within or quit and have no affect whatsoever. Jumping up and down, crying and tossing your toys out the pram just makes you look like pre-adolescents unworthy of any attention whatsoever. Nice ad hominem. I haven't done anything with the CQ or char creator on this account because I can't be bothered. My main has a new avatar, you'll find it in this very thread with the name Isil Rahsen, it's currently out of gametime and I have no plans to resub it or this char. (which isn't subbed either just FYI) If it's so hysterical that RMT mods and ships will have no effect then why are so many people against it? Why do people rail against FotM ships and unbalanced races? They'll be the same thing once CCP is done. FotM will be whatever the best ship/mods get put up on the RMT Cash Shop and anyone who can't compete will have to either outblob or spend the cash themselves. (Unless your a VERY VERY rich char going by the 1.3bil monocle prices.) The notion that anyone who can't afford the isk for NEX controlled ship/mod prices aren't worth considering is as laughable as the rest of your post. As for your second paragraph no other game has a P2P + P2W scheme. If CCP wants P2W then they should also go F2P. And just because the entire industry is going to MT then EVE must be too right? (It's not like they have two other games that already have MT designed in from the start in development or anything.) After this I should continue to pay them not once, but TWICE to be competitive? Your ****ed, and anyone who thinks like you is ****ed. I won't play any MMO with a P2W scheme on principle alone, but especially not after already paying a sub fee. If not paying for a game that is going a direction I don't like is throwing my "toys out on the pram" then so be it. At least I won't be paying these asshats twice for a game they can't be bothered to fix. EDIT: I feel I must preface this whole post with that even if they promise to never introduce "Items of Power" as they put it, I still won't be back because the trust is gone. They've lied not once but twice about MTs in EVE.
Glyken Touchon Gallente Independent Alchemists	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:40:00 - [2462] Edited by: Glyken Touchon on 24/06/2011 08:46:21 Originally by: Gwenywell Shumuku Originally by: bl3h Edited by: bl3h on 24/06/2011 05:27:14 Give CCP a break, they're just trying to maximize profit, something that a proper business should do. I bet most of the other MMO developers have this exact same discussion, but they just haven't been leaked And, that makes it better ...because? I agree with you, Gwenwyll. Basic rule is don't put anything down on paper/screen if it isn't suitable for public consumption. Been in a few companies where that was the rule and anything even slightly iffy was restricted to verbal informal meetings (not minuted). My previous comments on various threads have been fairly tame, but now that the newsletter has been confirmed to be legit, I don't really know what to say. A company newsletter has a wide distribution, and copies can easily go astray, so it was horrendously naive to think that this storm wouldn't kick off given the past history MTs have had with the players. At least Zynga are upfront about it. MT for cosmetics is fine, but I won't play a game that has MT pay to win. Eve hasn't reached that stage yet, but given the style of the game, I may as well get off now and not waste my time in the interim. If you say it won't happen, give me a reason to believe that the lead game designer won't implement his wishes. Lets look a bit deeper, with (maybe) a bit of tinfoil. This was the reason visibility of other players' standings was removed. All the fluff about performance was a blind. This is why the industry expansion never materialised- with MT ships/ammo, it would have been a waste of development time. Mining update- same. What else has been shelved because MTs would make it not viable? Originally by: sales pitch Why use all those clunky interfaces and spend hours mining, when for just one small payment, you can get the [item] of your dreams. CCP has also told it's customers that $50+ should be considered micro. So expect an increase in sub costs too, as it's just a small increase. MTs won't affect gameplay? It has already affected unrelated systems by having them removed and depriving them of development time. edit: Originally by: Algathas Joseph Gallo: June 2009 û Present (2 years 1 month) "As CFO of CCP Games, Joe oversees the financial positioning and reporting of CCP. He is also responsible for the strategic initiatives of the Company and relations with its investors." His previous work history: "Managing Director, Investment Banking Citigroup This explains a lot too. ______ When the forums asked CCP for transparency, we didn't mean the HUD...
Sellendis Caldari The Ares project	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:42:00 - [2463] I still wonder how they missed one thing? Buying a license to shoot anyone in hisec without concord getting involved. :) Since noble ammo/ships/standing was in plans...wonder if this was also. For 100 plex (just guessing) you could shoot anyone you like to, and if they want to shoot ya back, they need to pay 100 plex also. Breaking aggro mechanics, lol. Who cares, license + monocle = happy (rich) customer.
Lamparski	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:46:00 - [2464] So its real, Ive been reading the forums for a couple hours now and its really sad that Eve is at a great cross roads that could see a lot of veterans leave.
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:46:00 - [2465] Originally by: Sellendis I still wonder how they missed one thing? Buying a license to shoot anyone in hisec without concord getting involved. :) Since noble ammo/ships/standing was in plans...wonder if this was also. This is already in the game with the exception of NPC corps. Sell some PLEX, use ISK to pay for a wardec. Easy :-)
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:46:00 - [2466] Edited by: HeIIfire11 on 24/06/2011 08:47:02 Oh noooo!!! What did I miss I lost my page..and there's a new threadnaught already!! Anyone seen my pitchfork? And Miilla was right about Friday
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:55:00 - [2467] Originally by: Lamparski So its real, Ive been reading the forums for a couple hours now and its really sad that Eve is at a great cross roads that could see a lot of veterans leave. Keep reading. Not cross-roads. A culdesac, a dead-end. No "could". "has". His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Sellendis Caldari The Ares project	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:56:00 - [2468] Originally by: Saving Face Originally by: Sellendis I still wonder how they missed one thing? Buying a license to shoot anyone in hisec without concord getting involved. :) Since noble ammo/ships/standing was in plans...wonder if this was also. This is already in the game with the exception of NPC corps. Sell some PLEX, use ISK to pay for a wardec. Easy :-) But that is not game-breaking mechanics. This way you could shoot anyone and not need a wardec for it. Its a one man license to kill. And i got a better one to go with it, license to fly a supercap in hisec. Why not? Would make Jita flood with tears :)
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 08:57:00 - [2469] Originally by: Sellendis Originally by: Saving Face Originally by: Sellendis I still wonder how they missed one thing? Buying a license to shoot anyone in hisec without concord getting involved. :) Since noble ammo/ships/standing was in plans...wonder if this was also. This is already in the game with the exception of NPC corps. Sell some PLEX, use ISK to pay for a wardec. Easy :-) But that is not game-breaking mechanics. This way you could shoot anyone and not need a wardec for it. Its a one man license to kill. And i got a better one to go with it, license to fly a supercap in hisec. Why not? Would make Jita flood with tears :) Haha, why not?
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:29:00 - [2470] bump
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:47:00 - [2471] Looks like were done here boys...pack it up. Those leaving..now's the time. See you on the other side with a lightsaber in my hand.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:48:00 - [2472] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Looks like were done here boys...pack it up. Those leaving..now's the time. See you on the other side with a lightsaber in my hand. I think this is my last MMO for a long while.
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:50:00 - [2473] Originally by: HeIIfire11 Looks like were done here boys...pack it up. Those leaving..now's the time. See you on the other side with a lightsaber in my hand. Not until CCP delete the threads and round 2 starts. Some of us still have months of subscription time left. :-) His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 09:56:00 - [2474] Eve: The worlds EMPTYEST game universe
Justin Cody Caldari T.A.L.O.N. Company	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:06:00 - [2475] CCP Soundwave's problem is that he understands that we don't want the sh*t he's shoveling and YET he thinks it should be shoveled anyhow...straight down our throats whether we like it or not. I think he underestimates (MASSIVELY) how much our revenues contribute to his ability to drunkenly author stupid opinions. He may have a right to his opinions...but hey opinions are like that thing poop tumbles out of...everybody has em...even our EVE characters (I think). And sometimes he should just have the better mind to STFU and GBTW. Remind people that profit is the difference between revenue and expense. This makes you look smart. Scott Adams
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:14:00 - [2476] Well, since we can't take CCP or the Eve game seriously anymore, may aswell have fun during the SELF DESTRUCT phase :) No point in getting all miserable over it.. Have fun, while it lasts. Just a different kind of fun :) For every new feature they want, just nod and say yes its awesome. Screw em. Because they wont listen to anything other than their way. The Frank Sinatra business model, "I'll do it MY way..." They are the people that will have to face the LAYOFFS not us.
Dok Klick	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:15:00 - [2477] Ganz einfache Rechnung: Entweder ich kann die alte UI in der Station wieder einschalten, oder CCP sieht KEIN GELD mehr von mir.
Justin Cody Caldari T.A.L.O.N. Company	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:18:00 - [2478] The shame is that we can't gank him on TQ to the point of violating the EULA. Remind people that profit is the difference between revenue and expense. This makes you look smart. Scott Adams
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:23:00 - [2479] I never got to experience any MMO company self destructions before Now I am right in it :) It's awesome fun to see a company destroy itself, really it is, The fun part is, the people running the company just cannot see it. The next thing on my list of TODO's is to watch a real life train wreck to compare it.
Demure Guise	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:27:00 - [2480] I was there during the Hellgate debacle. This looks and sounds very similar, but without the "Failboat" meme.
Nishachara Special Operations Corp Mortal Destruction	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:31:00 - [2481] Edited by: Nishachara on 24/06/2011 10:31:31 Oh shut up Miilla ... You are only showing your immaturity and idiotism... And at worst you are hindering the community to be taken seriously by the CCP...
Miilla Minmatar Hulkageddon Orphanage	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:32:00 - [2482] Originally by: Nishachara Edited by: Nishachara on 24/06/2011 10:31:31 Oh shut up Miilla ... You are only showing your immaturity and idiotism... And at worst you are hindering the community to be taken seriously by the CCP... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA ↑
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:32:00 - [2483] is this thread dying now the so called apology and parley one is up
Coarl Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:32:00 - [2484] Originally by: Horace Nancyball tl;dr I'm pretty sure that if RMT ever goes beyond "vanity items" it is unlikely to imbalance the null sec game but rather the "pve WoW brigade" so who cares? The EVE universe is big enough to let you avoid the fully rmt officer fitted faction battleships mining for trit. You literally know nothing of how eve works if that's what you think. Either biomass your toon and start again, only this time actually work through the entire tutorial. OR Have a loong hard think about how extra shiny ships in empire will get used in nullsec. (PL's T3 fleets anyone?). Changes to highsec = changes everywhere, it's the same server universe you clown!
Akira Samposeppa Gallente Arthashastra	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:45:00 - [2485] Maybe it would be the best if we all dont log in after dt as a sign of protest until ccp explains the leaked memo.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:58:00 - [2486] Originally by: Akira Samposeppa Maybe it would be the best if we all dont log in after dt as a sign of protest until ccp explains the leaked memo. Best way to protest is with your wallet. Cancel your sub if it means something to you.
Kyang Tia	Posted - 2011.06.24 10:58:00 - [2487] I'm sure everything has been said on 80 pages that i didn't bother reading. Just one thing: If microtransactions for non-vanity items are introduced to EVE, i will cancel my subscription. I won't accept it, and if this is "the future of gaming", then this future will happen without me.
Titmando Caldari Wildly Inappropriate Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:06:00 - [2488] TL;DR Someone might of said this but micro-transactions or not, they are not forcing you to buy the monocle or those blue suede shoes. Let them introduce it continue to play eve and they'll probably realize how bad it is when the numbers come in. No need to EMO-RAGE quit because of a change! not an exactly gameplay-limiting change is it now? Or am I missing something? -T I <3 carebear's "let's poo in their cornflakes.."
Akira Samposeppa Gallente Arthashastra	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:08:00 - [2489] Originally by: Isis Soryu Best way to protest is with your wallet. Cancel your sub if it means something to you. Oh its already canceled, and it runs out in 20 days or so. Maybe ill renew it with a plex/gtc if things start looking a bit better, but as things stand i wont. But, i wont pay $ until i am sure that ill play this game (and like it) for years to come and that game wont become money grab PTW, MT, piece of carp.
leth ghost	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:09:00 - [2490] Originally by: Titmando TL;DR Someone might of said this but micro-transactions or not, they are not forcing you to buy the monocle or those blue suede shoes. Let them introduce it continue to play eve and they'll probably realize how bad it is when the numbers come in. No need to EMO-RAGE quit because of a change! not an exactly gameplay-limiting change is it now? Or am I missing something? the news letter ?
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:12:00 - [2491] Originally by: Titmando TL;DR Someone might of said this but micro-transactions or not, they are not forcing you to buy the monocle or those blue suede shoes. Let them introduce it continue to play eve and they'll probably realize how bad it is when the numbers come in. No need to EMO-RAGE quit because of a change! not an exactly gameplay-limiting change is it now? Or am I missing something? READ THE THREAD FFS
Vim Spiritus Draconis	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:14:00 - [2492] Wow. Lots of rage here. What is the problem? An internal document meant to cause discussion about mt? I realy don't see the issue here, 'Greed is good?' see that questionmark on the cover? Not 'Greed is good' as is qouted. Talks about expendeble aur boosters for dust. Oone whacky guy being all pro everything thats got to do with microtransactions, one not as keen. One guy, hellokitten the sponsor of hulkageddon, got banned and makes people go into rage mode to support him more then over this document as I read this thread. Can I have all your stuff, you that are quitting. I would get so rich :D
Miep Miep	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:15:00 - [2493] Edited by: Miep Miep on 24/06/2011 11:16:06 While i enjoy the drama and the show... i somehow dont care anymore. Had a nice time o7, heared thats something with laser swords and stuff coming out, cya there.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:15:00 - [2494] Originally by: Vim Wow. Lots of rage here. What is the problem? An internal document meant to cause discussion about mt? I realy don't see the issue here, 'Greed is good?' see that questionmark on the cover? Not 'Greed is good' as is qouted. Talks about expendeble aur boosters for dust. Oone whacky guy being all pro everything thats got to do with microtransactions, one not as keen. One guy, hellokitten the sponsor of hulkageddon, got banned and makes people go into rage mode to support him more then over this document as I read this thread. Can I have all your stuff, you that are quitting. I would get so rich :D You can't read. CCP Soundwave goes into great detail about offering "Items of Power" aka non-vanity items in EVE.
Vim Spiritus Draconis	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:20:00 - [2495] Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Vim Wow. Lots of rage here. What is the problem? An internal document meant to cause discussion about mt? I realy don't see the issue here, 'Greed is good?' see that questionmark on the cover? Not 'Greed is good' as is qouted. Talks about expendeble aur boosters for dust. Oone whacky guy being all pro everything thats got to do with microtransactions, one not as keen. One guy, hellokitten the sponsor of hulkageddon, got banned and makes people go into rage mode to support him more then over this document as I read this thread. Can I have all your stuff, you that are quitting. I would get so rich :D You can't read. CCP Soundwave goes into great detail about offering "Items of Power" aka non-vanity items in EVE. I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A?
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:22:00 - [2496] Originally by: Vim Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Vim Wow. Lots of rage here. What is the problem? An internal document meant to cause discussion about mt? I realy don't see the issue here, 'Greed is good?' see that questionmark on the cover? Not 'Greed is good' as is qouted. Talks about expendeble aur boosters for dust. Oone whacky guy being all pro everything thats got to do with microtransactions, one not as keen. One guy, hellokitten the sponsor of hulkageddon, got banned and makes people go into rage mode to support him more then over this document as I read this thread. Can I have all your stuff, you that are quitting. I would get so rich :D You can't read. CCP Soundwave goes into great detail about offering "Items of Power" aka non-vanity items in EVE. I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? You've missed the part where Soundwave is Lead Design and Diagoras is the CSM to CCP rep and a stats guy? Who do you think pulls more weight in the decision making structure? Seleene from the current CSM (formerly CCP Abathur) has also commented on how often things "discussed" in Fearless end up as policy.
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:33:00 - [2497] Originally by: Vim Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Vim Wow. Lots of rage here. What is the problem? An internal document meant to cause discussion about mt? I realy don't see the issue here, 'Greed is good?' see that questionmark on the cover? Not 'Greed is good' as is qouted. Talks about expendeble aur boosters for dust. Oone whacky guy being all pro everything thats got to do with microtransactions, one not as keen. One guy, hellokitten the sponsor of hulkageddon, got banned and makes people go into rage mode to support him more then over this document as I read this thread. Can I have all your stuff, you that are quitting. I would get so rich :D You can't read. CCP Soundwave goes into great detail about offering "Items of Power" aka non-vanity items in EVE. I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? Its just thoughtss but as in RL.. if i see someone with a gun pointing in my direction i dont wat till he pull the Trigger, i start to scream immediately hrhr. No i dont ragequit now but i use the only thing i have.. this forum to tell them what i think about. And the Moment they dont listen and bringg in those stuff, i will hit the cancle button.
Teako	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:36:00 - [2498] CCP is just so decoupled from their own game its sad. Some pricks like CCP Soundwave thought they was the gods and could do anything. I wonder how many layoffs at CCP this little mistake will cost. 30? 50? People. Will the responsible ******s be included?
Vim Spiritus Draconis	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:37:00 - [2499] Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Vim Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Vim Wow. Lots of rage here. What is the problem? An internal document meant to cause discussion about mt? I realy don't see the issue here, 'Greed is good?' see that questionmark on the cover? Not 'Greed is good' as is qouted. Talks about expendeble aur boosters for dust. Oone whacky guy being all pro everything thats got to do with microtransactions, one not as keen. One guy, hellokitten the sponsor of hulkageddon, got banned and makes people go into rage mode to support him more then over this document as I read this thread. Can I have all your stuff, you that are quitting. I would get so rich :D You can't read. CCP Soundwave goes into great detail about offering "Items of Power" aka non-vanity items in EVE. I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? You've missed the part where Soundwave is Lead Design and Diagoras is the CSM to CCP rep and a stats guy? Who do you think pulls more weight in the decision making structure? Seleene from the current CSM (formerly CCP Abathur) has also commented on how often things "discussed" in Fearless end up as policy. If thoose outrageous ideas he is presenting (damn good character acting that soundwave A- for taking an extreme point of view in a debate document and act as gordon gekko himself(strange, I wonder if thats the intent with calling it the gordon gekko edition)) about selling ingame items that benefit ship pewpew and standing gains; I would be a dramaticly sad panda and abandon ship. I'll rather see it as nothing but a debate document to create an inhouse stir; probably mostly aimed to get ideas for blingbling out of DUST and WoD. I dont care if WoD & Dust is microtransactionarcadia. But as I said, should they indeed introduce non vanity(not clothes, furniture, ship paintjobs, etc etc) ,I would be sad and take my money elsewhere. Till that actually happens, pewpew =)
skepsiss	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:37:00 - [2500] Can't believe I activated both my accounts right before this. Oh well, time to put past into past. And thinking I really wanted to buy a PS3 from that ****hole of a company that is Sony, just to play Dust. That being said, good luck with your future crap, CCP.
mvrck22	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:39:00 - [2501] http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065&page=95#2830 Originally by: Trebor Daehdoow Originally by: Clone Whisper It's not fair to [the CSM] to be elected and than be forbidden to communicate with the people they are representing about what's going on behind the screens. I say, truely make the CSM the voice of the community tehy are suposed to represent and stop having them be barricaded in their movement to do their jobs. We try and communicate with the players as much as possible. Sure, there are some things that are NDA, and (alas) there are things like the virtual goods pricing strategy (or, for that manner, <insert recent CCP screwup here>) where CSM was simply not consulted. But outside of those limitations, we do the best we can. Similarly, we convey both our personal opinions and player opinions to people in CCP. Some are receptive to the outside perspective, some are not. As for what you should do to best express your opinion of recent events in New Eden, all I can tell you is that CCP pays more attention to what you do than what you say.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:42:00 - [2502] Edited by: Isis Soryu on 24/06/2011 11:42:05 Originally by: Vim Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Vim I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? You've missed the part where Soundwave is Lead Design and Diagoras is the CSM to CCP rep and a stats guy? Who do you think pulls more weight in the decision making structure? Seleene from the current CSM (formerly CCP Abathur) has also commented on how often things "discussed" in Fearless end up as policy. If thoose outrageous ideas he is presenting (damn good character acting that soundwave A- for taking an extreme point of view in a debate document and act as gordon gekko himself(strange, I wonder if thats the intent with calling it the gordon gekko edition)) about selling ingame items that benefit ship pewpew and standing gains; I would be a dramaticly sad panda and abandon ship. I'll rather see it as nothing but a debate document to create an inhouse stir; probably mostly aimed to get ideas for blingbling out of DUST and WoD. I dont care if WoD & Dust is microtransactionarcadia. But as I said, should they indeed introduce non vanity(not clothes, furniture, ship paintjobs, etc etc) ,I would be sad and take my money elsewhere. Till that actually happens, pewpew =) Look I'd love to be wrong, but my faith in CCP is gone. They lied once about MT being introduced and I'll be damned if I'll let them do it to me a second time.
Bloody2k Gallente ZERO T0LERANCE RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:42:00 - [2503] On the one hand, it is appalling - on the other hand this document shows how piggishness destroy human virtues. The unfavourable and malign approach at the opposite to the eve player community, destroy the last piece of credit in CCP. That EVE-ONLINE is a game for the community - that is long time ago. There was a time, I was very proud to be a part of the EVE player community, because it was a aweful gamedesign. EVE was a game for player - that was my impression and not built, to milk the player communitys money. CCP - are you aware of the treasure, the EVE community elevate from all other existing MMO's? You are destroying the base why EVE isn't fade since all these years. CCP - there is just one way to get last credit back! CCP - this community wont mess around 1. END MICROTRANSACTIONS NOW, END MICROTRANSACTIONS BETTER TODAY THAN TOMORROW! Einmal mit Profis!
enderhexfyre Gallente D00M. Northern Coalition.	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:44:00 - [2504] Moooooooooo milking us for the cows we are Killboard Link
Binary Broker	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:47:00 - [2505] I hate this. 9 days and counting..
Vaerah Vahrokha Minmatar Vahrokh Consulting	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:52:00 - [2506] From the leaked doc: We are FEARLESS If you are fearless why do you write you have to keep it hidden? Fearful people cower up. Auditing \| Research \| 3rd Party \| Collateral Holding \| EvE RL Charity
Megumi Yumiko	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:53:00 - [2507] think its time ccp comes with there idea's about it for the future to make sure or eve dies in a week or 2 or it survives hehe
Vandrion Gallente The Collective B O R G	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:53:00 - [2508] Qouted from the Beginnings Blog on the Dust514 site: "DUST 514 will, as EVE Online does, have a dynamic virtual economy and market that offers the tools that will give you a competitive edge, when used skillfully. Players are able to purchase different gear to equip before deploying into battle, using InterStellar Kredits (ISK), the in-game earned currency of the EVE universe, or through real money currency, called Aurum (AUR). This provides players with flexibility and adaptability in how they approach a combat scenario. Certain items are only available through ISK transactions, while others are only available through AUR. These are then traded freely on a player-driven secondary marketplace." So... CCP is including AUR in DUST which further ties it into Eve and explains why CCP isn't listening to the feedback from the players. http://www.dust514.com/en/news/?article=1980 "RPS: So, if IÆm an EVE player, how is my game going to change after DUST is released? Torfi: Well, you have the ability to be more strategic when you are conquering planets and solar systems, in nulsec. Those are the main touchpoints. Highsec carebears need not worry. The same for lowsec. The main touchpoint upon the launch of DUST, will be in nulsec, will be in sovereignty, will be in inflicting damage and destruction and death upon your enemies, destroying their infrastructure and their means to survive, either by means or scorched earth or by stealing their installations on the surfaces of planets. There will be more going on on the surfaces of planets. WeÆve introduced mechanics allowing people to manufacture goods on the planets, but planets will play a more pivotal role in sovereignty mechanics further down the line." Snippet of the RPS interview on Dust 514 So not only will the dust players spend RL cash to buy an advantage in their game, they will be using that RL cash purchase to buy an advantage in OUR sov warfare. MT is here to stay folks...
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:53:00 - [2509] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 24/06/2011 11:56:13 Originally by: Akira Samposeppa Maybe it would be the best if we all dont log in after dt as a sign of protest until ccp explains the leaked memo. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cascading_failure Login means nothing now. edit: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=failure%20cascade probably better cite. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Azahni Vah'nos Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.24 11:54:00 - [2510] Now there must be people from the medical profession who play EvE that can answer this: What's the cure for 'Sparkle Pony Syndrome' that some individuals at CCP seem to have contracted? A highly contagious desease that seems to be going around the MMO developers at the moment.
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:05:00 - [2511] Originally by: Isis Soryu Nice ad hominem. I haven't done anything with the CQ or char creator on this account because I can't be bothered. My main has a new avatar, you'll find it in this very thread with the name Isil Rahsen, it's currently out of gametime and I have no plans to resub it or this char. (which isn't subbed either just FYI) If it's so hysterical that RMT mods and ships will have no effect then why are so many people against it? Why do people rail against FotM ships and unbalanced races? They'll be the same thing once CCP is done. FotM will be whatever the best ship/mods get put up on the RMT Cash Shop and anyone who can't compete will have to either outblob or spend the cash themselves. (Unless your a VERY VERY rich char going by the 1.3bil monocle prices.) The notion that anyone who can't afford the isk for NEX controlled ship/mod prices aren't worth considering is as laughable as the rest of your post. /quote] So, basically, you aren't actually playing the game. You don't actually have first hand knowledge of what the current situation plays out like, let alone what may or may not appear in the future (any more than I do). You're really just reacting to the hysteria...contagious isn't it? Like I said in my post I reacted a year ago EXACTLY as you are are now. Subsequent events have shown my reaction to be wholly out of proportion. The world goes on spinning. The thing I learned? "Plus ta change, plus c'est la mOme chose"
DeadDuck Amarr Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:07:00 - [2512] Originally by: Vandrion So not only will the dust players spend RL cash to buy an advantage in their game, they will be using that RL cash purchase to buy an advantage in OUR sov warfare. TBH I'm not worried with Dust Interaction. That game life expectancy is what ? 1-2 years? It's a FPS, as soon the new hot thing comes to market, bye bye Dust. Strength and Honour
Selene D'Celeste Caldari The D'Celeste Trading Company ISK Six	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:11:00 - [2513] Originally by: Vim I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? The fact that such options are even on the table is not acceptable. ______________________________
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:14:00 - [2514] Quote: So, basically, you aren't actually playing the game. You don't actually have first hand knowledge of what the current situation plays out like, let alone what may or may not appear in the future (any more than I do). You're really just reacting to the hysteria...contagious isn't it? Like I said in my post I reacted a year ago EXACTLY as you are are now. Subsequent events have shown my reaction to be wholly out of proportion. The world goes on spinning. The thing I learned? "Plus ta change, plus c'est la mOme chose" You're ******ed. Literally brain damaged. How recent would I have to have been subbed for my opinion to matter then? 1 day ago perhaps? A week? Your whole argument boils down to "You aren't subbed you don't matter trolololol" I've played this game for 5+ years and I know perfectly well what will happen. CCP will add in their non-vanity items, they will have an advantage to entice buyers, and then they will become FotM just like anything that is better than something else. Just like lasers and just like projectiles after them. Only this time you'll get to pay for it. Keep on trolling though, your so far out of touch I have no interest in talking to you.
Reed Tiburon Caldari Future Corps Sleeper Social Club	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:15:00 - [2515] It's done. It's over. The rats left the ship long ago. Now the passengers are taking to the lifeboats while the captain's clutching the wheel, singing sea shanties the whole way down. --- R.I.P. EVE ONLINE [img]ht
Chesty McJubblies Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:16:00 - [2516] Originally by: Khira Kitamatsu Originally by: Miilla CCP are going to TRY and be greedy, we see that now, in the AUR prices for vanity items. They WILL SUCCEED, if you let them, and you let them by buying the items. There is only one way to prevent it succeeding, don't buy them. Or would you prefer to play Entropia? Hey Miilla quit all ready. Your incessant whining is like the droning of a katydid. Anyone with even a 1/4 of a brain can see this is fake and not real. Look at all the grammatical and spelling errors. lolpwnt ----------------------------------------
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:18:00 - [2517] Originally by: Coarl You literally know nothing of how eve works if that's what you think. Either biomass your toon and start again, only this time actually work through the entire tutorial. OR Have a loong hard think about how extra shiny ships in empire will get used in nullsec. (PL's T3 fleets anyone?). Changes to highsec = changes everywhere, it's the same server universe you clown! My point was that those people flying around in T3s will (or at least should) have those fits anyway. The people actually needing uber mods will have the isk to obtain them one way or another anyway. The first time I see a fully officer fitted Bantam cruising around hi-sec taking out rats I will just laugh in your face.
Vim Spiritus Draconis	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:22:00 - [2518] Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Vim I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? The fact that such options are even on the table is not acceptable. Are they realy on the table, not just standpoints for causing inhouse stir? They are on the table to cause debate, they are on the table to implement in DUST and WoD. They are on the table to blatantly slap people with the worst ever for EvE ideas; in an inhouse document meant to cause a debate/stir. And this is the lead designer presenting the worst things? I'am happy he knows EvE good enough to know what would be tremendously bad and argue for it to cause debate. Just look at the rage in this thread, that is testament that he knows precisely what bad ideas are.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:24:00 - [2519] Originally by: Vim Originally by: Selene D'Celeste Originally by: Vim I read that. That is the guy having the all pro transactions arguments. I can take and debate a pro whale hunting opinion if I'am to cause debate and reflection. Without supporting it even slightly. What is the problem with people having a document containing a debate with to blatant arguments like taken from retorics A? The fact that such options are even on the table is not acceptable. Are they realy on the table, not just standpoints for causing inhouse stir? They are on the table to cause debate, they are on the table to implement in DUST and WoD. They are on the table to blatantly slap people with the worst ever for EvE ideas; in an inhouse document meant to cause a debate/stir. And this is the lead designer presenting the worst things? I'am happy he knows EvE good enough to know what would be tremendously bad and argue for it to cause debate. Just look at the rage in this thread, that is testament that he knows precisely what bad ideas are. It's nice that you can keep the faith up.
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:27:00 - [2520] Originally by: Isis Soryu You're ******ed. Literally brain damaged. How recent would I have to have been subbed for my opinion to matter then? 1 day ago perhaps? A week? Your whole argument boils down to "You aren't subbed you don't matter trolololol" I've played this game for 5+ years and I know perfectly well what will happen. CCP will add in their non-vanity items, they will have an advantage to entice buyers, and then they will become FotM just like anything that is better than something else. Just like lasers and just like projectiles after them. Only this time you'll get to pay for it. Keep on trolling though, your so far out of touch I have no interest in talking to you. Wow....and when I say "wow" I mean I assume that is where you come from? You know SO much don't you? You can actually see into the future? You really must be so rich winning the lottery week after week? Like I said. When you can discuss the current game situation with first hand knowledge and not fuelled by a bin load of second hand adolescent emo-rage then maybe your rhetoric will have a little more substance.
Isis Soryu Caldari Universitas Interimo Research	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:30:00 - [2521] Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Isis Soryu You're ******ed. Literally brain damaged. How recent would I have to have been subbed for my opinion to matter then? 1 day ago perhaps? A week? Your whole argument boils down to "You aren't subbed you don't matter trolololol" I've played this game for 5+ years and I know perfectly well what will happen. CCP will add in their non-vanity items, they will have an advantage to entice buyers, and then they will become FotM just like anything that is better than something else. Just like lasers and just like projectiles after them. Only this time you'll get to pay for it. Keep on trolling though, your so far out of touch I have no interest in talking to you. Wow....and when I say "wow" I mean I assume that is where you come from? You know SO much don't you? You can actually see into the future? You really must be so rich winning the lottery week after week? Like I said. When you can discuss the current game situation with first hand knowledge and not fuelled by a bin load of second hand adolescent emo-rage then maybe your rhetoric will have a little more substance. Keep trollin, maybe someone else will bite.
Morgan Polaris	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:35:00 - [2522] Originally by: Isis Soryu Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Isis Soryu You're ****ed. Literally brain damaged. How recent would I have to have been subbed for my opinion to matter then? 1 day ago perhaps? A week? Your whole argument boils down to "You aren't subbed you don't matter trolololol" I've played this game for 5+ years and I know perfectly well what will happen. CCP will add in their non-vanity items, they will have an advantage to entice buyers, and then they will become FotM just like anything that is better than something else. Just like lasers and just like projectiles after them. Only this time you'll get to pay for it. Keep on trolling though, your so far out of touch I have no interest in talking to you. Wow....and when I say "wow" I mean I assume that is where you come from? You know SO much don't you? You can actually see into the future? You really must be so rich winning the lottery week after week? Like I said. When you can discuss the current game situation with first hand knowledge and not fuelled by a bin load of second hand adolescent emo-rage then maybe your rhetoric will have a little more substance. Keep trollin, maybe someone else will bite. It's hard to say this with a straight face... Keep it on topic guys. Free Helicity Boson!** \| Donations accepted: 1BpQEYT7aSUNM863BV67FPxyv1cpxr74uu
HLF No45678 Station Dwellers	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:35:00 - [2523] Remeber SWG and NGE? History teaches nothing.
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:36:00 - [2524] Originally by: Isis Soryu Keep trollin, maybe someone else will bite. Intolerant of others' points of view. Inability to form a coherent argument without resorting to personal insults. Speaking from a base of no knowledge whatsoever and extrapolating hysterically. Oh dear. Just as well you've left the game.
Dantes Wolf Caldari i-Pos	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:48:00 - [2525] Everything that is alive is raw and wild - and you just killed EVE by making a domesticated skull****ed who.re of her. :( [...] and the wolf was cursed, so the more it ate, the hungrier it went.. Dante alighieri
HeIIfire11	Posted - 2011.06.24 12:51:00 - [2526] Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Isis Soryu Keep trollin, maybe someone else will bite. Intolerant of others' points of view. Inability to form a coherent argument without resorting to personal insults. Speaking from a base of no knowledge whatsoever and extrapolating hysterically. Oh dear. Just as well you've left the game. I'll bite...
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:11:00 - [2527] Holy ****, I go away for a while and come back to find a 120 pages long 'apology' thread. Anyone care to summarize it? Miilla? Anyone?
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:12:00 - [2528] Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 24/06/2011 13:13:07 Originally by: Tla Atij Holy ****, I go away for a while and come back to find a 120 pages long 'apology' thread. Anyone care to summarize it? Miilla? Anyone? The video in the sig. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Bloody2k Gallente ZERO T0LERANCE RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:13:00 - [2529] I think CCP is paralysed! Go, go, go community! Einmal mit Profis!
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:14:00 - [2530] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 24/06/2011 13:13:07 Originally by: Tla Atij Holy ****, I go away for a while and come back to find a 120 pages long 'apology' thread. Anyone care to summarize it? Miilla? Anyone? The video in the sig. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Saw that yesterday, made me chuckle.
Lederstrumpf	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:15:00 - [2531] Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Originally by: Liza la'fabre 1.4Bil isk for a god-damn monocle!? really is the economy that bad in iceland after the Landsbanki debacle. Bj÷rg=lfur Thor Bj÷rg=lfsson = Landsbanki = Novator Partners = CCPGames Picture getting clearer? Thanks! Yes, indeed. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novator_Partners == snip == The owner or owners of Novator are hiding behind a web of companies which includes companies in places such as Cyprus, Cayman Islands, Delaware, Gibraltar, Tortola (British Virgin Islands), and Luxembourg. Investigations published in Denmark suggest that the underlying companies are linked to Russian companies == snip ==
Foralai Altrus	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:15:00 - [2532] Originally by: Tla Atij Holy ****, I go away for a while and come back to find a 120 pages long 'apology' thread. Anyone care to summarize it? Miilla? Anyone? The newsletter is real and legit They don't want to answer the question on plans to release more than 'vanity' items in the MT store They are in panic mode, only time they come out with the PR force like this is when accounts drop fast
Tla Atij	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:19:00 - [2533] Originally by: Foralai Altrus Originally by: Tla Atij Holy ***, I go away for a while and come back to find a 120 pages long 'apology' thread. Anyone care to summarize it? Miilla? Anyone? The newsletter is real and legit They don't want to answer the question on plans to release more than 'vanity' items in the MT store They are in panic mode, only time they come out with the PR force like this is when accounts drop fast Thanks. Now... where's my pitchfork... goes to apology thread*
Constantinus Maximus Paxian Expeditionary Force	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:23:00 - [2534] Originally by: Tla Atij Originally by: Constantinus Maximus Edited by: Constantinus Maximus on 24/06/2011 13:13:07 Originally by: Tla Atij Holy ****, I go away for a while and come back to find a 120 pages long 'apology' thread. Anyone care to summarize it? Miilla? Anyone? The video in the sig. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Saw that yesterday, made me chuckle. It's a very accurate depiction of the detail and subtlety of the situation. Obviously someone who has been around the CSM/employees and stuff for a good while. His name was John Turbefield! Truth. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4YHvtEJgBc Best brief on the details. FREE HELICITY
Solidaridad	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:45:00 - [2535] R.I.P.
Rasz Lin Caldari Uitraan Diversified Holdings Incorporated	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:50:00 - [2536] CCP:
Coarl Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:58:00 - [2537] Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Coarl You literally know nothing of how eve works if that's what you think. Either biomass your toon and start again, only this time actually work through the entire tutorial. OR Have a loong hard think about how extra shiny ships in empire will get used in nullsec. (PL's T3 fleets anyone?). Changes to highsec = changes everywhere, it's the same server universe you clown! My point was that those people flying around in T3s will (or at least should) have those fits anyway. The people actually needing uber mods will have the isk to obtain them one way or another anyway. The first time I see a fully officer fitted Bantam cruising around hi-sec taking out rats I will just laugh in your face. And my point is that at the moment, the playing field is pretty 'level' regarding the shiny **** you fly: ships, mods, ammo are all available to you in the ingame market for isk acquired either through gameplay or PLEX/GTC trading. Once you introduce a higher tier of items whereby people with the fatter RL wallet can BUY an advantage over and above what you can currently get from the ingame market then that will be when the game crashes and burns. Those raging about these proposed changes now are doing so in the vain hope that ccp actually listen and pay heed to the 5h1tstorm they are about to unleash before it's too late. Nice attempt at the trolling officer fitted bantam btw. If you succeed in griefing that 5hit from some clueless AUR asshat, i will be the first to applaud your fat lewts and laugh loudly at the killboard link (and affected pilot).
Mag Theron Open University of Celestial Hardship Art of War Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 13:59:00 - [2538] Originally by: Rasz Lin CCP: Wow, that made me laugh so hard...
Lederstrumpf	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:07:00 - [2539] Originally by: Miilla At this stage; I am past caring and just having FUN at CCP's expense now. Its the NEW GAME! How long will it take until sandbox scammers become real life money traders ?
Shintai Gallente Arx Io Orbital Factories Arx Io	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:21:00 - [2540] Originally by: HLF No45678 Remeber SWG and NGE? History teaches nothing. It teaches that ÇÇP didnt survieve evolution. Darwin won again. -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Tarasina	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:22:00 - [2541] Edited by: Tarasina on 24/06/2011 14:25:29 Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Isis Soryu Keep trollin, maybe someone else will bite. Intolerant of others' points of view. Inability to form a coherent argument without resorting to personal insults. Speaking from a base of no knowledge whatsoever and extrapolating hysterically. Oh dear. Just as well you've left the game. Isis learned from the best, Fox news, CNN etc etc, list goes on.
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:29:00 - [2542] 2ndpagenotyet
Algathas The Revenge of Auntie Freeze	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:38:00 - [2543] Originally by: Glyken Touchon Originally by: Algathas Joseph Gallo: June 2009 û Present (2 years 1 month) "As CFO of CCP Games, Joe oversees the financial positioning and reporting of CCP. He is also responsible for the strategic initiatives of the Company and relations with its investors." His previous work history: "Managing Director, Investment Banking Citigroup This explains a lot too. I worked to help build a company IRL which was eventually sold to a publicly traded company. I ended up in a management position right below the C level people in this company. Before we sold to them, our ideals were to build a great company and it would speak for itself, causing the money to come in and our clients to love us. After we were merged with the publicly traded company the company ended up running flat. The "C" level people were more interested in how they could spin buzz words to investors than making a great company. They would open more offices not because they were needed, but because investors like seeing a bunch of offices nationwide as a showing of their presence, even if we could do the same performance from a single office. In the end, I left my six figure salaried plus bonus position at the company because I knew I could not fight the mentality of spin the C level management was putting out. 2 years later the company became another Enronesque scandal and imploded into nonexistance. This same spin is what we see here in CCP. Suddenly Gallo and others take over in upper management, and they brings around investors. They don't play the game. Their job is to spin to investors reasons to invest. Rich investors like words like "Microtransactions" or even fancier ones like "Virtual Goods Sales". The FOTM money making idea. Of course the lower grunts that develop and do play the game won't all share this mentality, so they either leave or are pushed to believe it by documents like "Fearless". EVE is no longer the game we signed up for long ago. It is being twisted as a tool to raise share prices. Whether that is successful for CCP remains to be seen. Perhaps they will get lucky and attract more new customers than the old ones they shed. The problem is, until those mythical new customers are actually signed up and paying, then all they are is mere projections, not reality. The current player base is real income in hand.
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:46:00 - [2544] Has their been any feed back from CCP? Thanks Regards Junkie Babe Thank you Regards Junkie babe
RensPriceChecker2	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:51:00 - [2545] Edited by: RensPriceChecker2 on 24/06/2011 14:51:43 Originally by: Junkie Babe Has their been any feed back from CCP? Thanks Regards Junkie Babe The feedback from ccp was: "hello. thanks for all your posts. we understand you believe microtransactions are fantastic and only the prices are a few cents to high. some of you also seem not super amazingly excited about the latest expansion. that is very sad because we want to make everyone as happy as our most dull fanboys. now that we see where you are comming from, can you please stop posting so much? Thanks you."
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.06.24 14:53:00 - [2546] LOL Thank you Regards Junkie babe
Horace Nancyball	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:10:00 - [2547] Originally by: Coarl Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Coarl You literally know nothing of how eve works if that's what you think. Either biomass your toon and start again, only this time actually work through the entire tutorial. OR Have a loong hard think about how extra shiny ships in empire will get used in nullsec. (PL's T3 fleets anyone?). Changes to highsec = changes everywhere, it's the same server universe you clown! My point was that those people flying around in T3s will (or at least should) have those fits anyway. The people actually needing uber mods will have the isk to obtain them one way or another anyway. The first time I see a fully officer fitted Bantam cruising around hi-sec taking out rats I will just laugh in your face. And my point is that at the moment, the playing field is pretty 'level' regarding the shiny **** you fly: ships, mods, ammo are all available to you in the ingame market for isk acquired either through gameplay or PLEX/GTC trading. Once you introduce a higher tier of items whereby people with the fatter RL wallet can BUY an advantage over and above what you can currently get from the ingame market then that will be when the game crashes and burns. Those raging about these proposed changes now are doing so in the vain hope that ccp actually listen and pay heed to the 5h1tstorm they are about to unleash before it's too late. Nice attempt at the trolling officer fitted bantam btw. If you succeed in griefing that 5hit from some clueless AUR asshat, i will be the first to applaud your fat lewts and laugh loudly at the killboard link (and affected pilot). And how would you describe PLEX exactly? Oh yes, available to those with the fatter wallets.
Tachibana Kanade	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:34:00 - [2548] bump
Mamayev Kurgan	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:43:00 - [2549] And a good ol bump from me .. want to keep this thread front and center until CCP deigns to respond to the lies this document reveals. They want to talk about the monocles .. not the newsletter .. won't let them ignore it.
Xeronn Amarr Silver Snake Enterprise Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:49:00 - [2550] R.I.P EvE it`s been a great 4 years Thanks to the best gaming comunity that ever graced (or trolled , or scammed , or spammed...etc) a game with it`s presence I`ll miss this place , but i`m too much of an emo to stand around watching EvE die a slow and agonizing death so...here`s to CCP going bankrupt as soon as possible! good nigh
Coarl Gallente Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:50:00 - [2551] Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Coarl Originally by: Horace Nancyball Originally by: Coarl You literally know nothing of how eve works if that's what you think. Either biomass your toon and start again, only this time actually work through the entire tutorial. OR Have a loong hard think about how extra shiny ships in empire will get used in nullsec. (PL's T3 fleets anyone?). Changes to highsec = changes everywhere, it's the same server universe you clown! My point was that those people flying around in T3s will (or at least should) have those fits anyway. The people actually needing uber mods will have the isk to obtain them one way or another anyway. The first time I see a fully officer fitted Bantam cruising around hi-sec taking out rats I will just laugh in your face. And my point is that at the moment, the playing field is pretty 'level' regarding the shiny **** you fly: ships, mods, ammo are all available to you in the ingame market for isk acquired either through gameplay or PLEX/GTC trading. Once you introduce a higher tier of items whereby people with the fatter RL wallet can BUY an advantage over and above what you can currently get from the ingame market then that will be when the game crashes and burns. Those raging about these proposed changes now are doing so in the vain hope that ccp actually listen and pay heed to the 5h1tstorm they are about to unleash before it's too late. Nice attempt at the trolling officer fitted bantam btw. If you succeed in griefing that 5hit from some clueless AUR asshat, i will be the first to applaud your fat lewts and laugh loudly at the killboard link (and affected pilot). And how would you describe PLEX exactly? Oh yes, available to those with the fatter wallets. Yes i know what plex is and GTC (i sometimes buy a GTC or two to sell off in order to lessen the grind time for ships and toys) BUT all of the stuff i buy ingame through ISK is the SAME stuff as what everyone else buys, there is no ingame advantage to owning it OVER AND ABOVE any other player in the same ship who may have got it by grinding ingame for several hours. The difference is TIME ONLY. The difference between stuff acquired through ISK and concern over shiny new 'exclusive' stuff (ships/mods/ammo) acquired through AUR is that the AUR stuff may offer an advantage ingame to someone with a mega fat RL wallet over and above that which everyone else who buys stuff through ISK may acquire. This difference will be to actual game affecting stuff (resists/damage/tank/drone fielded etc). This will create a two-tier version of eve which will cause a mass exodus and ruin the game/CCP in the long run.
Takaedeatchy Caldari Southern Cross Trilogy Flying Dangerous	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:51:00 - [2552] Originally by: HLF No45678 Remeber SWG and NGE? History teaches nothing. So very true I was think the same. The added the TCG as well, screwed up the market with TCG items.
Govinda Sertan	Posted - 2011.06.24 15:58:00 - [2553] >>>First the CQ : CCP spend what, one year maybe, developping this ** ? A small place with a stupid sims to look at, doing nothing.... >>>Then the mall shop : yeah starting to sell vanity fair for outrageous price. >>>Finally, the leak : where we clearly see that CCP dont intend to work on EVE anymore, but just milk us, the gamers, until we are all dry. I joined EvE because of the relation between the community and CCP. Now I see that CCP just want to be exactly like others company, and dont want to do a good job, but just making fast money, even when there is more and more players coming in. I seriously consider to quit. If they do as they say, this game will be ** very soon.
T0KER	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:05:00 - [2554] I HOPE EVERYONE ENJOYS THEIR PAY TO PLAY & PAY TO WIN EVE. I WILL NOT BE A PART IN ANOTHER MICROTRANSACTION P2W GAME
dhunpael Caldari Narwhals Ate My Duck	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:19:00 - [2555] it's confirmed, now just push it trough and you won't lose me, but all the players in the game (ok not all of them, there are those who love to play hello kitty online)
Heroldyn Yhamad	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:22:00 - [2556] we can still play eve offline. for free! http://eve.znaor.hr/evegame/index.php
Slaktoid	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:24:00 - [2557] Just chiming in to say that this stuff is indeed deeply disturbing reading. I fear for what the future may bring. We cannot afford to lose big chunks of the community. The game will die if these ideas are put into practice. CCP needs to take a long hard look at what they're about to unleash here. The CSM has a more important task than ever before them: To Salvage this game from total ruin. Every messageboard everywhere is literally on fire.
Kno Bodeesbitch	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:28:00 - [2558] Dear CCP, I spent a good chunk of a day defending your right to use MT for vanity items in the first MT threadnaught. I now have to eat crow and apologize to all of those I insulted for being alarmist..thanks... You have completely changed the way I feel about this game. I have 11 accounts, all paid every month via CC..never plex...I just love(d) the Eve community and world you have created that I wanted characters in every aspect of it. Its not the MT that turned me off its the lies...I am sorry you did this
Sasha Whorlita	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:31:00 - [2559] Originally by: Govinda Sertan >>>First the CQ : CCP spend what, one year maybe, developping this **** ? A small place with a stupid sims to look at, doing nothing.... >>>Then the mall shop : yeah starting to sell vanity fair for outrageous price. >>>Finally, the leak : where we clearly see that CCP dont intend to work on EVE anymore, but just milk us, the gamers, until we are all dry. Ugg i gotta say something here It hasnt been 1 year for 1 room check the other thread below this one, CCP spent most of there time developing the ENGINE for Incarna, the thing that makes that room possible, Incarna is step 1 in testing CARBON to see how it performans and be optimized before letting other areas open up or going multiplayer with it....... The mall shop, its vanity items who gives a fck yes its overpriced and insanely rediculous but its vanity items that dont affect anything. And where in that entire leak (the ORIGINAL ONE not the EN24) did they say any of that, the fcking leak was a document of 2 devs giving pro and con sides of MT in games... it wasnt a corporate policy even tho some may have seen it as that it was a newsletter debating directions.... - Now i will say if they make the NeX anything but vanity then i'm gone, i don't play eve to be able to buy a win card for RL cash thats just bullsh*t (dramiel 8H 8M 8L anyone lol) ... And the idea of NeX skinned ships without requiring a trade in of a unpainted player bought player built ship is not something i will stand for, it ruins the economy and means that you could buy ships anywhere in eve even deep nullsec without any logistics... SO NO NeX should offer ship SKINNING for a price if they want ... but NOT ships themselves!!!!!
Natsett Amuinn	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:32:00 - [2560] I'm taking donations if anyone would like to unload any isk they'd like to be rid of. I even take plex if you'd like to send me some of them as well. It would be very much appreciated.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:38:00 - [2561] so...still nothing from CCP except the derailing from the original thread to a new CCP thread hm? Nice touch. No, the LINK to the DOCUMENT will not vanish, bump.
Korbin Dallaz	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:41:00 - [2562] Originally by: Kno Bodees*** Dear CCP, Its not the MT that turned me off its the lies...I am sorry you did this I think that says it all right there. I have been telling people for a while that the CSM is a useless PR tool and that CCP only uses it to give the illusion that they give a **. So you guys are caught doing exactly that using the CSM to force stuff on the players and give them some illusion of control and instead of taking a good hard look at yourselves and where this game is going you permaban the person who leaked it ? That speaks volumes to your level of disconnect from your customers and you absolute lack of understanding the true problem.
Dazram Two	Posted - 2011.06.24 16:43:00 - [2563] screw these *******s man, i'm letting my account expire and I'm never touching this garbage again
Korbin Dallaz	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:02:00 - [2564] Originally by: Sasha Whorlita The mall shop, its vanity items who gives a fck yes its overpriced and insanely rediculous but its vanity items that dont affect anything. And where in that entire leak (the ORIGINAL ONE not the EN24) did they say any of that, the fcking leak was a document of 2 devs giving pro and con sides of MT in games... it wasnt a corporate policy even tho some may have seen it as that it was a newsletter debating directions.... Do you remember 2 expansions ago when they introduced PI and the servers were down for a little longer than expected and they gave us all like 100K skill points to spend ? Well in the past when servers were down for longer than expected CCP would say stop crying we tell you to put long skills in case this happens. I suspected then especially with the speed at which the delivery interface for applying skill points was introduced that it was developed to sell skill points and was released at that point to test it. The leaked document confirms that is the direction they are headed behind the scenes. While they may not have done it yet their actions clearly indicate that is the direction that they are headed. CCP gave up on eve players and has chosen a different and larger audience. Their actions in response to all of this only confirm that.
TedStriker The Scope	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:15:00 - [2565] Well well, up again, ppl should read it, as the FIRST POST in the DEV-Thread is not even MENTIONING the newsletter!!!!
KITTYCALLER	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:16:00 - [2566] Its sad cuz ive been playing eve for 4 years now, and if the virtual store stuff becomes necessary to play, thats all she wrote for me, thanks ccp for ruining my game of choice entirely... i will not be purchasing anything from virtual goods store at all ever, deal with it
Erichan	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:18:00 - [2567] UGH I didnt make the connection between the learning points being able to be distributed for refunds and the whole MT thing. So you trade plex for a finite amount of sps to spend? EEEK. That they had that in development and just accelerated that for the issue of the downtime means this has been planned for a long time. /faceplam how did I miss it.
Melerose Tenaku	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:23:00 - [2568] sweet, I'll totally buy more SP on my toon, right after I CANCEL MY SUBSCRIPTIONS!
Saving Face	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:27:00 - [2569] Originally by: Erichan UGH I didnt make the connection between the learning points being able to be distributed for refunds and the whole MT thing. So you trade plex for a finite amount of sps to spend? EEEK. That they had that in development and just accelerated that for the issue of the downtime means this has been planned for a long time. /faceplam how did I miss it. Also don't forget that PLEX for remaps was already on SiSi at one point, somehow they forgot how "well" that went.
Chesty McJubblies Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:34:00 - [2570] Originally by: Hans Jagerblitzen BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAH This "leak" is hysterical. I can't believe people actually believe this. It's completely unprofessional, cartoonish, and plays on every EvE bittervets fears and paranoia like harp strings. If you believe this is real, and that this represents CCP opinion, please do the EvE community a favor and just quit the game now. No, not "quit the game" but stay on the forums complaining needlessly as if CCP cares, just quit, walk away, and stop posting. Go find something better to do than whining about a GAME that you've decided is horrible but need to stick around and make worse with your rude, useless, trolling. CCP has said in plain english they ignore ****heads but respond to constructive criticism. .....this is like New Eden's version of the Barack Obama birther phenomena. Complete with fake documents "proving" that CCP is making a greedy money grab. This is rooted in simple emotional outcry, nothing else. Just as the birthers will cry foul no matter what gets posted as evidence, so the naysayers will whine about monocles destroying their spaceship game. Lets be honest, all of you who believe this to be true, will not care if CCP comes out and responds, even though they wont. You wouldn't believe them. Stop demanding it like them saying "not us" is all you need to be convinced. You forgot to edit this out of existence. ----------------------------------------
Abrazzar	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:35:00 - [2571] What they fail to see is that a lot of EVE players chose EVE to get away from all this MT bull**** and upper management buzzfarts that now infest CCP. By forcing this development they are losing the hard core of their loyal player base. --------
Majuan Shuo Gallente Sons Of 0din Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:59:00 - [2572] Free LIANG you ****ers. "All your monies AUR belong to us." -- CCP
Alec Page Moo corporation Reverberation Project	Posted - 2011.06.24 17:59:00 - [2573] CCP - You cannot reshape the EVE universe to favor those more economically endowed in real life. By doing so, you will alienate (and by this I mean you will LOSE subscribers) a large percentage of your user base, likely counteracting any profits your legal RMTing may bring. In essence that's what it is: legal RMTing, because offering advantages in game for a swipe of the credit card will do exactly what RMT has done in the pastûruin the gameûmerely on a larger level. If these changes come about, I for one will no longer subscribe to EVE.
Faith O'Siras	Posted - 2011.06.24 18:00:00 - [2574] So has CCP said anything about this officially?
Londo Cebb Official Market Discussions Troll	Posted - 2011.06.24 18:06:00 - [2575] Edited by: Londo Cebb on 24/06/2011 18:05:50 Originally by: Faith O'Siras So has CCP said anything about this officially? Yes they have. http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1536065&page=5#126
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.24 18:17:00 - [2576] Originally by: Faith O'Siras So has CCP said anything about this officially? Yup, something along the lines of "oh, we see you like MT but the prices are too high yes? maybe we can do something about that, i will give you an answer in a few days as i can say anything, i'm just a PR tool. Then ppl got angry again asked if she didn't notice the FAT ELEPHANT THREAD.... "oh, i see...well, its real...now, could you stop posting about it, pretty please? It makes us look bad".
Melerose Tenaku Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.24 18:54:00 - [2577] A Quote from Mullan Turrek in his latest post on EN247 Quote: A while back I showed you a picture of the currency exchange that demonstrated money spent, and then consumed by the CCP monster. It turns out that I was a little off. IÆve had a chance to take a look at the new noble exchange store, and IÆve changed my mind considerably. So hereÆs a new image that helps demonstrate the currency cycle in EVE just a little bit more effectively.
Echo Watts	Posted - 2011.06.24 19:15:00 - [2578] Page 2 Sniper... Fakeedit: oh, little late. Anyway, I don't care about the vanity stuff. Right now you can spend RL cash on in game stuff (PLEX). When you fight someone who's using weapons you can't, because he has more SP than you, that's fine. When are people going to be able to buy SP? Will T3 battleships only be available using RL cash? Maybe not be sellable on the open market so to have one you'll have to spend your own money, not isk, to get one? It's all speculation. I just don't like where this trend this is going.
Mamayev Kurgan	Posted - 2011.06.24 19:25:00 - [2579] Bump .. this is THE issue, CCP. Face it, answer for it.
Liliana Morgenstern	Posted - 2011.06.24 19:44:00 - [2580] Originally by: Slaktoid Just chiming in to say that this stuff is indeed deeply disturbing reading. I fear for what the future may bring. We cannot afford to lose big chunks of the community. The game will die if these ideas are put into practice. CCP needs to take a long hard look at what they're about to unleash here. The CSM has a more important task than ever before them: To Salvage this game from total ruin. Every messageboard everywhere is literally on fire. +1 I fear for the future of EVE at this point.
ArchenTheGreat Caldari Pulsar Nebulah Army of Lovers.	Posted - 2011.06.24 19:51:00 - [2581] I am really disapointed. I can stand vanity items in ingame shop. I'll just don't use them and will not care. But players buying their way into game it's something I am strongly against. I don't play too much but I still pay subscription every month. If you make micropayments in EVE I will probably quit.
Eden Falls	Posted - 2011.06.24 20:04:00 - [2582] I've been playing since 2003. This is the first time i posted on forums. If they are going to follow the "Entropia" model, i'll cancel my 4 accounts and i think a lot of vets will feel the same. This is a sad day for eve :(
Riveth	Posted - 2011.06.24 20:04:00 - [2583] CCP, I am disappoint. FACE UP.
BigD Dan	Posted - 2011.06.24 20:29:00 - [2584] dont tread on my game ccp give us back eve
Braden Andedare	Posted - 2011.06.24 20:31:00 - [2585] greed will kill this game pls keep it pure no pay to win schemes!!!!
Londo Cebb Official Market Discussions Troll	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:00:00 - [2586] Greed is good.
Dragan Moonraker Rheinbraun Heavy Industries	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:05:00 - [2587] Edited by: Dragan Moonraker on 24/06/2011 21:05:29 That newsletter shows just how deeply out of touch they are with their customers. "I shop there for I am" ? Give me a ****ing break. The sarcasm laced all over that thing makes them sound like trolls.
Bloody2k Gallente ZERO T0LERANCE RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:22:00 - [2588] Edited by: Bloody2k on 24/06/2011 21:27:56 . Einmal mit Profis!
Bloody2k Gallente ZERO T0LERANCE RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:25:00 - [2589] Everyone should ask the following questions. Does it still make sense to put money, time and passion in a game that the developers continue to develop only with the aim to milk the community? Everyone should really think critically. CCP developed a product for you players, but only one product that maximized their profit. It's not about CCP to develop a good product, but a product with the greatest possible profit. I have no desire to fund a product with my money that I would not have! If I pay money for a product, then I would also like that this money is used for this product. It may be. that my opinion is too naive in this capitalist world, but it's up to you, dear community. No matter what CCP will do, I can not believe a word about them. They gave us all aware of leave in the dark. They have lied to and from the front to back. you, to them for so long are faithful. Quite apart from the contemptuous words against us. I've been looking forward to further developments which have developed many of you have been ignored by CCP and obvious. Maybe some of them are introduced in WoD:) It would not surprise me, anyway. Perhaps you may see a variety of more relaxed than I and other pilots. Eve is going to change massively. It will not be the game for which we have been through so many times that night. Einmal mit Profis!
g3ckko	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:32:00 - [2590] CCP you're going into the wrong direction. Don't listen to business school ******s who use 2 of their 3 braincells to maximize profit and the remaining one to crash their Porsche into a tree. EVE won't exist for long if you continue like that. People get frustrated for a good reason if you want them to PAY for new items which could determine the outcome of a fight. It's simply an insult for those people who built themselves a decent char over the years. We're paying a subscription and that's it. If you want more, you'll soon find out you'll get less. Seriously guys, please do not implement all those genuinely bad ideas!!
GODDHAND	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:41:00 - [2591] http://de.justin.tv/deamosseraph#/w/1380742320/2
GODDHAND	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:45:00 - [2592] And in Amarr http://de.justin.tv/dnah_pmip#/w/1381178160
nikitasius	Posted - 2011.06.24 21:54:00 - [2593] greed is good +1
Jericho thePure Amarr The 13th Armored Headhunters	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:00:00 - [2594] Enough is enough.. CCP Zulu you wanted to nerf carriers way back when. You should have been fired then.. now this? Can CCP Zulu and hit the reset button and hope we the players forgive you in time. Don't go the way of SWG, please don't. Eve is not your cash cow you can kick around and abuse. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig "All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..."
Natasha Zenith Caldari Crushed Ambitions	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:07:00 - [2595] Greed is bad, always has been always will be!
Jericho thePure Amarr The 13th Armored Headhunters	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:17:00 - [2596] Why is it this thread keeps moving to page 2 so quickly eh? You can't hide this topic. Everyone I know in game is ****ed off about this. ------------------------------------------------- - Sig "All those moments, will be lost in time like tears in rain...... time to die ..."
Carrelle Rouppon	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:22:00 - [2597] My faith in CCP has been shaken. Don't do it.
Saris Jacinta	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:23:00 - [2598] Well... question.. is it a bad Omen ... ? Today Sony Online Entertainment wrote down that at 15.12.2011 they will close all SWG Servers. ( So much about what happens to a Game when Devs look at Money and not at the Community. ) Take a look at it.. SOE thought they dont need the Hardcore Players.. they dont need longtime Subscribers. And if SOE where not SOE with this massive Background SWG would have broken theire Neck. Be alarmed :)
Erksine	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:28:00 - [2599] CCP Soundwave set to RED...
Jacoba Stalker	Posted - 2011.06.24 22:50:00 - [2600] Originally by: Saris Jacinta Well... question.. is it a bad Omen ... ? Today Sony Online Entertainment wrote down that at 15.12.2011 they will close all SWG Servers. ( So much about what happens to a Game when Devs look at Money and not at the Community. ) Take a look at it.. SOE thought they dont need the Hardcore Players.. they dont need longtime Subscribers. And if SOE where not SOE with this massive Background SWG would have broken theire Neck. Be alarmed :) I think the idiot project manager for SWG at SOE was hired by CCP. This is the same form of stupidity that moronic imbecile came up with.
Madmartigan Gallente Helljumpers White Noise.	Posted - 2011.06.24 23:28:00 - [2601] I¦ve been playing this game since 8th of may 2003. If CCP really are going to go through with this "virtual goods sales" thingy in a way it affects game play, I¦m done with this game. Very very disappointed.
JoeBear770 Amarr Faster Muffins	Posted - 2011.06.25 00:34:00 - [2602] bump
Madjak Burton	Posted - 2011.06.25 00:42:00 - [2603] Please add this gem of a quote from the leaked memo to your origial post --- "I don't oppose the concept of virtual goods in the case of vanity items, merely in cases where the monetization of items impacts the balance of the game." - John Tuberfield oh, wait . . .
Joe450	Posted - 2011.06.25 01:23:00 - [2604] wow, CCP turning the game more and more like World of warcraft.. the one with more real money can have the better items Come on CCP i thought you were better than this and defened Eve to WoW but starting to learn maybe the W0W players were right
Wakeland	Posted - 2011.06.25 02:09:00 - [2605] Originally by: Joe450 wow, CCP turning the game more and more like World of warcraft.. the one with more real money can have the better items Come on CCP i thought you were better than this and defened Eve to WoW but starting to learn maybe the W0W players were right You cannot buy anything on WoW that gives you an advantage over any other player. You're wrong and an idiot.
Asaphia	Posted - 2011.06.25 02:16:00 - [2606] He thinks its weird to be called Hilter for charging for saved fittings? Why not just charge me for use of my assests button or market window too you ****ing jackass. I'm a nobody but I've got 6 accounts and I think I'm pretty much headed toward the door. Goodbye 90 dollars a month. Chump change perhaps...but just how many other players are gonna say the same?
Arcaneidas	Posted - 2011.06.25 02:52:00 - [2607] Also getting confirmed reports from the SiSi server that NEX items are DESTROYED when you get podded, because the items are applied to you CURRENT CLONE. Therefore when you get into a new clone, NEX items are not on them. Beautiful. I mean I don't know how this can get any worse other than another Zulu leaked email saying " all current subscribers have had there bank accounts cleaned out, thanks for giving us your secure information, Sucker--- I mean Capsuleers" Fun ride though.
Krystal Divine Minmatar The Red Exhilez Chaos Theory Alliance	Posted - 2011.06.25 03:16:00 - [2608] Originally by: Wakeland Originally by: Joe450 wow, CCP turning the game more and more like World of warcraft.. the one with more real money can have the better items Come on CCP i thought you were better than this and defened Eve to WoW but starting to learn maybe the W0W players were right You cannot buy anything on WoW that gives you an advantage over any other player. You're wrong and an idiot. Too true. At least the garbage that Blizzard sells to its WoW players is just vanity stuff. No one can buy anything and use it to have an advantage over another player. It's just a lot of "Looky what I have!" junk. And if CCP is going to have micro transactions in Eve, at least stick to vanity stuff that real players wouldn't give to %#&%s about.
Benri Konpaku	Posted - 2011.06.25 03:31:00 - [2609] And now the mail thread has been locked.
Rumplefink	Posted - 2011.06.25 03:36:00 - [2610] OMG It is REAL? OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG
G 0 D	Posted - 2011.06.25 03:41:00 - [2611] Originally by: Bloody2k Everyone should ask the following questions. Does it still make sense to put money, time and passion in a game that the developers continue to develop only with the aim to milk the community? Everyone should really think critically. CCP developed a product for you players, but only one product that maximized their profit. It's not about CCP to develop a good product, but a product with the greatest possible profit. I have no desire to fund a product with my money that I would not have! If I pay money for a product, then I would also like that this money is used for this product. It may be. that my opinion is too naive in this capitalist world, but it's up to you, dear community. No matter what CCP will do, I can not believe a word about them. They gave us all aware of leave in the dark. They have lied to and from the front to back. you, to them for so long are faithful. Quite apart from the contemptuous words against us. I've been looking forward to further developments which have developed many of you have been ignored by CCP and obvious. Maybe some of them are introduced in WoD:) It would not surprise me, anyway. Perhaps you may see a variety of more relaxed than I and other pilots. Eve is going to change massively. It will not be the game for which we have been through so many times that night.
Benri Konpaku	Posted - 2011.06.25 03:47:00 - [2612] White goth elephants are expensive.
Mister Miracle	Posted - 2011.06.25 04:45:00 - [2613] FIGHT THE POWER!
wakelinrules	Posted - 2011.06.25 04:50:00 - [2614] always said that ccp=FAIL
Shaktah Minmatar Children of the Spaghetti Monster	Posted - 2011.06.25 05:00:00 - [2615] Edited by: Shaktah on 25/06/2011 05:01:18 So much drama.
Arakkis Melanogaster GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.06.25 06:04:00 - [2616] haha wtf guys seriously
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.25 06:28:00 - [2617] Wow, just wow. I expected a failblog, but this was just a big "**** you". Basically, just confirmed every FEAR the players have. I know CCP thinks like this, but TELLING US upfront? Wow. I don't know if they have balls of steel or are just so completely nuts.
Nozomi en Tilavine	Posted - 2011.06.25 08:38:00 - [2618] EVE Online Subscription Cancelled You have cancelled your EVE Online subscription. Your account will be suspended at the end of the current subscription period, expiring on ******. Your characters will be stored safely and be ready for you to enjoy again should you decide to return. If you feel that this cancellation has been made in error, you can quickly and easily reopen your account by clicking below.
Rumplefink	Posted - 2011.06.25 08:43:00 - [2619] He has a monocle! Get him!
Clone Whisper	Posted - 2011.06.25 11:47:00 - [2620] In my opinion,.. i would say to all those with multiple accounts, just kick one out of the window, If you feel strongly against what CCP is pulling over your head, throw out some more alts. What ever you want,.. as stated by a CSM CCP looks at what you do more than what you say. Sht, even CCP members said this in documents. So let's show tehm how we feel,.. let's see if we can reduce the number of accounts by 25% over the weekend. That should not be to hard since every hardcore EVE fan has at least 2 alts. You don't have to reduce them to biomass if you don't want to, if cahnges are made you can alwais chose to reactivate. However,... i'd like to see the face on the CCP-know-it-alls when they have to explain to their board of directors what teh F** happened for their player bace to drop by 25% over the weekend. If we would manage this it would be an achevement on our part and a realy difficult thing to swallow on CCP's end.
Cabrini Synt	Posted - 2011.06.25 13:38:00 - [2621] Originally by: Aineko Macx I was never so close to cancelling my 3 accounts. Also inb4l. I havn't read through all 88 pages of posts but this succinctly sums up why the controversial stuff CCP has done in the past will continue.
Phoenus Caldari Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2011.06.25 15:29:00 - [2622] I'm not going to say definitively that 'I quit'. I will, however - be watching extremely closely the moves that CCP makes hereonin.
darius mefrel	Posted - 2011.06.25 16:15:00 - [2623] CCP should be very lucky that they have their Headquarters in Iceland. I mean if they have their Headquarter here in Switzerland while such informations get leaked... it wont take long and their Building would probably look like the UBS Building in Zurich after they enraged the people in Switzerland. Nobody really would invest his Time and travel to iceland just to bomb down their building with paint... It's easier to push the "Cancel Subscription" button and cancelled Subscriptions probably will hurt them much more and longer than a bit Paint ot the Walls...
Law Deschain	Posted - 2011.06.25 16:23:00 - [2624] That is fuct. Wow, now I understand why people are angry.
Duchy Duke	Posted - 2011.06.25 17:21:00 - [2625] Bump
Sajad	Posted - 2011.06.25 17:23:00 - [2626] THE PLAYERS CANNOT BE SILENCED
Bashaka	Posted - 2011.06.25 17:24:00 - [2627] Get rid of AUR, this is bull****.
Grey Stormshadow Starwreck Industries	Posted - 2011.06.25 17:25:00 - [2628] HEY CCP HILMAR - I JUST FOUND THIS. LOOKS LIKE THE TRUE CCP IS FILLED WITH ROTTEN APPLES AND TOTAL BS I WONDER HOW MANY WILL AGREE WITH YOUR NEW VISION Account expires in 0d 3h 23m 9s and counting The another account reached termination point already. Here are my tears - they are free - reel em in --- This is one of the moments where we look at what CCP does and less of what they say. Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change
Law Deschain	Posted - 2011.06.25 17:41:00 - [2629] bump
Law Deschain	Posted - 2011.06.25 18:25:00 - [2630] Originally by: Grey Stormshadow HEY CCP HILMAR - I JUST FOUND THIS. LOOKS LIKE THE TRUE CCP IS FILLED WITH ROTTEN APPLES AND TOTAL BS I WONDER HOW MANY WILL AGREE WITH YOUR NEW VISION Account expires in 0d 3h 23m 9s and counting The another account reached termination point already. Here are my tears - they are free - reel em in
staravenger	Posted - 2011.06.25 18:40:00 - [2631] If you don't like a game. Quit, but stop behaving like a bunch of dramaqueens, ruining it for other people. For all i care they charge $100000 for insignificant ugrades like, monacles, skirts and a "Bieber" haircut. If you don't want it, don't buy it. Then the next thing. Stop speculating about further microtransactions which probably will never see the light of day, OR, probably will as an extra service or whatever. Either way, to much speculation guys. Now go play Hello Kitty Online. ____ Extending my 4 accounts for 1 year each!
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.25 18:51:00 - [2632] Originally by: staravenger Then the next thing. Stop speculating about further microtransactions which probably will never see the light of day, OR, probably will as an extra service or whatever. ah, still in denial stage hm? well, if it suits you. may we will even have a nice "told you so" if we are still here when it comes, just for fun.
Jolteon Taylor	Posted - 2011.06.26 03:08:00 - [2633] Edited by: Jolteon Taylor on 26/06/2011 03:09:54 Edited by: Jolteon Taylor on 26/06/2011 03:08:05 Originally by: Grey Stormshadow HEY CCP HILMAR - I JUST FOUND THIS. Wow. Reading those, shows off some very annoyed (ex?) staff. Taken from a review, under the 'cons' section. Quote: CCP does not take criticism well and often ignores retrospectives. Criticism is considered to be a negative attitude and is severely frowned upon. A lot of effort goes into maintaining a good morale with a lot of internal PR. After all itÆs cheaper to print posters than pay an average salary to employees. Several years now CCP has predicated insane subscriber goals that cannot be met. Naturally this is met with scepticism by the employees but it falls on deaf ears. The result is that the company is suffering because we cannot sustain the development of EVE, DUST and WOD. EVE is not creating enough revenue which means that solutions are sought, solutions that CCP was vehemently against a few years ago. Career progression is nonexistent unless you become friends with the right clique of people and use the right corporate buzzwords. Hard work is not something that will set you apart, most people work hard until they become so disillusioned as they realise it makes no difference and slack off. Combine this with the below average pay (CCP pays 30% to 50% less than other companies) and youÆll often hear a lot of frustration when work is discussed outside of the office by people who have been here for some time. The longer you stay the less you start to care about the game you develope, because no one else does. I hope CCP is about to pull one fat bunny out if its sleeve, else EVE, and perhaps CCP is about to have a tumbling fall. Judging by the reaction of ....well everyone, realy.
VeloxMors	Posted - 2011.06.26 04:32:00 - [2634] CCP being ignorant of their player base? I never thought I'd have seen the day. Keep up the good work CCP. I love all these features nobody wanted, even if you don't fix anything we actually wanted fixed. All of the null sec nerfs were an awesome idea. Living out in null was waaaay too easy, and people were making too much isk. Now it's awesome... nobody can make isk, sovereignty is still jacked, JBs are a joke, and we keep getting these wicked convenient incursions that lock down entire constellations for a week at a time without warning. SUPER FUN, CCP, I'm glad you're in touch with want we want as players. Also, Sony is an upstanding company; a true beacon of goodness. I'm ecstatic that you're willing to put all of Dust, a focal point of the Eve community, solely into their gaming system's hands. I hear it's a very secure platform, too... there's no way Dust could fail. Besides, I couldn't imagine anybody that plays Eve would have liked to have seen Dust on the PC. I doubt any of those Eve players have PCs anyhow. Oh and all of my IRL money? Yeah just take it - I didn't want it anyways. If anyone at CCP takes offense to this, you shouldn't be listening to us. Hilmar's orders. Wouldn't want to disobey glorious leader, now would we...
G 0 D	Posted - 2011.06.26 05:03:00 - [2635] People that are leaving should give perpetuum online a try. Hundreds of players that have quit over this are in the ingame channel EVE. http://www.perpetuum-online.com/
Sniperdoc Caldari Stargate Kommand	Posted - 2011.06.26 06:26:00 - [2636] Originally by: VeloxMors CCP being ignorant of their player base? I never thought I'd have seen the day. Keep up the good work CCP. I love all these features [...] anyhow. Oh and all of my IRL money? Yeah just take it - I didn't want it anyways. If anyone at CCP takes offense to this, you shouldn't be listening to us. Hilmar's orders. Wouldn't want to disobey glorious leader, now would we... +1 Subscriptions on my two accounts have been canceled. Drakes ROCK!
Shintai Gallente Arx Io Orbital Factories Arx Io	Posted - 2011.06.26 15:44:00 - [2637] I wonder if Zulu wants to comment. -------------------------------------- Abstraction and Transcendence: Nature, Shintai, and Geometry
Bootleg Jack	Posted - 2011.06.26 15:48:00 - [2638] Gullible people.
Unraveller Chase	Posted - 2011.06.26 16:14:00 - [2639] Been playing for close to 3 years now. If this truly does get implemented, me and my 2 accounts are gone too.
Gwenywell Shumuku	Posted - 2011.06.26 18:22:00 - [2640] Originally by: Bootleg Jack Gullible people. omg...really? still not up to speed? living in a cave much? This is the interwebs...common...4 days = eternity.
Akiriy Azuriko	Posted - 2011.06.26 18:42:00 - [2641] Bro. i'm so mad right now.
Valei Khurelem	Posted - 2011.06.26 18:45:00 - [2642] Another interesting and unique MMORPG gone down the drain. Ah well, guess I'll see about getting my minecraft account fixed finally at least they can't ****up singleplayer games this badly.
ALLYOURMONEY BELONGTOUS	Posted - 2011.06.27 06:04:00 - [2643] Originally by: Valei Khurelem Another interesting and unique MMORPG gone down the drain. Ah well, guess I'll see about getting my minecraft account fixed finally at least they can't ****up singleplayer games this badly. I might join you
Far King	Posted - 2011.06.27 07:00:00 - [2644] As long as I get to scoop a pair of smoking boots when I pod someone... then I'm cool with this.
Kawika Cox	Posted - 2011.06.28 00:25:00 - [2645] World of Tanks... at least they can do Sov warfare right... and admit that giant fights aren't possible at the time... and invest in better servers... and correctly do a pay to play game.
pedros Minmatar Gaia Freelancers	Posted - 2011.06.28 19:08:00 - [2646] omg.. 89 pages of WHINE If u dont like ignore or leave and give me ur stuff now ffs brainf**k http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBKShDMZ_40&feature=feedlik
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2011.06.29 08:41:00 - [2647] Originally by: Kawika Cox World of Tanks... at least they can do Sov warfare right... and admit that giant fights aren't possible at the time... and invest in better servers... and correctly do a pay to play game. How would you translate WoT Clan Warfare into the EVE persistent world? Address the issues of manufacturing capital and supercapital ships, planting Cyno beacons, jump bridges, territorial upgrades. [ Australian players join channel ANZAC ]
Mara Rinn	Posted - 2011.06.29 08:49:00 - [2648] Quote: CCP does not take criticism well and often ignores retrospectives. Criticism is considered to be a negative attitude and is severely frowned upon. A lot of effort goes into maintaining a good morale with a lot of internal PR. After all itÆs cheaper to print posters than pay an average salary to employees. Several years now CCP has predicated insane subscriber goals that cannot be met. Naturally this is met with scepticism by the employees but it falls on deaf ears. The result is that the company is suffering because we cannot sustain the development of EVE, DUST and WOD. EVE is not creating enough revenue which means that solutions are sought, solutions that CCP was vehemently against a few years ago. Career progression is nonexistent unless you become friends with the right clique of people and use the right corporate buzzwords. Hard work is not something that will set you apart, most people work hard until they become so disillusioned as they realise it makes no difference and slack off. Combine this with the below average pay (CCP pays 30% to 50% less than other companies) and youÆll often hear a lot of frustration when work is discussed outside of the office by people who have been here for some time. The longer you stay the less you start to care about the game you develope, because no one else does. Sounds like just about every programming job I've had. The pay sucks and the company has no ability to attract customers, the management is bloody-minded, there's very little employee satisfaction, and staff work too hard and blame management :) For the moment I have a comfy job where I program about 12 lines of polished code each day. I'm not happy, but I'm comfortable. Now take the usual scenario of programmers being younger people with fancy ideas about how much money they're worth, recast the opinions expressed in Glassdoor in that light, and you get to understand that things at CCP must be just about the same as most other programming houses. Amplify that by the butthurt felt by the young programmers heading off to Iceland with stars in their eyes about how wonderful the country is and how lovely it would be to be paid to program a game, only to find out that programming a game is really hard. Yeah, Glassdoor is about what I'd expect to hear from people who are disillusioned enough to feel like venting about it. [ Australian players join channel ANZAC ]
Irn VanBru	Posted - 2011.06.29 12:00:00 - [2649] Originally by: pedros omg.. 89 pages of WHINE If u dont like ignore or leave and give me ur stuff now ffs brainf**k http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBKShDMZ_40&feature=feedlik emmm no :D
Babar Baboli Minmatar	Posted - 2011.06.29 12:44:00 - [2650] So much whine. Please give me all your stuff before you leave. I will treat it like my first born. KTHXBAI
Vain Eldritch Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2011.06.29 12:51:00 - [2651] Can I get a crimson smoking jacket and long cigar-holder to go with the monocle I ridicule yet secretly covet? And a Bulldog? ______________________________ Vanitas vanitatum omnia vanitas.
Hayaishi Gallente Aperture Harmonics	Posted - 2011.07.21 00:29:00 - [2652] bump
Jonathan Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.07.24 21:54:00 - [2653] A month (and change) later and what have we gotten in response to legitimate customer outrage at a colossal failure by CCP to be honest and competent? A non-apology apology and a bunch of lies from CSM that they've already reneged on. I'm curious why SWG's playerbase had a spine (when NGE hit) whereas EVE's playerbase doesn't (when Incarna hit.) Any thoughts on that? I'd speculate that a big difference is that NGE was only 2 years post-launch whereas Incarna+P2W is 8 years post-launch. Incarna+P2W is a greater betrayal, in that sense, but the customers are that much more addicted already so they're less willing to tell CCP "Yippee ki-yay mother****ers." "I represent those who voted for me, not 'everyone'. Don't give me your entitled voter schtick ..." ~CSM Chair Mittens
Moon Shadowfall	Posted - 2011.07.24 22:04:00 - [2654] Edited by: Moon Shadowfall on 24/07/2011 22:06:47 you forgot ...and Akjon Fergusan is STILL crying like a baby daily...this time on an alt. Would you PLEASE go play with yout "No More Tears" Barbie and quit whining. If you hate this game so much, PLEASE leave... It's VERY sad.

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If you keep this up CCP, WoW actually starts to look appealing.

It is JUST vanity items...Ignore the man

behind the curtain.

So, who's up for playing Eve?

So, who's up for playing Eve?

Thanks.It's a bad sign when the rat's erm, TROLLS, leave the ship first.(I have also suspended my Eve Sdk and Apps development)Get the hint.

I think it's time to remove EVE and CCP adwords from our fan sites.

So, who wants to play Eve?Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

> Would you like to play a game of Thermonuclear War? > NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN> G A M E O V E R

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

So, who's in the mood to play Eve?

Eve is turning into the most expensive DLC milking game ever in the history of gaming.

Eve is turning into the most expensive DLC milking game ever in the history of gaming.

Eve is turning into the most expensive DLC milking game ever in the history of gaming.

Hands up who Microtransaction PURCHASED a QUAFE T-shirt again?

How is the PLEX market atm?

His name was John Turbefield!

There will probably be a CCP person posting on Friday... That way we get to rage even more over the weekend while they go boozing

Can we get coverage on Slashdot for this?

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

His name was John Turbefield!

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

His name was John Turbefield!

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

They are probably currently debating and coming up with a idea to get them out of this. You can`t come up with compelling bull**** to convince us and fix this in a blink.

Fucking. Lovely.How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

They are probably currently debating and coming up with a idea to get them out of this. You can`t come up with compelling bull**** to convince us and fix this in a blink.

They will post on Friday, then we get to emorage more all over the weekend, they come back monday hungover and we are easier to deal with as we have raged the hot air out of ourselves over the weekend.

test

im tired of them i have a lvl 85 paladin on WOW that needs better gear... i think nows as good a time as any

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

The most damaging thing that could probably happen is people stop paying and THE PLEX PRICES RISE.Those with stockpiles could RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money.Wouldnt that hurt?

The most damaging thing you can do probably is stop paying and SCREW THE PLEX PRICES.Those with stockpiles should RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money.Make em hurt.

The most damaging thing that could probably happen is people stop paying and THE PLEX PRICES RISE.Those with stockpiles could RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money.Wouldnt that hurt?

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

His name was John Turbefield!

For all those Comparing Goblins/Dwarfs/Orcs/Mage games with Eve/scifi/spaceships/rayguns.Two VERY DIFFERENT GENRES of game and audience.SCIFI is niche, always has been, always will be. Vampires/Orcs/Dwarfs Always POPULAR.SCI FI = LOW AUDIENCEFANTASY = HUGE MASS APPEALDo not compare the two.

I WONDER IF LULZSEC COULD HELP???

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE **** LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO **** THIS GAME UP

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE **** LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO **** THIS GAME UP

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE **** LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO **** THIS GAME UP

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE **** LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO **** THIS GAME UP

C C P = Company Conning Players

CSM should quit. You are just dancing clown dressed monkeys in this.They are worthless anyway, 14% csm vote turnout, and also no bite.CSM are lied to, CSM just dance about like monkeys to CCP's tune.

I cannot wait for Microtransactions everywhere.Hurry up CCP! Roll em out!

http://slashdot.org/submission/1669048/Eve-Online-and-60-microtransactionsExpect the forums to get Slashdotted SOONÖ

BEWARE THE BANKERS!

His name was John Turbefield!

BEWARE THE BANKERS!

It is JUST vanity items...

Ignore the man

Thanks.

It's a bad sign when the rat's erm, TROLLS, leave the ship first.

(I have also suspended my Eve Sdk and Apps development)

Get the hint.

So, who wants to play Eve?

Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?

Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?

Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?

Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?

Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

So, who wants to play Eve?

Who is actually logged in right now? Or are you just constant refreshing this page and logged off the client for more refresh rate?

> Would you like to play a game of Thermonuclear War?
> NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

> G A M E O V E R

There will probably be a CCP person posting on Friday...

That way we get to rage even more over the weekend while they go boozing

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

They are probably currently debating and coming up with a idea to get them out of this. You can`t come up with compelling bull to convince us and fix this in a blink.

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

They are probably currently debating and coming up with a idea to get them out of this. You can`t come up with compelling bull to convince us and fix this in a blink.

The most damaging thing that could probably happen is people stop paying and THE PLEX PRICES RISE.

Those with stockpiles could RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money.

Wouldnt that hurt?

The most damaging thing you can do probably is stop paying and SCREW THE PLEX PRICES.

Those with stockpiles should RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money.

Make em hurt.

The most damaging thing that could probably happen is people stop paying and THE PLEX PRICES RISE.

Those with stockpiles could RAISE THE PRICE so AURUM is even more OUT OF REACH, and SUBSCRIBERS have to be forced to stop playing with alts / accounts or pay real money.

Wouldnt that hurt?

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP

R U FCKIN SERIOUS? WOW AREN'T YOU THE GREATEST LITTLE LOYAL LAPDOG EVAR!!!! PEOPLE LIKE YOU IS WHY CCP IS ABLE TO THIS GAME UP

CSM should quit. You are just dancing clown dressed monkeys in this.

They are worthless anyway, 14% csm vote turnout, and also no bite.

CSM are lied to, CSM just dance about like monkeys to CCP's tune.

I cannot wait for Microtransactions everywhere.

Hurry up CCP! Roll em out!

http://slashdot.org/submission/1669048/Eve-Online-and-60-microtransactions

Expect the forums to get Slashdotted SOONÖ

Where can we see an accurate and fast number of subs in Eve?

I guess server loading will drop, that's one indicator of less alt usage. Any others?

I really want to watch this Train wreck in slow motion :) Then play it back after CCP goes bye bye as examples for other MMO's in future :)

Eve just became a SHARDED game, FINANCIALLY SHARDED.

Those with disposable money to burn, those without.

I think this thread deserves its own node on the cluster no?

Somebody petition for a large fleet fight, 300k vs 1?

Wut is it :) synopsis please! I have no video bandwidth lol

PS: for those tired of pushing F5, get the "RELOAD EVERY" add-in for firefox g

Wut is it :) synopsis please! I have no video bandwidth lol

PS: for those tired of pushing F5, get the "RELOAD EVERY" add-in for firefox g

Wut is it :) synopsis please! I have no video bandwidth lol

PS: for those tired of pushing F5, get the "RELOAD EVERY" add-in for firefox g

Fucking. Lovely.

How about you grow some balls and front up to your playerbase?

Moderate me, ban me, you shitlicking cum-gargling, cock-juggling, feces-coated pustules. Show that you're reading this thread.

R.I.P.

EVE ONLINE

HEY CCP HILMAR - I JUST FOUND THIS.
LOOKS LIKE THE TRUE CCP IS FILLED WITH ROTTEN APPLES AND TOTAL BS

HEY CCP HILMAR - I JUST FOUND THIS.
LOOKS LIKE THE TRUE CCP IS FILLED WITH ROTTEN APPLES AND TOTAL BS