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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 13 post(s) |
Wacktopia
Infinity Miners Union
Eych Four Eks Zero Ahr
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Posted - 2009.01.15 13:42:00 -
[751]
Edited by: Wacktopia on 15/01/2009 13:42:49
 Quote:
Step 1: In Apocrypha, March 10th, we discontinue support for ShaderModel 1, making ShaderModel 2 (GeForce FX (5 series) or ATi R300 series cards or compatible) the minimum requirement and discontinue the "Classic client" version of EVE, replacing it with "Premium Lite"
Step 2: In the Winter Expansion 2009 we are considering discontinuing support for ShaderModel 2 and make the minimum specification ShaderModel 3(GeForce 6 class cards or ATi x1300 or compatible)
I have a laptop with 945GM Intel built-in graphics, which I bought before starting to play EVE. Luckily, the current client supports it. It doesnt support SM3, but not sure about SM2.
EVE is the only game I play and I probably wont run out and buy a new laptop if it stops working on my current one. Not because I cant simply afford it but because I really dont want to spend upwards of ú300 just to carry on playing a game that currently works for me.
From my perspective, I hope SM2 works on my lappy and CCP decide not to drop it at the end of 2009.
CCP: Please provide a "SM2 and SM3 Checker Program" so those of us who are unsure about our laptop performance can check easily. Please do not post that link to Wikipedia article as it makes for an unfriendly read. |
Ming Mongol
Cerebellum Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.01.15 13:48:00 -
[752]
The real joke here is that CCP expects people to shell out cash to upgrade their luxury entertainment platforms at a time when the world is going to hell and disposable income is rapidly diminishing. Makes me wonder if there is anyone thinking over there.
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AnyOldIron
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Posted - 2009.01.15 13:52:00 -
[753]
No. The real joke is that the ones who want fancy graphics aren`t posting on here because they are off playing Halo 3 on their fancy 47 inch plasma TV, they are not playing eve or reading the forums.
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Wacktopia
Infinity Miners Union
Eych Four Eks Zero Ahr
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:01:00 -
[754]
Companies want to make profits and push products forward. That's the way of the world. Making changes that are detromental to core business is unlikely but you cannot keep all the people happy all the time.
My vote goes for...
Upgrade graphics to SM2 and SM3 2009: Yes :)
Remove the SM2 option at the end of 2009: No :(
Give people (like me) a little longer to get themselves up to SM3.
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Azure Dreams
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:06:00 -
[755]
Looks good
I see some want Eve to look like this
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Des Jardin
Ad Astra Vexillum
Arcane Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:19:00 -
[756]
The most interesting aspect of this entire thread is that EVE players do not play the game for the graphics.
Graphics are nice but it is not why people pay their monthly subscriptions.
Accordingly, a decision that affects the player base conditioned on a premise that better graphics makes EVE better is unfounded and, likely, detrimental in the long run.
Unfortunately, game development is as agile as a supertanker. Apocypha will arrive in March. Some subscribers will no longer be able to play, but the true effect of the client change will probably be masked by the increase in subs that result from CCP's better marketing efforts.
Although potentially skewed, this thread bears out that graphics may be what draws people to EVE, but it is not what keeps folks around.
Des Jardin
P.S. Remember, the definition of insanity is to repeat doing something that fails in the hope that the outcome will be different the next time. |
Avon
Caldari
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:19:00 -
[757]
Originally by: Ming Mongol
The real joke here is that CCP expects people to shell out cash to upgrade their luxury entertainment platforms at a time when the world is going to hell and disposable income is rapidly diminishing. Makes me wonder if there is anyone thinking over there.
No the real joke is that they expect you to do it so that *you* can keep paying *them* money. |
Koala Bare
The Collective
Against ALL Authorities
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:22:00 -
[758]
Originally by: CCP Explorer
As CCP Zulupark said in his blog, at this time we are only considering making SM3 the minimum specification in the Winter Expansion in Q4 2009. We are soliciting your input on the matter.
yeah, but we've seen Zulupark before.
If you want to sollicite input, it's time for the eve client itself to start collecting the data on login and do some proper datamining over the course of the year. That way you can actually do decent projections.
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AnyOldIron
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:25:00 -
[759]
I`d agree with the datamining on login but make sure it logs which client you use , as well as your hardware config . |
Petar Quaresma
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:27:00 -
[760]
Edited by: Petar Quaresma on 15/01/2009 14:29:21
ABANDON GRAPHICS UPGRADES - EVE DOESN'T REQUIRE THEM
Eve makes for good screenshots but other than that, there isn't a need for upgraded graphics.
"Oh no, my upgraded harbinger is spinning in a circle shooting a little laser beam at another terrible ship model, please don't take away my upgraded graphics!"
Maybe if you focused on real game upgrades, like making 0.0 not suck or making PVE elements actually fun you would have more than 40k people (20k of which are alts) playing your game at the same time.
Accept the fact that Eve is an 'OLD' game and that people play it as a novelty. Work on making the game stable for as many people as possible.
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Alpha Dragh
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:33:00 -
[761]
Edited by: Alpha Dragh on 15/01/2009 14:35:04
yes, yes, yes
fully agree on the dev blog, even if i also use an old laptop to play sometimes.
why spend time and money on doing the same work 2 times ? Most people really do want eyecandy and do have the hardware.
Ofcourse ... in a forum you'll mostly see complains. That's normal ;) Doesnt mean you should not do it...
mooar nice gfx ! (but we should be able to switch it off / on for fleetbatles and such)
// edit : next poster : EVE IS NOT an old game. It's one of the best examples of a ongoing developing game.
ofcourse i dont use the great gfx in pvp , but i like to look at it when i am NOT in a pvp fight.
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Toninu
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:36:00 -
[762]
Hi,
While i do appreciate that CCP is making an effort to improve the game looks etc I would like to point out that gameplay and bugs are more important to focus on.
I have a desktop with 6800gt and a laptop with intel 965 express chipset and eve classic runs better on my laptop.
And for those saying play it on yur desktop, I think they should try seting up a bedside table and play eve while near their partner. I used to play wow but it is too much demanding on the hours and always actively attached to the keyboard.
On the other hand eve is a more relaxed game and the fact that most of the gameplay goes on preparation and setup i find it more challenging and amusing.
I am for letting people use their old pc to still play.
I think that being able to play on a laptop is a huge advantage on other games.
I agree with a small client to check market and skill change
I am in favour of a skill queue system (at least 3 skills)
I think CCP must stop podding system or let people insure their implants :)
But this may be the irrelevant view of an old 30 year old dude that still thinks he is a little boy playing pc games ^^.
only my 2 euro cents  |
Hollier
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:41:00 -
[763]
well said TONINU i wish i had your way with words |
CyberGh0st
Minmatar
Tribal Liberation Force
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Posted - 2009.01.15 14:56:00 -
[764]
Edited by: CyberGh0st on 15/01/2009 15:03:06
Edited by: CyberGh0st on 15/01/2009 15:00:35
Just want to clear up some misinformation about the Steam Hardware Survey :
1. There are more then 14% users with a DX8 or lower card, this is SM 1.x
However I am pretty sure this number will be alot less amongst EVE Online users, so the 5% SM 1.x users claimed by CCP will probably be quite close.
2. There are more then 10% users with a DX9 SM 2.0(b) card
You get this number when you take the 7,83% SM 2.0 users and add the 2,2% SM 2.0b users
However, it does not stop there, as I am sure that the percentage of EVE users with SM 2.0(b) cards is higher then the percentage of Steam users with SM 2.0(b) cards, as EVE users were never forced to upgrade up until now.
3. How does CCP go from 95% SM 2.0 users now, to 97% SM 3.0 users in Q4 2009? With the economical issues and alot of laptop users that just can't upgrade, I think it is safe to to say that the 97% SM 3.0 users by Q4 2009 is unrealistic, especially for EVE Online users.
Well if you force people, then you may be right, but then it is just a gamble of who will and who won't upgrade.
It is clear that we need an EVE online survey about this, before CCP looses customers and we loose friends and enemies.
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LordRyan77
Gallente
Ooops Inc.
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:08:00 -
[765]
Originally by: Sinigogo
Originally by: LordRyan77
Originally by: mattimus9
i don't understand why you people are getting all annoyed? to run an amazing game on a graphics technology now 7yrs old is amazing. they say that most computers should be replaced after 4yrs due to technology upgrades. to run any new game on a computer that old is always a struggle and CCP have to upgrade in the end otherwise EVE will become obsolete as other games improve.
I won't be able to use my laptop but luckily I have a PC and a new PC to be able to take version 3 you can get for about ú400 so maybe its time for you to upgrade!!!
Thats all fine and dandy as long as I don't have to replace my +$3,000(+ú2,300) 24 MONTH old PC.
If you managed to spend that amount of money on a PC 24 months ago that wont run SM2 graphics you're not really qualified to comment. That said, an SM2 capable card costs about as much as 10 packs of cigarettes these days. And also, 2 years is a small eternity on the hardware end of things. EVE is one of the very few games that actually runs on ancient cards to begin with, and this change will not affect that significantly.
Go CCP! More dev time on making things better, less on supporting cheap bastards, hurray!
I'm good, I went home and checked. I got GeForce 6 Series. I'm a console man, EVE is the only PC game I play.
Anyways back to the point, classic is a selling point for alot of people. Like many I use my laptop when traveliong. |
Zey Nadar
Gallente
Heavily Utilized Mechanic Mayhem
Einherjar Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:11:00 -
[766]
Edited by: Zey Nadar on 15/01/2009 15:14:07
Originally by: Rex Lashar
The biggest problem its going to cause is for people who want to log in and play or change skills from their laptops that have ****ty Intel chipsets. Unfortunately, there's probably a ton of those.
While I have a desktop with the specs to run this game, I originally loved how Eve was able to run on my laptop while some other MMOs did not. Then I could use a second account from my laptop for various reasons coordinating with my main account (hauling when im mining, scouting etc). I would still like this to continue without having to upgrade two machines.
If playing eve on my laptop becomes impossible, I may propably drop my second account.
ps. Update graphics for like planets and asteroids before you update overall graphics please. |
Cornelius Murphy
CEI Industries
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:32:00 -
[767]
I just ran the "TechPowerUp GPU-Z utility, as linked in this thread earlier. According to that, my laptop is running an ATI Mobility Radeon 9600/9700, and looks like it should be compatible.
Link to the stats: My Video Card
I am guessing the most important part is the "SM2.0". Can some tech head confirm I will be ok after March 10? My sub runs out in 5 days and there's no point extending it if not! |
David LeBatas
The Vorlon Empire
Skunk-Works
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:34:00 -
[768]
I am not sure if this was raised or covered in the thread, as there are too many posts that have nothing to offer but winge or specs (in the hope their crapped out old monster will still be supported).
So far, I have found the Eve client surprisingly robust on many machines, but what does concern me is parrallel clients. I don't use the premium client that much (not that I can't run it, or don't like it), but because I always run three clients at the same time. I know that many others do more and I distinctly remember that CCP demoed 10 parrallel clients before. Given that each additional client equates to increased revenue for CCP, I would be very surprised if they make it harder to run clients in parrallel.
However, if the new "lite" version has the same problems as running parrallel premium clients, I see a major problem comming up. I am not going to rack up multiple PCs, so I can play musical chairs to move between my three accounts. How is this new client with SM3 going to work with multiple clients running, even on the most highly powered PCs? |
Petar Quaresma
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:35:00 -
[769]
Originally by: Zey Nadar
Edited by: Zey Nadar on 15/01/2009 15:14:07
Originally by: Rex Lashar
The biggest problem its going to cause is for people who want to log in and play or change skills from their laptops that have ****ty Intel chipsets. Unfortunately, there's probably a ton of those.
While I have a desktop with the specs to run this game, I originally loved how Eve was able to run on my laptop while some other MMOs did not. Then I could use a second account from my laptop for various reasons coordinating with my main account (hauling when im mining, scouting etc). I would still like this to continue without having to upgrade two machines.
If playing eve on my laptop becomes impossible, I may propably drop my second account.
ps. Update graphics for like planets and asteroids before you update overall graphics please.
Ah yes, the all critical "asteroid and worthless planet" graphic update. Certainly a critical update to a game that needs massive gameplay overhauls to 0.0 and highsec. |
Mikalya
Amarr
Viziam
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:38:00 -
[770]
Originally by: Neylan
GREAT!
First Atari got in contact with Bioware and Never Winter Nights 2 lost its Linux und Mac support (not to mention the game wasn't as good as NWN 1).
And now Atari want's to make some money with Eve Online and suddenly it's important that Eve gets better graphic at the cost of Linux support.
Don't blame the NWN2 screw ups on Atari, that was 100% Obsidian's fiasco. I was in the NWN2 Toolset and Multi-player Betas, even our Beta Test Admin was getting annoyed with them 
My opinion of Atari went up during that period of time, my opinion of Obsidian turned into a burning hatred.....
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LordRyan77
Gallente
Ooops Inc.
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:44:00 -
[771]
Originally by: LordRyan77
Originally by: Sinigogo
Originally by: LordRyan77
Originally by: mattimus9
i don't understand why you people are getting all annoyed? to run an amazing game on a graphics technology now 7yrs old is amazing. they say that most computers should be replaced after 4yrs due to technology upgrades. to run any new game on a computer that old is always a struggle and CCP have to upgrade in the end otherwise EVE will become obsolete as other games improve.
I won't be able to use my laptop but luckily I have a PC and a new PC to be able to take version 3 you can get for about ú400 so maybe its time for you to upgrade!!!
Thats all fine and dandy as long as I don't have to replace my +$3,000(+ú2,300) 24 MONTH old PC.
If you managed to spend that amount of money on a PC 24 months ago that wont run SM2 graphics you're not really qualified to comment. That said, an SM2 capable card costs about as much as 10 packs of cigarettes these days. And also, 2 years is a small eternity on the hardware end of things. EVE is one of the very few games that actually runs on ancient cards to begin with, and this change will not affect that significantly.
Go CCP! More dev time on making things better, less on supporting cheap bastards, hurray!
I'm good, I went home and checked. I got GeForce 6 Series. I'm a console man, EVE is the only PC game I play.
Anyways back to the point, classic is a selling point for alot of people. Like many I use my laptop when traveliong.
Sorry at work had to cut response short. Anyways, I don't like classic. But like most eve players i am a working adult and spend a considerable amount of time playing on a laptop at a airport or a hotel room.
As far as affording a new PC, of course I could but my 2 yo main PC performs amazingily. I have no problems running 4 premium clients. The point is why replace a PC that preforms cause one aspect of your use changes. So why am complaining, mainily for the people who don't read these forums. And because my 2nd PC and laptop will no longer work.
LordRyan77 |
Dalmon Tar
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Posted - 2009.01.15 15:54:00 -
[772]
Originally by: AnyOldIron
No. The real joke is that the ones who want fancy graphics aren`t posting on here because they are off playing Halo 3 on their fancy 47 inch plasma TV, they are not playing eve or reading the forums.
Sure!
Thats why I use a nice and fancy new ubercomputer.
Why should we guys concern about classic and HighDef?
We just simple can play it ^^ |
Sader Rykane
Amarr
Midnight Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:09:00 -
[773]
Alright, I have no problem being forced to update my computer to play the game. I have an old Compaq V2000 series laptop that I run two classic clients on for mining and one for mission running. I'm definitly not sure whether it will be able to run premium light.
Right now, I'm an active college student and I unfortanatly had to quit my job and am in the process of searching for a new one. I had plans to upgrade my computer ASAP, and had even just slapped a one year subscription on both of my Eve accounts.
I need a way to change my skills, if I can't leave the station till I upgrade so be it, however I NEED a way to change skills etc while my account is active without actually having to log in to Premium lite (provided that my laptop cannot run premium lite, as I'm suspecting it cannot).
This would not be difficult to implement, and guess what CCP, you still get my money. However don't lock people out just because they cannot go out and get a new computer on such short notice.
In short:
Forcing us to upgrade is fine. Just allow people to change their skills without being forced to login.
...
Amateur sig maker Looking for work! |
Claire Voyant
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:14:00 -
[774]
I've been playing Eve for 4 years, but never been able to get it to run well on my computers. I've installed a new graphics card and additional memory on my old computer just to play Eve, but I've always been disappointed with the results. I'm currently playing on a $300 Dell with integrated graphics and it is actually running better playing two accounts than on my "gaming" machine.
One really frustrating thing about Eve is that performance has been getting worse as time goes on as CCP introduces improvements and fixes to make things "better" and "faster". At least with an off-the-shelf game I know how it will perform on the day I install it. I know that it's performance won't degrade if I keep playing it on the same computer.
Please, please, please, at least give us the option to play without graphics effects that don't effect how we actually play the game. I would be fine with just the overview on a black screen. At least I would be able to get where I'm going and target the bogeys when needed. When my FPS is below 10 the graphics are pretty useless anyway.
Someday I will get a rocking machine that I hope will get my FPS above 10, but in the mean time I will train Capital Ships V before the patch and cross my fingers. I hope I will be back after March 10.
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Aldiree Antima
Caldari
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:48:00 -
[775]
Originally by: Cornelius Murphy
I just ran the "TechPowerUp GPU-Z utility, as linked in this thread earlier. According to that, my laptop is running an ATI Mobility Radeon 9600/9700, and looks like it should be compatible.
Link to the stats: My Video Card
I am guessing the most important part is the "SM2.0". Can some tech head confirm I will be ok after March 10? My sub runs out in 5 days and there's no point extending it if not!
It looks OK, I think. Second opinion, plz.
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Crassus Silverwolf
Caldari
Liberty Forces
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Posted - 2009.01.15 16:58:00 -
[776]
CCP be wary of this change over and try not to rush to SM3 in the same year as switching to Premium Lite.
Many of us players play EVE whenever we have an opportunity whether that is at home on the Uber PC/Laptop or at work on the 10 year old laptop/pc. This has been one of the great things about playing EVE, I can get to work and play secretly (or not depending on the Boss), at the very least it has enabled a good deal of the player base to move stuff about on auto pilot, leaving the evenings free to play the more exciting elements of EVE.
I fully understand your desire to streamline your workloads etc but remember the graphics whilst amazing and beautiful should not be a barrier to entering the game on a low spec machine. So long as it does not mean double the work load in preparing upgrades and building ships etc please keep the Premium lite as low spec as possible.
If I can no longer play on a low spec machine at least I know that my work productiviy will get better and therefore you are at least helping me to do my job without distraction... :)
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Vorlich Dreculia
Amarr
Universal Business Solutions
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Posted - 2009.01.15 17:15:00 -
[777]
Edited by: Vorlich Dreculia on 15/01/2009 17:20:02
Why did this post blank?
I basically said that this is the most stupid idea ever; choosing to lose at least 5% of your customers in one fell swoop is not good business sense.
Also if I am not able to run the game any more, I will want a full refund for the entire life of my accounts; CCP would be changing a product after I had purchased it, so that I could no longer use it.
Similar cases have appeared in court in the UK and the companies have had to pay out.
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Zan Zabar
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Posted - 2009.01.15 17:22:00 -
[778]
i currently have cards that support sm4. and i would be interested in seeing eve support sli and physx cards.
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Marcus Arelios
Caldari
Global Sheep Enterprises
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Posted - 2009.01.15 17:43:00 -
[779]
Even though the graphics updates are not wanted by most players, they are necessary. Graphics are what is going to bring new players in. Lets see, if you tell a prospective new player, well the game looks like crap, but its gameplay is fun and complicated...good chance they'll find something else to play. A lot of the current players grew up with EVE from before premium so we are just used to the older graphics and don't notice it as much, but the newer ones will.
I full agree with CCP about updating the requirements, but I will agree with the players that pushing SM3 this soon might be a problem. SM2 is just fine, those cards are cheap and most laptops that play games support it, but SM3 is a little early yet.
A lot of players need to understand that forcing SM3 is something they are considering, not something they said they would do. I'd imagine that post was kind of a feeler to see what we thought. After this I doubt they'd force SM3. |
Vaerah Vain
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Posted - 2009.01.15 17:59:00 -
[780]
Quote:
Even though the graphics updates are not wanted by most players, they are necessary. Graphics are what is going to bring new players in. Lets see, if you tell a prospective new player, well the game looks like crap, but its gameplay is fun and complicated...good chance they'll find something else to play. A lot of the current players grew up with EVE from before premium so we are just used to the older graphics and don't notice it as much, but the newer ones will.
It's necessary, of course.
But look, Blizzard, the company that really have nothing to learn about getting huge amounts of subscriptions, upgraded their client from total rubbish to pixel shader + dynamic ligthing and my old computers can run it. Of course they will run with options turned off but **they run**. This is all you need to go on with your mining / lab / indy alts. Even Asteroids graphics would do.
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