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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 8 post(s) |
Phaade
Perimeter Defense Systems
356
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 16:59:54 -
[1321] - Quote
Senov Belis wrote:+1 to the "not playing anymore" list.
All I do is follow my FC and shoot things. If this is no longer possible, bye, I can not give you money anymore.
Good, one less f1 monkey.
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16220
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 17:06:34 -
[1322] - Quote
Lan Wang wrote:baltec1 wrote:Lan Wang wrote:
so because you're overlord fc's have mastered fleet fights you want them nerfed so its harder for any upcoming/learning fc to engage in fleet fights? what a selfish thing to say
That is like saying it was selfish of us to tell CCP they needed to nerf tracking titans. We stand to lose the most from this change as our tactics rely heavily upon one guy in the fleet doing nearly all the work. yeah that was a pretty sh!t thing to say on my part and tbh i cant even think of any sort of comeback because it was so terrible, sorry i actually dont really know why i even posted that.
You are a rare gem.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16221
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 17:20:27 -
[1323] - Quote
Miner Hottie wrote:
Nope. Now you're just dodging the real issue (wormholes) and being that guy :getout:
Wormholes operate in the same way as any other area of space when it comes to scanning stuff down with scouts. If anything WH entities should have an advantage after this change in having more experienced probing pilots per head in their organisations.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
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xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
283
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 17:24:35 -
[1324] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Miner Hottie wrote:
Nope. Now you're just dodging the real issue (wormholes) and being that guy :getout:
Wormholes operate in the same way as any other area of space when it comes to scanning stuff down with scouts. If anything WH entities should have an advantage after this change in having more experienced probing pilots per head in their organisations.
nail on the head and it's not exactly hard these days to probe. so all people gotta do is up the scout numbers and train more probers. |
Juan Mileghere
Incident Command Southern Star Dominion
31
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 17:48:19 -
[1325] - Quote
Literally this fixes/changes nothing except adding a few cloaky alts/members to fleet to achieve the same damn thing as currently is and causes hassles for those in WH space as well as moving fleets in null-sec space. People will adapt though as always though.
Blobbing Explained
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Ima Spyalt
Republic University Minmatar Republic
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 17:57:41 -
[1326] - Quote
This change just makes what I do more tedious so much so that instead of paying for the account I'll just make some newbies do it for me and go back to what I used to do and see how many players I make leave this game. On a side note instead of Awoxing getting destroyed now its half the game you all get to suffer like us awoxers had to we adapted but still is tedious and boring. |
Dersen Lowery
Defy.
1640
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 18:12:03 -
[1327] - Quote
Juan Mileghere wrote:Literally this fixes/changes nothing except adding a few cloaky alts/members to fleet to achieve the same damn thing as currently is and causes hassles for those in WH space as well as moving fleets in null-sec space. People will adapt though as always though.
I'm amazed at the number of WH groups who don't use scouts much. We certainly did.
No wonder there was so much crying over recons getting dscan immunity.
Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.
I voted in CSM X!
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Princess Bride
Corripe Cervisiam Trade Consortium
664
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 18:53:57 -
[1328] - Quote
Elsa Hayes wrote:I wonder what will be considered too hard next? Logging in?
Only if CCP makes logging in take twice as long as it does now. Because that's what they're doing now with fleet warps. And it's just as stupid of an idea.
http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
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Alix Tichelman
Hedion University Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 19:11:03 -
[1329] - Quote
I love how all of the proponents of this idea are constantly urging us all to "make" a guy in our corp scout. Or "get a guy to" do it.... "Recruit nubs to" spend their game time LITERALLY invisible (both on grid and on KMs) during fights. No one is saying "Oh my god this new role for scout will be AMAZEBALLS! EVERYONE will be tripping over themselves to scout because it will be SO FUN. And why is that? Because it's going to be a crap, thankless, mostly doable with an alt, role that no one will want to play. The only time you get noticed is when you screw up and get decloaked, or someone else screws up and warps to you at zero. All the visibility of an OGB, the lack of KMs like logi, but without the any direct interaction between you and your fleet or the enemy fleet once the fight starts. Requires an experienced pilot to pull it off without dying, and experienced pilots are going to LOATHE doing it. In the end, FCs will simply multibox the role, because it's that or wait for someone else to step up and do it. I predict it will be used routinely as punishment for screwing up, like KP duty or hauling POS fuel.
But yeah... GREAT IDEA. |
Iowa Banshee
Fenrir Vangard
9
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 19:32:49 -
[1330] - Quote
CCP Fozzie wrote:Hopelesshobo wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote: As announced on the o7 show we are making some changes to fleet warp. Fleet Commanders, Wing Commanders & Squad Commanders will no longer be able to warp to anything a fleet member couldnGÇÖt warp to on their own. This includes GÇô
Bookmarks Does this include corporation bookmarks that the person in the same corp could warp to? Yes. You can only fleet warp to things that any member of your fleet could warp to, no matter what corp or alliances they are a part of.
I can have a fleet made up of just my corp mates, all have access to the corp bookmarks, all are able to warp on their own to these bookmarks and there are NO other Non-Corp fleet members
Just to clarify this:- Can they still fleet warp?
and if not - considering that they meet all the perquisites - why not? |
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Onslaughtor
Occult National Security Phoenix Naval Systems
147
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 19:43:17 -
[1331] - Quote
So me and a bunch of friends found a possible solution to keeping the main design goal of getting people involved with fleets and a sense of personal agency, while maintaining our current level of fleet ability, AND adding in new ability in the form of sudo fleet formations.
Current fleet warp functions are split into 2 parts.
1 Fleet warps as we know them now become emergency fleet warps. They can only warp to a few permanent objects such as the sun, planets, stations, and gates. This is the "No time to explain we are leaving" option for the fc and keeps that functionality alive while limiting it and allowing game play to form in the chase.
2 The new fleet warp mechanic is a fleet warp broadcast. This broadcast works on anything the current (pre aegis) fleetwarp can. Upon activation, everyone gets a visible broadcast saying the fc is starting a fleet warp. From there each pilot mush click on it and accept the warp at a range they choose. After some number of seconds (ten seems reasonable) the fleetwarp is initiated for everyone who signed on. After that, any fleet member may still warp to the broadcast in the fleet history.
In this way, current functionality is preserved and the design goals are meet, while also adding new functionality. Programing my be required, o dear.
If you agree please quote as these forums seem to bury things really quickly. |
holdmybeer
The Conference Elite CODE.
1
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 19:55:51 -
[1332] - Quote
My concerns about these changes are all in high-sec.
As someone with very low security status, it's going to be extremely tedious to be in fleet and coordinate good warp-ins on top of a target in high-sec, who are carrying my assets but don't still know it. There are problems I immediately see
Flying in low/null sec is probably manageable, as you can sit still in space for as long as you like, without getting destroyed by NPCs if you don't warp right away as you land or right after you shoot. Sure, I could command the fleet to "warp to x in 3, 2, 1.." that's how I command them to press the undock button, but then I would need to trade all new fleet members my bookmarks, I'd have to be doing this constantly.
As an FC I do however have a way around this: Warping my alt or other fleet members characters first to the bookmarks I want to use only so I can warp the fleet to it right after. This is the only way to keep the fleet together as it is absolutely crucial for me and my whole alliance in high-sec. I can just imagine myself explaining the mechanics to others and saying like "Oh yeah, we used to be able to warp into bookmarks before as a fleet, but now you have to fill in the role of a bookmark instead of shooting ships. Sorry bro" (In my opinion it's a horrible idea giving fleet members the role of a bookmark.)
These changes will simply force me to do more work as FC for the fleet to be successful, since high-sec mechanics are preventing my fleet members to navigate properly on their own.
Is this intentional, or will you have systems and ideas for high-sec, just like you have them for wormholes? I would hope that we could atleast warp into bookmarks as a fleet when in high-sec. |
Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2520
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 20:04:15 -
[1333] - Quote
Iowa Banshee wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Hopelesshobo wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote: As announced on the o7 show we are making some changes to fleet warp. Fleet Commanders, Wing Commanders & Squad Commanders will no longer be able to warp to anything a fleet member couldnGÇÖt warp to on their own. This includes GÇô
Bookmarks Does this include corporation bookmarks that the person in the same corp could warp to? Yes. You can only fleet warp to things that any member of your fleet could warp to, no matter what corp or alliances they are a part of. I can have a fleet made up of just my corp mates, all have access to the corp bookmarks, all are able to warp on their own to these bookmarks and there are NO other Non-Corp fleet members Just to clarify this:- Can they still fleet warp? and if not - considering that they meet all the perquisites - why not? Another way to say it:
All bookmarks are invalid targets for all fleet warp situations |
Iowa Banshee
Fenrir Vangard
9
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 20:23:51 -
[1334] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Iowa Banshee wrote:CCP Fozzie wrote:Hopelesshobo wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote: As announced on the o7 show we are making some changes to fleet warp. Fleet Commanders, Wing Commanders & Squad Commanders will no longer be able to warp to anything a fleet member couldnGÇÖt warp to on their own. This includes GÇô
Bookmarks Does this include corporation bookmarks that the person in the same corp could warp to? Yes. You can only fleet warp to things that any member of your fleet could warp to, no matter what corp or alliances they are a part of. I can have a fleet made up of just my corp mates, all have access to the corp bookmarks, all are able to warp on their own to these bookmarks and there are NO other Non-Corp fleet members Just to clarify this:- Can they still fleet warp? and if not - considering that they meet all the perquisites - why not? Another way to say it: All bookmarks are invalid targets for all fleet warp situations
As always we adapt - So the new method will be
After scanning jump out of the Buzzard into the Domi Wait 10mins for the bookmarks to update Check that the 2 other fleet members have the bookmarks Announce jump to XXX at 20km Announce 3-2-1 Warp
It just seems like there's a lot more needless stuff than click "warp fleet"
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kraken11 jensen
The Gallant Collective Requiem Eternal
88
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 20:26:55 -
[1335] - Quote
Phaade wrote:Senov Belis wrote:+1 to the "not playing anymore" list.
All I do is follow my FC and shoot things. If this is no longer possible, bye, I can not give you money anymore. Good, one less f1 monkey.
so everyone that click f1 is an f1 monkey. |
Dun'Gal
Myriad Contractors Inc.
256
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 20:41:25 -
[1336] - Quote
kraken11 jensen wrote:Phaade wrote:Senov Belis wrote:+1 to the "not playing anymore" list.
All I do is follow my FC and shoot things. If this is no longer possible, bye, I can not give you money anymore. Good, one less f1 monkey. so everyone that click f1 is an f1 monkey. yes |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16222
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:01:52 -
[1337] - Quote
Iowa Banshee wrote:
As always we adapt - So the new method will be
After scanning jump out of the Buzzard into the Domi Wait 10mins for the bookmarks to update Check that the 2 other fleet members have the bookmarks Announce jump to XXX at 20km Announce 3-2-1 Warp
It just seems like there's a lot more needless stuff than click "warp fleet"
Scan target, warp buzzard to it, warp the fleet to the buzzard.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16222
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:04:26 -
[1338] - Quote
holdmybeer wrote:My concerns about these changes are all in high-sec.
As someone with very low security status, it's going to be extremely tedious to be in fleet and coordinate good warp-ins on top of a target in high-sec, who are carrying my assets but don't still know it. There are problems I immediately see
Flying in low/null sec is probably manageable, as you can sit still in space for as long as you like, without getting destroyed by NPCs if you don't warp right away as you land or right after you shoot. Sure, I could command the fleet to "warp to x in 3, 2, 1.." that's how I command them to press the undock button, but then I would need to trade all new fleet members my bookmarks, I'd have to be doing this constantly.
As an FC I do however have a way around this: Warping my alt or other fleet members characters first to the bookmarks I want to use only so I can warp the fleet to it right after. This is the only way to keep the fleet together as it is absolutely crucial for me and my whole alliance in high-sec. I can just imagine myself explaining the mechanics to others and saying like "Oh yeah, we used to be able to warp into bookmarks before as a fleet, but now you have to fill in the role of a bookmark instead of shooting ships. Sorry bro" (In my opinion it's a horrible idea giving fleet members the role of a bookmark.)
These changes will simply force me to do more work as FC for the fleet to be successful, since high-sec mechanics are preventing my fleet members to navigate properly on their own.
Is this intentional, or will you have systems and ideas for high-sec, just like you have them for wormholes? I would hope that we could atleast warp into bookmarks as a fleet when in high-sec.
In terms of ganking nothing changes. Everyone undocks, warp to insta-undock safe, fleet warp to ship scanner guy, gank.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Zappity
Stay Frosty. A Band Apart.
2224
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:07:03 -
[1339] - Quote
Just increase combat probe scan time and slow down fleet warp speed. Leave the usefulness of the feature alone.
Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec.
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Shadowforge Dawkins
Catastrophic Overview Failure Brave Collective
21
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Posted - 2015.06.15 21:08:53 -
[1340] - Quote
Onslaughtor wrote:So me and a bunch of friends found a possible solution to keeping the main design goal of getting people involved with fleets and a sense of personal agency, while maintaining our current level of fleet ability, AND adding in new ability in the form of sudo fleet formations.
Current fleet warp functions are split into 2 parts.
1 Fleet warps as we know them now become emergency fleet warps. They can only warp to a few permanent objects such as the sun, planets, stations, and gates. This is the "No time to explain we are leaving" option for the fc and keeps that functionality alive while limiting it and allowing game play to form in the chase.
2 The new fleet warp mechanic is a fleet warp broadcast. This broadcast works on anything the current (pre aegis) fleetwarp can. Upon activation, everyone gets a visible broadcast saying the fc is starting a fleet warp. From there each pilot mush click on it and accept the warp at a range they choose. After some number of seconds (ten seems reasonable) the fleetwarp is initiated for everyone who signed on. After that, any fleet member may still warp to the broadcast in the fleet history.
In this way, current functionality is preserved and the design goals are meet, while also adding new functionality. Programing my be required, o dear.
If you agree please quote as these forums seem to bury things really quickly.
While this seems viable on paper... however I foresee ungodly lag spikes coming from it. Imagine a fleet of 500 people getting that same broadcast and having to click on it, couldn't tell you. As for Wormhole space, not going to fly. If our target can align in 15 seconds we just lost him due to the warp time being another 10 seconds out of warp waiting on the fleet warp.
I believe it would be best suited to reduce fleet warp to squads at the most. possibly let wings as well. |
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Rowells
ANZAC ALLIANCE Fidelas Constans
2520
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:12:39 -
[1341] - Quote
kraken11 jensen wrote:Phaade wrote:Senov Belis wrote:+1 to the "not playing anymore" list.
All I do is follow my FC and shoot things. If this is no longer possible, bye, I can not give you money anymore. Good, one less f1 monkey. so everyone that click f1 is an f1 monkey. How does one 'click' F1? |
stoicfaux
5900
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:29:08 -
[1342] - Quote
Rowells wrote:kraken11 jensen wrote:Phaade wrote:Senov Belis wrote:+1 to the "not playing anymore" list.
All I do is follow my FC and shoot things. If this is no longer possible, bye, I can not give you money anymore. Good, one less f1 monkey. so everyone that click f1 is an f1 monkey. How does one 'click' F1? Mechanical keyboard? Chorded? Pedantic?
Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
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Shadowforge Dawkins
Catastrophic Overview Failure Brave Collective
22
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Posted - 2015.06.15 21:37:36 -
[1343] - Quote
If CCP really wants to nail this concept on the head... of forcing more content and not ******* over other areas of k-space and wormhole space, why don't they change this a bit.
While still adhereing to the plans of removing fleet warp; Allow squads to keep fleet warp, ONLY the squads.
Q; Why only squads? A; It will Create new Tactics in all aspects of space, both known and wormhole.
Q; What kind of new content is created? -all space A; FC's will now get to pick out who is in the special ops Squad that no one else listens to and get their own channel. Short bus.
Q; How does this affect T3 tactics? A; A group of Scouts and Tackle will now occupy the same squad, with the new duty of only hunting, catching, and killing T3's at range.
Q; Does it kill wormhole fighting capabilities? A; No, They will have to select what ships are in what squads if and when we exceed 10 people... they will have to adapt, yes, but it will not be raze another monument worthy.
Q; Does it mess up those annoying altaholics? A; No... maybe? if someone has that many alts they deserve to suffer. seriously. I have a life away from the computer tho so I have a rather one sided opinion on these altaholics.
Q; Does it wreck pirate fleets causing calculated mayhem in highsec? A; No, so long as it is a small fleet of 10 or less. Otherwise I'd love to see the end result of it.
Q; Does it end the Blob Battles? A; Even if you got rid of fleet warp all together, still going to happen. They will just be coming in droves of 10 now. If ill timed you can wipe out their Logi then whatever comes next. |
stoicfaux
5900
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:40:13 -
[1344] - Quote
@baltec1 Quick[1] question: IIRC, somewhere in this thread, didn't you state that you can fleet warp to a ship that's already in warp?
Does the fleet warp to the target ship-still-in-warp's current location, or the destination location of the warp?
[1] Quick, dumb, potato, potatoe...
Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
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Foxstar Damaskeenus
SiIhouette Shadow Cartel
267
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:40:51 -
[1345] - Quote
I'm willing to admit I'm wrong. However, this seems like trying to fix something that isn't broke or fix something that's broken by breaking 5 other things.
I'm concerned for high sec gankers. Some CODE. members were saying this was going to ruin some of their gank fleets. The last thing this game needs, i thought, was people mining all day in high sec and tanking the price of minerals. This is also going to make people safer from combat probing and fleets warping on them.
Eve is a hard game, not a risk averse game. This feels very much like a step in the wrong direction.
This may be the first time I've come on forums to gripe since the rumor Hilmar wanted to sell "pay to win" special ammo in the Aurum store.
No changes to skill points EVER!!!
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Sumeragy
Revolution of Chaos Nemesis Enterprises.
8
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:43:27 -
[1346] - Quote
This Tread should be the reason we should invent for the Forums an dislike button !! |
baltec1
Bat Country Goonswarm Federation
16225
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:48:42 -
[1347] - Quote
stoicfaux wrote:@baltec1 Quick[1] question: IIRC, somewhere in this thread, didn't you state that you can fleet warp to a ship that's already in warp?
Does the fleet warp to the target ship-still-in-warp's current location, or the destination location of the warp?
[1] Quick, dumb, potato, potatoe...
Current location. Get a fast ship to warp around in a triangle, have the fleet make their own safe and you wind you with stuff everywhere. Makes scanning stuff a real pain for the enemy.
Join Bat Country today and defend the Glorious Socialist Dictatorship
|
Onslaughtor
Occult National Security Phoenix Naval Systems
148
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:49:07 -
[1348] - Quote
Shadowforge Dawkins wrote:Onslaughtor wrote:So me and a bunch of friends found a possible solution to keeping the main design goal of getting people involved with fleets and a sense of personal agency, while maintaining our current level of fleet ability, AND adding in new ability in the form of sudo fleet formations.
Current fleet warp functions are split into 2 parts.
1 Fleet warps as we know them now become emergency fleet warps. They can only warp to a few permanent objects such as the sun, planets, stations, and gates. This is the "No time to explain we are leaving" option for the fc and keeps that functionality alive while limiting it and allowing game play to form in the chase.
2 The new fleet warp mechanic is a fleet warp broadcast. This broadcast works on anything the current (pre aegis) fleetwarp can. Upon activation, everyone gets a visible broadcast saying the fc is starting a fleet warp. From there each pilot mush click on it and accept the warp at a range they choose. After some number of seconds (ten seems reasonable) the fleetwarp is initiated for everyone who signed on. After that, any fleet member may still warp to the broadcast in the fleet history.
In this way, current functionality is preserved and the design goals are meet, while also adding new functionality. Programing my be required, o dear.
If you agree please quote as these forums seem to bury things really quickly. While this seems viable on paper... however I foresee ungodly lag spikes coming from it. Imagine a fleet of 500 people getting that same broadcast and having to click on it, couldn't tell you. As for Wormhole space, not going to fly. If our target can align in 15 seconds we just lost him due to the warp time being another 10 seconds out of warp waiting on the fleet warp. I believe it would be best suited to reduce fleet warp to squads at the most. possibly let wings as well.
broadcasting to 256 (as that is the actual limit) fleet members as we have seen in game already takes no time at all or lag that we have ever really seen. Yes this may be a little different but to judge a idea on something so unknown and irreverent based on the current broadcast system and warpsystem combined, is futile at best.
As for the second one, ships still take time to align into warp. The fc can start the broadcast as soon as he hits grid and then people can follow it while they align, in other words similar to a un pre aligned fleet warp. If you want faster then you have to warp yourself. I don't really see how the argument you gave is really unique to wh space or really even related. All wh bookmark and fleet warping functionality is saved while maybe slowing down your fleet warping in the case of ceptors. And if in your case you have eyes on target like I would expect a good wh hunter to do then you can just warp to fleetmate and save the hassle. Some small changes may have to be made in the case of combat scanning, but you can fit combat probe launchers to your t3ds and dictors if you try.
Finally your last proposal doesn't meet the original design goal for the change. It may be better than what fozzie wants (this is his idea btw) but still doesn't fix the problem of player agency in fleets. |
Foxstar Damaskeenus
SiIhouette Shadow Cartel
267
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:50:41 -
[1349] - Quote
How about they just don't change it, this is dumb.
No changes to skill points EVER!!!
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stoicfaux
5900
|
Posted - 2015.06.15 21:51:28 -
[1350] - Quote
Sumeragy wrote:This Tread should be the reason we should invent for the Forums an dislike button !! CCP was going to implement a dislike button for individuals to express their displeasure over a post, but a vocal component of player base whined that FCs should be able to "Fleet Dislike" a post, whereupon CCP rolled their eyes and nerfed drone assignment instead.
Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
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