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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:10:00 -
[481]
 Originally by: Fulbert
Next profession in EVE : Lawyer
Included new skills (Cha/Int) : Lawyer, Penal Law, Common Law, Contract Voiding, EULA Preservation, Money Laundering Formalization...
I think some people in this thread have already injected those skills and trained them to level 1, then got distracted and trained something else.
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[SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:10:00 -
[482]
Edited by: Tippia on 10/03/2011 18:13:30
Originally by: General Mujahideen Husseni
Even so, it'd be assumed proprietary material of that website.
àwhich they've offered everyone (including CCP) along with a "have fun!"
As for the impropriety, that's something the individual "customers" have to go after EN24 about ù IskBank and CCP are not involved in that particular scuffle.
Of course, none of this matters because it's no different than someone putting in a petition and saying "I think character X is RMT:ing" and CCP launching an investigation based on that.
ùùù
ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à
you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö
ù Karath Piki |
Cory Sopapilla
Minmatar
Kiroshi Group
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:12:00 -
[483]
Originally by: Cutter Isaacson
Read. this. slowly.
The list has been published on a public website, that means it is now in the public domain. That means it can be used by anybody.
Do. you. understand. yet?
Ah, so I guess all of those lawyers going after mp3 and movie sharers didn't know the law as well as you? I believe you also posted your credit card and contact info on a website called eveonline.com as well. eveonline.com is a public website and you "published" as soon as you hit the submit button.
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Nina Mercedez
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:16:00 -
[484]
Originally by: Burnharder
For the life of me I cannot understand why you'd play a game like Eve and then remove almost all of the sense of achievement buy buying your Isk.
Luckily those people exist. And luckily CCP gave us the PLEX feature.
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LHA Tarawa
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:19:00 -
[485]
Originally by: dexington
That is the same as saying you can publish eg. music in mp3 form on a public site and then it's no longer anyones property and now part of the public domain, unless you live in china things don't work that way.
music is copyrighted. It is highly unlikely that the content of this database was copyrighted.
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General Mujahideen Husseni
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:20:00 -
[486]
Originally by: Tippia
As for the impropriety, that's something the individual "customers" have to go after EN24 about ù IskBank and CCP are not involved in that particular scuffle.
I was only giving him an example of when information which is explicitly or implicitly fictitious can remain malicious.
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Ingvar Angst
Amarr
Omni Industrial Coalition
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:21:00 -
[487]
I get a kick out of these folks that think whether or not the list was obtained legally has any bearing at all on whether or not CCP can enforce their policy against engaging in RMT on their own computers.
You guys crack me up.
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Malcanis
Caldari
Alcohlics Anonymous
Scum Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:21:00 -
[488]
http://games.slashdot.org/story/11/03/10/1712207/In-Isk-We-Trust-the-EVE-Online-IskBank-Exposed#comments
ruh-roh...
Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players. |
Voogru
Gallente
Massive Damage
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:22:00 -
[489]
ISK Buyer Tears.
They are delicious!
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Jake Rivers
Caldari
Rule of Five
Split Infinity.
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:22:00 -
[490]
Originally by: Florestan Bronstein
Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 10/03/2011 15:16:50
Originally by: Hayaku Codolle
The second one and perhaps slightly less visual thing is that CCP is left out of the loop on RMT.
5,540 PLEX sitting idly just in this RMT shop's hangars - that's 96,900$ for CCP that they didn't have to provide any service for.
At the very least this RMT shop created enough PLEX demand to fund about one CCP employee all by itself (and create up to 2770 legit ISK buyers).
That is most likely a $96,000 loss for CCP if most of that plex was purchased through stolen credit card numbers, as in most cases of transactions with stolen cards, the monies are reversed as soon as the card is found to be used in fraudulent transactions.
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LHA Tarawa
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:23:00 -
[491]
Originally by: General Mujahideen Husseni
I also agree that it's not entirely compromising when I access a supermarket's database of customers and their information. Identitiy theft? Pffft. Doesn't exist.
Identity theft is a crime whether you stole the information or got it out of public information like property deeds, phone book or other publically available information.
It is that act of identity theft (pretending to be another person) that is the crime, not getting the name and number from a public posting of stolen information.
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General Mujahideen Husseni
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:24:00 -
[492]
Edited by: General Mujahideen Husseni on 10/03/2011 18:25:08
^
I was being sarcastic.
Originally by: Ingvar Angst
I get a kick out of these folks that think whether or not the list was obtained legally has any bearing at all on whether or not CCP can enforce their policy against engaging in RMT on their own computers.
You guys crack me up.
Uhhh, because in Western constitutional democracies there are protections against unlawful procurement of evidence i.e. wiretapping or hacking (unlawful access).
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:25:00 -
[493]
Originally by: General Mujahideen Husseni
Uhhh, because in Western constitutional democracies there are protections against unlawful procurement of evidence i.e. wiretapping or hacking (unlawful access).
àand since this is not a case of unlawful procurement of evidence, CCP can enforce their policy against engaging in RMT just fine.
ùùù
ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à
you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö
ù Karath Piki |
Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:27:00 -
[494]
Originally by: Jake Rivers
Originally by: Florestan Bronstein
Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 10/03/2011 15:16:50
Originally by: Hayaku Codolle
The second one and perhaps slightly less visual thing is that CCP is left out of the loop on RMT.
5,540 PLEX sitting idly just in this RMT shop's hangars - that's 96,900$ for CCP that they didn't have to provide any service for.
At the very least this RMT shop created enough PLEX demand to fund about one CCP employee all by itself (and create up to 2770 legit ISK buyers).
That is most likely a $96,000 loss for CCP if most of that plex was purchased through stolen credit card numbers, as in most cases of transactions with stolen cards, the monies are reversed as soon as the card is found to be used in fraudulent transactions.
Not necessarily. It depends on how the transactions are handled. Sometimes the financial institutions eat the cost, sometimes the retailers.
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[SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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dexington
Caldari
Baconoration
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:28:00 -
[495]
Originally by: Burnharder
I very much doubt a database used by someone engaged in criminal activity is covered by copyright law and as it's a database of online virtual characters, the Data Protection act doesn't come into play. There are various whistle-blower laws that take precedence in any case. And it IS criminal activity because I very much doubt the business in question charges VAT or pays state individual or business taxes on earnings.
The eula gives CCP the right to close accounts the make use of RMT, but that does not make anyone buying isk a criminal and their personal information would still be protected by normal laws. The company not paying taxes would not give CCP any special rights to their customer database.
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Malcanis
Caldari
Alcohlics Anonymous
Scum Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:29:00 -
[496]
Originally by: General Mujahideen Husseni
Edited by: General Mujahideen Husseni on 10/03/2011 18:25:08
^
I was being sarcastic.
Originally by: Ingvar Angst
I get a kick out of these folks that think whether or not the list was obtained legally has any bearing at all on whether or not CCP can enforce their policy against engaging in RMT on their own computers.
You guys crack me up.
Uhhh, because in Western constitutional democracies there are protections against unlawful procurement of evidence i.e. wiretapping or hacking (unlawful access).
Nope, just in one, as it turns out. And in any case those protections only apply to the courts, not to private businesses.
Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players. |
Centri Sixx
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:30:00 -
[497]
People are assuming the information matches and isn't being used for political gain. CCP can verify it but don't assume its that easy to do, considering the massive volume of transactions going on in EVE each day. Generally the specificity of detail argues against it, but the problem with an anonymous source stealing information is that they are an anonymous source stealing it. Whistleblowers are effective when they are inside the organization and can back it up with their position, and not just the hard data.
In other games, I'd probably be dropping these objections, but EVE is infamous for metagaming political warfare, and I have to look at this with more skepticism because of that. Hopefully we can get some follow-up and verification done.
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Washukanni
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:30:00 -
[498]
Originally by: Cutter Isaacson
Read. this. slowly.
The list has been published on a public website, that means it is now in the public domain. That means it can be used by anybody.
Do. you. understand. yet?
 oh dear...
You may wish to do some READING on the subject(it usually helps). Most national legislation and international conventions can be found online, plenty of website and database specific copyright and data protection material.. all in the name of education (and not making an idiot of yourself).
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Grindkore
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:35:00 -
[499]
How can a person spend several thousand real dollars on a internet spaceships game? I mean that would be good amount to to take to Vegas and to have a much more fun for a weekend. I can understand having multiple accounts to multibox and train alts, but buying ISK?
Perhaps I just don't take this "GAME" seriously, don't get me wrong I love EVE. But why would you spend that kind of money even if you are wealthy on intangible and worthless game currency?
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dexington
Caldari
Baconoration
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:39:00 -
[500]
Originally by: Grindkore
Perhaps I just don't take this "GAME" seriously, don't get me wrong I love EVE. But why would you spend that kind of money even if you are wealthy on intangible and worthless game currency?
It's their money, their account and their choice...
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General Mujahideen Husseni
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:42:00 -
[501]
Originally by: Malcanis
Nope, just in one, as it turns out. And in any case those protections only apply to the courts, not to private businesses.
I can't think it's really good business practice to make a judgment on third hand knowledge as well, when it involved the punishment of ******s who Pay Money For Internet Spaceships.
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Obsidian Hawk
RONA Legion
RONA Directorate
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:43:00 -
[502]
Massively has now reported on this. Now here comes the outside flames.
Once stuff like this hits the news it becomes big. CCP will be forced to take action.
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Malcanis
Caldari
Alcohlics Anonymous
Scum Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:45:00 -
[503]
Originally by: General Mujahideen Husseni
Originally by: Malcanis
Nope, just in one, as it turns out. And in any case those protections only apply to the courts, not to private businesses.
I can't think it's really good business practice to make a judgment on third hand knowledge as well, when it involved the punishment of ******s who Pay Money For Internet Spaceships.
You're probably right, but that's neither here nor there: it's entirely CCP's decision. As said dozens of times already, CCP are 100% enabled to use the list as the basis for investigations, and no-one will take seriously any attempt to say that they aren't regardless of how much contorted logic, smokescreens and strawmen certain people in this thread attempt to apply.
Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players. |
Ingvar Angst
Amarr
Omni Industrial Coalition
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:52:00 -
[504]
Originally by: dexington
Originally by: Grindkore
Perhaps I just don't take this "GAME" seriously, don't get me wrong I love EVE. But why would you spend that kind of money even if you are wealthy on intangible and worthless game currency?
It's their money, their account and their choice...
Actually, the account belongs to CCP. You pay for the privilege of being allowed to access the account on their machines and modify the data as you see fit, provided you do so within the terms of the EULA agreement.
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.10 18:58:00 -
[505]
Originally by: dexington
Originally by: Grindkore
Perhaps I just don't take this "GAME" seriously, don't get me wrong I love EVE. But why would you spend that kind of money even if you are wealthy on intangible and worthless game currency?
It's their money, their account and their choice...
No, it's CCP's intellectual property, including your characters. Read the EULA.
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Linda Flamewalker
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:01:00 -
[506]
Originally by: General Mujahideen Husseni
Originally by: Malcanis
Nope, just in one, as it turns out. And in any case those protections only apply to the courts, not to private businesses.
I can't think it's really good business practice to make a judgment on third hand knowledge as well, when it involved the punishment of ******s who Pay Money For Internet Spaceships.
Why do people assume CCP will make judgements based solely on this?! Of course they will investigate said people and if they find out the person has been buiying isk.. banhammer time.
Its not like they go "oh someone claimed.. ok ban" if they did.. we wouldnt have the constant *****ing about RMT and botting.
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:10:00 -
[507]
Originally by: Linda Flamewalker
Its not like they go "oh someone claimed.. ok ban" if they did.. we wouldnt have the constant *****ing about RMT and botting.
We'd have goons /petitioning everyone they come across for RMT and botting. 
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[SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:10:00 -
[508]
Originally by: Linda Flamewalker
Why do people assume CCP will make judgements based solely on this?!
Because that assumption opens a tiny window of hope, where proving the list as inadmissible or illegal to use would mean that their alts are safeà 
ùùù
ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à
you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö
ù Karath Piki |
Borun Tal
Minmatar
Space Pods Inc
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:10:00 -
[509]
That's just friggin' sad. Some of you take this GAME way too freakin' seriously...
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:13:00 -
[510]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Linda Flamewalker
Why do people assume CCP will make judgements based solely on this?!
Because that assumption opens a tiny window of hope, where proving the list as inadmissible or illegal to use would mean that their alts are safeà
Considering what some people have stated in this thread about supporting RMT, I would venture a guess you hit the nail on the head.
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