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| Author | Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 42 post(s) |
 Spaja Saist    |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:44:00 -
[1411]
Because he has the dumbest ideas. |
 Spaja Saist Gallente Void Engineers |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:44:00 -
[1412]
Because he has the dumbest ideas. |
 Squid Lord |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:48:00 -
[1413] Well The lag will be reduced on the servers due to all the people, including me, that cancel their account due to the fact that people grow tired of CCP FORCING major changes onto PAYING customers and not caring what we think or feel. Hit them in the pocket book HARD. That is the only thing they care about. Squid Lord |
 Squid Lord |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:48:00 -
[1414] Well The lag will be reduced on the servers due to all the people, including me, that cancel their account due to the fact that people grow tired of CCP FORCING major changes onto PAYING customers and not caring what we think or feel. Hit them in the pocket book HARD. That is the only thing they care about. Squid Lord |
 Spaja Saist |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:49:00 -
[1415]
Putting flowers on a pile of **** isn't going to change the smell. |
Spaja Saist Gallente Void Engineers |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:49:00 -
[1416]
Putting flowers on a pile of **** isn't going to change the smell. |
 Hllaxiu |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:50:00 -
[1417] As to "OMG Webbing at 45km!" - drones are rarely used beyond range 20, especially heavy drones due to bugged travel and recall and their slow lumbering nature for such small ships. I wouldn't really worry about it too much. I would however worry about balance in the 0-25km spectrum where medium range (~10-40km) is going to be preferred over short range (~0-10km) which plays into the hands of autocannons and pulses and reduces the tactical viability of blasters in situations such as gate/station camps where distances are preset. But my fears may be misplaced. I'll wait on the test server. This may actually be a interesting change for drones if its done correctly. |
 Hllaxiu Shiva Morsus Mihi |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:50:00 -
[1418] As to "OMG Webbing at 45km!" - drones are rarely used beyond range 20, especially heavy drones due to bugged travel and recall and their slow lumbering nature for such small ships. I wouldn't really worry about it too much. I would however worry about balance in the 0-25km spectrum where medium range (~10-40km) is going to be preferred over short range (~0-10km) which plays into the hands of autocannons and pulses and reduces the tactical viability of blasters in situations such as gate/station camps where distances are preset. But my fears may be misplaced. I'll wait on the test server. This may actually be a interesting change for drones if its done correctly. --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson |
 Squid Lord |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:55:00 -
[1419]
Agreed. They do not care. Period End of Story. Dominixs are now totally worthless. Thanks for NOTHING CCP!. My money and alot of other peoples money they will miss. |
Squid Lord |
Posted - 2005.11.02 00:55:00 -
[1420]
Agreed. They do not care. Period End of Story. Dominixs are now totally worthless. Thanks for NOTHING CCP!. My money and alot of other peoples money they will miss. |
 Spaja Saist |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:05:00 -
[1421]
I'm with ya. If these changes go through I'm done. I used to really enjoy this game. |
Spaja Saist Gallente Void Engineers |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:05:00 -
[1422]
I'm with ya. If these changes go through I'm done. I used to really enjoy this game. |
Maya Rkell |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:07:00 -
[1423] Can I have your stuff? Good riddance. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
 Maya Rkell Forsaken Empire The Forsaken Empire |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:07:00 -
[1424] Can I have your stuff? Good riddance. //Maya |
 newbalt |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:15:00 -
[1425] Edited by: newbalt on 02/11/2005 01:17:20 Two the last two people whinging about the dominix, at the moment the only ' omgaaadnurf' to its abilities is its mining amount with mining drones. It'll do pretty much the same amount of damage it did before. Argh wrong character again, this noob alt is pretty addictive maybe i'll go flame bob and 5 in the corporation, alliance and organization discussions forums!  |
 newbalt |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:15:00 -
[1426] Edited by: newbalt on 02/11/2005 01:17:20 Two the last two people whinging about the dominix, at the moment the only ' omgaaadnurf' to its abilities is its mining amount with mining drones. It'll do pretty much the same amount of damage it did before. Argh wrong character again, this noob alt is pretty addictive maybe i'll go flame bob and 5 in the corporation, alliance and organization discussions forums! |
Darpz |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:17:00 -
[1427] not sure if its been asked but are the new ECM and dampening drones effected by the Electronic skills that effect the ship modules of those types? |
Maya Rkell |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:17:00 -
[1428]
The targeting and probably some of the other issues are lag-related and hence exactly what they ARE fixing. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted." |
 Darpz Rampage Eternal Ka-Tet |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:17:00 -
[1429] not sure if its been asked but are the new ECM and dampening drones effected by the Electronic skills that effect the ship modules of those types? |
Maya Rkell Forsaken Empire The Forsaken Empire |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:17:00 -
[1430]
The targeting and probably some of the other issues are lag-related and hence exactly what they ARE fixing. //Maya |
 Jania Royale |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:21:00 -
[1431] Edited by: Jania Royale on 02/11/2005 01:21:19 mebbe Im a bit of a masochist, cause these changes wouldnt drive me away from eve. they just hurt. bad. I can look forward to my ships of choice, dronecarriers, being Broken and the drone system (which is fine in concept and only need Repair, not replacement) being thrown away. why? Lag? not buying that excuse. possible overpowering due to new dronetypes? big possibility. so why introduce new items Simply to break the system they are supposed to improve? if those ewar drones are so overpowering, why use them? why no think Smart, like Heavy stacking penalties that make having more then 2 in space pointless, or (gasp) a size increase, so people who want to deploy these snazzy new drones Give Up their flexibility. lot of better ways to add your lovely new content. These changes are a smackdown to drone specialists. |
 Jania Royale |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:21:00 -
[1432] Edited by: Jania Royale on 02/11/2005 01:21:19 mebbe Im a bit of a masochist, cause these changes wouldnt drive me away from eve. they just hurt. bad. I can look forward to my ships of choice, dronecarriers, being Broken and the drone system (which is fine in concept and only need Repair, not replacement) being thrown away. why? Lag? not buying that excuse. possible overpowering due to new dronetypes? big possibility. so why introduce new items Simply to break the system they are supposed to improve? if those ewar drones are so overpowering, why use them? why no think Smart, like Heavy stacking penalties that make having more then 2 in space pointless, or (gasp) a size increase, so people who want to deploy these snazzy new drones Give Up their flexibility. lot of better ways to add your lovely new content. These changes are a smackdown to drone specialists. |
 Hllaxiu |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:22:00 -
[1433]
"Sticking" and the lack of/random MWDing are the important issues currently. |
Hllaxiu Shiva Morsus Mihi |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:22:00 -
[1434]
"Sticking" and the lack of/random MWDing are the important issues currently. --- Our greatest glory is not in never failing, but in rising up every time we fail. - Emerson |
DarK |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:24:00 -
[1435] All the miners moaning that a BATTLEship won't be an uberminer is just funny. Mining != battle with asteroids. Too bad, so ******* sad. Your money they won't miss, having 1 less moaner will compensate for that. |
 DarK STK Scientific |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:24:00 -
[1436] All the miners moaning that a BATTLEship won't be an uberminer is just funny. Mining != battle with asteroids. Too bad, so ******* sad. Your money they won't miss, having 1 less moaner will compensate for that. |
Kaell Meynn |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:55:00 -
[1437]
Now, now, no need to get snippy. Tux is an intelligent man, and i'm sure after seeing the issues pointed out he'll work on a way to resolve them. He clearly did not mean to nerf the Dominix and other drone carriers with this change... it was an oversight I'm sure he'll correct before implementation. Just like the Thermal only damage thing, it was pointed out, he saw that it wasn't good, and he fixed it. Now he just needs to fix the issues with all other drones.. mining, ECM, Web, etc, etc... because there isn't just damage drones in the game. In case you missed it TUX, here is (yet another) explanation of the issues... 1) Boosting HPs across the board will help non-drone carriers more than it will help drone carrier ships, and yet drone carriers are the ones that need it more, as they rely on drones for survival. (feel free to ask if you dont understand how this is the case) 2) Doubling of HPs for non-drone carriers and Trippling of HPs for drone carriers will not make them as survivable as they are currently, because half of their survivability is in that you have to lock each one individually, which takes a long time. Perhaps if you make them take 3 times as long to be locked in addition to trippling their HPs, this would make them as survivable. 3) These new non-damage drones will not be a viable alternative for drone carrier ships, as it'll take a larger portion of their damage drones effectiveness than it will for non-drone carrier ships, relagating these new drones to be used by only non-drone carriers, rather the opposite of what you'd expect. Clearly an indicator that something is wrong. If drone carriers are currently balanced, and not in need of a nerf, then why make them have to give up 3 drones to use a new feature, when everyone else only has to give up (at most) 2 drones to use the same features. Actually, less than 2, since many/most non-drone users dont have drone interfacing, so they are only giving up 1 combat drone of damage to use the new drones, but drone-carriers have to give up 3?! 4) Drone Carriers currently used for mining operations have been just outright ruined without a second thought. 5 Mining Drone II's that do 3 times as much damage as they used to (they do zero damage for those that don't know) are not as effective as 15 Mining Drone II's, CLEARLY. In fact, they are 1/3 as effective, which is clearly a HUGE nerf of their drone mining capability (66% reduction for those that suck at math). Thanks again for your time Tux, and please let us know that you realize that these issues exist, even if you dont have a solution to them yet... Kaell |
 Kaell Meynn Divergence |
Posted - 2005.11.02 01:55:00 -
[1438]
Now, now, no need to get snippy. Tux is an intelligent man, and i'm sure after seeing the issues pointed out he'll work on a way to resolve them. He clearly did not mean to nerf the Dominix and other drone carriers with this change... it was an oversight I'm sure he'll correct before implementation. Just like the Thermal only damage thing, it was pointed out, he saw that it wasn't good, and he fixed it. Now he just needs to fix the issues with all other drones.. mining, ECM, Web, etc, etc... because there isn't just damage drones in the game. In case you missed it TUX, here is (yet another) explanation of the issues... 1) Boosting HPs across the board will help non-drone carriers more than it will help drone carrier ships, and yet drone carriers are the ones that need it more, as they rely on drones for survival. (feel free to ask if you dont understand how this is the case) 2) Doubling of HPs for non-drone carriers and Trippling of HPs for drone carriers will not make them as survivable as they are currently, because half of their survivability is in that you have to lock each one individually, which takes a long time. Perhaps if you make them take 3 times as long to be locked in addition to trippling their HPs, this would make them as survivable. 3) These new non-damage drones will not be a viable alternative for drone carrier ships, as it'll take a larger portion of their damage drones effectiveness than it will for non-drone carrier ships, relagating these new drones to be used by only non-drone carriers, rather the opposite of what you'd expect. Clearly an indicator that something is wrong. If drone carriers are currently balanced, and not in need of a nerf, then why make them have to give up 3 drones to use a new feature, when everyone else only has to give up (at most) 2 drones to use the same features. Actually, less than 2, since many/most non-drone users dont have drone interfacing, so they are only giving up 1 combat drone of damage to use the new drones, but drone-carriers have to give up 3?! 4) Drone Carriers currently used for mining operations have been just outright ruined without a second thought. 5 Mining Drone II's that do 3 times as much damage as they used to (they do zero damage for those that don't know) are not as effective as 15 Mining Drone II's, CLEARLY. In fact, they are 1/3 as effective, which is clearly a HUGE nerf of their drone mining capability (66% reduction for those that suck at math). Thanks again for your time Tux, and please let us know that you realize that these issues exist, even if you dont have a solution to them yet... Kaell |
j0sephine |
Posted - 2005.11.02 02:08:00 -
[1439] Edited by: j0sephine on 02/11/2005 02:18:16 "2) Doubling of HPs for non-drone carriers and Trippling of HPs for drone carriers will not make them as survivable as they are currently, because half of their survivability is in that you have to lock each one individually, which takes a long time. Perhaps if you make them take 3 times as long to be locked in addition to trippling their HPs, this would make them as survivable." Auto-lock back in the client settings allows you to simultaneously lock on up to 7-9 drones or so, depending on the ship and skills. Then while killing these drones you simply switch to 'drones only' overview mode, and as soon as one of the locked drones is dead you ctrl-click another drone in overview that isn't indicated as already locked, and proceed to kill the already-locked drone(s) meantime. This means that aside from initial lock time, there's practically no pause at all while one is killing the drones. As such, there's no reason to increase lock time on drones from what it is currently, because the survability being in part due to having to lock on each and single one of them... is a fallacy. "If drone carriers are currently balanced, and not in need of a nerf, then why make them have to give up 3 drones to use a new feature, when everyone else only has to give up (at most) 2 drones to use the same features. Actually, less than 2, since many/most non-drone users dont have drone interfacing, so they are only giving up 1 combat drone of damage to use the new drones, but drone-carriers have to give up 3?!" This is wrong -- one drone out of five on drone carrier can indeed mean giving up on more damage than the same drone would do on ship with less skill and no bonus, but the fraction of firepower is the same if not smaller, because _all_ five drones of highly skilled drone carrier are more effective than these of non-drone carrier. E.g: non-drone carrier has 3 drones doing 2 damage each. they give up one drone, reducing damage output of 6 down to 4, i.e. by 33% drone carrier has 5 drones doing 3 damage each. they give up one drone, reducing damage output of 15 down to 12, i.e. by 20% you can easily see who is losing bigger part of their total firepower here, to make use of the new features... |
 j0sephine Caldari Reikoku Band of Brothers |
Posted - 2005.11.02 02:08:00 -
[1440] Edited by: j0sephine on 02/11/2005 02:18:16 "2) Doubling of HPs for non-drone carriers and Trippling of HPs for drone carriers will not make them as survivable as they are currently, because half of their survivability is in that you have to lock each one individually, which takes a long time. Perhaps if you make them take 3 times as long to be locked in addition to trippling their HPs, this would make them as survivable." Auto-lock back in the client settings allows you to simultaneously lock on up to 7-9 drones or so, depending on the ship and skills. Then while killing these drones you simply switch to 'drones only' overview mode, and as soon as one of the locked drones is dead you ctrl-click another drone in overview that isn't indicated as already locked, and proceed to kill the already-locked drone(s) meantime. This means that aside from initial lock time, there's practically no pause at all while one is killing the drones. As such, there's no reason to increase lock time on drones from what it is currently, because the survability being in part due to having to lock on each and single one of them... is a fallacy. "If drone carriers are currently balanced, and not in need of a nerf, then why make them have to give up 3 drones to use a new feature, when everyone else only has to give up (at most) 2 drones to use the same features. Actually, less than 2, since many/most non-drone users dont have drone interfacing, so they are only giving up 1 combat drone of damage to use the new drones, but drone-carriers have to give up 3?!" This is wrong -- one drone out of five on drone carrier can indeed mean giving up on more damage than the same drone would do on ship with less skill and no bonus, but the fraction of firepower is the same if not smaller, because _all_ five drones of highly skilled drone carrier are more effective than these of non-drone carrier. E.g: non-drone carrier has 3 drones doing 2 damage each. they give up one drone, reducing damage output of 6 down to 4, i.e. by 33% drone carrier has 5 drones doing 3 damage each. they give up one drone, reducing damage output of 15 down to 12, i.e. by 20% you can easily see who is losing bigger part of their total firepower here, to make use of the new features... |
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Originally by: Denrace
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