EVE Search - New drones, modules and what not

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 42 post(s)
Kaell Meynn	Posted - 2005.11.03 20:31:00 - [2041] Originally by: Malken maybe i missed it somewhere but will 5 mining drones pull in the same amount as 15 used to? or did that part get overlooked? They are making it the same as 15 for SOME drone carriers. They've implied that they wont do this for the Dominix or the Moros, and those ships will be reduced to 10 drones worth or mining.
Kaell Meynn Divergence	Posted - 2005.11.03 20:31:00 - [2042] Edited by: Kaell Meynn on 03/11/2005 20:41:27 Originally by: Malken maybe i missed it somewhere but will 5 mining drones pull in the same amount as 15 used to? or did that part get overlooked? They are making it the same as 15 for SOME drone carriers. They've implied that they wont do this for the Dominix or the Moros, and those ships will be reduced to 10 drones worth or mining.
Kaell Meynn	Posted - 2005.11.03 20:40:00 - [2043] Originally by: Skulmar i havnt read the all the posts (its simply too much) so if this question has already been answered plz give me a link: did anyone think about reducing the signature radius of drones as a drone controlle bonus of the ishtar, domi..(or even for all drones) instead of or in conjunction with increasing the hp? it would increase targeting time, make them tougher and smart bombs would also be still usefull, so it would be more similar to the current system. with the hp increasing system SB will get quite useless or at least far less effective then now. I believe I suggested it and it was summarilly ignored.
Kaell Meynn Divergence	Posted - 2005.11.03 20:40:00 - [2044] Originally by: Skulmar i havnt read the all the posts (its simply too much) so if this question has already been answered plz give me a link: did anyone think about reducing the signature radius of drones as a drone controlle bonus of the ishtar, domi..(or even for all drones) instead of or in conjunction with increasing the hp? it would increase targeting time, make them tougher and smart bombs would also be still usefull, so it would be more similar to the current system. with the hp increasing system SB will get quite useless or at least far less effective then now. I believe I suggested it and it was summarilly ignored.
Derran	Posted - 2005.11.03 20:51:00 - [2045] Originally by: Slink Grinsdikild I still think EW and Webber drones are way too unbalancing, especially as counter-frigate tools. Its bad enough that Heavy Nosferatu's are the 'I win' button against smaller ships, now we'll have webbers CHASING us and jammers beating frigate/cruiser sensor strenght all the time. So much for frigate specialization eh? Um, you expect to solo a battleship with a frigate? Not going to happen. Ever try 10 frigates against a battleship though? Lotsa fun. Especially when you go after those types of people who expect a battleship to be the equivalent of a maxed out level character on another type of MMORPG. They are like freaking out when they die.
Derran Minmatar Khumatari Holdings Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2005.11.03 20:51:00 - [2046] Originally by: Slink Grinsdikild I still think EW and Webber drones are way too unbalancing, especially as counter-frigate tools. Its bad enough that Heavy Nosferatu's are the 'I win' button against smaller ships, now we'll have webbers CHASING us and jammers beating frigate/cruiser sensor strenght all the time. So much for frigate specialization eh? Um, you expect to solo a battleship with a frigate? Not going to happen. Ever try 10 frigates against a battleship though? Lotsa fun. Especially when you go after those types of people who expect a battleship to be the equivalent of a maxed out level character on another type of MMORPG. They are like freaking out when they die.
Skulmar	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:00:00 - [2047] @ Kaell: any idea why? i made a post in the last 2 dev blogs and it allways gets completly ignored even by devs. to me it looks much better then simply increasing the hp.
Skulmar	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:00:00 - [2048] @ Kaell: any idea why? i made a post in the last 2 dev blogs and it allways gets completly ignored even by devs. to me it looks much better then simply increasing the hp.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:24:00 - [2049] Originally by: Derran Originally by: Slink Grinsdikild I still think EW and Webber drones are way too unbalancing, especially as counter-frigate tools. Its bad enough that Heavy Nosferatu's are the 'I win' button against smaller ships, now we'll have webbers CHASING us and jammers beating frigate/cruiser sensor strenght all the time. So much for frigate specialization eh? Um, you expect to solo a battleship with a frigate? Not going to happen. Ever try 10 frigates against a battleship though? Lotsa fun. Especially when you go after those types of people who expect a battleship to be the equivalent of a maxed out level character on another type of MMORPG. They are like freaking out when they die. Yea, NOW. The point is that the new drones, in particular the web ones, tip the balance FAR too far towards the BS. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."
Maya Rkell Forsaken Empire The Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:24:00 - [2050] Originally by: Derran Originally by: Slink Grinsdikild I still think EW and Webber drones are way too unbalancing, especially as counter-frigate tools. Its bad enough that Heavy Nosferatu's are the 'I win' button against smaller ships, now we'll have webbers CHASING us and jammers beating frigate/cruiser sensor strenght all the time. So much for frigate specialization eh? Um, you expect to solo a battleship with a frigate? Not going to happen. Ever try 10 frigates against a battleship though? Lotsa fun. Especially when you go after those types of people who expect a battleship to be the equivalent of a maxed out level character on another type of MMORPG. They are like freaking out when they die. Yea, NOW. The point is that the new drones, in particular the web ones, tip the balance FAR too far towards the BS. //Maya
Slink Grinsdikild	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:31:00 - [2051] Originally by: Derran Um, you expect to solo a battleship with a frigate? Not going to happen. All I want is to be able to tackle effectively. I'm still very new, but I chose to specialize in frigates because I wanted to tackle bigger ships. Not only do webbers and ewar drones make it harder to tackle the enemy, i'm worried my own gang members (aka those i'm tackling for) will in future say "Get a bigger ship, we have drones that fill your role already kthnx" And between MWD signature radius, Warp Core Stabilizers and Nosferatu's its hard enough already.
Slink Grinsdikild Brotherhood of Wolves Astral Wolves	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:31:00 - [2052] Originally by: Derran Um, you expect to solo a battleship with a frigate? Not going to happen. All I want is to be able to tackle effectively. I'm still very new, but I chose to specialize in frigates because I wanted to tackle bigger ships. Not only do webbers and ewar drones make it harder to tackle the enemy, i'm worried my own gang members (aka those i'm tackling for) will in future say "Get a bigger ship, we have drones that fill your role already kthnx" And between MWD signature radius, Warp Core Stabilizers and Nosferatu's its hard enough already. __ Account cancelled
MortiSeraphim	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:51:00 - [2053] only pity is the devs dont listen to players' complaints or feedback on changes even after its widespread unpopularity...its like they dont care they have paying customers. ...and someone commented before, yet another boost for the dev's lovechild: the interceptor.
MortiSeraphim Vox Silentium Ultionis Silentium Ordo	Posted - 2005.11.03 21:51:00 - [2054] only pity is the devs dont listen to players' complaints or feedback on changes even after its widespread unpopularity...its like they dont care they have paying customers. ...and someone commented before, yet another boost for the dev's lovechild: the interceptor.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.11.03 22:08:00 - [2055] Yea, web drones are a...wait, they're not. Intelligence > You. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."
Maya Rkell Forsaken Empire The Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2005.11.03 22:08:00 - [2056] Yea, web drones are a...wait, they're not. Intelligence > You. //Maya
Malken	Posted - 2005.11.03 22:17:00 - [2057] Originally by: Jim Raynor Luckily heavy missiles happen to pwn heavy drones quite nicely. Which sadly is only one of the few things they are good against. perhaps but compare the dmg a battleships drones do to a interceptor vs the dmg a cerberus do to a interceptor and its a giggle
Malken	Posted - 2005.11.03 22:17:00 - [2058] Originally by: Jim Raynor Luckily heavy missiles happen to pwn heavy drones quite nicely. Which sadly is only one of the few things they are good against. perhaps but compare the dmg a battleships drones do to a interceptor vs the dmg a cerberus do to a interceptor and its a giggle Quote: [05:17:46] Obiareus > freindlies dock or safespot [05:17:51] Obiareus > YOU CANNOT WIN
Jim Raynor	Posted - 2005.11.03 23:13:00 - [2059] Originally by: Malken Originally by: Jim Raynor Luckily heavy missiles happen to pwn heavy drones quite nicely. Which sadly is only one of the few things they are good against. perhaps but compare the dmg a battleships drones do to a interceptor vs the dmg a cerberus do to a interceptor and its a giggle yes for some reason the sig penalty on mwd is being offset by the increased velocity WAY too much.. sorry but .3 damage is pretty stupid, there is like, almost no way for a cerberus to beat an inty without assaults and double web or something.. and if he is good and stays out of web range, well, u lose, or have to run, or whatever ------ If Captain James T. Kirk and Mr. Spock embracing one another, in a bath tube, nude, in space, is wrong, I don't want to be right.
Jim Raynor Caldari Umbra Congregatio Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2005.11.03 23:13:00 - [2060] Originally by: Malken Originally by: Jim Raynor Luckily heavy missiles happen to pwn heavy drones quite nicely. Which sadly is only one of the few things they are good against. perhaps but compare the dmg a battleships drones do to a interceptor vs the dmg a cerberus do to a interceptor and its a giggle yes for some reason the sig penalty on mwd is being offset by the increased velocity WAY too much.. sorry but .3 damage is pretty stupid, there is like, almost no way for a cerberus to beat an inty without assaults and double web or something.. and if he is good and stays out of web range, well, u lose, or have to run, or whatever ------ I'll make a sig later.
keepiru	Posted - 2005.11.03 23:32:00 - [2061] That's cause its 2 completely independent factors each applying a negative multiplier to damage, and not affecting each other in any way. Instead of 2 factors for turrets where one applies a multiplier to the other which then decided the random number function used to decide hit type and chance to hit etc. Unless ive beeen sold something other than tobacco at the cornerstore i made a lenghty post about this sort of problem being inherent in the missile mechanics that were being handed to us, but people were too busy screaming about the death of the lvl4 raven to care... Essentially its much much harder to balance such a system with 2 independent modifiers, so all you can do is tweak the values a little this or that way, but in order to make missiles do good damage to an mwding target without making the velocity factor scaled by the signature size factor like id suggested or some similar interdependency between the factors, youd pretty much have to turn them into the i-win button they were - in some cases - before. How this has any relation to drones, im not quite sure myself. ------------- Where are the named 800mm Plates and Mega Ions, CCP?
keepiru Supernova Security Systems	Posted - 2005.11.03 23:32:00 - [2062] That's cause its 2 completely independent factors each applying a negative multiplier to damage, and not affecting each other in any way. Instead of 2 factors for turrets where one applies a multiplier to the other which then decided the random number function used to decide hit type and chance to hit etc. Unless ive beeen sold something other than tobacco at the cornerstore i made a lenghty post about this sort of problem being inherent in the missile mechanics that were being handed to us, but people were too busy screaming about the death of the lvl4 raven to care... Essentially its much much harder to balance such a system with 2 independent modifiers, so all you can do is tweak the values a little this or that way, but in order to make missiles do good damage to an mwding target without making the velocity factor scaled by the signature size factor like id suggested or some similar interdependency between the factors, youd pretty much have to turn them into the i-win button they were - in some cases - before. How this has any relation to drones, im not quite sure myself. ---------------- Boost T2 Plate HP!
Qayos	Posted - 2005.11.04 00:59:00 - [2063] Please don't make Megathrons just as good with ECM drones as a Dominix, that's silly.
Qayos Aliastra	Posted - 2005.11.04 00:59:00 - [2064] Please don't make Megathrons just as good with ECM drones as a Dominix, that's silly.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.11.04 02:55:00 - [2065] Originally by: Jim Raynor Originally by: Malken Originally by: Jim Raynor Luckily heavy missiles happen to pwn heavy drones quite nicely. Which sadly is only one of the few things they are good against. perhaps but compare the dmg a battleships drones do to a interceptor vs the dmg a cerberus do to a interceptor and its a giggle yes for some reason the sig penalty on mwd is being offset by the increased velocity WAY too much.. sorry but .3 damage is pretty stupid, there is like, almost no way for a cerberus to beat an inty without assaults and double web or something.. and if he is good and stays out of web range, well, u lose, or have to run, or whatever Uh-huh. 3 volleys to kill an interceptor is bad? Smoke. Pipe. Wtf. "Corpse cannot be fitted onto ship. Only hardware modules can be fitted."
Maya Rkell Forsaken Empire The Forsaken Empire	Posted - 2005.11.04 02:55:00 - [2066] Originally by: Jim Raynor Originally by: Malken Originally by: Jim Raynor Luckily heavy missiles happen to pwn heavy drones quite nicely. Which sadly is only one of the few things they are good against. perhaps but compare the dmg a battleships drones do to a interceptor vs the dmg a cerberus do to a interceptor and its a giggle yes for some reason the sig penalty on mwd is being offset by the increased velocity WAY too much.. sorry but .3 damage is pretty stupid, there is like, almost no way for a cerberus to beat an inty without assaults and double web or something.. and if he is good and stays out of web range, well, u lose, or have to run, or whatever Uh-huh. 3 volleys to kill an interceptor is bad? Smoke. Pipe. Wtf. //Maya
Paradox Eve	Posted - 2005.11.04 03:22:00 - [2067] Response to the Domi pilots that have a problem with this change: 1) As has been pointed out in this thread many times before, in addition to loosing no dmg from your drones ect, you are gaining a great deal of versatility by having drones in your bay for any possible situation you encounter. This very much offsets the relatively small dmg loss over another pilot when you use one of the new drones as opposed to a traditional drone. Verstility: learn it and respect it, and then you can come back and post again. 2) Instead of having two full waves of drones in your bay, you will have have three full waves of drones, or two full waves plus extra E-WAR drones. This is very much a boost. [See above, for versatility.] 3) For the most part, you dont often need E-WAR drones, as the domi is a very capable E-WAR ship to begin with- and the mods will serve you much better than the drones. The drones will just further supliment this ability with a very flexable set of E-WAR drones in your bay for any situation you run into. [See versatility above.] 4) Any other ship that uses these drones will have to reduce thier dmg output to do so, just like the Domi. The dmg will be reduced slightly less than if it were a Domi, but see "versatility" above. 5) Domi is my ship of choice, and I think these changes are great. Ive come to worry a bit about the webber drones, but Ill hold my comments until I see them in action.
Paradox Eve	Posted - 2005.11.04 03:22:00 - [2068] Response to the Domi pilots that have a problem with this change: 1) As has been pointed out in this thread many times before, in addition to loosing no dmg from your drones ect, you are gaining a great deal of versatility by having drones in your bay for any possible situation you encounter. This very much offsets the relatively small dmg loss over another pilot when you use one of the new drones as opposed to a traditional drone. Verstility: learn it and respect it, and then you can come back and post again. 2) Instead of having two full waves of drones in your bay, you will have have three full waves of drones, or two full waves plus extra E-WAR drones. This is very much a boost. [See above, for versatility.] 3) For the most part, you dont often need E-WAR drones, as the domi is a very capable E-WAR ship to begin with- and the mods will serve you much better than the drones. The drones will just further supliment this ability with a very flexable set of E-WAR drones in your bay for any situation you run into. [See versatility above.] 4) Any other ship that uses these drones will have to reduce thier dmg output to do so, just like the Domi. The dmg will be reduced slightly less than if it were a Domi, but see "versatility" above. 5) Domi is my ship of choice, and I think these changes are great. Ive come to worry a bit about the webber drones, but Ill hold my comments until I see them in action.
Sarrena	Posted - 2005.11.04 03:28:00 - [2069] Perhaps. As long as they fix the bloody core AI bugs with drones and stop all the love making and slow mo effects. Test longer then with missles and lets see where this lands, although I'd still prefer a higher cap of 10 then 5. Oh, and drop Caldari masses, seriously those ships must have lead linings for what they look like.
Sarrena Amarr	Posted - 2005.11.04 03:28:00 - [2070] Perhaps. As long as they fix the bloody core AI bugs with drones and stop all the love making and slow mo effects. Test longer then with missles and lets see where this lands, although I'd still prefer a higher cap of 10 then 5. Oh, and drop Caldari masses, seriously those ships must have lead linings for what they look like.

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