What is more enjoyable with anchoring on the FC, targeting what he calls and pressing f1?

But DUUUUUDE!!!!!! I get to be on the killmail while the scout might not.

People don't want to be "just a scout" for the exact same damn reason the SRP manager somehow had to include a damn rule about no guns on logi.

Muuuuuuuh killboard!!!!!!

We do this now, and we will be able to do this after the proposed changes. What's your point?

The need for green is real.

[quote=Awkward Pi Duolus]What is more enjoyable with anchoring on the FC, targeting what he calls and pressing f1?

The point is, that - as you observed correctly - it will still be possible to catch targets, even if they are inside of whatever gas-clouds, debrid-fields or similar areas. Some people claimed they wouldn't be able to do this after the fleetwarp change.

Correct is, they can't do it the way they did before. They can still do it with some adaptations.

The whole "problem" is an attitude one. If you think you don't contribute as a scout, you are not doing it wrong but thinking wrong.

A great point.

At best, it will be the extra alt the FC has been forced to make, unless s/he uses such an alt already.

At worst, it will be an otherwise active pilot being hamstrung into becoming a mobile bookmark instead of actually enjoying the game the way s/he wanted to.

Eh, people's expectation from this game and the amount of effort they want to put into it differ.

Scouting is like being a logi or a fleet booster - you don't do it for the killmails, but because you get the satisfaction from knowing that you made a disproportionately positive contribution to the fleet.

Unfortunately, nothing in this change will cause people who otherwise wouldn't have become scouts, now become scouts. It will, however, increase the burden on FCs to have a backup prober alt ready, if they don't already, when no one steps up.

The euphoria from seeing your enemies annihilated one by one in a brilliant flash as the collective alpha of a fleet chews through them is quite something, actually.

Sure, doing small gang stuff is a different kind of heart pumping fun, but that's for my late night T3D/dessie jaunts.

Sometimes though, say on weekends with friends, I just like to sit back and see things burn without having to break too much of a sweat.

The FC could always do what they do when no-one steps up to logi...

It's ok, you will still be euphoric when the FC fleet warp you to his scout, alt or player, before resuming with the CTRL-CLICK F1 fun gameplay.

No it isn't a great point, it a foolish and myopic point - you may be surprised to find that not everyone came to the game with the same aspirations as you, whoever you are. Some people came to this game to give out hugs in signal cartel or to spend weeks gaining the trust of some dude to overturn an alliance or simple to explore the beauty that is Eve. Loads of guys will love the new scout power:

imagine you become the +¬minence grise, you warp all these mugs to victory or defeat, or perhaps to certain death!

I've just worked out why Bat Country are so into supporting this. lol

Absolutely. After all, a fleet only ever needs one logi, which could easily be alt-tabbed.

Then what's the point of making the game any more tedious for the FC and less fun for the poor scout who's now relegated to being a mobile bookmark?

How about you think of your FC and realize he probably does not find it fun to scan everything by himself, provide the warp ins by himself and then direct the fleet all by himself? Is your lazy attitude of not being willing to work for the fleet to work supposed to be a god given right that nobody will ever remove from you?

The reason FC might overload from a change like this is because there are too many lazy people in fleet would would be happy if they could farm KM while afk. When FC start quitting because nobody steps up to support them and just step down themselves and decide to just be F1 grunt, then maybe people will realise they should of stepped up just a little bit once in a while to do the "hard and boring" job of enabling all your friends to have a fight.

The "enablers" in this game do all the work and as soon as some MIGHT get offloaded to the rest of the fleet, it's all tears and rage because the god given right of the lazy leeches might be somewhat reduced...

Shakespeare could not write a bigger tragedy...

I share your indignation, my friend. If my arguments make me seem like a F1-monkey, then lemme correct that saying I fly inties, sabres, SBs and logi - those with specific roles. I couldn't care less about KMs at this point.

BUT! Fleet is full of people trying to get whom into specialized roles is like pulling teeth. A game mechanic change will not entice them to do anything. It will simply mean more work for those that care.

I wouldn't call it a tragedy though, and much less a Shakespearean one at that - people are entitled to their gameplay styles, and I wouldn't presume to dictate their choices. I certainly wouldn't want to make it any more tedious than it already is.

So you are some kind of "defender of the dead weight"?

Look at all that forumwhine. Lovely! Good idea for a number of reasons; most noticably the involvement of dedicated scouts/tacklers over the "blops your ass" approach. I take it fleetwarp to a member will still be possible, yes?

Now, if somebody could explain me once more, very slowly, why this would "break wormholes" ? People in wormholes can't hit "warp to corp location" for themselves? People don't know how to type "X" in fleet chat or profoundly dislike to listen to comms and warp their own goddamn asses?

Or is it maybe because then you'd have to be IN the corp and not just purple whist staying safely in NPC corps? I don't get the whole fuzz here-- please explain. Warp drive still working as intended, only difference being you have the additional human factor of good vs bad scout, good vs bad warp-your-own. Oh wait! I get it. The notion that the group with the better pilots might win scares you?

Lol. And +1 Fozzie.

While I'm on a roll pissing of people across the globe, can I pitch the idea of a midslot module called the "Remote Cyno Jammer"? Not *that* would really stir up the place "Oh noes! I'll unsub all my 843 accounts at once!!" LOL and LOL. But seriously guys; can CCP do anything without y'all going heads-over-heels about how this would break the game forever? Good idea is good. EvEwiki has a good article on how to engage your warpdrive. Read it.

Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.

Death to NPSI cancer

Says the NPC forum alt.

Says the NPC forum alt.

More like, defender of folks who don't want to play this game like it's their second job.

I would not call them dead weight at all. Inactive characters are dead weight. People who PvE all day in null are dead weight. People who wh*re with a logi gun instead of repping are dead weight. Forum warriors with 0 kills are dead weight.

Casual players who just wanna have some fun and make up many, if not most, of the gamers in Eve - not dead weight.

Tying it to the proposed changes, there is nothing there that would force these folks to be the "I was there" guy. There is also nothing in game now that prevents those who wanna be the "I was there" guy, be that guy.

That is what makes this such a vacuous game mechanic change.

Your "not dead weight" crowd will still get their fleet warp at the end of the day so their gameplay is not affected. The FC will be able to deal with it as long as his group is willing to train people into the required roles. If they are not willing, I guess they will get defeated by the side who does...

So.. given that FCs are currently willing to train new scouts anyway, what's the point of this change then?

To stop the FC ship from being the scout in a battle.