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Ghost Training to be Removed

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Hertford Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:23:00 - [271] Originally by: Inanna Zuni Originally by: Hertford Originally by: Inanna Zuni News for Snarker. SUBSCRIBERS PAY. People running 'ghost accounts' do not. They shouldn't benefit therefore! People running 'ghost accounts' do indeed pay. Just not 100% of the time. If someone is paying for only 3 months out of every 6, they're still paying. Ghost Training isn't free, merely *cheaper*. So you pay for 3 months and you get 3 months training (and playing time). makes sense. You don't pay for 3 months and you get nothing in return. seems reasonable/(TANSTAAFL) So, overall, what is wrong with that? Absolutely nothing, I for one actually think CCP is perfectly justified in making this change. However, as many people have posted, 'ghost training' was a nice little bonus, something that made training up an alt cheaper, and thus well worth doing, and I think this change is unnecessary, risky and unpopular. I just wanted to call you out on a stupid statement that wasn't true.
Orion Moonstar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:23:00 - [272] Originally by: Inanna Zuni Spewing shit from somewhere The point is that Eve isn't actually a good enough game to take away what small benefits it has. Analogy: A dude has just fallen off of a cliff, but another person catches their arm before they plummet into oblivion. Now the person who's life was just saved is insulting their savior while pulling out arm hairs. http://www.dariusjohnson.org/dec20bobts.mp3 http://www.daitengu.com/ohgod/dec20bobts.mp3
Salpad Caldari Carebears with Attitude	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:24:00 - [273] Originally by: JafoPBCFR Ok great. Now make the skill times less that way when you hit the 30-90 day training you dont want to cancel while you train. WOW that would make sense wouldnt it? Nahhh It would remove that TIMESINK wouldnt it. No, the long training times for level 5 skillz are fine. The problem isn't that level 5s take a long time, but that many level 5s are trained not because the player truly, deeply, sincerely wants the actual effect of that specific level 5, but only because the level 5 is a prerequisite for something that the player does want. Of course there are level 5s that are actually desirable. I didn't train Caldari Battleship to 5 so I could train Marauder skill. I trained Caldari Battleship to 5 because I want the sweet bonus it gives me. However, in many other cases, specific skillz are trained to five only because the game forces players to. Skillz prerequisites needs to be looked at, thoroughly, and many of the level 5 prerequisites are stupid, and need to be lowered to level 4. That's how simple it is. If CCP implements this change, many players will rejoice and be happy. -- Salpad
kublai Art of War	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:24:00 - [274] How stupid do you think we are? I'll be selling a character before the month ends as a result of this, with this little "balancing" issue there's no way I can afford 4 accounts, certainly not after you blew the GTC price throug the damn roof. We'll see how long it takes me to go down to two accounts, congrats CCP, that's one less payday from me, I won't quit the game, but I will buy one gtc less per month as will many many others. Not to mention the hundreds of people who quit eve long ago and only buy a gtc now and then to keep skilling, talk about shooting yourself in the foot. A-War Recruiting
Inanna Zuni Minmatar The Causality Electus Matari	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:24:00 - [275] Originally by: Cueball Mcfuzz You're a collosal idiot if you think that the ability to take a break and still advance wasn't deeply satisfying to those of us who don't ********** over CCP and play constantly. Try to connect with the non-insane portion of the crowd and see how taking away this small small advantage for no good reason takes away a tremendous portion of good feeling and goodwill. If it was such a "small small" advantage then how come 11 pages of mostly bleating? It isn't! It is a massive disadvantage to players (ie those who actually pay their subscriptions) to let other people get such a benefit without paying for it. It devalues their subscription. You don't get education for free on Earth so why should you expect to get it for free in Eve? My principles
Caiman Graystock Comrades in Construction Anarchy.	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:24:00 - [276] People aren't getting something for free any more wah wah.
More money Erasers inc.	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:24:00 - [277] You should give us free game time every extra DT what you F*** up. No more apogolizes you need to give us something back... PS: did all your bamk take your monies and you need to do this?
TheG2 Gallente Dirty Rotten Scoundrels	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:25:00 - [278] Looks like its time to start looking at other MMO's. One of the nice things about EVE was that you didn't need to grind to play and overtime you'd just get better, but I don't see a point, I'll just go play another game. It's been fun, but recent changes and this nonsense are just another sign CCP has lost its way.
Miner Wyvern	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:25:00 - [279] As a dual account holder, I agree to this action wholeheartedly, however, I do think that greater throught should be put through before making this change perminant.. So here's my two cents worth. We all know ghost training DOES affect player skill balances, and DOES impact your wallet, HOWEVER... Just cutting it off without a means to compromise is thoughtless and destructive. I agree with the small percentage of the forum who isnt just upset about not being able to train 4 characters at the same time for virtually free. If one dosent pay, one should't train, but, if you are going to do this, you should enable the ability to train skills on more then one character on the SAME account with a SINGLE SKILL queue. That way people can train skills on 2-3 accounts LIKE THEY DO ANYWAYS, but be able to do it next to their main account which they, in all likelyhood, spend more time on anyway. The single skill queue, balances things out abit more as you can plan skills that go through downtime, or train a second skill to kick in if you do decide to leave your alt inactive for a few months while you blow crap up in a titan, or whathave you. Of course, these changes, however, will NOT affect people who use two seperate clients to multi-task specific roles or jobs. I do realize that a fair few ammount of multi-client fans are out there, but seeing as they ALREADY PAY to participate in these activities, there wouldnt be any loss in that area, if anything, it might help to promote multi-client participation. Instigating change without fair recompence will only lead to additional issues, please think it over abit more before taking any radical steps.. If anything else.. If you DO put on multi-character skill training.. Just think of all the money you would get just from character transfer transactions..
Illectroculus Defined	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:25:00 - [280] Darn - and I was about to use this trick, give myself a month off and spend some quality time with my family while I trained up Caldari Battleship V - I'm sure I can tear myself away from the game for long enough to spend some time with them on thanksgiving. (my 3 year old daughter Skye calls Eve the 'shooting game' and would like to have the portrait editor as a standalone toy if you've got some spare time) No complaints here to be honest, CCP has been overly generous with this in the past and I'm not surprised that CCP is nixing this. But it would also be nice to get a skill queue or at the very least automagicly train the next level enabled sometime sooner rather than later.
TheAdj Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [281] Originally by: Inanna Zuni Originally by: Snarker What the hell, nice work CCP, you just lost tons of subscribers. News for Snarker. SUBSCRIBERS PAY. People running 'ghost accounts' do not. They shouldn't benefit therefore! TANSTAAFL You've gotta be an ISD guy or something trying to white knight. People who ghost train resub and keep playing, usually they stopped playing for a reason and return (burnt out, RL caught up, etc). Going "hey at least I can train up BS5 or ASC5 so I can keep working on getting into a carrier" is enough to offset people being unable to actually play for a bit. This change removes that, and a lot of people will simply just not return after a break because they're still exactly the same as when they left, whereas everyone else kept training. This is a poorly thought out change and the shitty excuse in the OP proves that. Hopefully this monstrous threadnaught proves the point to CCP and they drop this really poor idea. ----------------
jackarse	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [282] well il be down to 2 accounts from 5 its your lose so why do it
Bonefish O'Hallahan GoonFleet	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [283] Originally by: Inanna Zuni Originally by: Hertford Originally by: Inanna Zuni News for Snarker. SUBSCRIBERS PAY. People running 'ghost accounts' do not. They shouldn't benefit therefore! People running 'ghost accounts' do indeed pay. Just not 100% of the time. If someone is paying for only 3 months out of every 6, they're still paying. Ghost Training isn't free, merely *cheaper*. So you pay for 3 months and you get 3 months training (and playing time). makes sense. You don't pay for 3 months and you get nothing in return. seems reasonable/(TANSTAAFL) So, overall, what is wrong with that? If it had always been this way, golden. What we had in ghost training was a relatively unique feature that appealed to the casual player who LIKES to take breaks from Eve and come back to a slightly advanced skill. The feature (which was apparently massively unfair to CCP, fellate them some more please) was a low cost issue that actively encouraged part-time players to keep more accounts and come back when they did unsubscribe- some of us DO unsubscribe regularly. There's no earthly reason to take it away and not expect a backlash from those of us who have, right or wrong, grown to expect it. Sad truth is, there will be an impact on the bottom line now and all new players will just accept that this is the way it is. It's probably good business in the long run, but it shows VERY clearly that CCP's motivations continue to be antithetical to pleasing the playerbase.
Agrikk	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [284] Another multi account player against this move. I've never ghosted on any of my accounts, but also have never felt somehow cheated because of those who do.
Orion Moonstar GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [285] Originally by: Jalxan On a side note, I believe those who are more active online, should be rewarded with an increased skillpoint accumulation rate. That would keep a LOT of people online for longer. I'd certainly keep both of my accounts logged on to the box that doesn't even have a monitor on it that sits in my closet. Online doesnt mean active, moreso in eve http://www.dariusjohnson.org/dec20bobts.mp3 http://www.daitengu.com/ohgod/dec20bobts.mp3
Capota	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [286] Originally by: Audrea Everything logical and sensible has already been said, now we gotta wait for ccp to get back on their feets from the crash landing from the moon... hopefully Well if they don't get back o their feet soon at least i hope they realise that they will lose allot of players ,and instead of 42K player they will have 21K in a verry short time.. Good job CCP , keep it this way and you will lose everything in a few days.
Ure Doom	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:26:00 - [287] Worst Change Ever Totally unjustified money grab that will backfire badly on CCP
Carlani Hudson	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:27:00 - [288] This is very, very bad idea, that shouldn't even have passed the drawing board.
Rana Tekkren Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:27:00 - [289] I totally endorse this change. I think people with fat wallets IRL should have an advantage over those who haven't. Live with it. Money makes the world go around!
I m Minmatar BWR Gamers Legion of Honor	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:27:00 - [290] WTF ..first GTC's and now this ....ccp u start to make this game worst than better , LAGGY SERV , nerf speed , expensive gtcs , and now not ghost train anymore ... if the gtc's will be cheaper that will be ok but ...u want to losse more and more player _____ STEP UP NOW !
Darvin Felth Oberon Incorporated	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:27:00 - [291] Originally by: CCP Fallout We understand that this is a hot topic amongst players . You guys fail Your present from Harry will be in the post ... Smoking Whippets since 1967 ....
Ocerdyn Royal Production Society	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:28:00 - [292] Edited by: Ocerdyn on 13/10/2008 18:28:57 Edited by: Ocerdyn on 13/10/2008 18:28:00 Originally by: Inanna Zuni So you pay for 3 months and you get 3 months training (and playing time). makes sense. You don't pay for 3 months and you get nothing in return. seems reasonable/(TANSTAAFL) So, overall, what is wrong with that? You would perhaps have a point in it wasn't 5 years into the game and training while unsubbed wasn't a major selling point that probably a majority of players have enjoyed. Have you ever considered that maybe, just maybe, training unsubbed was one of the perks of playing EVE and it's your own fault that you've never taken advantage of it?
Getmore Alts	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:28:00 - [293] Originally by: SiJira next change from ccp is your skills stop training when you go offline Wait, I have a better idea: Your skills will train when you are online and killing npc-s!
Bloody Rabbit Jita Miners	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:28:00 - [294] Originally by: Snarker What the hell, nice work CCP, you just lost tons of subscribers. Yes CCP You just lost subscribers who aren't paying; its your loss!!! PS I will still keep my 3 accounts active...even when I'm sent away for a few months Originally by: Shadarle I notice a lot of people who are very bad at playing the market tend to want CCP to step in and remove the competition from the market so they don't continue coming in last place.[/qu
Ramiren	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:29:00 - [295] 12 Pages and still no offical response.. Do they even deserve our cash?
Vek NaVek	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:29:00 - [296] The interesting thing about this is that, people who 'ghost train' have more than one account, and while CCP will more than likely keep the number of people who play eve, they will just be getting less $ from them. This is probably a calculated move based on increasing subscription, but I do honestly think it will backfire. Those who were paying for 6months/year will now no longer bother with that extra account and more than likely not make it a full 12month sub.
ignobil	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:30:00 - [297] anyone knows any pirate eve server??? i think i will ear this a lot now or even better: hey!!! look this new eve like mmo "bla bla" is great!!! came on! it¦s new :D eve isn¦t a new game and like all older games can¦t afford to lose as many players as something like this does, so ccp you should think on that a little better.
the Burglar	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:30:00 - [298] Originally by: Bonefish O'Hallahan What this was was a nice way for people to get perhaps an extra 15 days (at most!) of skill training and feel like, "man, I'm getting my money's worth here! I can't wait to come back to eve after my break!" Some of us have real lives, take real breaks, and aren't tremendous basement dwelling MMORPG ***s. I feel exactly the same, with a real life its good to be able to ake a break instead and know that you actually have something new to look forward to when you reactivate your account. I recently reactivated my account ONLY because i knew that my Battleship lvl 5 was complete in a few hours. But seeing the lack of CCP responses i think they just don't give a f* and are giving the marketing-guy a raise for his splendid money-making-idea. This will mean that you will loose another $209.94 a year from me, since i will get rid of my alt-char.
Rouque Vanderbuilt Nuts and Bolts	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:30:00 - [299] Epic fail...
Acobar Minmatar Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2008.10.13 18:30:00 - [300] I am hopeful that the changes are due to skill queuing, but if not I will be downsizing from five accounts to two. Ideas: "Opt-in" or "opt-out" of skill queuing, which would allow both sides to be happy. If you opt-in you can't train accounts when account is not active. If you aren't then you can.... Why don't you offer the ability for people to pay for training rights on a per character basis. Don't charge full price, but a somewhat lessened amount to promote it's use. By increasing the number of characters per account you would solve the multiple account gripes and complaints. We all have numerous accounts for training only, so allow us to train numerous characters on one account for a "service fee" plus a per character charge. Agony is recruiting Joining Agony

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